fluoride

[Guest guest]

I wonder! I can't imagine not being able to feel my legs! I had no trouble

walking just about an hour after either of my little ones were born. I was mad

that they made me ride in the stupid wheelchair. I'd been cooped up long enough

in that bed and I wanted to move!

They had a rule at *both* hospitals I had my babies at, that babies couldn't be

carried in the hallway. Not even by the baby's mother or father. That made me

maaaaad.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

robin koloms <rkoloms wrote: I

wonder if the video mentions the negatives of epidurals: increased rate of

c-section, delayed breastfeeding, severe headaches, interference with maternal

bonding, etc.

 

Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: I'm not getting on anyone who

chooses differently, just at the people who don't respect decisions made by

parents. If someone has the epidural, fine by me. I am absolutely terrified of

needles and an epidural for me would have made the experience completely

unbearable. When nurses or anyone try to force a mother into something the

mother does not want, that is absolutely wrong. Those nurses heard me say a

million times saying I did not want it and that I would not for any reason even

watch the video. Due to my young age they just assumed I didn't know what I

wanted and they kept pressuring me. What anyone else chooses is their own

business. Being bombarded by nurses saying " just in case you change your mind "

is not a good experience, and the next time around I made it clear on one of my

first few visits that I was not going to tolerate being treated that way. When I

said I wish they'd just trust us to be good parents, I meant that

I wish they'd trust us to make the

decisions we feel are right instead of just trying to push us into doing what

they think we should.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

Alexis Middle wrote: or a blessing - I wasn't planning on having one until I

was in labor - my son was posterior so it was in my back and unbearable, I had

an epidural and ended up having to have a c-section as well. I was glad I had

the epidural as you need the anesthetics for the surgery but nonetheless felt

guilty for several months after as I was unable to have the natural childbirth I

had hoped for. In the end a healthy baby and mother is all that matters so pls

try not to pass judgment and add to the guilt of others if they are not able to

follow the same path as you.

 

robin koloms wrote: Epidurals are evil!

 

Kadee M wrote: Sort of good to know I wasn't alone in having a Nazi involved

with my pregnancy. With my daughter, the doctor tried very hard to get me to

watch the epidural video " just in case, " even after I told him I absolutely was

not for any reason going to get an epidural. I ended up shouting and crying at

one nurse who absolutely would not leave me alone about it. I wish they'd just

trust some of us to be good parents!!

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother wrote: i don't know much about fluoride, but i know that three of

my husband's

siblings have those spots on their teeth and they only got them after the

water in their area became fluoridated. also, when i was pregnant with my

first, i was initially in a CNM practice and she pressured me very, very

hard to get a prenatal vitamin that had fluoride in it. i refused after

doing some research and finding out that the effects of fluoride in a fetus

are indeterminate. (i ultimately left that practice for a homebirth one --

nazi midwives indeed who won't let me make decisions for myself!) so i

definitely do not recommend that. i don't know all the arguments for and

against fluoridation but i did fluoride treatments in elementary school and

i won't be having my kids do them. they do it that way for everyone in

hopes that they'll catch the one or two kids whose parents don't make them

brush (same reason they give all newborn babies shots and drops for STDs).

my son brushes just fine, i don't need a school or government or health

department deciding what is and is not acceptable to put in my kids'

bodies. we use the tom's of maine or burt's bees toothpastes and they are

vegan indeed.

 

[Guest guest]

The nurses all hated me.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote: i

am not under any circumstances capitulating for nurses here, but i will

explain why they pressure women so much to have drugs. on the one hand you

have a woman who is awake and aware and whose body is most likely telling

her to move. so this women is not going to stay in bed, she is going to

make noises spontanteously, she might squat or rock or moan, her partner is

wandering around after her with ginger ale and cold packs, maybe she has a

doula who is encouraging her to walk and take showers and generally make a

mess. a good nurse who is doing evidence-based care would come and

auscultate (listen with a doppler) that woman every 20-30 minutes or so, but

on most nursing floors they claim to not have enough nurses for that (and

due to nursing cut-backs, many times that is true). on the other hand, you

have a woman on an epidural. she is strapped to the bed by a monitor,

which becomes 100% necessary with an epi because of the risks to the baby

(although they are not likely to tell you that). this woman is complacently

sitting or lying or sleeping through her labor while the partner watches

football. her contractions are monitored not by a nurse actually touching

or communicating with her, but by a single nurse at a central kiosk. now

imagine a whole labor floor of women either a) listening to their bodies and

being general pains in the asses by moving, rocking, making noise, needing

to be touched and reassured by nurses, auscultated, encouraged, and paid

attention to, or b) a whole floor of laboring women who are laying in bed

requiring nothing but a single nurse to watch everyone's contractions on a

single screen. now, you are an overtired, oveworked, underpaid and

underappreciated nurse. which would you prefer? you can bet you'd be drug

pusher too.

 

[Guest guest]

I don't think anyone's upset about epidurals when they're necessary. I

personally am just upset at how so many of the nurses I dealt with, and even my

doctor, tried to push that decision on me when I didn't want it.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

smartgirl27us <thesmartfamily3 wrote:

Please don't assume that epidurals are always neccessarily evil. I

wanted natural child birth with both of my kids but ended up with an

epidural both times.

 

The first time, my water broke but I did not go into labor. They

ended up having to induce (with two different drugs) and eventually

contractions started but they were so violent, close together, and

painful that eventually my doctor told me that if I didnt get an

epidural to allow me to rest that I might not have the energy to push

when the time came. I got one.

 

The second time I was in labor (induced again because I had high blood

pressure and was overdue) for over 24 hours and the baby was not

desending. The baby's heart rate started fluctuating and they ended

up doing an emergency c-section (with epidural). Turned out his foot

was wrapped up in the umbilical chord and the c-section may have saved

his life.

 

(Sorry for the long post not really related to vegetarian parenting!)

 

Rachael

 

, robin koloms <rkoloms wrote:

>

> Epidurals are evil!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I always enjoy reading your posts(earthmother), but the ones about epidurals

have been especially enjoyable. I think you make very good points-I know this

isn't a childbirth group, but I love to share/hear opinions about a subject so

near and dear to my heart.

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote: i am not under any

circumstances capitulating for nurses here, but i will

explain why they pressure women so much to have drugs. on the one hand you

have a woman who is awake and aware and whose body is most likely telling

her to move. so this women is not going to stay in bed, she is going to

make noises spontanteously, she might squat or rock or moan, her partner is

wandering around after her with ginger ale and cold packs, maybe she has a

doula who is encouraging her to walk and take showers and generally make a

mess. a good nurse who is doing evidence-based care would come and

auscultate (listen with a doppler) that woman every 20-30 minutes or so, but

on most nursing floors they claim to not have enough nurses for that (and

due to nursing cut-backs, many times that is true). on the other hand, you

have a woman on an epidural. she is strapped to the bed by a monitor,

which becomes 100% necessary with an epi because of the risks to the baby

(although they are not likely to tell you that). this woman is complacently

sitting or lying or sleeping through her labor while the partner watches

football. her contractions are monitored not by a nurse actually touching

or communicating with her, but by a single nurse at a central kiosk. now

imagine a whole labor floor of women either a) listening to their bodies and

being general pains in the asses by moving, rocking, making noise, needing

to be touched and reassured by nurses, auscultated, encouraged, and paid

attention to, or b) a whole floor of laboring women who are laying in bed

requiring nothing but a single nurse to watch everyone's contractions on a

single screen. now, you are an overtired, oveworked, underpaid and

underappreciated nurse. which would you prefer? you can bet you'd be drug

pusher too.

 

 

[Guest guest]

My sister spent many years as a labor nurse and as a nurse/midwife. She

delivered my daughter and, along with my doctor (she delivered her kids, too),

made me aware of the all of the options available during labor.

 

Medicine is a consumer good. I wouldn't buy a refridgerator without doing

research. If I brought home spoiled tofu, I would take it back to the store.

We have a responsibility to ourselves and our children to read everything we can

to make the best choices.

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

i am not under any circumstances capitulating for nurses here, but i will

explain why they pressure women so much to have drugs. on the one hand you

have a woman who is awake and aware and whose body is most likely telling

her to move. so this women is not going to stay in bed, she is going to

make noises spontanteously, she might squat or rock or moan, her partner is

wandering around after her with ginger ale and cold packs, maybe she has a

doula who is encouraging her to walk and take showers and generally make a

mess. a good nurse who is doing evidence-based care would come and

auscultate (listen with a doppler) that woman every 20-30 minutes or so, but

on most nursing floors they claim to not have enough nurses for that (and

due to nursing cut-backs, many times that is true). on the other hand, you

have a woman on an epidural. she is strapped to the bed by a monitor,

which becomes 100% necessary with an epi because of the risks to the baby

(although they are not likely to tell you that). this woman is complacently

sitting or lying or sleeping through her labor while the partner watches

football. her contractions are monitored not by a nurse actually touching

or communicating with her, but by a single nurse at a central kiosk. now

imagine a whole labor floor of women either a) listening to their bodies and

being general pains in the asses by moving, rocking, making noise, needing

to be touched and reassured by nurses, auscultated, encouraged, and paid

attention to, or b) a whole floor of laboring women who are laying in bed

requiring nothing but a single nurse to watch everyone's contractions on a

single screen. now, you are an overtired, oveworked, underpaid and

underappreciated nurse. which would you prefer? you can bet you'd be drug

pusher too.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I had to be still and be hooked up to monitors for 14 hours before an

anestelogist (I know thats not spelled right) even came in and said that an

epidural wouldn't work for me because of my scoliosis. I had to lie still the

whole 14 hours prior to that. (and afterwards too) They did give me statol.

So basically what you are saying is that if I had refused any drugs (which it

didn't seem like the statol helped with the pain at all it only made me a

little groggy) that I could've actually walked around! That's irritating to

know.

Renee

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

i am not under any circumstances capitulating for nurses here, but i will

explain why they pressure women so much to have drugs. on the one hand you

have a woman who is awake and aware and whose body is most likely telling

her to move. so this women is not going to stay in bed, she is going to

make noises spontanteously, she might squat or rock or moan, her partner is

wandering around after her with ginger ale and cold packs, maybe she has a

doula who is encouraging her to walk and take showers and generally make a

mess. a good nurse who is doing evidence-based care would come and

auscultate (listen with a doppler) that woman every 20-30 minutes or so, but

on most nursing floors they claim to not have enough nurses for that (and

due to nursing cut-backs, many times that is true). on the other hand, you

have a woman on an epidural. she is strapped to the bed by a monitor,

which becomes 100% necessary with an epi because of the risks to the baby

(although they are not likely to tell you that). this woman is complacently

sitting or lying or sleeping through her labor while the partner watches

football. her contractions are monitored not by a nurse actually touching

or communicating with her, but by a single nurse at a central kiosk. now

imagine a whole labor floor of women either a) listening to their bodies and

being general pains in the asses by moving, rocking, making noise, needing

to be touched and reassured by nurses, auscultated, encouraged, and paid

attention to, or b) a whole floor of laboring women who are laying in bed

requiring nothing but a single nurse to watch everyone's contractions on a

single screen. now, you are an overtired, oveworked, underpaid and

underappreciated nurse. which would you prefer? you can bet you'd be drug

pusher too.

 

[Guest guest]

Well, I don't know, but my dentist said that if you have the kind of R.O.

filter that has three filters (thus it is called triple filtered) then yes

it does remove the flouride. That is the kind we have. But apparently if

it's R.O. but not triple filtered than it does still have the flouride.

Leena

 

>

>

> On Behalf Of Bonnie Barker

>Tuesday, September 19, 2006 3:29 PM

>

>Re: fluoride

>

>My dentist said that reverse osmosis filters do NOT remove

>fluoride from the water, and recommended we use bottled water.

>I'm hoping he was wrong about that, does anyone know?

>Thanks, Bonnie

>

[Guest guest]

My husband was out of town and it was the middle of the night when I went into

labor. My doctor gave me stadol, which stopped my labor temporarily and I went

to sleep. LOL and that is what I was doing when my husband arrived 5 hours

later. Shortly after he arrived they stopped the stadol and I went back into

labor and delivered a healthy baby girl 6 hours later. I can tell you that

when they gave me the epidural, it was such a beautiful relaxing release of all

pain.. I have no bad feelings about it at all. I was able to get up and walk

shortly after this. I didn't have any long term inability to walk at all.

 

I am sorry you had to be so still. That would be awful. I never had that

experience before. I moved around right up until the end.

Judy

-

Renee Carroll

Wednesday, September 20, 2006 7:55 AM

Re: fluoride

 

 

I had to be still and be hooked up to monitors for 14 hours before an

anestelogist (I know thats not spelled right) even came in and said that an

epidural wouldn't work for me because of my scoliosis. I had to lie still the

whole 14 hours prior to that. (and afterwards too) They did give me statol. So

basically what you are saying is that if I had refused any drugs (which it

didn't seem like the statol helped with the pain at all it only made me a little

groggy) that I could've actually walked around! That's irritating to know.

Renee

 

 

.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

oh yes, stadol is pretty much useless. goes right to the baby too. i am

saddened by your story, renee, but i hear it every day, women being treated

like cattle on the assembly line of birth. i won't go off on it completely

here, but suffice to say there is this incredibly psychology behind what

they do to women in the hospital that is so very, very difficult to

overcome. i hear time and time again of women who go in educated and

informed and ready to demand their rights as laboring women to have their

babies in the healthiest and most active way possible, who nevertheless end

up strapped to a bed, where they can't move to use gravity to bring the baby

down and help their labors progress, so they end up with pitocin, which

makes their contractions so unbearable they cannot continue on without

drugs, so they end up with an epi, which straps them to the bed further,

further depletes the usefulness of their labor, so they end up with MORE

pitocin, which the baby doesn't handle well, so the heartbeat starts

fluctuating, and before you know it, that baby has been cut out of her, and

they tell me this story later so incredibly bewildered that this happened to

them. it is just plain sick and abusive what they do to laboring women.

this isn't even including the majority of women whose labors are induced for

convenience, who aren't informed of the many very real and highly likely

risks of induction, or the many women who end up with cesareans for being in

labor for " too long, " or the women who end up with cesareans for being " too

small, " or the women whose waters are broken without permission, who have

multiple vaginal exams without any information about increased risk of

infection, or the women who have episiotomies without even being told it's

going to be done, whose doctors are stuck in the dark ages and have

evidently never seen any of the research about how much worse it is for a

woman to have an episio...ok, i'll stop now. but, i'm sorry that happened

to you.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Kadee,

Well, I can tell you that in my own pregnancy and labor, I NEVER had an

internal exam. I had midwifery care and a home water birth. There was nothing

that alerted her to examine me in that way. She was at my birth during active

labor and was there all the way through my labor etc. She didn't work for a

hospital and was trained to look, listen and touch women on the outside of their

bellies. I didn't have the waiting room stuff. My prenatal visits were always

at least 40 minutes spent entirely with my midwife ; with lots of hot tea,

questions, discussions and plenty of wonderful birth stories. Dr.'s are

hampered by insurance as far as office visits.

Peace,

Laura

 

abbey_road3012 writes:

 

Are all those exams during pregnancy a bad thing? I got so sick of those.

And sitting in the stupid waiting room for an hour just so the doctor can ask

if I'm feeling all right- couldn't that be done over the phone??

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Ah, get me on the episiotomy subject, will ya? After my daughter was born and we

were in our room, a nurse came in the room to check my stitches. " What

stitches?!? " I asked. The doctor explained to me that it was necessary. Funny,

it wasn't necessary the second time with a slightly bigger baby. And the fact

that I was never even told it was done made me reeeeeally mad.

Are all those exams during pregnancy a bad thing? I got so sick of those. And

sitting in the stupid waiting room for an hour just so the doctor can ask if I'm

feeling all right- couldn't that be done over the phone??

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

oh yes, stadol is pretty much useless. goes right to the baby too. i am

saddened by your story, renee, but i hear it every day, women being treated

like cattle on the assembly line of birth. i won't go off on it completely

here, but suffice to say there is this incredibly psychology behind what

they do to women in the hospital that is so very, very difficult to

overcome. i hear time and time again of women who go in educated and

informed and ready to demand their rights as laboring women to have their

babies in the healthiest and most active way possible, who nevertheless end

up strapped to a bed, where they can't move to use gravity to bring the baby

down and help their labors progress, so they end up with pitocin, which

makes their contractions so unbearable they cannot continue on without

drugs, so they end up with an epi, which straps them to the bed further,

further depletes the usefulness of their labor, so they end up with MORE

pitocin, which the baby doesn't handle well, so the heartbeat starts

fluctuating, and before you know it, that baby has been cut out of her, and

they tell me this story later so incredibly bewildered that this happened to

them. it is just plain sick and abusive what they do to laboring women.

this isn't even including the majority of women whose labors are induced for

convenience, who aren't informed of the many very real and highly likely

risks of induction, or the many women who end up with cesareans for being in

labor for " too long, " or the women who end up with cesareans for being " too

small, " or the women whose waters are broken without permission, who have

multiple vaginal exams without any information about increased risk of

infection, or the women who have episiotomies without even being told it's

going to be done, whose doctors are stuck in the dark ages and have

evidently never seen any of the research about how much worse it is for a

woman to have an episio...ok, i'll stop now. but, i'm sorry that happened

to you.

 

[Guest guest]

all those exams are NOT necessary. as a student midwife rule #1 for me is,

NO EXAMS FROM CURIOSITY! an experienced and educated midwife can tell just

from watching a woman's movements and breathing approximately where she is

in her labor, so presumably doctors and nurses could do the same thing

too...but oh, that would involve actually spending time with the laboring

woman. they do so many so they know when to start you on the pit, lol. and

also because the general rule is that when a woman reaches 4 cm., she can

have an epidural. the only time i had exams with my son was when i asked,

and i wouldn't have asked for any but that my labor went on for so long. in

60 hours i had three exams and my midwife was so gentle and good at it, i

barely noticed the intrusion. doing so many exams is one reason why, in

terms of infection, working with a midwife is much safer than working with a

doctor. every time you get an exam your chance of infection increases

threefold, and you probably don't want to know what they'll do to your baby

if you end up getting infected. and episiotomies...yuck. one of the most

disgusting obstetric interventions invented. great when there is a TRUE

EMERGENCY, like shoulder distocia...not so great when the doctor is in a

hurry or convinced that it will keep a woman from tearing (does that make

ANY sense?!). increased bleeding, increased chance of infection, longer

healing time, greater chance of fustula, increased incontinence, sometimes

years of painful intercourse, nerve damage, and the oh-so-pleasant and not

terribly rare side effect of the thing ripping all the way through at the

time and " unzipping " with subsequent babies...yup, they're a lifesaver all

right!

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

What about the exams during pregnancy, before the labor actually starts?

That's ridiculous that they'd actually do such awful things just because they

were in a hurry! I'm getting so fed up with all these doctors just trying to go

the cheap or easy way out. My daughter and I have had these infections on our

skin for over 2 weeks now and we've been to the doctor twice- a total of three

different doctors just guessed as to what it is and prescribed based on a guess.

We took the " culprit " to the vet, one of our little mice, and she knew

immediately where we'd gotten it. She (the vet) was really upset that our

doctors hadn't done skin scrapings to see just what it was. Now my daughter has

a second infection and my son has one too. If they'd have just gotten it right

the first time... ugh!

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

all those exams are NOT necessary. as a student midwife rule #1 for me is,

NO EXAMS FROM CURIOSITY! an experienced and educated midwife can tell just

from watching a woman's movements and breathing approximately where she is

in her labor, so presumably doctors and nurses could do the same thing

too...but oh, that would involve actually spending time with the laboring

woman. they do so many so they know when to start you on the pit, lol. and

also because the general rule is that when a woman reaches 4 cm., she can

have an epidural. the only time i had exams with my son was when i asked,

and i wouldn't have asked for any but that my labor went on for so long. in

60 hours i had three exams and my midwife was so gentle and good at it, i

barely noticed the intrusion. doing so many exams is one reason why, in

terms of infection, working with a midwife is much safer than working with a

doctor. every time you get an exam your chance of infection increases

threefold, and you probably don't want to know what they'll do to your baby

if you end up getting infected. and episiotomies...yuck. one of the most

disgusting obstetric interventions invented. great when there is a TRUE

EMERGENCY, like shoulder distocia...not so great when the doctor is in a

hurry or convinced that it will keep a woman from tearing (does that make

ANY sense?!). increased bleeding, increased chance of infection, longer

healing time, greater chance of fustula, increased incontinence, sometimes

years of painful intercourse, nerve damage, and the oh-so-pleasant and not

terribly rare side effect of the thing ripping all the way through at the

time and " unzipping " with subsequent babies...yup, they're a lifesaver all

right!

 

[Guest guest]

Know that I am jealous!! If I ever have another baby I really hope our

insurance will cover something like that. I never did trust the child care place

on base with the kids after they required a pediatrician's note saying they

didn't have to eat meat during any meals, so I had to take my daughter to every

appointment while I was pregnant with my son. My husband would take off work to

come with me on almost all the visits, but still it was such a pain! I didn't

have a single problem either time, and yet was subjected to those awful exams

every month, half of them nothing more than being asked how I felt and if the

baby was moving and if I had any questions. Hearing all these stories of happy

births make me so sad that I didn't have that too! I'm so awfully modest, I got

really embarrassed having a strange man um... yeah. Would've been nice to have

someone I was more comfortable with.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

VAP79 wrote:

Kadee,

Well, I can tell you that in my own pregnancy and labor, I NEVER had an

internal exam. I had midwifery care and a home water birth. There was nothing

that alerted her to examine me in that way. She was at my birth during active

labor and was there all the way through my labor etc. She didn't work for a

hospital and was trained to look, listen and touch women on the outside of

their

bellies. I didn't have the waiting room stuff. My prenatal visits were always

at least 40 minutes spent entirely with my midwife ; with lots of hot tea,

questions, discussions and plenty of wonderful birth stories. Dr.'s are

hampered by insurance as far as office visits.

Peace,

Laura

 

abbey_road3012 writes:

 

Are all those exams during pregnancy a bad thing? I got so sick of those.

And sitting in the stupid waiting room for an hour just so the doctor can ask

if I'm feeling all right- couldn't that be done over the phone??

 

[Guest guest]

oh my heavens kadee, are you saying you had a vaginal exam at every single

appointment?! that is completely and utterly unnecessary and really, really

stupid. the only good reason to do a vaginal exam in pregnancy is if the

woman has had surgery on her cervix, to see if the scar tissue is loose

enough and how prevalent it is. it's also a good way of ascertaining for

certain that there really is a pregnancy, but what with blood tests and many

other non-invasive tests, it's really not necessary to go to such lengths.

that is horrible! i was with an OB/GYN-nurse midwife practice for the first

half of my first pregnancy, and i remember how horrible my appointments

were. i only had a vaginal exam the first time but every appointment was

just stupid. was the baby moving, did i have any questions (not that i ever

got satisfactory answers), a urine test that i realized with a REAL midwife

i could have done on my own and had some idea of what the results were...it

was just ridiculous. i got maybe ten minutes with the CNM each time, after

waiting 45 minutes most of the time, and she was so snippy and awful. i

hope this isn't TMI but at one point, i asked if there was anything i could

do about my, um, low libido, in the first trimester, because i was just so

exhausted. her reply? " do it anyway, otherwise he'll think you don't love

him anymore and who knows, maybe he'll start looking elsewhere. " great,

very compassionate advice! i ultimately swtiched to a real midwife and

planned for a homebirth and saw how incredibly different it could be. with

this midwife i'm seeing for this pregnancy, i just saw her the other day,

and i visited with her for an hour and a half. that's about how long all of

my appointments are. i check my own urine and keep my own file so i always

know what's going on. we listen to the baby at MY request, she checks the

position and shows me how to do it myself, and then the rest of the time we

talked about...oh everything, my last birth and how i'm feeling going into

this one, any questions i have about how she handles certain things (with

REAL answers, not " don't you worry your pretty head about it! " ), preparing

for breastfeeding, stories of births that she's attended, and completely

unrelated subjects, not like she's above me at all, but like she's on my

level and isn't afraid to talk about how silly some men are about washing

dishes, stuff like that. it is an AMAZING experience to work with a midwife

who knows you intimately and loves you and considers it an honor to share

your birth with you, who considers YOU to be in charge, who believes 100% in

your body's ability to birth a perfect baby. i hear other women's stories

of their experiences with OBs or CNMs or nurses (or crappy midwives -- those

are the worst), their experiences in the hospital, the abuse that they just

accept because they think they're alone in what they experienced or,

conversely, think that it happens to everyone and that's just the way it is,

and i just want to cry because it really does NOT need to be and SHOULD NOT

be like that.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I didn't get the whole exam every visit, but probably about 7 or 8 times. The

last month it was every week, both pregnancies. Ugh. I wish I'd have known about

midwives and all this other stuff when I was pregnant. RRrrrgh. Hubby is wanting

a third, and if I do go for it I am going to go for something different! It

should be illegal for anyone to bring a tiny baby *anywhere*- it just kills me,

when we see one, hubby says, " Honey, don't you want another baby? " Totally

unfair.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

oh my heavens kadee, are you saying you had a vaginal exam at every single

appointment?! that is completely and utterly unnecessary and really, really

stupid. the only good reason to do a vaginal exam in pregnancy is if the

woman has had surgery on her cervix, to see if the scar tissue is loose

enough and how prevalent it is. it's also a good way of ascertaining for

certain that there really is a pregnancy, but what with blood tests and many

other non-invasive tests, it's really not necessary to go to such lengths.

that is horrible! i was with an OB/GYN-nurse midwife practice for the first

half of my first pregnancy, and i remember how horrible my appointments

were. i only had a vaginal exam the first time but every appointment was

just stupid. was the baby moving, did i have any questions (not that i ever

got satisfactory answers), a urine test that i realized with a REAL midwife

i could have done on my own and had some idea of what the results were...it

was just ridiculous. i got maybe ten minutes with the CNM each time, after

waiting 45 minutes most of the time, and she was so snippy and awful. i

hope this isn't TMI but at one point, i asked if there was anything i could

do about my, um, low libido, in the first trimester, because i was just so

exhausted. her reply? " do it anyway, otherwise he'll think you don't love

him anymore and who knows, maybe he'll start looking elsewhere. " great,

very compassionate advice! i ultimately swtiched to a real midwife and

planned for a homebirth and saw how incredibly different it could be. with

this midwife i'm seeing for this pregnancy, i just saw her the other day,

and i visited with her for an hour and a half. that's about how long all of

my appointments are. i check my own urine and keep my own file so i always

know what's going on. we listen to the baby at MY request, she checks the

position and shows me how to do it myself, and then the rest of the time we

talked about...oh everything, my last birth and how i'm feeling going into

this one, any questions i have about how she handles certain things (with

REAL answers, not " don't you worry your pretty head about it! " ), preparing

for breastfeeding, stories of births that she's attended, and completely

unrelated subjects, not like she's above me at all, but like she's on my

level and isn't afraid to talk about how silly some men are about washing

dishes, stuff like that. it is an AMAZING experience to work with a midwife

who knows you intimately and loves you and considers it an honor to share

your birth with you, who considers YOU to be in charge, who believes 100% in

your body's ability to birth a perfect baby. i hear other women's stories

of their experiences with OBs or CNMs or nurses (or crappy midwives -- those

are the worst), their experiences in the hospital, the abuse that they just

accept because they think they're alone in what they experienced or,

conversely, think that it happens to everyone and that's just the way it is,

and i just want to cry because it really does NOT need to be and SHOULD NOT

be like that.

 

[Guest guest]

that's crazy. i really love this, i heard this from a woman a few weeks

ago. she was at 38 weeks and at her appointment with her OB, he examined

her and said that " there wasn't much going on in her cervix " -- it was still

tight, high and hard, no cervical changes. so he told her that he wanted to

go ahead and schedule a cesarean for her, and if she went into labor before

then, great, but he didn't see it happening since nothing was happening in

her cervix. so right at 40 weeks, she had her baby out by cesarean. now,

keep in mind, this was her very first baby, and she should have been happy

there wasn't anything going on in her cervix, since the baby obviously

wasn't ready to come out yet. by standards of average she could have had

another month to go. and with almost all first babies, there are rarely ANY

cervical changes until, ya know, LABOR!!! she found out later the doctor

was planning to go out of town and did so the day after she had her

cesarean. so now she has to go into every pregnancy fighting to have a

vaginal birth and terrified because she's never experienced labor before,

and she got to go into her first experience of motherhood having had major

abdominal surgery. i felt sorry for her but also like, she could have done

just a tiny bit of research for herself, or gotten a second opinion, but it

seems like most poeple accept the word of their doctors as God; i know i

tend to do that with things NOT baby-related and i've had to really work

hard to be able to stand up to doctors' authority on certain issues.

definitely weigh your options if you have another baby, kadee. so many

women don't know that they even HAVE options. most women don't realize that

statistically it's far safer to have a midwife and have your baby out of

hospital, and even more women don't realize that even if it hurts, it can

still be a pleasant experience.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Doctors who do things like that ought to be beaten!! A friend I grew up with was

born on Valentine's Day- her due date was a few days away, her mother was just

starting to have contractions, and the doctor gave her pitocin because he had a

Valentine's Day party to go to that night and didn't want to miss it because of

a baby being born. I'd have strangled him if it had been me.

My doctor with my first pregnancy, on my final " exam " visit just 6 days before

my daughter was born, said that on Monday (ended up being the day after Leah was

born) if she wasn't born already he'd like to induce. I said no, the baby will

come when he/she is ready and not a moment before. Why on earth would a doctor

want to force a baby out before the baby is ready? It's almost like they want to

sell as many " services " and drugs as possible just to make money.

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

earthmother <earthmother213 wrote:

that's crazy. i really love this, i heard this from a woman a few weeks

ago. she was at 38 weeks and at her appointment with her OB, he examined

her and said that " there wasn't much going on in her cervix " -- it was still

tight, high and hard, no cervical changes. so he told her that he wanted to

go ahead and schedule a cesarean for her, and if she went into labor before

then, great, but he didn't see it happening since nothing was happening in

her cervix. so right at 40 weeks, she had her baby out by cesarean. now,

keep in mind, this was her very first baby, and she should have been happy

there wasn't anything going on in her cervix, since the baby obviously

wasn't ready to come out yet. by standards of average she could have had

another month to go. and with almost all first babies, there are rarely ANY

cervical changes until, ya know, LABOR!!! she found out later the doctor

was planning to go out of town and did so the day after she had her

cesarean. so now she has to go into every pregnancy fighting to have a

vaginal birth and terrified because she's never experienced labor before,

and she got to go into her first experience of motherhood having had major

abdominal surgery. i felt sorry for her but also like, she could have done

just a tiny bit of research for herself, or gotten a second opinion, but it

seems like most poeple accept the word of their doctors as God; i know i

tend to do that with things NOT baby-related and i've had to really work

hard to be able to stand up to doctors' authority on certain issues.

definitely weigh your options if you have another baby, kadee. so many

women don't know that they even HAVE options. most women don't realize that

statistically it's far safer to have a midwife and have your baby out of

hospital, and even more women don't realize that even if it hurts, it can

still be a pleasant experience.

 

[Guest guest]

it's because they like to keep their lives easy and orderly and even if you

end up in surgery because of their impatience, well, really that's all the

better for them. the induction rate in this country is through the roof! i

can't believe how many women receive the message that the placenta just

falls apart or something at 41 weeks...or 40, or 42, or whatever date the

doctor pulls out of his butt. one of the sadnesses of going into

traditional midwifery is the realization that i will be on call EVERY SINGLE

MINUTE FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE, lol. because babies do come when they are

ready, not when we'd like them to. yes, the placenta has a shelf life, and

yes, sometimes babies do stay in there for too long. but there are ways to

find out how the baby is faring if it's over the due date, not just sticking

something in a woman's bloodstream or cervix and hoping it comes out all

right. it makes me so mad when i hear of women getting induced because

somebody was going on vacation and didn't want to be inconvenienced; as a

general rule babies do NOT like pitocin and the uterus likes it even less.

it increases complications dramatically and regularly ends up in cesarean.

i'm terrified to hear that some women are still getting cytotec even!

patience is not the general rule with doctors and hospitals, which is why so

many labors end up in cesarean for " distocia, " meaning, " you took too long

and we don't feel like waiting for you, we need your bed for the next paying

customer. "