Who is an offender to the Guru?

[Guest guest]

 

I am not talking about some rebelious behavior towards the guru, but sincere inquiry in the spirit of practicality, direct experience, and observable situations in the realm of practical implementation of sadhana bhakti.

 

Of course we can simply quietly ignore such instructions or injunctions and do what obviously needs to be done, but isn't that somewhat dishonest?

Sounds like your begging the question and that you already know the answer. Since you have thought very deeply about this, tell us the answer.

[Guest guest]

 

Then you know...turns out needed an amendment. Or two. Okay maybe ten more. Nah make that...

 

That is called "real life". Adjustments are needed all the time. Only utopian ideas "dont need adjustments".

[Guest guest]

 

Sounds like your begging the question and that you already know the answer. Since you have thought very deeply about this, tell us the answer.

 

Not really. It is quite a dillema for me.

[Beggar 0]

 

Not really. It is quite a dillema for me.

Become a great saint and religious reformer. Its your only hope.

[Guest guest]

<strong>Sermons of the Guardian of Devotion</strong>

Volume 2, Chapter 4

When Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura began the Service of the [Mayapura] <i>Dhama</i> and Mahaprabhu, he had to do many things to attract the public to accept his discovery of the <i>Dhama</i> as authentic. At that time, the place was uninhabited. Gradually a brick building was made, and the worship of the Deity of Mahaprabhu was begun.

The Temple came later. Generally the <i>Brahmana</i> cooks he required would not stay there very long because it was an isolated place and there were violent elements nearby. To ensure that the Service continued, he had to undergo many undesirable things. For example, sometimes he had to prepare <i>ganjika</i> (hemp) by his own hand, for the cook! Otherwise, the cook would have left. At times, when 'respectable' persons came, he had to make arrangements for tobacco. There were many other trials.

Our Guru Maharaj, Prabhupada, also did similar things, to the extreme. When Anderson, the Governor, was invited to Mayapur, at that time it was arranged with a Calcutta hotel to bring appropriate food for the function, including even meats. The hotelier was arranged to cater for the Governor and his entourage. And when Prabhupada suggested some similar approach in foreign preaching also, <b>I modestly protested that if the meat dishes, non-vegetarian dishes, were served in the Math area it would bring criticism to the mission</b>; to which he replied, 'No, no! I decided all these things thousands of births ago. We have to do anything and everything for the Service of Mahaprabhu.' That was his answer. <i>Vaikuntha-vrtti</i> - no <i>kuntha</i>, no limitation: 'I am prepared to do anything for the Service of Mahaprabhu, for the propagation of His Mission. The Grace of Mahaprabhu should be distributed throughout the length and breadth of the whole world. And for that, anything should be done. No stone unturned. Physical connection is no connection. We shall try to save our internal purity, that is all.' And to save so many souls from impure habits and diet, Srimad Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaj also took the risk of external contamination by filthy things. He had to go to the place of that anti-atmosphere to save them. If the house is on fire, one must run the risk of burns to his body if he reallymeat wants to save the inhabitants.

It is interesting to note that while Srila Sridhar Maharaj appreciated the feeling of Prabhupada Srila Saraswati Thakura that "I am prepared to do anything for the Service of Mahaprabhu, for the propagation of His Mission", Srila Sridhar Maharaj himself tended to be conservative and a traditionalist in his behaviour - he was born in a brahmana family and he was disinclined to do things that went against his brahmana nature. Providing meat for foreign guests seemed disgusting to him. He found it hard to reconcile this sort of activity with his own inner belief in the principle "to thine own self be true".

 

Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur surrounded himself with exalted bhaktas, many of whom where born in highly respected brahmana families. Devotees such as Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj who was born in a brahmana family in the "Nityananda vamsa", the lineage of descendents Srila Nityananda Prabhu himself, and Sripad Bhakti Pramod Puri Maharaj. Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur taught these devotees the <i>Vaikuntha-vrtti</i> understanding about no limitation in our willingness to surrender and perform bhakti: 'I am prepared to do anything for the Service of Mahaprabhu, for the propagation of His Mission.

 

But the "end justifies the means" activities of some people from a degraded or perverted, or criminal or hippy background -- the sort of activities that are described in Monkey on a Stick -- those sorts of activities set back the propagation of the sankirtan movement of Mahaprabhu. An ISKCON Acharya recently told me that Prabhupada taught "all publicity is good publicity"; but I beg to differ from him on that point. Some publicity the Krishna Consciousness Movement gets is very bad publicity. Bad publicity would not be pleasing to Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur. Of that, I feel quite certain.

 

We have seen devotees who think that "the end justifies the means" within the Krishna Consciousness Movement. We have seen the repercussions that their activities caused. If a devotee deceives people, if a devotee steals from people, if a devotee acts in a scandalous way and it gets into the newspapers or into a book such as "Monkey on a Stick" or a published article such as the Rolling Stone magazine's article "Dial Om for Murder", then has that "end justifies the means" activity brought about a favourable end result? I think not.

 

How should a devotee act, and think? Should we adopt the prinicple that the "end justifies the means" in our daily life? Many people are accustomed to following their Guru or appointed leaders blindly. They agree to go down that route. The leader will tell you a disciple must have unquestioning obedience to his Guru. If the disciple hears "women are less intelligent" or "women should be controlled by their husband" he will think the community he is in should be organized so that women are subservient to men. A mindless follower will similarly think that black people are meant to be controlled by fair skinned people, or slaves, when he hears some things written in some places.

 

I believe devotees should not be mindless followers. If your Guru says "serve meat to the visitors" then there is no harm in raising a mild protest to that. Prabhupada Srila Saraswati Thakura did not reject Srila Sridhar Maharaj when he queried his Guru about things his Guru had said. In fact it is the responsibility of a genuine disciple to seek deeper insights from his Guru, as opposed to adopting a blind faith attitude of "I do exactly what I am told". An enlightened disciple knows what is right and what is wrong, and his external (mahanta) Guru and internal (caitya) Guru are in perfect accord. There is no aparadha in Arjuna's statement to his Guru, "Krishna I will not fight!". A devotee is permitted to act according to his conscience.

 

 

Bhaktivinoda Thakura has given his decision, in his Tattva-sutra, that although when Bhagavad-gita was spoken to Arjuna, he engaged himself in fighting, had it been Uddhava in place of Arjuna, after hearing the conclusion of Bhagavad-gita where Krsna says, "Give up everything and surrender to Me," Uddhava would have accepted this and gone away from the warfield. Upon hearing the same advice, Arjuna acted in one way, but Uddhava would have acted in another. After hearing the first installment of Krsna's instructions Arjuna tells Krsna in the Bhagavad-gita (3.1 - 2):

jyayasi cet karmanas te mata buddhir janardana

tat kim karmani ghore mam niyojayasi kesava

vyamisreneva vakyena buddhim mohayasiva me

tad ekam vada niscitya yena sreyo 'ham apnuyam

 

"You say that jnana, knowledge, is better than karma, work. Why then do you want to engage me in this dreadful karma of fighting?" Then Krsna said, "You have your capacity in karma: finish your career, and then you can aspire to come to the level of jnana, inquiry into knowledge. It is not a cheap thing to transcend all activity and attain naiskarmya, freedom from karma. First finish the course of your karma; then you will become free from karma, and gradually you will develop transcendental knowledge and devotion. So, I say, 'Engage yourself in this present fight.' Fighting is not recommended for everyone, but for you, and men of your section."

 

The deeper understanding of the final instruction of Srimad Bhagavad-Gita "sarva dharman parityajya" is that one’s adhikara or qualification is always in accordance with one's own svabhava or inherent nature. Those individuals who have realized "vasudeva sarvam iti" are endowed with a detached nature and will, after hearing the Bhagavad-Gita, accept the renounced order like Uddhava and refrain from work in the mundane world.

 

When Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj returned from preaching in England, he brought one Mr. Burchett back with him. A meeting was held at the Bagh Bazaar Math. That meeting was presided over by a gentleman of the name Hiran Dutta, a good scholar and a Theosophist. In his talk he said, 'When we were students at City College, Bhaktivinoda Thakura delivered a lecture there to the effect that in the near future Western scholars would come and join the Sankirtana under the banner of Mahaprabhu. Now, clearly, I can bear witness to the fact that his prediction is beginning to come true. I heard the lecture in my young days, and now in my old age I see the evidence - it is going to be true. I am very glad for that.'

Prabhupada Srila Saraswati Thakura wanted the Krishna Consciousness Movement to spread all around the world. It has spread - to some extent. But in comparison to the spread of Buddhism in the past 30 years the growth of Krishna Consciousness in the West is rather insignificant. People may not like this statement, but from an impartial viewpoint I feel this is very much the case. What differentiates Buddhists and followers of Krishna Consciousness? Well, for starters, Buddhists never think that the end justifies the means. They don't believe their teacher is somehow above and beyond the law of karma. Even the famous teachers of Buddhism always remain mindful that they need to act in an ethical way. Buddhists believe if you are a hypocrite who preaches "goodness" while doing many kinds of "end justifies the means" bad things then you will get some instant karma for that. No matter how lofty a status you have within your little clique. Devotees can learn something from the Buddhists on this point, I believe.

 

Again and again we are told that only one disciple of Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur ever preached successfully in the West. But in the quote of Srila Sridhar Maharaj above we see that he witnessed that Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur was immensely pleased when his disciple Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj brought his disciple (Mr. Burchet) to India. Wouldn't it be nice to see that ISKCON devotees were able to appreciate the achievement of Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj?

Mr. Burchett was an Australian and he was the initiated disciple of Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj. When he came to India he met Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur, the Guru of his Guru. Mr. Burchett was in fact the first person ever to receive initiation from a disciple of Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur. Indeed, Sripad Bhakti Saranga Goswami Maharaj was the first disciple of Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur to become a diksa guru - he began initiating after being commanded to do that by Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur.

 

In the meeting at Bagh Bazaar Math we find that Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur arranged that a Theosophist, Hiran Dutta, was chairman of the meeting. That kind of broad minded, non-sectarian thinking... where do we see that now?

[Shakti-Fan 0]

 

In the meeting at Bagh Bazaar Math we find that Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur arranged that a Theosophist, Hiran Dutta, was chairman of the meeting. That kind of broad minded, non-sectarian thinking... where do we see that now?

Well, we can see that on our computer screen in the words of Srila Sridhar Maharaja. We can only see that kind of thinking transformed into action when there is a person who has a high type of devotion. That is very rare.

[Guest guest]

 

The deeper understanding of the final instruction of Srimad Bhagavad-Gita "sarva dharman parityajya" is that one’s adhikara or qualification is always in accordance with one's own svabhava or inherent nature.

 

Deep stuff, prabhu... thank you very much for sharing these realizations... I'm much indebted to you all...