Applying Gita

[Guest guest]

As I told in another thread, I would be posting a verse every day and request suggestions on how to apply. This should be drawn from actual practical application through devotional service to solve a real world problem. It should not be something theoretical. I am sure this will help solve the problems for hundreds of members who visit this forum and thousands of their friends. I request a very active participation from all the members. Many people view this and leave but please share your realizations on this web-sangh.

 

All of us worry about some problem or the other - financial, position, health or just confusion about future. According to the Lord one who is a pandita does not worry for either the living or the dead.

 

as'ocyan anvacos tvam prajna vAdams ca bhAshase| gatAsU agatAsums ca nAnu socanti panditah||

 

How do I apply this ?

 

I take counsel from devotees who have helped me solve the problem spiritually or through subtler means like astrology. Thus the Lord protects me from bad decisions through the guidance of devotees whose intention is your welfare.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Every one's life has alternate spells of happiness and distress. One enjoys when things go well and is sad when things go bad. Then we start endeavouring for making things go on well. But the fact is that the result of our endeavour is limited by our past karma. Alternate spells of happiness and distress is inevitable.

 

matra sparsas tu kaunteya sitoshna sukha duhkha da | AgamApAyino nityas tAm titikshava bhArata ||

 

Srila Prabhupada teaches a very simple applicayion of this principle. A devotee should get up early in the morning and take bath even though it is cold in winter. Or cook for Krishna in the kitchen. Basically, these are duties and one should tolerate incoveniences in the execution of duty. Honestly, I have not been able to apply even this.

 

From HH Bhanu Swami Maharaj, a disciple of Srila Prabhupada, I heard that external world is affected by internal consciousness. When we are pure the external world changes. This is practically realizable at all levels. And the application is very simple.

 

Whenever a problem that is overwhelming, I sit down and remind myself that it is the influence of time and past karma. Then by chanting, I try to understand that it is due to my impurity that the karma is having effect. If I were to be devotee the it will be only a token reaction. As becoming a devotee is difficult, I try to apply any of the principle of devotional service - it could be chanting, reading, listening, visiting temples, donating money or whatever. What comes as a mountain goes away like a fog.

 

The tough part is not solving the problems but remembering Krishna when the going is good. And thanks to the promise of this verse, the next spell of "problems" is sure to come -

 

I see that 19 people have seen this post. To make it rich in content, I request every one to post their understanding - especially those who are advanced in realization.

 

 

[karthik_v 0]

Ram,

 

as'ocyan anvacos tvam prajna vAdams ca bhAshase| gatAsU agatAsums ca nAnu socanti panditah||

 

How do I apply this ?

 

I take counsel from devotees who have helped me solve the problem spiritually or through subtler means like astrology. Thus the Lord protects me from bad decisions through the guidance of devotees whose intention is your welfare.

 

As you have pointed out, the realized pandita doesn't worry about anything material - whether it is good or bad. Either way, it has no impact on him. So, even if you are afflicted by a material distress, a transcendental person doesn't care to resolve it. His concern is not you material welfare - pandita samadarshinah. So, I am not sure that deploying something like astrology can be construed as spiritual. For a pandita, the only course which matters is that which leads you to transcendence. Why would he even care if you meet with material pleasures or sufferings en route?

 

At a higher level, once a person is transcendental, would he even care about anything material? Or, would he even perceive another jiva? From the Vaishnava perspective, the answer would be yes. The realized person still cares for the spiritual advancement of another jiva out of mercy. The advaitic argument would be that for a realized person there is nothing else to perceive and hence the question of showing mercy to another jiva doesn't arise.

 

Any thoughts on this?

[karthik_v 0]

Ram,

 

Then by chanting, I try to understand that it is due to my impurity that the karma is having effect.

 

Are you implying that the effects of karma get diminished just because a person is transcendental? I am skeptical. Nobody in this world would question the intense piety of Srila Prabhupad. Yet, he suffereed heart attacks and went through many material sufferings. Everyone would accept that Kanchi Paramacarya was a great saint. Yet he had to be operated for cataract. Historically, many Hindu saints have been kiled by the Muslim invaders. Many Christian saints like Thomas Beckett have been murdered. What I think is that karma nevertheless has its impact even on a transcendental person. But, such a person doesn't see that as a suffering. Anything material doesn't bother him.

 

I request every one to post their understanding - especially those who are advanced in realization.

 

Yes, I have done so /ubbthreads/images/icons/smile.gif

[Gauracandra 1]

When we go to the park we feel great comfort. At the same time there are worms that are suffering in the very same atmosphere afraid of being chewed up by a bird. That same worm if put in our work place environment might feel great relaxation, at the same time that we fear our boss will come and chew us out. So happiness and distress are always there, but it depends on our perspective.

[Guest guest]

We can attribute the suffering of great saints to prArabhda karma or Krishna lIlA. They also may take on others'suffering. They are not interested in manipulating the material world.

 

But we dont want to suffer even in this life as much as possible inspite of the fact we know it is temporary.

 

From our point of view, we can mitigate our suffering by pious activities & prAyaschittas. By performing sAdhana bhakti and trying to reform ourselves, we can push away some of the karmic effects. We have to suffer those reactions which are fully fructified but we can undo those which are there as seeds.

 

Have you not felt Krishna's hand in your life ? So it was not all karma. It was deiva netrena

[Guest guest]

Our normal tendency is to work for gain, success and happiness in work, studies etc. And one wants to avoid defeat, loss, unhappiness etc. But Krishna says

 

sukha duhkhe same krtva labhalabau jayAjayau

tato yuddhAya yujyasva naivam pApam avapsyasi

 

I dont know how this can be applied. Any thoughts ?

[Guest guest]

Whenever I raised controversy people jumped in to answer. Some times the response would come in just a few minutes!!! But for a positive step like applying gita, the response is too bad. But I started a similar thread for Penn State University students and the response is very encouraging. I request the members of this forum to actively contribute.

[Guest guest]

Sri:

Dear All,

I really welcome Rajaram's suggestion of "applying gIta".

 

> We have to do it gradually in simple steps. One application is to

> consult wise people when we are in distress. This way we will learn

how

> to execute our duties without getting affected. Who are the wise

people ?

> They are people who are advanced in devotion and knowledge because

they

> are not affected by the dualities of the world. On the other hand,

they

> enjoy the taste of bhakti all the time.

 

Very true. To get out of distress, the first step is to consult people

who

are wise.

 

The definition of wise as correctly put is "the one who enjoys the

taste

of bhakti all the time". I feel that there is a small catch here. Even

to

identify "wise" people, one has to be "wise". For example, Sri Bhaktha

PrahlAda was very wise ! His father HiranyakashipU, even

though was physically very close, could not recognize PrahlAda's wisdom

!!

 

This seems to be a "chicken" and "egg" problem. I humbly request other

members to share their thoughts on identifying the 'wise'.

 

Thanks and Regards,

Venkatesh Sarangan

 

 

[Guest guest]

Text 45

 

“The Vedas deal mainly with the subject of the three modes of material nature. O Arjuna, become transcendental to these three modes. Be free from all dualities for gain and safety, and be established in the self.”

 

 

From the purport:

 

 

 

"One has to learn tolerance in the face of dualities such as happiness and distress, or cold and warmth, and by tolerating such dualities become free from anxieties regarding gain and loss."

 

-Bhagavad Gita (As it is) p. 132 (Contents of the Gita Summarized 2.46)

 

 

 

Perhaps the best place to start this journey of stoicism is with detachment from the material. Sri Krishna preaches a type of objectivity that is extremely challenging for young people such as us to practice. In order to understand the permanence of the soul, one must first understand the impermanence of the material objects and material bodies around us. Western society is filled with attachment to inanimate material objects, many of us share that same attachment—this attachment must be abolished. The path to freedom from dualities regarding birth, death, disease, and old age will come naturally after one learns to forgo attachment to the material objects in our surroundings.

 

 

 

As Rajaram said, we must take gradual, simple steps. I believe the first step is detachment from the inanimate, material objects that surround us.

 

 

 

-Samit

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Thiru Rajaram,

 

Thank you and it is good idea. Keepup this good work.

 

With good wishes,

 

Venkatachalam

 

Rajaram Venkataramani wrote:

 

Dear All -

 

I would like to start a new discussion "Applying Gita". Most of Bhagavad Gita is sung by Lord Sri Krishna Himself. He is the Supreme Lord and is our best friend and well wisher. Don't we want to apply the teachings in our life ? Definitely. And be guaranteed, it will be of immense benefit. It has been so for the greatest people of the past and this century.

 

I would like to start with a verse every day and ask for simple application. I would also present my own practical experience.

 

asocyan anavacos tvam prajna vAdams ca bhAshasE |

 

gatAsUn agatAsUms ca nAnu socanti panditAh ||

 

Arjuna was lamenting about the effects of the war. This is the first verse spoken by the Lord in response. It says that even though Arjuna is speaking like a learned man but he is lamenting for what is not worthy of grief. A learned man does not lament for either the living or the dead.

 

The sign of wisdom is happiness. If at any time we are unhappy, we are not wise. True knowledge is to know that we are not this body but we are spiritual. Then whatever happens to the body like birth, death, disease, old age or honor/dishonor, gain/loss should not bother us. But all of this bother us, right ? How do we get out ?

 

We have to do it gradually in simple steps. One application is to consult wise people when we are in distress. This way we will learn how to execute our duties without getting affected. Who are the wise people ? They are people who are advanced in devotion and knowledge because they are not affected by the dualities of the world. On the other hand, they enjoy the taste of bhakti all the time.

 

Any other application ?

 

Regards

 

Rajaram V.

 

 

[Somesh Kumar 0]

 

Even to identify "wise" people, one has to be "wise". For example, Sri Bhaktha

PrahlAda was very wise ! His father HiranyakashipU, even though was physically very close, could not recognize PrahlAda's wisdom !!

 

 

 

This is a very nice statement. Only a wise can understand another wise. That is to say that only a person who has enjoyed some little bhakti can appreciate the presence of another bhakta. Otherwise it's not possible.

 

There's a saying in Hindi "bandar kya jaane adrakh ka swaad" meaning that "how can monkey know the taste of ginger". So, that applies to the people who are averse to bhakti and bhaktas!

 

[Guest guest]

I think one gets wiser with spiritual knowledge and experience. By following some of the principles, one understands more and so on. Similarly, by committing offenses and sins one goes down towards sinful life.

[Gauracandra 1]

Happiness and distress - how to handle them? I’m not sure I know the answer as sometimes I handle them well, sometimes I don’t. A lot of times the distress in our lives is purely mental. We make things out much worse than they are, or will be. Imagination is a powerful thing, and we can always imagine how bad a situation will turn out. In tough times, very often things are out of our control. We should understand that we are not the controller, and what ever may come, we must simply do the best we can, and let come what may. Certainly there are times when there is real distress, and I would not say just to ignore it. But often so much of the distress we experience is either in our mind or out of our control. In either case we shouldn’t worry as it is either false or inevitable.

[Guest guest]

my friend you say "All of us worry about some problem or the other - financial, position, health or just confusion about future. According to the Lord one who is a pandita does not worry for either the living or the dead."

i am just a child on this path, so i cannot say so many learned things as i see all of you saying.but yes i can say this much i see everything as passing, i see myself as passing, even my own sorrow/joys as passing, how can i worry? i am sure krsna has said the same in better and more learned phrases. but please can we all not de-clutter the language and make it simpler. make it as simple as krsna the cowherd king made it for the simple rustic folks of mathura?

 

from my own understanding of life, i only know that if i worry about anything, it leads me nowhere, except in a whirlpool of maya. the living would benefit better if instead of worry i were to perform action and the dead have already left for another world where the benefit of my actions cannot reach them. so let me just let them alone and perform my actions, immmesered in the everlasting bliss of the NOW.

you say and i quote, "I take counsel from devotees who have helped me solve the problem spiritually or through subtler means like astrology. Thus the Lord protects me from bad decisions through the guidance of devotees whose intention is your welfare."

i am sure we are all arjuna at some point in our lives and it makes sense to call out to the internal or external krsna for help, when caught on the battlefield of kurukshetra. but do not let the battlefield dishearten even if it baffles momentarily. besides have faith in your own self, coz ultimately the whole mahabharta lies within...the krsna is as much within as much as the arjuna. you know your situation more than anyone else and do not let the world cloud your vision to the extent that you think that others can solve your problems, however well-meaning those people may be. you have already been endowed to solve all your problems by your own buddhi and viveka. do not get into too many misleading things, especially astrology...

 

 

 

 

 

[Streetstraw 0]

Applying Gita to get Duryodhan out of the White House. And getting Ari Fleischdog's mouth off the media.

Just as Chaindog blocks 9/11 investigation because he's directly involved in bringing down WTC, not INdirectly, DIRECTLY! ... so too, Ari Fleischdog on behalf of Bushcut, is blocking investigation of Sniper bullets because...

Duryodhan Bushman is more concerned with riflemen's privacy than citizen's safety. And keeping his 9/11 + sniper connection distant.

Who set fire to that House of Lac? Bushing denied it even faster than Duryodhan. How? By blaming his former friend: some kidney patient foreigner wearing a turban.