Did Ravana reach heaven by hating Vishnu

[Guest guest]

Ive read in a few posts people say that Kauravas,karna were all killed in teh battle not by krishna because they didnt deserve to die in his hands in order to goto heaven.

Whereas Sisupaala or Ravana went to heaven cause they hated god all the time so remembered him,if that is the short cut to heaven y not everyone hate Krishna rather than praise him?If sisupaala had the choice of 3 births instead of 7 to go to heaven if he hated Hari then y not everyone..just food for thought.

 

Hate Krishna go to heaven soon.

[Guest guest]

yes.. that's right

 

if you want to be liberated you have to make it big....

 

youy have to be a big devotee calling in this way the lord to take you to vaikunta, or you have to be a very big demon to call the lord to kill you.. then you'll quit the material world because the lord cannot avoid to give the liberation, even when he kills..

 

but the liberation of demons does not includes the love.. bhakti... bliss... joy.. happiness. Because they did not want to love god, they do not get love for god

[Guest guest]

So what exactly do the demons get if they r liberated..so u mean to say they dont get the great bodies or apsaras and all other pleasures in heaven though they r liberated?

[Guest guest]

heavenly planets are not liberation, in heavenly planets people die and come back in the earth... liberation is vaikunta... demons do no get vaikunta and they do not get heaven, they go in impersonal brahman that is, in comparison with the possibility of gettin the loving company of sri bhagavan in vaikunta, a disgrace... a coma..

[Guest guest]

wow,thats something i never heard before..so the liberation is just like a second chance,that means all the tapas and powers that ravana or other demons got when they get liberated goes to a waste..am i right?so its not like god gives them heaven after killing them..he just puts them in coma so that they see no pain or gain..its like death u mean.

[Guest guest]

didnt Ravana worship Shiva heavily?

[Guest guest]

it is very simple.. god fulfills your desires.

 

so many people make austerities, in my country the bakers wake up two ours before brahmins.. but brahmins work for god and bakers work for maya..

 

so why if a demon wants to kill krsna he has to be forced to get krsna's eternal company?

 

so he gets liberation from material pain, he goes in brahman, and he does not get god's company, vaikunta..

 

it is not death.. you have said liberation and it is actually a liberation..

 

if you search for god to love him instead of to kill him you get liberation plus love.. is it not simple?

[Guest guest]

he worshiped shiva, but with the purpose to kill rama..

 

imagine to worship jesus christ asking him to kill buddha or allah.. how could you call it a worship?

[Guest guest]

This is nonsense teaching that people reach Bhagavaan by hate.

 

Ravana is actually Jaya, one of the dvarapalakas of the gates of Vaikunta.

 

His birth as Ravana, sisupala(last birth) are all asuric in nature. These incarnations are material modes and do not constitute the svarupa of Jaya. Jaya is Satvika by nature, but got deluded due to curse from sons of BrahmA.

 

The case of Jaya(Ravana) and Vijaya(Kumbakarna) is an exceptional in nature and not a rule in general and is not to be mimicked by us.

[maadhav 0]

guest,

 

i know you.

doing good here.

please use a good user name it helps,

and you know it.

 

[Guest guest]

"This is nonsense teaching that people reach Bhagavaan by hate."

 

see what happens to kamsa...

[Guest guest]

Mr Maadav,

Doesnt matter if i have a name or not..just my opinions and questions matter..and now what is this new concept of kamsa not reaching heaven..i thought anyone killed by vishnu goes to heaven..though the dimesion of enjoyment there migth differ as per some users view..

 

But i really do want to know a firm answer

 

IS IT POSSIBLE TO GO TO HEAVEN BY HATING GOD 100% or NOT..whether it is not full enjoyment or not is a different thing..

[Guest guest]

IS IT POSSIBLE TO GO TO HEAVEN BY HATING GOD 100% or NOT.

 

no

 

hating god and getting so much power to be dangerous to the universe is ike calling vishnu to kill us....

 

but if we die in this way we go in nirguna brahman.. not in heaven or vaikunta

[Guest guest]

And what is nirguna brahman and where did u get that quote from..inRamayana and Mahabaratha it was said that whoever killed fighting against god goes to heaven..

[Guest guest]

Also ur dead whether vishnu kills u or not..what happened to Abhimany in the battle field..he died the most gruesome death in the whole epic..he was taught by Krishna himself and son of arjuna,the right hand man of Krishna..

[Guest guest]

>he worshiped shiva, but with the purpose to kill rama..

 

>imagine to worship jesus christ asking him to kill buddha or >allah.. how could you call it a worship?

 

Rama was the one who challenged to kill Ravana and he isnt a coward to surrender to his enemy?Wont u get agitated if ur sisters nose is cut and the cutter asks u to bow his feet?If u were a king with all powers wont u fight or just surrender like a coward.

[Guest guest]

you started the thread asking a seemingly innocuous question about how ravana reached heaven. Now you're changing the subject upside down by defending ravan, which is totally unrelated to your original question. Hmm, it isn't very difficult to see why you're here...

[Guest guest]

"but if we die in this way we go in nirguna brahman.. not in heaven or vaikunta"

 

These vaishnavite guys can dare to say what krishna/vishnu himself doesn't say. And yet call themselves devotees of krishna or vishnu, as they think that they're doing all this to only make him look good or proud.

 

Sitting in hell the vaishnavites have chalked out by their clear logic the different levels in which there exists different types of heavens/hells and also their understanding of nirguna bramhan. Keep them in hell longer, and they will create more such levels by their logic and they will find more followers. Learning this vaishnavite thinking is hell. Unlearning this thinking is bigger hell. Moksha lies beyond these two hells & with self realization for vaishnavas.

[Ganeshprasad 0]

Jai Ganesh

 

I am glad you have recognized there is a trouble maker among us.

 

this person has no genuine inquery.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

[Guest guest]

 

see what happens to kamsa...

 

 

Asuras like Vena, Kansa etc. go to hell. All this thing about Nirguna Brahman etc. is pure speculation and nonsense like the claim of people can reach Bhagavaan by hate.

 

It is Bhagavaan who is both Nirguna and Saguna. Any body who is said to reach the ONE Brahman(who is both Nirguna and Saguna), attains Moksha.

 

Definitely Kansa or Vena did not attain moksha. If anyone claims otherwise must provide reference.

 

Lord Krishna clearly says in Gita that one who hates HIM goes to eternal HELL.

 

ahankaram balam darpam

kamam krodham ca samsritah

mam atma-para-dehesu

pradvisanto 'bhyasuyakah

 

SYNONYMS

ahankaram--false ego; balam--strength; darpam--pride; kamam--lust; krodham--anger; ca--also; samsritah--having taken shelter of; mam--Me; atma--one's own; para dehesu--in other bodies; pradvisantah--blasphemes; abhyasuyakah--envious.

 

Clinging to egoism, power, arrogance, lust, and anger; these malicious people hate Me (who dwells) in their own body and others' bodies. (16.18)

 

tan aham dvisatah kruran

samsaresu naradhaman

ksipamy ajasram asubhan

asurisv eva yonisu

 

SYNONYMS

tan--those; aham--I; dvisatah--envious; kruran--mischievous; samsaresu--into the ocean of material existence; nara-adhaman--the lowest of mankind; ksipami--put; ajasram--innumerable or forever; asubhan--inauspicious; asurisu--demoniac; eva--certainly; yonisu--in the wombs.

 

I hurl these haters, cruel, sinful, and mean people of the world, into the wombs of demons again and again. (16.19)

 

asurim yonim apanna

mudha janmani janmani

mam aprapyaiva kaunteya

tato yanty adhamam gatim

 

asurim--demoniac; yonim--species; apannah--gaining; mudhah--the foolish; janmani janmani--in birth after birth; mam--unto Me; aprapya--without achieving; eva--certainly; kaunteya--O son of Kunti; tatah--thereafter; yanti--goes; adhamam--condemned; gatim--destination.

 

O Arjuna, entering the wombs of demons birth after birth, the deluded ones sink to the lowest hell without ever attaining Me. (16.20)

[Guest guest]

Well i am not the one who is defending Ravana..if vaishnavaites themselves say on one hand he goes to heaven by hating god then that means he is in heaven..on the other hand when people say that u cant hate god and ravanas purpose was to kill rama i had to put the main reason of ravanas intention...

 

It doesnt matter what my intentions r and who i support..answer my queries if u know the answer...leave ur prejudice about me for a while..

[Guest guest]

Well it does make Krishna sound a hypocrite..This is how it is

 

His devotee Arjuna had all of it

Ahankaram

Pride,EGO(that he was a great archer)

Lust(countless women he enjoyed)

 

same applies to Krishna the casanova who molested women like crazy..

but if a man has these then he goes to eternal heaven..

 

wow what a concept?

 

Once again the question seems unanswered

 

Did Ravana,Kumbhkarana and co go to heaven or not?Forget Kamsa atleast answer for ravana...if they went to heaven then anyone who hates vishnu can go,if theyhavent then where in this concept started?

[Guest guest]

The idea of eternell HELL from where there is no return is also mentioned in Mahabharatha.

 

The following are the words of Duryodhana to KrishnA(Draupati).

 

http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m07/m07133.htm

 

All that, during the match at dice, thy foolish and wicked son, with Karna (on his side), said unto the princes of Panchala causing her to be brought into the assembly, all the harsh words, again, that Karna said unto Krishnâ, in the same place, before thyself, O king, and the sons of Pandu, in thy hearing and that of all the Kurus, viz., O KrishnA, the Pandavas are lost and have sunk into eternal hell, therefore, choose thou other husbands,--alas, the fruit of all that is now manifesting itself.

 

Meaning that Draupati cannot expect her husbands to come back after sinking into eternal hell and hence Duryodhana asks Draupati to choose another husband.

[Guest guest]

And if Ravana did go to hell then what happens to Lord Shivas powers..is he a mute spectator for his devotee going to hell.what good is he?

[Guest guest]

 

Well it does make Krishna sound a hypocrite..This is how it is

 

His devotee Arjuna had all of it

Ahankaram

Pride,EGO(that he was a great archer)

Lust(countless women he enjoyed)

 

 

Nonsense.. Nothing like that happened.

 

 

same applies to Krishna the casanova who molested women like crazy..

but if a man has these then he goes to eternal heaven..

 

wow what a concept?

 

 

Again nonsense....Ignorant hate filled comments.

 

Krishna has no material body.

 

 

Did Ravana,Kumbhkarana and co go to heaven or not?Forget Kamsa atleast answer for ravana..

 

 

Ravana and Kumbakarna took incarnations as Sisupala and somebody else(I do not remember) and then attained Moksha. This is an exception.

 

 

...if they went to heaven then anyone who hates vishnu can go,

 

 

No.

 

 

if theyhavent then where in this concept started?

 

 

Some ignorant guy started it.