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Vishnu or Shiva as per Vedas?

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The link given by jndas is quiet informative. I learn a few things there, plz do have a look.


I was a bit disturb above the classification of the puranas (i.e sattvika,rajasika and tamasika),but now it a bit more clear in my mind, specially after learning that Lord Shiva himself who defined this classification.


The bhagavata, is said to give the highest religious principles. The skanda purana also glorifies the bhagavata purana.


I still have a question though. If the vedas refered a lot to "Indra" as supreme (as some members here have pointed out) why he is not really mentioned in the puranas? The puranas is after all the explanatory version of the vedas.


Hari bol




well, maybe he is but the Purana is now lost to time. You never know! Because of this, the question becomes speculative at best...

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Could the indra mentioned be, the King of heaven (Supreme personality) instead of the 'actual' indra (King of heaven in the material domain)?

Well I suppose Advaitists would refer to Indra as a attribute or quality of Brahman, described as the king of heaven, or the manifestation of God through lightning.

But if you take it literally, then it is referring to the god Indra as we know in later scriptures like Mahabharata, where he has a lesser position and is below Krishna (Visnu) who is the supreme God. The Vedas talk of the mighty deeds of Indra who slew the dragon on the mountain, that released the waters.

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I will have to have a look at Kurma Purana, though the above is in line with what Jiva Gosami says in Tattva Sandarbha, as well as many other general references in the Puranas that state number of verses for various texts that are much higher than those found today. Similarly there are countless books mentioned in the Puranas that deal with particular sciences that dont exist today.

From my copy of tattva sandharba i've got the following translation

12) tatra ca vedasabdasya samprati dusparatvad duradhigamarthatvac ca tadarthanirnayakanam muninam api parasparavirodhad vedaru

po vedarthanirnayakas cetihasapuranatmakah sabda eva vicaraniyah / tatra ca yo va vedasabdo natmaviditah so pi taddrstyanumeya eveti samprati tasvaiva pramotpakatvam sthitam / tathahi mahabharate manaviye ca itihasapuranabhyam vedam samupabrmhayed iti puranat puranam iti canyatra / na cavedena vedasya brmhanam sambhavati na hy aparipurnasya kanakavalayasya trapuna puranam yujyate / nanu yadi vedasabdah puranam itihasam copadatte tarthi puranam anyad anvesaniyam / yadi tu na na tarhitihasapuranayor abhedo vedena / acyate visistaikarthapratipadakapadakadambasyapauruseyatvad abhede 'pi svarakramabhedad bhedanirdeso py upapadyate / rgadibhih saman anayor apauruseyatvenabhedo madhyandinasrutav eva vyajyata evam va are 'sya mahato bhutasya nihsvasitam etad yad rgvedo yajurvedah samavedo 'tharvangirasa itihasah puranam ityadina //

"And here, since the Vedas are at present difficult to go through completely (due to unavailability of complete text and decrease in human memory) and hard to comprehend-for even the sages who sought to ascertain their meaning contradict one another-we will examine sabda in the form of Itihasa and Puranas alone, both of which partake of the nature of Vedas, and serve to ascertain the meaning of the Vedas. Furthermore, those portions of the Vedas which are not known on their own can only be inferred by examining Itihasa and Puranas. For these reasons, it is evident that in the present age, Itihasa and Puranas are alone capable of generating true knowledge.

Thus we find in the Mahabharata and Manu Smriti, "One should supplement the Vedas with Itihasa and Puranas" (M.Bh.,Adiparvan 1/267); and elsewhere," 'Purana'is so called because it completes (purana)." For just as a chipped gold bracelet cannot be filled with lead, so also the Vedas cannot be supplemented by something non-vedic.

But then, if we accept Itihasa and Purana as Vedas, won't we have to look for a seperate book called Purana. Otherwise, Itihasa and Puranas will be considered identical with the Vedas.

To this we reply, even though this cluster of verses (Vedas, Puranas & Itihasas), all of which propound the same specific view, admits of no distinction, insofar as all the verses have emnated from Lord, still a distinction can be made in terms of word order and accent. The identity if Itihasa and Puranas with the Rgveda etc., with respect to their transcendental origin, is expressed in the Madhyandina Sruti itself: "...in the same way, my dear, what is know as the Rigveda, Yajurveda, Samaveda, Atharvaveda, Itihasa, Purana...has been breathed forth from that Supreme Lord" (Br.U. 2/4/10)".

It looks like the incomplete aspect has been added and not from the verse as it is given in brackets, I could be wrong on that.

The next verse points to the fact that bramhaloka has many more verses

13) ata eva skandaprabhasakhande

pura tapas cacarogram amaranam pitamahah /

avirbhutas tato vedah sasadangapadakramah //

tatah puranam akhilam sarvasastramayam dhruvam /

nityasabdamayam punyam satakotipravistaram /

nirgatam brahmano vaktrat tasya bhedan nibodhata //

brahmam puranam prathamam ityadi /

atra satakotisankhya brahmaloke prasiddheti tathoktam /

/trtiyaskandhe ca

rgyajuhsamatharvakhyan vedan purvadibhir mukhaih /


itihasapuranani pancamam vedam isvarah /

sarvebhya eva vaktrebhyah sasrje sarvadarsanah // iti /

api catra saksad eva vedasabdah prayuktah puranetihasayoh /

anyatra ca

puranam pancamo vedah /

itihasah puranam ca pancamo veda ucyate /

vedan adhyapayamasa mahabharatapancaman // ityadau

anyatha vedan ityadav api pancamatvam navakalpyeta samana-

jatiyanivesitatvat sankhyayah / bhavisyapurane

karsnam ca pancamam vedam yan mahabharatam smrtam /

iti / tatha ca samakauthumiyasakhayam chandogyopanisadi ca

rfvedam bhagavo 'dhyemi yajurvedam samavedam

atharvanam caturtham itihasam puranam pancamam

vedanam vedam ityadi / ata eva asya mahato bhutasya

ityadav itihasapuranayos caturnam evantarbhutatvakal-

panaya prasiddhapratyakhyanam nirastam / tad uktam

brahmam puranam prathamam ityadi //

"Therefore, it is stated in the Prabhasa Khanda of the Skanda Purana; "In ancient times, Brahma, the grandsire of the demigods, practiced severe austerities. As a result, the Vedas became manifest along with the six auxilliary branches and the pada and krama texts. Then the entire Purana, the embodiment of all the scriptures, unchanging, composed of the eternal sabda, sacred, and consisting of a hundred crores (of verses) issued forth from Brahma's mouth. Listen to the different divisions of that (Purana): the Brahma Purana is first..." (Sk.P. 2/3-5) The figure "a hundred crores" is mentioned here since that is known to be the number (of verses) which exist in Brahmaloka. And in the third skandha (of the Bhagavata): "He manifested the four Vedas, known as Rk, Yajus, Saman, and Atharvan, one after the other, from his four mouths, beginning with the one facing east." (Bh. P. 3/12/37) And in the same context:"Then, the all-seeing Lord manifested Itihasa and Puranas, the fifth Veda, from all of his mouths." (Bh. P.3/12/39) And here, the actual word "Veda" is used with reference to Itihasa and Puranas. Elsewhere we find:"The Purana is the fifth Veda;Itihasa and Puranas are said to be the fifth Veda;" (Bh. P.1/4/20) "He taught the vedas, with the Mahabharata as the fifth" (M.Bh., Moksadharma 340/11) etc.

If it were not the case (that Itihasa and Puranas are Vedic in nature), then the characterization of then as the "fifth" in the preceding verses would be unwarranted, since only things of the same kind can be combined to form a single sum. It is stated in the Bhavisya Purana: "That which is known as the Mahabharata is Krsna Dvaipayana's (i.e. Vyasa's) fifth Veda" We also find in the Chandogya Upanisad of the Kauthumiya Sakha:"Sir, I have learned the Rgveda, the Yajurveda, the Samaveda, and the fourth, or Atharvaveda, as well as Itihasa and Purana, the fifth Veda among the Vedas" (Ch. U.7/1/2) Thus is refuted the well-known to be deleted belief that the terms, Itihasa and Purana, occurring in Br.U.2/4/10 refer merely to be deleted portions of the four Vedas themselves. Therefore it is stated," The Brahma Purana is first..."

Im sure some of the sciences may have dissappered but it seems it may be possible the figure of only 6% of what vyas wrote is a bit of an exaggeration using the kurma purana verse. It may be true we have very limited knowledge compared to brahmaloka, but 6% of what vyas gave us is different. I dont see where jiva goswami is making that claim. I also dont see prabhupada saying this probably more often saying the contarary that most of it is there.


The person who I heard this from hasnt got many years of sanskrit knowledge and could be incorrect but would be nice if someone with more access and knowledge can have a look at it.

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i think hindus r busy in making partitions between themselves.we should be shy for that.always trying to think weather shiva great or vishnu great.what bullshit?no such difference anywhere.vedas never told. vedas used various names at various places but they always tell about only one god.we call him as shiva, we call him as vishnu, we call him as bramha.GOD---G-generator,O-organiser,D- destroyer. when all this become one we will get GOD.dont let ur minds buried on silly,vulgar things.hindus have to vomit out the buried norrowness from their minds.these half knowledged persons should die from nation.these people r more dangerous than pakisthanee terrorists. my friens be aware of such persons who create differences among shiva and vishnu. these people r getting funds from pakisthan to create differences among hindus.dont beleave their words. they r pakka fundamentalistic muslims acting as hindus.

this has existed for thousands of years (vishnu Vs. Shiva), doubt its going to go any time soon.

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Good question. Although many Vaishnavas or Shaivites here won't like to hear it, the truth is that Shiva is not mentioned in the Vedas as a god, but as a word meaning auspicious, but the deity for destruction - Rudra is mentioned. Vishnu is mentioned, but is a minor deity in the Vedas as is Brahma (Prajapati). Many Vaishnava and Shaivite sects don't really teach the Vedas, but teach the Puranas, Itihasa and Agamas.

The 'main' God of the Vedas is actually Indra, who became a minor god later in Vaishnavite and Shaivite traditions. Some believe that not only Rudra but Indra also was combined into the Shiva of later Hinduism, as auspiciousness (shiva) is a quality of Indra.

The Question is " What do the vedas say?" tHEY DO SAY something and that is what we will like to hear. Some vaishnava acaryas(Vishvanath Cakravati ) have said that Shiva is a Vishnu expansion.

In Caitanya Bhagavat it is said that when Lord Nityananda Prabhu visited Vishnu-Kanchi and Shiva Kanchi this controversy was going on at a much higher level. It was actually a violent quarrel. What did he do? He simply laughed very loudly and went on his way. Lord Caitanya acted identically. It is stated in some puranas that vaishnavas who criticise Lord Shiva and Shivaites who criticise Lord Vishnu are both offenders.

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Radhe Krishna,

A few corrections.

The name of lord shiva is clearly mentioned in Yajur Veda. In the middle of Shri Rudram you would find the verse "Nama Shivayacha".

Shri Veda Vyasa only compiled and divided the vedas for the purpose of proper implementation of the same in performance of yagyas. Every major yagya is performed with scholar from all the three vedas each one of them having separate roles in the performance of yagyas.

about a 100 shakas (Branches) of yajur veda only one is available now. of about 1000 shakas of sama veda only 3 is availablel now. about a 100 and odd shakas of rig veda only 1 is available now.

Veda vyasa did not compose the vedas but compiled them.

A clear study of vedas would reveal that not only shiva,

but Shiva, Vishnu, Ganesha, Surya, Shakthi all of them find repetitive references in vedas.

Regarding puranas - in Every purana, (puranas written as per purana lakshanas all of which should be available in every purana - one among them is shrishti varnana - how the universe and living beings are created) - there are details about the creation

All the puranas composed by veda vyasa who is an incarnation of lord vishnu.

It is said that

"Vyasaya vishnu roopaya vyasa rupaya vishnave"

From the puranas composed by Veda Vyasa - depending upon the purana one takes for interpretation - one can comfortably argue that Shiva or Vishnu or Ganesha or Surya or Shakthi or Even Skanda has created the world and all the deities including those other than the main deity of the purana.

In shiva purana it is shiva who has created everything including lord vishnu

In Vishnu Purana it is lord vishnu who has created eveerything including lord shiva

likewse it goes.

So who created whom is rather a matter of interpretation and depends upon the tool of interpretation.

In the very beginning, one friend unknowingly included even Bhagavath gita among puranas which is utterly wrong.

Radhe Krishna

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  • 6 years later...

"Sa brahma sa Shiva sa Hari sendra sokshara parmas swarat" This is wat purusha suktham says, which means brama Vishnu shiva and indra combined undivided force is purusha. When its divided by perception then would keep name and roopa differently. Until roopa is there then will have differences only when the difference goes off then the true existence of course purusha.

Good question. Although many Vaishnavas or Shaivites here won't like to hear it, the truth is that Shiva is not mentioned in the Vedas as a god, but as a word meaning auspicious, but the deity for destruction - Rudra is mentioned. Vishnu is mentioned, but is a minor deity in the Vedas as is Brahma (Prajapati). Many Vaishnava and Shaivite sects don't really teach the Vedas, but teach the Puranas, Itihasa and Agamas.

The 'main' God of the Vedas is actually Indra, who became a minor god later in Vaishnavite and Shaivite traditions. Some believe that not only Rudra but Indra also was combined into the Shiva of later Hinduism, as auspiciousness (shiva) is a quality of Indra.

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  • 1 year later...

All the Vedas and BHAGAVATHAM confirm that LORD KRISHNA IS GOD...even LORD KRISHNA himself says that..HE IS SUPERIOR TO ALL and NO ONE IS EQUAL OR GREATER TO HIM....Moreover..LORD SHIVA NEVER SAID THAT HE IS GOD...Not only..lord shiva..no one except LORD KRISHNA said that they are god...We can clearly conclude that LORD KRISHNA is only controller of everything...

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All the Vedas and BHAGAVATHAM confirm that LORD KRISHNA IS GOD...even LORD KRISHNA himself says that..HE IS SUPERIOR TO ALL and NO ONE IS EQUAL OR GREATER TO HIM....Moreover..LORD SHIVA NEVER SAID THAT HE IS GOD...Not only..lord shiva..no one except LORD KRISHNA said that they are god...We can clearly conclude that LORD KRISHNA is only controller of everything...


Hare Krishna Prabhu ,


You are saying this as if you have read all puranas and veda. Have you read veda ? Have you read bhagavata purana ? Have you read shiva purana ?


Veda vyasa was the sage who wrote all puranas wherein he stated both shiva and vishnu as supreme gods . Both vishnu and shiva are non-different . According to bhagavata purana , ramayana and varaha purana , those who sees difference between shiva and vishnu never attain vishnu or shiva.


In bhagavata purana too , shiva and vishnu both are mentioned as supreme gods and of the form of parabramhan .


Now I am going to show how shiva is supreme according to Bhagavata Purana :


Taking refuge in Lord Shiva, the saviour


SB 8.7.19: O King, when that uncontrollable poison was forcefully spreading up and down in all directions, all the demigods, along with the Lord Himself, approached Lord Śiva [sadāśiva]. Feeling unsheltered and very much afraid, they sought shelter of him.


SB 8.7.20: The demigods observed Lord Śiva sitting on the summit of Kailāsa Hill with his wife, Bhavānī, for the auspicious development of the three worlds. He was being worshiped by great saintly persons desiring liberation. The demigods offered him their obeisances and prayers with great respect.


SB 8.7.21: The prajāpatis said: O , Mahādeva, Supersoul of all living entities and cause of their happiness and prosperity, we have come to the shelter of your lotus feet. Now please save us from this fiery poison, which is spreading all over the three worlds.


Shiva, the creator


SB 8.7.22: O lord, you are the cause of bondage and liberation of the entire universe because you are its ruler. Those who are advanced in spiritual consciousness surrender unto you, and therefore you are the cause of mitigating their distresses, and you are also the cause of their liberation. We therefore worship Your Lordship.



SB 8.7.23: O lord, you are self-effulgent and supreme. You create this material world by your personal energy, and you assume the names Brahmā, Viṣṇu and Maheśvara when you act in creation, maintenance and annihilation.

SB 8.7.24: You are the cause of all causes, the self-effulgent, inconceivable, Brahman, which is originally Parabrahman. You manifest various potencies in this cosmic manifestation.


Shiva as source of OM


SB 8.7.25: O lord, you are the original source of Vedic literature. You are the original cause of material creation, the life force, the senses, the five elements, the three modes and the mahat-tattva. You are eternal time, determination and the two religious systems called truth [satya] and truthfulness [ṛta]. You are the shelter of the syllable oḿ, which consists of three letters a-u-m.


Universe is inside Shiva


SB 8.7.26: O father of all planets, learned scholars know that fire is your mouth, the surface of the globe is your lotus feet, eternal time is your movement, all the directions are your ears, and Varuṇa, master of the waters, is your tongue.


Shiva Stuti


SB 8.7.27: O lord, the sky is your navel, the air is your breathing, the sun is your eyes, and the water is your semen. You are the shelter of all kinds of living entities, high and low. The god of the moon is your mind, and the upper planetary system is your head.


SB 8.7.28: O lord, you are the three Vedas personified. The seven seas are your abdomen, and the mountains are your bones. All drugs, creepers and vegetables are the hairs on your body, the Vedic mantras like Gāyatrī are the seven layers of your body, and the Vedic religious system is the core of your heart.


SB 8.7.29: O lord, the five important Vedic mantras are represented by your five faces, from which the thirty-eight most celebrated Vedic mantras have been generated. Your Lordship, being celebrated as Lord Śiva, is self-illuminated. You are directly situated as the supreme truth, known as Paramātmā.


SB 8.7.30: O lord, your shadow is seen in irreligion, which brings about varieties of irreligious creations. The three modes of nature — goodness, passion and ignorance — are your three eyes. All the Vedic literatures, which are full of verses, are emanations from you because their compilers wrote the various scriptures after receiving your glance.


Shiva, the Brahman


SB 8.7.31: O Lord Girīśa, since the  Brahman  is transcendental to the material modes of goodness, passion and ignorance, the various directors of this material world certainly cannot appreciate it or even know where it is. It is not understandable even to Lord Brahmā, Lord Viṣṇu or the King of heaven, Mahendra.


Shiva, The destroyer


SB 8.7.32: When annihilation is performed by the flames and sparks emanating from your eyes, the entire creation is burned to ashes. Nonetheless, you do not know how this happens. What then is to be said of your destroying the Dakṣa-yaj�a, Tripurāsura and the kālakūṭa poison? Such activities cannot be subject matters for prayers offered to you.


Shiva Stuti


SB 8.7.33: Exalted, self-satisfied persons who preach to the entire world think of your lotus feet constantly within their hearts. However, when persons who do not know your austerity see you moving with Umā, they misunderstand you to be lusty, or when they see you wandering in the crematorium they mistakenly think that you are ferocious and envious. Certainly they are shameless. They cannot understand your activities.


SB 8.7.34: Even personalities like Lord Brahmā and other demigods cannot understand your position, for you are beyond the moving and nonmoving creation. Since no one can understand you in truth, how can one offer you prayers? It is impossible. As far as we are concerned, we are creatures of Lord Brahmā's creation. Under the circumstances, therefore, we cannot offer you adequate prayers, but as far as our ability allows, we have expressed our feelings.


SB 8.7.35: O greatest of all rulers, your actual identity is impossible for us to understand. As far as we can see, your presence brings flourishing happiness to everyone. Beyond this, no one can appreciate your activities. We can see this much, and nothing more.


SB 8.7.36: Śrīla Śukadeva Gosvāmī continued: Lord Śiva is always benevolent toward all living entities. When he saw that the living entities were very much disturbed by the poison, which was spreading everywhere, he was very compassionate. Thus he spoke to his eternal consort, Satī, as follows.


SB 8.7.37: Lord Śiva said: My dear Bhavānī, just see how all these living entities have been placed in danger because of the poison produced from the churning of the ocean of milk.


SB 8.7.38: It is my duty to give protection and safety to all living entities struggling for existence. Certainly it is the duty of the master to protect his suffering dependents.


SB 8.7.39: People in general, being bewildered by the illusory energy, are always engaged in animosity toward one another. But devotees, even at the risk of their own temporary lives, try to save them.


SB 8.7.40: My dear gentle wife Bhavānī, when one performs benevolent activities for others, Hari, is very pleased. And when the Lord is pleased, I am also pleased, along with all other living creatures. Therefore, let me drink this poison, for all the living entities may thus become happy because of me.


SB 8.7.41: Śrīla Śukadeva Gosvāmī continued: After informing Bhavānī in this way, Lord Śiva began to drink the poison, and Bhavānī, who knew perfectly well the capabilities of Lord Śiva, gave him her permission to do so.


SB 8.7.42: Thereafter, Lord Śiva, who is dedicated to auspicious, benevolent work for humanity, compassionately took the whole quantity of poison in his palm and drank it.


SB 8.7.43: As if in defamation, the poison born from the ocean of milk manifested its potency by marking Lord Śiva's neck with a bluish line. That line, however, is now accepted as an ornament of the Lord.


SB 8.7.44: It is said that great personalities almost always accept voluntary suffering because of the suffering of people in general. This is considered the highest method of worshiping the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is present in everyone's heart.


SB 8.7.45: Upon hearing of this act, everyone, including Bhavānī [the daughter of Mahārāja Dakṣa], Lord Brahmā, Lord Viṣṇu, and the people in general, very highly praised this deed performed by Lord Śiva, who is worshiped by the demigods and who bestows benedictions upon the people.


SB 8.7.46: Scorpions, cobras, poisonous drugs and other animals whose bites are poisonous took the opportunity to drink whatever little poison had fallen and scattered from Lord Śiva's hand while he was drinking.


SB 4.4.11: The blessed goddess said: Lord Siva is the most beloved of all living entities. He has no rival. No one is very dear to him, and no one is his enemy. No one but you could be envious of such a universal being, who is free from all enmity.


SB 4.4.12: Twice-born Daksha, a man like you can simply find fault in the qualities of others. Lord Siva, however, not only finds no faults with others' qualities, but if someone has a little good quality, he magnifies it greatly. Unfortunately, you have found fault with such a great soul.


SB 4.6.35: The demigods saw Lord Siva situated in his perfection as the master of the senses, knowledge, fruitive activities and the path of achieving perfection. He was the friend of the entire world, and by virtue of his full affection for everyone, he was very auspicious.


SB 4.6.36: He was seated on a deerskin and was practicing all forms of austerity. Because his body was smeared with ashes, he looked like an evening cloud. On his hair was the sign of a half-moon, a symbolic representation.


SB 4.6.37: He was seated on a straw mattress and speaking to all present, including the great sage Narada, to whom he specifically spoke about the Absolute Truth.


SB 4.6.38: His left leg was placed on his right thigh, and his left hand was placed on his left thigh. In his right hand he held rudraksha beads. This sitting posture is called virasana. He sat in the virasana posture, and his finger was in the mode of argument.


SB 4.6.39: All the sages and demigods, headed by Indra, offered their respectful obeisances unto Lord Siva with folded hands. Lord Siva was dressed in saffron garments and absorbed in trance, thus appearing to be the foremost of all sages.


SB 4.6.40: Lord Siva's lotus feet were worshiped by both the demigods and demons, but still, in spite of his exalted position, as soon as he saw that LordBrahma was there among all the other demigods, he immediately stood up and offered him respect by bowing down and touching his lotus feet, just as Vamanadeva offered His respectful obeisances to Kasyapa Muni.


SB 4.6.41: All the sages who were sitting with Lord Siva, such as Narada and others, also offered their respectful obeisances to Lord Brahma. After being so worshiped, Lord Brahma, smiling, began to speak to Lord Siva.


SB 4.6.42: Lord Brahma said: My dear Lord Siva, I know that you are the controller of the entire material manifestation, the combination father and mother of the cosmic manifestation, and the Supreme Brahman beyond the cosmic manifestation as well. I know you in that way.


SB 4.6.43: My dear lord, you create this cosmic manifestation, maintain it, and annihilate it by expansion of your personality, exactly as a spider creates, maintains and winds up its web.


SB 4.6.44: My dear lord, Your Lordship has introduced the system of sacrifices through the agency of Daksha, and thus one may derive the benefits of religious activities and economic development. Under your regulative principles, the institution of the four varnas and asramas is respected. The brahmanas therefore vow to follow this system strictly.


SB 4.6.45: O most auspicious lord, you have ordained the heavenly planets, the spiritual Vaikuntha planets and the impersonal Brahman sphere as the respective destinations of the performers of auspicious activities. Similarly, for others, who are miscreants, you have destined different kinds of hells which are horrible and ghastly. Yet sometimes it is found that their destinations are just the opposite. It is very difficult to ascertain the cause of this.


SB 4.6.46: My dear Lord, devotees who have fully dedicated their lives unto your lotus feet certainly observe your presence as Paramatma in each and every being, and as such they do not differentiate between one living being and another. Such persons treat all living entities equally. They never become overwhelmed by anger like animals, who can see nothing without differentiation.


Shiva Advaita - Shiva is one, there is no second


SB 4.6.47: Persons who observe everything with differentiation, who are simply attached to fruitive activities, who are mean minded, who are always pained to see the flourishing condition of others and who thus give distress to them by uttering harsh and piercing words have already been killed by providence. Thus there is no need for them to be killed again by an exalted personality like you.


SB 4.6.48: My dear lord, if in some places materialists, who are already bewildered by the insurmountable illusory energy, sometimes commit offenses, a saintly person, with compassion, does not take this seriously. Knowing that they commit offenses because they are overpowered by the illusory energy, he does not show his prowess to counteract them.


SB 4.6.49: My dear lord, you are never bewildered by the formidable influence of the illusory energy, Maya.Therefore you are omniscient and should be merciful and compassionate toward those who are bewildered by the same illusory energy and are very much attached to fruitive activities.


Note: Ignore the purport biggrin.gif


Shiva Advaita


SB 8.12.8: My dear Lord, Your Lordship alone is the cause and the effect. Therefore, although You appear to be two, You are the absolute one. As there is no difference between the gold of a golden ornament and the gold in a mine, there is no difference between cause and effect; both of them are the same. Only because of ignorance do people concoct differences and dualities. You are free from material contamination, and since the entire cosmos is caused by You and cannot exist without You, it is an effect of Your transcendental qualities.


ekas tvam eva sad asad dvayam advayam ca

svarnam kritakritam iveha na vastu-bhedah

ajnanatas tvayi janair vihito vikalpo

yasmad guna-vyatikaro nirupadhikasya




ekah -- the only one; tvam -- Your Lordship; eva -- indeed; sat -- which is existing, as the effect; asat -- which is nonexistent, as the cause; dvayam -- both of them; advayam -- without duality; ca -- and; svarnam -- gold; krita -- manufactured into different forms; akritam -- the original source of gold (the gold mine); iva -- like; iha -- in this world; na -- not; vastu-bhedah -- difference in the substance; ajnanatah -- only because of ignorance; tvayi -- unto You; janaih -- by the general mass of people; vihitah -- it should be done; vikalpah -- differentiation; yasmat -- because of; guna-vyatikarah -- free from the differences created by the material modes of nature; nirupadhikasya -- without any material designation.




My dear Lord, Your Lordship alone is the cause and the effect. Therefore, although You appear to be two, You are the absolute one. As there is no difference between the gold of a golden ornament and the gold in a mine, there is no difference between cause and effect; both of them are the same. Only because of ignorance do people concoct differences and dualities. You are free from material contamination, and since the entire cosmos is caused by You and cannot exist without You, it is an effect of Your transcendental qualities.


SB 8.12.9: Those who are known as the  Vedantists regard You as the Brahman. Others, known as the Mimamsaka philosophers, regard You as religion. The Sankhya philosophers regard You as the transcendental person who is beyond prakriti and purusha and who is the controller of even the demigods. The followers of the codes of devotional service known as the Pancaratras regard You as being endowed with nine different potencies. And the Patanjala philosophers, the followers of Patanjali Muni, regard You as the supreme independent Personality of Godhead, who has no equal or superior.



So still do you have any doubt on unity of shiva and krishna ?



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|| om namo bhagavate vāsudevāya ||


stotra:   shrimad bhagvad gītā

chhanda: anushṭup

ṛshī:  kṛshṇa dvaipāyana veda vyās

devatā:  shri kṛshṇa paramātmā


So you see, Shri Kṛshṇa is GOD . Because He alone says  so, yes, but why does He say so? Because He is ParaBramhan', Paramātmā .

Therefore Shri Kṛshṇa is refered to as Shri Kṛshṇa Paramātmā :)


* So, one has to have dṛdha (firm) bhāvanā (consciousness) that Shri Kṛshṇa is  nirguṇ ParaBramhan' who attracts the entire multi-bramhānḍa (universes) to Him . (Kṛshṇa = ākarshaṇa , attractive, attraction owing to prema, paramānanda).


* This anādi- ananta  Bramhan' is very very very auspicious . Therefore Shiva is one of His names .


* This Bramhan' pervades everything, all existence. Therefore He is called Vishṇū.


* This Bramhan' cries in pain when He sees suffering in the world, and wants to extinguish it - therefore He is Rudra.


* This Bramhan' is the king of all senses, and facilitates their existence, therefore He is Indra.


* This Bramhan' is Sat-ChitĀnand, and Knowledge Pure, which burns of all seeds of sanchit & āgami karma, therefore He is also called Agnī


* This Bramhan' is cool and cools off agony by His charm, bliss and benevolence, therefore He is also called Varuṇa


* This Bramhan' is bright effulgence of knowledge, that destroys all neissance and dispells darkness, therefor He is also called Sūrya.


* This Bramhan' is extremely beautiful and brings happiness with His cool radiance. Therefore He is also called Chandra.



However, this Bramhan' is ALL of this and a lot lot more than we can put on paper , but can it be said that He is only Indra, only Agni, only Vāyū, only Sūrya, only Shiva etc.? No we cannot say this .  Therefore, He has to be described using many many names each bringing some aspect of His Being. How is this Bramhan'? It is such and such --- but ultimately, even though His compassion overflows for us and He takes all these forms and shapes, He is that sacchidānanda svarūpa alone, Pure Conscious Being. That alone is pure existential consciousness, that alone is Knowledge Itself, THAt alone is eternal bliss itself.


Suppose your name is ... let us say  uday  or meenākshī.

Does it mean being like the dawn or having fish-shaped eyes is all I can say about you? Of course not . You are so many other things in other contexts - but that is your personality. Ultimately, you are just you - the ātmā, being, the same one who is he she it they we you me I.

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