Caste System Cast Out, Or Is It?

[Yegan 0]

Hari Bol,

 

I have been reading some of the threads on this forum and have come across one which has shed some confusion in my mind.

 

As per his holiness Srila Prabhupada, caste is nature dependent and NOT birth dependent. So someone who is born in a sudra family for example can later do preaching and thus is a brahmin, independent of his family background.

 

Now what I cannot understand is if this is so, then why Dronocarya refuses to accept Karna as his disciple. To my knowledge Dronacarya refuses to accept Karna as hisciple because the latter was from "sudra" family.

Karna blatantly has the nature of a warrior and as such Dronacarya should have accepted him as disciple, since caste is nature dependent.

 

Can anyone plz enlighten me on this issue. I am not well versed in Mahabaharat, my appologies if I made a wrong statement.

 

Jai Radhe

 

[Guest guest]

You seem to forget also that Karna was PROMOTED to kshatriya by Dhuryodana who gave him land so he could become kshatriya. Also Dronacharya wanted to gain land and become a kshatriya as well, and he warred with Kripacharya about this, which is very unbrahmin-like.

 

Perhaps Drona couldn't teach Karna because Karna didn't have the STATUS of kshatriya, until Dhuryodana promoted him. His nature may have been kshatriya but he didn't have the status of kshatriya so Drona couldn't teach him.

 

It's sort of like if a farmer displayed tendencies of being a scientist, yet he had no training, no education for such a field. Most scientists would never consider the farmer's theories with much weight, because the farmer did not have the status of being a scientist.

[Yegan 0]

 

You seem to forget also that Karna was PROMOTED to kshatriya by Dhuryodana who gave him land so he could become kshatriya. Also Dronacharya wanted to gain land and become a kshatriya as well, and he warred with Kripacharya about this, which is very unbrahmin-like.

 

Perhaps Drona couldn't teach Karna because Karna didn't have the STATUS of kshatriya, until Dhuryodana promoted him. His nature may have been kshatriya but he didn't have the status of kshatriya so Drona couldn't teach him.

 

It's sort of like if a farmer displayed tendencies of being a scientist, yet he had no training, no education for such a field. Most scientists would never consider the farmer's theories with much weight, because the farmer did not have the status of being a scientist.

 

Dear guest,

Thxs for responding, but your explanation doesnt seem convincing to me.

 

If birth dictates your caste, then Karna is a kshatriya by birth, for his father is none but the sun god. Whether Dhuryodana, gave him lands or not, doesnt matter at all for Karna is born as kshatriya. As a matter of fact, he is the true heirs of all the lands and the only one eligible to be crowned king (Since he is the eldest pandavas).

 

Considering the STATUS issue, well I dont agree with you because:

 

1. Anyone born in a poor family, will never be able to become a kshatriya because obviously STATUS would be absent as you have clearly mentioned. (Usually someone poor doesnt have proper education or training hence NO REQUIRED STATUS to become a kshatriya according to you. I obviously disagree with that.)

 

2. If STATUS is one of the attributes that makes someone to be kshatriya or may be Brahmin then to me I find that very unfair. So many people are born poor but with blatant characteristics of a kshatriya, but due to their so called "unproper status" they are deprived to become kshatriya.

Anyway I have never come across a verse which says that your caste is STATUS dependent. Point me to a verse which says so.

 

3. If someone needs lands or woteva STATUS to be accredited as kshatriya, then there would be no soldiers fighting in Mahabharat because obviously their so called status is same if not lower than Karna and thus unfit to fight.

 

It's sort of like if a farmer displayed tendencies of being a scientist, yet he had no training, no education for such a field. Most scientists would never consider the farmer's theories with much weight, because the farmer did not have the status of being a scientist.

The proclaimed scientist at some point of his life had no training nor proper education ,same like the farmers. It took someone to give him the chance to learn and acquire knowledge ,independent of his so called status before becoming a scientist.

 

The farmer may not have the knowledge of the scientist at present but it might well be that the farmer's nature is more scientific than the scientist. Given the chance to explore his nature, (i.e learning and training) he can become a scientist as well.

 

Same thing applies with Karna. His nature is blatantly that of a kshatriya, and if everyone were like Dronacarya(Take disciple based on status, according to you), then Karna would have never been given the chance to fight which would have been very unfair for someone with kshatriya nature.

 

[Jahnava Nitai Das 1]

Also do not forget that people in Mahabharata made mistakes, that's why the entire war happened. If everyone was perfect then there wouldn't have been any conflict.

[Yegan 0]

 

Also do not forget that people in Mahabharata made mistakes, that's why the entire war happened. If everyone was perfect then there wouldn't have been any conflict.

Dear jndas,

From your statement above should I presume that Dronacarya has made a mistake in refusing to teach Karna because he is a "sudra" ?

 

Hari bol