The Shadow....

[Guest guest]

These days I am facing myself in a way that is tearing every part of me up. The

point in the process that I am facing the mirror and being completely honest

with myself.

 

How many people really know themselves? Are you who you are because of societal

standards, or because you really feel that way? Is it fear? I think about all of

my philosophies on what makes a good person, and I find myself wondering if even

that is true. All of the things I believe I am.

 

How many times do we lie to ourselves and others for simple acceptance. Why do

we feel the need to overcompensate with good deeds to hide our true nature? How

many people really get a rush when they see that car crash? How many people look

for bodies expecting to see blood? Half of yourself hopes nobody is hurt... but

that little shadow self is secretely looking for some gore. It's hard to admit

it. I know.

 

Why is reality TV so popular? Built around suffering. So many people are

addicted to it because it is fun for us. If that wasn't our nature, it wouldn't

be so popular.

 

SO I wonder... how many honest people are there.

 

I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know she

was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many good

deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.

 

Is it so bad to admit that you are a cruel and manipulative person but still be

an active member of society and not act upon it? To know that you are both

loving and giving, yet selfish and unkind to some?

 

I wonder why spiritualists are always so positive and loving. Is that to make up

for the deep dark center in themselves... the shadow? Are they really that

" White light? " Or is it because they are afraid.... Afraid of what they know is

waiting in the dark... Of who they pretend they aren't... Are we really so good?

I doubt it.

 

Anyways just some stuff going on in my head these days. Curious about what other

people have to say about it.

 

Much love to all!

 

-Tiffany S

[Guest guest]

Hi Tiffany, I will give you some of my thoughts on what you wrote. The bible say

mankind is sinful and born in sin and is capable of all corrupt deeds, everyone

one of us. Even those who appear to be good. But God with his unconditional love

provided for our short comings. I am sure you know the story. The way I see it,

those ones who know they are corrupt, who commit very corrupt deeds can come to

see their need of a savior much quicker than the ones who see themselves as good

or not so bad.

 

Not all people love to look upon the gore. When I come upon a wreck, I turn my

head and do not look. I have never been the first one to come upon such a scene

and I thank God for that. If I ever did though, I would stop and see if I could

be of help to them. I am not all that good at that though. At the sight of

someone in pain/suffering, I mostly just automaticly pass out. I do not like

reality TV and do not watch it. One time of watching it for a little while at my

brother's was enough for me. I can not stand seeing people getting hurt and in

pain.

 

As for Mother Teresa being called an atheist. I would say that is just heresay.

I did not know about that until your post and went and read up on why she was

being called an atheist. FRom her letter, I don't see her as totally losing her

faith. I see her as going through the dark night of the soul, where her faith

was being tested. I would say she past the test, she never gave up her calling,

but continued even though she was no longer hearing from God. She was in service

to others right up until she died. If she was an atheist she you would not have

been able to continue.

 

I can identify with her agony, for I do not sense or hear from God as I did in

the beginning either. I have had nothing but my faith to go on for years now,

but I cannot give up what I know is true even though my faith gets weak at

times. I thank you for writing about Teresa today. Reading of her struggles has

given me strength. My faith has been very low lately and this is just boosted I

needed. This shows me God is still with me in an indirect way and if He never

reveals Himself in a personal way as He did in the beginning, it is OK with me

now.

 

Thank you Tiffany.

 

This facing yourself in compete honesty is good. I pray you will be able to work

through your struggles and come out shininng.

 

Love & blessings,

Linda

 

 

, " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia wrote:

>

> These days I am facing myself in a way that is tearing every part of me up.

The point in the process that I am facing the mirror and being completely honest

with myself.

>

> How many people really know themselves? Are you who you are because of

societal standards, or because you really feel that way? Is it fear? I think

about all of my philosophies on what makes a good person, and I find myself

wondering if even that is true. All of the things I believe I am.

>

> How many times do we lie to ourselves and others for simple acceptance. Why do

we feel the need to overcompensate with good deeds to hide our true nature? How

many people really get a rush when they see that car crash? How many people look

for bodies expecting to see blood? Half of yourself hopes nobody is hurt... but

that little shadow self is secretely looking for some gore. It's hard to admit

it. I know.

>

> Why is reality TV so popular? Built around suffering. So many people are

addicted to it because it is fun for us. If that wasn't our nature, it wouldn't

be so popular.

>

> SO I wonder... how many honest people are there.

>

> I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know

she was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many

good deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.

>

> Is it so bad to admit that you are a cruel and manipulative person but still

be an active member of society and not act upon it? To know that you are both

loving and giving, yet selfish and unkind to some?

>

> I wonder why spiritualists are always so positive and loving. Is that to make

up for the deep dark center in themselves... the shadow? Are they really that

" White light? " Or is it because they are afraid.... Afraid of what they know is

waiting in the dark... Of who they pretend they aren't... Are we really so good?

I doubt it.

>

> Anyways just some stuff going on in my head these days. Curious about what

other people have to say about it.

>

> Much love to all!

>

> -Tiffany S

>

[Guest guest]

"When you face yourself" is way of wording something we do but it is misleading to what we expect from the question. If you faced yourself you would know who you are, but it doesn't seem to work that way. Maybe who you are is what faces the world, but you are not the world you are facing. Doesn't help much, huh? We still don't know who we are, and it would really really help if we could pin ourselves to something in the world. If we could identify with something and then have a self to know and attribute judgments. This would be especially helpful when we try to understand why we do the things we do and why others do what they do. Most people need that in order to stay sane, given how difficult it is to make sense of and process the powerful

energies of emotion and thought.

 

I think what we are going through is the suspension of disbelief, we have briefly returned to reality and realized the movie we are watching in our mind isn't real. And we were sitting in the movie chair our whole lives, lost in the story. We need that story, with good and bad characters, a plot, and of course a happy ending. Bad endings are unacceptable to our character because our biology uses the stories to reach what the body needs. I have always struggled with standing up for myself, competition, and basic survival. My life or the path of my body is not secure, nor is it fulfilled, and the pain of this has always lead me into dangerous places like drugs and risk taking. Dying from an overdose is a very real threat to my survival, and that is not what one character would like to hear. As a presence, I am aware that my form may not make it and this is not a bad ending.

 

I refrain from particpating in a great deal of life. For one I don't like what it feels like to put across a character, and two I don't like it when other people try to shackle me with a character. Perhaps because of the pain suffered growing up, from my own failures to feeling the pain of the world, entering into a story with an interplay between characters does not appeal to me. For one I have no interest in being in a story where I am becoming something, where I am becoming someone in relation to what someone else is becoming. That isn't real to me anymore. But I really enjoy sharing this world with the presence of others, and it has been difficult attracting those circumstances into my life.

 

The evolution of a creation is what we are experiencing. The way people behave is the unfolding of this process. It is difficult to accept that there are no good or bad people because we grow up with that programming. One behavior or process does not condem all of creation, which is what many of us go through when we go through something and think the reality is just a cruel accident. Even after we can think abstractly as adults, we still have trouble letting go of the need to take one part of the world and make it into something in our minds. Sometimes, especially in the heat of an exchange, we cannot help making an imaginary character or event the result of our discomfort or suffering. It is harder to be a presence that is facing an evolving world of processes. The shadow does not belong to you or anyone else. As a presence we have processes established long ego and the newly emerging

ones. Most people like to identify themselves with these new systems with greater order and intergration. People seperate the patterns they don't understand and it becomes a shadow, or there are processes they simply resist or deny that become shadow. Naturally things like emotions are suppressed because people don't incorperate that into their identity.

 

I don't want to become invested in the imaginary dramas, victories, and losses the mind will create because we are biologically driven by evolution to employ them. This causes me a lot of pain because by not participating in the game that unites most of humanity, I miss out on what is good for me like the energies of touch and cooperation.

 

My body and mind are going through so many changes and feelings. I have my own little corner of evolution to experience, my greatest sense of success or feeling "good" is how well I can reconcile the fact that I create my own experience of this evolving creation through my own judgments.

 

 

 

sangelikdementia <angelikdementia Sent: Sunday, August 2, 2009 5:52:01 PM The Shadow....

These days I am facing myself in a way that is tearing every part of me up. The point in the process that I am facing the mirror and being completely honest with myself.How many people really know themselves? Are you who you are because of societal standards, or because you really feel that way? Is it fear? I think about all of my philosophies on what makes a good person, and I find myself wondering if even that is true. All of the things I believe I am.How many times do we lie to ourselves and others for simple acceptance. Why do we feel the need to overcompensate with good deeds to hide our true nature? How many people really get a rush when they see that car crash? How many people look for bodies expecting to see blood? Half of yourself hopes nobody is hurt... but that little shadow self is secretely looking for some gore. It's hard to admit it. I know.Why is reality TV so popular? Built around suffering. So many people are

addicted to it because it is fun for us. If that wasn't our nature, it wouldn't be so popular. SO I wonder... how many honest people are there.I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know she was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many good deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.Is it so bad to admit that you are a cruel and manipulative person but still be an active member of society and not act upon it? To know that you are both loving and giving, yet selfish and unkind to some? I wonder why spiritualists are always so positive and loving. Is that to make up for the deep dark center in themselves.. . the shadow? Are they really that "White light?" Or is it because they are afraid.... Afraid of what they know is waiting in the dark... Of who they pretend they aren't... Are we really so good? I doubt it.Anyways just some

stuff going on in my head these days. Curious about what other people have to say about it.Much love to all!-Tiffany S

[Guest guest]

Linda...I can understand how you can see the sin aspect from a Christian

perspective. I really can't say anything as far as that goes... Since I left the

Christian faith many years ago, my opinions differ...

 

As far as Mother Teresa.... She inspired me as well. Knowing that she did not

believe in God, she still did good out of the pureness of her own heart. To be

kind without question or expectation of any reward. She is one of the most

inspiring people I have to look up to. Pure, honest, good. That is definitely

saint worthy in my opinion!

 

I guess what I was saying is I am more or less pondering what is true to our

nature vs what isn't. If what we believe to be good deeds is merely

cultural/societal upbringing.

 

As an animal of this earth, we are a part of the cycle. I see certain animals

act in their circles and it is quite interesting as we are so similar to them.

How apes have their families, mourn the dead, cannibalize and install terror

tactics. How cats kill without mercy, even offspring that are not from them, but

they show great affection and love to each other.

 

I remember this episode on a leopards life. She killed a monkey because it was

on her territory. She didn't know that the monkey had a baby attached to her.

When the mother was dead she took that baby monkey to the tree with her and

tried to take care of it in mercy. Unfortunately the baby died from the cold...

but it was so beautiful.

 

I am beginning to wonder about all of these rules we have. If these rules are

merely a way for us to function as a dominating species. Like murder... it seems

to have a double standard. It is okay for the government to come in and invade

other countries, but for the typical man... it is evil? I have a hard time

determining the difference. Is it only okay because of our leaders? If so then

is murder a part of our nature... if so, then is it a sin if all other predators

commit it even to their own kind? Are they sinful? Do we really only feel this

way because of our upbringing... then what is really wrong? Isn't it also wrong

to use rat poison and ant traps? I guess pests don't qualify and that seems an

error to me. What is the difference? Because society says it is okay?

 

I think about natural human emotions... rage, depression, fear, lust... I wonder

how anyone could even consider those wrong as they all serve a purpose for our

survival as a living, breathing earth dweller. Depression lets you know that

something is wrong, so fix it. Anger lets you know that you are BEING wronged,

so fix it. Lust helps you procreate... so procreate. Fear keeps you from

sleeping with lions, hence being alive the next day. Stuff like that.

 

As Zack said, I don't want to put on a character show either.

 

" My body and mind are going through so many changes and feelings. I have my own

little corner of evolution to experience, my greatest sense of success or

feeling " good " is how well I can reconcile the fact that I create my own

experience of this evolving creation through my own judgments. "

 

I totally do agree with Chrism's lessons on forgiveness and balance. It has

helped immensely. Perhaps that is why I am here. Realizing that I wasn't wrong,

it was only taught to feel guilty about certain thoughts and actions. Forgiving

myself for feeling that way and others as well.

 

When I think about every mistake I ever made I no longer see it as " sinful. " I

see it as perfection. For without it, I would not be here, going through my K

experience. No guilt is left in me.

 

I am not necessarily struggling with anything, so no worries there, if anything

it is the new acceptance that these parts that has thrown me for a loop. It is

quite the surprise realizing that I am neither a good angel nor a bad one. That

these parts of me are perfect. That I am! That I don't have to do good deeds or

be the volunteer of the year. That it is perfectly acceptable to be a wonderful

mother, love my husband, be a great member of society purely because I choose

to. That there is no fear of doing anything " wrong " anymore.

 

That is what I mean by the Shadow... integrating with it and loving it. All that

I am. And realizing that if I get pissed off.. that is okay too. So long as I do

something about it lol!

 

-Tiffany S

 

 

 

 

 

, " Linda " <crazycats711

wrote:

>

> Hi Tiffany, I will give you some of my thoughts on what you wrote. The bible

say mankind is sinful and born in sin and is capable of all corrupt deeds,

everyone one of us. Even those who appear to be good. But God with his

unconditional love provided for our short comings. I am sure you know the story.

The way I see it, those ones who know they are corrupt, who commit very corrupt

deeds can come to see their need of a savior much quicker than the ones who see

themselves as good or not so bad.

>

> Not all people love to look upon the gore. When I come upon a wreck, I turn my

head and do not look. I have never been the first one to come upon such a scene

and I thank God for that. If I ever did though, I would stop and see if I could

be of help to them. I am not all that good at that though. At the sight of

someone in pain/suffering, I mostly just automaticly pass out. I do not like

reality TV and do not watch it. One time of watching it for a little while at my

brother's was enough for me. I can not stand seeing people getting hurt and in

pain.

>

> As for Mother Teresa being called an atheist. I would say that is just

heresay. I did not know about that until your post and went and read up on why

she was being called an atheist. FRom her letter, I don't see her as totally

losing her faith. I see her as going through the dark night of the soul, where

her faith was being tested. I would say she past the test, she never gave up her

calling, but continued even though she was no longer hearing from God. She was

in service to others right up until she died. If she was an atheist she you

would not have been able to continue.

>

> I can identify with her agony, for I do not sense or hear from God as I did in

the beginning either. I have had nothing but my faith to go on for years now,

but I cannot give up what I know is true even though my faith gets weak at

times. I thank you for writing about Teresa today. Reading of her struggles has

given me strength. My faith has been very low lately and this is just boosted I

needed. This shows me God is still with me in an indirect way and if He never

reveals Himself in a personal way as He did in the beginning, it is OK with me

now.

>

> Thank you Tiffany.

>

> This facing yourself in compete honesty is good. I pray you will be able to

work through your struggles and come out shininng.

>

> Love & blessings,

> Linda

>

>

 

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I believe it was Mother Therresa who said she did all the things she did as she was aware of a "mini hitler" inside of her. Yes, I am very aware of my shadows, and I'm not really that ashamed of them (I used to be), they are there as part of my whole and so must be part of my perfection. I do strive to live in love and service but sometimes find myself wanting to punch people on the end of their nose for what ever reason :-)) We did chose to eat from the tree of knowledge, to know both good and bad so we could grow up, I think God always intended for us to eat from that tree as we needed to learn to be thinking for ourselves and become adults.Love to you and your shadow, elektra x x x

[Guest guest]

Hello sister Tiff S, you have me curious. It's the first time i came across the word atheist relegated to M.Teresa, if you have time, educate me please.Love Love Love to you my dear. ty

 

I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know she was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many good deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.

[Guest guest]

I ran across it a in a magazine about it a year or two ago, in a doctors office.

I was actually quite shocked when I read it. Here are a few news sites I can

muster up real quick...

 

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,294395,00.html

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/08/23/eveningnews/main3199062.shtml

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/aug/24/wasmotherteresaanatheist

 

Hope this helps...

 

-Tiffany S

 

 

, inkong Flrr

<inkong08flrr wrote:

>

> Hello sister Tiff S, you have me curious. It's the first time i came across

the word atheist relegated to M.Teresa, if you have time, educate me please.

> Love Love Love to you my dear. ty

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

>

>

>

> I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know

she was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many

good deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.

>

[Guest guest]

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1655415,00.html

 

This is a 6 page article that tells more of what she went through.

 

Her becoming an athiest is what the main media (FOX, CBS, NBC) protrayed, which

isn't the belief of Rev. Brian Kolodiejchuk who is the author of the book

created from her letters.

 

Linda

 

, " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia wrote:

>

> I ran across it a in a magazine about it a year or two ago, in a doctors

office. I was actually quite shocked when I read it. Here are a few news sites I

can muster up real quick...

>

> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,294395,00.html

>

> http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/08/23/eveningnews/main3199062.shtml

>

> http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/aug/24/wasmotherteresaanatheist

>

> Hope this helps...

>

> -Tiffany S

>

>

> , inkong Flrr

<inkong08flrr@> wrote:

> >

> > Hello sister Tiff S, you have me curious. It's the first time i came across

the word atheist relegated to M.Teresa, if you have time, educate me please.

> > Love Love Love to you my dear. ty

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ________________________________

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > I wonder how many demons Mother Teresa had. Was she secretly racist? I know

she was an Atheist... but was there more than that? For someone with so many

good deeds under her belt... she had to have something more going on inside.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry Tiffany, I guess I misunderstood that first senstence you wrote, probably

some of the rest too.

 

@@ These days I am facing myself in a way that is tearing every part of me up.@@

 

That just sounded like a struggle to me. LOL!

 

I do believe mankind was created perfect in the beginning as well as the

animals. The way I see it, we nor the animals were preditors in the beginning.

It is only after mankind choose to know good and evil that this changed all

things and death and destruction became apart of our world. We ourselves chose

to be like the gods (I take these gods were the fallen angels) knowing good and

evil. The way I see it, it did not wake us up to consiciousness, but put us to

sleep (spiritual death). The religions, mystery school teachings of old where

ways man tried in his own power to get back what was lost, mostly likely

inspired by the angels both the fallen and the ones who did not fall. From

watching the Zeitgeist Movie, there were two brotherhoods, the black and the

white, so it makes sense that there were two teachings.

 

I do believe there is some truth in those teachings or I would not be here. The

bible says Lucifer, the head of the fallen, does not have the ability to create,

he can only mimic. He takes what is from the God source and distorts it so as to

keep us in an unconscious state spiritually. How many people in the world are

truly spiritual awakened? Not very many, compared to how many of us there are.

Lucifers desires to keep as many as possible as slaves to serve his agenda.

 

The God source did not leave us in our fallen state. The laws was given so that

we could become conscious of our now fallen spiritual nature. We know right and

wrong from the law written inside us as well as written outside of ourselves. It

is even written in nature and the stars..the mystery schools of old knew this.

 

The way I see it, the negative emotions were not part of our beginning state

either. They are apart of us now, because we chose to know duality. They are

not apart of our true real selves. Look at the word " shadow " itself, a shadow is

just an elusive thing that is not really a part of you. When you look down at

your shadow it is not a part of you, it is just a dark image of you. It is the

same thing with the inner shadow is the way I see it. Both are an illusion of

you. It is only the absent of light.

 

The illusions that were given " not " to make us to become conscicous beings, for

we were already conscious beings in our original state, but conscious only of

good/love. When we took of the tree of knowledge of good and evil we became

spiritually unconscious (same meaning as spiritually dead) of who we were. We

now needed the opposite illusions as a contrast to realize the state we have

fallen into. The law was given so that we could see what we had now become. The

God source did not turn His back on us, we turned our back on Him. Going by what

the bible says, the God source desired for us to take of the Tree of life, but

were given free will to chose for ourselves.

 

Even so, God still loves us unconditionally and has not left us to figure our

own way out. In his great love for us he has provided a way out.

 

As for Mother Teresa, it would be how one would looks at it I guess. That

webpage that states her becoming an athiest is that one person's opinion is the

way I see it. I do not see her as totally losing faith in God, mostly because

she did continued her service to others. The guy who wrote the book from her

letters does not see it has losing total faith either.

 

Quote:

@@ Yet Kolodiejchuk sees it in St. John's context, as darkness within faith.

Teresa found ways, starting in the early 1960s, to live with it and abandoned

neither her belief nor her work. Kolodiejchuk produced the book as proof of the

faith-filled perseverance that he sees as her most spiritually heroic act. @@

 

I totally do agree with Chrism's lessons on forgiveness and balance as well.

 

I cannot see mistakes as perfection though, there would be no need for

forgiveness is that were so. I do think I am beginning to understand what you

and others are saying, that we co-created this world and can now through

enlightenment are taking part in recreating it.

 

I see myself as perfect in Christ, but I also do believe it is left up to us to

take what is given and use our gifts to take part in becoming co-creators of

heaven on earth. The bible says we are to take back the dominion over the of

earth that was taken from us in the fall.

 

One of my favorite bible verses is James 2:26 As the body without the

spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

 

It takes both faith and works to take back what is rightfully ours.

 

Tiffany, even though your way is different than mine, I am glad you have peace

with your way of dealing with the guilt and all.

 

Love, blessings, and peace to you on your journey.

 

Linda

 

 

 

 

, " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia wrote:

>

> Linda...I can understand how you can see the sin aspect from a Christian

perspective. I really can't say anything as far as that goes... Since I left the

Christian faith many years ago, my opinions differ...

>

> As far as Mother Teresa.... She inspired me as well. Knowing that she did not

believe in God, she still did good out of the pureness of her own heart. To be

kind without question or expectation of any reward. She is one of the most

inspiring people I have to look up to. Pure, honest, good. That is definitely

saint worthy in my opinion!

>

> I guess what I was saying is I am more or less pondering what is true to our

nature vs what isn't. If what we believe to be good deeds is merely

cultural/societal upbringing.

>

[Guest guest]

Hey Tiffany,

 

I would just like to tip my hat to you for your insight about human emotions and

the whole concept of good/sin. What a mess our cultural programmings have made

:\

 

I'd like to offer my thoughts about good/bad from a scientifi-ish perspective.

I've come to view everything as " energy " , with no qualitative attachments. I

view " creation " as energy harmonizing to create more/new energy. I see

" destruction " as energies out of synch creating less/new energy. Along with the

scientific perspective comes the idea that in the void you actually have

infinite potential. So complete destruction only paves the way for infinite

creation! Big circle, ouroboros snake, infinite loop, etc.

 

Science breaks down pretty hard when consciousness comes into play though... I

would say the only time you find true " evil " as we all think of it is when a

conscious being does something that deep down they don't want to do, but their

experiential programming makes it very hard for them to choose what they really

want.

 

I would say love is the feeling of creation, and anger is the feeling of

destruction. Harmony and discord. Both have their uses and are needed to find

balance. Because of our experience with reality and the programming it gives

(such a huge bias for creation, with ample opportunity for destruction) I think

we push our destructive nature back from our awareness and it becomes the shadow

as you've described.

 

" That is what I mean by the Shadow... integrating with it and loving it. All

that I am. And realizing that if I get pissed off.. that is okay too. So long as

I do something about it lol! "

 

PERFECT

 

Blessings to you, I think you are finding your path to balance on!

 

-Gabriel

 

 

 

, " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia wrote:

>

> Linda...I can understand how you can see the sin aspect from a Christian

perspective. I really can't say anything as far as that goes... Since I left the

Christian faith many years ago, my opinions differ...

>

> As far as Mother Teresa.... She inspired me as well. Knowing that she did not

believe in God, she still did good out of the pureness of her own heart. To be

kind without question or expectation of any reward. She is one of the most

inspiring people I have to look up to. Pure, honest, good. That is definitely

saint worthy in my opinion!

>

> I guess what I was saying is I am more or less pondering what is true to our

nature vs what isn't. If what we believe to be good deeds is merely

cultural/societal upbringing.

>

> As an animal of this earth, we are a part of the cycle. I see certain animals

act in their circles and it is quite interesting as we are so similar to them.

How apes have their families, mourn the dead, cannibalize and install terror

tactics. How cats kill without mercy, even offspring that are not from them, but

they show great affection and love to each other.

>

> I remember this episode on a leopards life. She killed a monkey because it was

on her territory. She didn't know that the monkey had a baby attached to her.

When the mother was dead she took that baby monkey to the tree with her and

tried to take care of it in mercy. Unfortunately the baby died from the cold...

but it was so beautiful.

>

> I am beginning to wonder about all of these rules we have. If these rules are

merely a way for us to function as a dominating species. Like murder... it seems

to have a double standard. It is okay for the government to come in and invade

other countries, but for the typical man... it is evil? I have a hard time

determining the difference. Is it only okay because of our leaders? If so then

is murder a part of our nature... if so, then is it a sin if all other predators

commit it even to their own kind? Are they sinful? Do we really only feel this

way because of our upbringing... then what is really wrong? Isn't it also wrong

to use rat poison and ant traps? I guess pests don't qualify and that seems an

error to me. What is the difference? Because society says it is okay?

>

> I think about natural human emotions... rage, depression, fear, lust... I

wonder how anyone could even consider those wrong as they all serve a purpose

for our survival as a living, breathing earth dweller. Depression lets you know

that something is wrong, so fix it. Anger lets you know that you are BEING

wronged, so fix it. Lust helps you procreate... so procreate. Fear keeps you

from sleeping with lions, hence being alive the next day. Stuff like that.

>

> As Zack said, I don't want to put on a character show either.

>

> " My body and mind are going through so many changes and feelings. I have my

own little corner of evolution to experience, my greatest sense of success or

feeling " good " is how well I can reconcile the fact that I create my own

experience of this evolving creation through my own judgments. "

>

> I totally do agree with Chrism's lessons on forgiveness and balance. It has

helped immensely. Perhaps that is why I am here. Realizing that I wasn't wrong,

it was only taught to feel guilty about certain thoughts and actions. Forgiving

myself for feeling that way and others as well.

>

> When I think about every mistake I ever made I no longer see it as " sinful. " I

see it as perfection. For without it, I would not be here, going through my K

experience. No guilt is left in me.

>

> I am not necessarily struggling with anything, so no worries there, if

anything it is the new acceptance that these parts that has thrown me for a

loop. It is quite the surprise realizing that I am neither a good angel nor a

bad one. That these parts of me are perfect. That I am! That I don't have to do

good deeds or be the volunteer of the year. That it is perfectly acceptable to

be a wonderful mother, love my husband, be a great member of society purely

because I choose to. That there is no fear of doing anything " wrong " anymore.

>

> That is what I mean by the Shadow... integrating with it and loving it. All

that I am. And realizing that if I get pissed off.. that is okay too. So long as

I do something about it lol!

>

> -Tiffany S

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

When I was lost in the illusion that I was dying from HIV I didn't believe in GoD (in the beginning part) I believed we just died and that was that. I then took it upon myself to make the world a better place, not for reward from a GoD or something in the after life, I did it out of pure love and forgiveness for humanity, my way on righting the wrong I felt had been done to me. I thought, if I die I want to have made this world a better place so something like this is less likely to happen to another person ever again.Thats why when I fell in love with hubby, something I never intended on doing, (I was just going to stay alone and die in my mind) I couldnt forgive myself for not telling him, how could I have done all that good work and then ruin it all by not facing my fears with the man i love? I wasnt afraid to die either, I was afraid to tell people I

(thought I) had HIV as it was so dirty and taboo.hmmmm, strange how we can operate. (I know I didnt really ruin it but thats how my mind felt in the moment)I did some of my greatest acts of unconditional kindness while in that state, it was that state which then lead me to GoD as I had a vision and Jesus, on behalf of GoD , who spoke with me. I was then a believer!!! But, I must say, believing in nothing was a very powerful state of growth as I believed in unconditional love, really without condition, no reward what so ever, no karma, no good books to be written down in and remembered in heaven, no pay off, just a happy death. There really is something to be said for that.Love elektra x x x

[Guest guest]

Yeah, I meant as in a way that it was tearing my perceptions and denials apart.

I could have been a bit clearer =)

 

**Keep in mind with the rest of this, that it is merely my own take on things. I

wish not to offend or be in a debate... just merely expressing my opinion**

Thanks =) (smiley face)

 

I remember a quote in Genesis by God, " And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is

become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand,

and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: "

 

SO we became as God knowing the difference because I interpreted it that he was

referring to himself. But I could be wrong...

 

I never watched the Zeitgeist movie because I am not one to watch about

conspiracy theories and I have heard that it isn't factual in a lot of ways.

That's just me though.

 

Just like the " What the bleep " movies. I don't take much from them because of a

lot of the pseudo science involved and that lady who runs it, JZ Knight, is a

freak IMO lol. Ramtha? Huh? Just my opinion.

 

I guess my perception on Satan (from a theological perspective) is different.

Perhaps more Jewish in that he is an angel of god with a crappy job. That he is

the tester and accuser. I do know that the fallen angel concept is a new

testament thing. In my opinion I don't see why the two books are together, but

that's just me. **Once again, please don't judge me as a bad person because I

see things differently... I mean the utmost respect as theology is a very very

very (infinity) very sensitive subject**

 

But then again I also see that the God of the bible could also be interpreted as

" Satan " or Error.. but that is a gnostic thing. As far as theology is concerned,

My only REAL beliefs are that all of these " characters " are simply avatars from

our own psyche. Don't be offended as I am not disputing your faith... it is just

how I see it. Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

 

As far as the shadow being separate.. I differ as well. As far as consciousness

I have only to look at the universe for that answer. From destruction, the core

elements go to basics to start anew. To bring new life, new stars... etc. It is

a constant cycle. To be reborn, one must die. To know good, one must be both

good and evil. I think of it as a battery...

 

I do like your take on this though...

 

" The illusions that were given " not " to make us to become conscicous beings, for

we were already conscious beings in our original state, but conscious only of

good/love. When we took of the tree of knowledge of good and evil we became

spiritually unconscious (same meaning as spiritually dead) of who we were. We

now needed the opposite illusions as a contrast to realize the state we have

fallen into. The law was given so that we could see what we had now become. The

God source did not turn His back on us, we turned our back on Him. Going by what

the bible says, the God source desired for us to take of the Tree of life, but

were given free will to chose for ourselves. "

 

I believe what you choose to do is up to you. We all have a place in the balance

and cycle of life. I believe counteracting the bad by doing good is a great

balancer. It's all about moderation.

 

As far as Mother Teresa... She did lose her faith and/or doubted it. Atheist is

just another definition. It's all a word game apparently. But who knows what

went through her head as she passed. **shrug** A lot of people like to take it

subjectively and that is fine (myself included). Whatever works for people IMO.

100 people look at every situation 200 different ways. That is the beauty of

things. Nobody knows for sure.

 

I love you Linda and thank you so much for expressing yourself. I value your

views immensely!

 

(It's amazing how diverse this group is)

 

-Tiffany S

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " Linda " <crazycats711

wrote:

>

> Sorry Tiffany, I guess I misunderstood that first senstence you wrote,

probably some of the rest too.

>

> @@ These days I am facing myself in a way that is tearing every part of me

up.@@

>

> That just sounded like a struggle to me. LOL!

>

> I do believe mankind was created perfect in the beginning as well as the

animals. The way I see it, we nor the animals were preditors in the beginning.

It is only after mankind choose to know good and evil that this changed all

things and death and destruction became apart of our world. We ourselves chose

to be like the gods (I take these gods were the fallen angels) knowing good and

evil. The way I see it, it did not wake us up to consiciousness, but put us to

sleep (spiritual death). The religions, mystery school teachings of old where

ways man tried in his own power to get back what was lost, mostly likely

inspired by the angels both the fallen and the ones who did not fall. From

watching the Zeitgeist Movie, there were two brotherhoods, the black and the

white, so it makes sense that there were two teachings.

>

> I do believe there is some truth in those teachings or I would not be here.

The bible says Lucifer, the head of the fallen, does not have the ability to

create, he can only mimic. He takes what is from the God source and distorts it

so as to keep us in an unconscious state spiritually. How many people in the

world are truly spiritual awakened? Not very many, compared to how many of us

there are. Lucifers desires to keep as many as possible as slaves to serve his

agenda.

>

> The God source did not leave us in our fallen state. The laws was given so

that we could become conscious of our now fallen spiritual nature. We know right

and wrong from the law written inside us as well as written outside of

ourselves. It is even written in nature and the stars..the mystery schools of

old knew this.

>

> The way I see it, the negative emotions were not part of our beginning state

either. They are apart of us now, because we chose to know duality. They are

not apart of our true real selves. Look at the word " shadow " itself, a shadow is

just an elusive thing that is not really a part of you. When you look down at

your shadow it is not a part of you, it is just a dark image of you. It is the

same thing with the inner shadow is the way I see it. Both are an illusion of

you. It is only the absent of light.

>

> The illusions that were given " not " to make us to become conscicous beings,

for we were already conscious beings in our original state, but conscious only

of good/love. When we took of the tree of knowledge of good and evil we became

spiritually unconscious (same meaning as spiritually dead) of who we were. We

now needed the opposite illusions as a contrast to realize the state we have

fallen into. The law was given so that we could see what we had now become. The

God source did not turn His back on us, we turned our back on Him. Going by what

the bible says, the God source desired for us to take of the Tree of life, but

were given free will to chose for ourselves.

>

> Even so, God still loves us unconditionally and has not left us to figure our

own way out. In his great love for us he has provided a way out.

>

> As for Mother Teresa, it would be how one would looks at it I guess. That

webpage that states her becoming an athiest is that one person's opinion is the

way I see it. I do not see her as totally losing faith in God, mostly because

she did continued her service to others. The guy who wrote the book from her

letters does not see it has losing total faith either.

>

> Quote:

> @@ Yet Kolodiejchuk sees it in St. John's context, as darkness within faith.

Teresa found ways, starting in the early 1960s, to live with it and abandoned

neither her belief nor her work. Kolodiejchuk produced the book as proof of the

faith-filled perseverance that he sees as her most spiritually heroic act. @@

>

> I totally do agree with Chrism's lessons on forgiveness and balance as well.

>

> I cannot see mistakes as perfection though, there would be no need for

forgiveness is that were so. I do think I am beginning to understand what you

and others are saying, that we co-created this world and can now through

enlightenment are taking part in recreating it.

>

> I see myself as perfect in Christ, but I also do believe it is left up to us

to take what is given and use our gifts to take part in becoming co-creators of

heaven on earth. The bible says we are to take back the dominion over the of

earth that was taken from us in the fall.

>

> One of my favorite bible verses is James 2:26 As the body without the

> spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

>

> It takes both faith and works to take back what is rightfully ours.

>

> Tiffany, even though your way is different than mine, I am glad you have peace

with your way of dealing with the guilt and all.

>

> Love, blessings, and peace to you on your journey.

>

> Linda

>

>

>

>

> , " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia@> wrote:

> >

> > Linda...I can understand how you can see the sin aspect from a Christian

perspective. I really can't say anything as far as that goes... Since I left the

Christian faith many years ago, my opinions differ...

> >

> > As far as Mother Teresa.... She inspired me as well. Knowing that she did

not believe in God, she still did good out of the pureness of her own heart. To

be kind without question or expectation of any reward. She is one of the most

inspiring people I have to look up to. Pure, honest, good. That is definitely

saint worthy in my opinion!

> >

> > I guess what I was saying is I am more or less pondering what is true to our

nature vs what isn't. If what we believe to be good deeds is merely

cultural/societal upbringing.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

God DOES work in mysterious ways....................Julie--- On Tue, 8/4/09, Elektra Fire <elektra.fire wrote:Elektra Fire <elektra.fireRe: Re: The Shadow.... Date: Tuesday, August 4, 2009, 11:44 AM

 

 

When I was lost in the illusion that I was dying from HIV I didn't believe in GoD (in the beginning part) I believed we just died and that was that. I then took it upon myself to make the world a better place, not for reward from a GoD or something in the after life, I did it out of pure love and forgiveness for humanity, my way on righting the wrong I felt had been done to me. I thought, if I die I want to have made this world a better place so something like this is less likely to happen to another person ever again.Thats why when I fell in love with hubby, something I never intended on doing, (I was just going to stay alone and die in my mind)

I couldnt forgive myself for not telling him, how could I have done all that good work and then ruin it all by not facing my fears with the man i love? I wasnt afraid to die either, I was afraid to tell people I

(thought I) had HIV as it was so dirty and taboo.hmmmm, strange how we can operate. (I know I didnt really ruin it but thats how my mind felt in the moment)I did some of my greatest acts of unconditional kindness while in that state, it was that state which then lead me to GoD as I had a vision and Jesus, on behalf of GoD , who spoke with me. I was then a believer!!! But, I must say, believing in nothing was a very powerful state of growth as I believed in unconditional love, really without condition, no reward what so ever, no karma, no good books to be written down in and remembered in heaven, no pay off, just a happy death. There really is something to be said for that.Love elektra x x x

[Guest guest]

Hi Tiffany

I am going to write in between your paragraphs, in answer to your post . I went to bed last night thinking about yours and Gabriels post and I think I am finally beginning understanding what you are saying. I have been trying to understand about the shadow now for over a year. Droxine from another groups says to live the questions until you live the answers. I am not real sure I even know what she is meaning by that, but I have been living the last year or so with the questions about the shadow in my mind and have not been able to make much sense of it.

I don't know if am understanding it right still, but feels like there is a little bit of light peeking through after reading both of your post last night.

A BIG THANK YOU to both of you.

Linda

, "angelikdementia" <angelikdementia wrote:>> Yeah, I meant as in a way that it was tearing my perceptions and denials apart. I could have been a bit clearer =)

@@ I am sure you were very clear to most of the people here on this group, it was me that didn't get it. You and most here are way ahead of me in understanding the psycological stuff. @@

> > **Keep in mind with the rest of this, that it is merely my own take on things. I wish not to offend or be in a debate... just merely expressing my opinion** Thanks =) (smiley face)

I get tickled when I see your little icon for smiley face, now. I looked it up to see for myself and sure enough there are two different computer codes that make the same smiley face. I thought that was amazing how two different codes can come out as as the same picture. That is a a mystery to me... how that can be. Hehe! @@> > I remember a quote in Genesis by God, "And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:"> > SO we became as God knowing the difference because I interpreted it that he was referring to himself. But I could be wrong...

@@ Yes, that is how it is written alright, and there has been a lot of speculations on the word "us" written there. It sure brings up a red flag... just who this Lord God is that created us. Some say the "us" is the seven spirits of God. That could mean the seven archangels I suppose, but some say there are only 4 archangels and others that there were 7. I don't have an answer to that, but continue wondering about the "us" there. It must mean something.

Have you ever noticed that in the first chapter of Genesis just uses the word God and then in the 2nd chapter it changes to The Lord God. It is like it is two different accounts pieced together by putting the seventh of the first book as the beginning of the 2nd chapter. This much surely mean something , too.

I like what Edgar Cayce had to say about all that in the book written from his files called, "The Sory of Soul". It is interesting what he says about all the root races and that they each had their Adam and Saviour. He also said in this book that each of these Adams were the reincarnation (he use the word prototype) of the same entity that was Jesus, the first begotten of creation. It is through this first begotten entity, the son of God of the triune Godhead that all the rest of creation came to be created , starting with the archangels of which Lucifer was the head/the first. Then the rest of the sons of God/ the angels were created.

It was interesting that the first three root race periods ended with a flood, this one the 4 root race that we are now is to be ended with fire a purification rather than water. The first three root race decended into matter and the 4th is the middle, the bridge in between the first three and the last three which will be ascending root races back to spirit. Hehe! If this is true we still all have a long,long, ways to go yet. @@> > I never watched the Zeitgeist movie because I am not one to watch about conspiracy theories and I have heard that it isn't factual in a lot of ways. That's just me though. > > Just like the "What the bleep" movies. I don't take much from them because of a lot of the pseudo science involved and that lady who runs it, JZ Knight, is a freak IMO lol. Ramtha? Huh? Just my opinion.

@@ The Zeitgeist movie did have a lot of errors in it in my opinion, there is a christian one made that counter balanced it by pointing out those errrors. I don't know if it did much good, LOL! I was mostly interested in the kundalini references that were made. I didn't care much for the "What the Bleep" movie, either. It didn't make much sense to me. @@

> > I guess my perception on Satan (from a theological perspective) is different. Perhaps more Jewish in that he is an angel of god with a crappy job. That he is the tester and accuser. I do know that the fallen angel concept is a new testament thing. In my opinion I don't see why the two books are together, but that's just me. **Once again, please don't judge me as a bad person because I see things differently... I mean the utmost respect as theology is a very very very (infinity) very sensitive subject**

@@ I agree with what you say about Satan, but I see him as the one and same as Lucifer, though. Lucifer held the highest office of all the angels before his uprising. After his fall he then recieved the name change to Satan and was given the lowest of all jobs of being the tester and accuser of mankind. That is the way I see it . I may be wrong. There is much in the Old testament about lucifer and the fallen angels...about the war that took place in the heaven realms. It didn't begin in the New Testament...but ended there with Jesus on the cross! mhoI agree, theology is a sensitive subject to many people, much the same as kundalini and lots of other subjects . When people feel their beliefs threatened, their root chakra...instincts to protect kicks in. @@

> > But then again I also see that the God of the bible could also be interpreted as "Satan" or Error.. but that is a gnostic thing. As far as theology is concerned, My only REAL beliefs are that all of these "characters" are simply avatars from our own psyche. Don't be offended as I am not disputing your faith... it is just how I see it. Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

@@ Tiffany, I am not judging you, I am very much interested in what you have to say and to understand, especially about what is meant by the shadow. Also, about the "characters" as avatars of our psyche. I would love to be able to set down and have long discussion with you about these things. I am not one to be easily offended about my faith, never have been. I have been on both sides, after all. So there really is no need in you saying that in ever post to me. I respect other peoples opinion and enjoy hearing them.@@

> > I believe what you choose to do is up to you. We all have a place in the balance and cycle of life. I believe counteracting the bad by doing good is a great balancer. It's all about moderation.

@@ As long as we are living under the laws of duality, I agree.@@

> I love you Linda and thank you so much for expressing yourself. I value your views immensely!

@@ I love you too, Tiffany and value your views.@@> > (It's amazing how diverse this group is) I agree 100%> > -Tiffany S

Blessings & Love,

Linda

[Guest guest]

Reading this reminded me of a dream I had while in tibet, I felt it was a test of some sort:I am given a new human to look after, he is like a robot or clone, 16 years old, almost adult, yet totally blank like a newly born baby. Its my job to show this being around Earth and life so they can learn and grow. I take them to many different places, they ask me lots of questions and I try to answer them subjectively, without trying to programm them in to "my way" of thinking, and finally they ask me "what is to be human?" I answer "I can't answer your questions for you, its up to you to look at all the data, listen to everything and then make up your own unique perspective, you decide whats real, thats what it is to be human".I think that was good advice, :-)) love elektra x x x Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one. A lot of people like to take it subjectively and that is fine (myself included). Whatever works for people IMO. 100 people look at every situation 200 different ways. That is the beauty of things. Nobody knows for sure.

[Guest guest]

Dear Tiffany,

 

In the begining i struggled too. And having ideas which is different from others. According to me there are many errors in the written bible The Rulers, the priests often wrote it as how they wanted rather the real thing.

 

I do not believe in the yahweh either. God is not someone who pleases the smell of the animals or human sacrifices. Those are written in satenic rituals. This yahweh to me was also the Saten. OT it says yahweh asked moses to build a temple, and bring all sorts of gold etc things and only king solomon could do this. And God is a spirit and Jesus said in the new testament my Father God created all things and has earth as his foot stool and heaven his throne.. So do not need anything from earth...

 

Also if you read elohim who created men only gave men only what comes of the trees to eat. yahweh gave people all the animals also to eat and thus increased sin...

 

If you read the aquarian gospel of the Jesus christ you would understand these. It is freely available on line. I believe in this bible with all my heart!!http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/agjc/index.htm

 

I do not agree on all the things written in the following link but you can read it and see.

 

http://www.luisprada.com/Protected/the_lacerta_files.htm to me also yahweh was a very bad alien who gave some powers to moses to get things he wanted... that was teh reason why they heard loud noises and the peopel were not allowed to see the god on mountain if they saw they would be killed so their secret would be safe....

 

(I ask forgiveness if i have offended others by my post - But i had the same questions and understandings as Tiffany)

 

MAJI

Treat people as if they were what they ought to be, and you'll help them to become what they are capable of becoming.

--- On Wed, 8/5/09, Linda <crazycats711 wrote:

Linda <crazycats711 Re: The Shadow.... Date: Wednesday, August 5, 2009, 12:58 AM

 

 

Hi Tiffany

I am going to write in between your paragraphs, in answer to your post . I went to bed last night thinking about yours and Gabriels post and I think I am finally beginning understanding what you are saying. I have been trying to understand about the shadow now for over a year. Droxine from another groups says to live the questions until you live the answers. I am not real sure I even know what she is meaning by that, but I have been living the last year or so with the questions about the shadow in my mind and have not been able to make much sense of it.

I don't know if am understanding it right still, but feels like there is a little bit of light peeking through after reading both of your post last night.

A BIG THANK YOU to both of you.

Linda

, "angelikdementia" <angelikdementia wrote:>> Yeah, I meant as in a way that it was tearing my perceptions and denials apart. I could have been a bit clearer =)

@@ I am sure you were very clear to most of the people here on this group, it was me that didn't get it. You and most here are way ahead of me in understanding the psycological stuff. @@

> > **Keep in mind with the rest of this, that it is merely my own take on things. I wish not to offend or be in a debate... just merely expressing my opinion** Thanks =) (smiley face)

I get tickled when I see your little icon for smiley face, now. I looked it up to see for myself and sure enough there are two different computer codes that make the same smiley face. I thought that was amazing how two different codes can come out as as the same picture. That is a a mystery to me... how that can be. Hehe! @@> > I remember a quote in Genesis by God, "And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:"> > SO we became as God knowing the difference because I interpreted it that he was referring to himself. But I could be wrong...

@@ Yes, that is how it is written alright, and there has been a lot of speculations on the word "us" written there. It sure brings up a red flag... just who this Lord God is that created us. Some say the "us" is the seven spirits of God. That could mean the seven archangels I suppose, but some say there are only 4 archangels and others that there were 7. I don't have an answer to that, but continue wondering about the "us" there. It must mean something.

Have you ever noticed that in the first chapter of Genesis just uses the word God and then in the 2nd chapter it changes to The Lord God. It is like it is two different accounts pieced together by putting the seventh of the first book as the beginning of the 2nd chapter. This much surely mean something , too.

I like what Edgar Cayce had to say about all that in the book written from his files called, "The Sory of Soul". It is interesting what he says about all the root races and that they each had their Adam and Saviour. He also said in this book that each of these Adams were the reincarnation (he use the word prototype) of the same entity that was Jesus, the first begotten of creation. It is through this first begotten entity, the son of God of the triune Godhead that all the rest of creation came to be created , starting with the archangels of which Lucifer was the head/the first. Then the rest of the sons of God/ the angels were created.

It was interesting that the first three root race periods ended with a flood, this one the 4 root race that we are now is to be ended with fire a purification rather than water. The first three root race decended into matter and the 4th is the middle, the bridge in between the first three and the last three which will be ascending root races back to spirit. Hehe! If this is true we still all have a long,long, ways to go yet. @@> > I never watched the Zeitgeist movie because I am not one to watch about conspiracy theories and I have heard that it isn't factual in a lot of ways. That's just me though. > > Just like the "What the bleep" movies. I don't take much from them because of a lot of the pseudo science involved and that lady who runs it, JZ Knight, is a freak IMO lol. Ramtha? Huh? Just my opinion.

@@ The Zeitgeist movie did have a lot of errors in it in my opinion, there is a christian one made that counter balanced it by pointing out those errrors. I don't know if it did much good, LOL! I was mostly interested in the kundalini references that were made. I didn't care much for the "What the Bleep" movie, either. It didn't make much sense to me. @@

> > I guess my perception on Satan (from a theological perspective) is different. Perhaps more Jewish in that he is an angel of god with a crappy job. That he is the tester and accuser. I do know that the fallen angel concept is a new testament thing. In my opinion I don't see why the two books are together, but that's just me. **Once again, please don't judge me as a bad person because I see things differently... I mean the utmost respect as theology is a very very very (infinity) very sensitive subject**

@@ I agree with what you say about Satan, but I see him as the one and same as Lucifer, though. Lucifer held the highest office of all the angels before his uprising. After his fall he then recieved the name change to Satan and was given the lowest of all jobs of being the tester and accuser of mankind. That is the way I see it . I may be wrong. There is much in the Old testament about lucifer and the fallen angels...about the war that took place in the heaven realms. It didn't begin in the New Testament...but ended there with Jesus on the cross! mhoI agree, theology is a sensitive subject to many people, much the same as kundalini and lots of other subjects . When people feel their beliefs threatened, their root chakra...instincts to protect kicks in. @@

> > But then again I also see that the God of the bible could also be interpreted as "Satan" or Error.. but that is a gnostic thing. As far as theology is concerned, My only REAL beliefs are that all of these "characters" are simply avatars from our own psyche. Don't be offended as I am not disputing your faith... it is just how I see it. Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

@@ Tiffany, I am not judging you, I am very much interested in what you have to say and to understand, especially about what is meant by the shadow. Also, about the "characters" as avatars of our psyche. I would love to be able to set down and have long discussion with you about these things. I am not one to be easily offended about my faith, never have been. I have been on both sides, after all. So there really is no need in you saying that in ever post to me. I respect other peoples opinion and enjoy hearing them.@@

> > I believe what you choose to do is up to you. We all have a place in the balance and cycle of life. I believe counteracting the bad by doing good is a great balancer. It's all about moderation.

@@ As long as we are living under the laws of duality, I agree.@@

> I love you Linda and thank you so much for expressing yourself. I value your views immensely!

@@ I love you too, Tiffany and value your views.@@> > (It's amazing how diverse this group is) I agree 100%> > -Tiffany S

Blessings & Love,

Linda

[Guest guest]

Well it sounds to me like you passed it! hehe.

 

I find it wonderful that everyone has a different view. I mean, if we didn't...

things would be quite boring. It is these differences in opinion that make you

unique and special regardless of the view. It helps others to grow as well. I

don't know how many times my views have changed in my life and I'm only 26! I

always have something I tell myself...

 

" I can't say I am positive about something, because I know in just a few months

my views will change. " I don't know how many times I have changed my political

preference for example. When I was young I was anti-government. When I was 18 I

was a Democrat. When I was 22 I became a Republican. Now... well I am

Independant. Next year? I could be something totally different lol. I could

never be a preacher or teacher because I wouldn't be able to teach anything!

Well, unless it was a simple subject like Math.

 

There is no right or wrong way to understand something. I mean, could you

imagine if everyone in the world liked pizza? Eating that stuff every single

day? Talk about monotony. And man would we be fat!

 

=)

 

-Tiffany S

 

 

, Elektra Fire

<elektra.fire wrote:

>

> Reading this reminded me of a dream I had while in tibet, I felt it was a test

of some sort:

> I am given a new human to look after, he is like a robot or clone, 16 years

old, almost adult, yet totally blank like a newly born baby. Its my job to show

this being around Earth and life so they can learn and grow. I take them to many

different places, they ask me lots of questions and I try to answer them

subjectively, without trying to programm them in to " my way " of thinking, and

finally they ask me " what is to be human? " I answer " I can't answer your

questions for you, its up to you to look at all the data, listen to everything

and then make up your own unique perspective,  you decide whats real, thats what

it is to be human " .

>

> I think that was good advice, :-)) love elektra x x x

>  Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

>

> A lot of people like to take it subjectively and that is fine (myself

included). Whatever works for people IMO. 100 people look at every situation 200

different ways. That is the beauty of things. Nobody knows for sure.

>

[Guest guest]

I am trying to answer as many emails as possible but after a few days of not

checking my box is FULL!! haha.

 

I will definitely check this stuff out when I get the time. Thank you for

spending the time on those links.

 

It is difficult to express your opinions when they differ so much from the

mainstream, but then again, Jesus was also considered a heretic.

 

I've come to realize that this group is becoming increasingly open and accepting

of everyone's views. I know that I don't follow any faith in particular. As many

on here that have posted recently, I also take what I can use from all religions

and leave the rest. I personally don't feel one path is THE path, as I am still

not set on any particular pantheon to this day.

 

I think all religions have a message. I respect all of them. I love Buddhism,

Taoism, LaVeyan Satanism, Theistic Satanism (Yes, I did say that lol. I find

their beliefs in the twist quite beautiful actually) Hinduism, Judaism,

Mormonism, Atheism, Agnosticism, The church of the Subgenious, Rastafarian, You

name it.

 

In the end we are what we are. It doesn't matter what books you read, whether

you are poor or rich or what god you prayed to or didn't. When you were born you

were faithless. You simply were. What you are is dependent on upbringing and

society. If I was born in a Muslim state, I would most likely have Muslim in my

main belief system. Since I am American and was brought up in a Christian

family... Christianity will always be my first.

 

We are all beautiful regardless of the little things that make you " different. "

They are merely labels and we are so much more than that.

 

Nobody should be offended, and if they are... It is time for an internal

microscope.

 

Love to all!!

 

-Tiffany S

 

, Majitha E <majitha79

wrote:

>

> Dear Tiffany,

>  

> In the begining i struggled too. And having ideas which is different from

others. According to me there are many errors in the written bible The Rulers,

the priests often wrote it as how they wanted rather the real thing.

>  

> I do not believe in the yahweh either. God is not someone who pleases the

smell of the animals or human sacrifices. Those are written in satenic rituals.

This yahweh to me was also the Saten. OT it says yahweh asked moses to build a

temple, and bring all sorts of gold etc things and only king solomon could do

this. And God is a spirit and Jesus said in the new testament my Father God

created all things and has earth as his foot stool and heaven his throne.. So do

not need anything from earth...

>  

> Also if you read elohim who created men only gave men only what comes of the

trees to eat. yahweh gave people all the animals also to eat and thus increased

sin...

>  

> If you read the aquarian gospel of the Jesus christ you would understand

these. It is freely available on line. I believe in this bible with all my

heart!!

>

> http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/agjc/index.htm

>  

> I do not agree on all the things written in the following link but you can

read it and see.

>  

> http://www.luisprada.com/Protected/the_lacerta_files.htm to me also yahweh was

a very bad alien who gave some powers to moses to get things he wanted... that

was teh reason why they heard loud noises and the peopel were not allowed to see

the god on mountain if they saw they would be killed so their secret would be

safe....

>  

> (I ask forgiveness if i have offended others by my post - But i had the same

questions and understandings as Tiffany)

>  

> MAJI

> Treat people as if they were what they ought to be, and you'll help them to

become what they are capable of becoming.

>  

>

> --- On Wed, 8/5/09, Linda <crazycats711 wrote:

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for taking the time to respond so clearly Linda =)

 

I am glad that we have grown from our initial misunderstandings of each other.

I think that helped us both. When we both got offended in the beginning with

this Christian/not Christian thing (a few weeks ago), we learned a lot from each

other. We got strength by expressing just how the other felt. We also melted

that barrier that seemed to separate us.

 

Now we are as we are, two people having a civil conversation regarding this

faith issue, or any other issue. It is no longer a matter of right vs wrong. We

are perfect in our own rights.

 

We all have something to learn from each other. It's not the message in itself

that matters, but how one learns from it. How one grows.

 

Much love to you Linda!!

 

-Tiffany S

 

 

 

, " Linda " <crazycats711

wrote:

>

>

> Hi Tiffany

>

> I am going to write in between your paragraphs, in answer to your post .

> I went to bed last night thinking about yours and Gabriels post and I

> think I am finally beginning understanding what you are saying. I have

> been trying to understand about the shadow now for over a year. Droxine

> from another groups says to live the questions until you live the

> answers. I am not real sure I even know what she is meaning by that,

> but I have been living the last year or so with the questions about the

> shadow in my mind and have not been able to make much sense of it.

>

> I don't know if am understanding it right still, but feels like there

> is a little bit of light peeking through after reading both of your post

> last night.

>

> A BIG THANK YOU to both of you.

>

> Linda

>

>

> , " angelikdementia "

> <angelikdementia@> wrote:

> >

> > Yeah, I meant as in a way that it was tearing my perceptions and

> denials apart. I could have been a bit clearer =)

>

> @@ I am sure you were very clear to most of the people here on this

> group, it was me that didn't get it. You and most here are way ahead of

> me in understanding the psycological stuff. @@

>

> >

> > **Keep in mind with the rest of this, that it is merely my own take on

> things. I wish not to offend or be in a debate... just merely expressing

> my opinion** Thanks =) (smiley face)

>

> [] I get tickled when I see your little icon for smiley face, now.

> I looked it up to see for myself and sure enough there are two

> different computer codes that make the same smiley face. I thought that

> was amazing how two different codes can come out as as the same picture.

> That is a a mystery to me... how that can be. Hehe! @@

> >

> > I remember a quote in Genesis by God, " And the LORD God said, Behold,

> the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he

> put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live

> for ever: "

> >

> > SO we became as God knowing the difference because I interpreted it

> that he was referring to himself. But I could be wrong...

>

> @@ Yes, that is how it is written alright, and there has been a lot of

> speculations on the word " us " written there. It sure brings up a red

> flag... just who this Lord God is that created us. Some say the " us "

> is the seven spirits of God. That could mean the seven archangels I

> suppose, but some say there are only 4 archangels and others that there

> were 7. I don't have an answer to that, but continue wondering about the

> " us " there. It must mean something.

>

> Have you ever noticed that in the first chapter of Genesis just uses the

> word God and then in the 2nd chapter it changes to The Lord God. It is

> like it is two different accounts pieced together by putting the seventh

> of the first book as the beginning of the 2nd chapter. This much surely

> mean something , too.

>

> I like what Edgar Cayce had to say about all that in the book written

> from his files called, " The Sory of Soul " . It is interesting what he

> says about all the root races and that they each had their Adam and

> Saviour. He also said in this book that each of these Adams were the

> reincarnation (he use the word prototype) of the same entity that was

> Jesus, the first begotten of creation. It is through this first begotten

> entity, the son of God of the triune Godhead that all the rest of

> creation came to be created , starting with the archangels of which

> Lucifer was the head/the first. Then the rest of the sons of God/ the

> angels were created.

>

> It was interesting that the first three root race periods ended with a

> flood, this one the 4 root race that we are now is to be ended with fire

> a purification rather than water. The first three root race decended

> into matter and the 4th is the middle, the bridge in between the first

> three and the last three which will be ascending root races back to

> spirit. Hehe! If this is true we still all have a long,long, ways to go

> yet. @@

> >

> > I never watched the Zeitgeist movie because I am not one to watch

> about conspiracy theories and I have heard that it isn't factual in a

> lot of ways. That's just me though.

> >

> > Just like the " What the bleep " movies. I don't take much from them

> because of a lot of the pseudo science involved and that lady who runs

> it, JZ Knight, is a freak IMO lol. Ramtha? Huh? Just my opinion.

>

> @@ The Zeitgeist movie did have a lot of errors in it in my opinion,

> there is a christian one made that counter balanced it by pointing out

> those errrors. I don't know if it did much good, LOL! I was mostly

> interested in the kundalini references that were made.

> I didn't care much for the " What the Bleep " movie, either. It didn't

> make much sense to me. @@

>

> >

> > I guess my perception on Satan (from a theological perspective) is

> different. Perhaps more Jewish in that he is an angel of god with a

> crappy job. That he is the tester and accuser. I do know that the fallen

> angel concept is a new testament thing. In my opinion I don't see why

> the two books are together, but that's just me. **Once again, please

> don't judge me as a bad person because I see things differently... I

> mean the utmost respect as theology is a very very very (infinity) very

> sensitive subject**

>

> @@ I agree with what you say about Satan, but I see him as the one and

> same as Lucifer, though. Lucifer held the highest office of all the

> angels before his uprising. After his fall he then recieved the name

> change to Satan and was given the lowest of all jobs of being the

> tester and accuser of mankind. That is the way I see it . I may be

> wrong. There is much in the Old testament about lucifer and the fallen

> angels...about the war that took place in the heaven realms. It didn't

> begin in the New Testament...but ended there with Jesus on the cross!

> mho

> I agree, theology is a sensitive subject to many people, much the same

> as kundalini and lots of other subjects . When people feel their

> beliefs threatened, their root chakra...instincts to protect kicks in.

> @@

>

> >

> > But then again I also see that the God of the bible could also be

> interpreted as " Satan " or Error.. but that is a gnostic thing. As far as

> theology is concerned, My only REAL beliefs are that all of these

> " characters " are simply avatars from our own psyche. Don't be offended

> as I am not disputing your faith... it is just how I see it. Opinions

> are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

>

>

> @@ Tiffany, I am not judging you, I am very much interested in what you

> have to say and to understand, especially about what is meant by the

> shadow. Also, about the " characters " as avatars of our psyche. I would

> love to be able to set down and have long discussion with you about

> these things. I am not one to be easily offended about my faith, never

> have been. I have been on both sides, after all. So there really is

> no need in you saying that in ever post to me. I respect other peoples

> opinion and enjoy hearing them.@@

>

> >

> > I believe what you choose to do is up to you. We all have a place in

> the balance and cycle of life. I believe counteracting the bad by doing

> good is a great balancer. It's all about moderation.

>

> @@ As long as we are living under the laws of duality, I agree.@@

>

> > I love you Linda and thank you so much for expressing yourself. I

> value your views immensely!

>

> @@ I love you too, Tiffany and value your views.@@

> >

> > (It's amazing how diverse this group is) I agree 100%

> >

> > -Tiffany S

>

>

> Blessings & Love,

>

> Linda

>

[Guest guest]

That was the two of you!!??

Good thing you both kissed and made up, otherwise we would sorely miss both your

take.

i love you Tiff S

i love you Lin

Blessings, ty

 

 

 

 

________________________________

angelikdementia <angelikdementia

 

Saturday, August 8, 2009 1:22:23 PM

Re: The Shadow....

 

 

Thank you for taking the time to respond so clearly Linda =)

 

I am glad that we have grown from our initial misunderstandings of each other. I

think that helped us both. When we both got offended in the beginning with this

Christian/not Christian thing (a few weeks ago), we learned a lot from each

other. We got strength by expressing just how the other felt. We also melted

that barrier that seemed to separate us.

 

Now we are as we are, two people having a civil conversation regarding this

faith issue, or any other issue. It is no longer a matter of right vs wrong. We

are perfect in our own rights.

 

We all have something to learn from each other. It's not the message in itself

that matters, but how one learns from it. How one grows.

 

Much love to you Linda!!

 

-Tiffany S

 

Kundalini-Awakening -Systems- 1 , " Linda " <crazycats711@

....> wrote:

>

>

> Hi Tiffany

>

> I am going to write in between your paragraphs, in answer to your post .

> I went to bed last night thinking about yours and Gabriels post and I

> think I am finally beginning understanding what you are saying. I have

> been trying to understand about the shadow now for over a year. Droxine

> from another groups says to live the questions until you live the

> answers. I am not real sure I even know what she is meaning by that,

> but I have been living the last year or so with the questions about the

> shadow in my mind and have not been able to make much sense of it.

>

> I don't know if am understanding it right still, but feels like there

> is a little bit of light peeking through after reading both of your post

> last night.

>

> A BIG THANK YOU to both of you.

>

> Linda

>

>

> Kundalini-Awakening -Systems- 1 , " angelikdementia "

> <angelikdementia@ > wrote:

> >

> > Yeah, I meant as in a way that it was tearing my perceptions and

> denials apart. I could have been a bit clearer =)

>

> @@ I am sure you were very clear to most of the people here on this

> group, it was me that didn't get it. You and most here are way ahead of

> me in understanding the psycological stuff. @@

>

> >

> > **Keep in mind with the rest of this, that it is merely my own take on

> things. I wish not to offend or be in a debate... just merely expressing

> my opinion** Thanks =) (smiley face)

>

> [] I get tickled when I see your little icon for smiley face, now.

> I looked it up to see for myself and sure enough there are two

> different computer codes that make the same smiley face. I thought that

> was amazing how two different codes can come out as as the same picture.

> That is a a mystery to me... how that can be. Hehe! @@

> >

> > I remember a quote in Genesis by God, " And the LORD God said, Behold,

> the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he

> put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live

> for ever: "

> >

> > SO we became as God knowing the difference because I interpreted it

> that he was referring to himself. But I could be wrong...

>

> @@ Yes, that is how it is written alright, and there has been a lot of

> speculations on the word " us " written there. It sure brings up a red

> flag... just who this Lord God is that created us. Some say the " us "

> is the seven spirits of God. That could mean the seven archangels I

> suppose, but some say there are only 4 archangels and others that there

> were 7. I don't have an answer to that, but continue wondering about the

> " us " there. It must mean something.

>

> Have you ever noticed that in the first chapter of Genesis just uses the

> word God and then in the 2nd chapter it changes to The Lord God. It is

> like it is two different accounts pieced together by putting the seventh

> of the first book as the beginning of the 2nd chapter. This much surely

> mean something , too.

>

> I like what Edgar Cayce had to say about all that in the book written

> from his files called, " The Sory of Soul " . It is interesting what he

> says about all the root races and that they each had their Adam and

> Saviour. He also said in this book that each of these Adams were the

> reincarnation (he use the word prototype) of the same entity that was

> Jesus, the first begotten of creation. It is through this first begotten

> entity, the son of God of the triune Godhead that all the rest of

> creation came to be created , starting with the archangels of which

> Lucifer was the head/the first. Then the rest of the sons of God/ the

> angels were created.

>

> It was interesting that the first three root race periods ended with a

> flood, this one the 4 root race that we are now is to be ended with fire

> a purification rather than water. The first three root race decended

> into matter and the 4th is the middle, the bridge in between the first

> three and the last three which will be ascending root races back to

> spirit. Hehe! If this is true we still all have a long,long, ways to go

> yet. @@

> >

> > I never watched the Zeitgeist movie because I am not one to watch

> about conspiracy theories and I have heard that it isn't factual in a

> lot of ways. That's just me though.

> >

> > Just like the " What the bleep " movies. I don't take much from them

> because of a lot of the pseudo science involved and that lady who runs

> it, JZ Knight, is a freak IMO lol. Ramtha? Huh? Just my opinion.

>

> @@ The Zeitgeist movie did have a lot of errors in it in my opinion,

> there is a christian one made that counter balanced it by pointing out

> those errrors. I don't know if it did much good, LOL! I was mostly

> interested in the kundalini references that were made.

> I didn't care much for the " What the Bleep " movie, either. It didn't

> make much sense to me. @@

>

> >

> > I guess my perception on Satan (from a theological perspective) is

> different. Perhaps more Jewish in that he is an angel of god with a

> crappy job. That he is the tester and accuser. I do know that the fallen

> angel concept is a new testament thing. In my opinion I don't see why

> the two books are together, but that's just me. **Once again, please

> don't judge me as a bad person because I see things differently. .. I

> mean the utmost respect as theology is a very very very (infinity) very

> sensitive subject**

>

> @@ I agree with what you say about Satan, but I see him as the one and

> same as Lucifer, though. Lucifer held the highest office of all the

> angels before his uprising. After his fall he then recieved the name

> change to Satan and was given the lowest of all jobs of being the

> tester and accuser of mankind. That is the way I see it . I may be

> wrong. There is much in the Old testament about lucifer and the fallen

> angels...about the war that took place in the heaven realms. It didn't

> begin in the New Testament... but ended there with Jesus on the cross!

> mho

> I agree, theology is a sensitive subject to many people, much the same

> as kundalini and lots of other subjects . When people feel their

> beliefs threatened, their root chakra...instincts to protect kicks in.

> @@

>

> >

> > But then again I also see that the God of the bible could also be

> interpreted as " Satan " or Error.. but that is a gnostic thing. As far as

> theology is concerned, My only REAL beliefs are that all of these

> " characters " are simply avatars from our own psyche. Don't be offended

> as I am not disputing your faith... it is just how I see it. Opinions

> are like a$$holes, everyone has one.

>

>

> @@ Tiffany, I am not judging you, I am very much interested in what you

> have to say and to understand, especially about what is meant by the

> shadow. Also, about the " characters " as avatars of our psyche. I would

> love to be able to set down and have long discussion with you about

> these things. I am not one to be easily offended about my faith, never

> have been. I have been on both sides, after all. So there really is

> no need in you saying that in ever post to me. I respect other peoples

> opinion and enjoy hearing them.@@

>

> >

> > I believe what you choose to do is up to you. We all have a place in

> the balance and cycle of life. I believe counteracting the bad by doing

> good is a great balancer. It's all about moderation.

>

> @@ As long as we are living under the laws of duality, I agree.@@

>

> > I love you Linda and thank you so much for expressing yourself. I

> value your views immensely!

>

> @@ I love you too, Tiffany and value your views.@@

> >

> > (It's amazing how diverse this group is) I agree 100%

> >

> > -Tiffany S

>

>

> Blessings & Love,

>

> Linda

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Much love to you Tiffany.

Blessings,

Linda

 

, " angelikdementia "

<angelikdementia wrote:

>

> Thank you for taking the time to respond so clearly Linda =)

>

> I am glad that we have grown from our initial misunderstandings of each

other. I think that helped us both.

[Guest guest]

This set of eclipses we just had were also helping us to address our shadows,

how appropriate the discussions we've been having lately.I have noticed a shift

in myself lately, I am at a point where everything just seems the same, all one,

no seperation, all religion, all ideas, all beliefs, its all one. If that makes

sense =)

Its a lovely feeling, I have been spending time with some hard core anarchists

from Holland, really interesting for me to see another perspective and absorb

its love .Everything really has love at its base, the shadow is there but when

it moves out the way, you see only love, everywhere in everything.Bless us all,

elektra x x x