Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Hi Jo It is! Zak and I love getting into the holiday spirit and it is a good learning experience for both of us. I will talk a bit about the things we put out or even see at other homes. And he will ask questions about some and some I cannot answer so we look it up together. We tell stories on it and talk about what he thinks it may have been like back then or ask I why he thinks something may have been done that way and it uses his imagination. Sometimes we'll get books from the library on certain subjects. It's amazing though how much everything ties together from the stars, to Pagen rituals, to fall, leaves changing, the Pilgrims, Indians & Thanksgiving etc. Every year we learn something new together. I do tend to not sugar coat things for him, but I also stay a bit away from the graphic things like bloodshed. He's only 7 and quite a bit sensitive so I figure a little at a time. BB Nikki , " jo " <jo.heartwork@g...> wrote: > > Hi Nikki > > It sounds like fun :-) > > BB > Jo > - > " earthstrm " <nikkimack@m...> > > Tuesday, October 11, 2005 6:48 PM > Re: Thanksgiving > > > > Hi Jo, > > > > Pilgrims, turkeys and cornacopias (spelling?) > > > > Oh and bales of hay and corn stalks > > > > BB > > Nikki > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 We had one pair here last year. We now have two pairs. The dogs ignore the turkeys but cause serious aniety amongst hunters <g> I think the turkeys know this! Lynda - fraggle Wednesday, October 12, 2005 10:03 AM Re: Thanksgiving that is for a modern inbred monstrosity turkey wild turkeys live over a decade..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Just dont open Pandoras box, whatever you do! The Valley Vegan...........Lynda <lurine wrote: One is alive and well on my diningroom table. Is it an endangered species and should I be giving it special treatment? Lynda - peter hurd Tuesday, October 11, 2005 1:18 PM Re: Thanksgiving Arent cornucopias exticnt? The Valley Vegan............Peter H Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Come on then explain this American custom to me. Do native Americans celebrate? what do they think of it? Have they anything to give thanks for? The Valley Vegan.............Anouk Sickler <zurumato wrote: Hi jo,I haven't liked thanksgiving in a while, for one thing, my family, as the years go by, the less time I want to spend with them. because I see them as soo different from me. my cousins, if I had to pick them as friends, I probably wouldn't.with the exception of my mom, they are just too mainstream. reason number two. there is just too much death, I can't raally recall the numberbut something like 600 million or so turkeys die on that day.That is just sadness, I go into mourning and have nothing to celebrate. I for being thankful?I am thankful every day in my private spiritual way and feel trulypicked/blessed/chosen/lucky/fortunate/grateful to have such apriviledged life. I am trying to gather up enough money to go to new york (in liue ofbirthday) to go for thanksgiving. to visit my mom. But ***MOSTLY** to go to Prada boutique. its on 57 streetand 5th avenue (i think). there will be a protest in front of the store. (non-violent)I will probably be handing out leaftlets to the public, that doesn't know that they kill baby seals to make thierpurses. I would love to meet up with anyone who is interested in going.> > , "jo" wrote:> >> > I like decorating indoors for the different seasons, and Pagan > festivals. Are there any particular decorations connected with > Thanksgiving???> > > > Jo> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Hi Nikki It sounds like you are doing things just right -IMO. Zak will find out about the nastier things when he is older - no need to rush into it. BB Jo - " earthstrm " <nikkimack Wednesday, October 12, 2005 2:45 PM Re: Thanksgiving > Hi Jo > > It is! Zak and I love getting into the holiday spirit and it is a > good learning experience for both of us. I will talk a bit about the > things we put out or even see at other homes. And he will ask > questions about some and some I cannot answer so we look it up > together. > > We tell stories on it and talk about what he thinks it may have been > like back then or ask I why he thinks something may have been done > that way and it uses his imagination. Sometimes we'll get books from > the library on certain subjects. > > It's amazing though how much everything ties together from the > stars, to Pagen rituals, to fall, leaves changing, the Pilgrims, > Indians & Thanksgiving etc. Every year we learn something new > together. > > I do tend to not sugar coat things for him, but I also stay a bit > away from the graphic things like bloodshed. He's only 7 and quite a > bit sensitive so I figure a little at a time. > > BB > Nikki Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Ooops.... Nikki , peter hurd <swpgh01@t...> wrote: > > Just dont open Pandoras box, whatever you do! > > The Valley Vegan........... > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Oh no............. *cringing* Nikki , peter hurd <swpgh01@t...> wrote: > > Come on then explain this American custom to me. > Do native Americans celebrate? what do they think of it? Have they anything to give thanks for? > > The Valley Vegan............. > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Hi Jo Thank you, that's pretty much how I felt too. He will have plenty to deal with in many years to come, might as well give him pleasantries now. BB Nikki , " jo " <jo.heartwork@g...> wrote: > > Hi Nikki > > It sounds like you are doing things just right -IMO. Zak will find out > about the nastier things when he is older - no need to rush into it. > > BB > Jo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 Oh dear, I may already have done this. Eldest daughter is named Kassondra <g> Lynda - peter hurd Just dont open Pandoras box, whatever you do! The Valley Vegan........... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 Some do. Mainly those who were denied thier culture. ' And some that do make it into a day to show what was actually done, to read the journals of Gov. Bradford and celebrate their own culture and not the myth. Same with Genocide Day (Columbus Day to others). Lynda - peter hurd Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:37 PM Re: Re: Thanksgiving Come on then explain this American custom to me. Do native Americans celebrate? what do they think of it? Have they anything to give thanks for? The Valley Vegan.............Anouk Sickler <zurumato wrote: Hi jo,I haven't liked thanksgiving in a while, for one thing, my family, as the years go by, the less time I want to spend with them. because I see them as soo different from me. my cousins, if I had to pick them as friends, I probably wouldn't.with the exception of my mom, they are just too mainstream. reason number two. there is just too much death, I can't raally recall the numberbut something like 600 million or so turkeys die on that day.That is just sadness, I go into mourning and have nothing to celebrate. I for being thankful?I am thankful every day in my private spiritual way and feel trulypicked/blessed/chosen/lucky/fortunate/grateful to have such apriviledged life. I am trying to gather up enough money to go to new york (in liue ofbirthday) to go for thanksgiving. to visit my mom. But ***MOSTLY** to go to Prada boutique. its on 57 streetand 5th avenue (i think). there will be a protest in front of the store. (non-violent)I will probably be handing out leaftlets to the public, that doesn't know that they kill baby seals to make thierpurses. I would love to meet up with anyone who is interested in going.> > , "jo" wrote:> >> > I like decorating indoors for the different seasons, and Pagan > festivals. Are there any particular decorations connected with > Thanksgiving???> > > > Jo> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 so no one listens to her???? Lynda Oct 12, 2005 6:03 PM Re: Thanksgiving Oh dear, I may already have done this. Eldest daughter is named Kassondra <g> Lynda - peter hurd Just dont open Pandoras box, whatever you do! The Valley Vegan...........To send an email to - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 Nope. Not that this is necessarily a bad thing <g> Lynda - fraggle Thursday, October 13, 2005 8:29 AM Re: Thanksgiving so no one listens to her???? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 Thanks for the honesty Lynda, being Welsh, I know very little of how dominant cultures celebrations affect the displaced in other parts of the world, but am genuinely interested. The Valley Vegan............Lynda <lurine wrote: Some do. Mainly those who were denied thier culture. ' And some that do make it into a day to show what was actually done, to read the journals of Gov. Bradford and celebrate their own culture and not the myth. Same with Genocide Day (Columbus Day to others). Lynda - peter hurd Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:37 PM Re: Re: Thanksgiving Come on then explain this American custom to me. Do native Americans celebrate? what do they think of it? Have they anything to give thanks for? The Valley Vegan.............Anouk Sickler <zurumato wrote: Hi jo,I haven't liked thanksgiving in a while, for one thing, my family, as the years go by, the less time I want to spend with them. because I see them as soo different from me. my cousins, if I had to pick them as friends, I probably wouldn't.with the exception of my mom, they are just too mainstream. reason number two. there is just too much death, I can't raally recall the numberbut something like 600 million or so turkeys die on that day.That is just sadness, I go into mourning and have nothing to celebrate. I for being thankful?I am thankful every day in my private spiritual way and feel trulypicked/blessed/chosen/lucky/fortunate/grateful to have such apriviledged life. I am trying to gather up enough money to go to new york (in liue ofbirthday) to go for thanksgiving. to visit my mom. But ***MOSTLY** to go to Prada boutique. its on 57 streetand 5th avenue (i think). there will be a protest in front of the store. (non-violent)I will probably be handing out leaftlets to the public, that doesn't know that they kill baby seals to make thierpurses. I would love to meet up with anyone who is interested in going.> > , "jo" wrote:> >> > I like decorating indoors for the different seasons, and Pagan > festivals. Are there any particular decorations connected with > Thanksgiving???> > > > Jo> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 13, 2005 Strange name? ( spelling any way?), could have been worse could have been Echidna or Medusa? The Valley Vegan.............Lynda <lurine wrote: Oh dear, I may already have done this. Eldest daughter is named Kassondra <g> Lynda - peter hurd Just dont open Pandoras box, whatever you do! The Valley Vegan...........Peter H How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Photos. Get Photos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 14, 2005 Eldest son is Alexandar <g> We are into the individual and unique. Lynda - peter hurd Strange name? ( spelling any way?), could have been worse could have been Echidna or Medusa? The Valley Vegan............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 14, 2005 hi peter, i only know one native american person, my brother in law and my take on it is that he feels crummy. some native american indians, reclaim columbus day and instead call it Indigenous People Celebration day. they have a festival with food and traditions. they basically don't understand why the USA, declares a holiday, has parades, and praises someone (columbus) who basically was a slave trader and commited genecide. especially when he never even set foot in the united states! as far as thanksgiving, they feel that what is taught in the elementary school history books is one side and not the complete truth. They basically just ignore thanksgiving. , peter hurd <swpgh01@t...> wrote: > > Come on then explain this American custom to me. > Do native Americans celebrate? what do they think of it? Have they anything to give thanks for? > > The Valley Vegan............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 14, 2005 Hi nikki, it sounds like you are a great mom. my son is seven also, i also try to do things the same way. as far as I know, he still believes in santa claus. sometimes, when approaching a subject that is painful, like slavery for example, we look at facts, then I let him draw his own conclusion. I also try to talk about the positives. , " jo " <jo.heartwork@g...> wrote: > > Hi Nikki > > It sounds like you are doing things just right -IMO. Zak will find out > about the nastier things when he is older - no need to rush into it. > > BB > Jo > - > " earthstrm " <nikkimack@m...> > > Wednesday, October 12, 2005 2:45 PM > Re: Thanksgiving only 7 and quite a > > bit sensitive so I figure a little at a time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 14, 2005 I like to think everyone is an individual, despite their label/moniker. The Valley Vegan............Lynda <lurine wrote: Eldest son is Alexandar <g> We are into the individual and unique. Lynda - peter hurd Strange name? ( spelling any way?), could have been worse could have been Echidna or Medusa? The Valley Vegan.............Peter H Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2005 I'll vote for that! Peter for Prez! Lynda - peter hurd Friday, October 14, 2005 10:37 AM Re: Thanksgiving I like to think everyone is an individual, despite their label/moniker. The Valley Vegan............ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2005 Nah, I thought weagreed Fraggle was your man, but I`ll stand with him because his campaign will have the best music! The Valley Vegan.............Lynda <lurine wrote: I'll vote for that! Peter for Prez! Lynda - peter hurd Friday, October 14, 2005 10:37 AM Re: Thanksgiving I like to think everyone is an individual, despite their label/moniker. The Valley Vegan............Peter H To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Security Centre. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 17, 2005 Hi Anouk, Thank you very much, I do try. LOL And the same to you too! You seem to be very caring and thoughtful. I agree, whenever it is a touchy subject, I try to explain the facts delicately and then ask him how he feels about it and what he thinks. We then talk about it a bit. I figure it is of no use to lie, but sugar-coating at 7 is still a good idea. Part of me likes that Zak believes in Santa. It gives him something good to believe in and hope. I explained Santa in one of the old traditional ways in that he was a person who wanted to help needy children many years ago and still does help people. Of course then you get into the cartoons and stories on t.v. and the tale spins. Nikki , " Anouk Sickler " <zurumato@e...> wrote: > > Hi nikki, > > it sounds like you are a great mom. > my son is seven also, i also try to do things > the same way. as far as I know, > he still believes in santa claus. > > sometimes, when approaching a subject that is painful, > like slavery for example, we look at facts, > then I let him draw his own conclusion. > I also try to talk about the positives. > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 1, 2005 From the time I was a kid the turkey was my least favorite part of thanksgiving. In fact, sometimes there were so many other yummy favorites that I didn't even bother taking any. homemade mac and cheese, candied sweet potatoes, mashed potatoes in mushroom gravy, herbed stuffing smothered in said mushroom gravy, creamed onions, cranberry sauce, pineapple stuffing, OMG, who the heck needs a turkey??? unless you are inviting him to eat with you, in which case I would include a little dish of water as well. ) - thelilacflower Tuesday, November 01, 2005 7:11 AM Re: Howdy & " NAtural CUres " & THANKSGIVING Hi JLyn, Hsven't heard about this book but I can only imagine. Most of the time the cleaning solutions don't print anything on the container but " call poison control is accidently swallowed. " Or " make sure you have ventilation when using. " For Thanksgiving, are you going to make yourself stuffing on the side? Have you ever made fresh cranberry sauce? A sweet potato casserole? Sre you going to try a vegatable dish? Donna , J Rouge <spice_e_talula_rouge> wrote: > > Anyway, has anyone heard of Ken Treudue's book Natural Cures They don't Want you to know about? I started reading it last week. Ok can I just say that the stuff in there is awful. I mean he talks about all this crap in our food and cleaners and water... it makes you want to go live on some remote island, farm your own land, and boil every single once of water ever to cross your lips! Although I haven't finished it (still in the first third), I recommend it! > > What is every one serving for Thanks Giving? I want to serve something interesting. Of course the rest of the crew will have their typical turkey, but I'd like to have 2 or 3 veggie dishes that would wow staunch meat eaters (but be easy to cook! LOL). > > J Lyn > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 13, 2005 Wow,Melody that sounds fantastic! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2005 I totally understand. We are not going to either family so there are a couple of options. We can stay home and I can cook which would be fine except my husband wants turkey and I don't want to cook it. The kids and I would eat Tofurky or Unturkey. So, we will probably go out if we can find a place that has vegan food too. Last year, we went out only to find out the stuffing had sausage, there was butter on the veggies and masked potato. Thanksgiving dinner was plain pasta. This year I will plan better. It is so challenging having meat eaters at holiday celebration since there is usually traditional food (which is always meat for some reason). Carol Chessie <vegetariyum wrote: Just a little rant, hope no one minds...I have family coming in for the holiday and I had thought that the family meal was going to take place at someone else's house but it will be at mine instead. That's okay, but I am kicking myself for not anticipating this holiday better and testing vegan recipes beforehand. I just know this meal is going to be full of egg and dairy products, not to mention the turkey that they are bringing and I am really having a hard time with it this year. In the past I have simply ignored the meat products, but my new-found desire to become vegan changes everything. Also, the fact that I have children who are old enough to understand what's going on makes a difference. My stepdad is a lost cause, but my mother and brother are at least very aware omnis. They do eat meat, but have become educated about how it's produced and use a lot of meat alternatives too. I wish I had anticipated this and could prepare a vegan feast for them. I just have had so much going on I didn't think about it. I am going to try a few things though. I am going to make the tofu pudding chocolate pie with a cashew whipped topping, and a vegan pumpkin pie if I can find an easy recipe. I am still working on the vegetarian to vegan transition and it is going fairly well...struggling with the creamer issue though and with cheese and yogurt. Silk creamer is okay but still has that taste. I think the problem is that what I am drinking is really half coffee half milk. Maybe the nut milks will work better. Cheese - we use a lot of the veg slices and shreds, but how do you replace feta or smoked cheddar? And yogurt...I just haven't had a chance to try enough different kinds to find one that I like. But I do want to recommend that mori-nu (?) tofu pudding mix - it is incredible! One request...DH and DD #1 really love their milk and I don't think he will ever be able to go without it. I really want to transition her to soy, but in order to do so I will have to keep his secret from her. She always wants " daddy's milk. " Any advice on that? She gets that we don't eat animals, and I'm working on the " milk is for baby cows " idea. I guess I just need to find an alternative that she likes better. She does love chocolate silk...maybe the vanilla or very vanilla will work. Sorry so long, thanks for listening! Chessie For more information about vegetarianism, please visit the VRG website at http://www.vrg.org and for materials especially useful for families go to http://www.vrg.org/family.This is a discussion list and is not intended to provide personal medical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a qualified health professional. edical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a qualified health professional. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2005 Chessie, I'm not sure if you've seen or have a copy of November's Vegetarian Times, but the roasted vegetable cornucopias on the front cover look delicious and impressive. I saw those and told myself that if I ever host Thanksgiving at my house, I'm going to try and make those. The recipe is on the inside as well as some other holiday sides. I think a lot of the recipes are veg. rather than vegan but it's just an idea to throw out. I hope things go well for you and your family and know that the rest of us are in your shoes. I sponsored a turkey this Thanksgiving for the first time on that turkey adoption website that was suggested a couple of weeks ago and I've been trying to spread that around to my family that instead of sacrificing a poor turkey, that we can save one. I think I will start doing that every year and hope that my family will " catch on " . Doubtful but there's always hope. Good luck and have a happy holiday. Carrie - Chessie<vegetariyum < > Thursday, November 17, 2005 11:17 AM Thanksgiving Just a little rant, hope no one minds...I have family coming in for the holiday and I had thought that the family meal was going to take place at someone else's house but it will be at mine instead. That's okay, but I am kicking myself for not anticipating this holiday better and testing vegan recipes beforehand. I just know this meal is going to be full of egg and dairy products, not to mention the turkey that they are bringing and I am really having a hard time with it this year. In the past I have simply ignored the meat products, but my new-found desire to become vegan changes everything. Also, the fact that I have children who are old enough to understand what's going on makes a difference. My stepdad is a lost cause, but my mother and brother are at least very aware omnis. They do eat meat, but have become educated about how it's produced and use a lot of meat alternatives too. I wish I had anticipated this and could prepare a vegan feast for them. I just have had so much going on I didn't think about it. I am going to try a few things though. I am going to make the tofu pudding chocolate pie with a cashew whipped topping, and a vegan pumpkin pie if I can find an easy recipe. I am still working on the vegetarian to vegan transition and it is going fairly well...struggling with the creamer issue though and with cheese and yogurt. Silk creamer is okay but still has that taste. I think the problem is that what I am drinking is really half coffee half milk. Maybe the nut milks will work better. Cheese - we use a lot of the veg slices and shreds, but how do you replace feta or smoked cheddar? And yogurt...I just haven't had a chance to try enough different kinds to find one that I like. But I do want to recommend that mori-nu (?) tofu pudding mix - it is incredible! One request...DH and DD #1 really love their milk and I don't think he will ever be able to go without it. I really want to transition her to soy, but in order to do so I will have to keep his secret from her. She always wants " daddy's milk. " Any advice on that? She gets that we don't eat animals, and I'm working on the " milk is for baby cows " idea. I guess I just need to find an alternative that she likes better. She does love chocolate silk...maybe the vanilla or very vanilla will work. Sorry so long, thanks for listening! Chessie For more information about vegetarianism, please visit the VRG website at http://www.vrg.org<http://www.vrg.org/> and for materials especially useful for families go to http://www.vrg.org/family.This<http://www.vrg.org/family.This> is a discussion list and is not intended to provide personal medical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a qualified health professional. edical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a qualified health professional. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
