Nama Japa

[Guest guest]

I would like to do namasmaranam of the lord bu doing JAPA on either Narayana Ashtakshara mantra, Vasudeva dvAdashakshara mantra or the maha mantra. By I have heard that one needs to get UPADESHAM on it before proceeding. But I dont know any one who could give me updasham etc. Can I start with any upadesham from any GURU. Please Avice.

 

 

[Guest guest]

I meant. I have a guru, but he entered Bridavanam 300 yrs ago( SAMADHI). I have prayed to him, I think because of him, I have known the true goal of life.But to start doing JAPA, one needs initation from a gurur. My guru wont give me explanations etc on the mantras etc to start it as he is in Yoga Samadhi. I wanted to know, Can I start namasmaranam anyway.

[Priitaa 0]

No one needs initiation to chant Hare Krishna. Simply chant! /images/graemlins/smile.gif Why waste time? Life is too short in kali yuga. If your guru took you this far, dont block yourself. Its not a complicated process, we humans make it complicated. Lord Caitanya made it easy. Simply chant Hare Krishna and Be Happy.

[theist 1]

Priitaa. If some big name baba tells us not to chant for some reason we should increase our chanting and never hear from such a person again.

[Guest guest]

No...my guru did not ask me to stop chanting...while I was browsing the net. In one of the sites, I saw that they had mentioned that one needs upadesham from a guru to start with etc

[Priitaa 0]

Thiest,

 

True. I dont know who this person's guru is, so I can't comment on him, one way or the other. I just was pointing out that anyone can chant Hare Krishna and initiation is unimportant.

 

I only just now read some other thread about a bogus guru, so if this poster is connected to that thread, I did not know it. With that said, boy, where do all these 'guru's' come from? And just see how many prefer to be cheated, that is, if they are following a bogus guru.

[livingentity 0]

I was chatting last night with someone who had been told by some devotees within ISKCON that his chanting maha-mantra was useless and meaningless since he is not initiated.

 

How did this mis-information get started? It is possible that this person misunderstood what was being said to him. I want to give the benefit of doubt.

[Guest guest]

My guru is not BOGUS, he is a saint from Madhva Sampradaya. As I said earlier, I got the info about " initiation" on the net.

[Priitaa 0]

On the one hand, its shocking. On the other hand, not really. Even when Prabhpuada was here in his vani, modifications, alterations, and changing this or that instruction of his got twisted. Kirtananda tried to do his Christian thing with robes in NV even back then. One sanyasi said Prabhupada was Krishna (Prabhupada corrected him), and the list goes on. I dont know why some do these things, but it seems the human being has a propensity to cheat. Oh, thats it! haha I figured it out as I typed. Its one of the four human propensites.

 

Yet, why it is, when we have finally a chance to get out of the materal world, we rather cheat or be cheated, that's the part I dont get.

[Priitaa 0]

Guest,

 

No one said YOUR guru is bogus. We were referring to another poster.

[cRimAl 0]

The thing is: when do you know that a guru is bogus ?

 

My guru is Krishna.

I often wonder why I don't hear people talking more about Krishna as their guru, especially in temples where guru debate takes up a whole lot of precious time.

 

[yasodanandana 0]

in these debates the ones saying that the guru is ONLY krsna or that the ONLY guru is an acharya who is no more in our world are very active and maybe, often, the biggest "time wasters" and insincere.... maybe more than the ones who, correctly, approach (or pray krsna to approach one day) a pure, present, uttama adhikari and follow (or try to follow)

 

 

The thing is: when do you know that a guru is bogus ?

••••we have read often in this site some words of srila gaura govinda maharaja saying that we, being conditioned, do not understand when one is pure... so the only hope is "to cry before krishna", to desire with all oure heart to be choosen by an uttama adhikari.

 

We will obtain a bogus if we have bogus desires, we will have a pure if we are sincere.. and the vaishnava, ultimately thinks that if he has some realizations or progresses (including the one to be in the school of a pure acharya) it's all krsna's mercy

 

 

[cRimAl 0]

in these debates the ones saying that the guru is ONLY krsna or that the ONLY guru is an acharya who is no more in our world are very active and maybe, often, the biggest "time wasters" and insincere.... maybe more than the ones who, correctly, approach (or pray krsna to approach one day) a pure, present, uttama adhikari and follow (or try to follow)

 

 

 

Hmm, that sounds like a strange way of reasoning to me.

Communication based on just written words isn't always easy I guess. I just hope you didn't understand me wrong.

 

 

[Priitaa 0]

Crimal,

 

You ask a good question, how does one know when a guru is bogus? Many don't know how to tell. Without Prabhupada's books I would be no exception. But of course, I can only make that decision for myself, and everyone has to make it for themselves. However, there are many places all throughout shastra which describe what qualifications one must have to be a guru. I suggest you look for some of those. Must run! Haribol.

[cRimAl 0]

However, there are many places all throughout shastra which describe what qualifications one must have to be a guru.

 

 

 

Indeed, but i'm afraid that people don't get the opportunity to spend enough time with the person that they have chosen as their potential guru so doesn't that make it pretty impossible in a lot of cases to make that up for yourself ? I read somewhere that a pupil should spend at least a year in close association with his/her (i guess that some persons will already claim now that this would be impossible for women since close association between women and guru's is not considered to be 'beneficial, but that's a whole other discussion I guess) potential guru so that 'both' parties could see if giving/taking initiation would be favorable.

I think there have been enough examples already in the past of people getting into serious mental problems because of guru issues so I definitely think that it's something that we shouldn't deal with in a lighthearted manner.

 

I'm sorry, I wish i could explain myself a little bit better but English is not my main language and I seem to be missing a lot of words in my english vocabulary that are in fact very necessary to make my thoughts and questions more clear, so forgive me if my sentences seem a little bit weird sometimes.

[yasodanandana 0]

"Hmm, that sounds like a strange way of reasoning to me.

Communication based on just written words isn't always easy I guess. I just hope you didn't understand me wrong. "

•••oh i am sorry, excuse me.. i try to expand a little:

 

basically i see that these guru issues are very western, in the traditional gaudya vaishnava situation (this does not exclude iskcon of course) there's the obvious necessity to find a uttama adhikari guru and there's also the opinion, maybe very strong, of the devotees on the purity and competence of others. But the discussions are very few, the guru and math appartenence is private and personal and the people associate and do services on other basis and affinities

 

so the discussions "my guru"--"your guru" are very few

 

said this i think that the most quarrelling cathegories are, perhaps, many of the post samadhi initiation advocates and some of the "there's no need of guru, i can do by myself reading and listening to paramatma" party

 

i do not want to offend you or any other devotee, surely i am super OT, i think also that the majority of the people in the above position is not there because they're bad or demons,,,, maybe unfortunate.. exactly like me who i am a devotee only as a farce

 

so please excuse me for any offence, i have only a little idea that the guru debate is more for who has not a guru, maybe hiding behind "i do not need.. krsna is the guru"

 

so i admit another time my complete OT , be mercyful!!

[cRimAl 0]

so please excuse me for any offence, i have only a little idea that the guru debate is more for who has not a guru, maybe hiding behind "i do not need.. krsna is the guru"

 

 

Oh, but I do want and need a guru. Ofcourse I do...i'm merely saying that in the end the real guru will always be Krishna cause He is the guru of the guru of the guru...

ANyways, no offence taken, I was just trying to understand better where you were coming from.

 

[Priitaa 0]

Oops! Mistake.

[Priitaa 0]

Crimal,

 

You are correct that too many dont spend enough time with their potential guru. Many dont know what they are getting into either. Then they get into it, or figure it out, and feel they 'have' to stick with all of it now. It can get quite messy, as I have seen devotees go thru this and it takes years, even decades, to process sometimes. Its better to take your time figuring out who you want as guru. Read Prabhupada's books and search for a variety of types of quotes or comments, instructions really, on the topic. Right now your uncertainty comes from not knowing these things, and that is resolved thru study. Dont take my opinion, or anyones opinion, on what to do here. You must take your own, which is developed after good amount of study time is invested into it. And it sounds like you've got a good head on your shoulders, or good gut instincts. Go with that and see where it takes you.