Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Dear friends must tell you with joy that am glad to be in your company. Just read alout to sylvie, my wife, this email below Oh rafael, oh prasant tku so much for sharing those wisdom trying to live according to the wisdom of our MASTER, who is GDS Grace living for us always, means having a lot of obstacles to master, but when being honest and grateful and surrendering completely to our SELF joy endless is the result. This, dear friends, your humble friends, experiences even now, amidth so many challenges to tackle, living in the surrounding our Sadguru choose for us, is the answer for lifes quest. Thank you all - special thank you to our moderator, our sangha founder, our boooooooom Yossi, Ramesh and all of us who do not participate anymore but have always been of help - when really needed. Om namo bhagavate Sri Ramanaya Om and of course Gabriele and others.... michael - rafaelstoneman Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:49 PM Re: (unknown) This is well appreciated. It is wise to cling to the Master's words. What more can I say? , Prasanth Jalasutram <jvrsprasanth wrote:>> Everyone of us are equal and travelling in the same boat and we all are one> and the same.> > Just wanted to add ramana maharshi's opinions about What is right and What> is wrong<http://prashantaboutindia.blogspot.com/2009/06/ramana-maharshi-about-what-is-right-and.html>> Q: If it is a question of doing something one considers wrong, and thereby> saving someone else from a great wrong, should one do it or refrain?> > Bhagavan: What is right and wrong? There is no standard by which to judge> something to be right another to be wrong. Opinions differ according to the> nature of the individual and according to the surroundings. They are again> ideas and nothing more. Do not worry about them. But get rid of thoughts. If> you always remain in the right, then right will prevail in the world.> > When asked for further elucidation Sri Bhagavan then pointed out that to see> wrong in another is one's own wrong. The discrimination between right and> wrong is the origin of sin. One's own sin is reflected outside and the> individual in ignorance superimposes it on another. The best course for one> is to reach the state in which such discrimination does not arise. Do you> see wrong or right in your sleep? Be asleep even in the wakeful state, abide> as the Self and remain uncontaminated by what goes on around. Moreover,> however much you might advise them, your hearers may not rectify themselves.> Be in the right yourself and remain silent. Your silence will have more> effect than your words or deeds.> > Source: The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi edited by Arthur Osborne> Om namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya> Prasanth Jalasutram> > On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobswrote:> > >> >> >> > Dear Raef,> >> > I feel that the gist of your question rests in this paragraph.> >> > "What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant> > to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many> > of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here".> >> > I am in full agreement with this statement.> >> > Each in our own way are directed by his Grace to form our own synthesis of> > his Teachings to precisely suit our own needs; and eventually after> > determined persistence in the sadhana, to which we are best suited, reach> > Realisation of the Self.> >> > All love,> >> > In Him,> >> > Alan> >> > > >> > > > --> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2236 - Release 07/13/09 17:57:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Michael, The palpability (is this a real word?)of your heart is felt deeply Rafael , " Michael Bindel " <michael.bindel wrote: > > Dear friends > > must tell you with joy that am glad to be in your company. > Just read alout to sylvie, my wife, this email below > Oh rafael, oh prasant > tku so much for sharing those wisdom > trying to live according to the wisdom of our MASTER, who is GDS Grace living for us always, means having a lot of obstacles to master, but when being honest and grateful and surrendering completely to our SELF joy endless is the result. > This, dear friends, your humble friends, experiences even now, amidth so many challenges to tackle, living in the surrounding our Sadguru choose for us, is the answer for lifes quest. > Thank you all - special thank you to our moderator, our sangha founder, our boooooooom Yossi, Ramesh and all of us who do not participate anymore but have always been of help - when really needed. > > Om namo bhagavate Sri Ramanaya Om > > > and of course Gabriele and others.... > > > michael > > > - > rafaelstoneman > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:49 PM > Re: (unknown) > > > > > > This is well appreciated. It is wise to cling to the Master's words. What more can I say? > > , Prasanth Jalasutram <jvrsprasanth@> wrote: > > > > Everyone of us are equal and travelling in the same boat and we all are one > > and the same. > > > > Just wanted to add ramana maharshi's opinions about What is right and What > > is wrong<http://prashantaboutindia.blogspot.com/2009/06/ramana-maharshi-about-what-\ is-right-and.html> > > Q: If it is a question of doing something one considers wrong, and thereby > > saving someone else from a great wrong, should one do it or refrain? > > > > Bhagavan: What is right and wrong? There is no standard by which to judge > > something to be right another to be wrong. Opinions differ according to the > > nature of the individual and according to the surroundings. They are again > > ideas and nothing more. Do not worry about them. But get rid of thoughts. If > > you always remain in the right, then right will prevail in the world. > > > > When asked for further elucidation Sri Bhagavan then pointed out that to see > > wrong in another is one's own wrong. The discrimination between right and > > wrong is the origin of sin. One's own sin is reflected outside and the > > individual in ignorance superimposes it on another. The best course for one > > is to reach the state in which such discrimination does not arise. Do you > > see wrong or right in your sleep? Be asleep even in the wakeful state, abide > > as the Self and remain uncontaminated by what goes on around. Moreover, > > however much you might advise them, your hearers may not rectify themselves. > > Be in the right yourself and remain silent. Your silence will have more > > effect than your words or deeds. > > > > Source: The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi edited by Arthur Osborne > > Om namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya > > Prasanth Jalasutram > > > > On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@>wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Raef, > > > > > > I feel that the gist of your question rests in this paragraph. > > > > > > " What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant > > > to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many > > > of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here " . > > > > > > I am in full agreement with this statement. > > > > > > Each in our own way are directed by his Grace to form our own synthesis of > > > his Teachings to precisely suit our own needs; and eventually after > > > determined persistence in the sadhana, to which we are best suited, reach > > > Realisation of the Self. > > > > > > All love, > > > > > > In Him, > > > > > > Alan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2236 - Release 07/13/09 17:57:00 > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Oh no Rafe ..I was just kidding ...Ultimately we all GET THERE .. all love ramesh --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman wrote: rafaelstoneman <rafaelstonemanRe: (unknown) Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 7:01 PM Thank you Rameshyou are a true gentleman... i am a scoundral... but I love when others challange me when it is true to do so.Rafael, ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Rafe ,> > Ofcourse you are entitled to your view point and I would not challenge that gently or otherwise.> > With all love> > ramesh> > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote:> > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...>> Re: (unknown)> > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 5:12 PM> > > > > > > > > Thank you for that Ramesh, especially we all have one to one relationship with the only one... > > what i would gently challenge is the idea of remnant karma... i do not approach things this way... so must wonder why you would... it is a story that was picked up somewhere in reading the holy texts and the words of Ramana... but are you absolutely certain that Ramana would describe it this way to you in your heart? If so, I stand corrected, if not, well sir... in all love and service> > Rafael> > , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote:> >> > Dear Rafael ,> > > > Exquisite ...your expressions , your feelings and most of all your STATE OF BEING !> > > > I just want to comment very briefly ..Just replied this morning to Richards's mail regarding duality thus : " I for one have to content with the feeling of duality until the oneness becomes complete and permanent." > > > > Yes intellectually i have understood or rather I feel i have understood the real meaning of Advaita . But sustaining in that state of experience is altogether a different thing ..The glimpses are there no doubt ..but it appears that there is enough remnant karma to be worked out before the state becomes permanent.> > > > Ofcourse the source and destination are the same ..within one's own SPIRITUAL HEART !> > > > And last but not the least ..we all have ONE to ONE realtionship with the ONLY ONE !> > > > love> > > > ramesh> > > > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote:> > > > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...>> > (unknown)> > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 11:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like some feedback on this from all who would like to respond.> > > > We are all in agreement here that Ramana's life was the perfect demonstration. We have all practiced Self Enquiry and all feel devotion to Ramana, so by no means is this to instigate argument. I want to understand something very specific here.> > > > I know that Ramana Himself made reference to Laksmhi the cow and His mother as having attained realization, along with others.> > > > And we all approach Him as the realized one. No confusion here.> > > > What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here.> > > > What I trust alone is when Ramana speaks directly to me. Even here the context is only relevant to the moment and the context of how I hear what He is saying; with filters or in complete clarity.> > > > What I am being told and I share this with all of you here not to be validated or confirmed in any way but simply because it is rising in what I would call truth of obeying Ramana's word to me.> > > > It has been brought to my attention by Ramana, that there is no way to call someone Realized (this He is making relevant to me in this moment for His own purpose). The reason He says He wants me to fully comprehend this is to let go of this self definition in terms of being realized. He says all is the realized Self, what else could be? This is what He is revealing in the heart right now... this is not regurgitation of His statements read over the years in study. He is urging me to let go completely of this idea, that there is a destination to arrive at known as realization. This may sound contrary to some of His statments and may be confirmed by other statements He has made. But that is also not the point.> > > > He has made it abundantly clear to me that only one in their own heart can confirm that they are the eternal self. Now, as Ramana is the eternal self in the heart, He can confirm from within. At this point it is no longer required to call the one confirming this truth by the name of Ramana, as it is the eternal with out the form any longer- do we really believe that when the eternal had the form of Ramana, that the form interfered in any way? No, I believe we agree on this matter, which is why we regard Ramana as the perfect demonstration of the Eternal with a human form. > > > > Yet, as this confirmation is made by ourself in the heart, we continue to refer to the confirmer as Ramana out of respect and loyalty to the one we love; just as Ramana continued to refer to Arunachala, and Papaji always had a picture of Ramana behind him. > > > > What I am getting at is that it can seem like tricky business when we interact and especially with all the non dual teachers out there comming out of the wood work, and the rising sense in ourselves to be teachers, if not in the traditional sense, at the least in our day to day encounters.> > > > I am expressing all of this with the intent to be completely honest and in turn refine the communication process on these matters.> > > > I know I have used a lot of words, and it may be a tendency of the mind to want to articulate how one experiences being oneself, limited to language, and I am more than happy to keep quiet and even go away from here if this is a distraction. And I fully accept the notion of you all saying that this is just the ramblings of one on their way to realization. But is this really how you all see the matter? That we are heading to a final realization? Because again, Ramana has told me to give up that notion of finality in order to fully uncover what has always been, and could never be called an acomplishment.> > > > Yours in Ramana and in Honesty,> > > > Rafael Stoneman> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Get Where? , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv wrote: > > Oh no Rafe ..I was just kidding ...Ultimately we all GET THERE .. > all love > > ramesh > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman wrote: > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman > Re: (unknown) > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 7:01 PM > > Thank you Ramesh > you are a true gentleman... i am a scoundral... but I love when others challange me when it is true to do so. > > Rafael > > , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote: > > > > Dear Rafe , > > > > Ofcourse you are entitled to your view point and I would not challenge that gently or otherwise. > > > > With all love > > > > ramesh > > > > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> > > Re: (unknown) > > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 5:12 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for that Ramesh, especially we all have one to one relationship with the only one... > > > > what i would gently challenge is the idea of remnant karma... i do not approach things this way... so must wonder why you would... it is a story that was picked up somewhere in reading the holy texts and the words of Ramana... but are you absolutely certain that Ramana would describe it this way to you in your heart? If so, I stand corrected, if not, well sir... in all love and service > > > > Rafael > > > > , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Rafael , > > > > > > Exquisite ...your expressions , your feelings and most of all your STATE OF BEING ! > > > > > > I just want to comment very briefly ..Just replied this morning to Richards's mail regarding duality thus : " I for one have to content with the feeling of duality until the oneness becomes complete and permanent. " > > > > > > Yes intellectually i have understood or rather I feel i have understood the real meaning of Advaita . But sustaining in that state of experience is altogether a different thing ..The glimpses are there no doubt ..but it appears that there is enough remnant karma to be worked out before the state becomes permanent. > > > > > > Ofcourse the source and destination are the same ..within one's own SPIRITUAL HEART ! > > > > > > And last but not the least ..we all have ONE to ONE realtionship with the ONLY ONE ! > > > > > > love > > > > > > ramesh > > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> > > > (unknown) > > > > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 11:07 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like some feedback on this from all who would like to respond. > > > > > > We are all in agreement here that Ramana's life was the perfect demonstration. We have all practiced Self Enquiry and all feel devotion to Ramana, so by no means is this to instigate argument. I want to understand something very specific here. > > > > > > I know that Ramana Himself made reference to Laksmhi the cow and His mother as having attained realization, along with others. > > > > > > And we all approach Him as the realized one. No confusion here. > > > > > > What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here. > > > > > > What I trust alone is when Ramana speaks directly to me. Even here the context is only relevant to the moment and the context of how I hear what He is saying; with filters or in complete clarity. > > > > > > What I am being told and I share this with all of you here not to be validated or confirmed in any way but simply because it is rising in what I would call truth of obeying Ramana's word to me. > > > > > > It has been brought to my attention by Ramana, that there is no way to call someone Realized (this He is making relevant to me in this moment for His own purpose). The reason He says He wants me to fully comprehend this is to let go of this self definition in terms of being realized. He says all is the realized Self, what else could be? This is what He is revealing in the heart right now... this is not regurgitation of His statements read over the years in study. He is urging me to let go completely of this idea, that there is a destination to arrive at known as realization. This may sound contrary to some of His statments and may be confirmed by other statements He has made. But that is also not the point. > > > > > > He has made it abundantly clear to me that only one in their own heart can confirm that they are the eternal self. Now, as Ramana is the eternal self in the heart, He can confirm from within. At this point it is no longer required to call the one confirming this truth by the name of Ramana, as it is the eternal with out the form any longer- do we really believe that when the eternal had the form of Ramana, that the form interfered in any way? No, I believe we agree on this matter, which is why we regard Ramana as the perfect demonstration of the Eternal with a human form. > > > > > > Yet, as this confirmation is made by ourself in the heart, we continue to refer to the confirmer as Ramana out of respect and loyalty to the one we love; just as Ramana continued to refer to Arunachala, and Papaji always had a picture of Ramana behind him. > > > > > > What I am getting at is that it can seem like tricky business when we interact and especially with all the non dual teachers out there comming out of the wood work, and the rising sense in ourselves to be teachers, if not in the traditional sense, at the least in our day to day encounters. > > > > > > I am expressing all of this with the intent to be completely honest and in turn refine the communication process on these matters. > > > > > > I know I have used a lot of words, and it may be a tendency of the mind to want to articulate how one experiences being oneself, limited to language, and I am more than happy to keep quiet and even go away from here if this is a distraction. And I fully accept the notion of you all saying that this is just the ramblings of one on their way to realization. But is this really how you all see the matter? That we are heading to a final realization? Because again, Ramana has told me to give up that notion of finality in order to fully uncover what has always been, and could never be called an acomplishment. > > > > > > Yours in Ramana and in Honesty, > > > > > > Rafael Stoneman > > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Good question...It could ofcourse be here and now ! --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman wrote: rafaelstoneman <rafaelstonemanRe: (unknown) Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 9:53 PM Get Where? , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote:>> Oh no Rafe ..I was just kidding ...Ultimately we all GET THERE ..> all love> > ramesh> > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote:> > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...>> Re: (unknown)> > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 7:01 PM> > > > > > > > > Thank you Ramesh> you are a true gentleman... i am a scoundral... but I love when others challange me when it is true to do so.> > Rafael> > , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote:> >> > Dear Rafe ,> > > > Ofcourse you are entitled to your view point and I would not challenge that gently or otherwise.> > > > With all love> > > > ramesh> > > > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote:> > > > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...>> > Re: (unknown)> > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 5:12 PM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for that Ramesh, especially we all have one to one relationship with the only one... > > > > what i would gently challenge is the idea of remnant karma... i do not approach things this way... so must wonder why you would... it is a story that was picked up somewhere in reading the holy texts and the words of Ramana... but are you absolutely certain that Ramana would describe it this way to you in your heart? If so, I stand corrected, if not, well sir... in all love and service> > > > Rafael> > > > , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Rafael ,> > > > > > Exquisite ...your expressions , your feelings and most of all your STATE OF BEING !> > > > > > I just want to comment very briefly ..Just replied this morning to Richards's mail regarding duality thus : " I for one have to content with the feeling of duality until the oneness becomes complete and permanent." > > > > > > Yes intellectually i have understood or rather I feel i have understood the real meaning of Advaita . But sustaining in that state of experience is altogether a different thing ..The glimpses are there no doubt ..but it appears that there is enough remnant karma to be worked out before the state becomes permanent.> > > > > > Ofcourse the source and destination are the same ..within one's own SPIRITUAL HEART !> > > > > > And last but not the least ..we all have ONE to ONE realtionship with the ONLY ONE !> > > > > > love> > > > > > ramesh> > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 7/14/09, rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...> wrote:> > > > > > > > > rafaelstoneman <rafaelstoneman@ ...>> > > (unknown)> > > > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 11:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like some feedback on this from all who would like to respond.> > > > > > We are all in agreement here that Ramana's life was the perfect demonstration. We have all practiced Self Enquiry and all feel devotion to Ramana, so by no means is this to instigate argument. I want to understand something very specific here.> > > > > > I know that Ramana Himself made reference to Laksmhi the cow and His mother as having attained realization, along with others.> > > > > > And we all approach Him as the realized one. No confusion here.> > > > > > What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here.> > > > > > What I trust alone is when Ramana speaks directly to me. Even here the context is only relevant to the moment and the context of how I hear what He is saying; with filters or in complete clarity.> > > > > > What I am being told and I share this with all of you here not to be validated or confirmed in any way but simply because it is rising in what I would call truth of obeying Ramana's word to me.> > > > > > It has been brought to my attention by Ramana, that there is no way to call someone Realized (this He is making relevant to me in this moment for His own purpose). The reason He says He wants me to fully comprehend this is to let go of this self definition in terms of being realized. He says all is the realized Self, what else could be? This is what He is revealing in the heart right now... this is not regurgitation of His statements read over the years in study. He is urging me to let go completely of this idea, that there is a destination to arrive at known as realization. This may sound contrary to some of His statments and may be confirmed by other statements He has made. But that is also not the point.> > > > > > He has made it abundantly clear to me that only one in their own heart can confirm that they are the eternal self. Now, as Ramana is the eternal self in the heart, He can confirm from within. At this point it is no longer required to call the one confirming this truth by the name of Ramana, as it is the eternal with out the form any longer- do we really believe that when the eternal had the form of Ramana, that the form interfered in any way? No, I believe we agree on this matter, which is why we regard Ramana as the perfect demonstration of the Eternal with a human form. > > > > > > Yet, as this confirmation is made by ourself in the heart, we continue to refer to the confirmer as Ramana out of respect and loyalty to the one we love; just as Ramana continued to refer to Arunachala, and Papaji always had a picture of Ramana behind him. > > > > > > What I am getting at is that it can seem like tricky business when we interact and especially with all the non dual teachers out there comming out of the wood work, and the rising sense in ourselves to be teachers, if not in the traditional sense, at the least in our day to day encounters.> > > > > > I am expressing all of this with the intent to be completely honest and in turn refine the communication process on these matters.> > > > > > I know I have used a lot of words, and it may be a tendency of the mind to want to articulate how one experiences being oneself, limited to language, and I am more than happy to keep quiet and even go away from here if this is a distraction. And I fully accept the notion of you all saying that this is just the ramblings of one on their way to realization. But is this really how you all see the matter? That we are heading to a final realization? Because again, Ramana has told me to give up that notion of finality in order to fully uncover what has always been, and could never be called an acomplishment.> > > > > > Yours in Ramana and in Honesty,> > > > > > Rafael Stoneman> > >> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 14, 2009 Rafael palpability - is the exact word for what i feel that you want to transmit.... what a powerful word.... let share your background so we can understand your way who influenced you most when being very young indeed..... regarding this palpability: in spite of all obstacles since being born the quality of "heart" was always the center of my attention - even if i did not understand what i looked for; of course. And in the world i entered and lived this quality of HEART was admired and at the same time looked down at... Due to Grace - what else? - walked the walk with all distraction and always returned sooner than later.... finally accepted that only living a path of HEART (words of Castaneda) was worth walking.. and it came like it had to come "meeting" Ramana and of course again not understanding a word... never giving up - till the curtain of NOKNOWLEDGE was raised and understood and not accepted and suffered and accepted and slowly but surely discovered that ONGONG happines depend ONLY on this persons readiness glad that you came to our Sangha! in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - rafaelstoneman Tuesday, July 14, 2009 5:38 PM Re: (unknown) Michael,The palpability (is this a real word?)of your heart is felt deeplyRafael , "Michael Bindel" <michael.bindel wrote:>> Dear friends> > must tell you with joy that am glad to be in your company.> Just read alout to sylvie, my wife, this email below> Oh rafael, oh prasant> tku so much for sharing those wisdom> trying to live according to the wisdom of our MASTER, who is GDS Grace living for us always, means having a lot of obstacles to master, but when being honest and grateful and surrendering completely to our SELF joy endless is the result.> This, dear friends, your humble friends, experiences even now, amidth so many challenges to tackle, living in the surrounding our Sadguru choose for us, is the answer for lifes quest.> Thank you all - special thank you to our moderator, our sangha founder, our boooooooom Yossi, Ramesh and all of us who do not participate anymore but have always been of help - when really needed.> > Om namo bhagavate Sri Ramanaya Om> > > and of course Gabriele and others....> > > michael> > > - > rafaelstoneman > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:49 PM> Re: (unknown)> > > > > > This is well appreciated. It is wise to cling to the Master's words. What more can I say?> > , Prasanth Jalasutram <jvrsprasanth@> wrote:> >> > Everyone of us are equal and travelling in the same boat and we all are one> > and the same.> > > > Just wanted to add ramana maharshi's opinions about What is right and What> > is wrong<http://prashantaboutindia.blogspot.com/2009/06/ramana-maharshi-about-what-is-right-and.html>> > Q: If it is a question of doing something one considers wrong, and thereby> > saving someone else from a great wrong, should one do it or refrain?> > > > Bhagavan: What is right and wrong? There is no standard by which to judge> > something to be right another to be wrong. Opinions differ according to the> > nature of the individual and according to the surroundings. They are again> > ideas and nothing more. Do not worry about them. But get rid of thoughts. If> > you always remain in the right, then right will prevail in the world.> > > > When asked for further elucidation Sri Bhagavan then pointed out that to see> > wrong in another is one's own wrong. The discrimination between right and> > wrong is the origin of sin. One's own sin is reflected outside and the> > individual in ignorance superimposes it on another. The best course for one> > is to reach the state in which such discrimination does not arise. Do you> > see wrong or right in your sleep? Be asleep even in the wakeful state, abide> > as the Self and remain uncontaminated by what goes on around. Moreover,> > however much you might advise them, your hearers may not rectify themselves.> > Be in the right yourself and remain silent. Your silence will have more> > effect than your words or deeds.> > > > Source: The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi edited by Arthur Osborne> > Om namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya> > Prasanth Jalasutram> > > > On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@>wrote:> > > > >> > >> > >> > > Dear Raef,> > >> > > I feel that the gist of your question rests in this paragraph.> > >> > > "What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant> > > to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many> > > of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here".> > >> > > I am in full agreement with this statement.> > >> > > Each in our own way are directed by his Grace to form our own synthesis of> > > his Teachings to precisely suit our own needs; and eventually after> > > determined persistence in the sadhana, to which we are best suited, reach> > > Realisation of the Self.> > >> > > All love,> > >> > > In Him,> > >> > > Alan> > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > --> >> > > > > > > -------------------------> > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2236 - Release 07/13/09 17:57:00> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2237 - Release 07/14/09 05:56:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 15, 2009 thank you , " Michael Bindel " <michael.bindel wrote: > > Rafael > > palpability - is the exact word for what i feel that you want to transmit.... > what a powerful word.... > let share your background so we can understand your way > who influenced you most when being very young indeed..... > > > regarding this palpability: > in spite of all obstacles since being born the quality of " heart " was always the center of my attention - even if i did not understand what i looked for; of course. And in the world i entered and lived this quality of HEART was admired and at the same time looked down at... > Due to Grace - what else? - walked the walk with all distraction and always returned sooner than later.... > finally accepted that only living a path of HEART (words of Castaneda) was worth walking.. > and it came like it had to come > " meeting " Ramana and of course again not understanding a word... > never giving up - till the curtain of NOKNOWLEDGE was raised and understood and not accepted and suffered and accepted and slowly but surely discovered that ONGONG happines depend ONLY on this persons readiness > > glad that you came to our Sangha! > > in Sri Ramana Maharshi > > michael > - > rafaelstoneman > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009 5:38 PM > Re: (unknown) > > > > > > Michael, > > The palpability (is this a real word?)of your heart is felt deeply > > Rafael > , " Michael Bindel " <michael.bindel@> wrote: > > > > Dear friends > > > > must tell you with joy that am glad to be in your company. > > Just read alout to sylvie, my wife, this email below > > Oh rafael, oh prasant > > tku so much for sharing those wisdom > > trying to live according to the wisdom of our MASTER, who is GDS Grace living for us always, means having a lot of obstacles to master, but when being honest and grateful and surrendering completely to our SELF joy endless is the result. > > This, dear friends, your humble friends, experiences even now, amidth so many challenges to tackle, living in the surrounding our Sadguru choose for us, is the answer for lifes quest. > > Thank you all - special thank you to our moderator, our sangha founder, our boooooooom Yossi, Ramesh and all of us who do not participate anymore but have always been of help - when really needed. > > > > Om namo bhagavate Sri Ramanaya Om > > > > > > and of course Gabriele and others.... > > > > > > michael > > > > > > - > > rafaelstoneman > > > > Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:49 PM > > Re: (unknown) > > > > > > > > > > > > This is well appreciated. It is wise to cling to the Master's words. What more can I say? > > > > , Prasanth Jalasutram <jvrsprasanth@> wrote: > > > > > > Everyone of us are equal and travelling in the same boat and we all are one > > > and the same. > > > > > > Just wanted to add ramana maharshi's opinions about What is right and What > > > is wrong<http://prashantaboutindia.blogspot.com/2009/06/ramana-maharshi-about-what-\ is-right-and.html> > > > Q: If it is a question of doing something one considers wrong, and thereby > > > saving someone else from a great wrong, should one do it or refrain? > > > > > > Bhagavan: What is right and wrong? There is no standard by which to judge > > > something to be right another to be wrong. Opinions differ according to the > > > nature of the individual and according to the surroundings. They are again > > > ideas and nothing more. Do not worry about them. But get rid of thoughts. If > > > you always remain in the right, then right will prevail in the world. > > > > > > When asked for further elucidation Sri Bhagavan then pointed out that to see > > > wrong in another is one's own wrong. The discrimination between right and > > > wrong is the origin of sin. One's own sin is reflected outside and the > > > individual in ignorance superimposes it on another. The best course for one > > > is to reach the state in which such discrimination does not arise. Do you > > > see wrong or right in your sleep? Be asleep even in the wakeful state, abide > > > as the Self and remain uncontaminated by what goes on around. Moreover, > > > however much you might advise them, your hearers may not rectify themselves. > > > Be in the right yourself and remain silent. Your silence will have more > > > effect than your words or deeds. > > > > > > Source: The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi edited by Arthur Osborne > > > Om namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya > > > Prasanth Jalasutram > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@>wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Raef, > > > > > > > > I feel that the gist of your question rests in this paragraph. > > > > > > > > " What I am looking at is that Ramana saying someone is realized is relevant > > > > to the moment that He said it and who He was saying it to. How we take many > > > > of His teachings may seem to differ in each of us here " . > > > > > > > > I am in full agreement with this statement. > > > > > > > > Each in our own way are directed by his Grace to form our own synthesis of > > > > his Teachings to precisely suit our own needs; and eventually after > > > > determined persistence in the sadhana, to which we are best suited, reach > > > > Realisation of the Self. > > > > > > > > All love, > > > > > > > > In Him, > > > > > > > > Alan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2236 - Release 07/13/09 17:57:00 > > > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.13/2237 - Release 07/14/09 05:56:00 > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 30, 2009 ---- Original message ---- >Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 10:33:06 +0530 (IST) > A T Rajesh Kumar <gabbardaaku >Subject: (unknown) >To: > > > > Hello Upadeshaji, > I don't think Richard Sir has done anything wrong. > He has just given us an innocent, curious witness > account of the village puja. These village people, > whose spiritual consciousness is not yet awakened > have their own way of worshipping God. Why criticise > their innocent Bhakti? These village folks have > nothing impure in their mind when they perform > animal sacrifice. According to Lord Krishna, it is > the motive behind the actions which really count, > and not the actions themselves. We must always pick > only what is good and discard what is bad. Why not > pick out the Bhakti of these village floks. > rgds, > rajesh > > --------------- thank you for your compasssion, dear rajesh. Whoever perceives Within misfortune Fortune Within hunger Satiation And happiness Within misery, Beholding Joy and beauty Wherever Eye is cast - Such a one, My friend Sees Truly Indeed. _()_ yosy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted July 30, 2009 No one is criticizing the village people or the village puja, etc. Do not make a mountain out of a molehill.  Those who wish to read such articles about animal sacrifices can find plenty of places on the web to do so. The point is that not everything needs to be posted here on this list. One has to show good taste and judgment and sensitivity to the mental atmosphere of a place. There were people who were asked to leave Ramanashram when they did not follow the rules or the general expectations. We follow the same principle here. People are here because they are devotees of Bhagavan Ramana or have a strong affinity with the Sage of Arunachala. It is really that simple. The Guru here is Ramana. Namaste and love to all Harsha  On Behalf Of A T Rajesh Kumar Thursday, July 30, 2009 1:03 AM (unknown) Hello Upadeshaji, I don't think Richard Sir has done anything wrong. He has just given us an innocent, curious witness account of the village puja. These village people, whose spiritual consciousness is not yet awakened have their own way of worshipping God. Why criticise their innocent Bhakti? These village folks have nothing impure in their mind when they perform animal sacrifice. According to Lord Krishna, it is the motive behind the actions which really count, and not the actions themselves. We must always pick only what is good and discard what is bad. Why not pick out the Bhakti of these village floks. rgds, rajesh Looking for local information? Find it on Local Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 8, 2009 Dear Gopi again thank you..... b u t do you agree or disagree with the last statement in my previous mail? So each of us should give hisher best to live his life according to hisher INNER BELIEF i prefer to state my inner knowledgebecause this INNER knowledge should and must be free of any doubtbut this is only possible for those of us who have been struggling suffering etc thru ages - who understand the luggagge of "past", integrated the lessons learned from "past" into their present beingonly those can communicate like you stated on a personal level in the dual world, rooted themselves in nonduality. awaiting your esteemed reply in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael bindel - Gopi Krishna Cc: michael.bindel Tuesday, September 08, 2009 11:49 AM (unknown) Dear Michael Bindel,Love and Love alone....Many thanks for your kind words. I am blessed and honoured. May God bless us all to tread on the path of Reality, Truth and Happiness. Let us all invoke His blessings in our day-to-day life so that we do not get distracted by the false glitters of this world and wander away from His path. I pray O Lord!Let the light ofSelf-RealisationBe lightedIn my Heart!!!Love and Love alone....P. Gopi Krishna Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel (AT) t-online (DOT) hu michael_bindel Mon Sep 7, 2009 6:52 am (PDT) Dear Gopi Krishnaafter reading and rereading your contribution:wonderful work donethank you so much for answering the question michael put to the Sangha, because this questions touches the core of "the matter"Due to my manyfold experiences in decades with people all over who looked for "being happy", wanting to "change" their lives, wanting to find "TRUTH" and so and discovering that most, nearly all of them, wanted just to find an easier way out of the labyrinth of their life, nearly never commiting themselves fully to their "search". The same i found i so many who use advaita as a signpost instead of looking to the "moon".So i keep asking all concerned how do you put your search in practical terms in life from moment to moment...and here there is a big big silenceYour answer is really to the point - congratulations.There remains a question mark regarding your last statement:The understanding and truth that "I am the Self and NOT THIS BODY" should not lead to arguments, but make one to understand the depth of it so that one deals with others as one deals with oneself. That is the true understanding and approach of Advaita.And who of us deals with himself as heshe should - according to Advaita?Knowing that we are the SELF and nothing else - in a world full of those, who believe their egosuffering is all what is....So each of us should give hisher best to live his life according to hisher INNER BELIEF i prefer to state my inner knowledgebecause this INNER knowledge should and must be free of any doubtbut this is only possible for those of us who have been struggling suffering etc thru ages - who understand the luggagge of "past", integrated the lessons learned from "past" into their present beingonly those can communicate like you stated on a personal level in the dual world, rooted themselves in nonduality.Hoping it was able to communicate what michael mentin GD michael TRUSTS UNCONDITIONALLYmichael- Gopi Krishna Cc: michael.bindel@ t-online. hu Monday, September 07, 2009 6:38 AM to all concernedDear All,Let me add, my two cents of confusion or understanding of Advaita while involving ourselves physically in the activities of this world, which is apparently an illusion. In fact, this world is not an illusion as such, but unless we think so, we get attached to it and that is the reason, we need to keep in mind that all these changes in the apparent world outside is perishable and the only non-perishable thing is Self or Soul or Atman or Brahman, as the case may be.Now coming to the point in view, we all know that none of us is going to survive on this earth beyond a point. We all have to leave behind everything that we think ours. But, what really ours is nothing. When nothing is ours, why all these attachments, ego-centric approaches like shouting at others on disagreement or difference of opinion and dub such a behaviour on karma, etc. It means, there is something wrong somewhere in our understanding. That is the reason, Bhagawan Sri Ramana Maharshi says live an Advaita life inwardly but outwardly lead a dwaita life, as this materialistic world does not understand and appreciate the Advaita way of life. I fully agree with expressions of Alan Jacob with all love and respects.Love and Love alone.....P. Gopi Krishna Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.82/2351 - Release 09/07/09 06:40:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 9, 2009 Dear Michael,Love and Love alone....I am too small a person to give an answer. However, let me put down here what I feel. There are as many paths as the devotees. Every path is unique in its own way. And, each sadhaka is unique in his or her approach. Like wise, each path is as important as any other one. When the goal is surely to reach and realise HIM and the means are simple and sincere, the outcome will naturally be compassionate and loving not only towards the fellow human beings, but also the overall nature, including plants, animals, birds, insects, etc., due to the reality or knwolddge dawn on the sadhaka that he is also equally a part of the overall. That unconditional love is generated and strengthened as one proceeds carefully on the path to the Ultimate Reality. In any path, struggle is inevitable, but I do not call it struggle for the simple reason that it is part and parcel of the chosen and accepted path. Even pain is a pleasure in this path, provided one understands and apprecites it.What else can I write?Love and Love alone....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel michael_bindel Tue Sep 8, 2009 7:16 am (PDT) Dear Gopi again thank you..... b u t do you agree or disagree with the last statement in my previous mail? So each of us should give hisher best to live his life according to hisher INNER BELIEF i prefer to state my inner knowledge because this INNER knowledge should and must be free of any doubt but this is only possible for those of us who have been struggling suffering etc thru ages - who understand the luggagge of "past", integrated the lessons learned from "past" into their present being only those can communicate like you stated on a personal level in the dual world, rooted themselves in nonduality. awaiting your esteemed reply in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael bindel Add whatever you love to the India homepage. Try now! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 9, 2009 Dear Gopi "i am too small a person" i understand what you b u t please this is NONSENSE agree wholeheartedly with the content of your mail congratulations to being able to formulate "heavy stuff" like this in such a clear way.... in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - Gopi Krishna Cc: michael.bindel Wednesday, September 09, 2009 11:38 AM Re: (unknown) Dear Michael,Love and Love alone....I am too small a person to give an answer. However, let me put down here what I feel. There are as many paths as the devotees. Every path is unique in its own way. And, each sadhaka is unique in his or her approach. Like wise, each path is as important as any other one. When the goal is surely to reach and realise HIM and the means are simple and sincere, the outcome will naturally be compassionate and loving not only towards the fellow human beings, but also the overall nature, including plants, animals, birds, insects, etc., due to the reality or knwolddge dawn on the sadhaka that he is also equally a part of the overall. That unconditional love is generated and strengthened as one proceeds carefully on the path to the Ultimate Reality. In any path, struggle is inevitable, but I do not call it struggle for the simple reason that it is part and parcel of the chosen and accepted path. Even pain is a pleasure in this path, provided one understands and apprecites it.What else can I write?Love and Love alone....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel (AT) t-online (DOT) hu michael_bindel Tue Sep 8, 2009 7:16 am (PDT) Dear Gopiagain thank you.....b u tdo you agree or disagree with the last statement in my previous mail?So each of us should give hisher best to live his life according to hisher INNER BELIEFi prefer to state my inner knowledge because this INNER knowledge should and must be free of any doubt but this is only possible for those of us who have been struggling suffering etc thru ages - who understand the luggagge of "past", integrated the lessons learned from "past" into their present beingonly those can communicate like you stated on a personal level in the dual world, rooted themselves in nonduality.awaiting your esteemed replyin Sri Ramana Maharshimichael bindel Add whatever you love to the India homepage. Try now! Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.86/2355 - Release 09/08/09 20:45:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 10, 2009 Dear Michael,Love and Love alone....That is not NONSENSE. That is the fact. I know my limitations and my worth and also my knowledge. I am nothing if HE is not with me and I am everything with HIM. So, when I know the truth, why should I hesitate to accept the truth that "I am too small a person". I do not have any problem in accepting it and I am happy to do so. Thanks for understanding me and also please add to that understanding that Gopi is too small a person. I will be ever thankful to you. I do not hestate to speak the truth and bow my head in all reverence to all elders in the group or otherwise. Love and Love alone..P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel michael_bindel Wed Sep 9, 2009 11:12 am (PDT) Dear Gopi "i am too small a person" i understand what you b u t please this is NONSENSE agree wholeheartedly with the content of your mail congratulations to being able to formulate "heavy stuff" like this in such a clear way.... in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - Gopi Krishna Cc: michael.bindel@ t-online. hu Wednesday, September 09, 2009 11:38 AM Re: (unknown) Dear Michael, Love and Love alone.... I am too small a person to give an answer. However, let me put down here what I feel. There are as many paths as the devotees. Every path is unique in its own way. And, each sadhaka is unique in his or her approach. Like wise, each path is as important as any other one. When the goal is surely to reach and realise HIM and the means are simple and sincere, the outcome will naturally be compassionate and loving not only towards the fellow human beings, but also the overall nature, including plants, animals, birds, insects, etc., due to the reality or knwolddge dawn on the sadhaka that he is also equally a part of the overall. That unconditional love is generated and strengthened as one proceeds carefully on the path to the Ultimate Reality. In any path, struggle is inevitable, but I do not call it struggle for the simple reason that it is part and parcel of the chosen and accepted path. Even pain is a pleasure in this path, provided one understands and apprecites it. What else can I write? Love and Love alone.... P. Gopi Krishna Now, send attachments up to 25MB with India Mail. Learn how. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 11, 2009 Dear Gopi what a joy to read the mail Andreas sent you! its exactly that why i wrote you about this statement "too small a person" the SPARKLE OF LIGHT which is in every atom is therefore the driving force in Gopis existence too Therefore you cannot be really be "to small a person" besides your knowing that personality is just maya or LEELA and accepting "the little i the little Gopi" as to small a person is only right when you fully understand that there is no person existing in reality but all this words are so easily used by all of us and so incredible few are ready to COMPLETE AND UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!! And some even cheat themselves to believe their socalled past hast no value anymore because of their theoretical acceptance of Advaita. Dear Gopi - your contributions and your emails show me that you really are devoted. And that in itself is wonderful - Grace in action. But try to feel that you yourself are GD. Not your personality - but the driving force in yourself - the sparkle of LIGHT And remember the most HOLY NAME OF GD as our Sadguru Sri Ramana Maharshi stated and acceptet even "holier" than the holiest name in hindu culture OM AMEN I AM WHO I AM and that dear Gopi is your REAL NAME and in this the clinging to "to little a person" is a dangerous trap because lacking of real SELFESTEEM means lacking of real LOVE for your SELF and means your LOVE is not LOVE but some form of "humanly" love, sentimental etc with all respect for your achievements already and feeling that you are walking the walk in a wonderful way wanted to share this with you something else i want to share awakening in the morning michael reminds himself always THANKFUL for being (whatever"tragic" the situation; its only a situation, passing...) J O Y in being alive as the thankyou for GD this has to be expressed all day longI I AM IMMORTAL I AM GD because i am the SELF in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - Andreas Farsatis Friday, September 11, 2009 12:26 AM AW: Re: (unknown) Dear Gopi, how could He not be with "you"?! Regarding His teachings being anything than Him its a sin so it is when one identifys with a "too small a person". In my understanding one cant have anything else, than a problem accepting such a thing, true humility is a state and not a statement. Be no person at all and there is only happinesss, THAT IS what i understand.. Ramana the atomic bomb of Jnana only with His Love Von: Gopi Krishna <p_gopi_krishna >An: CC: michael.bindel (AT) t-online (DOT) huGesendet: Donnerstag, den 10. September 2009, 11:41:55 UhrBetreff: Re: (unknown) Dear Michael,Love and Love alone....That is not NONSENSE. That is the fact. I know my limitations and my worth and also my knowledge. I am nothing if HE is not with me and I am everything with HIM. So, when I know the truth, why should I hesitate to accept the truth that "I am too small a person". I do not have any problem in accepting it and I am happy to do so. Thanks for understanding me and also please add to that understanding that Gopi is too small a person. I will be ever thankful to you. I do not hestate to speak the truth and bow my head in all reverence to all elders in the group or otherwise. Love and Love alone..P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel@ t-online. hu michael_bindel Wed Sep 9, 2009 11:12 am (PDT) Dear Gopi"i am too small a person"i understand what you b u t please this is NONSENSEagree wholeheartedly with the content of your mailcongratulations to being able to formulate "heavy stuff" like this in such a clear way....in Sri Ramana Maharshimichael- Gopi Krishna Cc: michael.bindel@ t-online. hu Wednesday, September 09, 2009 11:38 AM Re: (unknown)Dear Michael,Love and Love alone....I am too small a person to give an answer. However, let me put down here what I feel. There are as many paths as the devotees. Every path is unique in its own way. And, each sadhaka is unique in his or her approach. Like wise, each path is as important as any other one. When the goal is surely to reach and realise HIM and the means are simple and sincere, the outcome will naturally be compassionate and loving not only towards the fellow human beings, but also the overall nature, including plants, animals, birds, insects, etc., due to the reality or knwolddge dawn on the sadhaka that he is also equally a part of the overall. That unconditional love is generated and strengthened as one proceeds carefully on the path to the Ultimate Reality. In any path, struggle is inevitable, but I do not call it struggle for the simple reason that it is part and parcel of the chosen and accepted path. Even pain is a pleasure in this path, provided one understands and apprecites it.What else can I write?Love and Love alone....P. Gopi Krishna Now, send attachments up to 25MB with India Mail. Learn how. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.89/2360 - Release 09/10/09 11:29:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 11, 2009 Dear Michael and Andreas,Love and Love alone.....Can you see the tears of joy in my eyes for your kind and loving words? May God bless you. These is His blessings and dedicated to HIM alone.But, let me reiterate that I am too small a person for the simple reason that I know what I went through and where I am right now and what is going to be my future. I am saying these with a sense of joy and also love. There is no modesty involved in these words. To put my feelings more clearly, let me quote what Hanuman said to Lord Rama regarding the former's relationship with His Lord Sri Rama at different levels. When I identify myself with the body, O Lord. I am Thy creature, eternally separate from Thee. When I identify myself with the soul, I am a spark of that Divine Fire which Thou art.But when I identify myself with the Atman, I and Thou art one.And, let also repeat that it was NOT nonsense, it was with full of sense. Not an arbitrary and self-defeating statement, it was an open and purposefully made statement. Every one of us has one's limitations and I, for one, am fully aware of them. True humility is a state, no doubt, but that state brings out the statement of what one is in. Is it not? I accept, what you are, what is my present condition, otherwise it amounts boasting. I repeat what I and what Alan Jacob said ealier that in Advaita one can have the thought or feeling that "I am No Person" inwardly, but externally, when you are dealing with the near and dear or public or anybody outside, one has to accept what one is physically, while maintaining inwardly that "I am Soul, not this body". That is true advaita, though it appears contradicting, and that is that Bhagawan Sri Ramana Maharshi said. Reality is at two different levels gives two different meanings. In reality, yes, there is no person at soul level, but in reality there is a person at physical level and that person has a name and form. Accepting this truth, grow inwardly from non-entity to Entity, from something to NOTHING. That is Advaita. And, Advaita also means, "When a person sees that nothing and no one is separate from him, that he is one with all the people, animals, and objects in the universe, when a person sees and hears and knows nothing else -- that is the Infinite." One has to grow to that level of understanding and that is possible only when one is modest and ready to learn all the lessons that the life teaches. Only then borns the true unconditional surrender to the Truth, to the Reality, to the Guru, to Pure Love and to One and All that shines in that Truth.I am fully aware of the driving force in me and I am with It always, but, having said that, and at the same time, let also say that knowing and believing it is different from real experience. Till one experiences it fully and truly, one has to understand and appreciate the limitations one has. Be aware of one's condition, accept one's limitations and surrender to the Force within and without, with all humility and love to grow beyond all limitations.Many thanks for your understanding and really appreciate your love and blessings.May God bless you and all of us.Love and Love alone.....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel michael_bindel Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:38 am (PDT) Dear Gopi what a joy to read the mail Andreas sent you! its exactly that why i wrote you about this statement "too small a person" the SPARKLE OF LIGHT which is in every atom is therefore the driving force in Gopis existence too Therefore you cannot be really be "to small a person" besides your knowing that personality is just maya or LEELA and accepting "the little i the little Gopi" as to small a person is only right when you fully understand that there is no person existing in reality but all this words are so easily used by all of us and so incredible few are ready to COMPLETE AND UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!! And some even cheat themselves to believe their socalled past hast no value anymore because of their theoretical acceptance of Advaita. Dear Gopi - your contributions and your emails show me that you really are devoted. And that in itself is wonderful - Grace in action. But try to feel that you yourself are GD. Not your personality - but the driving force in yourself - the sparkle of LIGHT And remember the most HOLY NAME OF GD as our Sadguru Sri Ramana Maharshi stated and acceptet even "holier" than the holiest name in hindu culture OM AMEN I AM WHO I AM and that dear Gopi is your REAL NAME and in this the clinging to "to little a person" is a dangerous trap because lacking of real SELFESTEEM means lacking of real LOVE for your SELF and means your LOVE is not LOVE but some form of "humanly" love, sentimental etc with all respect for your achievements already and feeling that you are walking the walk in a wonderful way wanted to share this with you something else i want to share awakening in the morning michael reminds himself always THANKFUL for being (whatever"tragic" the situation; its only a situation, passing...) J O Y in being alive as the thankyou for GD this has to be expressed all day longI I AM IMMORTAL I AM GD because i am the SELF in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - Andreas Farsatis Friday, September 11, 2009 12:26 AM AW: Re: (unknown) Dear Gopi, how could He not be with "you"?! Regarding His teachings being anything than Him its a sin so it is when one identifys with a "too small a person". In my understanding one cant have anything else, than a problem accepting such a thing, true humility is a state and not a statement. Be no person at all and there is only happinesss, THAT IS what i understand.. Ramana the atomic bomb of Jnana only with His Love Now, send attachments up to 25MB with India Mail. Learn how. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 11, 2009 Very stimulating exchange of hearts ...thank you Gopi Krishna , Michael and Andreas...Am sure all members of the Sangha would have benefited. all love ramesh --- On Fri, 9/11/09, Gopi Krishna <p_gopi_krishna wrote: Gopi Krishna <p_gopi_krishna Re: (unknown) Cc: michael.bindel, pandaenaDate: Friday, September 11, 2009, 3:54 PM Dear Michael and Andreas,Love and Love alone.....Can you see the tears of joy in my eyes for your kind and loving words? May God bless you. These is His blessings and dedicated to HIM alone.But, let me reiterate that I am too small a person for the simple reason that I know what I went through and where I am right now and what is going to be my future. I am saying these with a sense of joy and also love. There is no modesty involved in these words. To put my feelings more clearly, let me quote what Hanuman said to Lord Rama regarding the former's relationship with His Lord Sri Rama at different levels. When I identify myself with the body, O Lord. I am Thy creature, eternally separate from Thee. When I identify myself with the soul, I am a spark of that Divine Fire which Thou art.But when I identify myself with the Atman, I and Thou art one.And, let also repeat that it was NOT nonsense, it was with full of sense. Not an arbitrary and self-defeating statement, it was an open and purposefully made statement. Every one of us has one's limitations and I, for one, am fully aware of them. True humility is a state, no doubt, but that state brings out the statement of what one is in. Is it not? I accept, what you are, what is my present condition, otherwise it amounts boasting. I repeat what I and what Alan Jacob said ealier that in Advaita one can have the thought or feeling that "I am No Person" inwardly, but externally, when you are dealing with the near and dear or public or anybody outside, one has to accept what one is physically, while maintaining inwardly that "I am Soul, not this body". That is true advaita, though it appears contradicting, and that is that Bhagawan Sri Ramana Maharshi said. Reality is at two different levels gives two different meanings. In reality, yes, there is no person at soul level, but in reality there is a person at physical level and that person has a name and form. Accepting this truth, grow inwardly from non-entity to Entity, from something to NOTHING. That is Advaita. And, Advaita also means, "When a person sees that nothing and no one is separate from him, that he is one with all the people, animals, and objects in the universe, when a person sees and hears and knows nothing else -- that is the Infinite." One has to grow to that level of understanding and that is possible only when one is modest and ready to learn all the lessons that the life teaches. Only then borns the true unconditional surrender to the Truth, to the Reality, to the Guru, to Pure Love and to One and All that shines in that Truth.I am fully aware of the driving force in me and I am with It always, but, having said that, and at the same time, let also say that knowing and believing it is different from real experience. Till one experiences it fully and truly, one has to understand and appreciate the limitations one has. Be aware of one's condition, accept one's limitations and surrender to the Force within and without, with all humility and love to grow beyond all limitations.Many thanks for your understanding and really appreciate your love and blessings.May God bless you and all of us.Love and Love alone.....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel@ t-online. hu michael_bindel Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:38 am (PDT) Dear Gopiwhat a joy to read the mail Andreas sent you!its exactly that why i wrote you about this statement "too small a person"the SPARKLE OF LIGHT which is in every atom is therefore the driving force in Gopis existence tooTherefore you cannot be really be "to small a person"besides your knowing that personality is just maya or LEELAand accepting "the little i the little Gopi" as to small a person is only right when you fully understand that there is no person existing in realitybut all this words are so easily used by all of us and so incredible few are ready to COMPLETE AND UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!!And some even cheat themselves to believe their socalled past hast no value anymore because of their theoretical acceptance of Advaita.Dear Gopi - your contributions and your emails show me that you really are devoted. And that in itself is wonderful - Grace in action.But try to feel that you yourself are GD.Not your personality - but the driving force in yourself - the sparkle of LIGHTAnd remember the most HOLY NAME OF GDas our Sadguru Sri Ramana Maharshi stated and accepteteven "holier" than the holiest name in hindu culture OM AMENI AM WHO I AMand that dear Gopiis your REAL NAMEand in this the clinging to "to little a person" is a dangerous trapbecause lacking of real SELFESTEEM means lacking of real LOVE for your SELFand means your LOVE is not LOVE but some form of "humanly" love, sentimental etcwith all respect for your achievements already and feeling that you are walking the walk in a wonderful way wanted to share this with yousomething else i want to shareawakening in the morning michael reminds himself alwaysTHANKFUL for being (whatever"tragic" the situation; its only a situation, passing...)J O Y in being alive as the thankyou for GD this has to be expressed all day longII AM IMMORTAL I AM GD because i am the SELFin Sri Ramana Maharshimichael- Andreas Farsatis Friday, September 11, 2009 12:26 AMAW: Re: (unknown)Dear Gopi,how could He not be with "you"?!Regarding His teachings being anything than Him its a sinso it is when one identifys with a "too small a person".In my understanding one cant have anything else, than a problem acceptingsuch a thing, true humility is a state and not a statement.Be no person at all and there is only happinesss,THAT IS what i understand..Ramana the atomic bomb of Jnanaonly with His Love Now, send attachments up to 25MB with India Mail. Learn how. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 11, 2009 ---- Original message ---- >Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 10:33:46 +0200 > " Michael Bindel " <michael.bindel >Subject: Re: Re: (unknown) >To: > > > > Dear Gopi > > what a joy to read the mail Andreas sent you! > its exactly that why i wrote you about this > statement " too small a person " > the SPARKLE OF LIGHT which is in every atom is > therefore the driving force in Gopis existence too > Therefore you cannot be really be " to small a > person " > besides your knowing that personality is just maya > or LEELA > and accepting " the little i the little Gopi " as to > small a person is only right when you fully > understand that there is no person existing in > reality > but all this words are so easily used by all of us > and so incredible few are ready to COMPLETE AND > UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!! > And some even cheat themselves to believe their > socalled past hast no value anymore because of their > theoretical acceptance of Advaita. > Dear Gopi - your contributions and your emails show > me that you really are devoted. And that in itself > is wonderful - Grace in action. > But try to feel that you yourself are GD. > Not your personality - but the driving force in > yourself - the sparkle of LIGHT > And remember the most HOLY NAME OF GD > as our Sadguru Sri Ramana Maharshi stated and > acceptet > even " holier " than the holiest name in hindu > culture OM AMEN > > I AM WHO I AM > > > and that dear Gopi > > > is your REAL NAME > > > and in this the clinging to " to little a person " is > a dangerous trap > > because lacking of real SELFESTEEM means lacking of > real LOVE for your SELF > and means your LOVE is not LOVE but some form of > " humanly " love, sentimental etc > > > with all respect for your achievements already and > feeling that you are walking the walk in a wonderful > way wanted to share this with you > > something else i want to share > > awakening in the morning michael reminds himself > always > > THANKFUL for being (whatever " tragic " the > situation; its only a situation, passing...) > J O Y in being alive as the thankyou for GD > this has to be expressed all day longI > I AM IMMORTAL I AM GD because i am the SELF > > > in Sri Ramana Maharshi > > michael > > hehehe reminds me the advice one of the jewish hasisdic sheikhs gave his followers: " carry in one pocket a note 'this whole wide world was created for my sake!' and in other pocket note saying 'i am nothing but a speck of dust', and find your way between them... " yosy nnb > > - > Andreas Farsatis > > Friday, September 11, 2009 12:26 AM > AW: Re: > (unknown) > > > Dear Gopi, > > how could He not be with " you " ?! > > Regarding His teachings being anything than Him > its a sin > so it is when one identifys with a " too small a > person " . > > In my understanding one cant have anything else, > than a problem accepting > such a thing, true humility is a state and not a > statement. > Be no person at all and there is only happinesss, > THAT IS what i understand.. > > Ramana the atomic bomb of Jnana > > only with His Love > > --------------- > > Von: Gopi Krishna <p_gopi_krishna > An: > CC: michael.bindel > Gesendet: Donnerstag, den 10. September 2009, > 11:41:55 Uhr > Betreff: Re: > (unknown) > > > Dear Michael, > > Love and Love alone.... > > That is not NONSENSE. That is the fact. I know my > limitations and my worth and also my knowledge. I > am nothing if HE is not with me and I am > everything with HIM. So, when I know the truth, > why should I hesitate to accept the truth that " I > am too small a person " . I do not have any problem > in accepting it and I am happy to do so. > > Thanks for understanding me and also please add to > that understanding that Gopi is too small a > person. I will be ever thankful to you. I do not > hestate to speak the truth and bow my head in all > reverence to all elders in the group or otherwise. > > Love and Love alone.. > > P. Gopi Krishna > > Re: (unknown) > > Posted by: " Michael Bindel " michael.bindel@ > t-online. hu michael_bindel > > Wed Sep 9, 2009 11:12 am (PDT) > > Dear Gopi > > " i am too small a person " > > i understand what you b u t please this is > NONSENSE > > agree wholeheartedly with the content of your mail > > congratulations to being able to formulate " heavy > stuff " like this in such a clear way.... > > in Sri Ramana Maharshi > > michael > - > Gopi Krishna > > Cc: michael.bindel@ t-online. hu > Wednesday, September 09, 2009 11:38 AM > Re: > (unknown) > > Dear Michael, > > Love and Love alone.... > > I am too small a person to give an answer. > However, let me put down here what I feel. There > are as many paths as the devotees. Every path is > unique in its own way. And, each sadhaka is unique > in his or her approach. Like wise, each path is as > important as any other one. When the goal is > surely to reach and realise HIM and the means are > simple and sincere, the outcome will naturally be > compassionate and loving not only towards the > fellow human beings, but also the overall nature, > including plants, animals, birds, insects, etc., > due to the reality or knwolddge dawn on the > sadhaka that he is also equally a part of the > overall. That unconditional love is generated and > strengthened as one proceeds carefully on the path > to the Ultimate Reality. In any path, struggle is > inevitable, but I do not call it struggle for the > simple reason that it is part and parcel of the > chosen and accepted path. Even pain is a pleasure > in this path, provided one understands and > apprecites it. > > What else can I write? > > Love and Love alone.... > > P. Gopi Krishna Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 11, 2009 Yes Gopi, Hanuman causes the Supreme to respond to his every whim. When Hanuman sincerely wants to go beyond devotee, the Supreme may want to keep him as he is to demonstrate to the rest what pure devotion is... as you have stated and demonstrated... in surrender we don't have a say in what the Supreme does with us... this is unconditional surrender... and thank you for your clear responses... Gopi Krishna <p_gopi_krishna Cc: michael.bindel; pandaenaSent: Friday, September 11, 2009 3:24:04 AM Re: (unknown) Dear Michael and Andreas,Love and Love alone.....Can you see the tears of joy in my eyes for your kind and loving words? May God bless you. These is His blessings and dedicated to HIM alone.But, let me reiterate that I am too small a person for the simple reason that I know what I went through and where I am right now and what is going to be my future. I am saying these with a sense of joy and also love. There is no modesty involved in these words. To put my feelings more clearly, let me quote what Hanuman said to Lord Rama regarding the former's relationship with His Lord Sri Rama at different levels. When I identify myself with the body, O Lord. I am Thy creature, eternally separate from Thee. When I identify myself with the soul, I am a spark of that Divine Fire which Thou art.But when I identify myself with the Atman, I and Thou art one.And, let also repeat that it was NOT nonsense, it was with full of sense. Not an arbitrary and self-defeating statement, it was an open and purposefully made statement. Every one of us has one's limitations and I, for one, am fully aware of them. True humility is a state, no doubt, but that state brings out the statement of what one is in. Is it not? I accept, what you are, what is my present condition, otherwise it amounts boasting. I repeat what I and what Alan Jacob said ealier that in Advaita one can have the thought or feeling that "I am No Person" inwardly, but externally, when you are dealing with the near and dear or public or anybody outside, one has to accept what one is physically, while maintaining inwardly that "I am Soul, not this body". That is true advaita, though it appears contradicting, and that is that Bhagawan Sri Ramana Maharshi said. Reality is at two different levels gives two different meanings. In reality, yes, there is no person at soul level, but in reality there is a person at physical level and that person has a name and form. Accepting this truth, grow inwardly from non-entity to Entity, from something to NOTHING. That is Advaita. And, Advaita also means, "When a person sees that nothing and no one is separate from him, that he is one with all the people, animals, and objects in the universe, when a person sees and hears and knows nothing else -- that is the Infinite." One has to grow to that level of understanding and that is possible only when one is modest and ready to learn all the lessons that the life teaches.. Only then borns the true unconditional surrender to the Truth, to the Reality, to the Guru, to Pure Love and to One and All that shines in that Truth.I am fully aware of the driving force in me and I am with It always, but, having said that, and at the same time, let also say that knowing and believing it is different from real experience. Till one experiences it fully and truly, one has to understand and appreciate the limitations one has. Be aware of one's condition, accept one's limitations and surrender to the Force within and without, with all humility and love to grow beyond all limitations.Many thanks for your understanding and really appreciate your love and blessings.May God bless you and all of us.Love and Love alone.....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Michael Bindel" michael.bindel@ t-online. hu michael_bindel Fri Sep 11, 2009 1:38 am (PDT) Dear Gopiwhat a joy to read the mail Andreas sent you!its exactly that why i wrote you about this statement "too small a person"the SPARKLE OF LIGHT which is in every atom is therefore the driving force in Gopis existence tooTherefore you cannot be really be "to small a person"besides your knowing that personality is just maya or LEELAand accepting "the little i the little Gopi" as to small a person is only right when you fully understand that there is no person existing in realitybut all this words are so easily used by all of us and so incredible few are ready to COMPLETE AND UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!!And some even cheat themselves to believe their socalled past hast no value anymore because of their theoretical acceptance of Advaita.Dear Gopi - your contributions and your emails show me that you really are devoted. And that in itself is wonderful - Grace in action.But try to feel that you yourself are GD.Not your personality - but the driving force in yourself - the sparkle of LIGHTAnd remember the most HOLY NAME OF GDas our Sadguru Sri Ramana Maharshi stated and accepteteven "holier" than the holiest name in hindu culture OM AMENI AM WHO I AMand that dear Gopiis your REAL NAMEand in this the clinging to "to little a person" is a dangerous trapbecause lacking of real SELFESTEEM means lacking of real LOVE for your SELFand means your LOVE is not LOVE but some form of "humanly" love, sentimental etcwith all respect for your achievements already and feeling that you are walking the walk in a wonderful way wanted to share this with yousomething else i want to shareawakening in the morning michael reminds himself alwaysTHANKFUL for being (whatever"tragic" the situation; its only a situation, passing...)J O Y in being alive as the thankyou for GD this has to be expressed all day longII AM IMMORTAL I AM GD because i am the SELFin Sri Ramana Maharshimichael- Andreas Farsatis Friday, September 11, 2009 12:26 AMAW: Re: (unknown)Dear Gopi,how could He not be with "you"?!Regarding His teachings being anything than Him its a sinso it is when one identifys with a "too small a person".In my understanding one cant have anything else, than a problem acceptingsuch a thing, true humility is a state and not a statement.Be no person at all and there is only happinesss,THAT IS what i understand..Ramana the atomic bomb of Jnanaonly with His Love Now, send attachments up to 25MB with India Mail. Learn how. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 14, 2009 Dear Ramesh, Rafael and Yosyf,Love and Love alone.....Many thanks for your kind words. May God bless you all.My point is very clear that I do not wish to take on myself the responsibility of doership. And, all along, I wanted to clear only this point, directly or indirectly. In fact, all this is just show of one's mundane knowledge and once this body disappears, all this show will just vanish in thin air. Nobody knows where this body known as Gopi Krishna has gone then. Having understood this much, my only effort, if at all one calls it an effort, is to do no damage whatsoever, to the extent possible, either to the self or to the society around me. That is the only way to grow from self to Self. Pujya Ramsukhdasji puts it very nicely. He says that every one of us knows what is negative in us and since we cannot do anything good to others, because of our own limitations, due to one reason or the other, the best recourse is not to do any negative and try one's best to weed out whatever negatives one has. The world may not be knowing what negatives one has, but every one of us knows what we have. So, the moment you start removing these negative tendencies, the space or vacuum thus ceated will naturally be occupied by the positive tendencies. It is then easy to elevate ourselves.Love and Love alone....P. Gopi Krishna Re: (unknown) Posted by: "ramesh chivukula" ramesh_chiv ramesh_chiv Fri Sep 11, 2009 3:33 am (PDT) Very stimulating exchange of hearts ...thank you Gopi Krishna , Michael and Andreas...Am sure all members of the Sangha would have benefited. all love ramesh=== Re: (unknown) Posted by: "yosyflug" yosyflug yosyx Fri Sep 11, 2009 5:09 am (PDT) hehehe reminds me the advice one of the jewish hasisdic sheikhs gave his followers: "carry in one pocket a note 'this whole wide world was created for my sake!' and in other pocket note saying 'i am nothing but a speck of dust', and find your way between them..." yosy=== Re: (unknown) Posted by: "Rafe Stoneman" rafaelstoneman rafaelstoneman Fri Sep 11, 2009 8:46 am (PDT) Yes Gopi, Hanuman causes the Supreme to respond to his every whim. When Hanuman sincerely wants to go beyond devotee, the Supreme may want to keep him as he is to demonstrate to the rest what pure devotion is... as you have stated and demonstrated. .. in surrender we don't have a say in what the Supreme does with us... this is unconditional surrender... and thank you for your clear responses... India has a new look. Take a sneak peek. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted September 29, 2009  Namaste Vivekaji: My information regarding India is no greater than what I find on the internet. Also, most of what has been written as to India has been supplied by Shri Kamleshji, not by me. While rural India may be treating its cows better, my understanding is that the sad truth is indeed reflected in what I write. There is a branch of PETA in India, and it is my understanding that the wife of Harshaji's teacher is very active in it. If there were no abuse there would be no need for PETA's presence there. When I posted Part 1, I had been unable to copy some pics which Kamleshji had sent to me in PDF format and which according to him are from India. I have since asked him to resend them to me and do intend to add them to the India section of Part 1... I am sure there are places where the cows are treated with respect and this is encouraging. It is unfortunate that so-called progress has resulted in so much abuse in the name of profit. There are no easy answers when money is involved. In His Service, Radhe - A T Rajesh Kumar Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:46 AM (unknown) Namaste Radheji,This blog was very disturbing. It moved me to tears. Thank you for this valuable information. In India, the situation is very different from that in US. Here almost everybody respects cows. The dairy industry is made up of large number of co-operative societies, which collect milk from rural house-holds. This adds extra income to these house-holds. People in the villages treat their animals just as their family members. There is still wide-spread usage of oxen/bulls in rural India. So that means the male calfs are spared. In many states of India, cow-slaughter is completely banned. Riots are known to break out when any cow is injured or killed by vested interests. Among the meat-eating Hindu population, only a very tiny minority eats beef. Here is the website of Amul and Nandini, two leading names of the dairy industry in India:http://www.amul.com/products.htmlhttp://www.kmfnandini.coop/html/aboutus.htmOne of my friends confirmed to me that cows are treated with love in the rural areas. This has brought back peace to my mind.Jai Shri Krishna India has a new look. Take a sneak peek. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.114/2401 - Release 09/28/09 17:53:00 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
