Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Hi Jane > Jo nobody likes war, but sometimes its a necessity. Nobody asked for 11 Sep > to happen but it did. More terrorist threats have been made this weekend. More terrorists are made with every bomb that is dropped. > You're happy for the world to sit back and wait for it to happen? Perhaps I > shouldn't even be discussing this with you guys. I'll let you go back to > the fairies at the bottom of your garden! At least the fairies at the bottom of the garden know how to think for themselves! BB Peter --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Hi Cathy > He also mentioned that there was an anti-war march yestereday, but > that these people were " unrepresentative " . Arrogant bastard. I agree. I've never seen such a varied group of protesters (and I've been on enough protests!) - there were all races, all religions, animal rights people, politicians, trade unionists, civil servants, etc. etc. > Peter and Jo > - please let me know if there's another protest at a weekend and I'll be > there if I can. I think Jo's already posted something on this, but we'll keep you (and anyone else who wants to know) informed of anything we hear. > The knowledge that there are people who think that America > and Britain bombing the shit out of one of the poorest countries is a good > idea and that they deserved it, sickens me utterly. Well said! BB Peter --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Hi Fraggle > i was wondering...when britain signed on to become America's junior partner, did you guys get a good severance package or anything? Stock options? > ah..from the days of " rule britainia " to todays follow america's lead where ever it shall lead... Yeah, we got a great deal - we took on all of America's spare wheat stocks, which the majority of the population are allergic to! :-) BB Peter --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Peter wrote: > > > At least the fairies at the bottom of the garden know how to think for > themselves! It's not good to resort to ad feminam attacks simply because someone doesn't agree with you. > BB > Peter > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 > > To send an email to - > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Peter wrote: > > Hi Jane > > > Really Peter? So who was the puppy in the Second World War? > > I didn't think we were talking about the second world war. You took the conversation onto the US/UK relationship, to which WW2 is a sound counterexample. > > Was the > > American government the puppy then? > > The American government tried desperately to join in for most of the war, > but could never convince it's people - so it engineered a situation where > Japan had no real option but to attack. Read some of the material from the > then US secretary of state for foreign affairs - the one that is > particularly telling is his letter to Roosevelt in which he states " we must > make it appear that Japan are the agressors " . Ah. So they *forced* Japan to launch a *surpise attack* against Pearl Harbour? > > You need to throw your fancy Alice in > > Wonderland ideas out of the window and face up to reality. > > Which reality - the one presented by the media? I think I'll stick to the > real world. You are welcome to continue living in the fantasy world of > television and newspapers - I can understand that this is far more > comfortable than striving for truth. Apparently Jane thinks that the media in an open society are not a fantasy world, but simply more reliable than believing whatever Peter forwards. That seems sound. Alastair Campbell today asked the media to not show bin Laden videos, because it's enemy propoganda. The media told him that that was *his* problem, and showing both sides was *their* job. That's what happens in an open society, and it shows that it is far from a fantasy world. > > We need America > > and they need us too and I'm not just talking about war. I gather > politics > > isn't your strong point Peter. > > I seem to know a fair bit more about the reality of politics than you do - > all you've done is regurgitate stuff fed to you my the media. We don't > " need " America at all - we are just told that. If the whole of Europe were > to ignore America, you'd soon find that it would be America who needs us! *sigh* Notcing what someone else is saying clearly isn't your strong suit. Jane just said that America needs us. What you disagree with her about is whether we need America. We're clearly better off with them than without them. For a start off, it's where we get Star Trek from . And we *do* need them for any peacekeeping or defense duties. Without their equipment, NATO units are hamstrung. > BB > Peter > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Ian > It's not good to resort to ad feminam attacks simply because someone > doesn't agree with you. I think you are being too pernickity now! The original insults came from Jane, so she must accept that she might get answers that she doesn't like. Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 > And we *do* need them for any peacekeeping or defense duties. Without > their equipment, NATO units are hamstrung. Has anyone done any 'digging' into the history and connections of NATO? Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 > ---------- > > umm > hey.. > *raises paw* > got an idea..its wacky...nutty.... > but..i live way over here , so you have to excuse me... > how about we just listen to each other's opinions, and keep it open, ok? > Dear, cuddly Fraggle - I cannot say that you are wrong, you aren't, but oh how I need people to know how awful it is that they want the bombing to continue! It would be dishonest of me to say that I can respect a person whilst hating their point of view - love the sinner, hate the sin - if only I could but I am not that well evolved. > if you don't agree with someone's point...fine...yer opinion..please, > retort... > but, can we stay away from the name calling and bickering...gets us > nowhere, and i'm tooo damn old to play on the monkey bars, well, not that > old, but, i'm afraid of heights... > Well I think I'm about twice your age (44) and I'll race you up those monkey bars any old time! > oh, and well said cathy.. > > Bless your cotton socks. Long live Fraggle. Cheers indeed! Cathy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Cathy > Thank you Jo. I have put it on my calendar and will be there if it is > humanly possible. Maybe we could meet up? That would be good. We'll see if we can arrange it nearer the time. I expect my daughter and her partner will be there as well. Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 " Cathy Jupp (BR) " wrote: > > > ---------- > > > > umm > > hey.. > > *raises paw* > > got an idea..its wacky...nutty.... > > but..i live way over here , so you have to excuse me... > > how about we just listen to each other's opinions, and keep it open, ok? > > > Dear, cuddly Fraggle - I cannot say that you are wrong, you aren't, but oh > how I need people to know how awful it is that they want the bombing to > continue! It would be dishonest of me to say that I can respect a person > whilst hating their point of view - love the sinner, hate the sin - if only > I could but I am not that well evolved. Cathy, there's no-one on the list who's actually professed the point of view that angered you so much. -- Ian McDonald http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~type40/alternative.html http://travel.to/startrekcolony - Star Trek: Colony site & .mov http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~type40/who-rpg.html - Dr. Who RPGs Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Personally I feel that just about everything that can be said has been said on this thread, and do not wish to continue the nit-picking. We have different opinions, and that's that. Jo > Cathy, there's no-one on the list who's actually professed the point of > view that angered you so much. > > -- > Ian McDonald --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 15, 2001 Jo wrote: > > Personally I feel that just about everything that can be said has been said > on this thread, and do not wish to continue the nit-picking. We have > different opinions, and that's that. > > Jo > > > Cathy, there's no-one on the list who's actually professed the point of > > view that angered you so much. This isn't nit-picking. Cathy seems to be saying that she doesn't like Jane and myself. She's talking as if I (to avoid speaking for anyone else) want to bomb innocent Afghanis for the hell of it, when what I actually want to do is minimise innocent deaths, whether from the Taliban, from famine, from collateral damage, or from terrorist atrocities. I think I'll jump over to the other list, where I'm an outspoken dove, for a few mins. . > > > > -- > > Ian McDonald > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 16, 2001 ah..see, they asked the media(they meaning the government)last week not to air em... so far, they haven't...they mentioned some video over the weekend, but not what it contained.. tho, if there was secret messages being sent out, couldn't the terrorists just tune into some other channel, or, bacchus forbid..the internet?? >Alastair Campbell today asked the media to not show bin Laden videos, >because it's enemy propoganda. The media told him that that was *his* >problem, and showing both sides was *their* job. That's what happens in >an open society, and it shows that it is far from a fantasy world. > >> > We need America >> > and they need us too and I'm not just talking about war. I gather >> politics >> > isn't your strong point Peter. >> >> I seem to know a fair bit more about the reality of politics than you do - >> all you've done is regurgitate stuff fed to you my the media. We don't >> " need " America at all - we are just told that. If the whole of Europe were >> to ignore America, you'd soon find that it would be America who needs us! > >*sigh* > >Notcing what someone else is saying clearly isn't your strong suit. Jane >just said that America needs us. What you disagree with her about is >whether we need America. > >We're clearly better off with them than without them. For a start off, >it's where we get Star Trek from . > >And we *do* need them for any peacekeeping or defense duties. Without >their equipment, NATO units are hamstrung. > >> BB >> Peter >> >> --- >> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >> Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 >> >> >> To send an email to - >> >> Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 16, 2001 Hi Fraggle > tho, if there was secret messages being sent out, couldn't the terrorists just tune into some other channel, or, bacchus forbid..the internet?? I just love this - Bin Laden, the man who, apparently, has managed to get 16 people to commit suicide in the most highly organised terrorist attack ever, and who has then managed to start a bacterial warfare against America using Anthrax, having to resort to " secret messages " in video broadcasts! BB Peter --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 16, 2001 > ---------- > Dr Ian McDonald[sMTP:ian.mcdonald] > > We're clearly better off with them than without them. For a start off, > it's where we get Star Trek from . > Hear hear! But now that we've GOT the recipe...... (sorry - I meant videos!) Apologies to Fraggle (and anyone too young to remember NTNO'CN). I love Americans really - just not sure about your politicians (or ours, come to that!) Cathy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 17, 2001 Hi Ian / Cathy > > We're clearly better off with them than without them. For a start off, > > it's where we get Star Trek from . OK, but *apart* from Star Trek, what have the Americans ever done for us? (just kidding!) BB Peter --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 17, 2001 Peter > OK, but *apart* from Star Trek, what have the Americans ever done for us? > (just kidding!) Some of their metal bands are pretty good! but that's nothing to do with their government, of course. Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release 18/09/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 17, 2001 --- Jo <Heartwork wrote: > Peter > > > OK, but *apart* from Star Trek, what have the > Americans ever done for us? > > (just kidding!) > > Some of their metal bands are pretty good! but > that's nothing to do with > their government, of course. > > Jo > > I am no fan of the Americans but sometimes i feel you have to grudingly respect them. They have come to Europes aid more than once and have stood up for freedom of expression how lucky we are to be able to protest, there are few countries where freedom of individual expression is as open as we are here. Anad > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release > 18/09/01 > > ===== X Make a great connection at Personals. http://personals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 14, 2001 Jo/Peter - Is the anti-war march still on for 17th November? If so, will you give times/meeting place please? I'm hoping to combine it with an anti-fur demo, but no doubt times will clash! If you're still going, where should we meet? Don't worry if not, I'm quite used to going to this sort of thing by myself. Thanks Cathy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 14, 2001 Isn't there an HLS demo on the 17th - " Cathy Jupp (BR) " <cjbr Wednesday, November 14, 2001 1:30 PM RE: Re: anti-war march > Jo/Peter - Is the anti-war march still on for 17th November? If so, will > you give times/meeting place please? I'm hoping to combine it with an > anti-fur demo, but no doubt times will clash! If you're still going, where > should we meet? Don't worry if not, I'm quite used to going to this sort of > thing by myself. > Thanks > Cathy > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 15, 2001 Cathy There is an anti-war march on Sunday 18th. Gather at Hyde Park at midday. I'm not sure yet if we can go, but I hope so. Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.286 / Virus Database: 152 - Release 09/10/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2001 Dear Jo I am committed for Sunday, so sadly will not be joining you. What a shame - I kept Saturday free. No doubt I shall not be idle, but I really did want to stand up and be counted. My mother said it would make no difference - the government will do what they want regardless, but as I pointed out, if I do not make my voice heard then what point is there to my existence? Next time maybe. You are my only source of info, so can you let me know when other demos are scheduled? I'm pretty much out of it on Sundays, but if I have a bit of notice I can usually do Saturdays. Thank you very much. I hope it keeps fine for you. Cathy > ---------- > Peter[sMTP:Snowbow] > Reply > 15 November 2001 21:13 > > Re: Re: anti-war march > > Cathy > > There is an anti-war march on Sunday 18th. Gather at Hyde Park at midday. > I'm not sure yet if we can go, but I hope so. > > Jo > > > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system ( http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.286 / Virus Database: 152 - Release 09/10/01 > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2001 There was a peace march in Totnes today. Very busy! Jane - " Cathy Jupp (BR) " <cjbr Saturday, November 17, 2001 12:09 PM RE: Re: anti-war march > Dear Jo > I am committed for Sunday, so sadly will not be joining you. What a shame - > I kept Saturday free. No doubt I shall not be idle, but I really did want > to stand up and be counted. My mother said it would make no difference - > the government will do what they want regardless, but as I pointed out, if I > do not make my voice heard then what point is there to my existence? > Next time maybe. You are my only source of info, so can you let me know > when other demos are scheduled? I'm pretty much out of it on Sundays, but > if I have a bit of notice I can usually do Saturdays. > Thank you very much. I hope it keeps fine for you. > Cathy > > > ---------- > > Peter[sMTP:Snowbow] > > Reply > > 15 November 2001 21:13 > > > > Re: Re: anti-war march > > > > Cathy > > > > There is an anti-war march on Sunday 18th. Gather at Hyde Park at midday. > > I'm not sure yet if we can go, but I hope so. > > > > Jo > > > > > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system ( http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.286 / Virus Database: 152 - Release 09/10/01 > > > > > > > > Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2001 Cathy Not to worry. I know from previous mails how involved you are with 'being counted' for your beliefs. I will certainly let you know if there is another one - we were surprised that this one is on a Sunday. Are you on an HLS demo this weekend? Jo > I am committed for Sunday, so sadly will not be joining you. What a shame - > I kept Saturday free. No doubt I shall not be idle, but I really did want > to stand up and be counted. My mother said it would make no difference - > the government will do what they want regardless, but as I pointed out, if I > do not make my voice heard then what point is there to my existence? > Next time maybe. You are my only source of info, so can you let me know > when other demos are scheduled? I'm pretty much out of it on Sundays, but > if I have a bit of notice I can usually do Saturdays. > Thank you very much. I hope it keeps fine for you. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.286 / Virus Database: 152 - Release 09/10/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted November 17, 2001 > There was a peace march in Totnes today. Very busy! Wow! They are all over the place, it seems. I am pleased there are so many who feel the same. Jo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.286 / Virus Database: 152 - Release 09/10/01 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
