Prabhupada Desires His Disciples to Become Qualified Like Him

[Guest guest]

Prabhupada Desires His Disciples to Become Qualified Like Him

 

Lord Caitanya says that Under My order, you become a spiritual master. To become a spiritual master under the order of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is not very difficult. Unless we adulterate, mix in something nonsense in His teachings, if we simply present, as it is, then every one of us can become a spiritual master. His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

 

So many people say, "Oh, Swamiji, you have done wonderful." So I say, the secret of my wonderful activities is that I have not tried to adulterate it. I am simply presenting as it is. Everything is there in the Bhagavad-gita, and I am simply reproducing it. And it is acting. Because I am not adulterating the sweet rice with sand, people are tasting it very nice.

So you also follow the same principle. Don't try to adulterate. Present it as it is. And people will like it. There is no difficulty. (710716LE.DET Lectures)

 

"The spiritual master who first gives information about spiritual life is called the vartma-pradarsaka-guru, the spiritual master who initiates according to the regulations of the sastras is called the diksa-guru, and the spiritual master who gives instructions for elevation is called the siksa-guru. Factually the qualifications of a spiritual master depend on his knowledge of the science of Krsna."

 

731108SB.DEL Lectures

People say that "Swamiji, you have done miracles." But what miracles I have done? I am simply repeating Krsna's words. That's all. So everyone can do that. Everyone can take this matter very seriously. His life will be successful. He will make others successful. It is so nice thing.

 

740404BG.BOM Lectures

So actually it is happening. We are not wonderful men. But our only business is that we are speaking only the same thing as Krsna has spoken. That's all. There is no magic. This is the magic. If you adulterate nonsensically like a rascal, then you cannot become a spiritual master. If you simply follow what Krsna has spoken, then you become spiritual master. Very simple thing. It doesn't require education. You can hear from your spiritual master what has Krsna said.

 

SB 4.29.51 Talks Between Narada and King Pracinabarhi

One who is engaged in devotional service has not the least fear in material existence. This is because the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the Supersoul and friend of everyone. One who knows this secret is actually educated, and one thus educated can become the spiritual master of the world. One who is an actually bona fide spiritual master, representative of Krsna, is not different from Krsna.

 

TLC 18 The Conversations with Prakasananda

When a devotee is perfectly qualified in chanting the transcendental vibration of the holy name, he is quite fit to become a spiritual master and to deliver all the people of the world... one who is situated on the platform of love of Godhead chants the holy name loudly for all concerned. As a result, everyone becomes initiated in the chanting of the holy names--Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare. Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare.

 

761210DB.HYD Lectures

We got this information from His Divine Grace Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, and that knowledge is still going on. You are receiving through his servant. And in future the same knowledge will go to your students. This is called parampara system. It is not that you have become a student and you'll remain student. No. One day you shall become also guru and make more students, more students, more. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission, not that perpetually... Yes, one should remain perpetually a student, but he has to act as guru. That is the mission of Caitanya Mahaprabhu... So we should become always a very obedient student to our guru. That is the qualification. That is the spiritual qualification.

 

710718RC.DET Conversations

Prabhupada: Yes. All of them will take over. These students, who are initiated from me, all of them will act as I am doing. Just like I have got many Godbrothers, they are all acting. Similarly, all these disciples which I am making, initiating, they are being trained to become future spiritual masters.

 

750302BA.ATL Lectures

This is the mission of Caitanya Mahaprabhu and, by disciplic succession, Bhaktivinoda Thakura, then my spiritual master. Then we are trying our level best. Similarly, you will also try your level best on the same principle. Then it will go on. Same principle. It doesn't matter whether one is born in India or outside India. No.

 

720518AR.LA Lectures

So we have got this message from Krsna, from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, from the six Gosvamis, later on, Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura. And we are trying our bit also to distribute this knowledge. Now, tenth, eleventh, twelfth... My Guru Maharaja is tenth from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, I am eleventh, you are the twelfth. So distribute this knowledge. People are suffering.

 

660729BG.NY Lectures

That is a chance given, that you can become a brahmana, you can become a great devotee of Lord Krsna, and you can become the spiritual master of the world. That is the... And I think you should take seriously.

 

750406CC.MAY Lectures

And to become acarya is not very difficult. First of all, to become very faithful servant of your acarya, follow strictly what he says. Try to please him and spread Krsna consciousness. That's all. It is not at all difficult. Try to follow the instruction of your Guru Maharaja and spread Krsna consciousness. That is the order of Lord Caitanya. "By following My order, you become guru." And if we strictly follow the acarya system and try our best to spread the instruction of Krsna... Simply repeat what is said by Krsna, then you become acarya. But you should understand the meaning also; otherwise how you can explain? So, we want to spread Krsna consciousness. Simply prepare yourself how to repeat Krsna's instructions very nicely, without any malinterpretation. Then, in future... Suppose you have got now ten thousand. We shall expand to hundred thousand. That is required. Then hundred thousand to million, and million to ten million. So there will be no scarcity of acarya, and people will understand Krsna consciousness very easily. So make that organization. Don't be falsely puffed up. Follow the acarya's instruction and try to make yourself perfect, mature. Then it will be very easy to fight out maya. Yes. Acaryas, they declare war against maya's activities.

 

680817VP.MON Lectures

Spiritual master is not a new invention. It is simply following the orders of the spiritual master. So all my students present here who are feeling so much obliged... I am also obliged to them because they are helping me in this missionary work. At the same time, I shall request them all to become spiritual master. Every one of you should be spiritual master next. And what is their duty? Whatever you are hearing from me, whatever you are learning from me, you have to distribute the same in toto without any addition or alteration. Then all of you become the spiritual master. That is the science of becoming spiritual master. To become a spiritual master is not very wonderful thing. Simply one has to become sincere soul. That's all.

 

730822VP.LON Lectures

You'll have to become spiritual master. You, all my disciples, everyone should become spiritual master. It is not difficult. It is difficult when you manufacture something. But if you simply present whatever you have heard from your spiritual master, it is very easy. If you want to become overintelligent, to present something, to interpret something, whatever over you have heard from spiritual master you can make some further addition, alteration, then you'll spoil whole thing. Then you'll spoil whole thing. Don't make addition or alteration. Simply present as it is. Therefore, we have begun Bhagavad-gita As It Is. Don't try to become over spiritual master. Then you'll spoil. Remain always a servant of your spiritual master and present the thing as you have heard. You'll be spiritual master. This is secret. You should know it. Don't try to become overintelligent. That will spoil.

 

730822VP.LON Lectures

So I hope that all of you, men, women, boys and girls, become spiritual master, and follow this principle. Spiritual master, simply, sincerely, follow the principles and speak to the general public. Then Krsna immediately becomes your favorite. Krsna does not become your favorite; you become Krsna's favorite. Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita, na ca tasmad manusyesu kascin me priya-krttamah: "One who is doing this humble service of preaching work, Krsna consciousness, nobody is dearer than him to Me." So if you want to become recognized by Krsna very quickly, you take up this process of becoming spiritual master, present the Bhagavad-gita as it is. Your life is perfect.

 

 

[Guruvani 0]

In Srila Prabhupada's translation of Upadesh-amrita of Rupa Goswami; THE NECTAR OF INSTRUCTION he orders:

 

quote

"One should not become a spiritual master unless he has attained the platform of uttama-adhikari"

text 5 purport

 

So, all of the above quotes should be taken face value, but in light of what Prabhupada says in the books as well.

When unfit disciples try to become spiritual master from the lower positions of madhyama and kanistha, chaos is wrought upon the movement and we have seen plenty of that since the disappearance of Srila Prabhupada. In order to prevent that kind of disaster Srila Prabhupada took extraordinary measures to remedy that problem. However, after he left so many unqualified disciples tried to neglect his measures and prematurely attempt to act as spiritual master. The result is that ISKCON broke and splintered and practically disintegrated. What we now have is a movement that has lost most of it's credibility over this guru fiasco and smrti gurus from the Gaudiya Math are now being dragged into the movement and contradicting Srila Prabhupada's reforms at the cost of international confusion around the movement.

[Guruvani 0]

Also, if you read Prabhupada's books closely, you will see that he advocates the conception of "joining the society", "joining ISKCON", "joining the Krishna consciousness movement" etc. etc. Prabhupada repeats this theme constantly in his books and lectures.

The concept of joining a society or joining ISKCON portrays somewhat of a different idea than becoming the disciple of an individual so-called guru. Prabhupada gave us something bigger than our own individual efforts; he gave us a society, a movement that offered so much more than any one devotee can be as spiritual master.

Prabhupada taught that his disciples were actually initiated into his society(ISKCON)more than as initiated as his direct disciples. He had some direct disciples, but he also had many disciples that he never personally knew. Being a part of Prabhupada's society is something much bigger, greater and better than being the disciple of one individual follower of Prabhupada. Prabhupada gave the world a whole society of gurus and taught that joining this society was his idea of accepting the parampara.

When a new devotee takes initiation from an individual disciple of Srila Prabhupada instead of being initiated into the whole society as Prabhupada advocated, he many times looses the benefit of the association and instruction of so many other wonderful disciples of Srila Prabhupada. He minimizes the value of their instruction by thinking that he only has one guru, his diksha guru. This is a great loss. In the Prabhupada era of ISKCON, new devotees got guidance, training and instruction from so many wonderful, senior devotees. Nowadays, they restrict their instruction to one so-called diksha guru and loose all the good instruction they should have been getting from so many other senior devotees. This is not what ISKCON was supposed to be about.

Prabhupada advocated "joining the society" not "joining a diksha guru's private club". Read his books and you will see that Prabhupada advocated a somewhat different version of the parampara than the ancient, unsuitable system of traditional guru-disciple parampara.

 

Go through the Nectar of Instruction and see how many times Prabhupada advocates "joining the society", "joining the movement" etc. etc. He uses this theme hundreds of times throughout his books and this was his reformed idea of parampara for the western world and the modern age.

 

Siksha guru is no less important than diksha guru. Prabhupada wanted all his disciples to be siksha guru. However, his system was for joining the society - not for becoming a disciple of any individual devotee within the society. If you read his books you will see this.

 

The society of a great spiritual master like Srila Prabhupada's ISKCON is called "acharya sampradaya". Joining the society established by a great acharya is non-different than becoming his direct disciple. Such acharya sampradayas have existed in the history of the parampara and such a society is certainly the best system for the movement of the modern day. When a great acharya establishes such a society he sometimes deputizes some disciples to initiate new devotees into the society. This system is just as legitimate as the less appropriate method of direct guru-disciple methods more favored in smaller circles and ancient times.

[Guest guest]

Can an istitution give prema? Or is it the duty of an exalted Sri Guru Maha Bhagavata to give you the ultimate goal of life:Krishna prema?

[Guruvani 0]

I don't think that prema is something that is given as much as it is something that is earned. Prema is the attainment of those whose lives are filled with sacrifice and surrender and it is not something that is just given away so easily and cheaply to the undeserving. What is given away very easily is the knowledge of how to attain prema. What one does with that knowledge determines whether one attains prema or not.

Institutions don't give prema either. But, service to more advanced devotees will help one attain prema. If that institution is an institution dedicated to serving the mission of a pure devotee then yes, serving that institution can help one attain prema. Sadhu-sanga is also an institution. An institution can be an institution of pure devotees and indeed serving them can help one attain prema. Mahaprabhu gave us an institution; he gave us the Sankirtan movement - the society of pure devotees. So, there is a great benefit in serving an institution, otherwise why did Saraswati Goswami form the Gaudiya Math? Why did Keshava Maharaja form the GVS? Why did Sridhar Maharaja for the CSM? Institutions have been established by many great acharyas. If institutions were not instrumental in helping devotees advance in devotional service then why have so many great acharyas established institutions? Does not Narayana Maharaja belong to an institution of Vaishnavas?

What we are calling an institution is actually another term for sadhu-sanga and guru-seva. By serving the guru's institution we can serve the guru and get so much valuable association. In this way, the institutions of the great acharyas are very important facilities for advancing in devotional service.

[Guruvani 0]

Prema, or love of God, is already in the heart. It must be uncovered and unleashed. It is not something that one has to acquire from another. This idea that prema is something that one gets by loitering around some so-called guru, is a fictitious ploy used by bogus gurus to earn their livelyhood.

Prema is uncovered and unleashed in the heart through sacrifice and dedication. It is not something magical that one gets by buying a plane ticket to India and loitering around some so-called sadhu. You cannot get prema by buying a plane ticket to India. Prema is realized and awakened through total sacrifice, committment and dedication to service of the mission of the pure devotee. And we know from the teachings of the six goswamis that Mahaprabhu had a mission. This is the same mission adopted by his devotees and that mission is to distribute the Holy Name to all the fallen souls of the world. A guru without a mission (an institution) is no guru at all, as Mahaprabhu started the mission to deliver all the fallen souls and all his sincere followers try to serve that mission of Mahaprabhu.

[theist 1]

"A guru without a mission (an institution) is no guru at all,..."<<

 

What was the name of Haridas Thakur's institution?

[Guruvani 0]

How many disciples did haridas have? maybe one? Mayadevi herself? his mission was to deliver mayadevi from her infatuation with Lord Shiva and reveal to her the lotus feet of Harinama. I think delivering mayadevi is about as great a mission as one could possibly undertake. to make a pure devotee of Krishna out of Lord Shiva's wife is quite a mission indeed!

[theist 1]

Your quote was "a guru without an institution is no guru at all."

 

Do you have some sastra to back that up is my qestion as I never heard that before.

 

Maybe I am not understanding what you mean by institution.

[stonehearted 0]

Yes, I'm with theist on this point. In the purport to Bg. 17.15, Srila Prabupada writes, "The process of speaking in spiritual circles is to say something upheld by the scriptures. One should at once quote from scriptural authority to back up what he is saying. At the same time, such talk should be very pleasurable to the ear." Gurvani's assertion is so broad and pointed that some sort of scriptural support would certainly help.

 

I also agree that he may find it well to explain what he means by institution. Especially the way he phrases his point, "A guru without a mission (an institution) is no guru at all," and its juxtaposition with Mahaprabhu's name, raises the question of what he means by "institution" and just what institution Mahaprabhu established. Or what institution Jagannath das babaji, or Gaura-kishora das babaji established, or worked in. Guru means teacher, and we are all meant to be gurus, teachers of Krishna consciousness, regardless of any institutional affiliation.

 

 

[Guruvani 0]

What I mean by institution is a matha, mandira or a society. The technical term for a society established by a guru is called "acharya sampradaya". Sampradaya is sometimes misunderstood to mean "parampara" but actually sampradaya means "community" or "society". When an acharya establishes a large following of devotees, that community of devotees around him and his mission is called a "sampradaya". ISKCON is Srila Prabhupada's acharya sampradaya.

What is a guru without a following? Can one be a professor without a class to teach? Not all pure devotees have a following or make disciples, so who are they guru of?

Haridas Thakur did not have any formal disciples, so what was his mission? Was he just a self-interested soul who's only purpose was his own salvation alone? Or, was his mission the greatest mission of all; to deliver Mayadevi herself?

A mission means a purpose and a goal. Sometimes that mission can be formalized into an institution and sometimes it remains informal.

Haridas thakur did not have a formal mission, neither did he have any formal disciples. He definetely did not have a non-profit organization established to promote Krishna consciousness. However, Haridas did have a mission and that mission was to deliver Mayadevi from her illusion that Lord Shiva was supreme. That is a very great mission and nothing less than any mission of the great acharyas in Gaudiya history.

[Guest guest]

Guru means teacher - Formally Gurus had a few disciples- He would teach them either in his home , under a tree or in some cases if the guru was given large amounts of money he would build a temple or temples. The Living Guru is the important thing. We must have faith that such a person exists. If we don't see him before us there must be a flaw in us not my neighbor. Krsna wants us to make spiritual advancement and provides for us we simply need to be sincere. Only cheaters will be cheated.

 

Read what Srila Bhaktisiddhanta has to say on the matter;

 

The name of Krishna on the lips of the supreme Lord (Sri Caitanya) had the power of making all persons, who heard it, realize the truth of whom they had been told by the scriptures. This was a most marvelous experience.

In this Iron Age it is only the name of Krishna appearing on lips of a bona fide sadhu who can lift the conditioned soul to the plane of the absolute. As a matter of fact even the scriptures also can only faintly describe the personality Godhead. The mere study of the scriptures can convey no full knowledge of the absolute as substantive entity. The name Krishna has the power to put the person on the absolute plane and endow the words of the revealed scriptures with their living meaning.

 

On the plane of the absolute all entities serve Godhead in infinite variety of forms and run harmoniously into, instead of clashing against, one another. Division of the person who once hears the name of Krishna undergoes this marvelous change. He can only then really believe in Godhead because he understands and sees whom he is to serve. He becomes in the substantive sense a bona fide theist or Vaisnava.

 

 

 

[Guruvani 0]

What is the meaning of Sankirtan? Sankirtan is the congegational chanting of the Holy Name, the congregational service of the pure devotee and the congregational association of devotees. Sankirtan is the mission, the institution that Mahaprabhu gave. He did not create a kirtan culture, rather a Sankirtan culture or what is called a movement of devotees dedicated to practicing the tenents of Mahaprabhu and his Sankirtan system.

Sankirtan is an institution. Sankirtan is a mission. Sankirtan is the institution and mission of Mahaprabhu. Srila Prabhupada formalized that mission into a non-profit corperation meant for the purpose advocated by Rupa Goswami:

 

"dadati pratigrhnati

guhyam akhyati prcchati

bhunkte bhojayate caiva

sad-vidham priti-laksanam"

 

Offering gifts in charity, accepting charitable gifts, revealing one's mind in confidence, inquiring confidentially, accepting prasada and offering prasada are the six symptoms of love shared by one devotee and another.

 

 

Prabhupada writes;

"The International Society for Krishna Consciousness has been established to facilitate these six kinds of loving exchanges between devotees"

 

 

This is Prabhupada's institution. This is his mission in esatablishing ISKCON. Who could possibly reject the advice of Rupa Goswami and ignore the institution he advocated for practicing these principles?

 

[theist 1]

>>"A mission means a purpose and a goal. Sometimes that mission can be formalized into an institution and sometimes it remains informal."<<

 

OK I'm with this. Sometimes a guru may not have a formal institution around him. That's up to Krsna. We must be cautious not to judge the level of Krsna realization someone has by the institutional structure that may be surrounding him. A highly realized soul may have little or no institution and a kanistha may have a giant institution under him.

 

Institutional structures may come and go according to Krsna's design. If Krsna gives His devotee 100 temples and then takes them away that is not a sign that that devotee has lost his devotion.

 

The danger I see is that a great devotee may show up at the door of a large institution and be treated improperly because he has no or a small institution and a rascal may show up and then be shown all honor because he has an large institution.

 

We need to see deeper than this.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

How can you possibly institutionalize love of God?How can you formalize loving exchanges amongst devotees? Can their be real spirit soul communion between conditioned souls that are mad for profit, distinction and adoration. Religious institutions are inherently corrupt by there very nature as they try to control everything . The only blessing is that there are a few Vaisnavas who can bestwow prema on the sincere souls.The acaryas set up institutions as a net in order to catch a few good souls who want krishna:the majority of souls who are in these institutions do not want krishna ,rather they make it their dharma or carreer(Spelling ?) of being a proffessional devotee.With out the causeless mercy of a Vaisnava ,pure devotee of the Lord ,his merciful glance,his foot dust,his remanants andfoot bathing water ther is no possibility of getting Krishna prema.

[Guest guest]

Read what Srila Bhaktisiddhanta has to say on the matter;

 

The name of Krishna on the lips of the supreme Lord (Sri Caitanya) had the power of making all persons, who heard it, realize the truth of whom they had been told by the scriptures. This was a most marvelous experience.

In this Iron Age it is only the name of Krishna appearing on lips of a bona fide sadhu who can lift the conditioned soul to the plane of the absolute. As a matter of fact even the scriptures also can only faintly describe the personality Godhead. The mere study of the scriptures can convey no full knowledge of the absolute as substantive entity. The name Krishna has the power to put the person on the absolute plane and endow the words of the revealed scriptures with their living meaning.

 

On the plane of the absolute all entities serve Godhead in infinite variety of forms and run harmoniously into, instead of clashing against, one another. Division of the person who once hears the name of Krishna undergoes this marvelous change. He can only then really believe in Godhead because he understands and sees whom he is to serve. He becomes in the substantive sense a bona fide theist or Vaisnava.

[Guest guest]

wonderful stuff from Srila Bhaktisiddhanta

 

He tells it like it is--AS IT IS, AS IT WAS and AS IT WILL ALWAYS BE.

[Guruvani 0]

To understand Bhaktisiddhnata Saraswati Goswami is something way beyond your means. Maybe you should try to understand Krishna consciousness from the disciple he appointed to preach in the western world?

He was not speaking to you. He was speaking to a different time and circumstance than today and he would not be very pleased that you are using his words to undermine the person he empowered to preach to the English speaking people and the whole western world.

You cannot go around Prabhupada and get to Bhaktisiddhanta. He would never condone that. Even many of his direct disciples could not uderstand him, so what hope is there for western upstarts to understand him?

[gHari 0]

Srila Prabhupada published his master's Sri Brahma-Samhita for the Western mlecchas. He also recorded the beginning of this foreword on an LP:<blockquote><center>Foreword

</center>

The materialistic demeanor cannot possibly stretch to the transcendental autocrat who is ever inviting the fallen conditioned souls to associate with Him through devotion or eternal serving mood. The phenomenal attractions are often found to tempt sentient beings to enjoy the variegated position which is opposed to undifferenced monism. People are so much apt to indulge in transitory speculations even when they are to educate themselves on a situation beyond their empiric area or experiencing jurisdiction. The esoteric aspect often knocks them to trace out immanence in their outward inspection of transitory and transformable things. This impulse moves them to fix the position of the immanent to an indeterminate impersonal entity, no clue of which could be discerned by moving earth and heaven through their organic senses.

 

The lines of this booklet will surely help such puzzled souls in their march towards the personality of the immanent lying beyond their sensuous gaze of inspection. The very first stanza of this publication will revolutionize their reserved ideas when the nomenclature of the Absolute is put before them as "KRSNa." The speculative mind would show a tendency of offering some other attributive name to designate the unknown object. They will prefer to brand Him by their experience as the "creator of this universe,""the entity beyond phenomena"--far off the reference of any object of nature and void of all transformation. So they will urge that the very fountainhead should have no conceivable designation except to show a direction of the invisible, and inaudible untouchable, nonfragrant and unperceivable object. But they will not desist from contemplating on the object with their poor fund of experience. The interested enquirer will be found to hanker after the records left by erudite savants to incompatible hallucinative views of savage demonstration. In comparing the different names offered by different thoughts of mankind, a particular judge would decide in favor of some nomenclature which will suit best his limited and specific whims. The slave mentality of an individual will no doubt offer invective assertions to the rest who will be appealing to him for a revelation of his decision. To remedy this evil, the hymns of the accepted progenitor of the phenomena would do great help in taking up the question of nomenclature which is possessed of adequate power to dispel all imaginations drawn out of their experiencing the phenomena by their tentative exploitations.

 

The first hymn will establish the supremacy of the Absolute Truth, if His substratum is not shot by the bullets of limited time, ignorance and uncomfortable feeling, as well as by recognizing the same as an effect instead of accepting Him as the prime cause. He will be satisfied to mark that the object of their determination is the par"excellent Supreme Lord SrI KRSNa who has eternally embodied Himself in His ever-presence, all-blissful, all-pervasive perfected knowledge as the very fountainhead of all prime causes of unending nonbeginning time, the supplying fosterer of all entities, viz., mundane and transcendental.

 

The subsequent lines will go to determine the different aspects of the Absolute, who are but emanations of the supreme fountainhead KRSNa, the attractive entity of all entities. Moreover, the derivative proclamation of the nomenclature will indicate the plane of uninterrupted, unending, transcendental felicity and the nomenclature Himself is the source of the two components which go by the names of efficient and material causes. The very transcendental name "KRSNa" is known as the embodiment of all the transcendental eternal rasas as well as the origin of all eclipsed conceptions of interrupted rasas found in the mentality of animated beings which are successfully depicted by litterateurs and rhetoricians for our mundane speculation.

 

The verses of Brahma-saMhitA are a full elucidation of the origination of phenomenal and noumenic conceptions. The hymns of the incarnated prime potency has dealt fully with the monotheistic speculations of different schools which are busy to give an outer cover of an esoteric concoction without any reference to the true eternal aspect of transcendental nontransformable and imperishable manifestation of the immanent. The hymns have also dealt with different partial aspects of the personality of the Absolute who is quite isolated from the conception of the enjoyers of this phenomenal world.

 

A very close attention and a comparative study of all prevailing thoughts and conceptions will relieve and enlighten all--be he a materialist, a downright atheist, an agnostic, a sceptic, a naturalist, a pantheist or a panantheist--busy with their knowledge of three dimensions only by their speculative exertions.

 

This booklet is only the fifth chapter of the Hymns of BrahmA which were recorded in a hundred chapters. The Supreme Lord SrI Caitanya picked up this chapter from the temple of Adi-kezava at Tiruvattar, a village lying under the government of Travancore, for the assurance of all God-loving, and especially KRSNa-loving, people in this conditioned jurisdiction. This booklet can easily be compared with another book which passes by the name of SrImad-BhAgavatam. Though it has got a reference in the pantheon of PurANas, the BhAgavatam corroborates the same idea of this PaJcarAtra.

 

The devotees should consider that these two books tend to the identical KRSNa who is the fountainhead of all transcendental and mundane entities and has a manifestive exhibition of the plenary variegatedness.

Aspersions of calumniation are restricted in the limited world, whereas transcendence cannot admit such angularities being an angle of 180 degrees or void of any angular discrepancies.

 

The publisher is carried away to the realm of gratitude when his stores of publication are scrutinized. ThAkura Bhaktivinoda has given an elucidatory purport of the conception of the most sublime fountainhead of all entities in Bengali, and one of his devout followers has rendered that into English for propagatory purpose. The purports and the translations are traced to the backgrounds of the writings of SrIla JIva GosvAmI, a contemporary follower of the Supreme Lord SrI KRSNa Caitanya. The emotional aspirations will find fair play in perusing the texts of this brochure by one and all who have any interest in pure theistic achievements. The materialistic inspection often goes on to say that the provincial conception of theism has made the depicting of transcendental unity into diverse face quite opposed to the ethical consideration of the limited region. But we differ from such erroneous considerations when we get a prospective view of the manifested transcendentality eliminating all historicities and allegorical enterprises. All our enjoying mood should have a different direction when we take into account the transcendental entity who has obsessed all frailties and limitations of nature. So we solicit the happier mood of the scrutinizers to pay special attention to the importance of manifestive transcendence in KRSNa.

 

It was found necessary to publish this small book for the use of English-knowing people who are interested in the acme of transcendental truths in their manifestive phases. The theme delineated in the texts of this book is quite different from the ordinary heaps of poetical mundane literature, as they are confined to our limited aspiration of senses. The book was found in the South some four centuries ago and it is again brought into light in the very same country after a long time, just like the worshiping of the Goddess Ganges by the offering of her own water.

 

SiddhAnta SarasvatI

Shree Gaudiya Math,

Calcutta, the 1st August, 1932.

</blockquote>

Of course, one may need a dictionary and a concentrated mind to get through these passages, but no one can belittle you for reading them.

 

gHari

[Guest guest]

Guruvani is really making a simple point here.

 

Fornal instruction is given by institutions. Even though you may recieve it at home let's say, institutions are devoted and structured for aspirants to assimilate concentrated information or knowledge of a particular field.

 

For example, do you learn to be a doctor at home? Or colleges and hospitals?

 

Prabhupada got his formal basics from an institution, and so did we.

 

Still, as has been pointed out, the personal things cannot be mechanized or deterministic. But that's a given. That's true everywhere.

 

Guess Guest

[Guruvani 0]

Actually, this version of Brahma-Samhita that you are ascribing to Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Goswami was actually rendered into English by Professor Nishikanta Sanyal, the disciple of Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Goswami from the original Bengali purports of Bhaktivinode based on the commentaries by Srila Jiva Goswami.

 

You are not reading an English version written by Bhaktisiddhanta, rather an Englsih version approved and edited by him.

 

Nonetheless, we all appreciate the book and I have a copy.

 

However Srila Prabhupada did instruct his disciples that:

 

"Whatever is to be learned of the teachings of Srila Bhaktivinode Thakura can be learned from our books. There is no need whatsoever for any outside instruction."

 

Considering this, we might understand that the best approach to learn the teachings of Bhaktivinode and Bhaktisiddhanta is to learn it from the books of Srila Prabhupada.

[Guruvani 0]

by the way gHari;

you are welcome for the information I gave you about Brahma-Samhita being translated by Professor Sanyal and not Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati. I guess he did write the introduction, but the verses were translated by Professor Sanyal.

Instead of fleeing this thread in embarassment you could have a least acknowledged that I corrected your misconception and shared with you some important information!

[gHari 0]

Guruvani,

 

I had heard things like that before, not directly related to the Samhita. The intro did sound to me like Srila Bhaktisiddhanta, and in many places Srila Prabhupada speaks of his master being the author.

 

To date, I have been unable to accept information from you as necessarily true. It may well be, but I always reserve judgement since I have found much of your paraphrasing to be questionnable. And quite frankly, I do not hear Supersoul in your words, but rather an aggressive arrogant hurtful attitude much distant to His compassion and purpose.

 

You will possibly remember that Srila Prabhupada wrote in one book a list of writings by the previous acaryas and Goswamis that a serious student should study. I could not find the reference, but it is there somewhere. This was just another example of your words not ringing true; again filled with antagonism and imagined authority, yet again false.

 

You should accept the shameful rant with Shyam as a warning. Something is amiss.

 

gHari

[gHari 0]

<blockquote>Los Angeles

25 December, 1973

73-12-25

 

My Dear Gurukrpa Maharaja and Yasodanandana Maharaja,

 

Please accept my blessings. Karandhara has received a letter from Tamala Krsna Goswami and he is expressing some hesitation about your returning to India. I can understand that previously there must have been some quarrel amongst you and that sometimes happens amongst god-brothers. Whatever is done is done; the main thing is we must not carry grudges or continue to quarrel amongst one another. So I am asking you personally, along with Tamala Krsna Goswami to whom I am sending a copy of this letter, to bury the hatchet and join together to push on this movement cooperatively.

 

Tamala Krsna Goswami has been appointed by me to manage and direct our Indian projects and actually he is the most expert and qualified in this connection. You both are also sannyasins and I know that the service which you do the best is Hare Krsna kirtana and Bhagavata Dharma preaching. So I have no objection if you return to India. Rather, I know you both can be a great asset for our programs there. I am requesting you, therefore, to concentrate on preaching and kirtana and work cooperatively with Tamala Krsna Goswami who is in charge there. Whatever imperfections and discrepancies may exist, if you all agree to my directions and cooperate in the right spirit then everything will turn out, but it will require everyone involved to be responsible and cooperate in executing and following the instructions of the Spiritual Master.

 

Now, one thing is I understand that in the past you were visiting Lalita Prasadji and that you may also be planning to continue to visit him when you return to India. This is not approved by me and I request you not to go to see him any more. He holds a grudge against my Guru Maharaja and even if it is transcendental it will gradually appear mundane in our eyes. <font color=blue>Whatever is to be learned of the teachings of Srila Bhaktivinode Thakura can be learned from our books. There is no need whatsoever for any outside instruction.</font> So I hope that you have understood these matters and I pray to Krsna always for your protection and advancement in Krsna consciousness.

 

Your ever well-wisher,

 

A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

ACBS:Kda

c.c. Tamala Krsna Goswami Maharaja</blockquote>

[gHari 0]

In reference to the writings of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura has been credited with writing the following in the periodical known as The Harmonist in December 1931 (Vol. XXIX No.6):<blockquote>

 

<H2>THAKUR BHAKTIVINODE</H2>

 

 

We avail of the opportunity offered by the Anniversary Celebrations of

the advent of Thakur Bhaktivinode to reflect on the right method of

obtaining those benefits that have been made accessible to humanity by

the grace of this great devotee of Krishna. Thakur Bhaktivinode has

been specifically kind to those unfortunate persons who are engrossed

in mental speculation of all kinds. This is the prevalent malady of

the present Age. The other Acaryas who appeared before Thakur

Bhaktivinode did not address their discourses so directly to the

empiric thinkers. They had been more merciful to those who are

naturally disposed to listen to discourses on the Absolute without

being dissuaded by the specious arguments of avowed opponents of

Godhead.

 

Srila Thakur Bhaktivinode has taken the trouble of meeting the

perverse arguments of mental speculationists by the superior

transcendental logic of the Absolute Truth. It is thus possible for

the average modern readers to profit by the perusal of his writings.

That day is not far distant when the priceless volumes penned by

Thakur Bhaktivinode will be reverently translated, by the recipients

of his grace, into all the languages of the world.

 

The writings of Thakur Bhaktivinode provide the golden bridge by which

the mental speculationist can safely cross the raging waters of

fruitless empiric controversies that trouble the peace of those who

choose to trust in their guidance for finding the Truth. As soon as

the sympathetic reader is in a position to appreciate the sterling

quality of Thakur Bhaktivinode's philosophy the entire vista of the

revealed literatures of the world will automatically open out to his

reclaimed vision.

 

There have, however, already arisen serious misunderstandings

regarding the proper interpretation of the life and teachings of Srila

Thakur Bhaktivinode. Those who suppose they understand the meaning of

his message without securing the guiding grace of the Acarya are

disposed to unduly favour the methods of empiric study of his

writings. There are persons who have got by heart almost everything

that he wrote without being able to catch the least particle of his

meaning. Such study cannot benefit those who are not prepared to act

up to the instructions lucidly conveyed by his words. There is no

honest chance of missing the warnings of Thakur Bhaktivinode. Those,

therefore, who are misled by the perusal of his writings are led

astray by their own obstinate perversity in sticking to the empiric

course which they prefer to cherish against his explicit warnings. Let

these unfortunate persons look more carefully into their own hearts

for the cause of their misfortunes.

 

The personal service of the pure devotee is essential for

understanding the spiritual meaning of the words of Thakur

Bhaktivinode. The Editor of this Journal, originally started by Thakur

Bhaktivinode, has been trying to draw the attention of all followers

of Thakur Bhaktivinode to this all-important point of his teachings.

It is not necessary to try to place ourselves on a footing of equality

with Thakur Bhaktivinode. We are not likely to benefit by any

mechanical imitation of any practices of Thakur Bhaktivinode on the

opportunist principle that they may be convenient for us to adopt. The

Guru is not an erring mortal whose activities can be understood by the

fallible reason of unreclaimed humanity. There is an eternally

impassable line of demarcation between the Saviour and the saved.

Those who are really saved can alone know this.Thakur Bhaktivinode

belongs to the category of the spiritual world-teachers who eternally

occupy the superior position.

 

The present Editor has all along felt it his paramount duty to try to

clear up the meaning of the life and teachings of Thakur Bhaktivinode

by the method of submissive listening to the Transcendental Sound from

the lips of the pure devotee. The Guru who realises the transcendental

meaning of all sounds, is in a position to serve the Absolute by the

direction of the Absolute conveyed through every sound. The

Transcendental Sound is Godhead, the mundane sound is non-Godhead. All

sound has got these opposite aptitudes. All sound reveals its Divine

face to the devotee and only presents its deluding aspect to the

empiric pedant. The devotee talks apparently the same language as the

deluded empiric pedant who had got by heart the vocabulary of the

Scriptures. But notwithstanding apparent identity of performance, the

one has no access to the reality while the other is absolutely free

from all delusion.

 

Those who repeat the teachings of Thakur Bhaktivinode from memory do

not necessarily understand the meaning of the words they mechanically

repeat. Those who can pass an empiric examination regarding the

contents of his writings are not necessarily also self-realised souls.

They may not at all know the real meaning of the words they have

learnt by the method of empiric study. Take for example the Name

"Krishna". Every reader of Thakur Bhaktivinode's works must be aware

that the Name manifests Himself on the lips of His serving devotees

although He is inaccessible to our mundane senses. It is one thing to

pass the examination by reproducing this true conclusion from the

writings of Thakur Bhaktivinode and quite another matter to realise

the Nature of the Holy Name of Krishna by the process conveyed by the

words.

 

Thakur Bhaktivinode did not want us to go to the clever mechanical

reciter of the mundane sound for obtaining access to the

Transcendental Name of Krishna. Such a person may be fully equipped

with all the written arguments in explanation of the nature of the

Divine Name. But if we listen to all these arguments from the dead

source the words will only increase our delusion. The very same words

coming from the lips of the devotee will have the diametrically

opposite effect. Our empiric judgment can never grasp the difference

between the two performances.The devotee is always right. The

non-devotee in the shape of the empiric pedant is always and

necessarily wrong. In the one case there is always present the

Substantive Truth and nothing but the Substantive Truth. In the other

case there is present the apparent or misleading hypothesis and

nothing but untruth. The wording may have the same external

appearance in both cases. The identical verses of the Scriptures may

be recited by the devotee and the non-devotee, may be apparently

misquoted by the non-devotee but the corresponding values of the two

processes remain always categorically different. The devotee is right

even when he apparently misquotes, the non-devotee is wrong even when

he quotes correctly the very words, chapter and verse of the

Scriptures.

 

It is not empiric wisdom that is the object of quest of the devotee.

Those who read the scriptures for gathering empiric wisdom will be

pursuing the wild goose chase. There are not a few dupes of their

empiric Scriptural erudition. These dupes have their admiring

under-dupes. But the mutual admiration society of dupes does not

escape, by the mere weight of their number, the misfortunes due to the

deliberate pursuit of the wrong course in accordance with the

suggestions of our lower selves.

 

What are the Scriptures? They are nothing but the record by the pure

devotees of the Divine Message appearing on the lips of the pure

devotees. The Message conveyed by the devotees is the same in all

ages. The words of the devotees are ever identical with the

Scriptures. Any meaning of the Scriptures that belittles the function

of the devotee who is the original communicant of the Divine Message

contradicts its own claim to be heard. Those who think that the

Sanskrit language in its lexicographical sense is the language of the

Divinity are as deluded as those who hold that the Divine Message is

communicable through any other spoken dialects. All languages

simultaneously express and hide the Absolute. The mundane face of all

languages hides the Truth. The Transcendental face of all sound

expresses nothing but the Absolute. The pure devotee is the speaker of

the Transcendental language. The Transcendental Sound makes His

appearance on the lips of His pure devotee. This is the direct,

unambiguous appearance of Divinity. On the lips of non-devotees the

Absolute always appears in His deluding aspect. To the pure devotee

the Absolute reveals Himself under all circumstances. To the

conditioned soul, if he is disposed to listen in a truly submissive

spirit, the language of the pure devotee can alone impart the

knowledge of the Absolute. The conditioned soul mistakes the deluding

for the real aspect when he chooses to lend his ear to the

non-devotee. This is the reason why the conditioned soul is warned to

avoid all association with non-devotees.

 

Thakur Bhaktivinode is acknowledged by all his sincere followers as

possessing the above powers of the pure devotee of Godhead. His words

have to be received from the lips of a pure devotee. If his words are

listened from the lips of a non-devotee they will certainly deceive.

If his works are studied in the light of one's own worldly experience

their meaning will refuse to disclose itself to such readers. His

works belong to the class of the eternal revealed literature of the

world and must be approached for their right understanding through

their exposition by the pure devotee. If no help from the pure devotee

is sought the works of Thakur Bhaktivinode will be grossly

misunderstood by their readers. The attentive reader of those works

will find that he is always directed to throw himself upon the mercy

of the pure devotee if he is not to remain unwarrantably

self-satisfied by the deluding results of his wrong method of study.

 

The writings of Thakur Bhaktivinode are valuable because they demolish

all empiric objections against accepting the only method of

approaching the Absolute in the right way. They cannot and were never

intended to give access to the Absolute without help from the pure

devotee of Krishna. They direct the sincere enquirer of the Truth, as

all the revealed scriptures do, to the pure devotee of Krishna to

learn about Him by submitting to listen with an open mind to the

Transcendental Sound appearing on His lips. Before we open any of the

books penned by Thakur Bhaktivinode we should do well to reflect a

little on the attitude, with which as the indispensable prerequisite,

to approach its study. It is by neglecting to remember this

fundamental principle that the empiric pedants find themselves so

hopelessly puzzled in their vain endeavour to reconcile the statements

of the different texts of the Scriptures. The same difficulty is

already in process of overtaking many of the so-called followers of

Thakur Bhaktivinode and for the same reason.

 

The person to whom the Acarya is pleased to transmit his power is

alone in a position to convey the Divine Message. This constitutes the

underlying principle of the line of succession of the spiritual

teachers. The Acarya thus authorised has no other duty than that of

delivering intact the message received from all his predecessors.

There is no difference between the pronouncements of one Acarya and

another. All of them are perfect mediums for the appearance of the

Divinity in the Form of the Transcendental Name Who is identical with

His Form, Quality, Activity and Paraphernalia.

 

The Divinity is Absolute Knowledge. Absolute Knowledge has the

character of indivisible Unity. One particle of the Absolute Knowledge

is capable of revealing all the potency of the Divinity. Those who

want to understand the contents of the volumes penned by the

piece-meal acquisitive method applicable to deluding knowledge

available to the mind on the mundane plane, are bound to be

self-deceived. Those who are sincere seekers of the Truth are alone

eligible to find Him, in and through the proper method of His quest.

 

In order to be put on the track of the Absolute, listening to the

words of the pure devotee is absolutely necessary. The spoken word of

the Absolute is the Absolute. It is only the Absolute Who can give

Himself away to the constituents of His power. The Absolute appears to

the listening ear of the conditioned soul in the form of the Name on

the lips of the sadhu. This is the key to the whole position. The

words of Thakur Bhaktivinode direct the empiric pedant to discard his

wrong method and inclination on the threshold of the real quest of the

Absolute. If the pedant still chooses to carry his errors into the

Realm of the Absolute Truth he only marches by a deceptive bye-path

into the regions of darker ignorance by his arrogant study of the

scriptures. The method offered by Thakur Bhaktivinode is identical

with the object of the quest. The method is not really grasped except

by the grace of the pure devotee. The arguments, indeed, are these.

But they can only corroborate, but can never be a substitute for, the

word from the living source of the Truth who is no other than the pure

devotee of Krishna, the concrete Personal Absolute.

 

Thakur Bhaktivinode's greatest gift to the world consists in this;

that he has brought about the appearance of those pure devotees who

are, at present, carrying on the movement of unalloyed devotion to the

Feet of Shree Krishna by their own wholetime spiritual service of the

Divinity. The purity of the soul is only analogously describable by

the resources of the mundane language. The highest ideal of empiric

morality is no better than the grossest wickedness to the

Transcendental perfect purity of the bonafide devotee of the Absolute.

The word 'morality' itself is a mischievous misnomer when it is

applied to any quality of the conditioned soul. The hypocritical

contentment with a negative attitude is part and parcel of the

principle of undiluted immorality.

 

Those who pretend to recognise the Divine Mission of Thakur

Bhaktivinode without aspiring to the unconditional service of those

pure souls who really follow the teachings of the Thakur by the method

enjoined by the scriptures and explained by Thakur Bhaktivinode in a

way that is so eminently suited to the requirements of the

sophisticated mentality of the present Age, only deceive themselves

and their willing victims by their hypocritical professions and

performances. These persons must not be confounded with the bonafide

members of the flock.

 

Thakur Bhaktivinode has predicted the consummation of religious unity

of the world by the appearance of the only universal church which

bears the eternal designation of the Brahma Sampradaya. He has given

mankind the blessed assurance that all Theistic churches will shortly

merge in the one eternal spiritual community by the grace of the

Supreme Lord Shree Krishna Chaitanya. The spiritual community is not

circumscribed by the conditions of time and space, race and

nationality. Mankind had been looking forward to this far-off Divine

Event through the Long Ages. Thakur Bhaktivinode has made the

conception available in its practicable spiritual form to the open

minded empiricist who is prepared to undergo the process of

enlightenment. The key stone of the Arch has been laid which will

afford the needed shelter to all awakened animation under its ample

encircling arms. Those who would thoughtlessly allow their hollow

pride of race, pseudo-knowledge or pseudo-virtue to stand in the way

of this long hoped for consummation, would have to thank only

themselves for not being incorporated in the spiritual society of all

pure souls.

 

These plain words need not be misrepresented, by arrogant persons who

are full of the vanity of empiric ignorance, as the pronouncements of

aggressive sectarianism. The aggressive pronouncement of the concrete

Truth is the crying necessity of the moment for silencing the

aggressive propaganda of specific untruths that is being carried on

all over the world by the preachers of empiric contrivances for the

amelioration of the hard lot of conditioned souls. The empiric

propaganda clothes itself in the language of negative abstraction for

deluding those who are engrossed in the selfish pursuit of worldly

enjoyment.

 

But there is a positive and concrete function of the pure soul which

should not be perversely confounded with any utilitarian form of

worldly activity. Mankind stands in need of that positive spiritual

function of which the hypocritical impersonalists are in absolute

ignorance. The positive function of the soul harmonises the claims of

extreme selfishness with those of extreme self-abnegation in the

society of pure souls even in this mundane world. In its concrete

realisable form the function is perfectly inaccessible to the empiric

understanding. Its imperfect and misleading conception alone is

available by the study of the Scriptures to the conditioned soul that

is not helped by the causeless grace of the pure devotees of Godhead.

</blockquote>