enjoying sex in marriage

[Guest guest]

Why is it looked down upon for a married couple who are both devotees of the Lord enjoy selfless sexual pleasure? When a man loves a woman deeply and vice-versa and they are engaged in this sacred act for the cultivation of love and for no other purpose why should it then be called illicit? If children come as the result of this act of love then more love to give and share. I think sexual intercourse with a unselfish attitude between two joined together in a sacred marriage is fine.

[Guest guest]

who said it was illicit? i thought illicit was sex outside marriage or extra-marital affairs.

 

[Guest guest]

I had the impression, according to some commentaries I read that sex without the purpose of having a child is illicit.

[Guest guest]

I heard that regulated sex between a devotee couple is ok to a certain extent, upto the age of 50, when they should both renounce.

[imported_yasodanandana 0]

Why is it looked down upon for a married couple who are both devotees of the Lord enjoy selfless sexual pleasure?

--who looks down upon devotees is in maya

 

When a man loves a woman deeply and vice-versa and they are engaged in this sacred act for the cultivation of love and for no other purpose why should it then be called illicit?

---sincerity is essential for advancing in spiritual life. No one lives the sex in such poetical way, everyone makes sex simply to get gratification. So we simply have to be sincere with ourselves and the others

 

I think sexual intercourse with a unselfish attitude between two joined together in a sacred marriage is fine.

---there's no possibility to be unselfish until we reach the pure love for krsna. So if we are not pure devotees, we cannot be unselfish, especially in the act that is the mos pleasurable and attractive in the material world

 

so.. monogamy is an advancement

sex exclusively for procreation is another advancement

quitting sex is another advancement

 

those are necessary steps that a devotee has to do without unnecessary repression (and without concocting a moral system to justify our desires), chanting hare krsna mahamantra, and accepting the guidance of a pure uttama adhikari spiritual master

[sumedh 0]

Hare Krishna and dandavat pranam

 

 

Why is it looked down upon for a married couple who are both devotees of the Lord enjoy selfless sexual pleasure? When a man loves a woman deeply and vice-versa and they are engaged in this sacred act for the cultivation of love and for no other purpose why should it then be called illicit? If children come as the result of this act of love then more love to give and share. I think sexual intercourse with a unselfish attitude between two joined together in a sacred marriage is fine.

 

 

 

It is not looked down but it has been told in no uncertain terms that to come to the correct platform this has to be given up. Krishna does not force anything, He did not do so even on Arjuna. What you call as the cultivation of love between two persons is coming from the mental platform and is not a property of the soul and in accordance with Vedic definitions is called lust. Consequently the simple calculation is that if we keep on wanting to enjoy that then that is all we can get in accordance with our desires and not love for God coming from the platform of soul; unless we desire something we cannot hope to get it especially something of eternal value.

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna!

 

All glories to Srila Prabhupada! I offer my humble obeisances unto him!

 

"If children come as the result of this act of love then more love to give and share"

 

The statement sounds as if children are but a byproduct of love-making. This is ILLICIT. Love-making SHOULD BE ONLY FOR CHILDREN and pleasure in that is a byproduct. Not only ordinary children but good Krishna Consciousness children is the reason for a husband and wife to have SEX- NONE OTHER- HOWEVER you look at it.

 

Sex for fun,

Sex between 2 lovers (man & man or woman & woman)

sex to have pleasure

sex outside marriage

sex inside marriage

 

If any act of sex is for BEGETTING a Krishna Con child- then that is VALID- the rest NULL & VOID & ILLICIT.

 

Haribol!

 

anand

[imported_yasodanandana 0]

"If any act of sex is for BEGETTING a Krishna Con child- then that is VALID- the rest NULL & VOID & ILLICIT."

 

there's graduality in the illicitness... all the steps you have written are absolutely not the same thing

 

another thing to say is that many bona fide gurus,(in all gaudya math, iskcon included) real uttama adhikaris, simply ask to the initiates to be monogamous with the plan to increase detachment in future

[Guest guest]

Haribol,

 

Is it a better advancement to have no sex at all than having sex for begetting Krishna Con child in marriage? For me it sounds like the same purity.

 

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna.

 

It's very difficult to give up sex, it's human nature.

 

But you have to realize that sexual lust will eventually cause misery even in this life for many and the cause of us coming back life after life. It's desires that causes us to come back to satisfy those desires.

 

So go on having sex, but it's not free. You will have to pay for it with your soul being covered in different material bodies for countless lifetimes. You will not go back to krishnaloka after this life but back here on this horrible planet called Earth. Or maybe another horrible planet. From the highest planet in the material to the lowest all are places opf misery, wherein repeated birth takes place.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna!

 

All glories to Srila Prabhupada! I offer my humble obeisances unto him!

 

Yes, it is correct to have sex for begetting Krishna Conscious child. I can give 3 references where it says sex for KC child is the correct thing.

 

1. Krishna in the Bhagavat Gita clearly said (not sure the chapter number adn text) that IAM SEX IN A MARRIAGE FOR BEGETTING A KRISHNA CONSCIOUS CHILD (iam paraphrasing).

 

2. Srila Prabhupada once referred to Srila Bhaktivinod Takura as an ideal householder and implied about how he had 11 children. In this instance, again, Srila Bhaktivinod Takura created 11 KC children. One of which was Srila Prabhuapda's GURU.

 

3. Bhaktisidhhanta Saraswati Goswami Maharaj said (i am paraphrasing) that he will have sex a 100 times if he will be able to beget good Krishna Con children.

 

From these, it is evident sex is accepted and nothing illicit about it. It is just the purposes behind sex. All of them directly say that SEX for begetting KRISHNA CON child is the right thing to do.

 

If one gets married, it is inevitable to not have sex. However, it is possible to regulate sex activity and that regulation is for begetting only KC children.

 

So, it is a continous process where one begetts a child and trains the child in KC. So, things dont just stop after sex. It is an ongoing process.

 

Haribol!

 

anand

[Guest guest]

it is an advancement because in vedic culture a grihasta when he's fit for, generally in the old age, he becomes vanaprasta, then sannyasi...

 

obviously vaishnavas can be completely liberated externally acting in any social or ecclesiastical condition.. but generally the path is : brahmachary.. grihasta... vanaprasta.. sannyasa

[Guest guest]

it is whats called regulated sense enjoyment.

[Guest guest]

Step by step, easy does it, from sraddha to prema

 

Also from animal life sex to only procreative sex.

 

Ultimately sex has to be completely given up, but not artificially, one needs Guru'c mercy. Pray for it and you will get.

 

Yes ,sincerity.

 

 

[BruzWayne 0]

Hare Krishna, gitamrta.org, in reply to your comment,

 

Hare Krishna. It's very difficult to give up sex, it's human nature.

 

--I agree, that's why it is smart aiming at regulating sex rather that giving it up. It gets regulated by having it following the vedic principles about it.

 

But you have to realize that sexual lust will eventually cause misery even in this life for many and the cause of us coming back life after life.

 

--Yes, sexual lust creates karma. But on the other hand regulated sex in Krishna Consciousness is allowed and it doesn't create karma.

 

It's desires that causes us to come back to satisfy those desires.

 

--We should have only one desire, "remain under the service of Lord Sri Krishna always every day". However, our minds will suddenly create other desires, therefore we must learn to create desires that are good for Krishna Consciousness. For example, we need sex, then we must desire that Krishna gives us a nice KC woman for a wife in order to have regulated sex with she. Otherwise, if after the need of sex appears in our minds and then we desire to have a woman for getting sex pleasure with she without getting married, then that is a dangerous desire that will create karma.

 

 

So go on having sex, but it's not free. You will have to pay for it with your soul being covered in different material bodies for countless lifetimes. You will not go back to krishnaloka after this life but back here on this horrible planet called Earth. Or maybe another horrible planet. From the highest planet in the material to the lowest all are places opf misery, wherein repeated birth takes place.

 

--This is true and that's why all of us are here, because we haven't learned yet to fix our minds only in the lotus feet of Krishna. So hopefully we can learn to have regulated sex first and then aspire to fix our minds on Krishna's lotus feet only, if at all possible someday.

 

Hare Krishna.

[BruzWayne 0]

Hare Krishna Jambu. You posted this topic wondering about the directions in order to enjoy sex in marriage. You know what really knocks me out about it? The recommendation that it takes 50 rounds of maha-mantra that each person in the KC married couple must chant before having the sexual relationship. I mean, how many japa rounds have you ever done by yourself in a row during the same day? My best record is having chanted 32 rounds in one day during Janmastami back in the year 2000. So the idea of chanting 50 rounds in a row in order to have sex it knocks me out, it's too much chanting... but let's say, ok, ok, I'll go for it. Next thing is, and where is the KC wife? I took a look at some KC women living or attending a KC center and guess what, it takes lakshmi in order to invite them out. So then you find yourself in the situation that first you need some lakshmi in order to be prepared to get a wife, you know, to have a nice home where to live and a car and a business and some money in the bank for vacation and expenses of all kind... but then you say, ok, ok, let's make enough lakshmi in order to propose marriage to one of these KC women and guess what... you work and work and work and, huh, no lakshmi, so one day you may wonder if all this nonsense of KC is true or is it just a bad joke from the Devil...

 

And when you think of all the times that you have sinned in the past in this life and what to say about other lives, regarding having sex with women without following the KC regulations, then we can realize that first we're going to have to pay a lot of bad circumstances due to our own karma before Krishna gives us a KC wife.

 

So, in my opinion, we may not have a KC wife in this life at all before paying all the karma that we owe from past relationships. Maybe we'll get lucky in our next life, lol.

 

And while we are doing all these KC sacrifices and austerities, somehow, we are watching at the same time karmi people kissing each other in the streets and we know that lots of couples are having sex every where and every day without any regulations, thus our minds receiving strokes from Vishnu's mace day after day... "Others are having pleasure from sex while you don't due to your silly devotion".

 

Ain't this life beautiful?

 

While we are talking about this, lots of couples are enjoying sex without regulations, right now, every where. Of course, they will have to face some consequences like getting AIDS or suddenly getting an unwanted pregnancy or whatever. lol.

 

While for us, there can be a nice KC wife and a sort of happy situation in the future, maybe in another life, after paying our own karma.

 

It's up to us, to keep up the yoga or quit -out of lack of patience.-

 

Karma... doesn't get paid fast and easy, lol. It takes time to pay it. At least we are not creating more karma for ourselves when we are doing KC bhakti yoga.

 

Hare Krishna.

[Guest guest]

I think that if his Devine Grace were still here he'd slap you silly (not in the physical sense). The question should be raised "why do people in the dark dump into things and hurt themselves" answer "because they do not have the benefit of having sight nor do they have the benefit of knowing the where the source of all light is". So it is my contention that rather than be tormented by such trivial things let your mind be at peace seek always the mercy of Guru.

[Joyan 0]

No one sees sex in this poetic way? Really? Because i do. You are wrong to say that everyone has sex simply for gratification - this is not true. You cannot make blanket statements like that. For this matter i could say everyone eats food simply to fulfill their own selfish desires - no, thats not true. We eat food to heal our bodies, and to share in a meal with our family. Sharing in love is not WRONG and i would be shocked and dismayed to see that any follower of Krsna say "Love is wrong."

 

I am sad to see you say that living unselfishly is impossible. However, i would disagree. With your arguement, one could say that chanting the mahamantra is "selfish" because we gain something from it. How absurd!

[imported_yasodanandana 0]

the 50 rounds are not for "having sex" but for "having (krsna conscious!!!)children"

 

"So, in my opinion, we may not have a KC wife in this life at all before paying all the karma that we owe from past relationships..."

 

if we have a grihasta mentality, we have to live a real grihasta life in order to become krsna conscious and pay the karma. So to have a wife/husband is essential for our advancement.. if we don't advance karma is still there

 

"And while we are doing all these KC sacrifices and austerities, somehow, we are watching at the same time karmi people kissing each other in the streets and we know that lots of couples are having sex every where and every day without any regulations, thus our minds receiving strokes from Vishnu's mace day after day... "Others are having pleasure from sex while you don't due to your silly devotion"."

 

this constant thinking of others making sex is in itself breaking regulative principles and it risks to be more damaging than breaking in the usual way

 

if i am attached to sex and i have it, even if illicit, i can live for a certain period without such obsession and be concentrated in chanting hare krsna

 

it is not perfection, but it is better than think obsessively 24/24 how much non devotees are lucky and what a big pleasure we're missing