theist

Yes. Good points. It's Krsna's service and not just the local religious body. We need to ease our way past the calculating stage. "How much is Krsna's and how much is mine?" It's ALL Krsna's. That was so easy even I didn't require a calculator. /images/graemlins/smile.gif When we stop purchasing all the world's unesscessary goodies and instead remain satisfied with the basics and use what's left in preaching or some service leaving the calculations up to Krsna we will certainly be the gainer. Remember the old lady fruit vendor?

Another ridiculous word likened to homophobia. A phobia is a disease, not an ordinary reaction to an obscene act like two men trying to have a version of sexual intercourse or religious fanatics killing thousands via a cowardly bomb attack. If the Muslims would even speak out strongly against the Islamofascists in their midst and strongly oppose them things might get better before they get worse. But they don't or only a rare few do. Silence means agreement. People understand this.

no one knows. Anyway you already understand that all of them are descended from Krishna. No need to difuse your intellectual energy too much as that list of your's could literaly be drawn out to no end. Main demigods are mentioned in Srimad Bhagavatam. Try there. Available at the link below. Hari Krsna

It is very difficult to try and speak to someone who tries so hard not to understand. I accept your point below: But I accept both sides of the coin. Not every prohibited action could possibly be written down in the vedas. Therefore there is guru who knows the essence and can guide one in applying that essence in one's present life situations. Now the other side of the same coin. Not everyone of the unlimited number of avatars of God can possibly be listed in what we call the vedas or any number of holy books throughout the entire universe. Therefore there is guru who can recognize these incarnations due to his having assimilated the same essence. It is not a difficult point. You shouldn't have much trouble with it unless you are unwilling to accept such from a melecha born as myself. In which case why speak to me at all as you are not my guru and I have not sought out your teaching on the matter.

Yes they are deteriorating. In the West we may see euthanasia become the norm in the future, with the elderly choosing to die under the pressure of "not wanting to be a burden". Their children will outwardly mourn but rejoice internally, happy to get the burden off and the inheritence that much sooner. Of course sati rites won't be forced on anyone and child labor laws may remain intact.

Yes that is a very good idea. In very simple language. Devotees sometimes bow to each other and say______. This is why. When the Deity doors open all the devotees bow and say_______. This is why. Such a plain spoken brochure would be a very great idea I think. Or even a small pass out booklet taking someone through the whole temple routine from morning services on throughout the day. Done in very great detail. What is an aroti ceremony? Why is he waving a cloth,water and incense? Why are they throwing water on everyone's head? Everything. I nominate a gHari ji and JNdas ji collaboration under the Audarya Fellowship logo.

Just reverse it and you may see something. Try to meditate on *dis-proved by absence of specific acknowledgement*. See the point? Or do you only accept one side of a coin?

Kulapavana, I have no idea about time and space other dimensions etc. other than I accept they exist. At least I can eat Krsna prasadam though. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Well just like we sometimes think that if only I could live in some other country or section of town etc. then I would be happy. Then we direct our valuable time to that goal alone and even if we do succeed happiness is never realized. Our material situation may be temporarily improved in some way but death and rebirth will still find us. As far as NASA goes they spend huge amount of money that could be better spent on Earth. And for what? Moon rocks and mars dust. They are looking for life but they have no idea what life really is. Waste of valuable human form and time.

I just find it interesting that the ancient texts discussing craft that could suddenly appear and then disappear at will. In fact they are saying the same things that people are now saying about UFO's. The thing is about the space program is that it is a coloosal waste of time and resources. It is far less than intelligent to try to drag an earth born body with you as you travel through space even if one does becomes attached to such an idea. A simple cost benefit analysis reveals that subtle body travel is infinitely better and more realistic for touring and developing the proper level of consciousness is the proper way to become a resident of some higher globe. Although that is also just a form of touring. I imagine that propeling one's sensory unit(Spock would say it like that I think)into space by sitting on gigantic bombs and lighting the fuse would be laughable to anyone whose planet is worth visiting anyway.

This is very important. Most Indians who come know all this as they most likely have been practicing since childhood, but for us Westerners enetering a Krishna temple can seem like stepping into another dimension. And it is. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Traditions have to be somewhat maleable sometimes when being introduced widely into a culture that sees them a foreign. I had never considered this before but have seen many awkward moments for newcomers at the charnamrita bowl. The thought of some soul who has been wandering for eons in birth and death coming right to that point and due to some simple circumstance is not able to partake is very very sad indeed. Basically the real breakdown is that someone taking the time to explain such procedures to obvious newcomers is rare. Think about it. It's your first time to a Krsna temple. Everyone has on traditional clothes and are singing in strange exotic languages(whether they themselves understand what is being sung or not, but that's another point). Ceremonies are going on that you have never seen before and don't understand. When the fire is brought around during arotik one can see what to do by all the others doing it or the person bring the ghee lamp is right there to help you. Not so at the table with the charnamrita water. I don't think Gaurachandra is suggesting making little paper cups manditory rather just a clean way to make the process more readily acceptable. This simple idea strikes me as a product of thoughtfull thinking. Guests feel an unavoidable culture shock. Those with more experience need to be aware of that and offer some simple guidance without waiting to be asked for it.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, O Horatio, then are contained in your philosophy." Somewhat prophetic.

It's like always swimming upstream against the current. As soon as one even tries to rest you find yourself being swept away downstream. Often I feel like I just can't go any further but then my experience of reality becomes more engulfed in this horror show around me. Personally I don't know if anyone else is in bliss but I surely am not. An occasional taste of something nice just to get me going again but mostly I just struggle. I guess it will be like this until we at least learn to be steady within ourselves amidst the whirling rapids of the modes of nature, knowing that Krsna is in control and He has our well being at heart.

Stalking Cat He is presently looking for someone who can give him a tail and some other bodily modifications to complete his goal. He considers this following his Native American religion.

I find it quite easy to fall deeper into darkness, to allow myself to become covered by an even denser blanket of ignorance. Just by letting go and letting the three modes have their way with my consciousness. Even from the liberated stage we retain the right to reject Krsna as the prime enjoyer and try to dream ourselves onto His throne.

have no clue as what to do at the charnamritam bowl. A little cup like that is self-explainitory.

Gaurachandra, the famous ghee bellies. Ever expanding. Yashodanandana, I read where Prabhupada talked about his youth when he played soccer(mistakenly called football by much of the world). If I remember right he said he played goalie because he didn't like to run so much. Rare is the Narada Muni type who as a boy has no need for such things. For sure though throughout the world we can see men who never gain the perspective on sports. All day sports-katha ad-nausem. Which reminds of the latest sports guy weirdness i saw advertised. You guys will love this. They are now marketing a home soda pop vending style machine that one can keep in the room by the tv. It stands about five ft. high x 2 1/2 ft and stocks many different favorite brands. During commercials now one needn't spend valuable time and energy going to the frig. for a soda, you can just go to this machine and punch your desired drink and it comes out the bottom just like a real vending machine. It comes with a large area on top where they will place your favorite teams logo and stuff. $500 bucks. America is so whacked out.

SB 4.22.27: When a person becomes devoid of all material desires and liberated from all material qualities, he transcends distinctions between actions executed externally and internally. At that time the difference between the soul and the Supersoul, which was existing before self-realization, is annihilated. When a dream is over, there is no longer a distinction between the dream and the dreamer. The purport to this verse must be read or the mind may seize the opputunity to play tricks. Use the link below, go to this verse and click on the verse number. That will take you to the sankrit, translation and purport.

Of course he was speaking of people that become very wrapped up in surfing, and not devotees who get some clean excercise by playing in the waves. People that take ordinary swimming as their all in all may be setting up their next birth as fish but that doesn't mean devotees shouldn't swim. Swimming is a devotee sport. I've seen this surfing/suffering quote mis-used alot. For sure if someone is talking and thinking about where the next good waves will come in and chases after the best beach all day that is a problem, but a guy sitting around all day getting fat and weak because he thinks some swimming or hiking or whatever is unbona-fide also has a problem. He neglects the proper upkeep of Krsna's gift of a valuable human form at his own peril. "...of bodies of water I am the ocean..."-Gita

I'm like you, unqualified to chant Krsna's names. But that qualification will only be acquired through chanting. In the stages most of us are at we are chanting various reflections and shadow representations of the Name. But by doing that and struggling through the offensive stages with Krsna prema in view success is quarunteed. Prabhupada didn't come seeking to inspire the "qualified" to chant but rather to qualify the unqualified so that we may chant. If someone tells us we are not qualified to chant Krtsna's name we can thank them and then keep on chanting towards that goal. If someone tells us we can't chant to become qualified then we can cover our ears yelling Krsna and leave his vicinity. No religious hurdles, or even regulative principles can stop one from crying out to their Lord. Remeber Prabhupada likened chanting Hare Krsna to a child crying out for its mother. What question is there of being qualified? Hare Krsna (drat,missed again) but someday suddha-nama will appear

Right there! That's what Bhumi was taking about. /images/graemlins/smile.gif The Bhagavatam in nature and right before our eyes if only we had the eyes to see. Float like a butterfly Drink nectar like a bee

Bhumi to Prthu: SB 4.18.2: My dear Lord, please pacify your anger completely and hear patiently whatever I submit before you. Please turn your kind attention to this. I may be very poor, but a learned man takes the essence of knowledge from all places, just as a bumblebee collects honey from each and every flower.

TRANSLATION All the sages said: Dear Dhruva, O son of King Uttanapada, may the Supreme Personality of Godhead known as Sarngadhanva, who relieves the distresses of His devotees, kill all your threatening enemies. The holy name of the Lord is as powerful as the Lord Himself. Therefore, simply by chanting and hearing the holy name of the Lord, many men can be fully protected from fierce death without difficulty. Thus a devotee is saved. PURPORT The great rsis approached Dhruva Maharaja at a time when his mind was very perplexed due to the magical feats exhibited by the Yaksas. A devotee is always protected by the Supreme Personality of Godhead. By His inspiration only, the sages came to encourage Dhruva Maharaja and assure him that there was no danger because he was a soul fully surrendered to the Supreme Lord. By the grace of the Lord, if a devotee, at the time of death, can simply chant His holy name — Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare — simply by chanting this maha-mantra, he immediately surpasses the great ocean of the material sky and enters the spiritual sky. He never has to come back for repetition of birth and death. Simply by chanting the holy name of the Lord, one can surpass the ocean of death, so Dhruva Maharaja was certainly able to surpass the illusory magical feats of the Yaksas, which for the time being disturbed his mind.

Thanks gHari. I have never been there before. I was very impressed by their attempt to be objective. Very rare these days. I bookmarked it to check out later at more depth. Beliefnet offers some interesting oppurtunities to spread Krsna consciousness. Kinda like standing on a street corner. Wide mix of people, sincere and curious, trolls etc. Devotees are needed there to share the spiritual side. Spread some seeds when you drop by there.