Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

[Guest guest]

I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am all set

to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even if She

doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something, since I

have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

[Guest guest]

I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I wrote down

stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them seems to be already

well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward the

fulfillment of their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly through

the air. Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure what

the Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my practices.

 

, "nandu_108" <n_mallan> wrote:

> I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am all

set

> to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even if She

> doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something, since I

> have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

[Guest guest]

Can someone explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I bow

to all Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont have

the dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali.

 

Durga Mata Ki Jai !

 

, "rudran2" <stechiekov> wrote:

> I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I wrote

down

> stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them seems to be

already

> well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward the

> fulfillment of their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly

through

> the air. Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure what

> the Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my practices.

>

> , "nandu_108" <n_mallan>

wrote:

> > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am all

> set

> > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even if She

> > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something, since

I

> > have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

[Guest guest]

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

jesuisdurga

[jesuisdurga ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:12

AMSubject: Re: Lakshmi

Puja update(new creation)Can someone explain what is special about

Laksmi or Sarasvati - I bow to all Gods and Goddesses - but quite

honestly I think they dont have the dash of Durga or the sheer power

or Kali. Durga Mata Ki Jai !,

"rudran2" <stechiekov> wrote:> I too had a good time doing

Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I wrote down > stuff on my note to Devi

and at least one of them seems to be already > well underway. This

shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward the > fulfillment of

their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly through > the air.

Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure what > the

Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my practices. > >

, "nandu_108" <n_mallan>

wrote:> > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I

am all > set > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of

Hers, even if She > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me

something, since I > > have asked for Her guidance and help. My

Pranams to everyone!To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

Attachment: (application/pdf) Lalitopakhyam.pdf [not stored]

[Guest guest]

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

[Guest guest]

Thank you Jesse !

 

If everything is really one , I wonder why there are so many Gods

and Goddesses in the Hindu Pantheon ( 30 million if I am

correct ) ...

 

Do these Gods and Goddesses 'really' exist on some other plane ?

 

I fell in love with Durga when I saw a statue of her when I was in

college and took an interest in her ever since.

 

 

 

 

 

, "Jesse Arana" <jessearana@c...>

wrote:

> Namaste,

>

> Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration

of

> that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness

> is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission.

> In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of

the

> Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari. Lakshmi,

Saraswati,

> and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

>

> Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi

also

> has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

> Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

> universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

>

> One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship

to

> the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power

> of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of Shiva,

and she

> rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna. And Lakshmi is

the

> wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So yogically, it's

important

> to invite each goddess to transform your mind, which is a slave to

the

> three Gunas, and bound by the interactions of subtle karmas.

>

> There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

> these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

>

>

>

>

>

> jesuisdurga [jesuisdurga]

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:12 AM

>

> Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> Can someone explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I

bow

> to all Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont

have

> the dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali.

>

> Durga Mata Ki Jai !

>

> , "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:

> > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I wrote

> down

> > stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them seems to be

> already

> > well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward

the

> > fulfillment of their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly

> through

> > the air. Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure

what

> > the Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my

practices.

> >

> > , "nandu_108" <n_mallan>

> wrote:

> > > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am

all

> > set

> > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even if

She

> > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something,

since

> I

> > > have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

>

>

>

> Sponsor

>

>

<http://rd./M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=17

05

> 075991:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o885gmo/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi-

bin/au

> toredir?camp=556&lineid=3614674∝=egroupweb&pos=HM>

>

> <http://us.adserver./l?

M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egrou

> pmail/S=:HM/A=1524963/rand=659612790>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of Service

> <> .

[Guest guest]

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

[Guest guest]

Namaste Durga,

Yes. The Devis and Devas (or you could call them Dakas and Dakinis)

really exist. They are "the" plane. All the universes exist in them,

not the other way around.

We all come from this duality of "inner" and "outer." Like, we think

that consciousness is "within" our body, when actually our body, and

all the worlds, are "within" consciousness.

So the Devas and Devis contain all the universes. We live in them. Pretty cool...huh?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

jesuisdurga

[jesuisdurga ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 11:22

AMSubject: Re: Lakshmi

Puja update(new creation)Thank you Jesse !If everything is really one

, I wonder why there are so many Gods and Goddesses in the Hindu

Pantheon ( 30 million if I am correct ) ... Do these Gods and

Goddesses 'really' exist on some other plane ? I fell in love with

Durga when I saw a statue of her when I was in college and took an

interest in her ever since. ,

"Jesse Arana" <jessearana@c...> wrote:> Namaste, > > Lakshmi, Durga,

and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of> that oneness.

As far as I know, the only way to understand that oneness> is to be

initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission.> In

the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of the>

Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari. Lakshmi,

Saraswati,> and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.> >

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi

also> has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura.

Lalita> Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all

the> universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached). >

> One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship

to> the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules

the power> of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she> rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the> wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important> to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the> three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.> > There is a lot more. Most

important is to understand that neither of> these Goddesses can be

realized without direct spiritual transmission.> > Jesse Arana

(Kailash)> www.meditationinfocus.com> > > > > -----Original

Message-----> jesuisdurga [jesuisdurga] > Sent:

Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:12 AM> >

Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)> > > Can

someone explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I bow > to

all Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont have >

the dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali. > > Durga Mata Ki Jai

!> > , "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:> > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I

wrote > down > > stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them

seems to be > already > > well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves

her pujaries toward the > > fulfillment of their goals not unlike an

arrow moving rapidly > through > > the air. Persistance on our own

part helps too. I am not sure what > > the Goddess has to do, but I

certainly most continue my practices. > > > > --- In

, "nandu_108" <n_mallan> > wrote:> >

> I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am all >

> set > > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even

if She > > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me

something, since > I > > > have asked for Her guidance and help. My

Pranams to everyone!> > > > Sponsor > >

<http://rd./M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=1705>

075991:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o885gmo/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi-bin/au>

toredir?camp=556&lineid=3614674∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > >

<http://us.adserver./l?M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egrou>

pmail/S=:HM/A=1524963/rand=659612790> > > To from

this group, send an email to:>

> > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to the Terms of Service>

<> .To from this group,

send an email to:Your use of

is subject to the

[Guest guest]

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

 

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[Guest guest]

Glad to meet an enlightened soul who is THE PATH. I fall at the feet

of your Guru - oh I forget you dont have one. I mean this in the

NICEST POSSIBLE WAY TOO.

Thank you for disproving the Guru Gita - which says 'The Guru is

everything - It is True It is True IT IS TRUE'.

Jai Durga !!!!

Kelly Leeper <blissnout > wrote:

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

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[Guest guest]

Just for the record --

 

Oh my beautiful Gurudeva - you are the loveliest of crutches , the

gold in fetter chains , I adore you . Why should I want a God(dess)

when even a moment of meditation upon you transports me to joy. My

Guru Bhagwan - You are everything I need. IT IS TRUE IT IS TRUE IT IS

TRUE.

 

Jai Guru !!!

 

 

 

 

 

, Durga 1008 <jesuisdurga>

wrote:

> Om Kellyai Namah. You join the ranks of Ramana Maharshi (and a few

more ) - he too didnt have a Guru at least in that particular

lifetime. Do you have an ashram ?

>

> Glad to meet an enlightened soul who is THE PATH. I fall at the

feet of your Guru - oh I forget you dont have one. I mean this in the

NICEST POSSIBLE WAY TOO.

>

> Thank you for disproving the Guru Gita - which says 'The Guru is

everything - It is True It is True IT IS TRUE'.

>

> Jai Durga !!!!

>

Kelly Leeper <blissnout> wrote:

> Jesse,

>

> Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

>

> I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

>

> Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

>

> I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

>

> Namste,

> Kelly

> Jesse Arana <jessearana@c...> wrote:

> Namaste Swamiji,

>

> The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I

am not sure how it was manifested.

>

> I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

>

> Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

>

>

>

>

> Saradananda [saradananda]

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 11:11 AM

>

> Re: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai Namah

>

> Loving greetings - and many thanks for sending the beautiful

Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the document, it

says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a transcript of a

series of talks that someone gave? or a direct translation of the

scripture?

>

> I also appreciated your comments on the oneness of Lakshmi, Durga

and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree "the only way to understand

that oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar

spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga - bhakti yoga, raja yoga,

jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga - have as their goal the

understanding (experience) of Oneness. These different paths of yoga

are suited for different people with different personalities - each

offers techniques to experience the Oneness. And each of them works,

if practiced diligently.

>

> with OM and Prem

> Swami Saradananda

>

> www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

>

> -

> Jesse Arana

>

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

> RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> Namaste,

>

> Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration

of that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

>

> Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi

also has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

>

> One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship

to the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

>

> There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither

of these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

> The New with improved product search

> Sponsor

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

> The New with improved product search

[Guest guest]

Laksmi is a vital componet in the composition of Durga. There are

various chapters within the Chandi dedicated to Laksmi. Laksmi

carries things forward and also brings things to completion.

 

I am sorry, but I know very little of Saraswati. I do have a fine

murti to her. I might have to wait for the Devi Mandir to publish a

Saraswati Puja. Short of this I might purchase the DM's little

Sarawati booklet for children. That way I should be able to glean

some knowledge of her.

 

, "jesuisdurga" <jesuisdurga>

wrote:

> Can someone explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I

bow

> to all Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont

have

> the dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali.

>

> Durga Mata Ki Jai !

>

> , "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:

> > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I wrote

> down

> > stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them seems to be

> already

> > well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward

the

> > fulfillment of their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly

> through

> > the air. Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure

what

> > the Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my

practices.

> >

> > , "nandu_108" <n_mallan>

> wrote:

> > > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I am

all

> > set

> > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even if

She

> > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something,

since

> I

> > > have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I am sorry you don't understand my sentiment. Thanks for your prayers.

Once you are initiated into sadhana, as long as you don't have bad

experiences, you realize how important it is to have a teacher. The

bond between student and teacher is of unfathomable importance. Due

to delusion, most people assume their "path" is what they really

want. They remain caught in their "likes" and "dislikes" about

spirituality, and and will remain "concerned for their freedom" or

some other idealization, based in duality...until someday, when their

heart realizes: that is the self-same delusion they sought to

transcend.

I pray to have the darshan of the Lotus Feet of my Gurus in my heart at all times.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Kelly Leeper

[blissnout ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:11

PMSubject: RE: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

[Guest guest]

Jesse,

I wholeheartedly agree with what you are saying.

Jai Gurudev!

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:43 PM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Hi,

I am sorry you don't understand my sentiment. Thanks for your prayers.

Once you are initiated into sadhana, as long as you don't have bad

experiences, you realize how important it is to have a teacher. The

bond between student and teacher is of unfathomable importance. Due

to delusion, most people assume their "path" is what they really

want. They remain caught in their "likes" and "dislikes" about

spirituality, and and will remain "concerned for their freedom" or

some other idealization, based in duality...until someday, when their

heart realizes: that is the self-same delusion they sought to

transcend.

I pray to have the darshan of the Lotus Feet of my Gurus in my heart at all times.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Kelly Leeper

[blissnout ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:11

PMSubject: RE: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

[Guest guest]

Jesse,

I have been initiated by Her as well as a human Guru. You still have

no idea what my words meant, but that is ok.

Namaste,

Kelly

Jesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Hi,

I am sorry you don't understand my sentiment. Thanks for your prayers.

Once you are initiated into sadhana, as long as you don't have bad

experiences, you realize how important it is to have a teacher. The

bond between student and teacher is of unfathomable importance. Due

to delusion, most people assume their "path" is what they really

want. They remain caught in their "likes" and "dislikes" about

spirituality, and and will remain "concerned for their freedom" or

some other idealization, based in duality...until someday, when their

heart realizes: that is the self-same delusion they sought to

transcend.

I pray to have the darshan of the Lotus Feet of my Gurus in my heart at all times.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Kelly Leeper

[blissnout ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:11

PMSubject: RE: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

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[Guest guest]

Thank you, Swami Saradananda!

 

Astraea

 

-- In , "Saradananda" <saradananda>

wrote:

> MessageOM Hrim Maha Lakshmai Namah

>

> Loving greetings - and many thanks for sending the beautiful

Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the document, it

says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a transcript of a

series of talks that someone gave? or a direct translation of the

scripture?

>

> I also appreciated your comments on the oneness of Lakshmi, Durga

and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree "the only way to understand

that oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar

spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga - bhakti yoga, raja yoga,

jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga - have as their goal the

understanding (experience) of Oneness. These different paths of yoga

are suited for different people with different personalities - each

offers techniques to experience the Oneness. And each of them works,

if practiced diligently.

>

> with OM and Prem

> Swami Saradananda

>

> www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

> -

> Jesse Arana

>

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

> RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> Namaste,

>

> Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the

celebration of that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to

understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a

similar spiritual transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my

Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita

Tripurasundari. Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her

primary expansions.

>

> Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi

also has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

>

> One important reason to contemplate the three is their

relationship to the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so

she rules the power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the

wife of Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo

Guna. And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

>

> There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither

of these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

[Guest guest]

Namaste Kelly,

I do have an idea of what your words mean. I hear your compassion and

your desire for things to be right and good for all beings in your

words. I am sorry I didn't make that clearer in my reply.

Jesse

Kelly Leeper

[blissnout ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 6:48

PMSubject: RE: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Jesse,

I have been initiated by Her as well as a human Guru. You still have

no idea what my words meant, but that is ok.

Namaste,

Kelly

Jesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Hi,

I am sorry you don't understand my sentiment. Thanks for your prayers.

Once you are initiated into sadhana, as long as you don't have bad

experiences, you realize how important it is to have a teacher. The

bond between student and teacher is of unfathomable importance. Due

to delusion, most people assume their "path" is what they really

want. They remain caught in their "likes" and "dislikes" about

spirituality, and and will remain "concerned for their freedom" or

some other idealization, based in duality...until someday, when their

heart realizes: that is the self-same delusion they sought to

transcend.

I pray to have the darshan of the Lotus Feet of my Gurus in my heart at all times.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Kelly Leeper

[blissnout ] Saturday, October 11, 2003 2:11

PMSubject: RE: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

[Guest guest]

The Guru Gita is right: the Guru is everything. Everything is also

the Guru.

 

Astraea

 

, Durga 1008 <jesuisdurga>

wrote:

> Om Kellyai Namah. You join the ranks of Ramana Maharshi (and a few

more ) - he too didnt have a Guru at least in that particular

lifetime. Do you have an ashram ?

>

> Glad to meet an enlightened soul who is THE PATH. I fall at the

feet of your Guru - oh I forget you dont have one. I mean this in the

NICEST POSSIBLE WAY TOO.

>

> Thank you for disproving the Guru Gita - which says 'The Guru is

everything - It is True It is True IT IS TRUE'.

>

> Jai Durga !!!!

>

Kelly Leeper <blissnout> wrote:

> Jesse,

>

> Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

>

> I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

>

> Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

>

> I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

>

> Namste,

> Kelly

> Jesse Arana <jessearana@c...> wrote:

> Namaste Swamiji,

>

> The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I

am not sure how it was manifested.

>

> I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

>

> Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

>

>

>

>

> Saradananda [saradananda]

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 11:11 AM

>

> Re: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai Namah

>

> Loving greetings - and many thanks for sending the beautiful

Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the document, it

says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a transcript of a

series of talks that someone gave? or a direct translation of the

scripture?

>

> I also appreciated your comments on the oneness of Lakshmi, Durga

and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree "the only way to understand

that oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar

spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga - bhakti yoga, raja yoga,

jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga - have as their goal the

understanding (experience) of Oneness. These different paths of yoga

are suited for different people with different personalities - each

offers techniques to experience the Oneness. And each of them works,

if practiced diligently.

>

> with OM and Prem

> Swami Saradananda

>

> www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

>

> -

> Jesse Arana

>

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

> RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

>

>

> Namaste,

>

> Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration

of that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

>

> Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi

also has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

>

> One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship

to the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

>

> There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither

of these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

>

> Jesse Arana (Kailash)

> www.meditationinfocus.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

>

>

>

> The New with improved product search

> Sponsor

>

>

>

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>

>

> Terms of

Service.

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>

> The New with improved product search

[Guest guest]

Did I disprove the Guru Gita? I'm not sure I understand that statement.

What I am saying is what alot of confirmed here is that Guru pervades

all and is in everything. Both Maa and my phsical Guru have stated,

The Guru is in everything, and if I am to think the Guru is only in

Swami Chetanananda, then I am wrong. He is right, he is right, he is

right. The Guru is where I see Guru and that is up the devotee. That

is the sadhana, the effort and then Ma finishes the initiation with

grace like frosting on a cake. If you need Guru to come from 1

person then you will need that one person to be Guru - that is

perfect for the person who needs this as most likely that is the way

they will learn in this lifetime. We cannot run from our

projections, Guru or otherwise.

You are the path too Jesuisdurga. I hope you don't disbelieve that.

I like spiritual life so my home is my ashram, my body my temple, Maa

sits there all the time even if I forget her. This goes for everyone

already. One doesn't have to be enlightened to know They are the

path. It's just a redirected thought and sadhana, a different bhava,

but no less valid than the others.

Having a physical Guru or not is irrelevant to me. It's nice to have

spiritual Friends, but I have always found the ultimate in Love and

sublime saftey with Maa as she was the only one I had for so long. I

would never give her up and when Guru is being GURU, they would never

ask that of me anyway:)

I hope I'm not confusing anyone. Jai Maa! Namaste to everyone..

Thanks Brian! *hugs*

Kelly

astraea2003 <astraea2003 > wrote:

The Guru Gita is right: the Guru is everything. Everything is also the

Guru. Astraea, Durga 1008

<jesuisdurga> wrote:> Om Kellyai Namah. You join the ranks of

Ramana Maharshi (and a few more ) - he too didnt have a Guru at

least in that particular lifetime. Do you have an ashram ?> > Glad

to meet an enlightened soul who is THE PATH. I fall at the feet of

your Guru - oh I forget you dont have one. I mean this in the NICEST

POSSIBLE WAY TOO.> > Thank you for disproving the Guru Gita - which

says 'The Guru is everything - It is True It is True IT IS TRUE'.> >

Jai Durga !!!! > > > > > > > > Kelly Leeper <blissnout>

wrote:> Jesse,> > Without the blessings of a teacher what path is

there? Surely you didn't mean that. There are those that are

without a direct teacher who are divinly guided and they are not as

rare as you think. However in realizing how the mind works, if a

Teacher for you is the only way to be on a Path, then that is what

will work for you. > > I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that

statement would only be true for you or those who have bought into

the idea that they are separate and lost without a teacher which can

be a crutch and a fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and

Oneness? Does that only come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't

that go against the teachings? From my experience, we are more

connected than you think to what is divine or what that statement

proclaims.> > Jesse, we ARE the path and when one

'gets that' they aren't looking for a transmission to come from

another unless they see Guru thru another and that doesn't even have

to be a person. To rely on a transmission of a teacher is likened

to a prostitute going to her pimp for her sustanance. That is not

what God intended. I'm not saying that transmissions are invalid or

that Guru is not neccessary or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying

is that the Initiatory process is so much more than what you

envision. > > I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe

that is not what you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the

divine Mother in more cases than not.> > Namste,> Kelly> Jesse Arana

<jessearana@c...> wrote:> Namaste Swamiji,> > The Lalitopakhyanam

translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was

manifested.> > I

didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a student

wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they need a

teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path under

the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas and

karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.> > Without the blessings of

the teacher what path is there? > > Jesse Arana (Kailash)>

www.meditationinfocus.com> > > > >

Saradananda [saradananda] > Saturday, October 11,

2003 11:11 AM> > Re:

Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)>

> > OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai Namah> > Loving greetings - and many thanks

for sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of

the document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?> > I also appreciated your comments on

the oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't

agree "the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated

into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of

yoga - bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha

yoga - have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness.

These different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.> > with

OM and Prem> Swami Saradananda> >

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html> >

- > Jesse Arana > To:

> Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52

AM> RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)>

> > Namaste, > > Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is

the celebration of that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to

understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a

similar spiritual transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my

Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita

Tripurasundari. Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her

primary expansions.> > Durga and Kali are considered the one, as

well. However, Lakshmi also has a Warrior aspect, as she is the

slayer of Kholasura.

Lalita Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached). > >

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship

to the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of Shiva,

and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna. And

Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.> > There is a lot more. Most

important is to understand that neither of these Goddesses can be

realized without direct spiritual transmission.> > Jesse Arana

(Kailash)> www.meditationinfocus.com> > > > To from

this group, send an email to:>

> > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to the > > > To

from this group, send an email to:>

> > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to the > > >

> > The New

Shopping - with improved product search >

Sponsor> > To from this group, send an email

to:> > > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to the > > >

> > The New

Shopping - with improved product

searchTo from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

 

The New with improved product search

[Guest guest]

Hi.

This is a very good question, and very interesting. I have read

various things about this topic in a variety of places, but only bits

and pieces.

In Tantra, the devis are the supreme creator. In Shaivism, Shiva is

supreme. In Vaishnava, Vishnu is supreme. In reality all of these are

One undivided consciousness. The supreme is beyond qualities such as

gender and name.

The supreme has two aspects, nirguna (without qualities), and saguna

(with qualities). The supreme is known as Brahman (though Tara,

Mahakali, Mahalakshmi, Mahasariswati, Tripurasundari, etc, are also

Brahman). Nirguna Brahman is without qualities of any kind, but it is

generally accepted that Brahman possesses sat, chit, ananda, or being,

conscious, and bliss as attributes. Saguna Brahman possesses such

qualities as gender, name, appearance, etc. so that she can be

approached by the unenlightened. But these qualities are said to in

no manner affect or diminish his unqualified state of existence.

You are Brahman. This is a fundamental supposition of spiritual

practice. Your Self, your Atman, your soul is no different than

Brahman. You are the individual wave to the vast sea, recognizable,

but inseparable.

Saguna Brahman as Mahakali is inseparable from nirguna Brahman, is

inseparable from Tara, is inseparable from Shree, from Kali, from

Savitri, from Chandra, from...from...from...from me, from you.

Yet the superficial qualities of the devas and devis do differ,

especially as they approach nature (hierarchically). Just as nature

is highly differentiated, the deities who inhabit and control nature

gain more distinct personalities. Interestingly, it is said that a

yogi who attains a certain level of attainment (I forget now exactly

which level) but not the highest, will become one of the gods, be

absorbed into Nature, until it is time for him to be reborn. Also

interesting, is that the Gods are said to be jealous of any yogi who

approaches enlightenment, afraid their position as a god will be

supplanted (but I'll bet there's more to it than that).

Just as you will one day know yourself to be Brahman (by whatever

name--or none at all) and yet still go by the name Jesuisdurga, still

retaining the same body, the same family, the same home, the same job

(you get the idea), so do the devas and devis know their true Self

and yet retain their unique characteristics and perform their duties.

Chris

jesuisdurga <jesuisdurga > wrote:

Thank you Jesse !If everything is really one , I wonder why there are

so many Gods and Goddesses in the Hindu Pantheon ( 30 million if I am

correct ) ... Do these Gods and Goddesses 'really' exist on some

other plane ? I fell in love with Durga when I saw a statue of her

when I was in college and took an interest in her ever since. --- In

, "Jesse Arana" <jessearana@c...> wrote:>

Namaste, > > Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the

celebration of> that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to

understand that oneness> is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a

similar spiritual transmission.> In the Sri Vidya transmission of my

Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of the> Three (Worlds) is

known as Lalita Tripurasundari. Lakshmi, Saraswati,> and Durga are

several of Her primary expansions.> > Durga and Kali are considered

the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also> has a Warrior aspect, as she

is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita> Tripurasundari takes birth as

Lakshmi when She creates all the> universes, as is told about in the

Lalitopakhyana (attached). > > One important reason to contemplate

the three is their relationship to> the three Gunas. Saraswati is the

wife of Brahma, so she rules the power> of transcendent wisdom in Raja

Guna. Durga is the wife of Shiva, and she> rules the transcendent

power to transform Tamo Guna. And Lakshmi is the> wife of Vishnu...

ruling the Sattva Guna. So yogically, it's important> to invite each

goddess to transform your mind, which is a slave to the> three Gunas,

and bound by the interactions of

subtle karmas.> > There is a lot more. Most important is to

understand that neither of> these Goddesses can be realized without

direct spiritual transmission.> > Jesse Arana (Kailash)>

www.meditationinfocus.com> > > > > >

jesuisdurga [jesuisdurga] > Saturday, October

11, 2003 2:12 AM> > Subject:

Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)> > > Can someone

explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I bow > to all

Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont have > the

dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali. > > Durga Mata Ki Jai !> >

, "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:> > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja

yesterday twice. I wrote > down > > stuff on my note to Devi and at

least one of them seems to be > already > > well underway. This shows

that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward the > > fulfillment of their

goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly > through > > the air.

Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure what > > the

Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my practices. > > >

> , "nandu_108" <n_mallan> >

wrote:> > > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now

I am all > > set > > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation

of Hers, even if She > > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to

give me something, since > I > > > have asked for Her guidance and

help. My Pranams to everyone!> > >

> Sponsor > >

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[Guest guest]

jesuisdurga,

Hi.

This is a very good question, and very interesting. I have read

various things about this topic in a variety of places, but only bits

and pieces.

In Tantra, the devis are the supreme creator. In Shaivism, Shiva is

supreme. In Vaishnava, Vishnu is supreme. In reality all of these are

One undivided consciousness. The supreme is beyond qualities such as

gender and name.

The supreme has two aspects, nirguna (without qualities), and saguna

(with qualities). The supreme is known as Brahman (though Tara,

Mahakali, Mahalakshmi, Mahasariswati, Tripurasundari, etc, are also

Brahman). Nirguna Brahman is without qualities of any kind, but it is

generally accepted that Brahman possesses sat, chit, ananda, or being,

conscious, and bliss as attributes. Saguna Brahman possesses such

qualities as gender, name, appearance, etc. so that she can be

approached by the unenlightened. But these qualities are said to in

no manner affect or diminish his unqualified state of existence.

You are Brahman. This is a fundamental supposition of spiritual

practice. Your Self, your Atman, your soul is no different than

Brahman. You are the individual wave to the vast sea, recognizable,

but inseparable.

Saguna Brahman as Mahakali is inseparable from nirguna Brahman, is

inseparable from Tara, is inseparable from Shree, from Kali, from

Savitri, from Chandra, from...from...from...from me, from you.

Yet the superficial qualities of the devas and devis do differ,

especially as they approach nature (hierarchically). Just as nature

is highly differentiated, the deities who inhabit and control nature

gain more distinct personalities. Interestingly, it is said that a

yogi who attains a certain level of attainment (I forget now exactly

which level) but not the highest, will become one of the gods, be

absorbed into Nature, until it is time for him to be reborn. Also

interesting, is that the Gods are said to be jealous of any yogi who

approaches enlightenment, afraid their position as a god will be

supplanted (but I'll bet there's more to it than that).

Just as you will one day know yourself to be Brahman (by whatever

name--or none at all) and yet still go by the name Jesuisdurga, still

retaining the same body, the same family, the same home, the same job

(you get the idea), so do the devas and devis know their true Self

and yet retain their unique characteristics and perform their duties.

Chris

jesuisdurga <jesuisdurga > wrote:

Thank you Jesse !If everything is really one , I wonder why there are

so many Gods and Goddesses in the Hindu Pantheon ( 30 million if I am

correct ) ... Do these Gods and Goddesses 'really' exist on some

other plane ? I fell in love with Durga when I saw a statue of her

when I was in college and took an interest in her ever since. --- In

, "Jesse Arana" <jessearana@c...> wrote:>

Namaste, > > Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the

celebration of> that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to

understand that oneness> is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a

similar spiritual transmission.> In the Sri Vidya transmission of my

Guru, Karunamayi, the Jewel of the> Three (Worlds) is

known as Lalita Tripurasundari. Lakshmi, Saraswati,> and Durga are

several of Her primary expansions.> > Durga and Kali are considered

the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also> has a Warrior aspect, as she

is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita> Tripurasundari takes birth as

Lakshmi when She creates all the> universes, as is told about in the

Lalitopakhyana (attached). > > One important reason to contemplate

the three is their relationship to> the three Gunas. Saraswati is the

wife of Brahma, so she rules the power> of transcendent wisdom in Raja

Guna. Durga is the wife of Shiva, and she> rules the transcendent

power to transform Tamo Guna. And Lakshmi is the> wife of Vishnu...

ruling the Sattva Guna. So yogically, it's important> to invite each

goddess to transform your mind, which is a slave to the> three Gunas,

and bound by the interactions of

subtle karmas.> > There is a lot more. Most important is to

understand that neither of> these Goddesses can be realized without

direct spiritual transmission.> > Jesse Arana (Kailash)>

www.meditationinfocus.com> > > > > >

jesuisdurga [jesuisdurga] > Saturday, October

11, 2003 2:12 AM> > Subject:

Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)> > > Can someone

explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati - I bow > to all

Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont have > the

dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali. > > Durga Mata Ki Jai !> >

, "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:> > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja

yesterday twice. I wrote > down > > stuff on my note to Devi and at

least one of them seems to be > already > > well underway. This shows

that Laksmi moves her pujaries toward the > > fulfillment of their

goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly > through > > the air.

Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure what > > the

Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my practices. > > >

> , "nandu_108" <n_mallan> >

wrote:> > > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now

I am all > > set > > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation

of Hers, even if She > > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to

give me something, since > I > > > have asked for Her guidance and

help. My Pranams to everyone!> > >

> Sponsor > >

<http://rd./M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egroupweb/S=1705>

075991:HM/A=1524963/R=0/SIG=12o885gmo/*http://hits.411web.com/cgi-bin/au>

toredir?camp=556&lineid=3614674∝=egroupweb&pos=HM> > >

<http://us.adserver./l?M=259395.3614674.4902533.1261774/D=egrou>

pmail/S=:HM/A=1524963/rand=659612790> > > To from

this group, send an email to:>

> > > > Your use of

Groups is subject to the Terms of Service>

<> .To from this group,

send an email to:Your use of

is subject to the

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[Guest guest]

Please don't feel I'm ganging-up on you, but I'm afraid I have to

largely agree with Jesse this time.

Astraea was right when she said this is a very complex topic. I think

a lot of the problem with mutual understanding in this issue is the

same as I think Brian was having in his earlier discussions on the

psychology of spiritual living; it's a question of levels.

We all know we are Sat, Chit, Ananda. On that level, we are

all-knowing, all-powerful, ever blissful. The difficulty is that as

much as we cling to the idea of our true nature, we don't experience

ourselves that way (only in the most limited sense). In the same way

we imagine all the objects and attributes in creation to be ours by

right (and they are), but again, we find, when push comes to shove,

that we can't access them (or, again, only in a limited way).

Pandit Tigunait gave this example once, and I liked it: The Advaitan

may travel around the world giving lectures on the reality of our

nature as pure consciousness, but he still has to board a plane to

get to his next lecture.

Swami Rama used to write that a person first has parents who feed,

protect, and raise him; then he has teachers who teach him how to

live in the world, but after that comes the gurudeva, who introduces

him to himself. He also used to write that the purpose of the

external guru is to lead you to the guru within. Yet Swamiji was very

devoted to his gurudeva, by all accounts, and continued to be guided

by him, despite his own advanced state, until he dropped his body

(and likely after).

It is my belief that the Guru Gita is actually addressing the

universal gurudeva. This is not to exclude the individual gurudeva,

but rather points again to the problem of levels. Guru is everywhere,

but so is consciousness. If we can't access consciousness at the

highest levels, what makes us think we can access the universal

gurudeva? To do so we need an individual gurudeva.

Knowledge is available to anyone with the ability to retrieve it (or

so I am given to understand). How many of us would attempt to

practice medicine through attunement rather than go to a medical

school? Just so, to learn the path of spiritual knowledge we should

go to a gurudeva. The spiritual path is at least as difficult and

complex as medicine.

The gurudeva is part of the natural order. The child who is without a

family is called an orphan, and may grow-up wounded at heart. The

spiritual aspirant without a gurudeva often wanders aimlessly amongst

the shallows, never venturing out into the depths. Only the gurudeva

can lead the student through the veils of fear and confusion for he

has gone before and knows the way.

The gurudeva isn't alone. She is one in a long chain of guides

stretching back to the beginning. She is a custodian of the stream of

knowledge that flows from that source in its subtle form as shakti. In

bestowing diksha, she bestows that shakti.

The grace of god is said to flow equally to all. Some are able to

accept it, some are not. According to Pandit Tigunait, once an

aspirant is initiated the forces of nature, the various shaktis,

recognize him. Mantras become potent, with their innate shaktis

responding to the flow of shakti from the tradition, manifesting

through the student. Having been initiated yourself, you should

recognize this.

It is true that some rise to great heights without a gurudeva. In the

Christian tradition there have always been saints who did not (or at

least seemed not to) have a gurudeva. Many however, became unbalanced

from their practices, and their superstitions, hallucinating all

manner of demons and other things. Many other Christian monks, I

believe, simply didn't get very far because they lacked the necessary

guidance and spiritual force.

Particularly in the path of bhakti, one can get by without a gurudeva.

There are many sages, I think, whose duty and joy it is to help such

people (as I have been) in secret. Still, I think their help is

limited by the capacities of the aspirant, who may not be able to

perceive or fully utilize aid given on a subtle level. But, though

one may be able to get by without a gurudeva, I must ask...why? The

only answer can be ego.

Only someone with an agenda rooted in egotism would choose to struggle

in relative isolation, risking failure, when the presence of the

gurudeva in one's life makes the path so much easier, clearer, and

surer.

I know you have a beloved gurudeva. I know you have been blessed and

know the value of your spiritual guide. In our culture there is a

strong current of individualism despite the fact that we rely on

others for everything. The idea that our relationship with God is

ours alone, achieved alone, and maintained alone, is extreme. The

gurudeva is as important to our spiritual development as parents and

teachers are to our life in the world. The sat guru is a force of

nature. The Divine Teacher in human form. Jai Gurudeva!

Chris

Kelly Leeper <blissnout > wrote:

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

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[Guest guest]

To understand me is to know me. However I know not many here truely

understand me because they don't know me or my experience. Truely

there is no side to be taken here.

When God becomes the pimp and the Devotee a prositite then you have

what is called a co-dependant relationship as me and Brian have

discussed previously on the post if anyone remembers. Even my PGuru

has told me this.

To make assumptions that any devotee has not experienced Guru in it's

truest sense is plainly an assumption. Just because a person has

different experience doesn't mean they are living thru the ego and

Just because a person can speak in pretty poetic prose and use alot

of big words doesn't mean they are enlightened. We can make alot of

assumptions about devotee's but they are assumptions. I think it's

important to speak for ourselves and in your case Chris, speak for

yourself. Same for Jesse.... If you need a PGuru to get there then

that is how it will work for you.

To go into the details of my Physical Guru and my relationship and the

conversations we have had regarding my experiences and his validation

of what I have experienced is not neccessary. I think too often

devotee's assume that just because a person is on the path and ask

questions, that they have not had high experiences - There is a weird

belief that people who have high experiences have to know scripture

without reading it and all of a sudden know the whole sanskrit

language and all that. My Physical Guru knows what I have

experienced and he was upset that I didn't renounce the world to work

his cause, deeply upset that I didn't do it. Renouncing in outer form

is not my dharma right now and I don't think that is the only

expression of a person who has had experience with high states of

consciousness. To think that only people from the East experience

God directly is misthinking and to think the only true Guru's are

from the East is again,

misthinking.

I know some devotee's who will run after anyone eastern because they

assume they are knowers of Brahman. When I have been told by some of

these people directly, they are NOT knowers of Brahman BUT they will

let the devotee's think that becuase ultimately, it's the devotee's

experience that matters. If they see Guru in a half realized person,

then Guru will come thru that person for them. If the devotee is near

a Knower of Brahman, if they don't have the awareness or will to

surrender they won't 'get it' anyway. The responsibility lies with

the devotee and if the devotee 'gets it' then you can blame Ma or

Guru or God that it was their grace depending on the state of mind or

bhava at the moment.

To assume the only way a person can experience God is to have a PGuru

is not true. That is closed minded. Guru works in so many different

ways and this little piece of the pie we call a physical teacher is

only part of the puzzle and not the largest. When Buddha went on his

journey he learned from many people doing sadhana's. Were these

individuals he learned from enlightened? Nope. Guru was leading him

thru himself the whole time thru other individuals, but not ONE

person. My Guru initiated my on Buddha's birthday and it's been very

telling of how I approach my path and have in the past. All my

teachers were valid, but if they were enlightened or not, who cares.

The responsibilty lies with the devotee and their willingness to open

and see and experience the Divine. I have not been disappointed as

God/Maa works thru the Knowers of Brahman and those who are not

Knowers of Brahman. If I see Guru in these

people, plants, or higher beings, then I am the lucky one.

I am not a begger of God although I will place my self LOW for God so

that grace can come. To think the only reason why one does not

follow the normal expectation of how a 'good disciple' should be as

being Ego, its a quick and easy answer, but it's not based in Truth

either. Sounds like a good defence mechanism to justify codependance

with Guru and the transmission coming from a source outside of the

Devotee. There is nothing outside of you Folks. This is my

expierience - yes experience!

So for all these lovely and sincere devotee's all around the world, in

the jungles, in cities, in their homes, who have not had the

transference you are looking for and speaking of, their expeirence is

invalid eh? You question God's decision because it didn't 'fit' into

your mold of what things should 'look like'. Like I said before,

don't get stuck in appearances. Spiritual Materialism has never been

more rampant. The Ego loves spiritual materialism as it hides behind

it to Appear to be more than what it is. My path has always been

S i m p l e. Me and Maa and Maa coming thru the teachers. It's

nothing I'm seeking validation from superstitious people.

Now, on the flip side, there is nothing wrong with transmission from a

teacher if the teacher gives that to the student unconditionally.

What I see in most cases is the human element of the PGuru expecting

the disciple to give him their life - a very conditional love. I

will give you more transmission if you this or if you that. (pimping)

GOD does not work that way. That is conditional, that is the Ego and

from what I have seen, is a power trip do maipulate the devotee into

believing they have to appear how the Guru wants them to in order to

get grace. It's popular to get transmissions these days. We have

people with very low self esteme's running to get a transmission.

Once they get it they think they 'Have It' and then they flaunt it

like it's a possession and gives them some kind of credential to

stick on their website, like this transmission is going to attract

followers?

The only transmission I am interested in is one that comes from God

directly. If the Guru transmits it unconditionally, then they are

real. What a person does with it is up to them. And to all the

devotee's out there who have not had 'The Holy Transmission' keep

your faith, be simple and love God. Pay no attention to those who

are selling something.

Namaste,

Kelly

chris kirner <chriskirner1956 > wrote:

Dearest Kelly,

Please don't feel I'm ganging-up on you, but I'm afraid I have to

largely agree with Jesse this time.

Astraea was right when she said this is a very complex topic. I think

a lot of the problem with mutual understanding in this issue is the

same as I think Brian was having in his earlier discussions on the

psychology of spiritual living; it's a question of levels.

We all know we are Sat, Chit, Ananda. On that level, we are

all-knowing, all-powerful, ever blissful. The difficulty is that as

much as we cling to the idea of our true nature, we don't experience

ourselves that way (only in the most limited sense). In the same way

we imagine all the objects and attributes in creation to be ours by

right (and they are), but again, we find, when push comes to shove,

that we can't access them (or, again, only in a limited way).

Pandit Tigunait gave this example once, and I liked it: The Advaitan

may travel around the world giving lectures on the reality of our

nature as pure consciousness, but he still has to board a plane to

get to his next lecture.

Swami Rama used to write that a person first has parents who feed,

protect, and raise him; then he has teachers who teach him how to

live in the world, but after that comes the gurudeva, who introduces

him to himself. He also used to write that the purpose of the

external guru is to lead you to the guru within. Yet Swamiji was very

devoted to his gurudeva, by all accounts, and continued to be guided

by him, despite his own advanced state, until he dropped his body

(and likely after).

It is my belief that the Guru Gita is actually addressing the

universal gurudeva. This is not to exclude the individual gurudeva,

but rather points again to the problem of levels. Guru is everywhere,

but so is consciousness. If we can't access consciousness at the

highest levels, what makes us think we can access the universal

gurudeva? To do so we need an individual gurudeva.

Knowledge is available to anyone with the ability to retrieve it (or

so I am given to understand). How many of us would attempt to

practice medicine through attunement rather than go to a medical

school? Just so, to learn the path of spiritual knowledge we should

go to a gurudeva. The spiritual path is at least as difficult and

complex as medicine.

The gurudeva is part of the natural order. The child who is without a

family is called an orphan, and may grow-up wounded at heart. The

spiritual aspirant without a gurudeva often wanders aimlessly amongst

the shallows, never venturing out into the depths. Only the gurudeva

can lead the student through the veils of fear and confusion for he

has gone before and knows the way.

The gurudeva isn't alone. She is one in a long chain of guides

stretching back to the beginning. She is a custodian of the stream of

knowledge that flows from that source in its subtle form as shakti. In

bestowing diksha, she bestows that shakti.

The grace of god is said to flow equally to all. Some are able to

accept it, some are not. According to Pandit Tigunait, once an

aspirant is initiated the forces of nature, the various shaktis,

recognize him. Mantras become potent, with their innate shaktis

responding to the flow of shakti from the tradition, manifesting

through the student. Having been initiated yourself, you should

recognize this.

It is true that some rise to great heights without a gurudeva. In the

Christian tradition there have always been saints who did not (or at

least seemed not to) have a gurudeva. Many however, became unbalanced

from their practices, and their superstitions, hallucinating all

manner of demons and other things. Many other Christian monks, I

believe, simply didn't get very far because they lacked the necessary

guidance and spiritual force.

Particularly in the path of bhakti, one can get by without a gurudeva.

There are many sages, I think, whose duty and joy it is to help such

people (as I have been) in secret. Still, I think their help is

limited by the capacities of the aspirant, who may not be able to

perceive or fully utilize aid given on a subtle level. But, though

one may be able to get by without a gurudeva, I must ask...why? The

only answer can be ego.

Only someone with an agenda rooted in egotism would choose to struggle

in relative isolation, risking failure, when the presence of the

gurudeva in one's life makes the path so much easier, clearer, and

surer.

I know you have a beloved gurudeva. I know you have been blessed and

know the value of your spiritual guide. In our culture there is a

strong current of individualism despite the fact that we rely on

others for everything. The idea that our relationship with God is

ours alone, achieved alone, and maintained alone, is extreme. The

gurudeva is as important to our spiritual development as parents and

teachers are to our life in the world. The sat guru is a force of

nature. The Divine Teacher in human form. Jai Gurudeva!

Chris

Kelly Leeper <blissnout > wrote:

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

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[Guest guest]

Namaste,

The Devi Mandir's Saraswati "booklet" is an actual puja -- just for

beginners. You can adapt the different mantras in that book and

expand your puja as big as you like. Also the Cosmic Puja touches

each of these Goddesses in individual pujas. Try that out!

 

Gauri

, "rudran2" <stechiekov>

wrote:

> Laksmi is a vital componet in the composition of Durga. There are

> various chapters within the Chandi dedicated to Laksmi. Laksmi

> carries things forward and also brings things to completion.

>

> I am sorry, but I know very little of Saraswati. I do have a fine

> murti to her. I might have to wait for the Devi Mandir to publish

a

> Saraswati Puja. Short of this I might purchase the DM's little

> Sarawati booklet for children. That way I should be able to glean

> some knowledge of her.

>

> , "jesuisdurga"

<jesuisdurga>

> wrote:

> > Can someone explain what is special about Laksmi or Sarasvati -

I

> bow

> > to all Gods and Goddesses - but quite honestly I think they dont

> have

> > the dash of Durga or the sheer power or Kali.

> >

> > Durga Mata Ki Jai !

> >

> > , "rudran2" <stechiekov>

> wrote:

> > > I too had a good time doing Laksmi Puja yesterday twice. I

wrote

> > down

> > > stuff on my note to Devi and at least one of them seems to be

> > already

> > > well underway. This shows that Laksmi moves her pujaries

toward

> the

> > > fulfillment of their goals not unlike an arrow moving rapidly

> > through

> > > the air. Persistance on our own part helps too. I am not sure

> what

> > > the Goddess has to do, but I certainly most continue my

> practices.

> > >

> > > , "nandu_108"

<n_mallan>

> > wrote:

> > > > I wrote down my goals and gave it to Mother Lakshmi. Now I

am

> all

> > > set

> > > > to recieve Her blessing in this new creation of Hers, even

if

> She

> > > > doesn't give me what I want, She has to give me something,

> since

> > I

> > > > have asked for Her guidance and help. My Pranams to everyone!

[Guest guest]

Dear Kelly,

Please forgive me. I did not intend to belittle your experience.

ChrisKelly Leeper <blissnout > wrote:

Chris,

To understand me is to know me. However I know not many here truely

understand me because they don't know me or my experience. Truely

there is no side to be taken here.

When God becomes the pimp and the Devotee a prositite then you have

what is called a co-dependant relationship as me and Brian have

discussed previously on the post if anyone remembers. Even my PGuru

has told me this.

To make assumptions that any devotee has not experienced Guru in it's

truest sense is plainly an assumption. Just because a person has

different experience doesn't mean they are living thru the ego and

Just because a person can speak in pretty poetic prose and use alot

of big words doesn't mean they are enlightened. We can make alot of

assumptions about devotee's but they are assumptions. I think it's

important to speak for ourselves and in your case Chris, speak for

yourself. Same for Jesse.... If you need a PGuru to get there then

that is how it will work for you.

To go into the details of my Physical Guru and my relationship and the

conversations we have had regarding my experiences and his validation

of what I have experienced is not neccessary. I think too often

devotee's assume that just because a person is on the path and ask

questions, that they have not had high experiences - There is a weird

belief that people who have high experiences have to know scripture

without reading it and all of a sudden know the whole sanskrit

language and all that. My Physical Guru knows what I have

experienced and he was upset that I didn't renounce the world to work

his cause, deeply upset that I didn't do it. Renouncing in outer form

is not my dharma right now and I don't think that is the only

expression of a person who has had experience with high states of

consciousness. To think that only people from the East experience

God directly is misthinking and to think the only true Guru's are

from the East is again,

misthinking.

I know some devotee's who will run after anyone eastern because they

assume they are knowers of Brahman. When I have been told by some of

these people directly, they are NOT knowers of Brahman BUT they will

let the devotee's think that becuase ultimately, it's the devotee's

experience that matters. If they see Guru in a half realized person,

then Guru will come thru that person for them. If the devotee is near

a Knower of Brahman, if they don't have the awareness or will to

surrender they won't 'get it' anyway. The responsibility lies with

the devotee and if the devotee 'gets it' then you can blame Ma or

Guru or God that it was their grace depending on the state of mind or

bhava at the moment.

To assume the only way a person can experience God is to have a PGuru

is not true. That is closed minded. Guru works in so many different

ways and this little piece of the pie we call a physical teacher is

only part of the puzzle and not the largest. When Buddha went on his

journey he learned from many people doing sadhana's. Were these

individuals he learned from enlightened? Nope. Guru was leading him

thru himself the whole time thru other individuals, but not ONE

person. My Guru initiated my on Buddha's birthday and it's been very

telling of how I approach my path and have in the past. All my

teachers were valid, but if they were enlightened or not, who cares.

The responsibilty lies with the devotee and their willingness to open

and see and experience the Divine. I have not been disappointed as

God/Maa works thru the Knowers of Brahman and those who are not

Knowers of Brahman. If I see Guru in these

people, plants, or higher beings, then I am the lucky one.

I am not a begger of God although I will place my self LOW for God so

that grace can come. To think the only reason why one does not

follow the normal expectation of how a 'good disciple' should be as

being Ego, its a quick and easy answer, but it's not based in Truth

either. Sounds like a good defence mechanism to justify codependance

with Guru and the transmission coming from a source outside of the

Devotee. There is nothing outside of you Folks. This is my

expierience - yes experience!

So for all these lovely and sincere devotee's all around the world, in

the jungles, in cities, in their homes, who have not had the

transference you are looking for and speaking of, their expeirence is

invalid eh? You question God's decision because it didn't 'fit' into

your mold of what things should 'look like'. Like I said before,

don't get stuck in appearances. Spiritual Materialism has never been

more rampant. The Ego loves spiritual materialism as it hides behind

it to Appear to be more than what it is. My path has always been

S i m p l e. Me and Maa and Maa coming thru the teachers. It's

nothing I'm seeking validation from superstitious people.

Now, on the flip side, there is nothing wrong with transmission from a

teacher if the teacher gives that to the student unconditionally.

What I see in most cases is the human element of the PGuru expecting

the disciple to give him their life - a very conditional love. I

will give you more transmission if you this or if you that. (pimping)

GOD does not work that way. That is conditional, that is the Ego and

from what I have seen, is a power trip do maipulate the devotee into

believing they have to appear how the Guru wants them to in order to

get grace. It's popular to get transmissions these days. We have

people with very low self esteme's running to get a transmission.

Once they get it they think they 'Have It' and then they flaunt it

like it's a possession and gives them some kind of credential to

stick on their website, like this transmission is going to attract

followers?

The only transmission I am interested in is one that comes from God

directly. If the Guru transmits it unconditionally, then they are

real. What a person does with it is up to them. And to all the

devotee's out there who have not had 'The Holy Transmission' keep

your faith, be simple and love God. Pay no attention to those who

are selling something.

Namaste,

Kelly

chris kirner <chriskirner1956 > wrote:

Dearest Kelly,

Please don't feel I'm ganging-up on you, but I'm afraid I have to

largely agree with Jesse this time.

Astraea was right when she said this is a very complex topic. I think

a lot of the problem with mutual understanding in this issue is the

same as I think Brian was having in his earlier discussions on the

psychology of spiritual living; it's a question of levels.

We all know we are Sat, Chit, Ananda. On that level, we are

all-knowing, all-powerful, ever blissful. The difficulty is that as

much as we cling to the idea of our true nature, we don't experience

ourselves that way (only in the most limited sense). In the same way

we imagine all the objects and attributes in creation to be ours by

right (and they are), but again, we find, when push comes to shove,

that we can't access them (or, again, only in a limited way).

Pandit Tigunait gave this example once, and I liked it: The Advaitan

may travel around the world giving lectures on the reality of our

nature as pure consciousness, but he still has to board a plane to

get to his next lecture.

Swami Rama used to write that a person first has parents who feed,

protect, and raise him; then he has teachers who teach him how to

live in the world, but after that comes the gurudeva, who introduces

him to himself. He also used to write that the purpose of the

external guru is to lead you to the guru within. Yet Swamiji was very

devoted to his gurudeva, by all accounts, and continued to be guided

by him, despite his own advanced state, until he dropped his body

(and likely after).

It is my belief that the Guru Gita is actually addressing the

universal gurudeva. This is not to exclude the individual gurudeva,

but rather points again to the problem of levels. Guru is everywhere,

but so is consciousness. If we can't access consciousness at the

highest levels, what makes us think we can access the universal

gurudeva? To do so we need an individual gurudeva.

Knowledge is available to anyone with the ability to retrieve it (or

so I am given to understand). How many of us would attempt to

practice medicine through attunement rather than go to a medical

school? Just so, to learn the path of spiritual knowledge we should

go to a gurudeva. The spiritual path is at least as difficult and

complex as medicine.

The gurudeva is part of the natural order. The child who is without a

family is called an orphan, and may grow-up wounded at heart. The

spiritual aspirant without a gurudeva often wanders aimlessly amongst

the shallows, never venturing out into the depths. Only the gurudeva

can lead the student through the veils of fear and confusion for he

has gone before and knows the way.

The gurudeva isn't alone. She is one in a long chain of guides

stretching back to the beginning. She is a custodian of the stream of

knowledge that flows from that source in its subtle form as shakti. In

bestowing diksha, she bestows that shakti.

The grace of god is said to flow equally to all. Some are able to

accept it, some are not. According to Pandit Tigunait, once an

aspirant is initiated the forces of nature, the various shaktis,

recognize him. Mantras become potent, with their innate shaktis

responding to the flow of shakti from the tradition, manifesting

through the student. Having been initiated yourself, you should

recognize this.

It is true that some rise to great heights without a gurudeva. In the

Christian tradition there have always been saints who did not (or at

least seemed not to) have a gurudeva. Many however, became unbalanced

from their practices, and their superstitions, hallucinating all

manner of demons and other things. Many other Christian monks, I

believe, simply didn't get very far because they lacked the necessary

guidance and spiritual force.

Particularly in the path of bhakti, one can get by without a gurudeva.

There are many sages, I think, whose duty and joy it is to help such

people (as I have been) in secret. Still, I think their help is

limited by the capacities of the aspirant, who may not be able to

perceive or fully utilize aid given on a subtle level. But, though

one may be able to get by without a gurudeva, I must ask...why? The

only answer can be ego.

Only someone with an agenda rooted in egotism would choose to struggle

in relative isolation, risking failure, when the presence of the

gurudeva in one's life makes the path so much easier, clearer, and

surer.

I know you have a beloved gurudeva. I know you have been blessed and

know the value of your spiritual guide. In our culture there is a

strong current of individualism despite the fact that we rely on

others for everything. The idea that our relationship with God is

ours alone, achieved alone, and maintained alone, is extreme. The

gurudeva is as important to our spiritual development as parents and

teachers are to our life in the world. The sat guru is a force of

nature. The Divine Teacher in human form. Jai Gurudeva!

Chris

Kelly Leeper <blissnout > wrote:

Jesse,

Without the blessings of a teacher what path is there? Surely you

didn't mean that. There are those that are without a direct teacher

who are divinly guided and they are not as rare as you think.

However in realizing how the mind works, if a Teacher for you is the

only way to be on a Path, then that is what will work for you.

I mean this in the nicest of ways, but that statement would only be

true for you or those who have bought into the idea that they are

separate and lost without a teacher which can be a crutch and a

fetter. Where is your faith in humanity and Oneness? Does that only

come with the package of a teacher? Doesn't that go against the

teachings? From my experience, we are more connected than you think

to what is divine or what that statement proclaims.

Jesse, we ARE the path and when one 'gets that' they aren't looking

for a transmission to come from another unless they see Guru thru

another and that doesn't even have to be a person. To rely on a

transmission of a teacher is likened to a prostitute going to her

pimp for her sustanance. That is not what God intended. I'm not

saying that transmissions are invalid or that Guru is not neccessary

or that Guru is a pimp, what I am saying is that the Initiatory

process is so much more than what you envision.

I pray for you to open your mind and heart. Maybe that is not what

you meant, but surely that is not the Will of the divine Mother in

more cases than not.

Namste,

KellyJesse Arana <jessearana (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Namaste Swamiji,

The Lalitopakhyanam translation came from www.dattapeetham.org. I am not sure how it was manifested.

I didn't mean that Sri Vidya was the only way. I meant that if a

student wants to pursue direct sadhanas of a particular path, they

need a teacher. Otherwise the student is bound to approach the path

under the influence of the three Gunas and their individual vasanas

and karmas. The worst being the notion of separate self. Since we are

trapped in that vasana, we turn our sadhana into mental conception.

The initiatory process, in which we receive a direct spiritual

transmission is what frees us of that.

Without the blessings of the teacher what path is there?

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

Saradananda

[saradananda (AT) yoga-vidya (DOT) de] Saturday, October 11, 2003

11:11 AMSubject: Re: Re:

Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

OM Hrim Maha Lakshmai NamahLoving greetings - and many thanks for

sending the beautiful Lalitopakhyana. One question: at the top of the

document, it says "Avadhoota Datta Peetam - Mysore". Is this a

transcript of a series of talks that someone gave? or a direct

translation of the scripture?I also appreciated your comments on the

oneness of Lakshmi, Durga and Saraswati. However, I wouldn't agree

"the only way to understand that oneness is to be initiated into Sri

Vidya, or a similar spiritual transmission." All paths of yoga -

bhakti yoga, raja yoga, jnana yoga, karma yoga and even hatha yoga -

have as their goal the understanding (experience) of Oneness. These

different paths of yoga are suited for different people with

different personalities - each offers techniques to experience the

Oneness. And each of them works, if practiced diligently.

with OM and Prem

Swami Saradananda

www.FlyingMountainYoga.org/2004yatra/southindiayatra2004.html

-

Jesse Arana

Saturday, October 11, 2003 8:52 AM

RE: Re: Lakshmi Puja update(new creation)

Namaste,

Lakshmi, Durga, and Saraswati are one. Navaratri is the celebration of

that oneness. As far as I know, the only way to understand that

oneness is to be initiated into Sri Vidya, or a similar spiritual

transmission. In the Sri Vidya transmission of my Guru, Karunamayi,

the Jewel of the Three (Worlds) is known as Lalita Tripurasundari.

Lakshmi, Saraswati, and Durga are several of Her primary expansions.

Durga and Kali are considered the one, as well. However, Lakshmi also

has a Warrior aspect, as she is the slayer of Kholasura. Lalita

Tripurasundari takes birth as Lakshmi when She creates all the

universes, as is told about in the Lalitopakhyana (attached).

One important reason to contemplate the three is their relationship to

the three Gunas. Saraswati is the wife of Brahma, so she rules the

power of transcendent wisdom in Raja Guna. Durga is the wife of

Shiva, and she rules the transcendent power to transform Tamo Guna.

And Lakshmi is the wife of Vishnu... ruling the Sattva Guna. So

yogically, it's important to invite each goddess to transform your

mind, which is a slave to the three Gunas, and bound by the

interactions of subtle karmas.

There is a lot more. Most important is to understand that neither of

these Goddesses can be realized without direct spiritual

transmission.

Jesse Arana (Kailash)

www.meditationinfocus.com

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the To from this

group, send an email to:Your

use of is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

The New with improved product search

To from this group, send an email

to:Your use of

is subject to the

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to:Your use of

is subject to the

 

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