Sabda (checks and balances)

[Guest guest]

If whatever the guru and sadhus say is based on sastra, how is that a perfect checks and balances? Since they are completely dependent on sastra, if sastra is wrong, then so are they. How do you address such a fallacy?

[tattvadarshi 0]

For a faithful follower of vedic spirituality, sastra is never to be considered wrong. It is regarded as apauruseya, of divine origin. What it means for the sadhu and guru to serve as a check on the sastra is that they can prevent misunderstanding or misinterpretation of the words of the sastra. Sometimes the meaning of the sastra may be difficult to understand or apply. Also, there may be apparent contradictions between different sastras. Guru and sadhu can resolve these seeming discrepancies.

[theist 1]

I love many of these questions that guest poses. They are strengthening in that they causes us to dig deeper into our foundational structures to see if they are stronly built. We should stick to a particular question raised though and perhaps proceed on to the next after it has been fully explored.

 

How do we know sastra is of divine origin in the first place? Because guru and sadhu say so? It does seem like a closed loop of circular reasoning.

 

When we say guru are we neglecting Caitya-guru? Is revelation from the Lord in the heart the missing link? In other words can we really say we know until then, until we know?

[Guest guest]

 

 

in the Bhagavad Gita Krishna says ,that with the shining

lamp of knowledge he destroys the darkness born of ignorance.

 

This is transcendental , the experience of "truth"

is revealed to the seeker at the discretion of the

supreme lord.

 

The mayavadis in their egotism think that by their endeavor

they will ascend to the heights of wisdom and conquer

the mysteries of the universe.

 

that is not possible, Krishna states that he is giving memory,intelligence,and forgetfullness.

 

without help from paramatma you would not know anything

from moment to momemt, you would be like a lump.

 

so transcendental truth is given to you and the decision

whether or not you can appreciate it will depend on

the decision of Paramatma, God.

[anadi 0]

Very good explanation by tattva-darshi.

 

There is no fault in the sastra.

Sometimes apears like this

because the condition soul cannot understand it,

and it has comendements for people of different eligibilities.

 

The real guru,

the tattva-darshi

is not dependent on sastra.

He realized the truth.

He realized his sambandha (relation) with his ista deva (worshipable deity) because he was under the guidance of another realized soul, and he himself can reveal the sambanda jnana to his disciples at the time of diksa.

 

Sastra is not a book, even if in this yuga aparently it is so.

Sastra is the transcendental sound (sabda brahma), which is directed to the soul.

 

Without the sat guru sastra would be a fairy tale book.

But sastra gives us asurance that vishnu jana (the man of God) will always be on the surface of the earth.

 

The unfortunate situation is that one has not enough sukriti (eternal pious activities) to get the association of sat guru.

[shvu 1]

 

Theist,

 

You are correct, it is circular logic.

 

Why is Shaastra flawless? Because the Guru says so.

Why is the Guru infallible? Because shaastra says so.

 

And round and round we go....

 

Cheers

 

[livingentity 0]

The vedas are not human knowledge (that would be flawed due to material contamination) - the vedas come from Lord Krsna.

 

Brahma, the first living being, received this knowledge and then passed it on to His sons and disciples (disciplic succession).

 

Vedas are perfect knowledge and guru teaches according to this perfect knowledge.

 

Jai Srila Prabhupada!!

[theist 1]

But it is natural that the absolute truth would confirm Himself through His different manifestations. So that can't be a reason for doubt. But is it reason enough for acceptance?

 

Perhaps our dilemna is present because we are hesitant to actually enter in to the inner side of the words of shastra and guru. Prefering to remain licking the outer side of the honey jar how can we expect to ever really the taste sweetness within?

[theist 1]

I like Shiva's directing it back to Supersoul. I can read shastra and misunderstand. I can hear guru and misunderstand. So while I must try to cross reference as much as possible can I really have faith in my ability to cross check the one against the other? No. But if Supersoul guides that cross checking....