Guest guest Report post Posted February 10, 2004 Dear Om Prem: I just want to say "Great!!" and I bow to you Kochu omprem <omprem wrote: OM Nora You will have emotional attachment to Devi as long as you do not truly know that you are Devi. As long as there is a distinction between you and Devi, then you have more Sadhana to do. As long as there is a distinction between you and Devi, you probably have an image of Her in your mind and, no doubt on your altar. But that icon or murti is not Devi. It serves to represent her, to provide a concrete focus for your love and adoration. Ot changes with time as you progress through your Sadhana. When you at last enter Cosmic Consciousness and become Self-Realized, forms drop away, you merge into the Infinite Ocean. Devi as Mahamaya perhps has two meanings. First, She is beyond the Maya of the eathly plane. As we move beyond the attractions, distractions and repulsions of the world, we enter into another plane of existence. Devi calls us there. Another meaning is that Devi is literally the Mahamaya, the Great Illusion. She is the final hurdle that we must overcome to enter into Cosmic Consciousness, Oneness with all, beyond space and time, beyond names and forms. Once we know ourselves as the Inifinite Divine, we have no need for the conventions of form or name. We just Are. Soham Tat Twam Asi Omprem , "N. Madasamy" <ashwini_puralasamy> wrote: > "It says quite clearly that Maya is a veiling force that > obscures one's Divine nature. No emotional value was assigned > to Maya. Nor should there be" > > "As Swami Sivananda's poem says, "Practise eternal vigilance > and introspection; Pray, do Japa, worship and meditate: Maya > can never, never approach you." > > I find this statement confusing ! DEVI herself being called the > Mahamaya. How can we not have emotional value to HER? / Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 10, 2004 OM Nora Me: You will have emotional attachment to Devi as long as you do not truly know that you are Devi. You: So When One have become a DEVI what happens? The self ceases to exist and it does not have any emotional attributes at all. Or you could say : Nora have cease to exist and she is the DEVI or She have merge with the DEVI. So ... how long do this process be: permanent or a temporary? Are we conscious of this process? Not just becoming a Devi but upon being the background from which Devi sprang, the self does cease to exist as a discrete entity. It does not have emotions, but it does have characteristics that we might interprete as Love or Ananada. So, Nora does cease to exist and becomes existence itself. The process could be either permanent or temporary. Temporary if you decide to be an avatar and return to the material world for the betterment of others. You are conscious of that part of the process which leads right up to the instant of being Devi. But when you are Devi, you are the process itself, you are consciousness itself. You are Satchidananda - Absolute Existence or Being, Absolute Consciousness or Pure Awareness, and the Absolute Bliss that lies beyond all the psychomental phenomena. Tat Twam Asi Omprem , "N. Madasamy" <ashwini_puralasamy> wrote: > "You will have emotional attachment to Devi as long as you do not > truly know that you are Devi." > > So When One have become a DEVI what happens? The self ceases to exist > and it does not have any emotional attributes at all. Or you could > say : Nora have cease to exist and she is the DEVI or She have merge > with the DEVI. So ... how long do this process be: permanent or a > temporary? Are we conscious of this process? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 10, 2004 > the whole matter. I suggest that you read "The Yogic Disciplines in the > Monistic Shaiva Tantric Traditions of Kashmir: Threefold, Fourfold, and > Six-Limbed" by Navjivan Rastogi in Ritual and Speculation in Early > Tantrism ed. by Teun Goudriaan, SUNY Press, 1992. Premji: Thank you for this reference; does this book have any practical tips on sadhana? > > I have experienced involuntary samadhi/loss of breath in which the only > event in consciousness was the mantra that came on. That might be called > an amplification of consciousness, but in fact it was simply the result > of following my guru's instructions and thereby avoiding physical > injury. Make no mistake, Tantra is the most dangerous path on the planet > if one does not have a qualified guru and does not follow his/her > instructions to the letter. I have experienced voluntary > samadhi/stoppage of breath in sexual yoga. With or without a partner, > the technique of kumbaka, the pot-shaped retention, allows isolation of > breath in the central channel, in particular in the heart center. Then > inhalation and exhalation can stop. Can you share more on how you attain kevala kumbaka, if this is permissible? I am passingly familiar with the great Abhinavagupta, though I was not aware that Vamachara was practiced in Kashmir Shaivism. > Out of body experience is rather common and often brings an outlook > which is the exact opposite of seeing this life as an illlusion. One > sees that human existence and the complete all around panorama is just > as real as Shiva/Shakti and that we all are exactly where we belong. > What is your experience? > The OBE in common parlance is something that occurs during the sleep/at the juncture between awake and sleep states. This is not very hard to achieve; but to achieve an OBE while fully awake requires is a great ability; Yogananda opines that this can be done ONLY when one can at will cease breath; when this happens one can consciously enter inner worlds, at which point life on earth looks like an illusion, more like watching a movie. I have not much experience in either kind of OBE. I would be greatful if you could share more on breath-control, this is a subject that is of immense interest to me. Sincerely, yogaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 10, 2004 , MaryJWoodworth@a... wrote: > In a message dated 2/9/04 5:47:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, > childofdevi writes: > > > > When you can consciously induce an OBE(out of body experience), that > > some say is when you know that the world is Maya; that you not this > > body and that you belong somewhere else and that you were always > > eternal and have never died > > arnt all flights of imiganation OBE's ? LOL, not at all, I mean there is very little similariy. In a real OBE, you would be walking around in your soul body as if it was your real body, and doing that consciously. The term OBE has been trivialised by the huge mass of books on the subject- this is at best just astral projection IMHO -yogaman > > One day many years ago I was reading a play and darn if I didn't take off it > was very unsettling but OBE's are easy ...its staying teathered to earth that > is difficult > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 11, 2004 In a message dated 2/10/04 9:00:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, childofdevi writes: > One day many years ago I was reading a play and darn if I didn't > take off it do you remember which play it was or the author? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 12, 2004 Dear Yogaman, The first thing you need in order to begin doing breathing exercises in the path of tantra is a teacher you can trust. A guru who has done the practice and succeeded and who has been able to teach others is a basic necessity. In some cases, like my own, the teacher and teachings were a necessity born out of heart-lung problems. But then, samsaric conditions are usually what lead us to find liberation. Eventually, I found a guru with whom I could live for a few years and then live and work with in close proximity. Success in the very first exercises depends upon your ability to grasp the pride of merging with your chosen deity. So sadhana is essential. When you have perfected the stages of generation and self-generation and have done the requisite mantra recitation and have received the signs which convince your teacher that you are able to proceed, then the instruction on breath control is given. Many books in all the tantric traditions describe the central channel, the sushumna, and its side channels etc etc. But the books are useless without a guru and the agreement of your personal, physical karma that this is now the right path for you. In any case, it is only one of many paths that bring us to the loving truth and beauty of divine realization. You can find the relevant passages on Vamacharya in the Kashmiri Shaivite path in ch. 29 of the Tantraloka of Abhinavagupta. If you do not know Sanskrit, you can find excerpts in Lilian Silburn's book on Kundalini and in Pandey's massive work on Abhinava. May you always have the good fortune to meet gurus and spiritual friends in your path of devotion to the deity whose autobiography you are writing with your life. Sw. Prem Vedarthi childofdevi wrote: > Can you share more on how you attain kevala kumbaka, if this is > permissible? I am passingly familiar with the great Abhinavagupta, > though I was not aware that Vamachara was practiced in Kashmir > Shaivism. > I would be greatful if you could share more on breath-control, this > is a subject that is of immense interest to me. > > Sincerely, > yogaman > > > ------------------------------ > Links > > * > / > > * > > > * Terms of > Service. > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 13, 2004 childofdevi wrote: > > the whole matter. I suggest that you read "The Yogic Disciplines in > > the > > Monistic Shaiva Tantric Traditions of Kashmir: Threefold, Fourfold, > and > > Six-Limbed" by Navjivan Rastogi in Ritual and Speculation in Early > > Tantrism ed. by Teun Goudriaan, SUNY Press, 1992. > > Premji: > > Thank you for this reference; does this book have any practical tips > on sadhana? Dear Yogaman, This book is full of tips. I recommend especially Having Become a God, He Should Sacrifice to the Gods by Vrajavallabha Dviveda. Besides important sections on purification of the elements and installation of the breaths, it gives a valuable perspective on the final teaching. In footnote 8, he presents the reasoning that if one can install God, by the greatness of the mantra, in such inert substances as an image, a cloth, a painting, a sacred ground, a skull, etc, then how could not His (I add Her) installation take place in this human body, which is filled with consciousness? Worship of self-deity is summed up in the Tantraloka: The body is made of all gods. (15.604). Sw. Prem Vedarthi ------------------------------ > Links > > * > / > > * > > > * Terms of > Service. > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted February 13, 2004 Pranaam Swami Prem-ji: Thank you for your suggestions and also for the book reference. Sincerely, -yogaman , James Rutke <jrutke@e...> wrote: > Dear Yogaman, > > The first thing you need in order to begin doing breathing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
