Praghosa has a way with words

[Beggar 0]

 

One should not become a spiritual master unless he has attained the platform of uttama-adhikari. A neophyte Vaisnava or a Vaisnava situated on the intermediate platform can also accept disciples, but such disciples must be on the same platform, and it should be understood that they cannot advance very well toward the ultimate goal of life under his insufficient guidance. Therefore a disciple should be careful to accept an uttama-adhikari as a spiritual master.

NOI

Verse 5 Purport

HDGACBSP

So if one's diksa guru is offering insufficient guidance and one has come into a connection with a higher guiding or siksa guru then there is no need to reject the diksa guru. If the diksa guru gives permission to take the higher quality siksa, and he is also seeking siksa then there is not a problem. But if the diksa guru trys to stop his disciple from getting such vital instruction it means that he thinks the disciple is his property and not Krsna's property and he can be rejected without incurring an offennse. This is basically how Narayana Maharaja explained the situation and Sridhar Maharaja also followed this policy in regard to reinitiating those who had ISKCON gurus in so-called "good standing".

[Guest guest]

 

So if one's diksa guru is offering insufficient guidance and one has come into a connection with a higher guiding or siksa guru then there is no need to reject the diksa guru. This is basically how Narayana Maharaja explained the situation

 

Can you show us the reference where Narayana Maharaja has said like this.

 

If you can't show authentic documented references, then why are you stating these things?

[Guest guest]

The present times advertise many false gurus who by giving indulgence to the whimsical desires of their disciples attempt to obtain a large number of followers. These so called magnanimous personalities, being respected as the self effulgent leaders for the present Age, have only succeeded in stifling the devotional mood of the general masses. In this way, these impostors have denied their followers of any success or hope of happiness. . . .

 

.. . . The spiritual master by delivering transcendental knowledge awakens the disciple form his ignorant state. The aspirant, on receiving initiation (diksa), becomes aware of his own real nature, the truth of the Supreme Lord, the means of accomplishment and the goal. In this way, freeing himself from the clutches of the illusory energy by proper striving in devotional practice, he finally remains entrenched in steady devotion to Lord Krishna. . .

 

Who is Acarya? As Manu Samhita states:- The twice-born who performs the upanayan ritual on his disciple and teaches him the purports of the Vedas is called an 'Acarya' (realized spiritual master)

 

Achinoti yah 'sastrartham acare sthapayatyapi

Svayam acarate yasmad acarya stena kirtitah

 

One who has realized the conclusions of the scriptures and teaches these to others by dint of his own model behavior is the self-realized Guru (Acarya). In this context if some arrogant pundit, whilst browsing through the Vedas and not finding proper mention of Sri Krishna dismisses the Vedas, then he is not exhibiting the proper conduct of an Acarya for blaspheming the scriptures. The Lord Himself declares in Gita, "I am the knower, the compiler and the end of all the Vedas". The Gita, as written by Sri Vyasadeva, is the cream of the Upanisads and this purport of the Vedas contain two important verses, mahavakya, namely: man mana bhava mad-bhakto mad -yaji mam namaskuru and sarva dharman parityaja mam ekam saranam vraja, which is that ultimately :- One should surrender to Lord Sri Krishna with devotion for attaining the prime goal of life. The genuine 'Acarya' explains the purports of the scriptures in terms of pure devotion, 'acaryam bhaktisamsanat' and this is the meaning of 'Acarya". Next, the meaning of the word 'Guru' is explained. 'Gu' means darkness of ignorance and 'Ru' means that which dissipates such darkness, or in other words, one who takes away the dense darkness of ignorance by giving transcendental knowledge to the disciple is called Guru. The Guru has the Supreme Lord stationed in his heart and does not differentiate other living entities with himself. In this sense, he is most magnanimous, thereby achieving his qualification as 'Guru'.

 

The spiritual master, having the form of the Absolute Truth firmly entrenched in his pure heart, is able to transmit pure knowledge to the disciple by initiation (diksa), without himself being reduced or minimized in any way. This is the inconceivable potency of the Supreme Lord. By this potency too, He can manifest in his absolute form both in the heart of the Guru and disciple at the same time.

 

In Srimad-Bhagavatam the sage Prabuddha says:

 

 

tasmad gurum prapadyeta jijnasuh sreyah uttamam

sabde pare ca nisantam barhmanyo pasam asrayam

 

To obtain his highest welfare, one should approach and take shelter of a self-realized spiritual master who is well-versed with knowledge of the scriptures and free from all vices like attachment and anger. The amassing of pious merit to enjoy in this life and hereafter is after all a temporary affair and opposed to the true goal.

 

It is imperative that the spiritual master be conversant with the purports of the revealed scriptures otherwise, if he is not able to clear the doubts of the disciples, inevitably the disciple will tend to become unsatisfied and may then become indifferent, or lack faith in the spiritual master. "Para brahma nisnatah" here refers to the necessity of the spiritual master being thoroughly convinced of the Absolute Transcendence by personal realization and experience; if not, his mercy will not be of much value nor will it bear any fruit. Another symptom of the bona fide spiritual master is that he is free form lust, anger, greed which is consonant with his spiritual awakening.

 

In Hari Bhakti Vilas, Srila Sanatana Gosvami quotes:

 

"A Guru who understands the actual conclusions of the revealed scripture has the ability to dissipate the doubts of the disciple. Furthermore, the Guru himself should be in a position to be able to experience the deep spiritual truths and be stoic in his understanding, otherwise he will never be able to impart true understanding to the disciple. The identity of such a spiritual master is peaceful and serene, whereby all base urges like lust etc. have been pacified. In addition he is resolute in the uninterrupted devotional service of the Lord such as the limbs of devotion like hearing and chanting. One should take shelter of such a genuine spiritual master.

 

from:

Essence of Pure Devotion

Chapter Two- Guru Tattva

by His Divine Grace Srila Bhakti Promod Puri Goswami Maharaja

[Beggar 0]

 

Can you show us the reference where Narayana Maharaja has said like this.

 

If you can't show authentic documented references, then why are you stating these things?

 

http://www.purebhakti.com/lectures/lecture20021203c.shtml

 

[srila Narayana Maharaja:] But we must consider that the presence of uttama-adhikari (mahabhagavata), madhyama-uttama-adhikari (those approaching the stage of bhava), and even madhyama-madhyama-adhikari (those at the stage of asakti) devotees are very rare in this world. It is very rare, therefore, to have a guru of this caliber. What should we do under these circumstances? We will have to take a guru. If a guru is not "sabde pare ca nisnatam", if he has not realized the established truths delineated in the Vedas, Upanisads and other sastras, but he has very strong faith in his pure guru and is sincerely following him, then, even if he is a madhyama-adhikari – or even kanistha-madhyama – do not reject that guru. If he is always serving his own mahabhagavat guru and is obedient both internally and externally to him, then do not reject him. We can give up our guru only with the consideration given by Srila Sanatana Gosvami in his Hari-bhakti-vilasa:

avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-kathamrtam

sravanam naiva kartavyam sarpocchistam yatha payah

["One should not hear anything about Krsna from a non-vaisnava. Milk touched by the lips of a serpent has poisonous effects; similarly, talks about Krsna given by a non-vaisnava are also poisonous."]

If a guru is not serving his own gurudeva, he has left the process given by him, and his guru is not satisfied by his behavior – only in that case can we reject him. However, if the guru is a madhyama-adhikari and sincere, if he is very obedient and following the footsteps of his guru, then he will gradually become uttama-adhikari. So we should not reject him. At the same time, if he is not perfect and thus cannot remove all our doubts about Krsna Consciousness, what should we do?

We should offer pranama to him and ask his permission to have the association of a mahabhagavata devotee: A disciple may ask, "May I go to Srila Jiva Gosvami"? or "May I go to Srila Rupa Gosvami?" or, "May I go to a high class of Vaisnava?" If the guru says, "No, you cannot go," you should give him up. On the other hand, if he says, "Certainly you can go, and I will also come," then he is a real guru. In fact, a guru who sends his disciple to a superior guru for instruction may also be an uttama-mahabhagavata, as there are various stages of mahabhagavata, and that guru is certainly not to be rejected. For example, Srila Narottama dasa Thakura was a disciple of Srila Lokanatha dasa Gosvami, but he took permission from him to take shelter of Srila Jiva Gosvami; and Srila Syamananda prabhu also took permission from Srila Hrdaya-caitanya dasa Gosvami for that same shelter of Srila Jiva Gosvami.

[Guest guest]

In 1996 Narayana Maharaja asked several women disciples of Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja in Australia to give up their connection with Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja. Vraja Vallabha was enraged but since one of these women was his step-daughter he gradually adjusted to the new reality. Such are the ways of Maya. In 1996 Narayana Maharaja also gave "diksa" to Ramai das and Lila Suka das who had previously received diksa directly from Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar Maharaj, but who said that when they got diksa they didn't feel they got any inspiration. Ramai das and Lila Suka das had no guru-nistha and Narayana Maharaja didn't tell them "have faith in Srila Sridhar Maharaj" instead he made them into his disciples.

 

We are still seeing the effects of the conflict those events provoked even today.

[Guest guest]

My friend Muralidhar was very angry after Narayana Maharaja captured Ramai and Lilasuka, Caitanya-mali and Lila Suka's wife as his diesciples. He is still angry about this today. Srila Govinda Maharaja spoke with the previous leader of the Math in Australia for one hour on the phone after that too. Srila Govinda Maharaja was shocked that Narayana Maharaja was not following Vaisnava etiquette. But what to do? And what happened after that? Ramai is now a committed Buddhist. Lila-suka and his wife both get pensions from the Ausralian government because both of them are listed as "insane". And Vraja-vallabha's daughter is the leader of NM's preaching in Australia.

 

- Anadi K. das.

[Shakti-Fan 0]

One time Govinda Maharaja was about to give an number of initiations and many of the prospective initiates were already initiated by ISKCON gurus. A rumour had spread that Govinda Maharaja was now on good terms with Hrdayanada Maharaja and would no longer reinitiate his disiciples. What really ensued was a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy. All of Hrdayanada Maharaja's disciples received reinitiation from Govinda Maharaja.

A friend of mine who had taken shelter of Bhakti Pramode Puri Maharaja told me that one day Jayapataka Maharaja arrived at the math and asked Puri Maharaja to please not reinitiate any of his disciples. I was told that Puri Maharaja said that it is the duty of any sannyasi to offer shelter to anyone seeking it. Jayapataka Maharaja was speechless, left a cash donation then took his leave. I really find it hard to believe that Naryana Maharaja would reinitiate a disciple of Sridhar Maharja. I have heard that he will chant on the beads and threads of Prabhupada and Sridhar Maharaja disciples but not as a formal connection. At some maths they call this "taking siksa".

[Guest guest]

"The relative and absolute considerations are always coming in clash. The absolute should be accepted and the relative sacrificed. Still the relative is necessary. After graduation from primary school another teacher is accepted for higher education, but that does not mean that the primary teacher is neglected or insulted. For our own interest, whatever we find which is akin to what was given to us by our guru maharaja, whatever we find that will enlighten us further, and whatever will help us to understand more clearly what we heard from our guru maharaja, must be accepted. Is my realization a living thing, or is it dead? Anyone who has come in connection with the infinite cannot but say this: "I am nothing." That should be the salient point.

 

We have left all social concerns and so many other shackles. For what? For the Absolute Truth. And wherever I shall find that, I must bow down my head. And if a great soul shows us, "This is the path to where you will find your thirst quenched. The line is in this zigzag way," we must accept that for our own interest. We are worshipers not of this form, but of substance. Wherever I feel the presence of my Lord in an intense form, I must be attracted to that side. Krsna says, sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja. Wherever we shall find Him, we must run in that direction. My interest is with Him. Not that we can challenge, "Why did Krsna appear here, and why is He appearing there?" If a man in a boat is passing through the current and finds himself in danger, then from whatever side help may come, he must run to that side."

 

Srila Sridhar Maharja, Sri Guru and his Grace Ch. 5

 

Disciples are not chattel of any one matha. There should be a free flow of faith. There is no reason to criticise Lila Suka's choice of siksa guru, and categorically state he lost his guru nistha for Srila Sridhara Maharaja because he decided to take shelter outside of his diksa guru's matha. He was not alone either. There are other diksa and siksa disciples who disaffiliated with the Sri Caitanya Sarasvati Matha to one degree or another after Srila Sridhar Maharaja's disappearance. Some stayed with Srila Sundar Govinda Maharaja and others left. Why criticise anyone's heart felt choice?. Just because they chose differently than Muralidhara prabhu does not mean they have no guru nistha.

 

The same thing happened after Srila Promod Puri Maharaja left this world. Some stayed to follow Srila Bhodayana Maharaj and others chose to take shelter elsewhere. The free flow of faith. No harm. It is not a criticism of anyone, only the jiva's free will.

[Guest guest]

Narayana Maharaja did give diksa to Ramai and Lila suka. This happened at Vraja Vallabha's house. Another disciple of Srila Sridhar Maharaj was present - Madana Mohana das. Madana Mohana was sick to see it but he stayed to see the whole thing happen. Then he came to Sri Govinda Dham and told me.

 

Ramai was the one who really wanted to get diksa from Narayana Maharaja. Like I said before he is a now a Buddhist. After Narayana Maharaja agreed to give it to Ramai this mad Lila Suka said "Me too".

 

I am the temple manager of Sri Govinda Dham, the main temple of Sri Chaitanya Saraswat Math in Australia. I received Harinama from Srila Prabhupada in 1973 and diksa from Srila Sridhar Maharaj in 1984.

 

Anadi Krishna das Kriti Ratna

[Shakti-Fan 0]

 

Narayana Maharaja did give diksa to Ramai and Lila suka.

Many of the older devotees will remember the claims of the GBC and their followers that Sridhar Maharaja was reinitiating Prabhupada's disciples. I'm sure if they we read this posts they will see the extreme irony. So when Govinda Maharaja chants on the threads and beads of Prabhupada's disciples and they sit in the agni hotra that is diksa?

I've heard ISKCONites claim that Govinda Maharaja reinitiates Prabhupada disciples. So does chanting on the threads and beads of one who has diksa mean reinitiation? I thought that it was a more formal type of siksa. Just because Madana Mohana saw chanting on beads and threads and a fire sacrifice, how would he know it was diksa? Puspadanta's wife in Oregon USA has Hare Nama and diksa from Govinda Maharaja. When she asked about her situation Narayana Maharaja told her that she already had diksa from a bonafide guru, but he would chant on her beads and thread as formal siksa. I mean if he wouldn't reinitiate into diksa a Govinda Maharaja disciple, he would reinitiate into diksa a Sridhar Maharaja who he openly worships (performs arati to a picture) and calls his siksa guru? I think that those who read this post will have to judge for themselves. Based on Madana Mohana's observation, report etcetera, you have no case.

[Guest guest]

When the acharya departs (Srila Prabhupada), chaos and absurdity overtakes the movement.

 

Why is the weakness and whimsy of neophyte devotees being allowed to create this kind of bitterness and contempt within the Saraswata school?

 

Maybe, in order to save the Saraswata school, some of the weak minded neophytes who want to jump around from guru to guru should just be sacrified for the welfare of the movement.

 

All the re-initiation business is bunk in my opinion.

I don't care who is re-initiating who.

It's all just so much small thinking to allow these shallow neophytes create this kind of rift between the major sects of the Saraswata school.

 

Let's these misfits who don't respect their diksha guru just fall by the wayside.

 

The movement can't save the world if a few mental cases are allowed to cause such major rifts in the movement.

[Guest guest]

Distorted understanding guru tattva is the basis of all this confusion. It all started out with what seemed like a good idea: break up the guru monopoly and emphasize the necessity of a "siddha" guru. Get rid of conventional and ecclesiastical, etc., gurus and go for the paramarthika guru.

 

What is the result? No respect for guru tattva. I.e., Acaryam mam vijaniyat is only meaningful if your guru is in fact truly as good as God. So if you see fault in your guru, then give him up. And if you are doing guru giri and think you are yourself good as God and don't see anyone else as good as God, then why not just take the disciples from them? After all, I don't have to see someone else's guru as being as good as God, do I?

 

This is why Hari-bhakti-vilasa says--

 

upadeSTAram AmnAyAgataM pariharanti ye |

tAn mRtAn api kravyAdAH kRtaghnAn nopabhuJjate ||

 

Even the jackals will not eat the corpses of those ingrates who abandon the mantra guru who comes in disciplic succession. (4.363)

 

So how can an entire sampradaya that begins with the rejection of Bhaktivinoda Thakur's diksha guru expect to not have this kind of problem?

[Guest guest]

Of course, I say that just for controversy's sake. This kind of thing has ALWAYS gone on, everywhere. But remember Hridaya Chaitanya's anger with Shyamananda. It was not unjustified, and required special circumstances for him to approve it. The exception that proves the rule.

[Guest guest]

Since when does a siksha guru chant on the beads and thread of someone else's disciple? I never heard that before.

[Guest guest]

 

 

So how can an entire sampradaya that begins with the rejection of Bhaktivinoda Thakur's diksha guru expect to not have this kind of problem?

 

problem?

 

the saraswata school has had success that surpassed even the preaching of Mahaprabhu himself.

 

Problem?

 

The problem is nothing compared to the accomplishments.

 

Mahaprabhu spread Krishna consiousness over South India and Bengal.

 

Srila Prabhupada spread Krishna consciousness to yavana and mleccha countries all over the world.

 

Prabhupada has done no less than Mahaprabhu.

 

So, you say problem?

 

No problem.

 

Just a little bitty problem amidst volumes and volumes of success.

 

The problem is with "traditional" camps who haven't accomplished much of anything in the last 400 years.

[Guest guest]

 

Acaryam mam vijaniyat is only meaningful if your guru is in fact truly as good as God. So if you see fault in your guru, then give him up.

 

Jagat you gave up Bhaktivinode Thakura so who are you to talk?

 

You told the world you "forgive" Bhaktivinode Thakura. Have you changed your spots now? Are you saying you have full faith in Bhaktivinode Thakura now?

 

 

Hari-bhakti-vilasa says--

 

upadeSTAram AmnAyAgataM pariharanti ye |

tAn mRtAn api kravyAdAH kRtaghnAn nopabhuJjate ||

 

Even the jackals will not eat the corpses of those ingrates who abandon the mantra guru who comes in disciplic succession. (4.363)

 

So how can an entire sampradaya that begins with the rejection of Bhaktivinoda Thakur's diksha guru expect to not have this kind of problem?

 

Doh...

 

You gave up believing in the mantra guru of your mantra guru and you used the internet to tell the whole world your reasons why. Didn't you?

[Guest guest]

 

Since when does a siksha guru chant on the beads and thread of someone else's disciple? I never heard that before.

 

Just for the record Srila Govinda Maharaja and Srila Sridhara Maharaja don't chant on anybody's sacred threads. It isn't a part of the ceremony at SCSM.

 

In regard to beads, if a person has lost their beads then they can ask a senior Vaisnava to chant on a new replacement mala the devotee will then use when doing their japa-seva.

 

Clearly Shakti's servant has very little knowledge about the ways of devotional service practiced in the preceptorial lineage of Srila Sridhara Maharaja.

[Guest guest]

 

Just for the record Srila Govinda Maharaja and Srila Sridhara Maharaja don't chant on anybody's sacred threads. It isn't a part of the ceremony at SCSM.

 

In regard to beads, if a person has lost their beads then they can ask a senior Vaisnava to chant on a new replacement mala the devotee will then use when doing their japa-seva.

 

Clearly Shakti's servant has very little knowledge about the ways of devotional service practiced in the preceptorial lineage of Srila Sridhara Maharaja.

[Guest guest]

Ramai told Narayana Maharaja how he had taken diksa from Srila Sridhar Maharaja and that he felt he "didn't get anything".

 

They are the exact words he used.

 

Did Narayana Maharaja say, "you should have faith in your Guru". No.

 

Narayana Maharaja spoke the mantras into Ramai's ear. And now Ramai is a Buddhist.

[Guest guest]

 

Jagat you gave up Bhaktivinode Thakura so who are you to talk? You told the world you "forgive" Bhaktivinode Thakura. Have you changed your spots now? Are you saying you have full faith in Bhaktivinode Thakura now? You gave up believing in the mantra guru of your mantra guru and you used the internet to tell the whole world your reasons why. Didn't you?

 

Who told you I gave up on Bhaktivinoda Thakur? Like nearly everyone else, you missed the point of my article.

 

Which was: There are two kinds of followers: the blind and the inquisitive. Those who are inquisitive better be prepared to come across flaws and errors in their guru varga. This is not a reason to go running to someone else, but to push forward. One is not obliged to carry the burden of such things. So I continue to take what I perceive to be misjudgments on the part of Bhaktivinoda Thakur as spots on the moon that do not distract from his glories. Nevertheless, I do not insist on carrying the burden of believing that Jagadananda Pandit wrote the Prema-vivarta. That's all.

 

So, my position is consistent as far as guru tattva is concerned. I still insist that accepting Bhaktivinoda Thakur without accepting Bipin Bihari Goswami is like a half-a-hen philosophy.

 

But I will have you know that just as I do not reject Bhaktivinoda Thakur, I do not reject Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati or Bhaktivedanta Swami as gurus in my life. I know you find it hard to balance these seemingly contradictory things in your head and heart. I am sorry. I continue to hold my position. I don't believe in rejecting gurus. I believe in sustained progress and growth, even if it is risky.

 

May GURU-Krishna always find me when I am lost.

May GURU-Krishna always give me light when I am in the dark.

May he give me strength when I am weak.

May he give me hope when I am abandoned by all.

[Guest guest]

 

Just for the record Srila Govinda Maharaja and Srila Sridhara Maharaja don't chant on anybody's sacred threads. It isn't a part of the ceremony at SCSM.

 

I have friends who were disciples of Srila Prabhupad and Srila Sridhar Maharaja who had their gayatri mantras "reinstated" by Srila Govinda Maharaja because they had not chanted on their threads for a long time. No guru chants on the thread as a part of an initiation ceremony for diksha mantras. The mantras are whispered in the ear of the disciple by the guru. I'm sure this is the case in the NM mission also because the ceremonies are basically the the same as ISKCON except for a few mantras. So the poster who wrote about chanting on threads was in error on that point.

[Guest guest]

 

I have friends who were disciples of Srila Prabhupad and Srila Sridhar Maharaja who had their gayatri mantras "reinstated" by Srila Govinda Maharaja because they had not chanted on their threads for a long time.

 

Why?

Srila Rupa Goswami says that the only atonement a devotee needs to undergo is to take up his service where he left off.

 

No other atonement or re-instatement is necessary.

[Guest guest]

 

 

So, my position is consistent as far as guru tattva is concerned. I still insist that accepting Bhaktivinoda Thakur without accepting Bipin Bihari Goswami is like a half-a-hen philosophy.

 

Cluck cluck cluck

 

For your information Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura received mantra from Srila Gaurakisore das Babaji Maharaj and the diksa was not coming in the line from Bipin Bihari Goswami. Bhaktivinoda Thakur is the father and siksa guru of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura but in our preceptorial line we have no connection whatosever to the diksa parampara of Bipin Bihari Goswami

[Guest guest]

 

I have friends who were disciples of Srila Prabhupad and Srila Sridhar Maharaja who had their gayatri mantras "reinstated" by Srila Govinda Maharaja because they had not chanted on their threads for a long time. No guru chants on the thread as a part of an initiation ceremony for diksha mantras. The mantras are whispered in the ear of the disciple by the guru. I'm sure this is the case in the NM mission also because the ceremonies are basically the the same as ISKCON except for a few mantras. So the poster who wrote about chanting on threads was in error on that point.

 

Please supply the names of these devotees so we can ask them if what you say is true.

 

I don't believe what you say is true.

 

If a person has been engaging in sinful actions for some time then they may "sit in" at a fire yajna for purification purposes but I know of no instances at all where either Srila Sridhar Maharaj or Srila Govinda Maharaj have given diksa mantras "again" to any disciples of Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhaupada.

 

I myself am a disciple of Srila Prabhupada (Auckland NZ, 1973), by the way.

[Guest guest]

 

Cluck cluck cluck

 

For your information Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura received mantra from Srila Gaurakisore das Babaji Maharaj and the diksa was not coming in the line from Bipin Bihari Goswami. Bhaktivinoda Thakur is the father and siksa guru of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura but in our preceptorial line we have no connection whatosever to the diksa parampara of Bipin Bihari Goswami

 

Don't bother trying to sound remotely rational on this matter. Cluck, cluck, cluck would have sufficed. Diksha is about sambandha. Disciplic succession is also about sambandha. Anyway, I am already regretting opening my mouth. I drop out of this discussion here. There is really no point.