Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make sense

November 4, 2009

Dear Friends,

KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit is among them.

I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position, it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord, possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th lord from Moon.

Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I have many cases where it fails.

In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

Thanks & Regards,Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish wrote:

Dear Sundar,

In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other dashas like Yogini are showing it.

Let’s forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be involved.

Natal chart,

Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

Won’t be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august 2010 !!!

Regards,Aashish

Sundar <sundar190561 Sent: Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM

Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

Dear AashishI know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?Thanks...... ....Sundar

@gro ups.com, aashish rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Sundarji,> I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am not elaborating.

> > Regards,> Aashish> > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> @gro ups.com

> Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> Post mortem analysis of marriage> > > > Dear Learned members> > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.

> > dob: 25th Aug, 1979> tob: 9.37 (rectified)> pob: Mumbai> > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > dasha/bukti/ antra> > planet sgl stl sl

> (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9) > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)> > rahu=sun(11, 12)> ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)

> > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > planet sgl stl sl > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)> (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)

> (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.

> > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > Thanks...... ...Sundar> > > > > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview. mail.. com/connectmore

>

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November 4, 2009

Dear Punit,

I completely agree with you...Mr.K.N.Rao comes out with his own theories,many of which when tried out carefully fail to give any correct results...I listen to his programme on TV...but I am most disappointed to listen to him...justifying events after they have taken place...!

With kind regards,

Yogesh Lajmi.

Punit Pandey <punitp Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make sense Date: Wednesday, November 4, 2009, 1:22 PM

Dear Friends,

KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit is among them.

I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position, it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord, possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as well as

Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th lord from Moon.

Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I have many cases where it fails.

In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

Thanks & Regards,Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote:

Dear Sundar,

In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other dashas like Yogini are showing it.

Letâ€™s forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be involved.

Natal chart,

Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

Wonâ€™t be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august 2010 !!!

Regards,Aashish

Sundar <sundar190561@ .co. in> @gro ups.comWed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

Dear AashishI know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?Thanks...... ....Sundar

@gro ups.com, aashish rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Sundarji,> I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am not elaborating.> > Regards,> Aashish> > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> @gro ups.com

> Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> Post mortem analysis of marriage> > > > Dear Learned members> > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.> > dob: 25th Aug, 1979> tob: 9.37 (rectified)> pob: Mumbai> > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > dasha/bukti/ antra> > planet sgl stl sl > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9) > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)> > rahu=sun(11, 12)> ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)> > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > planet sgl stl sl > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4-

7)> (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)> (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.> > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > Thanks...... ...Sundar> > > > > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview. mail.. com/connectmore>

Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn more.

November 4, 2009

Hi Punit

Like many of the 100s of tools that Jyotish gives - don't believe in all the

techniques that one comes up with. From Paul Manley's website here is what he

says

" What you'll see in the following illustrations is how the sign(s) that gets the

double transit will shift, generally from year to year. In fact, there are only

two positions of Jupiter and Saturn that will not have the double transit

phenomenon – when Jupiter is in the 8th or 12th house from Saturn. This means

that 10 out of the 12 possible positions, or more than 80% of the time, there

will be the double transit phenomenon happening in at least one sign, possibly

two. "

I have see this double transit work sometimes and sometimes not. Obviuosly we

have to pay attention to sookshma transits (or finer transits) and just double

transit.

I urge some expert to answer my question on the Placidus house system for a

chart that I put on the other day. One bhava covers 58 deg of zodiac, there are

3 planets in 8th house; This person is very succesful. I can explain every event

using vedic astreology and nakshatra analysis. The moment I put 3 planets in 8th

in this chart, I am lost.

For latititude that are closer to 66 deg N or S - I believe the Placidus system

of houses give wierd house cusps(correct me if I am wrong). This actor was born

in Scotland where latitude in 55deg. My question is for people born in such

norhtern altitudes -what system works? Is it still Placidus wasy of calculating

houses or something else. There should a clear answer from KP experts. I am

hoping there is that person in this list.

thanks

, Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:

>

> Dear Friends,

>

> KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I

> always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by

> which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for

> timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit

> is among them.

>

> I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful

> for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit

> suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal

> 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

>

> Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position,

> it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any

> point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is

> also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord,

> possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have

> 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other

> words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is

> influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider

> some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I

> have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than

> Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not

> aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th

> lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as

> well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either

> 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th

> lord from Moon.

>

> Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for

> Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that

> Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

>

> To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing

> the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I

> have many cases where it fails.

>

> In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

>

> Thanks & Regards,

>

> Punit Pandey

>

> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish wrote:

>

> >

> > Dear Sundar,

> >

> > In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only

> > required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other

> > dashas like Yogini are showing it.

> >

> > Let's forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri

> > Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect

> > natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be

> > involved.

> >

> > Natal chart,

> >

> > Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

> >

> > Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

> >

> > Won't be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august

> > 2010 !!!

> >

> > Regards,

> > Aashish

> >

> > ------------------------------

> > ** Sundar <sundar190561

> >

> > *To:*

> > *Sent:* Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM

> > *Subject:* Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

> >

> > Dear Aashish

> >

> > I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus

> > PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?

> >

> > Thanks...... ....Sundar

> >

> > @gro ups.com <%40>, aashish

> > rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Sundarji,

> > > I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you

> > use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am

> > not elaborating.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > > Aashish

> > >

> > > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > > Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>

> > > @gro ups.com <%40>

> >

> > > Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM

> > > Post mortem analysis of marriage

> > >

> > > Dear Learned members

> > >

> > > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit

> > of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.

> > >

> > > dob: 25th Aug, 1979

> > > tob: 9.37 (rectified)

> > > pob: Mumbai

> > >

> > > Time of birth reported is 9.22am

> > > Ayanamsha : 23.28.58

> > >

> > > dasha/bukti/ antra

> > >

> > > planet sgl stl sl

> > > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)

> > > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)

> > > (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)

> > >

> > > rahu=sun(11, 12)

> > > ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)

> > >

> > > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am

> > >

> > > planet sgl stl sl

> > > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)

> > > (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)

> > > (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)

> > >

> > > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)

> > > moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)

> > >

> > > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS

> > (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.

> > >

> > > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.

> > >

> > > Thanks...... ...Sundar

> > >

> > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how.

http://in.overview.

> > mail.. com/connectmore<http://in.overview.mail./connectmore>

> > >

> >

> > ------------------------------

> > Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn

more<http://in.rd./tagline_galaxy_3/*http://in.overview.mail./\

>

> > .

> >

>

November 4, 2009

Dear Mssumich,

Please note few points -

1. A method needs to be mathematically correct first before we can talk about predictive aspect of the method. As I mentioned this method is fundamentally flawed and doesn't make sense. I have mentioned the reason and would love to hear if somebody can show that I am missing something.

2. Double transit, as mentioned by Paul Manley, is different from what Shri KN Rao has used in his books. By Double-Transit, Shri KN Rao doesn't mean that both the planet should aspect one single sign, but one planet aspecting the house and other house lord (generally). As I demonstrated, this condition will match almost 100% of time and hence it makes this tool a good tool for post-mortem and justification. Though not useful for predictions.

3. If a method doesn't work, we should leave it and move on. If we will not accept that the method doesn't make sense, we can not discard it. By saying something like " we need to check dasa and yoga etc. " , we want to prove it some way or other. Why? If it doens't work, it doesn't work. We should not accpet anything blindly. There are quite a few teachings by Shri KN Rao that works and we should use them. Teachings that do not work, we should discard them.

4. I don not understand why you are mixing placidus with double-transit. Let us not mix both the threads. Though i guess that the way you asked your earlier question was not good for generating discussion. In my opinion, correct way for asking question is to present your own analysis and ask your question. If you are learner, you should present your detailed analysis. What is your analysis as per KP? What is your analysis as per Traditional? Saying that I am able to justify events using Traditional but not KP seems too vague a statement. I do not see reference of Sub in your post. I don't see reference of Nakshatra in your post. That doesn't qualify as a KP analysis and hence doesn't provoke any response. This I guess may be the reason you didn't get response.

Thanks & Regards,

Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 9:45 PM, mssumich <mssumich wrote:

Hi PunitLike many of the 100s of tools that Jyotish gives - don't believe in all the techniques that one comes up with. From Paul Manley's website here is what he says " What you'll see in the following illustrations is how the sign(s) that gets the double transit will shift, generally from year to year. In fact, there are only two positions of Jupiter and Saturn that will not have the double transit phenomenon – when Jupiter is in the 8th or 12th house from Saturn. This means that 10 out of the 12 possible positions, or more than 80% of the time, there will be the double transit phenomenon happening in at least one sign, possibly two. "

I have see this double transit work sometimes and sometimes not. Obviuosly we have to pay attention to sookshma transits (or finer transits) and just double transit.I urge some expert to answer my question on the Placidus house system for a chart that I put on the other day. One bhava covers 58 deg of zodiac, there are 3 planets in 8th house; This person is very succesful. I can explain every event using vedic astreology and nakshatra analysis. The moment I put 3 planets in 8th in this chart, I am lost.

For latititude that are closer to 66 deg N or S - I believe the Placidus system of houses give wierd house cusps(correct me if I am wrong). This actor was born in Scotland where latitude in 55deg. My question is for people born in such norhtern altitudes -what system works? Is it still Placidus wasy of calculating houses or something else. There should a clear answer from KP experts. I am hoping there is that person in this list.

thanks

, Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:>> Dear Friends,> > KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I

> always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by> which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for> timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit

> is among them.> > I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful> for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit> suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal

> 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.> > Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position,> it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any

> point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is> also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord,> possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have

> 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other> words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is> influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider

> some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I> have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than> Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not

> aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th> lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as> well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either

> 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th> lord from Moon.> > Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for> Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that

> Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.> > To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing> the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I

> have many cases where it fails.> > In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.> > Thanks & Regards,> > Punit Pandey> >

> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish wrote:> > >> >> > Dear Sundar,> >> > In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only

> > required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other> > dashas like Yogini are showing it.> >> >> >> > Let's forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri

> > Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect> > natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be> > involved.> >> >> >

> > Natal chart,> >> > Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna> >> > Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house> >> >> >

> >> > Won't be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august> > 2010 !!!> >> > Regards,> > Aashish> >> > ------------------------------

> > ** Sundar <sundar190561> >> > *To:* > > *Sent:* Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM> > *Subject:* Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage> >> >> >> > Dear Aashish> >> > I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus

> > PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?> >> > Thanks...... ....Sundar> >> > @gro ups.com <%40>, aashish > > rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Sundarji,> > > I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you> > use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am

> > not elaborating.> > >> > > Regards,> > > Aashish> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > > Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> > > @gro ups.com <%40>

> >> > > Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> > > Post mortem analysis of marriage> > >> > >> > >> > > Dear Learned members

> > >> > > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit> > of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.> > >> > > dob: 25th Aug, 1979

> > > tob: 9.37 (rectified)> > > pob: Mumbai> > >> > > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> > > Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > >> > > dasha/bukti/ antra

> > >> > > planet sgl stl sl> > > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)> > > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> > > (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)

> > >> > > rahu=sun(11, 12)> > > ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)> > >> > > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > >> > > planet sgl stl sl

> > > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)> > > (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)> > > (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > >

> > > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> > > moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > >> > > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS

> > (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.> > >> > > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > >> > > Thanks...... ...Sundar

> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview.

> > mail.. com/connectmore<http://in.overview.mail./connectmore>> > >> >> >

> > ------------------------------> > Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn more<http://in.rd./tagline_galaxy_3/*http://in.overview.mail./>

> > .> >> > > >>

November 4, 2009

5 Nov 2009

Dear Punit Bhai

I have tried Double Transit method from Asc as well as from Moon,

some twenty years ago and I found that to be around 30% success and I

personally don’t believe that’s good enough for prediction.

I am not too sure what’s the experience of other astrologers.

I would rather stick to KP though I am not getting 100% results here either.

Regards

Ravinder Grover

On Behalf Of Punit

Pandey

Thursday, November 05, 2009 2:22 AM

Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make

sense

Dear Friends,

KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP

astrologer, I always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary

method by which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another

such method for timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN

Rao's double transit is among them.

I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem

and not useful for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage.

Double-transit suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be

aspecting Natal 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its

own position, it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that

at any point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is

also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord,

possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have

66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other words,

around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is influencing

either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider some of the

possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I have seen Shri KN

Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than Ascendant. Which doubles the

possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting

from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th lord from Moon. So in any point of one's

life, if take transit from Moon as well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that

Jupiter will influencing either 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant,

or 7th from Moon, or 7th lord from Moon.

Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up

is true for Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I

feel that Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I

checked reducing the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I

do that way, I have many cases where it fails.

In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful

at all.

Thanks & Regards,

Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish wrote:

Dear Sundar,

In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if

vimshottari was only required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many

dashas. Other dashas like Yogini are showing it.

Let’s forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit

theory of Shri Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn

and Jupiter aspect natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th

lord will be involved.

Natal chart,

Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and

Lagna

Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th

house

Won’t be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before

end august 2010 !!!

Regards,

Aashish

Sundar <sundar190561

Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM

Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

Dear Aashish

I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus PAD.

But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?

Thanks...... ....Sundar

@gro

ups.com, aashish rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:

>

> Dear Sundarji,

> I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you

use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am

not elaborating.

>

> Regards,

> Aashish

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>

> @gro

ups.com

> Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM

> Post mortem analysis of marriage

>

> Dear Learned members

>

> My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit

of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.

>

> dob: 25th Aug, 1979

> tob: 9.37 (rectified)

> pob: Mumbai

>

> Time of birth reported is 9.22am

> Ayanamsha : 23.28.58

>

> dasha/bukti/ antra

>

> planet sgl stl sl

> (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)

> (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)

> (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)

>

> rahu=sun(11, 12)

> ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)

>

> Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am

>

> planet sgl stl sl

> (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)

> (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)

> (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)

>

> sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)

> moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)

>

> Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS

(except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.

>

> In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.

>

> Thanks...... ...Sundar

>

> Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview.

mail.. com/connectmore

>

Connect more, do more and share

more with India Mail. Learn more.

November 5, 2009

Dear mssumich,

The placidus system is valid for the latitude up to 66d30m only. As you have mentioned that the birth place of the person is 55Deg north, the diurnal circle will show more day time than night and vice versa depending upon the sun declination. However for this sort of latitude the distance (difference in degree) between the two consecutive cusps may go high as mentioned by you. I have not cast any charts for such high latitude may be our members who have experienced with such latitude may answer for your query.

Is there any astrology is followed in Scotland. If so what is the house division followed may be checked for you to proceed further.

You may need to test few more case to conclude that the use of placidus house for higher latitude in KP system.

I am unable provide more details and it needs some study.

GOOD LUCK!

D.Senthil--- On Wed, 11/4/09, mssumich <mssumich wrote:

mssumich <mssumich Re: Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make sense Date: Wednesday, November 4, 2009, 8:15 AM

Hi PunitLike many of the 100s of tools that Jyotish gives - don't believe in all the techniques that one comes up with. From Paul Manley's website here is what he says"What you'll see in the following illustrations is how the sign(s) that gets the double transit will shift, generally from year to year. In fact, there are only two positions of Jupiter and Saturn that will not have the double transit phenomenon â€“ when Jupiter is in the 8th or 12th house from Saturn. This means that 10 out of the 12 possible positions, or more than 80% of the time, there will be the double transit phenomenon happening in at least one sign, possibly two."I have see this double transit work sometimes and sometimes not. Obviuosly we have to pay attention to sookshma transits (or finer transits) and just double transit.I urge some expert to answer my question on the Placidus house system for a chart that I put on the other day. One bhava covers 58

deg of zodiac, there are 3 planets in 8th house; This person is very succesful. I can explain every event using vedic astreology and nakshatra analysis. The moment I put 3 planets in 8th in this chart, I am lost.For latititude that are closer to 66 deg N or S - I believe the Placidus system of houses give wierd house cusps(correct me if I am wrong). This actor was born in Scotland where latitude in 55deg. My question is for people born in such norhtern altitudes -what system works? Is it still Placidus wasy of calculating houses or something else. There should a clear answer from KP experts. I am hoping there is that person in this list.thanks@gro ups.com, Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:>> Dear Friends,> > KP made

timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I> always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by> which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for> timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit> is among them.> > I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful> for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit> suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal> 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.> > Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position,> it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any> point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is> also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th

lord,> possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have> 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other> words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is> influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider> some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I> have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than> Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not> aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th> lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as> well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either> 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th> lord from Moon.> > Similarly, Saturn also has

3 aspects and the above write-up is true for> Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that> Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.> > To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing> the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I> have many cases where it fails.> > In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.> > Thanks & Regards,> > Punit Pandey> > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:> > >> >> > Dear Sundar,> >> > In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only> > required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other> > dashas like Yogini are showing it.> >>

>> >> > Let's forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri> > Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect> > natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be> > involved.> >> >> >> > Natal chart,> >> > Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna> >> > Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house> >> >> >> >> > Won't be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august> > 2010 !!!> >> > Regards,> > Aashish> >> > ------------ --------- ---------> > ** Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> >> > *To:* @gro ups.com> > *Sent:* Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM> > *Subject:* Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage> >> >> >> > Dear Aashish> >> > I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus> > PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?> >> > Thanks...... ....Sundar> >> > @gro ups.com <% 40. com>, aashish> > rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Sundarji,> > > I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you> > use traditional astrology it's very clear. As

this forum is for KP only I am> > not elaborating.> > >> > > Regards,> > > Aashish> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > ____________ _________ _________ __> > > Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> > > @gro ups.com <% 40. com>> >> > > Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> > > Post mortem analysis of marriage> > >> > >> > >> > > Dear Learned members> > >> > > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit> > of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.> > >> > > dob: 25th Aug, 1979> > > tob: 9.37 (rectified)> > > pob: Mumbai> >

>> > > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> > > Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > >> > > dasha/bukti/ antra> > >> > > planet sgl stl sl> > > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)> > > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> > > (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)> > >> > > rahu=sun(11, 12)> > > ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)> > >> > > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > >> > > planet sgl stl sl> > > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)> > > (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)> > > (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > >> > > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> > > moon

mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > >> > > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS> > (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.> > >> > > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > >> > > Thanks...... ...Sundar> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview.> > mail.. com/connectmore<http://in.overview. mail.. com/connectmore>> > >> >> >> > ------------ --------- ---------> > Connect more, do more and share more with India

Mail. Learn more<http://in.rd. / tagline_galaxy_ 3/*http:/ /in.overview. mail.. com/>> > .> >> > > >>

November 5, 2009

Dear Punitji,

Good Morning.

I feel it is very correct what you have stated about the Double transit. I do agree with your suggestion that we should search out another complementary rule or method for fixing the time of event. In many cases we are not able to arrive at the correct time with the existing rules.

Regards.

Dr. Rath

Punit Pandey <punitp Sent: Wed, November 4, 2009 6:52:20 PM Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make sense

Dear Friends,

KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit is among them.

I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position, it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord, possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as well as

Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th lord from Moon.

Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I have many cases where it fails.

In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

Thanks & Regards,Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote:

Dear Sundar,

In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other dashas like Yogini are showing it.

Letâ€™s forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be involved.

Natal chart,

Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

Wonâ€™t be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august 2010 !!!

Regards,Aashish

Sundar <sundar190561@ .co. in> @gro ups.comWed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

Dear AashishI know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?Thanks...... ....Sundar

@gro ups.com, aashish rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Sundarji,> I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if you use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only I am not elaborating.> > Regards,> Aashish> > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> @gro ups.com

> Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> Post mortem analysis of marriage> > > > Dear Learned members> > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The transit of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.> > dob: 25th Aug, 1979> tob: 9.37 (rectified)> pob: Mumbai> > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > dasha/bukti/ antra> > planet sgl stl sl > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9) > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)> > rahu=sun(11, 12)> ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)> > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > planet sgl stl sl > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4-

7)> (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)> (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify DBAS (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.> > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > Thanks...... ...Sundar> > > > > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how. http://in.overview. mail.. com/connectmore>

Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn more.

November 5, 2009

Dear Friends,Some are using the following mathematically incorrect BTR method although Guruji KSK had clearly said to use only the RPs in birth time rectification.Asc Sub = Moon Star & Asc Sub-Sub = Moon Sub Rule.doc Explanation of the Test Results (in File section)To find birth time--- only the Ruling Planets at the moment of judgment will be useful and innumerable instances are given in the magazine "Astrology & Athrishta."-KP Reader VI page 138 (any edition)-- our beloved Guruji had found and was correct to tell that the RPs alone can be well used for the rectification of birth time in charts.-Prof. Vikari Ramamurthy in KPE-zine Nov 2009Regards,TW , Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:>> Dear Mssumich,> > Please note few points -> > 1. A method needs to be mathematically correct first before we can talk> about predictive aspect of the method. As I mentioned this method is> fundamentally flawed and doesn't make sense. I have mentioned the reason and> would love to hear if somebody can show that I am missing something.> > 2. Double transit, as mentioned by Paul Manley, is different from what Shri> KN Rao has used in his books. By Double-Transit, Shri KN Rao doesn't mean> that both the planet should aspect one single sign, but one planet aspecting> the house and other house lord (generally). As I demonstrated, this> condition will match almost 100% of time and hence it makes this tool a good> tool for post-mortem and justification. Though not useful for predictions.> > 3. If a method doesn't work, we should leave it and move on. If we will not> accept that the method doesn't make sense, we can not discard it. By saying> something like "we need to check dasa and yoga etc.", we want to prove it> some way or other. Why? If it doens't work, it doesn't work. We should not> accpet anything blindly. There are quite a few teachings by Shri KN Rao that> works and we should use them. Teachings that do not work, we should discard> them.> > 4. I don not understand why you are mixing placidus with double-transit. Let> us not mix both the threads. Though i guess that the way you asked your> earlier question was not good for generating discussion. In my opinion,> correct way for asking question is to present your own analysis and ask your> question. If you are learner, you should present your detailed analysis.> What is your analysis as per KP? What is your analysis as per Traditional?> Saying that I am able to justify events using Traditional but not KP seems> too vague a statement. I do not see reference of Sub in your post. I don't> see reference of Nakshatra in your post. That doesn't qualify as a KP> analysis and hence doesn't provoke any response. This I guess may be the> reason you didn't get response.> > Thanks & Regards,> Punit Pandey> > On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 9:45 PM, mssumich mssumich wrote:> > >> >> > Hi Punit> > Like many of the 100s of tools that Jyotish gives - don't believe in all> > the techniques that one comes up with. From Paul Manley's website here is> > what he says> > "What you'll see in the following illustrations is how the sign(s) that> > gets the double transit will shift, generally from year to year. In fact,> > there are only two positions of Jupiter and Saturn that will not have the> > double transit phenomenon – when Jupiter is in the 8th or 12th house from> > Saturn. This means that 10 out of the 12 possible positions, or more than> > 80% of the time, there will be the double transit phenomenon happening in at> > least one sign, possibly two."> >> > I have see this double transit work sometimes and sometimes not. Obviuosly> > we have to pay attention to sookshma transits (or finer transits) and just> > double transit.> >> > I urge some expert to answer my question on the Placidus house system for a> > chart that I put on the other day. One bhava covers 58 deg of zodiac, there> > are 3 planets in 8th house; This person is very succesful. I can explain> > every event using vedic astreology and nakshatra analysis. The moment I put> > 3 planets in 8th in this chart, I am lost.> >> > For latititude that are closer to 66 deg N or S - I believe the Placidus> > system of houses give wierd house cusps(correct me if I am wrong). This> > actor was born in Scotland where latitude in 55deg. My question is for> > people born in such norhtern altitudes -what system works? Is it still> > Placidus wasy of calculating houses or something else. There should a clear> > answer from KP experts. I am hoping there is that person in this list.> > thanks> >> >> > <%40>, Punit> > Pandey punitp@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Friends,> > >> > > KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I> > > always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by> > > which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method> > for> > > timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double> > transit> > > is among them.> > >> > > I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful> > > for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage.> > Double-transit> > > suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting> > Natal> > > 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.> > >> > > Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own> > position,> > > it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any> > > point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is> > > also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord,> > > possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we> > have> > > 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other> > > words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is> > > influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't> > consider> > > some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I> > > have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than> > > Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not> > > aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th> > > lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon> > as> > > well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing> > either> > > 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th> > > lord from Moon.> > >> > > Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for> > > Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that> > > Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.> > >> > > To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked> > reducing> > > the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that> > way, I> > > have many cases where it fails.> > >> > > In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.> > >> > > Thanks & Regards,> > >> > > Punit Pandey> > >> > >> > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai raiaashish@ wrote:> > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Dear Sundar,> > > >> > > > In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was> > only> > > > required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other> > > > dashas like Yogini are showing it.> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Let's forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of> > Shri> > > > Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect> > > > natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be> > > > involved.> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Natal chart,> > > >> > > > Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna> > > >> > > > Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Won't be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august> > > > 2010 !!!> > > >> > > > Regards,> > > > Aashish> > > >> > > > ------------------------------> > > > ** Sundar sundar190561@> > > >> > > > *To:* <%40>> >> > > > *Sent:* Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM> > > > *Subject:* Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Dear Aashish> > > >> > > > I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus> > > > PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?> > > >> > > > Thanks...... ....Sundar> > > >> > > > @gro ups.com <%40>,> > aashish> >> > > > rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Sundarji,> > > > > I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if> > you> > > > use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only> > I am> > > > not elaborating.> > > > >> > > > > Regards,> > > > > Aashish> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> > > > > Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>> > > > > @gro ups.com <%40>> >> > > >> > > > > Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM> > > > > Post mortem analysis of marriage> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Dear Learned members> > > > >> > > > > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The> > transit> > > > of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.> > > > >> > > > > dob: 25th Aug, 1979> > > > > tob: 9.37 (rectified)> > > > > pob: Mumbai> > > > >> > > > > Time of birth reported is 9.22am> > > > > Ayanamsha : 23.28.58> > > > >> > > > > dasha/bukti/ antra> > > > >> > > > > planet sgl stl sl> > > > > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)> > > > > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)> > > > > (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)> > > > >> > > > > rahu=sun(11, 12)> > > > > ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)> > > > >> > > > > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am> > > > >> > > > > planet sgl stl sl> > > > > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)> > > > > (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)> > > > > (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)> > > > >> > > > > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)> > > > > moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)> > > > >> > > > > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify> > DBAS> > > > (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.> > > > >> > > > > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.> > > > >> > > > > Thanks...... ...Sundar> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how.> > http://in.overview.> > > > mail.. com/connectmore<> > http://in.overview.mail./connectmore>> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > ------------------------------> > > > Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn> > more<> > http://in.rd./tagline_galaxy_3/*http://in.overview.mail./> > >> > > > .> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> >> > > >>

November 5, 2009

Dear Punit ji,

1. What generally understand by Double Transit is (for marriage) to take 7th

house only (without 7th lord) form Asc. only (without Moon) as provided by 4

links in the message below:

/message/21068

2. By post-mortem study of several charts, it has been found not working

sufficiently.

3. Whether mathematically correct or not is to be considered on the possible

chance of simultaneous double transit of Jupiter and Saturn which are moving by

different speeds.

4. Whether a rule or theory is reliable or not is usually tested by post-mortem

study only. There is no way to test whether it is correct or not for future

prediction because the future result is unknown.

5. The KP rules are based on post-mortem research study by Guruji KSK and his

assistants.

6. Quiz is also post-mortem study and the only thing is the result being unknown

during the time of doing it. After announcing the result, the study of why the

answer is correct or not is going to square one of post-mortem analysis.

7. That is why --

/message/29079

Thanks and regards,

TW

, Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:

>

> Dear Mssumich,

>

> Please note few points -

>

> 1. A method needs to be mathematically correct first before we can talk

> about predictive aspect of the method. As I mentioned this method is

> fundamentally flawed and doesn't make sense. I have mentioned the reason and

> would love to hear if somebody can show that I am missing something.

>

> 2. Double transit, as mentioned by Paul Manley, is different from what Shri

> KN Rao has used in his books. By Double-Transit, Shri KN Rao doesn't mean

> that both the planet should aspect one single sign, but one planet aspecting

> the house and other house lord (generally). As I demonstrated, this

> condition will match almost 100% of time and hence it makes this tool a good

> tool for post-mortem and justification. Though not useful for predictions.

>

> 3. If a method doesn't work, we should leave it and move on. If we will not

> accept that the method doesn't make sense, we can not discard it. By saying

> something like " we need to check dasa and yoga etc. " , we want to prove it

> some way or other. Why? If it doens't work, it doesn't work. We should not

> accpet anything blindly. There are quite a few teachings by Shri KN Rao that

> works and we should use them. Teachings that do not work, we should discard

> them.

>

> 4. I don not understand why you are mixing placidus with double-transit. Let

> us not mix both the threads. Though i guess that the way you asked your

> earlier question was not good for generating discussion. In my opinion,

> correct way for asking question is to present your own analysis and ask your

> question. If you are learner, you should present your detailed analysis.

> What is your analysis as per KP? What is your analysis as per Traditional?

> Saying that I am able to justify events using Traditional but not KP seems

> too vague a statement. I do not see reference of Sub in your post. I don't

> see reference of Nakshatra in your post. That doesn't qualify as a KP

> analysis and hence doesn't provoke any response. This I guess may be the

> reason you didn't get response.

>

> Thanks & Regards,

> Punit Pandey

>

> On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 9:45 PM, mssumich <mssumich wrote:

>

> >

> > Hi Punit

> > Like many of the 100s of tools that Jyotish gives - don't believe in all

> > the techniques that one comes up with. From Paul Manley's website here is

> > what he says

> > " What you'll see in the following illustrations is how the sign(s) that

> > gets the double transit will shift, generally from year to year. In fact,

> > there are only two positions of Jupiter and Saturn that will not have the

> > double transit phenomenon – when Jupiter is in the 8th or 12th house from

> > Saturn. This means that 10 out of the 12 possible positions, or more than

> > 80% of the time, there will be the double transit phenomenon happening in at

> > least one sign, possibly two. "

> >

> > I have see this double transit work sometimes and sometimes not. Obviuosly

> > we have to pay attention to sookshma transits (or finer transits) and just

> > double transit.

> >

> > I urge some expert to answer my question on the Placidus house system for a

> > chart that I put on the other day. One bhava covers 58 deg of zodiac, there

> > are 3 planets in 8th house; This person is very succesful. I can explain

> > every event using vedic astreology and nakshatra analysis. The moment I put

> > 3 planets in 8th in this chart, I am lost.

> >

> > For latititude that are closer to 66 deg N or S - I believe the Placidus

> > system of houses give wierd house cusps(correct me if I am wrong). This

> > actor was born in Scotland where latitude in 55deg. My question is for

> > people born in such norhtern altitudes -what system works? Is it still

> > Placidus wasy of calculating houses or something else. There should a clear

> > answer from KP experts. I am hoping there is that person in this list.

> > thanks

> >

> > <%40>, Punit

> > Pandey <punitp@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Friends,

> > >

> > > KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I

> > > always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by

> > > which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method

> > for

> > > timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double

> > transit

> > > is among them.

> > >

> > > I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful

> > > for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage.

> > Double-transit

> > > suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting

> > Natal

> > > 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

> > >

> > > Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own

> > position,

> > > it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any

> > > point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is

> > > also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord,

> > > possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we

> > have

> > > 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other

> > > words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is

> > > influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't

> > consider

> > > some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I

> > > have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than

> > > Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not

> > > aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th

> > > lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon

> > as

> > > well as Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing

> > either

> > > 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th

> > > lord from Moon.

> > >

> > > Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for

> > > Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that

> > > Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

> > >

> > > To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked

> > reducing

> > > the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that

> > way, I

> > > have many cases where it fails.

> > >

> > > In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

> > >

> > > Thanks & Regards,

> > >

> > > Punit Pandey

> > >

> > > On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish@> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Sundar,

> > > >

> > > > In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was

> > only

> > > > required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other

> > > > dashas like Yogini are showing it.

> > > >

> > > > Let's forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of

> > Shri

> > > > Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect

> > > > natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be

> > > > involved.

> > > >

> > > > Natal chart,

> > > >

> > > > Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

> > > >

> > > > Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

> > > >

> > > > Won't be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august

> > > > 2010 !!!

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Aashish

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------

> > > > ** Sundar <sundar190561@>

> > > >

> > > > *To:* <%40>

> >

> > > > *Sent:* Wed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM

> > > > *Subject:* Re: Post mortem analysis of marriage

> > > >

> > > > Dear Aashish

> > > >

> > > > I know you would say, venus is the UL lord, hence the marriage in venus

> > > > PAD. But did you see venus was debilitated on the day of marriage?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks...... ....Sundar

> > > >

> > > > @gro ups.com <%40>,

> > aashish

> >

> > > > rai <raiaashish@ ...> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Sundarji,

> > > > > I have just started learning KP and yet to pick up the basics. but if

> > you

> > > > use traditional astrology it's very clear. As this forum is for KP only

> > I am

> > > > not elaborating.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Aashish

> > > > >

> > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > > > > Sundar <sundar190561@ ...>

> > > > > @gro ups.com <%40>

> >

> > > >

> > > > > Sun, 1 November, 2009 10:59:22 PM

> > > > > Post mortem analysis of marriage

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Learned members

> > > > >

> > > > > My neighbour go married on 21st Oct, 2009 between 9 to 10am. The

> > transit

> > > > of DBAS does not fully signify the event fully.

> > > > >

> > > > > dob: 25th Aug, 1979

> > > > > tob: 9.37 (rectified)

> > > > > pob: Mumbai

> > > > >

> > > > > Time of birth reported is 9.22am

> > > > > Ayanamsha : 23.28.58

> > > > >

> > > > > dasha/bukti/ antra

> > > > >

> > > > > planet sgl stl sl

> > > > > (MD)rahu(11) sun(11,12) venus(11,2-9) venus(11,2-9)

> > > > > (AD)ketu(5) sat(12,5-6) rahu(11) venus(11,2-9)

> > > > > (PAD)venus(11, 2-9) sun(11,12) ketu(5) jupiter(11,4- 7)

> > > > >

> > > > > rahu=sun(11, 12)

> > > > > ketu=saturn( 12,5-6)

> > > > >

> > > > > Marriage on 21st October 2009 between 9 am to 10 am

> > > > >

> > > > > planet sgl stl sl

> > > > > (MD)rahu(4) sat(12,5-6) sun(1,12) jupiter(5,4- 7)

> > > > > (AD)ketu(10) moon(2,11) jupiter(5,4- 7) rahu-MD(4)

> > > > > (PAD)venus(12, 2-9) mer(1,1-10) moon(2,11) rahu-MD(4)

> > > > >

> > > > > sun venus(12,2-9) mars(10,3-8) venus(12,2-9)

> > > > > moon mars(10,3-8) sat(12,5-6) venus(12,2-9)

> > > > >

> > > > > Baed on the above it is seen that MD/AD/PAD does not fully signify

> > DBAS

> > > > (except for ketu, which is rahu's sub.

> > > > >

> > > > > In the light of the above how do we reconcile the timing of marriage.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks...... ...Sundar

> > > > >

> > > > > Keep up with people you care about with India Mail. Learn how.

> > http://in.overview.

> > > > mail.. com/connectmore<

> > http://in.overview.mail./connectmore>

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------

> > > > Connect more, do more and share more with India Mail. Learn

> > more<

> > http://in.rd./tagline_galaxy_3/*http://in.overview.mail./

> > >

> > > > .

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

November 5, 2009

Dear Punit and friends, I would suggest we also examine Lagna/7th or Moon/7th being aspected by both Jup and Sat simultaneously. Additionally on the day of marriage,Venus aspects Mars. These will improve the strike rate. In any case % adove 60 is a myth on CONSISTENT basis. We trying to make a difficult job easier.Astrology cannot be reduced to mathematics,once we consider it a divine science. Regards,

; Satish --- On Wed, 11/4/09, Punit Pandey <punitp wrote:Punit Pandey <punitp Why Shri KN Rao's Double Transit doesn't make sense Date: Wednesday, November 4, 2009, 6:52 PM

Dear Friends,

KP made timing an event much more easier. Though as a KP astrologer, I always feel that it will be nice to have another complementary method by which we can cross-check and confirm. In search of another such method for timing events, I looked into many methods and Shri KN Rao's double transit is among them.

I personally feel that it is merely a tool for post-mortem and not useful for future predictions. Let us take an example of Marriage. Double-transit suggests that transiting Jupiter and Saturn will always be aspecting Natal 7th and 7th lord at the time of marriage.

Now Jupiter has three aspects - 5,7, and 9. So including its own position, it will be influencing four houses in any chart. Which means that at any point of time the possibility of aspecting 7th is 33.33% and 7th lord is also 33.33%. If we take Jupiter's influence on either 7th OR 7th lord, possibility will double from 4/12 to 8/12 or 66.66%. So at any time, we have 66.66% possibility of Jupiter aspecting either 7th or 7th lord. In other words, around 66% of time in one's life, we will see that Jupiter is influencing either 7th or 7th. Of course, this calculation doesn't consider some of the possibility e.g. 7th lord is in 7th house itself. Anyways, I have seen Shri KN Rao is also checking Moon for transit other than Ascendant. Which doubles the possibility and if somehow Jupiter is not aspecting 7th and 7th lord counting from Lagna, it will aspect 7th or 7th lord from Moon. So in any point of one's life, if take transit from Moon as well as

Ascendant, it is almost certain that Jupiter will influencing either 7th from ascendant, or 7th lord from ascendant, or 7th from Moon, or 7th lord from Moon.

Similarly, Saturn also has 3 aspects and the above write-up is true for Saturn as well. In other words, seeing the above possibility, I feel that Double-Transit doesn't make sense at all.

To sound this method sensible and experimental purpose, I checked reducing the possibility by checking transit only from Ascendant. If I do that way, I have many cases where it fails.

In other words, I do not find Double-transit theory useful at all.

Thanks & Regards,Punit Pandey

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 2:06 PM, aashish rai <raiaashish (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote:

Dear Sundar,

In classical astrology there are so many dashas, if vimshottari was only required than why did Parashara muni talked about so many dashas. Other dashas like Yogini are showing it.

Letâ€™s forget about DBAs for time being as per double transit theory of Shri Kn rao marriage chances are high when transit Saturn and Jupiter aspect natal 1/7 axis or their natal lords. In rare cases 9th lord will be involved.

Natal chart,

Jupier is aspecting natal 7th lord, lagna lord and Lagna

Saturn is sitting in Lagna itself, aspecting 7th house

Wonâ€™t be surprised if there is a child birth/pregency before end august 2010 !!!

Regards,Aashish

Sundar <sundar190561@ .co. in> @gro ups.comWed, 4 November, 2009 10:31:33 AM