For both Krishna & Allah followers.

[Guest guest]

Kindly stop fighting about religions first. If anybody in this world decides to defend and show that he is best, his religion is best and so on.. he can find 'n' no. of ways to defend and 'n' no. of ways to criticize others. To my mind both are same. Both teach duality by saying God is different and us are different. Rather this is the second last stage which you both are talking. If we really look into it, really start progressing further into spirituality you yourself will find that it is the same conciousness which is passing through everybody, all living entities. No one is different. There is only one in this world there is no second. For example in a body if hand start fighting that i am different from body what you will say? it is stupid. Just like that we are leading a life of stupidity. Kindly try to read all sacred scriptures irrespective of any religion and develop knowledge and realise oneself to get blessed. Kindly don't develop hatred; develop love towards everybody irrespective of his religion, caste, creed, countrymen etc. Thanks.

[Guest guest]

Kindly stop fighting about religions first. If anybody in this world decides to defend and show that he is best, his religion is best and so on.. he can find 'n' no. of ways to defend and 'n' no. of ways to criticize others. To my mind both are same.

•••this last phrase is the object of discussion.... une can think that A is better, one can think that B is better, one can think that A and B are the same. All three are different theories: A, B, and A+B.. freedom is freedom of thinking and freedom from being grouped by someone else under a flag, sect, religion. Your saying that "both are the same" is a position, a typical position from a respectable school of thought called "advaita", so you should expect that someone having not your idea on how the things are going on in the universe will answer if you say "abandone your ideas and follow mine".

So if you consider that we are fighting (i do not... we are exchanging opinions with great and saint freedom), you too are fighting because you are bringing a different idea of yours.

I repeat, the idea that all is the same is an "idea", not the master of all the ideas.. i think that my wife is different from your wife and i like her more than yours, if you think that all wives are equal and you can embrass every wife in the world, it is not an idea who reunites all the other ideas on wives, it is different and disturbing for almost everyone.

An example to say that "all is the same" can be an imposition and a fanaticism too.

 

Both teach duality by saying God is different and us are different.

••i do not want to speak on islamism that i do not know very well, but gaudya vaishnavism says that we are simultaneously one and different with god... one in quality, different in quantity, we are sparks, he's the fire.. we are cells, he's the whole body.. drops and the ocean.

We are the same thing, but simultaneously we never lose our individuality, and this permits to us to be unite (=yoga) with god in an eternal relationship of love, because love is a union, but it is also a separation because it is required to have two subjects for exchanging feelings each other.

 

If we really look into it, really start progressing further into spirituality you yourself will find that it is the same conciousness which is passing through everybody, all living entities. No one is different.

••and it is right, the quality, the component is the same

 

There is only one in this world there is no second

••this depends from opinion, i think that the existence has to have variety also in the absolute state or the relative should be better and more full of features than the absolute, and i find it illogical. So i repeat my conception, there's oneness in quality and variety in quantity.

 

For example in a body if hand start fighting that i am different from body what you will say?

••i will say that hand simultaneously is the body and a part of the body, he's not the same as the head, or a foot or a knee, but, belonging to the same organism necessarily the hand has to work conjointly and harmonically. But there's difference, if you cut your nails, your hairs or the hands you will feel the difference. If you chew a chapati with teeths or hands you will get different results. So in this universe there's an enjoyer, god, krsna/vishnu who is like the stomach, and the other beings, that, as the other parts of the body collaborate to bring food to the stomach.

In this way, this offering to the stomach, brings sustaining and nutrition to every other part of the body. if you say that all is the same you will see how chewing chapatis or rasagullas with hands or putting them on the head will not get the same result if we, through our mout, put them in the stomach.

So the hand is simultaneously the same with the stomach and different from it... very simple

 

Kindly try to read all sacred scriptures irrespective of any religion and develop knowledge and realise oneself to get blessed.

••oh many thanks, you are a very kind person, i hope to be more and more in this mood and behaviour.

 

Kindly don't develop hatred; develop love towards everybody irrespective of his religion, caste, creed, countrymen etc. Thanks.

•••ok, thanks again, but remember that to develope love freedom is highly necessary, so be tolerant and learn to live with people with different opinions. The equation "all is one" and we have love.. "i am not god" and there's hate, is offensive and fanatic. In my opinion it is very simple to not be disturbed when people thinks like us, the difficult thing is to tolerate and love even who has opposite ideas.

I perfectly tolerate you, i cannot say i love you because i do not know you.. and, most of all, i do not need to artificially, for me, say that "all is the same", "all theories reunites in one", "first you see difference, then you advance and you see the one" to have a peaceful life with you in this world..

 

i do not feel these discussions as fights, i am not disturbed, but if one's disturbed better to not say that "to see differences between god and creatures is bringing hate" or like you have done equating vaishnavas to fanatical muslims... i or some one else will answer..

 

you are so peaceful, you do not like arguments, and you put vaishnavism close to islamic fanaticism? naah.. learn to live in a world of differences, this is peace.

[maadhav 0]

<< develop love towards everybody irrespective of his religion, caste, creed, countrymen etc. Thanks. >>

 

do you expect by your this statement the muslims of india will develop love towars you and other hindus?

if it happens, then they would need to give up islam.

if they dont, they did not take your message.

 

do you expect hindus to develop love towards the barbaric aggressor invader ideology whose followers slaughterd millions of hindus? if so, prove you are of sane mind.

 

krishna did not say arjun to develop love for duryodhan.

you think krishna was a fool?

 

 

[Guest guest]

your statement the muslims of india will develop love towars you and other hindus?

if it happens, then they would need to give up islam.

if they dont, they did not take your message.

 

Ans. This is entirely your perception

 

do you expect hindus to develop love towards the barbaric aggressor invader ideology whose followers slaughterd millions of hindus? if so, prove you are of sane mind.

 

Ans. that is past, the situation was different, people were different and everything was different. Rather you will find such type of unreliable persons in every religion, every time, in all centuries. By keeping past people in mind you cannot say this thing. Every day each man's perception, view, intelligence, behaviour etc. varies. You yourself judge what u r a year back and now, you yourself will find the answer.

 

krishna did not say arjun to develop love for duryodhan.

you think krishna was a fool?

 

Ans. Krishna is not a fool, he has done the right thing rather teh scene was different. First thing he was in present and second that was a battlefield.

[maadhav 0]

<< that is past, the situation was different, people were different and everything was different. >>

 

my dear bhushan ji,

 

islam has not change a bit.

who did destroy bamian buddha statue?

wo did 9/11?

who killed devotees in akshar dham tempel in gandinagar?

you want to see picture sna descriptions of what islam has done in recent times? if so, check out the link at

 

http://www/hinduunity.org

 

if the there any lie there, prove it there and here.

 

<< Krishna is not a fool, he has done the right thing rather teh scene was different. First thing he was in present and second that was a battlefield. >>

 

krishna is not absent. he is every where,

and he speaks to us thru gita.

why can you not listen him?

 

this is war time agaisnt islam.

islam does terrorism all over the world.

it will not spare you if you are a non muslim.

 

US and some other nations have waged open war against this terrorism. hoe can you have any peace when terrorosts are active almost every where?

 

do you take any pride because bharat lost pak and bangaldesh to the muslims? do you know that these partitions did not solve the muslims problem we have?

 

if you are a hard core gandian, you will hard time to understand kshatriya dharma and karma. gandi was not a hindu. he was a jain at heart. for jains, there is no god. and non violence is absolute. for hindus ther eis god, and non- violence is not an absolute principle. the vedic literatures say that the aatataayis must be killed. i am saying that the ideology that is not tolerant cannot be allowed in india. islam is totally intolerant of hinduism, and has invaded in india. it is foolish to allow islam in india. hardely any muslim counry allows hinduism in their land. they will not allow you to enter mecca. so, on that groud, tell your muslims frieds to give up islam if they want to live in your hindu land - bharat. else they can live in a muslim country.

 

[atanu 0]

 

 

Both Dvaita and Advaita are valid ways suitable at some stage or other.

 

Main requirement is giving up the doer ship. Whether one sticks to Dvaita or jumps to Advaita makes no difference, if the sense of doer ship vests with small individual.

 

Because individual always believes that it does the good things only. The bad things are done by the others. This brings in an important corollary. Only, faith in Advaita can lead to transfer of doer ship, both for good as well as bad deeds, to the Self.

 

 

Atanu

[atanu 0]

Dear Madhav,

 

Krishna did not ask Arjuna to hate either.

 

The central teaching is that Krishna is all and everything is done by Him only.

 

You people are such big devotees, but do you absorb this teaching? Muslims have hated and received appropriate results. Results will always be appropriate.

 

When Krishna is Brahman, are not all Muslims within him? Then what Muslims do, over that Krishna does not have any control?

 

Does some group of people and some deeds are outside His purview? The truth is: He is all and He does all.

 

Bin Laden was finished after he destryoyed Bamiyan Buddhas. Shree Krishna will create evil to create examples.

 

Dvaita has some inbuilt deficiency. It may make man fight against man if based on predujiced faith.

 

We must one day realize the truth of what Bhushan has pointed out in his post.

 

Atanu

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Because individual always believes that it does the good things only. The bad things are done by the others.

 

you are speaking of materialists, a spiritualist is humble and he does not need to nullify his personality to became humble. Humble is the result of a relationship, if there's not plurality of subjects and objects pride and humbleness have no sense... we have to be at least two to be humble.

[Guest guest]

Dvaita has some inbuilt deficiency. It may make man fight against man if based on predujiced faith.

 

everything creates problems if based on prejudiced faith, so please do not insult and give demonstration on what you preach.... dogmas and prejudices lead to war

[Guest guest]

Explain where I insulted you.

 

Atanu

[maadhav 0]

<< Krishna did not ask Arjuna to hate either. >>

 

sure, but the main poitn is he saidn him to kill asuras like duryodhan.

 

<< The central teaching is that Krishna is all and everything is done by Him only. >>

 

sure, and he has neve said non violence is ana absolute principle. he told arjun to fight when arjun declined to fight.

 

<< Muslims have hated and received appropriate results. >>

yes, for their benefit. they got pakisa, bangladesh, homes in the vedic land, 9/11, and more.

what we hindus got?

slaughter of millions of hindus,

destructions of thousands of our temples,

invaded barbaric ideology in our home land,

permanent enemy at the border and within.

 

why we got these?

because people like you

who spend all the time in preaching the hindus who already are non violent an teh victoms if islam, and who never made a civilized person out of a muslim.

did yoy ever spen time on a muslim forum?

what you tell them there?

what respose you ggot there?

 

<< Results will always be appropriate. >>

are the above results appropriate for you?

are you a hindu or an enemy of hindus?

 

<< When Krishna is Brahman, are not all Muslims within him? Then what Muslims do, over that Krishna does not have any control? >>

 

what i see is that people like you are cowards and have no coutrol to save the devabhoomi for the vedic culture.

krishna has created kshatriya varna, and you want to eliminate that varna totally, but you have no interest to make sane any barbarian.

 

<< Does some group of people and some deeds are outside His purview? The truth is: He is all and He does all. >>

 

and krishna did not say it to arjun (to do nothing).

so why someone should listen to you and not krishna?

 

<< Bin Laden was finished after he destryoyed Bamiyan Buddhas. >>

 

finished?

did you hear spain's train bombngs?

 

<< Shree Krishna will create evil to create examples. >>

 

he does not. ignorance and greed, ect does.

yiu can say he does, but he tells you to fight,

not sit and be happy, and stop/discourage others to fight.

 

<< Dvaita has some inbuilt deficiency. It may make man fight against man >>

 

by telling arjun to fight,

krishna recommended dvaita.

 

by telling:

man manaa mad bhakta, and more,

he said dvaita is better.

howeer i would not argue about dvaita-advaita.

whe you and i both reach at the top, we will know it.

 

<< We must one day realize the truth of what Bhushan has pointed out in his post. >>

 

we must one day realize the truth of what krishna has pointed out in gita.

 

is bhushan or you above krishna?

 

 

[atanu 0]

Oh. Dear Madhav,

 

Don’t be angry. Patience and faith please. He sees everything and creates most perfect solution. One Arjun may be on the way.

 

 

”why we got these?

because people like you

who spend all the time in preaching the hindus who already are non violent an teh victoms if islam, and who never made a civilized person out of a muslim.

did yoy ever spen time on a muslim forum?

what you tell them there?”

what respose you ggot there?”

 

Madhav, do you think that we can do what you claimed we have done? Do you believe in what you are saying? Can I or anybody do something that He does not want? Please, don’t think it ever again.

 

 

”<< We must one day realize the truth of what Bhushan has pointed out in his post. >>

 

we must one day realize the truth of what krishna has pointed out in gita.

 

is bhushan or you above krishna?”

 

No. Bhushan, me, you, Muslims, Christians -- no one is above Him. He contains all. He knows all. He does all.

 

 

 

I agree I am a coward. Why don’t you take up a gun and do what He wants? Why be angry at others?

 

 

Atanu

[gokulkr 1]

Dvaita was propounded by Sri Madhvacharya & Sri Raghavendraswamy.

 

Sri Raghavendraswamy knows all . He preached Dwaitam only. So we foolish mortals have no right to criticize it by telling it as defective.

 

if you people dont like "Dvaitham", then keep away from it rather than committing blasphemy of criticizing it.

 

Do you think u know better than Guru Raghavendra. of course comparing to Raghavendra swamy your so called "adi-shankara" is nothing. TILL NOW I HAVENT HEARD ANY ADI-SHANKARAS RUSHING TO CALL OF THEIR DEVOTEES, ONLY RAGHAVENDRASWAMY IS DOING IT.

 

So Raghavendraswamy has proved himself as God (even he had not declared himself due to his humbleness) by blessing his devotees till now (he is even giving darshans to his true devotees).

 

Hello Mr.Atanu Sri Guru Raghavendraswamy has proved ur so called "Advaitham" as false. do u think urself greater than rayaru.

 

humbly agree what rayaru tells. otherwise be silent.

 

Ure not a acharya to give ur views.

 

we (vaishnavas) agree wat our acharyas said instead of giving our own views.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Please do not frighten me. I am really frightened.

 

But I am interested to know about what Rayaru said.

 

Atanu

[Guest guest]

gokulr give explanations and logical demonstrations of your faith or people will think that we vaishnavas are only dogmatic/fanatics

 

no one is convinced if you say only "sri madhvacharya, sri raghavendra have defeated advaita"

 

you have to demonstrate, vaishnava means philosopher and practitioneer not blind believer

[maadhav 0]

<< He does all.

 

I agree I am a coward. >>

 

So, a coward should not tell kshatriyas to not fight,

if he were wise enough.

 

<< Why don’t you take up a gun and do what He wants? Why be angry at others? >>

 

any one with kshatriya spirit will fight

according to his/her ability and talent etc.

 

those who choose to not fight physically can also fight intellectually. (every hindu who chooses to fight can fight in some way) can you do it? or your mission is just to cool down the kshatriyas only, or make the hindus so passive like stones that all can kick them, and no one resists?

 

find out what the vedic literature says

how to treat the six kinds of aatataayis.

 

 

[Guest guest]

"any one with kshatriya spirit will fight

according to his/her ability and talent etc."

 

ksatrya is a saint warrior at the service of a saint king under the instruction of the pure master

 

again do not pollute this sacred word, if you make it cheap you are making hinduism cheap

 

[Guest guest]

< --- you have to demonstrate, vaishnava means philosopher and practitioneer not blind believer --->

 

are u Gaudiyas doing that ?

 

i dont think any Gaudiyas have demonstrated philosophies of "Prabhupada". they also blindly follow "prabhupada" without demonstrating.

 

 

[Guest guest]

you have in this forum the problem to be considered a fanatic blind believer.. to say that also others are fanatic will not help you..

 

now try to solve your problems ...

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

First try to know basic of vaishnavam.

When we select the sampradaya, we should follow the guru without doubting gurujis words/philosophies.

 

thats what i am doing.

 

if u still point me as a FANATIC, then all other four fingers point you as a FANATIC.

 

Guru Raghavendraji knows whether me a FANATIC , or people like you.

 

Of course, many people here mix politics with religion & induce fantism. but i am not dion like that.

 

I sprung to debate only when my sampradaya gets insulted.

 

My question is : whether you will be watching the fun when someone makes fun of ur sampradaya.

 

Whatever abuses you people hurl at me doesnt goes to me. it goes to God only.

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

First try to know basic of vaishnavam.

When we select the sampradaya, we should follow the guru without doubting gurujis words/philosophies.

 

thats what i am doing.

 

if u still point me as a FANATIC, then all other four fingers point you as a FANATIC.

 

Guru Raghavendraji knows whether me a FANATIC , or people like you.

 

Of course, many people here mix politics with religion & induce fantism. but i am not dion like that.

 

I sprung to debate only when my sampradaya gets insulted.

 

My question is : whether you will be watching the fun when someone makes fun of ur sampradaya.

 

Whatever abuses you people hurl at me doesnt goes to me. it goes to God only.

 

Moreover, many times Gaudiyas had committed blasphemy by commenting on Swami Narayana. "Swami Narayana" was incaranation of krishna.

 

Gaudiyas also dont accept "Sri Vallabhacharya" as incarnation of krishna.

 

But i respect all Vaishnava sampradayas equally. (NOTE : i am posint enclyopedia of all vaishnava sampradayas in "www.audarya-fellowship.com". this alone is a prrof that i respect all vaishnava sampradayas).

 

So this is enough to prove that i am a dogmatic/fanatic.

 

My question is whether people like you have heart to accept "Swami Narayana" & "Vallabhacharya" as incarnation of Lord krishna. Answer is no. So this proves whether i am fanatic or people like you.

 

Just because there are many gaudiyas than madhavas doesnt make a madhava like me as a fanatic.

 

of course, you go to PAKISTAN, hindus are treated khaafirs. just because pakis tell hindus as khafir doesnt make hindu as evil.

 

so just because mayavadis & people like you accuse me as fanatic , i dont become a fanatic.

 

By calling me as a fanatic, you people are just exposing your true side.

 

 

[Guest guest]

now calm down

[Guest guest]

Gokul,

 

There is no fault in Saivism / Vaishnavism. Rather it is the fault of yours who wants others to follow the same path which you are following. Don't you think that this is stupid. This is what Muslims/Christians also want to do. You have shown that your philosophy and your path to realisation is wrong by criticising others path. Remember one thing, if you cannot digest others path/philosophy rather if you think that is wrong then I will say that you are reading your philosophy wrongly. Both saivism and vaishnism displays a perfect path but it is your perception how you perceive the same. I regard rather I too give importance to Guru he will try to show you the right path and way to reach to that stage. But once you attain the stage of self-realisation then all these things will get vanished. Here I have seen some of the messages that Krishna speaks to everybody through Gita. Here by saying that you all have restricted Lord Krishna to GITA only rather it is not true which we all know. He is present everywhere, in every sacred scriptures. He speaks to everybody in whatever way, whatever scripture, whatever religion etc. according to the faith of a person. Don't think like a frog in well. Try to dance to the tune of Lord whether it is in Sanskrit, Hindi, English, Urdu whatever language, in whatever religion ....... hardly matters raise yourself above religion and then observe the Sweetness of divine. Thanks....

[gokulkr 1]

< -- Rather it is the fault of yours who wants others to follow the same path which you are following. --- >

 

i didnt tell everyone to accept dwaitham. i just ask not not defame dwaitham by telling it as defective.

 

< -- You have shown that your philosophy and your path to realisation is wrong by criticising others path. -->

 

I didnt criticized any other paths. i respect all sampradayas (my enclyopedia threads in audarya-fellowship is a proof). this proves that my philosophy is genuine.

 

< -- Remember one thing, if you cannot digest others path/philosophy rather if you think that is wrong then I will say that you are reading your philosophy wrongly. -->

 

It is you who have understood me wrongly. i didint disrespected any paths anywhere. If i cant digest others, theres no reason for me to come here. i just defending my path. will u tell defending ur wife/mother is a wrong thing ?

 

<-- I regard rather I too give importance to Guru he will try to show you the right path and way to reach to that stage. -->

 

I too am expecting that. i am sure ure also not matured enough to find fault with me.

 

<-- Here by saying that you all have restricted Lord Krishna to GITA only rather it is not true which we all know. -->

 

did i say like that ? only saivatees restrict krishna to vaishnavam & gita.

 

< -- He speaks to everybody in whatever way, whatever scripture, whatever religion etc. according to the faith of a person. -->

 

thats why i emphaasized not to defame dwaitham just because u people dont like it.

 

< --- Try to dance to the tune of Lord whether it is in Sanskrit, Hindi, English, Urdu whatever language, in whatever religion ....... hardly matters raise yourself above religion and then observe the Sweetness of divine. -->

 

Thats what i am doing. i see krishna in siva,jesus,allah,buddha. do saivatees see siva in other religions. i dont think so.

 

Any way without reading my other posts dont come to a conclusion about me. I respect shiva, brahma more than you people respect. I equally respect all genuine sampradayas.

 

NOTE : Actually i am not a Madhava. I am just a devotee of "Guru Raghavendraswamy". I follow "Shuddha-advaita".

 

Just because i respect all sampradayas equally, i empazised not to defame dwaitham.

 

I THINK U HAVE GOTTEN WHAT I AM TELLING. WITHOUT KNOWING ANYHING ABOUT ME DONT COME TO A CONCLUSION.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

"i didnt tell everyone to accept dwaitham. i just ask not not defame dwaitham by telling it as defective."

 

if you make a philosophical discussion it is natural that one with opposite ideas tells you that yours are defective....

 

"I THINK U HAVE GOTTEN WHAT I AM TELLING. WITHOUT KNOWING ANYHING ABOUT ME DONT COME TO A CONCLUSION."

 

the conclusion is that the word "forum" means place to discuss... if you want simply to put on your encyclopedias or messages, especting that people do not give their opinions on what you write this is not "technically" the right place

 

considering that you get also angry insulting also other vaishnavas