gum and bone loss

July 22, 2008

Thanks, Bill.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Mon, 7/21/08, bill_schoenbart <plantmed2 wrote:

bill_schoenbart <plantmed2

Re: gum and bone loss

Monday, July 21, 2008, 2:09 PM

Andrea,

It depends on your actual diagnosis. In menopausal " power surges " ,

there is often both yin and yang xu. If you balance the Kidney yang

herbs with Kidney yin herbs and add herbs like Huang Bai to clear

deficiency heat, it shouldn't be a problem. Of course, I'm speaking

theoretically, since I don't know your pattern. Since you are the

patient, you should be able to formulate something balanced and listen

to your body's feedback to modify the formula.

- Bill

,

< wrote:

>

> Thanks, Bill. I was also thinking about the bone-strengthening

herbs, but was concerned about them being too warming... Do you have

experience with using these for bone loss in

> menopausal women with " power surges " ?

>

> Andrea Beth

>

> Traditional Oriental Medicine

> Happy Hours in the CALM Center

> 753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

> Cottonwood, AZ 86326

> (928) 274-1373

>

---

Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including a

practitioner's directory and a moderated discussion forum.

July 22, 2008

This is very interesting. Thank you for sending it.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Mon, 7/21/08, <johnkokko wrote:

<johnkokko

Re: Re: gum and bone loss

Monday, July 21, 2008, 4:05 PM

Hi Andrea,

a dui yao for yin def heat (menopausal symptoms) could by Mo han lian and Nu

zhen zi.

They are not cloying, nourish the LV/KD yin, blackens the hair, are cooling

and Mo han lian is specifically known for solidifying loose teeth.

Also in the tonify yin category, Gui ban can (cold) can strengthen bones and

anchor yang.

Could these be added to the herbs that Bill suggested?

K.

On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 1:06 PM, <

wrote:

> Thanks, Bill. I was also thinking about the bone-strengthening herbs,

> but was concerned about them being too warming... Do you have experience

> with using these for bone loss in

> menopausal women with " power surges " ?

>

> Andrea Beth

>

> Traditional Oriental Medicine

> Happy Hours in the CALM Center

> 753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

> Cottonwood, AZ 86326

> (928) 274-1373

>

> --- On Mon, 7/21/08, bill_schoenbart

<plantmed2<plantmed2%40gmail.com>>

> wrote:

> bill_schoenbart <plantmed2

<plantmed2%40gmail.com>>

> Re: gum and bone loss

> To:

<%40>

> Monday, July 21, 2008, 12:47 PM

>

> I have seen this in an otherwise healthy patient who had a very-low-

> protein diet. In your case, if it's genetic, I would use the

> bone-strengthening herbs in the Tonify Kidney category, such as Xu

> Duan, Ba Ji Tian, Lu Rong, Gui Ban, Gu Sui Bu, Gou Ji, and Du Zhong.

>

> Gotu Kola should help strengthen the connective tissue in the sockets.

> It can be purchased as an extract. If you have a greenhouse, you could

> grow it and drink the juice.

>

> - Bill Schoenbart

>

> --- In

<%40>,

>

> < wrote:

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > Despite great hygiene and very clean teeth, I am experiencing rapid

> gum recession and now also some bone loss around my teeth.ï¿½ The

> recession was pretty gradual until I started transitioning in to

> menopause a year or so ago.ï¿½ My dentist tells me she's never seen

a

> cleaner mouth, but is concerned about the recession, especially since

> my front lower teeth are starting to loosen.ï¿½ I will be seeing a

> periodontist this week, but want to know if anyone knows of herbal

> formulas that can assist in regeneration of both, gum tissue and

> bone.ï¿½ Apparently, this is genetic - my mom experienced the same

> thing, and despite transplanting tissue from the roof of her mouth to

> her gumline, she still ended up needing bone grafts for dental

> implants. I'd love to avoid all of that, if possible.ï¿½ Anyone

have

> good results with our medicine?

> >

> > Thanks in advance,

> > Andrea Beth

> >

> > Traditional Oriental Medicine

> > Happy Hours in the CALM Center

> > 753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

> > Cottonwood, AZï¿½ 86326

> > (928) 274-1373

> >

July 22, 2008

Thank you, Cara. The lycopene article is interesting.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Mon, 7/21/08, Cara Frank <herbbabe wrote:

Cara Frank <herbbabe

Re: Re: gum and bone loss

Monday, July 21, 2008, 4:29 PM

Andrea,

I experienced gum recession during both my pregnancies. My dentist had

me take 100 mgs of Co-Q 10, which seemed to help at the time.

Also- there were articles on watermelon and lycopene content all over the

news several months ago. When watermelon is warm, the lycopene content

increases

http://www.healthcastle.com/lycopene_watermelon.shtml

anyway: on an herbal note: the teeth are governed by the kidneys: the gums

by the st/LI/ yang ming. This brings to mind herbs such as sheng ma and

sheng di ( and sheng di might be included in a formula to manage other

menopausal sx.

Just a few thoughts.....

Cara O. Frank, R.OM, Dipl Ac & Ch.H.

Six Fishes Healing Arts &

President China Herb Company of the Chinese Herb Program

Tai Sophia Institute of the Healing Arts

215-772-0770

July 22, 2008

Thanks, Tom!

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Tue, 7/22/08, Thomas Hurrle <tom wrote:

Thomas Hurrle <tom

Re: gum and bone loss

Tuesday, July 22, 2008, 12:44 PM

CO-Q 10 is particularily helpful for inflammation, a larger dose is

more effective ~125g/d or more. Often there is periodintal inflammation

in this situation, probably associated with yin deficiency stomach

heat. Pockets between the gum & tooth & gum tenderness show

inflammation. If this is present a salt mouthwash is useful.

Long term, a diet to support the kidneys is a sound strategy. Paul

Pitchford would be a place to start.

Tom Hurrle

Cara Frank <herbbabe wrote:

>

> Andrea,

> I experienced gum recession during both my pregnancies. My

dentist had

> me take 100 mgs of Co-Q 10, which seemed to help at the time.

>

---

Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including a

practitioner's directory and a moderated discussion forum.

July 28, 2008

Hi Kokko,

in browsing around the Bastyr website, i noticed this Whole Body Dentistry

--

http://www.bastyr.edu/bookstore/order/books.asp?item={56A04844-54ED-4C88-BC15-04\

4779472445} & catid=22

here it is on amazon -

http://www.amazon.com/Whole-Body-Dentistry-Discover-Missing-Better/dp/0967844304\

/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8 & s=books & qid=1217227405 & sr=8-1

looks like it includes Voll stuff amongst other good info.

~e

July 29, 2008

Edith, Looks great and only $13.57

Anyone on this group have a Voll dental meridian chart on hand?

Are there any other texts out there which have microsystem charts ?

How about Ralph Alan Dale?

K.

On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 11:46 PM, Edith Chan, L.Ac.

<chineseherbswrote:

> Hi Kokko,

>

> in browsing around the Bastyr website, i noticed this Whole Body Dentistry

> --

> http://www.bastyr.edu/bookstore/order/books.asp?item=

> {56A04844-54ED-4C88-BC15-044779472445} & catid=22

>

> here it is on amazon -

>

http://www.amazon.com/Whole-Body-Dentistry-Discover-Missing-Better/dp/0967844304\

/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8 & s=books & qid=1217227405 & sr=8-1

>

> looks like it includes Voll stuff amongst other good info.

>

> ~e

>

July 29, 2008

Re: tooth chart - see below. My belief is that some of the basic idea

holds true in many persons, but like all microsystems, you need to

establish multiple corroborating signs to have a clue what is going on

in any given individual.

This is on one of S. Barret's quackwatch pages:

http://www.dentalwatch.org/questionable/toothcharts.html

NOTE: This link is not to be construed as an endorsement of Mr

Barret's view's in ANY WAY WHATSOEVER.

joe reid

www.jreidomd.blogspot.com

July 29, 2008

Joe,

I never thought that I would thank S. Barrett!

He's promoting acupuncture and he doesn't even know it.

Interesting thing about the chart is that the right sided Earth channel

corresponds to the Pancreas,

while the left side corresponds to the Spleen.

A naturopath who utilizes Voll technology taught me that the right sided

" SP " primary channel corresponds to the Pancreas as well.

ie. needle the R side of SP 3 to stimulate the pancreas.

Anyone else know about this?

Thanks Joe for the chart.

K.

On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 9:00 PM, jreidomd <jreidomd wrote:

> Re: tooth chart - see below. My belief is that some of the basic idea

> holds true in many persons, but like all microsystems, you need to

> establish multiple corroborating signs to have a clue what is going on

> in any given individual.

>

> This is on one of S. Barret's quackwatch pages:

> http://www.dentalwatch.org/questionable/toothcharts.html

>

> NOTE: This link is not to be construed as an endorsement of Mr

> Barret's view's in ANY WAY WHATSOEVER.

>

> joe reid

> www.jreidomd.blogspot.com

>

--

aka Mu bong Lim

Father of Bhakti

The Four Reliances:

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

meaning that underlies them.

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

rely upon the definitive meaning.

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.

July 29, 2008

George Soulie De Morant States: The meridian of the pancreas is on the left -

that of the spleen on the right.

Ross

-

Chinese Medicine

Monday, July 28, 2008 10:43 PM

Re: gum and bone loss

Joe,

I never thought that I would thank S. Barrett!

He's promoting acupuncture and he doesn't even know it.

Interesting thing about the chart is that the right sided Earth channel

corresponds to the Pancreas,

while the left side corresponds to the Spleen.

A naturopath who utilizes Voll technology taught me that the right sided

" SP " primary channel corresponds to the Pancreas as well.

ie. needle the R side of SP 3 to stimulate the pancreas.

Anyone else know about this?

Thanks Joe for the chart.

K.

On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 9:00 PM, jreidomd <jreidomd wrote:

> Re: tooth chart - see below. My belief is that some of the basic idea

> holds true in many persons, but like all microsystems, you need to

> establish multiple corroborating signs to have a clue what is going on

> in any given individual.

>

> This is on one of S. Barret's quackwatch pages:

> http://www.dentalwatch.org/questionable/toothcharts.html

>

> NOTE: This link is not to be construed as an endorsement of Mr

> Barret's view's in ANY WAY WHATSOEVER.

>

> joe reid

> www.jreidomd.blogspot.com

>

--

aka Mu bong Lim

Father of Bhakti

The Four Reliances:

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

meaning that underlies them.

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

rely upon the definitive meaning.

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.

October 8, 2008

Andrea: This is not a response of which herbal formula to recommend at

this time. May I suggest you at least

consider taking a Co-Enzyme known as CQ 10 at around 100mg, capsule

or gel or liquid. After flossing followed by brushing then last

thing before bed take the CQ 10 on a gum brush and gently brush the cq

10 into the gums and DO NOT rinse your mouth. Great research from

Japan from at least 10 years ago or so. This co enzyme brings O2 into

the cells and kills anarobic bacteria and oxygenates the gums.Also

take an additional 200mg per day orally.

Peter Marinakis,PhD, MAc, FNAAOM

Full Circle Healing Arts

645 Ridgely Ave.

Annapolis, MD 21401

410-266-9370

On Jul 20, 2008, at 2:51 PM, wrote:

> Hi All,

>

> Despite great hygiene and very clean teeth, I am experiencing rapid

> gum recession and now also some bone loss around my teeth. The

> recession was pretty gradual until I started transitioning in to

> menopause a year or so ago. My dentist tells me she's never seen a

> cleaner mouth, but is concerned about the recession, especially

> since my front lower teeth are starting to loosen. I will be seeing

> a periodontist this week, but want to know if anyone knows of herbal

> formulas that can assist in regeneration of both, gum tissue and

> bone. Apparently, this is genetic - my mom experienced the same

> thing, and despite transplanting tissue from the roof of her mouth

> to her gumline, she still ended up needing bone grafts for dental

> implants. I'd love to avoid all of that, if possible. Anyone have

> good results with our medicine?

>

> Thanks in advance,

> Andrea Beth

>

> Traditional Oriental Medicine

> Happy Hours in the CALM Center

> 753 N. Main Street, Suite C-1

> Cottonwood, AZ 86326

> (928) 274-1373

>

October 8, 2008

Cool, Peter. Is this also effective where there is no bacterial problem, as in

my case?

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

1770 E. Villa Drive, Suite 5

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Tue, 10/7/08, Peter Marinakis <pmarinakis wrote:

Peter Marinakis <pmarinakis

Re: gum and bone loss

Chinese Medicine

Cc: " Marinakis Peter " <pmarinakis

Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 9:00 PM