Guest guest Report post Posted May 1, 2005 ShrI gurubhyo namah., ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this prayer and contemplation. Oh Holy Mother I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is becoming more industrialised it's becoming more at risk of environmental decay. As people are becoming more aware of the great power of Sri Arunachala, (http://www.poonja.com/Crisis_Arunachala.htm) the sweet little town of Thiruvannamalai is becoming polluted by the large number of tourists. And even Mother Ganges is becoming extremely polluted example: " Pollution Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution I pray that the larger countries, namely the ones that create the most pollution and make the most money at the same time, may take larger steps to prevent a global crisis of pollution. Praises be to you Dear Mother, for holding up the earth so far, and that you have protected it so well from the ravages of pollution and ignorance. I pray that you may influence their political leaders to acknowledge the problems at hand and that they may take them seriously. That keeping the earth clean should be higher on our priority list. Because for God's sake it is You we are disrespecting when we are careless in our waste management. I pray that you may bless the engineers, scientists and all those who fund those fields of knowledge so that to repeat something i saw on a political program the other day, ' we should make the knowledge of energy conservation as important as it was to put a man on the moon in the 1960's.' We should start feeling a real urgency to this situation. From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) 2. Namaste garud.ArUd.he kolAsura-bhayan.kari, Sarva-pApa-hare devi mahAlakshmi namo'stute. " Salutations, O rider of Garuda, terror of the demon Kola, remover of sins, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. " Dear mother i pray that you may remove the ignorance of death and birth, so that people may stop having the excuse to pollute when they say, 'I don't care, I'll be dead and gone by the time the earth is going to blow'. Supreme praises and exultations to you Sweet Mother. From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) 3. Sarvajne sarvavarade sarva-dushta-bhayan.kari, Sarava-duh.kha-hare devi mahAlakshmi namo'stute. Knower of all, giver of all boons, a terror to the wiked, remover of all sorrows, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. SADGURUNATH MAHARAJ KI JAY Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > prayer and contemplation. > > Oh Holy Mother > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is > becoming more industrialised it's becoming more at risk of > environmental decay. As people are becoming more aware of the great > power of Sri Arunachala, > (http://www.poonja.com/Crisis_Arunachala.htm) the sweet little town > of Thiruvannamalai is becoming polluted by the large number of > tourists. And even Mother Ganges is becoming extremely polluted > example: > " Pollution > > > > Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and > drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting > industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near > Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the > river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 > billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river > every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially > burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action > Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British > and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. > Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for > treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The > project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " > > care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution > > > > I pray that the larger countries, namely the ones that create the > most pollution and make the most money at the same time, may take > larger steps to prevent a global crisis of pollution. Praises be to > you Dear Mother, for holding up the earth so far, and that you have > protected it so well from the ravages of pollution and ignorance. I > pray that you may influence their political leaders to acknowledge > the problems at hand and that they may take them seriously. That > keeping the earth clean should be higher on our priority list. > Because for God's sake it is You we are disrespecting when we are > careless in our waste management. I pray that you may bless the > engineers, scientists and all those who fund those fields of > knowledge so that to repeat something i saw on a political program > the other day, ' we should make the knowledge of energy conservation > as important as it was to put a man on the moon in the 1960's.' We > should start feeling a real urgency to this situation. > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > 2. Namaste garud.ArUd.he > > kolAsura-bhayan.kari, > > Sarva-pApa-hare devi > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > " Salutations, O rider of Garuda, terror of the demon Kola, remover > of sins, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. " > > > > Dear mother i pray that you may remove the ignorance of death and > birth, so that people may stop having the excuse to pollute when > they say, 'I don't care, I'll be dead and gone by the time the earth > is going to blow'. > > Supreme praises and exultations to you Sweet Mother. > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > 3. Sarvajne sarvavarade > > sarva-dushta-bhayan.kari, > > Sarava-duh.kha-hare devi > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > Knower of all, giver of all boons, a terror to the wiked, remover of > all sorrows, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. > > > > SADGURUNATH MAHARAJ KI JAY The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on the flowing isness. Sorry. toombaru Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: > > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > > prayer and contemplation. > > > > Oh Holy Mother > > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is > > becoming more industrialised it's becoming more at risk of > > environmental decay. As people are becoming more aware of the great > > power of Sri Arunachala, > > (http://www.poonja.com/Crisis_Arunachala.htm) the sweet little town > > of Thiruvannamalai is becoming polluted by the large number of > > tourists. And even Mother Ganges is becoming extremely polluted > > example: > > " Pollution > > > > > > > > Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and > > drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting > > industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near > > Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the > > river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 > > billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river > > every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially > > burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action > > Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British > > and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. > > Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for > > treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The > > project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " > > > > care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution > > > > > > > > I pray that the larger countries, namely the ones that create the > > most pollution and make the most money at the same time, may take > > larger steps to prevent a global crisis of pollution. Praises be to > > you Dear Mother, for holding up the earth so far, and that you have > > protected it so well from the ravages of pollution and ignorance. I > > pray that you may influence their political leaders to acknowledge > > the problems at hand and that they may take them seriously. That > > keeping the earth clean should be higher on our priority list. > > Because for God's sake it is You we are disrespecting when we are > > careless in our waste management. I pray that you may bless the > > engineers, scientists and all those who fund those fields of > > knowledge so that to repeat something i saw on a political program > > the other day, ' we should make the knowledge of energy conservation > > as important as it was to put a man on the moon in the 1960's.' We > > should start feeling a real urgency to this situation. > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > 2. Namaste garud.ArUd.he > > > > kolAsura-bhayan.kari, > > > > Sarva-pApa-hare devi > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > " Salutations, O rider of Garuda, terror of the demon Kola, remover > > of sins, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. " > > > > > > > > Dear mother i pray that you may remove the ignorance of death and > > birth, so that people may stop having the excuse to pollute when > > they say, 'I don't care, I'll be dead and gone by the time the earth > > is going to blow'. > > > > Supreme praises and exultations to you Sweet Mother. > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > > > > > 3. Sarvajne sarvavarade > > > > sarva-dushta-bhayan.kari, > > > > Sarava-duh.kha-hare devi > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > Knower of all, giver of all boons, a terror to the wiked, remover of > > all sorrows, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. > > > > > > > > SADGURUNATH MAHARAJ KI JAY > > > > > > The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on the flowing isness. > > > Sorry. > > > > > toombaru Hi, toombaru: It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket science. First, their god tells them don't control the population growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. It's quite pathetic, don't you think? Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? Yours, fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> > wrote: > > > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > > > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > > > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > > > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > > > > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > > > prayer and contemplation. > > > > > > Oh Holy Mother > > > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > > > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > > > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > > > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > > > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > > > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > > > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > > > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > > > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is > > > becoming more industrialised it's becoming more at risk of > > > environmental decay. As people are becoming more aware of the great > > > power of Sri Arunachala, > > > (http://www.poonja.com/Crisis_Arunachala.htm) the sweet little town > > > of Thiruvannamalai is becoming polluted by the large number of > > > tourists. And even Mother Ganges is becoming extremely polluted > > > example: > > > " Pollution > > > > > > > > > > > > Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and > > > drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting > > > industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near > > > Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the > > > river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 > > > billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river > > > every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially > > > burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action > > > Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British > > > and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. > > > Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for > > > treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The > > > project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " > > > > > > care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution > > > > > > > > > > > > I pray that the larger countries, namely the ones that create the > > > most pollution and make the most money at the same time, may take > > > larger steps to prevent a global crisis of pollution. Praises be to > > > you Dear Mother, for holding up the earth so far, and that you have > > > protected it so well from the ravages of pollution and ignorance. I > > > pray that you may influence their political leaders to acknowledge > > > the problems at hand and that they may take them seriously. That > > > keeping the earth clean should be higher on our priority list. > > > Because for God's sake it is You we are disrespecting when we are > > > careless in our waste management. I pray that you may bless the > > > engineers, scientists and all those who fund those fields of > > > knowledge so that to repeat something i saw on a political program > > > the other day, ' we should make the knowledge of energy conservation > > > as important as it was to put a man on the moon in the 1960's.' We > > > should start feeling a real urgency to this situation. > > > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > > > 2. Namaste garud.ArUd.he > > > > > > kolAsura-bhayan.kari, > > > > > > Sarva-pApa-hare devi > > > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > > > > > " Salutations, O rider of Garuda, terror of the demon Kola, remover > > > of sins, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. " > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear mother i pray that you may remove the ignorance of death and > > > birth, so that people may stop having the excuse to pollute when > > > they say, 'I don't care, I'll be dead and gone by the time the earth > > > is going to blow'. > > > > > > Supreme praises and exultations to you Sweet Mother. > > > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. Sarvajne sarvavarade > > > > > > sarva-dushta-bhayan.kari, > > > > > > Sarava-duh.kha-hare devi > > > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > > > > > Knower of all, giver of all boons, a terror to the wiked, remover of > > > all sorrows, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. > > > > > > > > > > > > SADGURUNATH MAHARAJ KI JAY > > > > > > > > > > > > The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for > intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on > the flowing isness. > > > > > > Sorry. > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > Hi, toombaru: > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > Yours, > > fuzzie Conceptually isolating any thing as that cause of anything.......has its drawbacks. toombaru Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 - fuzzie_wuz Nisargadatta Monday, May 02, 2005 11:12 AM Re: A Prayer to Mahalakshmi Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: > > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > > prayer and contemplation. > > > > Oh Holy Mother > > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is > > becoming more industrialised it's becoming more at risk of > > environmental decay. As people are becoming more aware of the great > > power of Sri Arunachala, > > (http://www.poonja.com/Crisis_Arunachala.htm) the sweet little town > > of Thiruvannamalai is becoming polluted by the large number of > > tourists. And even Mother Ganges is becoming extremely polluted > > example: > > " Pollution > > > > > > > > Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and > > drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting > > industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near > > Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the > > river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 > > billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river > > every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially > > burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action > > Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British > > and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. > > Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for > > treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The > > project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " > > > > care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution > > > > > > > > I pray that the larger countries, namely the ones that create the > > most pollution and make the most money at the same time, may take > > larger steps to prevent a global crisis of pollution. Praises be to > > you Dear Mother, for holding up the earth so far, and that you have > > protected it so well from the ravages of pollution and ignorance. I > > pray that you may influence their political leaders to acknowledge > > the problems at hand and that they may take them seriously. That > > keeping the earth clean should be higher on our priority list. > > Because for God's sake it is You we are disrespecting when we are > > careless in our waste management. I pray that you may bless the > > engineers, scientists and all those who fund those fields of > > knowledge so that to repeat something i saw on a political program > > the other day, ' we should make the knowledge of energy conservation > > as important as it was to put a man on the moon in the 1960's.' We > > should start feeling a real urgency to this situation. > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > 2. Namaste garud.ArUd.he > > > > kolAsura-bhayan.kari, > > > > Sarva-pApa-hare devi > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > " Salutations, O rider of Garuda, terror of the demon Kola, remover > > of sins, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. " > > > > > > > > Dear mother i pray that you may remove the ignorance of death and > > birth, so that people may stop having the excuse to pollute when > > they say, 'I don't care, I'll be dead and gone by the time the earth > > is going to blow'. > > > > Supreme praises and exultations to you Sweet Mother. > > > > From the SrI MahAlashmyasht.akam (Hymn to Mahalashmi) > > > > > > > > 3. Sarvajne sarvavarade > > > > sarva-dushta-bhayan.kari, > > > > Sarava-duh.kha-hare devi > > > > mahAlakshmi namo'stute. > > > > > > > > Knower of all, giver of all boons, a terror to the wiked, remover of > > all sorrows, beloved goddess, Mahalakshmi, obeisance to you. > > > > > > > > SADGURUNATH MAHARAJ KI JAY > > > > > > The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on the flowing isness. > > > Sorry. > > > > > toombaru Hi, toombaru: It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket science. First, their god tells them don't control the population growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. It's quite pathetic, don't you think? Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? Yours, fuzzie anna-witness (never was called by the Jehovah thingy, er, the formated) well, fuzzie, my god is better than your god and my god will help me win cause i gots the right and true god, and my peoples have been true and right in their beLIEfs. Really kind of silly once it is seen, no? too bad there is no way to access a body count for all the bodies murdered to save one's 'soul'... reminds me of a story of an " indigenous' person going to the cleric, " tell me, if i hadn't known about god and Jesus, would I have gone to hell " the brown robe answers, " of course not, my son, you'd go straight to heaven, because you would not have known any better " . The native asks: " then why did you tell me " . God, a concept created in Man's Image in " this convoluted manner. And yet it is true, but seldom seen in its correctess, yours, ana context ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: >> Pollution of the Ganges has become so serious that bathing in and > drinking its water has become very dangerous. The major polluting > industry along the Ganges is the leather industry especially near > Kanpur, from which Chromium and other chemicals leak into the > river. Another huge source of pollution is that of the nearly 1 > billion litres of mostly untreated raw sewage that enters the river > every day. Inadequate cremation procedures result in partially > burnt or unburnt corpses floating in the river. The Ganga Action > Plan (GAP) was set up in 1985 by the Indian government with British > and Dutch support to build a number of waste treatment facilities. > Under the GAP sewage is intercepted and water is diverted for > treatment and several electrical crematoria have been built. The > project is now in its second phase - GAP II. " > > care of http://www.thewaterpage.com/ganges.htm#Pollution > sam: hey, I heard that the Gods protect the Ganges so the water always stays pure and won't be harmful to the health. So what happened! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 > > > > > > The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for > intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on > the flowing isness. > > > > > > Sorry. > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > Hi, toombaru: > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > Yours, > > fuzzie > > > anna-witness (never was called by the Jehovah thingy, er, the formated) > > well, fuzzie, my god is better than your god and my god will help me win cause i gots the right and true god, and my peoples have been true and right in their beLIEfs. Really kind of silly once it is seen, no? > > too bad there is no way to access a body count for all the bodies murdered to save one's 'soul'... > > reminds me of a story of an " indigenous' person going to the cleric, " tell me, if i hadn't known about god and Jesus, would I have gone to hell " the brown robe answers, > " of course not, my son, you'd go straight to heaven, because you would not have known any better " . The native asks: " then why did you tell me " . > > God, a concept created in Man's Image in " this convoluted manner. And yet it is true, but seldom seen in its correctess, > > yours, > > ana > context Oh Anna, That's just some more beliefs....about beliefs. toombaru Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 - toombaru2004 Nisargadatta Monday, May 02, 2005 1:29 PM Re: A Prayer to Mahalakshmi > > > > > > The wish for things to be different........and the hoped for > intervention of some power higher .....have absoultely no effect on > the flowing isness. > > > > > > Sorry. > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > Hi, toombaru: > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > Yours, > > fuzzie > > > anna-witness (never was called by the Jehovah thingy, er, the formated) > > well, fuzzie, my god is better than your god and my god will help me win cause i gots the right and true god, and my peoples have been true and right in their beLIEfs. Really kind of silly once it is seen, no? > > too bad there is no way to access a body count for all the bodies murdered to save one's 'soul'... > > reminds me of a story of an " indigenous' person going to the cleric, " tell me, if i hadn't known about god and Jesus, would I have gone to hell " the brown robe answers, > " of course not, my son, you'd go straight to heaven, because you would not have known any better " . The native asks: " then why did you tell me " . > > God, a concept created in Man's Image in " this convoluted manner. And yet it is true, but seldom seen in its correctess, > > yours, > > ana > context Oh Anna, That's just some more beliefs....about beliefs. toombaru Oh, Toombaru-, I keep telling you -- experience! Experience! EXPERIENCE! words are filling in until or spoken trying to explain, got it? sort of what's keeping Toombaru in the closet, so to speak. Come out come out wherever you Be!!!! It's quite grand, mysterious and playful, behind names, behind nothing.. Oh Oh, i feel a song, coming....and I will always love you, oo ooh, and I will always love you...... Anna is now leaving the building.... ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 > > > Hi, toombaru: > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > Yours, > > fuzzie devi: from where you are, your not wrong, but from where i am i see a bigger picture....*birth control, using pills, getting abortions* is not natural....for example.....so. fuzzy, are you awar that there is 5th stage self-realization and 7th stage liberation? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, toombaru: > > > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > > > Yours, > > > > fuzzie > > devi: from where you are, your not wrong, but from where i am i see a > bigger picture....*birth control, using pills, getting abortions* is > not natural....for example.....so. fuzzy, are you awar that there is > 5th stage self-realization and 7th stage liberation? Have you been reading Adi Da or something? fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > prayer and contemplation. > > Oh Holy Mother > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is Namaste, This is all very dualistic anyway, but giving it some validity won't change the effects of karma. We may change the future lives by reforming in this, but it won't change this one. What people call 'God' is just karma and karmic reaction. We cannot change a thing in this life but perhaps our attitude to events. The Goddess you talk of is just the energy that goes to allow polluters and non polluters to live and operate...........ONS..Tony. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, toombaru: > > > > > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the damage > > > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth control " . So, > > > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not rocket > > > science. First, their god tells them don't control the population > > > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from themselves. > > > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > > > > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > > > > > Yours, > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > devi: from where you are, your not wrong, but from where i am i see a > > bigger picture....*birth control, using pills, getting abortions* is > > not natural....for example.....so. fuzzy, are you awar that there is > > 5th stage self-realization and 7th stage liberation? > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > fuzzie devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> > wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, toombaru: > > > > > > > > It seems to me that it is religion that has caused most of the > damage > > > > to the earth. For instance, the Church says " no birth > control " . So, > > > > people breed like rats and destroy their habitat. It's not > rocket > > > > science. First, their god tells them don't control the > population > > > > growth, then, they pray to the same god to save them from > themselves. > > > > It's quite pathetic, don't you think? > > > > > > > > Am I wrong? Can I get a witness? > > > > > > > > Yours, > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: from where you are, your not wrong, but from where i am i > see a > > > bigger picture....*birth control, using pills, getting > abortions* is > > > not natural....for example.....so. fuzzy, are you awar that > there is > > > 5th stage self-realization and 7th stage liberation? > > > > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > fuzzie > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna have to give more details. I can't read your mind. I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it is). Are you liberated? fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Have you been reading Adi Da or something? fuzzie devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna have to give more details. I can't read your mind. I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it is). > > Are you liberated? > > fuzzie devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from looking at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs below and think thats liberation then no.... The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). 2. vicharana (enquiry). 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). 4. satwapatti (self-realization). 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). 7. turyaga (transcendence). if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external surrounding, then no i am not liberated... also, i still dream....so then again no.... ..see below... In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. So also is sahaja samadhi. " 4. What is the state beyond bliss? It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in oneself without concepts). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 2, 2005 Nisargadatta , " Tony OClery " <aoclery> wrote: Nisargadatta , " tyrone " <arunachala_1008> wrote: > ShrI gurubhyo namah., > ShrI lAbh shrI shubh shrI gan.eshAya namah.. > MahAlakshmyashtakam. stotram. > Aum Shrim lakshmyai namah ! > > Salutations to the Guru; salutations to Ganesha, the auspicious one > > > > I hope that the other members of this community may join me in this > prayer and contemplation. > > Oh Holy Mother > I pray not to you now for wealth of the material sense, but that you > may help me and your other children to restore the earth to a > stronger sense of beauty. I'm tired of seeing ecosystems being > destroyed by your children's distorted view of wealth. I find it > quite ironic that you are the Goddess of the earth and of wealth > because right now for the sake of wealth we are sacrificing the > earth in negative ways. It is the dynamic paradox i suppose. That to > truly know you we must find a balance between finding success on the > earth as well as keeping it clean. Even as the Mother Land is Namaste, This is all very dualistic anyway, but giving it some validity won't change the effects of karma. We may change the future lives by reforming in this, but it won't change this one. What people call 'God' is just karma and karmic reaction. We cannot change a thing in this life but perhaps our attitude to events. The Goddess you talk of is just the energy that goes to allow polluters and non polluters to live and operate...........ONS..Tony. --- End forwarded message --- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > fuzzie > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it > is). > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > fuzzie > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from looking > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > .see below... > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > oneself without concepts). Dear Devianandi: If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or sensory deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness and altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, that isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can analyze all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop at seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or realization. The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot be lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. Yours, fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > fuzzie > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it > > is). > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from looking > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > oneself without concepts). > > > Dear Devianandi: > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or sensory > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness and > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, that > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can analyze > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop at > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or realization. > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot be > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > Yours, > > fuzzie What happens when two enlightened people get together? toombaru Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > fuzzie > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it > > is). > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from looking > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > oneself without concepts). > > > Dear Devianandi: > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or sensory > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness and > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, that > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can analyze > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop at > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or realization. > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot be > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > Yours, > > fuzzie>> HALLELUIA!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " garyfalk1943 " <falkgw@h...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> > wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> > wrote: > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps > to > > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking > about > > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're > gonna > > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, > it > > > is). > > > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from > looking > > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice > the > > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not > himself > > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like > a > > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. > The > > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that > he > > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be > convinced. > > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is > in > > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is > also > > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > > oneself without concepts). > > > > > > Dear Devianandi: > > > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or > sensory > > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness > and > > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, > that > > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can > analyze > > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop > at > > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or > realization. > > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot > be > > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > > > Yours, > > > > fuzzie>> > Fuzzie........you are selling snake oil in the morgue.........dispensing prescriptions......to the dead......passing out eye glasses to the blind....... .....peddling life insurannce to that which was never alive...... ........conning the zombees...... teasing the monkeys......... ......peddling dope to down and out.............hawking shadows.......to shadows Three strikes......fuzz......... YOUR'E OUT! toombaru Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> wrote: > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps to > > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking about > > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're gonna > > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, it > > > is). > > > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from looking > > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the > > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself > > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a > > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The > > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he > > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. > > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in > > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also > > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > > oneself without concepts). > > > > > > Dear Devianandi: > > > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or sensory > > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness and > > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, that > > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can analyze > > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop at > > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or realization. > > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot be > > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > > > Yours, > > > > fuzzie What happens when two enlightened people get together? > > > > > toombaru You don't wanna know. fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " garyfalk1943 " <falkgw@h...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> > wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> > wrote: > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps > to > > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking > about > > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're > gonna > > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, > it > > > is). > > > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from > looking > > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice > the > > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not > himself > > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like > a > > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. > The > > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that > he > > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be > convinced. > > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is > in > > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is > also > > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > > oneself without concepts). > > > > > > Dear Devianandi: > > > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or > sensory > > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness > and > > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, > that > > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can > analyze > > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop > at > > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or > realization. > > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot > be > > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > > > Yours, > > > > fuzzie>> > > HALLELUIA!! Did ye get ye healed? fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " garyfalk1943 " <falkgw@h...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> > > wrote: > > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> > > wrote: > > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps > > to > > > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking > > about > > > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're > > gonna > > > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, > > it > > > > is). > > > > > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from > > looking > > > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice > > the > > > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not > > himself > > > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like > > a > > > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. > > The > > > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that > > he > > > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be > > convinced. > > > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is > > in > > > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is > > also > > > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > > > oneself without concepts). > > > > > > > > > Dear Devianandi: > > > > > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > > > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or > > sensory > > > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness > > and > > > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > > > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, > > that > > > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > > > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can > > analyze > > > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > > > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop > > at > > > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > > > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or > > realization. > > > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > > > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot > > be > > > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > > > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > > > > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > > > that. Find you. Be you. Understand self. Then, the seeking and the > > > desire and the categorizing and the suffering dissolves. Nothing > > > really changes. Life goes on. It's just that there is no longer any > > > dilemma. No problem. No question. No doubt. > > > > > > Yours, > > > > > > fuzzie>> > > > > > > Fuzzie........you are selling snake oil in the morgue.........dispensing prescriptions......to the dead......passing out eye glasses to the blind....... > > ....peddling life insurannce to that which was never alive...... > > .......conning the zombees...... > > teasing the monkeys......... > > .....peddling dope to down and out.............hawking shadows.......to shadows > > > > > > Three strikes......fuzz......... > > > YOUR'E OUT! > > > > > > toombaru " Teasing the monkeys " , eh? I'll take that into consideration. Thank you. Yours, fuzzie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 3, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: Nisargadatta , " garyfalk1943 " <falkgw@h...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , " fuzzie_wuz " <fuzzie_wuz> > wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " devianandi " <polansky@m...> > wrote: > > > Have you been reading Adi Da or something? > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: not lately, but i have read knee of listening and a few > > > others....anyway....my guru and ramana say there are seven steps > to > > > total enlightenment....you didn't asnwer my question? :-) > > > I couldn't answer because I didn't know if you were talking > about > > > Adi Da or L. Ron Hubbard or some Sufi tariqa or what? You're > gonna > > > have to give more details. I can't read your mind. > > > > > > I'm totally liberated. There are no levels. There's nothing (yet, > it > > > is). > > > > > > > > Are you liberated? > > > > > > > > fuzzie > > > > > > devi: ok: these 7 stages are from ramana maharshi and my gurus is > > > very similar but i don't have his chart available now..from > looking > > > at this chart i could say yes but if you read the two paragraphs > > > below and think thats liberation then no.... > > > > > > > > > The seven jnana bhoomikas are:- > > > 1. subheccha (the desire for enlightenment). > > > 2. vicharana (enquiry). > > > 3. tanumanasa (tenuous mind). > > > 4. satwapatti (self-realization). > > > 5. asamsakti (non-attachment). > > > 6. padarthabhavana (non-perception of objects). > > > 7. turyaga (transcendence). > > > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice > the > > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not > himself > > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like > a > > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. > The > > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that > he > > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be > convinced. > > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is > in > > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is > also > > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > > oneself without concepts). > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 4, 2005 fuzzie_wuz wrote: > > Dear Devianandi: > > Forget about Ramana and Nisargadatta and yogis and swamis and all > that. Find you. Be you. Yes, that is the essential teaching of Ramana! Love to all Harsha Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted May 4, 2005 > > > > if being liberated means that i am not aware of my external > > surrounding, then no i am not liberated... > > > > also, i still dream....so then again no.... > > > > .see below... > > > > > > > > In sahaja samadhi the activities, vital and mental, and the three > > states are destroyed, never to re-appear. However others notice the > > jnani active, e.g. eating, talking, moving, etc. He is not himself > > aware of these activities, whereas others are aware of his > > activities. They pertain to his body and not to his Real Self, > > swarupa. For himself, he is like the sleeping passenger --or like a > > child interrupted from sound sleep and fed, being unaware of it. The > > child says the next day that he did not take milk at all and that he > > went to sleep without it. Even when reminded he cannot be convinced. > > So also is sahaja samadhi. " > > > > 4. What is the state beyond bliss? > > It is the state of unceasing peace of mind which is found in the > > state of absolute quiescence, jagrat-sushupti (lit. sleep with > > awareness) which resembles inactive deep sleep. In this state, in > > spite of the activity of the body and the senses, there is no > > external awareness, like a child immersed in sleep* (who is not > > conscious of the food given to him by his mother). A yogi who is in > > this state is inactive even while engaged in activity. This is also > > called sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi (natural state of absorption in > > oneself without concepts). > > > Dear Devianandi: > > If you learn to meditate you can become mindless or whatever, if > that's what you want. It can also be done through hypnosis or sensory > deprivation. LSD and other chemicals can also induce mindlessness and > altered states. I used to be able to meditate and my body would > disappear and I would be like clear, transparent awareness. But, that > isn't where it's at. Yogis and sadhus and what not can train their > bodies to do all kinds of bizarre phenomena. So, what? You can analyze > all of this stuff and categorize it and divide it up into different > " stages " or " levels " , etc., as many " stages " as you like. Why stop at > seven stages? It can be divided up ad infinitum. All of this is > distraction. It does not lead to liberation or moksha or realization. > The only way to do that is to understand the self. The self is being > itself. It is pure awareness, nothing else. It always is and cannot be > lost or found. Once you realize it, there's no need to do anymore > sadhana or " spiritual " exercises or anything. > > fuzzie devi: you seem to be thinking that Self-realization and Liberation are the same.... they are not.... i was not asking for a lecture either.. i was asking what you thought were the differences between self- realization and liberation... and i was hoping that you could clear up my (puzzlement) about the gnani (liberated one) who is unaware of the external world and has lost the activities, vital and mental, and the three states which are destroyed, never to re-appear even while appearing to be active to the onlooker? if you don't know the answer just say so.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
