Yogkriya

No! Not Shanti Parva! READ THE ANUSHASANA PARVA!! There Krishna explains his right position and how he prays to Mahadeva. Its like a Guru who is everything and whole for his disciple. Which Krishna portrays to arjuna. But when asked about Mahadeva, his position is different. Then he takes the dasa bhava and very lovingly tells how he succeeded in please him with long penances. This is not pray. This is the path of sadhna. Not simply praying. After going to that great Rishi Upmanyu in the beautiful retreat of Vadari and requesting him for Pashupat Diksha, Krishna indeed performs many months of very hard sadhna standing on one leg, without eating or drinking to please Lord Mahadeva. Krishna himself states this in the Anushasana Parva. And says that there is none parallel to Bhava (Shiva) or greater than him. After taking the Pashupat Diksha (initiation and shaktipaat) and performing pashupat yog, one becomes fully Shaiv. So he was a staunch Shaiva too. Om Namah Shivaya.

Yes please see again. Om Namah Shivaya!

No you can't! lol And this is how all the purports are twisted to propagate another point of view. Purports are different than even translations. And most people read and follow purports.

This is funny isn't it? You can of course ignore what Krishna himself says and what the greatest of Rishis like Upmanyu and Bhishma say. You can follow someone else from Kaliyuga. Doesn't matter. But since you are trying to follow Krishna I guess you have to accept him and not a misinterpretation. Read the Mahabharata at least if not Shiva MahaPurana and Shiva Gita!!

Yes of course Lord Shiva offers his obeisance to him. Also, after Ramachandra through rigorous penances is successful in pleasing Lord Shiva and after Shiva appears before him, he (Shiva) praises him too. This is NOT "prays". Shiva doesn't need to pray to anyone! He is the Lord of all Lords!! But he can offer his appreciation and obeisance and respect. Narsimha is an avatara of Vishnu! Shiva is no avatara. He is Ishwara!! Whatever all of you quoted has no example of Shiva doing rigorous penances to "please" anyone. It is the Gaudiya 'misinterpretation' of scriptures that shows that Shiva is sitting on Kailash and "praying". I've even heard such a rediculous thing as Shiva is sitting there and chanting Hare Krishna! LOL How far can you go with fanaticism? Of course there are times where Shiva has said that Vishnu (Hari) is in his heart always! This is a matter of love. Of being one's beloved. But your agenda is to prove supremacy and competition. This is wrong. You don't do that.

All glories to Shri Vasudeva Krishna!!! All glories to Lord of the Lords Shri Mahadeva!!!

Yes True indeed. I've read this. Lord Shri Krishna himself also explains this in good detail to Yudhishthira - formost of the Pandavas. Shiva Bhakti and worship was widespread during Shri MaryadaPurushottma Lord Ramachandra and Shri Krishna. The wives of Lord Krishna also revered and prayed to Shiva, so did the residents of nand gaon. Rukmini in fact asked Krishna to go and perform severe penances to please Lord Shiva to seek a son - Samva. All glories to Lord of the Lords!! Hara Hara Hara Mahadev!!

Often in the name of spirituality, we keep brooding over Gods and spiritual worlds and what could be and must have been, the hows and whys without considering our own position now and here. Such an enquiry can be possibly considered a waste of time. It serves no purpose except pester some aimless curiosity. I think one sould be more interested in improving one's own karma and helping other devotees with their karmas as possible.

GURU, THE MENTOR OF ONE'S LIFE How can the disciple attain perfection, and give excellence to his life? How can he accumulate the qualities of a good disciple? A reflection, study and contemplation on these points, through this article... The word "Shishya" means to come near. It also means closeness, proximity and nearness. Therefore, a disciple. in the true sense of the word, is one who comes closest to the Guru, touches the live chords of the heart of Guru and finds a place therein and becomes one with him, all with a feeling of total dedication. Becoming one here means to completely fuse in his being the sadhnas, ideology and essence of spirituality that the Guru stands for. Virogopnishad lays down six qualities for a disciple in order to achieve perfection in this direction. A person or Sadhak attains perfection to the extent he is able to accumulate these qualities within himself. The six qualities mentioned in the Virogopnishad are as follows :- (1) The word "Shishya" also signifies dedication. The depth of dedication to the Guru determines the excellence of the disciple. Dedication admits no conditions. It has to be feeling oriented and not reason oriented. You may be a doctor, advocate or a big industrialist but the social status has nothing to do with the feeling of dedication. Those who dedicate themselves before the Guru without any pre-conditions and status considerations are really competent to become disciples. (2) A disciple has no personal desire or ambition. Before the Guru, he has to be like a simple child even though he may be holding a high post, or may be otherwise great or powerful financially. All these things are secondary, since before the Guru, a disciple is like a lump of clay without any form or size. Only with this feeling of humility can a person prove to be a good disciple. If a disciple continues to be prejudiced that he is very learned, is a professor, lawyer, industrialist or a high officer, the distance between him and the Guru continues and their, identities remain separate. It is therefore, obligatory for the disciple that whenever he appears before the Guru he should put aside all his titles and distinctions. Only then can there be a mutual accord with the Guru. (3) The disciple’s mind should basically be governed by true feelings and not by arguments, since the arguments result in ill-reasonings later on. If you have accepted someone as a Guru, it is evident that you have considered him to be more significant than your own self and that he is far advanced than you in a particular field. In such a case you have no right to argue with him unless you too achieve the knowledge in the field of his specialization and this knowledge can be gained only if you are able to win over the feelings of Guru by reverence. If the Guru gives any direction there should be no questions. His direction is above all things in life and to obey it is the main duty and function of the disciple. If you are inclined to argue things out and have ifs and buts in your mind, then it is better not to have a Guru at all. But once you have accepted a Guru there should be no ifs and huts. Only then can you achieve fusion with the Guru. (4) The disciple is not a judge and he has no right to test the Guru. If you consider it necessary, you can investigate and make inquiries, satisfy yourself by examining his individuality before accepting someone as Guru. But after becoming a disciple, the question of testing the Guru does not arise. Nor is he to be compared with any other Guru. To obey the order of the Guru should become the principle of one’s life. Any hesitation or doubt in following the orders of the Guru lessens the feeling of dedication. Therefore, whenever the disciple meets the Guru he should meet him with the feeling as if he is a mere child, irrespective of his status and position in personal life. (5) The word "Shishya" means nearness. The more near a disciple is to the Guru the greater will be the gains. You should remain physically present in the Guru s feet. If it is not possible, in the modern busy life, you should maintain proximity by correspondence or by telephonic conversation. If possible visit the Guru thrice or more times in a year and sit in his holy feet for a day or two. One should try to visit the Guru with the entire family at least once a year and try to attain something, from his divine presence. The Guru is also a member of the family. Rather he is the head of the family and it is the duty of the disciple to meet the Guru quite often and receive some guidance for the future. If you do not meet the Guru then how will you be able to receive anything from him. To remain in contact with the Guru and to identify himself with him is the duty of a disciple. (6) The direction given by the Guru is above all things. As a disciple, it is your duty to obey the directions. Something very important always lies hidden in the order of the Guru, though it may not be obvious at that time but with the passage of time, the disciple realises that the order given by the Guru earlier was for his own good. Therefore, whatever the orders of the Guru, it should not only be the duty, but the religion of the disciple to follow them. There should be no questions, no doubts or hesitations in obeying them. To obey the order of the Guru to the best of his ability and in the shortest possible time, has been considered the foremost duty of the disciple. According to Virogopnishad, the disciple who is able to assimilate the above qualities, is the real disciple. Therefore, before expecting anything from the Guru, one should introspect within, if he is a disciple in the true sense and fulfils the criterion laid down as above. If you fall short of the criterion how can you expect the Guru to fulfil your desires. The relations between the Guru and disciple are as delicate as a sheet of glass. A slight stroke causes a crack in it. Similarly, a slight difference with the Guru causes a strain in the relations, which turns into a wide gap. Therefore, the disciple should be constantly on the watch out , whether he is fulfilling all the criterion and should analyse this aspect from time to time. He should ask himself whether he has assimilated all the qualities necessary for a disciple and whether he has been able to become a perfect disciple. By such an analysis the heart becomes clear of all doubts and the chances of differences with the Guru are eliminated. The relations between the Guru and the disciple are not business like. There is no question of give and take between them. No feeling of remuneration for services done should be entertained by the disciple. There is no balance to measure or explain this exchange. The disciple has to remain as such and continue to march ahead on his path consistently. In clear words, the disciple has to remain like a child. His mental outlook should be one of dissatisfaction with sensual pleasures and evil social customs, on the same time maintaining concern and respect for the society in general. A disciple attains perfection by remaining disinterested in the outer world, by marching ahead on the path of duty, as directed by the Guru, and wishing for the general welfare of mankind. Such a disciple is always polite and without vanity and considers himself a nullity before the Guru. The most difficult Sadhana and devotion for a disciple is dedication in the feet of Guru and to assimilate the greatness of the Guru into himself. For achieving this goal, a disciple should continue to make great efforts. To be a real disciple, a man or woman has to subdue one’s ego, remain polite and face the world, remain in the feet of Guru and maintain a balance between himself and his family. Such a disciple is always prepared to sacrifice his social status, financial position and even his life to achieve the blessings of the Guru and thus to attain perfection. Complete dedication and surrender of one’s ego is the first step on the road to spiritual progress and this Shakti Sadhana (Sadhana of the Divine Energy) is possible only with the blessings of the Guru. Only with the above efforts, the disciple attains the qualities of the Guru and becomes a Guru himself. Others may address him as a Guru but he remains a disciple before his own Guru. These criterion, if maintained, bring him face to face with divinity. Only then, is he able to serve the mankind better and set an example for others to become good disciples.

Guru is a guide who can understand all one's problems and suggest Mantras with the help of which one could get rid of all problems. Unless a disciple gets rids of his mundane problems, he cannot make special effort to reach the divine or open his divine potential. Mantra is a divine combination of divine syllables or sounds which when chanted with devotion, faith and emotion gravitate the concerned God or Goddess or deity and secure their divine blessings. For divine help one must link with divine forces but majority of humans are unaware of these forces and have no link whatsoever. But when an individual starts chanting Mantra related to a particular deity regularly the gap between him and the concerned divine force steadily decreases. By regular use of Mantra a subtle link is formed and through this one could then obtain any desired boon within the power of the deity. One could obtain wealth, prosperity, fame, fearlessness, success and spiritual upliftment, but for each a different Mantra is chanted and a different deity propitiated. A Mantra is a special set of words through only that particular deity could be summoned. If I write or speak in Chinese you won't be able to understand and my words will not produce any effect. But if I speak the language you know its effect shall be with doubt. Praying to these deities in one's language won't help much but if one uses the words that they can understand the result shall be instant. These words are the Mantras evolved by Rishis and Yogis who actually prepared them and used them to prove their worth. Over the ages these have helped thousands of Sadhaks achieve even that which appeared impossible to them. Within doubt that whose chanting fulfils one's wish is a Mantra.

Was he publishing any every second newspaper ? He could if he could have every second vision of the Lord in a state of 'Nirvikalpa' samadhi.

Bhava dasa: Even if one is from the category of kanistha or madhyama, he can accept the position of guru. Here Srila Prabhupada is specifically referring to the uttama-adhikari guru. He is always liberated. Yogkriya: Where is the uttama-adhikari guru?? Any names? I'd like to have the fortune of meeting him. Bhava das: No. This interpretation of yours is not correct. Yogkriya: So You are trying to imply that a regular gbc and Narada Muni are at the same level? Again please let me know the name/s of anyone in any country, andd i'll go to see him. Bhava dasa: Your opinion on this does not align itself with the great maha-bhagavata acaryas in our sampradaya. Their opinions is that the distribution of this great literature and the public chanting of the Holy Names is the yajna of the present age, and leads to the highest perfectional stage of love of God—Krsna prema. "But just service"? YogKriya: No I can't align with them. You are trying to align the whole Vedic culture according to one sampradaya and its view point / agenda.. How is this possible? Yagna? What happened to the original yagna and Vedic culture / Sanatana Dharma? Of course, chanting holy names is good too... Hare Krishna Discussions spilling all over: Bhava Dasa: Yes, they could be, but since they are posted here, why should we not be allowed to discuss them? After all…you are. Aside from that, you enter into those forums and try to impose your viewpoints there. Why should we remain silent while you continue on with this distortion of Gaudiya siddhanta? YogKriya: No. I have been banned from Hare Krishna forums. Anybody is, when they fail to agree with your particular philosophy line and are considrerd rude and banned. Even if you try to have a normal healthy discussion. Last time somebody wasn't able to prove a point to me, so the moderator banned me. lol So the Hare Krishna viewpoints are only "imposed" here! And it is made sure by the people watching over it. The Gaudiya Siddhanta is distorting everything else here... Yog kriya: The forums are marked differently, but all of them seems to be Hare Krishna Forums. lol. Bhava dasa: Hare Krsna Yog kriya:Jai Gurudev!!

Jai Guru dev!! Keep the good work up!

Spiritual Master is always liberated!? hmm.. Depends what spiritual master he was talking about.. In general yes. But then ... Hari Kesh Swami was/is also a spiritual master. The term siddha/siddhi used is too generalized and does not pertain to any siddhi here. Again the relevance of Narada Muni and a "Spiritual Master" as a regular Iskcon acharya seems to be on a same level. That's the view reflected at least. I suppose a GBC member and Narad Muni are no considered at a similar level. Because if not, then there must be more classification on the sadhna and siddhi level of a sadhaka. Distributing books can be service but not a Vedic Sadhna leading to a Siddhi. But just service. Though it can be exalted and glorified to any level. Some thoughts. Also, these are specific Iskcon questions that could be discussed in Iskcon Forum though. Since others are banned from Iskcon forums, hence strictly Iskcon questions should be also focused on hare Krishna/Iskcon Gaudiya forums. Just a suggestion for JND. The forums are marked differently, but all of them seems to be Hare Krishna Forums. lol.

lol ! He's right there in your avatara's picture! So probably we can see him with our eyes too!

lol !

Indeed. Wings are needed to fly a gross physical object that is governed by physical laws of gravity, movement, air, inertia and momentum. The celestial beings are not bounded by these exact earthly laws. They have different 'bodies', powers and capacities and belong to a different realm of existence. So obviously they don't need those wings. This is what simple logic says. Also as JN Das quoted SPP, there are really no depictions of 'winged' beings in puranas and scriptures that are much much more ancient than Christianity. Wings could be symbolic in Christian books that were later accepted literally. Lord Hanuman could fly and had no wings. Yogis siddh in 'vayu gaman siddhi' can fly even with a gross physical body without needing any wings.

I don't have to develope sadhnas to do that. Sadhnas are there already. The need is to go to a Guru who has accomplished darshan/siddhi of a particular deity by following a certain sadhna/mantra. He can initiate you into that sadhna and look after your progress in it. There are different devta 'pratyakshikaran' sadhnas. That's the tantrik path. And there is the mantrik way to do a sadhna, the difference being only in teh sadhna procedures. Or simply follow the simple bhakti. This can take a longer time comparatively though. Tantrik mantras are stronger and give results in shorter time, but every sadhnas has certain intricate key points to acheiving success that are to be understood by Guru only. The yogic path is to activate your agya and anahat chakras to accomplish the same. Still you need specific sadhna, attachment, love, devotion towards the deity. These are the basics in any sadhnas.

Guest's words are true. Indeed Siddhashram is one place whose very soil is holy and worth smearing on your forehead like sandal paste, is energized through penances of great rishis through time immemorial. Thousands upon thousands of years. It has been in existence even in Satya Yuga. The high level of secrecy that Siddhashram maintains is probably the only reason that it is not known to common people. It is not reacheable through ordinary means. But there are certain rules and conditions that are to be fulfilled for one to enter it. It is possible only by the means of sadhna. I can go on and on... any level of decription or glory is not enough ... where still, there are yogis having hundreds of years of age are still living and performing their sadhnas and giving directions to worldly people. This is the only place that remains intact after earth is destroyed after the yuga cycles. This is one place where the great lord Vishnu performed his penance and then went to kill king Bali as Vamana avtara, there upon came back again to this revered Siddhashram to perform penance/sadhna to remove the sin of killing ... this might seem a bit mythological, but if you don't believe this, then you can throw all the shastras away, as these are not my words. Words said by the greatest sages of all times Shri Vishwamitra cannot be untrue. I will give one shastrik reference to Siddhashram. Open Valmiki Ramayana, Balya Kaand, where the great Sage Vishwamitra takes Lord Ramachandra away from from King Dasharatha to protect the completion of his sadhna and yagya. He takes Rama and Lakshmana to Sidhashrama, metts the sages there and reveals that this is Rama's ashrama. He (Rama) in his previous incarnation performed rigorous penances here as Vishnu and then as Vamandeva. And then initiates both the brothers into advance sadhnas such 'Bala ati Bala' ( a sadhna by accomplishing which one does not feel the need to sleep or eat and his physical strength is not lessened, but keeps increasing). And then give then divine mantrik weapons to guard his (Vishwamitra's) Yagya. He initiates them, gives them sadhnas and makes them acquire siddhi (perfection) in them. This reference is found in Sri Valmiki Ramayana on Siddhashrama. From time to time, Siddhashram sends accomplished yogis amidst the society to spread the ancient knowledge of India that is now being lost. Shri Vishuddhananda was one such yogi who was a siddha in Surya Vigyan sadhna. Lord Rama and his lineage were Surya Vanshi and were worshiping the Sun God!! In a rare revalation, Vishudhanada manifested a lotus in front of a few of his disciples, that came out of his navel and reached the room ceiling in height. He proved how it is possible and that when you read in the shastras the lotus coming out of Vishnu's navel, you shold believe in it. It was well noted by his prominent disciple Kaviraj who leter wrote a book on Siddhashram too. Sri Babaji (the dada Guru of Paramhansa Yogananda's Guru), who has an ageless mortal body for the last 2000 years is also from Siddhashram) More recently, Paramhansa Swami Nikhileshwarananda has helped bring the lost ancient sadhnas to common man by his mercy and divya shaktipaat, that a handful of Gurus are capable of today. Imagine getting revealed the exact sadhna paddhati (procedure) and mantras that Vashishtha or Vishwamitra used back then!! Obviously they were not just beating drums and cymbols! That was the Sanatana Dharma we have been talking about. The way of sadhnas, as practiced by our rishis. Other names of Siddhashram are Gyanganj, SidhGyanashram and it is also known as Shambala in Tibetan spiritual culture. (Though the Shambala term has now also come to be used in relation to other places, but the original Shambala is refered to Siddhashram only). It's situation is between Mt. Kailash and Tibet. Jai Gurudev!! YogKriya.

;-)

Agreeable. The problem arises when, Mr. A believing in 1 wants to force his own individual relation with 1 on Mr. B who believes in 2. Someone's spiritual level does not depend on someone else's recognizing it or not. There are many yogis who exist in the depths of Himalayas. Who are highly accomplished in their spiritual realms to a level that they can have direct divine vision are darshan with their beloved form of God. Who can talk to gandharvas, apsaras and celetial beings. Now someone who is not in touch with spiritual life at all may no believe in it. That's his right too.

hmmm .... sounds like ritvik ideology..! Anyways, if u believe in that, then its your right of course!!

JAI GURU DEV !!!!

Dear Guest, Yes. this is the picture. But a bigger blow up has a real feeling. I can have a quick contact with this picture while meditating on it. There is a certain inner compassion in it. Different pictures of Lord Krishna relay different moods. Many are reflecting joy, fun, playfulness, transcendence, and many other qualities. This particular picture, looks real as it is not out of this world beauty, but at the same time you feel while looking in the Lord's eyes in it, as if he is looking at you with a deeper compassion and you have a bond with him. It doesn't reflect a frenzy of joy, but more compassion and a lot of understanding for you. As if Krishna has come down to your level to meet you and wants to help you out of your position, problems etc..