Krsna consciousness is not for everyone?

[jayaisvara 0]

I've heard Swami Prabhupada say that KC is not for everyone but only the intelligent can understand it. So what to do about those who are not intelligent but still they have started chanting Krsna nama but are still in ignorance, what hope is there for these souls?

[Guest guest]

SP did not mean in the sense that Krishna is not everyone. Intelligence as what he refered could be interpreted as the understanding given by Lord or blessed by Lord to realise Him. But to get this blessings every soul at some time in their journey through different body gets enlightened by the Mercy of Lord Himself and thats how He makes the soul realise Him. So ultimately at one stage, He makes everyone intelligent enough to realise Him fully and reach Him. So dont worry and break your head...If you have started chanting Lord's name but yet remain with speculative thoughts to accept Him fully, you are probably iin the course of evolution. Keep your chanting and you will receive His causeless Mercy to realise Him totally in this birth itself if He wishes. If not in this birth, Krishna says iin Gita, that such souls never fall anyway and He comes to them in the form of bakthi to realise Him in the next birth anyways. So you are still blessed.

Raghavan

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

 

 

How you could be chanting Hare Krishna and not be intelligent. You question is very contradictory.

[jayaisvara 0]

Pankaja_Dasa prabhu, I chant Hare Krsna but I am not intelligent enough to chant with the proper motives and mood (trndad api sunicena...). I think its important that although we chant, the motive and sincerity counts. The thing is, how can one become intelligent enough to understand that sincerity and surrender will make this journey much faster? With a fickle mind, its so hard to practice anything in KC, as with my case.

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

 

 

The thing is, how can one become intelligent enough to understand that *sincerity and surrender will make this journey much faster?

 

 

Thing is Prabhu everything is aleady there in the Holy name. Your giving clue to your own mind that you need guidance by using the words *sincerity and surrender:

 

Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized soul can impart knowledge unto you because he has seen the truth.

__ http://bhagavadgitaasitis.com/4/34/en1

 

This is a scientific path. Prabhupada in Gita 1.1

 

Bhagavad-gita is the widely read theistic science summarized in the Gita-mahatmya (Glorification of the Gita). There it says that one should read Bhagavad-gita very scrutinizingly with the help of a person who is a devotee of Sri Krsna and try to understand it without personally motivated interpretations.

 

I would worry about yourself more. First you should try to get established. But I still don't think I answered your question. You will need to become established in surrender, knowing what it is etc. Sincerity leads up to surrender because it makes you faithful. So you have to have faith.

 

How do you have faith? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[jayaisvara 0]

I think my situation is this:

 

So Krsna says that one needs to approach a spiritual master and hear from him submissively. Ok, now the thing is, the main ingredient of this verse is submissive hearing. It would take me a lifetime I believe to just make myself submissive. So do you see? Just one word, submissive, will take me a lifetime with the grace of Lord and sadhus to properly make my mind follow. Then there are words like sincerity, surrender, humility and such. Its almost as if each of these words would take me a life time or many life times to properly implement into my heart through experience and such. So thus, its almost as if, before I even read the Gita, I should prepare for it for a life time cultivating proper attitude and respect towards others, and then, after some life times, after I learn what submissive and sincere represent, then I would be ready to hear the instruction. This is the way I see it as of now.

 

Just to follow 1 verse and purport, I think it would take me a lifetime because the words that are used in the purport and verse like submissive, sincere, humilty, surrender, faith etc. are qualities that I think would take me so many many births to be qualified enough to have them.

 

I don't know but do you understand prabhu?

[Guest guest]

"So what to do about those who are not intelligent but still they have started chanting Krsna nama but are still in ignorance, what hope is there for these souls? "

 

who chants hare krishna is no more in ignorance... he's in transcendental intelligence.. only question of time

 

 

[Kulapavana 0]

Krsna consciousness is not for everyone because:

 

some people are moving in the other direction

some people are too attached to their own religion

some people are too dull to understand its value

and so on....

 

everyone CAN take it up, but only few actually WILL...

 

[jayaisvara 0]

What are the requirements for understanding the value of KC?

[Guest guest]

krsna's mercy

 

we understand nothing if krsna does not bless us

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

 

 

*Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 12.9-Devotional Service

My dear Arjuna, O winner of wealth, if you cannot fix your mind upon Me without deviation, then follow the regulated principles of bhakti-yoga. In this way you will develop a desire to attain to Me.

 

Purport extract:

This practice of bhakti-yoga, under the rules and regulations, with the direction of a spiritual master, will surely bring one to the stage of love of God.

__

 

This instruction is to you and me. Devotees are: submissive, sincere, humble, surrendering, faithful. Just by talking to you on this forum I can feel your devotion. Now that's something.!

 

By associating with devotee who already have these qualities they will abide in your own mind-set. This is a fact.

 

BR Sridhara Maharaja In Gita says..

For example, if one engages in the general public welfare work of opening or running a hospital, if some service is even unknowingly rendered to a Vaisnava, one's devotional merit begins (ajnata-sukrti).

____

 

iccha-desire; Krishna uses the word desire He says you will develop. By Bhakti-yoga *principles. Now what is Bhakti-yoga:

 

Sb.2.3.10

 

akamah sarva-kamo va

moksa-kama udara-dhih

tivrena bhakti-yogena

yajeta purusam param

 

 

TRANSLATION

A person who has broader intelligence, whether he be full of all material desire, without any material desire, or desiring liberation, must by all means worship the supreme whole, the Personality of Godhead.

 

PURPORT

The Supreme Personality of Godhead Lord Sri Krsna is described in the Bhagavad-gita as purusottama, or the Supreme Personality. It is He only who can award liberation to the impersonalists by absorbing such aspirants in the brahmajyoti, the bodily rays of the Lord. The brahmajyoti is not separate from the Lord, as the glowing sun ray is not independent of the sun disc. Therefore one who desires to merge into the supreme impersonal brahmajyoti must also worship the Lord by bhakti-yoga, as recommended here in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. Bhakti-yoga is especially stressed here as the means of all perfection. In the previous chapters it has been stated that bhakti-yoga is the ultimate goal of both karma-yoga and jnana-yoga, and in the same way in this chapter it is emphatically declared that bhakti-yoga is the ultimate goal of the different varieties of worship of the different demigods. Bhakti-yoga, thus being the supreme means of self-realization, is recommended here. Everyone must therefore seriously take up the methods of bhakti-yoga, even though one aspires for material enjoyment or liberation from material bondage.

 

Akamah is one who has no material desire. A living being, naturally being the part and parcel of the supreme whole purusam purnam, has as his natural function to serve the Supreme Being, just as the parts and parcels of the body, or the limbs of the body, are naturally meant to serve the complete body. Desireless means, therefore, not to be inert like the stone, but to be conscious of one's actual position and thus desire satisfaction only from the Supreme Lord. Srila Jiva Gosvami has explained this desirelessness as bhajaniya-parama-purusa-sukha-matra-sva-sukhatvam in his Sandarbha. This means that one should feel happy only by experiencing the happiness of the Supreme Lord. This intuition of the living being is sometimes manifested even during the conditioned stage of a living being in the material world, and such intuition is expressed in the manner of altruism, philanthropy, socialism, communism, etc., by the undeveloped minds of less intelligent persons. In the mundane field such an outlook of doing good to others in the form of society, community, family, country or humanity is a partial manifestation of the same original feeling in which a pure living entity feels happiness by the happiness of the Supreme Lord. Such superb feelings were exhibited by the damsels of Vrajabhumi for the happiness of the Lord. The gopis loved the Lord without any return, and this is the perfect exhibition of the akamah spirit. Kama spirit, or the desire for one's own satisfaction, is fully exhibited in the material world, whereas the spirit of akamah is fully exhibited in the spiritual world.

 

Thoughts of becoming one with the Lord, or being merged in the brahmajyoti, can also be exhibitions of kama spirit if they are desires for one's own satisfaction to be free from the material miseries. A pure devotee does not want liberation so that he may be relieved from the miseries of life. Even without so-called liberation, a pure devotee is aspirant for the satisfaction of the Lord. Influenced by the kama spirit, Arjuna declined to fight in the Kuruksetra battlefield because he wanted to save his relatives for his own satisfaction. But being a pure devotee, he agreed to fight on the instruction of the Lord because he came to his senses and realized that satisfaction of the Lord at the cost of his own satisfaction was his prime duty. Thus he became akama. That is the perfect stage of a perfect living being.

 

Udara-dhih means one who has a broader outlook. people with desires for material enjoyment worship small demigods, and such intelligence is condemned in the Bhagavad-gita (7.20) as hrta jnana, the intelligence of one who has lost his senses. One cannot obtain any result from demigods without getting sanction from the Supreme Lord. Therefore a person with a broader outlook can see that the ultimate authority is the Lord, even for material benefits. Under the circumstances, one with a broader outlook, even with the desire for material enjoyment or for liberation, should take to the worship of the Lord directly. And everyone, whether an akama or sakama or moksa-kama, should worship the Lord with great expedience. This implies that bhakti-yoga may be perfectly administered without any mixture of karma and jnana. As the unmixed sun ray is very forceful and is therefore called tivra, similarly unmixed bhakti-yoga of hearing, chanting, etc., may be performed by one and all regardless of inner motive.

___

from above:

As the unmixed sun ray is very forceful and is therefore called tivra, similarly unmixed bhakti-yoga of hearing, chanting, etc., may be performed by one and all regardless of inner motive.

__

 

This is saying Bhakti-yoga is like the Sun. Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu.

 

[sumedh 0]

Hare Krisha and dandavat pranam

 

Prabhuji why do you think so; the post itself shows your sincerity, humility and your responses to the posts by other devotees are demonstrative of submissiveness. Complete surrender to Lord is itself the perfection.

 

A lover of God always thinks himself to be devoid of it; similar is the case with these qualities. Such thoughts of unsuitability come to my mind also sometimes, and the only thing to hold-on to is the Holy Name. Also consider: why should i be concerned about my spiritual progress; its His job now that i have decided to offer myself to Him.

[jayaisvara 0]

There are so many tricks that the false ego and my mind or anyones mind in fact can play on them. I wouldn't we surprised if I am just in the mode of goodness right now, and at any moment the modes can change.

 

 

A lover of God always thinks himself to be devoid of it

 

 

I think at the stage where I am at, I would really misunderstand this statement. Now my mind can easily tell me, "oh you think you have no devotion, but in reality you do, so don't worry, everything will be alright". That is the danger I believe, maybe some senior devotees can help out with this dilemma. You are right about being concerned with the progress, this just shows that I am not sincere, because I am doing calculation with bhakti, almost as if I am telling myself "I am doing so much and the Lord should also repay me properly for all the trouble I've gone through". I think that is also dangerous and it makes me forget that I am at the mercy of the sadhus and Krsna.

[Kulapavana 0]

"What are the requirements for understanding the value of KC?"

 

one needs some intelligence, some humility, sincerity and open mindednes to see the outstanding value of KC.

[sumedh 0]

Hare Krishna

 

In my opinion, for this reason one should not worry too much to this and take heart from the fact that the Holy Name is available to us despite our being so much fallen. Everyone has to proceed with whatever little one may have; there is no other option and sometime or the other we have to do it anyway.