RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

[Guest guest]

Boring boring boring

 

 

slg edith [slgedith]

08 April 2003 07:45

 

RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Untrue (again), I reminded the list and people who don't already know

that

Leslie's extreme reaction against smokers is part of a wider nastier

agenda

of intolerance that would totally ban IUD contraception, emergency

contraception and abortion no matter how early even for rape victims,

introduce *protective custody* to force women to term if *necessary* and

 

raise the age of consent to at least 18!

 

Edith

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Just 'butting' in.... sorry... I used to work in a hospital as a teenage volunteer and there were these scary/sickly people spending their last days together all with terminal lung cancer and advanced emphysema in this one ward. They were allowed to drink beer through straws and as some of them could only breathe through a trachea tube, they were so shattered, the nurses used to put the cig into the trachea tube so they could enjoy a few puffs in their last days of life. It was pretty horrifying but the nurses carried this out with humour, love and dignity. This was in the 70s in a small town in Canada. I doubt if it would still happen now. Hopefully there's cannabis and hemp beer now. Strange world.

slg edith <slgedith wrote:

You sick a-hole, if a smoker is already DYING of cancer -- maybe dead in a few days! -- what good will it do to take away little relief of smoking (preferably cannabis)????Even condemned criminals get last cigerette I thought!>At st geoges hospital in Tooting they have a smoking room for the incurable>cancer patients.I looked in and saw people of all ages smoking, I find that>diabolical, and only warped logic could justify it.>>>Simon_______________Get Hotmail on your mobile phone http://www.msn.co.uk/mobile~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

I did not pass

> on anyone's personal details, that is a lie.

 

IIRC you forwarded my emails to him. It's not too difficult from

there to track down my home details, especially in the posts in

which I include my website URL.

 

I'm not particularly interested in dragging up old arguements either

but feel this point should be clarified.

[Guest guest]

I honestly can't remember forwarding anything with your actual details, it's very unlikely I did that, and I looked over old archived emails and was unable to find any such thing. All I could find was my emails to and from him regarding working together to get various accounts of people who had suffered workplace discrimination for their beliefs, as I was planning on getting our experiences and several others together in a booklet. I also found an email telling him of the discussion on the other list. That was all I did that I remember and all in all I only exchanged hardly more than half a dozen emails with him over several months prior to you bringing his name up on the other list. Edith's repeated and tedious accusations that I am friends with a fascist or even former fascist are a complete exaggeration of the situation.

 

Lesley

 

 

quercusrobur2002 [grahamburnett]08 April 2003 20:09 Subject: Re: Smoking debate via other thoughtsI did not pass> on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. IIRC you forwarded my emails to him. It's not too difficult from there to track down my home details, especially in the posts in which I include my website URL.I'm not particularly interested in dragging up old arguements either but feel this point should be clarified.~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

Mr Patrick Harrington was a leading member of the fascist National Front in

the 1980's and has nowhere repudiated fascism or nazism -- his " new "

political thinking was publicly condemned as " green " fascism by informed

anti-fascists -- yet Leslie still defends his innocence as a " former

fascist " and anyone who doesn't buy it must be some kind of " bigot " ! Yes,

and when a list member who had been an active anti-fascist objected that she

could have put him and his family in some danger she laughed at him and

called him chicken!! How gross is that!!!

 

Leslie starts with crap about smoking but the rest is coming out now and it

isn't very pretty.

 

Edith

 

 

 

 

 

 

> " Lesley Dove " <Lesley

>

>

>RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>Tue, 8 Apr 2003 14:06:57 +0100

>

>If anyone wants to know the truth of this (not that I think anyone is

>remotely interested..) they can email me directly. I can explain how I came

>to be emailing very briefly a former NF member and activist. I did not pass

>on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. I did however invite him onto

>the other list to defend himself against things that were being said about

>things he did many years ago. He never joined the list anyway. I felt he

>had

>the right to know what was being said and refute it and explain where he

>stood now if he chose to. He probably quite rightly thought it was not

>worth

>the bother because of bigots like Edith who cannot believe that people can

>change.

>

>Lesley

>

>

> slg edith [slgedith]

> 06 April 2003 22:34

>

> RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>

>

> >I hope Michael when he returns will take action over some of your

>comments

> >Lesley

>

> Leslie just wants me banned so she can tell lies without being

>contradicted

> even though I defended her from a life-time ban on the *other* list...

>

> That is Leslie, who passed on personal details of a vegan anti-fascist

>on

> this list to a notorious *former* fascist and now she is trying to

>justify

> herself!

>

> Edith

>

> _______________

> Overloaded with spam? With MSN 8, you can filter it out

>

>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail & pgmarket=en-gb & XAPID=32 & DI=1059

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Edith has a certain side to her character which won't let her forgive and forget . It would not be so bad if she did not keep harping on about it all the time . You are being punished on one list by being permanently banned (it would seem ) It looks imo as if she wants to do the same thing here by having a go all the time . It is boring for most of us and not fair to you Lesley or newer people.

 

New people having no knowledge of the situation might simply take her word

 

I suggest we all ignore the comments -hard for Lesley maybe -and of course its brought Graham in again now

 

Totally unnecessary imo

 

 

Lesley Dove [Lesley] 08 April 2003 22:45 Subject: RE: Re: Smoking debate via other thoughts

I honestly can't remember forwarding anything with your actual details, it's very unlikely I did that, and I looked over old archived emails and was unable to find any such thing. All I could find was my emails to and from him regarding working together to get various accounts of people who had suffered workplace discrimination for their beliefs, as I was planning on getting our experiences and several others together in a booklet. I also found an email telling him of the discussion on the other list. That was all I did that I remember and all in all I only exchanged hardly more than half a dozen emails with him over several months prior to you bringing his name up on the other list. Edith's repeated and tedious accusations that I am friends with a fascist or even former fascist are a complete exaggeration of the situation.

 

Lesley

 

 

 

---

 

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

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[Guest guest]

Go away and bully someone else Edith . IMO you are no different with

your continual bullying . Lesley has made mistakes and appologised . She

should not be forced to agree with you re this man of whom I personally

know nothing .

 

We cannot all know all issues . We don't keep atacking each other over

vegan mistakes and we all make them (this is a vegan list )

You have a cruel streak Edith and imo you should remove the mote out of

your own eye

 

 

 

slg edith [slgedith]

08 April 2003 22:56

 

RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

 

 

Mr Patrick Harrington was a leading member of the fascist National Front

in

the 1980's and has nowhere repudiated fascism or nazism -- his " new "

political thinking was publicly condemned as " green " fascism by informed

 

anti-fascists -- yet Leslie still defends his innocence as a " former

fascist " and anyone who doesn't buy it must be some kind of " bigot " !

Yes,

and when a list member who had been an active anti-fascist objected that

she

could have put him and his family in some danger she laughed at him and

called him chicken!! How gross is that!!!

 

Leslie starts with crap about smoking but the rest is coming out now and

it

isn't very pretty.

 

Edith

 

 

 

 

 

 

> " Lesley Dove " <Lesley

>

>

>RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>Tue, 8 Apr 2003 14:06:57 +0100

>

>If anyone wants to know the truth of this (not that I think anyone is

>remotely interested..) they can email me directly. I can explain how I

>came to be emailing very briefly a former NF member and activist. I did

 

>not pass on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. I did however

>invite him onto the other list to defend himself against things that

>were being said about things he did many years ago. He never joined the

 

>list anyway. I felt he had the right to know what was being said and

>refute it and explain where he stood now if he chose to. He probably

>quite rightly thought it was not worth

>the bother because of bigots like Edith who cannot believe that people

can

>change.

>

>Lesley

>

>

> slg edith [slgedith]

> 06 April 2003 22:34

>

> RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>

>

> >I hope Michael when he returns will take action over some of your

>comments

> >Lesley

>

> Leslie just wants me banned so she can tell lies without being

>contradicted

> even though I defended her from a life-time ban on the *other*

>list...

>

> That is Leslie, who passed on personal details of a vegan

>anti-fascist

>on

> this list to a notorious *former* fascist and now she is trying to

>justify

> herself!

>

> Edith

>

> _______________

> Overloaded with spam? With MSN 8, you can filter it out

>

>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail & pgmarket=en-gb & XAPID=32 & DI=

>1059

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Angie

 

Who is the *bully* vs smokers, rape victims...???

 

I didn't start all this stuff with Leslie -- she started repeating

her well known (to some of us!) anti-smoking campaign which is a

whole bag of untruths and nastiness.

 

Remind us, why did Viv say she wanted out?

 

Peace

 

Edith

xx

 

 

 

 

, " Angie Wright " <angiewright@n...>

wrote:

> Go away and bully someone else Edith . IMO you are no different with

> your continual bullying . Lesley has made mistakes and

appologised . She

> should not be forced to agree with you re this man of whom I

personally

> know nothing .

>

> We cannot all know all issues . We don't keep atacking each other

over

> vegan mistakes and we all make them (this is a vegan list )

> You have a cruel streak Edith and imo you should remove the mote

out of

> your own eye

>

> Angie

>

>

>

> slg edith [slgedith@h...]

> 08 April 2003 22:56

>

> RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>

>

> Mr Patrick Harrington was a leading member of the fascist National

Front

> in

> the 1980's and has nowhere repudiated fascism or nazism --

his " new "

> political thinking was publicly condemned as " green " fascism by

informed

>

> anti-fascists -- yet Leslie still defends his innocence as

a " former

> fascist " and anyone who doesn't buy it must be some kind of " bigot " !

> Yes,

> and when a list member who had been an active anti-fascist objected

that

> she

> could have put him and his family in some danger she laughed at him

and

> called him chicken!! How gross is that!!!

>

> Leslie starts with crap about smoking but the rest is coming out

now and

> it

> isn't very pretty.

>

> Edith

> " Lesley Dove " <Lesley@v...>

> >

> >

> >RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

> >Tue, 8 Apr 2003 14:06:57 +0100

> >

> >If anyone wants to know the truth of this (not that I think anyone

is

> >remotely interested..) they can email me directly. I can explain

how I

> >came to be emailing very briefly a former NF member and activist.

I did

>

> >not pass on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. I did

however

> >invite him onto the other list to defend himself against things

that

> >were being said about things he did many years ago. He never

joined the

>

> >list anyway. I felt he had the right to know what was being said

and

> >refute it and explain where he stood now if he chose to. He

probably

> >quite rightly thought it was not worth

> >the bother because of bigots like Edith who cannot believe that

people

> can

> >change.

> >

> >Lesley

> >

> >

> > slg edith [slgedith@h...]

> > 06 April 2003 22:34

> >

> > RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

> >

> >

> > >I hope Michael when he returns will take action over some of

your

> >comments

> > >Lesley

> >

> > Leslie just wants me banned so she can tell lies without being

> >contradicted

> > even though I defended her from a life-time ban on the *other*

> >list...

> >

> > That is Leslie, who passed on personal details of a vegan

> >anti-fascist

> >on

> > this list to a notorious *former* fascist and now she is trying

to

> >justify

> > herself!

> >

> > Edith

> >

> >

_______________

> > Overloaded with spam? With MSN 8, you can filter it out

> >

> >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail & pgmarket=en-

gb & XAPID=32 & DI=

> >1059

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Smokers are the bullies not the bullied, my mum was the bully (even though she probably didn't understand herself to be a bully) smoking indoors even coming into my bedroom smoking when I had begged her to keep it out of my way because it made me feel ill, I used to sit up most of the night trying to breathe, I used to cough nearly all the time, I was even bullied at school for coughing all the time. Kilroy is on right now and it's about the effects of bullying on kids who were bullied. Standing up to smokers is self-preservation, not bullying. The only bullies to rape victims are rapists, people who try to help them escape the second assault of abortion which they are often pushed into if they are pregnant from rape are not bullies, they want to help both the innocent victims.

 

If you had suffered from second-hand smoke as a child the way I had, you would understand better. Lots of kids are affected, a little boy in my daughter's class just the other day told my daughter how much his mum smoking in the car with him and his sisters bothers him. He is also one of the naughtiest boys in the class according to my daughter, I think he may be playing up because of the way his mum clearly disrespects his right to fresh air, because I did exactly the same for years, complained and misbehaved, and everyone thought I was naughty when I was just crying out for help because I felt so ill all the time. I'm tempted to tell his mum what she is doing to her kids. Just because tobacco smoke does not bother you Edith, does not mean we all react the same as you or Viv.

 

Thanks Angie for the support. I did indeed apologise at the time for my mistake in making Graham feel threatened, even though I really did not believe there was any threat, and nothing bad has happened to Graham that I know of as a result of my invitation to this person to state his case on the group. He completely ignored the whole thing - probably the most mature thing to do really.

 

Edith has a bee in her bonnet and is irrational about anything to do with fascism, even people who were fascist a very long time ago, as far as she is concerned they can never change. It's a good job most of us don't think this way about animal-eaters or we would never talk to them or try to change them!

 

Lesley

 

 

slgedith [slgedith]09 April 2003 07:44 Subject: Re: Smoking debate via other thoughtsAngieWho is the *bully* vs smokers, rape victims...???I didn't start all this stuff with Leslie -- she started repeating her well known (to some of us!) anti-smoking campaign which is a whole bag of untruths and nastiness.Remind us, why did Viv say she wanted out?PeaceEdithxx , "Angie Wright" <angiewright@n...> wrote:> Go away and bully someone else Edith . IMO you are no different with> your continual bullying . Lesley has made mistakes and appologised . She> should not be forced to agree with you re this man of whom I personally> know nothing .> > We cannot all know all issues . We don't keep atacking each other over> vegan mistakes and we all make them (this is a vegan list )> You have a cruel streak Edith and imo you should remove the mote out of> your own eye> > Angie> > > > slg edith [slgedith@h...] > 08 April 2003 22:56> > RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts> > > Mr Patrick Harrington was a leading member of the fascist National Front> in > the 1980's and has nowhere repudiated fascism or nazism -- his "new" > political thinking was publicly condemned as "green" fascism by informed> > anti-fascists -- yet Leslie still defends his innocence as a "former > fascist" and anyone who doesn't buy it must be some kind of "bigot"!> Yes, > and when a list member who had been an active anti-fascist objected that> she > could have put him and his family in some danger she laughed at him and > called him chicken!! How gross is that!!!> > Leslie starts with crap about smoking but the rest is coming out now and> it > isn't very pretty.> > Edith> > > > > > > >"Lesley Dove" <Lesley@v...>> > > >> >RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts> >Tue, 8 Apr 2003 14:06:57 +0100> >> >If anyone wants to know the truth of this (not that I think anyone is > >remotely interested..) they can email me directly. I can explain how I > >came to be emailing very briefly a former NF member and activist. I did> > >not pass on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. I did however > >invite him onto the other list to defend himself against things that > >were being said about things he did many years ago. He never joined the> > >list anyway. I felt he had the right to know what was being said and > >refute it and explain where he stood now if he chose to. He probably > >quite rightly thought it was not worth> >the bother because of bigots like Edith who cannot believe that people> can> >change.> >> >Lesley> >> > > > slg edith [slgedith@h...]> > 06 April 2003 22:34> > > > RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts> >> >> > >I hope Michael when he returns will take action over some of your > >comments> > >Lesley> >> > Leslie just wants me banned so she can tell lies without being > >contradicted> > even though I defended her from a life-time ban on the *other* > >list...> >> > That is Leslie, who passed on personal details of a vegan > >anti-fascist> >on> > this list to a notorious *former* fascist and now she is trying to > >justify> > herself!> >> > Edith> >> > _______________> > Overloaded with spam? With MSN 8, you can filter it out> >> >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail & pgmarket=en-gb & XAPID=32 & DI=> >1059> >> >> >

[Guest guest]

Graham, unnecessary? ... or bringing him in is unnecessary? ...

 

 

 

Angie Wright [angiewright]

I suggest we all ignore the comments -hard for Lesley maybe -and of course its brought Graham in again now

 

Totally unnecessary imo

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

It is new to some people ,we need to remember that . We all repeat

ourselves -even you !

 

You or Viv ? Brought it all up when someone wanted to know more details

aboit the banned person and asked on the wrong list .

 

It has gone on from there . I'm bored by it so will stop now . I just

wish you would leave her alone

 

 

slgedith [slgedith]

09 April 2003 07:44

 

Re: Smoking debate via other thoughts

 

 

Who is the *bully* vs smokers, rape victims...???

 

I didn't start all this stuff with Leslie -- she started repeating

her well known (to some of us!) anti-smoking campaign which is a

whole bag of untruths and nastiness.

 

Remind us, why did Viv say she wanted out?

 

Peace

 

Edith

xx

 

 

 

 

, " Angie Wright " <angiewright@n...>

wrote:

> Go away and bully someone else Edith . IMO you are no different with

> your continual bullying . Lesley has made mistakes and

appologised . She

> should not be forced to agree with you re this man of whom I

personally

> know nothing .

>

> We cannot all know all issues . We don't keep atacking each other

over

> vegan mistakes and we all make them (this is a vegan list ) You have a

 

> cruel streak Edith and imo you should remove the mote

out of

> your own eye

>

> Angie

>

>

>

> slg edith [slgedith@h...]

> 08 April 2003 22:56

>

> RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

>

>

> Mr Patrick Harrington was a leading member of the fascist National

Front

> in

> the 1980's and has nowhere repudiated fascism or nazism --

his " new "

> political thinking was publicly condemned as " green " fascism by

informed

>

> anti-fascists -- yet Leslie still defends his innocence as

a " former

> fascist " and anyone who doesn't buy it must be some kind of " bigot " !

> Yes, and when a list member who had been an active anti-fascist

> objected

that

> she

> could have put him and his family in some danger she laughed at him

and

> called him chicken!! How gross is that!!!

>

> Leslie starts with crap about smoking but the rest is coming out

now and

> it

> isn't very pretty.

>

> Edith

> " Lesley Dove " <Lesley@v...>

> >

> >

> >RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

> >Tue, 8 Apr 2003 14:06:57 +0100

> >

> >If anyone wants to know the truth of this (not that I think anyone

is

> >remotely interested..) they can email me directly. I can explain

how I

> >came to be emailing very briefly a former NF member and activist.

I did

>

> >not pass on anyone's personal details, that is a lie. I did

however

> >invite him onto the other list to defend himself against things

that

> >were being said about things he did many years ago. He never

joined the

>

> >list anyway. I felt he had the right to know what was being said

and

> >refute it and explain where he stood now if he chose to. He

probably

> >quite rightly thought it was not worth

> >the bother because of bigots like Edith who cannot believe that

people

> can

> >change.

> >

> >Lesley

> >

> >

> > slg edith [slgedith@h...]

> > 06 April 2003 22:34

> >

> > RE: Smoking debate via other thoughts

> >

> >

> > >I hope Michael when he returns will take action over some of

your

> >comments

> > >Lesley

> >

> > Leslie just wants me banned so she can tell lies without being

> >contradicted

> > even though I defended her from a life-time ban on the *other*

> >list...

> >

> > That is Leslie, who passed on personal details of a vegan

> >anti-fascist

> >on

> > this list to a notorious *former* fascist and now she is trying

to

> >justify

> > herself!

> >

> > Edith

> >

> >

_______________

> > Overloaded with spam? With MSN 8, you can filter it out

> >

> >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail & pgmarket=en-

gb & XAPID=32 & DI=

> >1059

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Possibly both !!! but I meant that , the comments were unnecessary (badly written I know )

 

 

Oliver Slay [oliver] 09 April 2003 10:34 Subject: RE: Re: Smoking debate via other thoughts

Graham, unnecessary? ... or bringing him in is unnecessary? ...

 

 

 

Angie Wright [angiewright]

I suggest we all ignore the comments -hard for Lesley maybe -and of course its brought Graham in again now

 

Totally unnecessary imo

 

 

~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

you keep telling us that.... :-)

 

Angie Wright [angiewright]

 

 

 

We all repeat ourselves -even you !