Take the Vani but not the Vapu - Srila Prabhupada

[Guruvani 0]

Repeating the VANI of Srila Prabhupada is not going to kill ISKCON, rather it will revive and sustain it.

 

Like Prabhupada himself said:

"the dogs will bark, but the caravan will pass"

 

ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada will never be a flattering place for the Gaudiya Math Godbrothers. Some toes will be stepped on in the march of ISKCON to enlighten the whole world.

 

They should just leave ISKCON alone and accept the will of Srila Prabhupada that these Gaudiya Math Godbrothers and their disciples should stay away from ISKCON and ISKCON should stay away from them.

 

Seperate but equal............ one and different!

 

It's in Prabhupada's books! Should we go and edit out this issue now? I don't think so. It is alive and well in Prabhupada's books..........it' permanent and irreversible.

[yasodanandana 0]

surely you will be not offended if a say that your spiritual master is more gentle, open minded and mercyful than you (and me of course)

[Guruvani 0]

Actually, if you want to talk about offenses, I think it is offensive for followers of Gaudiya Math sannyasis, knowing Prabhupada's instructions to his disciples to avoid Gaudiya Math Godbrothers and their followers, to try and force their way into ISKCON temples for preaching and to try and force Prabhupada disciples to accept siksha and sanga with these Gaudiya Math types.

 

Prabhupada himself issued these mandates to his disciples and now his disciples are being ridiculed and persecuted for trying to obey these instructions. It's easy to make Prabhupada disciples out to be the bad guys when in fact it is well known that Prabhupada did not want his disciples to associate with these Gaudiya Math types.

 

The actual offense is the offense being committed by the disciples of these Gaudiya Math sannyasis to try and force their way into ISKCON temples against the will of Srila Prabhupada.

 

They didn't dare try it in the presence of Prabhupada, but now that he is gone the attempt is being made.

[Guruvani 0]

Prabhupada issued this instruction to all of his disciples and this order was never retracted:

 

 

Actually amongst my Godbrothers no one is qualified to become acarya. So it is better not to mix with my Godbrothers very intimately because instead of inspiring our students and disciples they may sometimes pollute them. This attempt was made previously by them, especially Madhava Maharaja and Tirtha Maharaja and Bon Maharaja but somehow or other I saved the situation. This is going on. We shall be very careful about them and not mix with them. This is my instruction to you all. They cannot help us in our movement, but they are very competent to harm our natural progress. So we must be very careful about them."

 

 

 

 

Don't blame Prabhupada's disciples for what Prabhupada said. It is very offensive to them.

 

 

[yasodanandana 0]

"to try and force their way into ISKCON temples" is surely an offence, but the dychotomy iskcon-gaudya vaishnava, or dividing the world in these two blocks is your fantasy

 

you have to speak about me, i am not responsible of the act of anyone different than me, i do not force and i do not enter in places without permission

 

and i have many bad qualities, but generally i avoid to cathegorize (a kanista feature with mayavadi nuances... madyam and uttama (that i am not) go on a personal plane)

 

you are speaking to me, about devotees, not about disturbing people

 

disturbing people have to be avoided .......but ....... having not said anything against iskcon and having not revealed a plane for conquer your temple with my armed godbrothers, i do not know why are you saying this to me

 

do not cathegorize, maybe you are right for 99%, but the offense done to the 1% will destroy your spiritual life

 

<font color="red"> why are you associating, speaking with an evil gaudyavaishnava(sob) like me? </font color>

[yasodanandana 0]

you have simply rewinded the same your tape... i do not rewind mine... haribol

 

but, for my clarification

 

what do you think about gaura govinda maharaja?

 

why he was anti ritvik?

[Guest guest]

If you are realizing Krsna with out a living guide and have the spiritual realization to understand a previouse guru's words then " Good for You". If you need help then help will be there for you. In either case Love of Krsna is needed. Death is around the corner so please don't cheat yourself and don't cheat others of an opertunity for genuine spiritual association.

[Guruvani 0]

Prabhupada said:

 

"So I have now issued orders that ALL my disciples should avoid ALL of my godbrothers. They should not have any dealings with them nor even correspondence, nor should they give them any of my books or should they purchase any of their books, neither should you visit any of their temples. Please avoid them."

 

 

A few words with some Godbrothers on Prabhupada's deathbed did not change any of this.

 

It still stands as Prabhupada vani.

[Guruvani 0]

I have a living guide. Prabhupada is living. His instructions are living. He is a living guide - not a fictitious figure.

[yasodanandana 0]

"A few words with some Godbrothers on Prabhupada's deathbed did not change any of this."

 

prabhupada for first proposed 64 rounds, than he changed in 32, then 16

 

 

 

the same for godbrothers... first opposition to facilitate neophytes, next the change when he feel that there is no more need.. not too strange

 

you as a ritvik advocate live on a conversation done near the time of the departure of his divine grace, that you think that is revolutionizing all prabhupada's guru tattva

 

last minute changes are good only for you?

 

(you are oscillating between saying that what i have said is true, like now, and saying that it is not true, lilamrita it is not shastra and so on, maybe you are a little short of arguments and it is an honour for a poor preacher like me...... what are you doing..in italy we call it "climbing mirrors")

[Guruvani 0]

The ritvik appointments was a signed document that Prabhupada sent out to all the temples and GBCs a few weeks before his departure.

 

where is your signed document that Prabhupada retracted his long standing orders to avoid the Gaudiya Math people?

 

You have nothing but make believe instructions from Srila Prabhupada that don't exist.

 

You don't need to be validated by me or Prabhupada. You can have your Gaudiya Math guru........be happy and let Prabhupada's disciples follow Prabhupada's instructions without making them out to be offenders.

[gHari 0]

Amen.

<Center><img src=http://home.primus.ca/~caitanya/Syamasundara.jpg></center>

[Guruvani 0]

Remember Krishna. Very good. Remember Krishna's instructions as well. Remember his pure devotee who gave Krishna to the whole world. Remember the mission called ISKCON that helped Prabhupada give Krishna to the whole world. Try to save and preserve that mission that Prabhupada wanted to be a model of Krishna consciousness living.

Some people don't give a damn about ISKCON, saving ISKCON, the success of ISKCON etc. etc., but there are those who feel it is the desire of Srila Prabhupada to make ISCKON a successful and prosperous mission. ISKCON is still the largest and most effective Krishna consciousness mission in the world, though it could have been thousands of times more thriving and prosperous following the actual design and plan of Srila Prabhupada.

 

ISKCON has faltered, failed and faded in the move to implement the Gaudiya Math dogma at the cost of rejecting the ritvik system of Prabhupada.

 

There are those of us that want to see ISKCON revived to it's former glory under the principles and procedures instituted by Srila Prabhupada.

 

Yes, remember Krishna............ but if you forget the instructions of the spiritual master, your idea of Krishna will be no more than a fiction character from a comic book.

 

Remembering Krishna means to remember the orders of the spiritual master. ISKCON is not irrelevant and inconsequential to be passed off as disposable and external.

Salvaging ISKCON for the service of Prabhupada is the greatest call of the 21st century. It is not "society consciousness", rather the hope and light of the world to demonstrate a Dhaiva-varnashrama community for the enlightenment and education of mankind.