Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 I changed the subject for this thread. Alon, Is this a book? Is the acup protocol discussed? Marian Alon wrote: >Re: Moringa-Morinda Posted by: " " alonmarcus alonmarcus2003 Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment neuropathy of the median nerve characterized by paresthesias and pain in the first through fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant afferent input from CTS will lead to maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was performed on CTS patients at baseline and after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a control, healthy adults were also tested 5 weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation was performed for median nerve innervated digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults demonstrated no significant test-retest differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 separation was contracted or blurred in CTS patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 SI representation shifted laterally after acupuncture treatment, leading to increased D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation correlated with decreasing paresthesias in CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced paresthesias constitute diffuse, synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our results for maladaptive change and correction are consistent with Hebbian plasticity mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory conditioning stimulus, shows promise in inducing beneficial cortical plasticity manifested by more focused digital representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Marian Its a abstract from pubmed Oakland, CA 94609 - Marian Blum Chinese Medicine Tuesday, June 13, 2006 9:57 PM CTS research I changed the subject for this thread. Alon, Is this a book? Is the acup protocol discussed? Marian Alon wrote: >Re: Moringa-Morinda Posted by: " " alonmarcus alonmarcus2003 Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment neuropathy of the median nerve characterized by paresthesias and pain in the first through fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant afferent input from CTS will lead to maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was performed on CTS patients at baseline and after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a control, healthy adults were also tested 5 weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation was performed for median nerve innervated digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults demonstrated no significant test-retest differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 separation was contracted or blurred in CTS patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 SI representation shifted laterally after acupuncture treatment, leading to increased D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation correlated with decreasing paresthesias in CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced paresthesias constitute diffuse, synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our results for maladaptive change and correction are consistent with Hebbian plasticity mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory conditioning stimulus, shows promise in inducing beneficial cortical plasticity manifested by more focused digital representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2006 Report Share Posted June 14, 2006 Hello Marian, i'd be happy to answer any questions. the acupuncture protocol was semi-individualized and mostly local / meridian based treatment approach. this is from the text of the paper: " Acupuncture was performed by experienced practitioners on CTS patients over a 5 week period, after baseline clinical and fMRI evaluation. Treatments were provided 3 times per week for three weeks and 2 times per week for the remaining two weeks. A semi- individualized approach was used wherein every subject was treated for 10 minutes with 2Hz electro-acupuncture at common acupoints (Figure 1) - unilateral TW-5 (triple-warmer 5, dorsal aspect of forearm) to PC-7 (pericardium 7, 1st wrist crease). This was followed by manual needling at acupoints chosen by the practitioner that were based on the individual symptoms of the presenting patient. Three points were chosen out of the following six: HT-3 (heart 3, medial aspect of elbow), PC-3 (pericardium 3, medial aspect of elbow crease), SI-4 (small intestine 4, ulnar aspect of wrist), LI-5 (large intestine 5, radial aspect of wrist), LI-10 (large intestine 10, lateral aspect of forearm), LU-5 (lung 5, lateral aspect of elbow crease). These points were stimulated with a manual even needle technique where a deqi response was obtained. " the pdf is not out yet, but i'll put it here once i get it: http://www.nmr.mgh.harvard.edu/~vitaly/ best regards, -vitaly napadow Chinese Medicine , " Marian Blum " <chinesemed wrote: > > > I changed the subject for this thread. > > Alon, > Is this a book? Is the acup protocol > discussed? > Marian > > > Alon wrote: > >Re: Moringa-Morinda > Posted by: " " > alonmarcus alonmarcus2003 > Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) > Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal > tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum > Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel > syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment > neuropathy of the median nerve characterized > by paresthesias and pain in the first through > fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant > afferent input from CTS will lead to > maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be > corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional > MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was > performed on CTS patients at baseline and > after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a > control, healthy adults were also tested 5 > weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation > was performed for median nerve innervated > digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar > nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based > and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses > demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI > activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA > 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to > healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a > significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P > < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during > D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults > demonstrated no significant test-retest > differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 > separation was contracted or blurred in CTS > patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 > SI representation shifted laterally after > acupuncture treatment, leading to increased > D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation > correlated with decreasing paresthesias in > CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced > paresthesias constitute diffuse, > synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our > results for maladaptive change and correction > are consistent with Hebbian plasticity > mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory > conditioning stimulus, shows promise in > inducing beneficial cortical plasticity > manifested by more focused digital > representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © > 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 Vitaly, A few questions: Why work on the ulnar nerve distribution in CTS patients? Were the manually-stimulated needles retained? Do you think it important to pass the 2hz between dorsal and ventral aspects (TW5-PC7)--perhaps in order to encompass the nerve itself rather than 'just' the meridians? Can your conclusions be stated in more vernacular language? I only understand enough to see this is very cool research. I'll look for the pdf in the future. thank you, Marian Chinese Medicine , " napadov " <napadov wrote: > > Hello Marian, > > i'd be happy to answer any questions. the acupuncture protocol was > semi-individualized and mostly local / meridian based treatment > approach. this is from the text of the paper: > > " Acupuncture was performed by experienced practitioners on CTS > patients over a 5 week period, after baseline clinical and fMRI > evaluation. Treatments were provided 3 times per week for three weeks > and 2 times per week for the remaining two weeks. A semi- > individualized approach was used wherein every subject was treated > for 10 minutes with 2Hz electro-acupuncture at common acupoints > (Figure 1) - unilateral TW-5 (triple-warmer 5, dorsal aspect of > forearm) to PC-7 (pericardium 7, 1st wrist crease). This was followed > by manual needling at acupoints chosen by the practitioner that were > based on the individual symptoms of the presenting patient. Three > points were chosen out of the following six: HT-3 (heart 3, medial > aspect of elbow), PC-3 (pericardium 3, medial aspect of elbow > crease), SI-4 (small intestine 4, ulnar aspect of wrist), LI-5 (large > intestine 5, radial aspect of wrist), LI-10 (large intestine 10, > lateral aspect of forearm), LU-5 (lung 5, lateral aspect of elbow > crease). These points were stimulated with a manual even needle > technique where a deqi response was obtained. " > > the pdf is not out yet, but i'll put it here once i get it: > http://www.nmr.mgh.harvard.edu/~vitaly/ > > best regards, > -vitaly napadow > > > Chinese Medicine , " Marian Blum " > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > > > I changed the subject for this thread. > > > > Alon, > > Is this a book? Is the acup protocol > > discussed? > > Marian > > > > > > Alon wrote: > > >Re: Moringa-Morinda > > Posted by: " " > > alonmarcus@ alonmarcus2003 > > Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) > > Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal > > tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum > > Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel > > syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment > > neuropathy of the median nerve characterized > > by paresthesias and pain in the first through > > fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant > > afferent input from CTS will lead to > > maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be > > corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional > > MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was > > performed on CTS patients at baseline and > > after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a > > control, healthy adults were also tested 5 > > weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation > > was performed for median nerve innervated > > digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar > > nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based > > and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses > > demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI > > activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA > > 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to > > healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a > > significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P > > < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during > > D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults > > demonstrated no significant test-retest > > differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 > > separation was contracted or blurred in CTS > > patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 > > SI representation shifted laterally after > > acupuncture treatment, leading to increased > > D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation > > correlated with decreasing paresthesias in > > CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced > > paresthesias constitute diffuse, > > synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our > > results for maladaptive change and correction > > are consistent with Hebbian plasticity > > mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory > > conditioning stimulus, shows promise in > > inducing beneficial cortical plasticity > > manifested by more focused digital > > representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © > > 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 ulnar nerve: are you refering to why SI-4 was included? it was there as an alternate point depending on individual patient presentation. theoretically all polyneuropathy patients are excluded from nerve conduction studies beforehand, but sometimes patients still report pain/tingling to pinky finger or ulnar side of hand... the manually stimulated needles were retained for full 30min during treatments. for EA, that was the general point; to pass stimulation through the arm. however, from a TCM point of view, you are promoting the natural flow of qi and connection from hand jue yin (PC) to hand shao yang (TW) meridians. basically, our conclusions are that CTS is not just present in the wrist. There is a concomittant mal-adaptive change in the cortex of the brain as well. Successful treatment with acupuncture seems to produce not just an amelioration of symptoms, but also a positive change in the brain as well. So acupuncture can imporve both the peripheral (wrist) and central (brain) components of CTS. we're hpoing to follow this up and explore some related hypotheses in the future with help (funding) from NIH... so, stay tuned. research progress is unfotunately glacially slow... wish i could change that, but.... vitaly Chinese Medicine , " marianpblac " <chinesemed wrote: > > Vitaly, > > A few questions: > > Why work on the ulnar nerve distribution in CTS patients? > Were the manually-stimulated needles retained? > > Do you think it important to pass the 2hz between dorsal and ventral > aspects (TW5-PC7)--perhaps in order to encompass the nerve itself > rather than 'just' the meridians? > > Can your conclusions be stated in more vernacular language? I only > understand enough to see this is very cool research. > > I'll look for the pdf in the future. > > thank you, > Marian > > > Chinese Medicine , " napadov " > <napadov@> wrote: > > > > Hello Marian, > > > > i'd be happy to answer any questions. the acupuncture protocol was > > semi-individualized and mostly local / meridian based treatment > > approach. this is from the text of the paper: > > > > " Acupuncture was performed by experienced practitioners on CTS > > patients over a 5 week period, after baseline clinical and fMRI > > evaluation. Treatments were provided 3 times per week for three > weeks > > and 2 times per week for the remaining two weeks. A semi- > > individualized approach was used wherein every subject was treated > > for 10 minutes with 2Hz electro-acupuncture at common acupoints > > (Figure 1) - unilateral TW-5 (triple-warmer 5, dorsal aspect of > > forearm) to PC-7 (pericardium 7, 1st wrist crease). This was > followed > > by manual needling at acupoints chosen by the practitioner that > were > > based on the individual symptoms of the presenting patient. Three > > points were chosen out of the following six: HT-3 (heart 3, medial > > aspect of elbow), PC-3 (pericardium 3, medial aspect of elbow > > crease), SI-4 (small intestine 4, ulnar aspect of wrist), LI-5 > (large > > intestine 5, radial aspect of wrist), LI-10 (large intestine 10, > > lateral aspect of forearm), LU-5 (lung 5, lateral aspect of elbow > > crease). These points were stimulated with a manual even needle > > technique where a deqi response was obtained. " > > > > the pdf is not out yet, but i'll put it here once i get it: > > http://www.nmr.mgh.harvard.edu/~vitaly/ > > > > best regards, > > -vitaly napadow > > > > > > Chinese Medicine , " Marian Blum " > > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I changed the subject for this thread. > > > > > > Alon, > > > Is this a book? Is the acup protocol > > > discussed? > > > Marian > > > > > > > > > Alon wrote: > > > >Re: Moringa-Morinda > > > Posted by: " " > > > alonmarcus@ alonmarcus2003 > > > Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) > > > Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal > > > tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum > > > Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel > > > syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment > > > neuropathy of the median nerve characterized > > > by paresthesias and pain in the first through > > > fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant > > > afferent input from CTS will lead to > > > maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be > > > corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional > > > MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was > > > performed on CTS patients at baseline and > > > after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a > > > control, healthy adults were also tested 5 > > > weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation > > > was performed for median nerve innervated > > > digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar > > > nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based > > > and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses > > > demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI > > > activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA > > > 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to > > > healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a > > > significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P > > > < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during > > > D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults > > > demonstrated no significant test-retest > > > differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 > > > separation was contracted or blurred in CTS > > > patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 > > > SI representation shifted laterally after > > > acupuncture treatment, leading to increased > > > D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation > > > correlated with decreasing paresthesias in > > > CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced > > > paresthesias constitute diffuse, > > > synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our > > > results for maladaptive change and correction > > > are consistent with Hebbian plasticity > > > mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory > > > conditioning stimulus, shows promise in > > > inducing beneficial cortical plasticity > > > manifested by more focused digital > > > representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © > > > 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2006 Report Share Posted June 16, 2006 Vitaly, Is there a reason why you didn't use EA for longer than 10 minutes? I usually use EA 20 mins, often with mixed hz-2to100 to get more types of responses. I see the TCM rationale: P7 source point and TB5 luo point. Thanks for the further explanation. I wonder whether the peripheral nerve impingement feeds back to the brain to, in effect, maintain or exacerbate the perception of the impingement? Lots of interesting hypotheses to explore ... if you're patient. Marian Chinese Medicine , " napadov " <napadov wrote: > > > ulnar nerve: are you refering to why SI-4 was included? it was there > as an alternate point depending on individual patient presentation. > theoretically all polyneuropathy patients are excluded from nerve > conduction studies beforehand, but sometimes patients still report > pain/tingling to pinky finger or ulnar side of hand... > > the manually stimulated needles were retained for full 30min during > treatments. > > for EA, that was the general point; to pass stimulation through the > arm. however, from a TCM point of view, you are promoting the natural flow of qi and connection from hand jue yin (PC) to hand shao yang TW) meridians. > > basically, our conclusions are that CTS is not just present in the > wrist. There is a concomittant mal-adaptive change in the cortex of > the brain as well. Successful treatment with acupuncture seems to > produce not just an amelioration of symptoms, but also a positive > change in the brain as well. So acupuncture can imporve both the > peripheral (wrist) and central (brain) components of CTS. we're hpoing > to follow this up and explore some related hypotheses in the future > with help (funding) from NIH... > > so, stay tuned. research progress is unfotunately glacially slow... > wish i could change that, but.... > > vitaly > > > Chinese Medicine , " marianpblac " > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > Vitaly, > > > > A few questions: > > > > Why work on the ulnar nerve distribution in CTS patients? > > Were the manually-stimulated needles retained? > > > > Do you think it important to pass the 2hz between dorsal and ventral > > aspects (TW5-PC7)--perhaps in order to encompass the nerve itself > > rather than 'just' the meridians? > > > > Can your conclusions be stated in more vernacular language? I only > > understand enough to see this is very cool research. > > > > I'll look for the pdf in the future. > > > > thank you, > > Marian > > > > > > Chinese Medicine , " napadov " > > <napadov@> wrote: > > > > > > Hello Marian, > > > > > > i'd be happy to answer any questions. the acupuncture protocol was > > > semi-individualized and mostly local / meridian based treatment > > > approach. this is from the text of the paper: > > > > > > " Acupuncture was performed by experienced practitioners on CTS > > > patients over a 5 week period, after baseline clinical and fMRI > > > evaluation. Treatments were provided 3 times per week for three > > weeks > > > and 2 times per week for the remaining two weeks. A semi- > > > individualized approach was used wherein every subject was treated > > > for 10 minutes with 2Hz electro-acupuncture at common acupoints > > > (Figure 1) - unilateral TW-5 (triple-warmer 5, dorsal aspect of > > > forearm) to PC-7 (pericardium 7, 1st wrist crease). This was > > followed > > > by manual needling at acupoints chosen by the practitioner that > > were > > > based on the individual symptoms of the presenting patient. Three > > > points were chosen out of the following six: HT-3 (heart 3, medial > > > aspect of elbow), PC-3 (pericardium 3, medial aspect of elbow > > > crease), SI-4 (small intestine 4, ulnar aspect of wrist), LI-5 > > (large > > > intestine 5, radial aspect of wrist), LI-10 (large intestine 10, > > > lateral aspect of forearm), LU-5 (lung 5, lateral aspect of elbow > > > crease). These points were stimulated with a manual even needle > > > technique where a deqi response was obtained. " > > > > > > the pdf is not out yet, but i'll put it here once i get it: > > > http://www.nmr.mgh.harvard.edu/~vitaly/ > > > > > > best regards, > > > -vitaly napadow > > > > > > > > > Chinese Medicine , " Marian Blum " > > > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I changed the subject for this thread. > > > > > > > > Alon, > > > > Is this a book? Is the acup protocol > > > > discussed? > > > > Marian > > > > > > > > > > > > Alon wrote: > > > > >Re: Moringa-Morinda > > > > Posted by: " " > > > > alonmarcus@ alonmarcus2003 > > > > Sat Jun 10, 2006 10:57 am (PST) > > > > Somatosensory cortical plasticity in carpal > > > > tunnel syndrome treated by acupuncture. Hum > > > > Brain Mapp. 2006 Jun 7;. Carpal tunnel > > > > syndrome (CTS) is a common entrapment > > > > neuropathy of the median nerve characterized > > > > by paresthesias and pain in the first through > > > > fourth digits. We hypothesize that aberrant > > > > afferent input from CTS will lead to > > > > maladaptive cortical plasticity, which may be > > > > corrected by appropriate therapy. Functional > > > > MRI (fMRI) scanning and clinical testing was > > > > performed on CTS patients at baseline and > > > > after 5 weeks of acupuncture treatment. As a > > > > control, healthy adults were also tested 5 > > > > weeks apart. During fMRI, sensory stimulation > > > > was performed for median nerve innervated > > > > digit 2 (D2) and digit 3 (D3), and ulnar > > > > nerve innervated digit 5 (D5). Surface-based > > > > and region of interest (ROI)-based analyses > > > > demonstrated that while the extent of fMRI > > > > activity in contralateral Brodmann Area 1 (BA > > > > 1) and BA 4 was increased in CTS compared to > > > > healthy adults, after acupuncture there was a > > > > significant decrease in contralateral BA 1 (P > > > > < 0.005) and BA 4 (P < 0.05) activity during > > > > D3 sensory stimulation. Healthy adults > > > > demonstrated no significant test-retest > > > > differences for any digit tested. While D3/D2 > > > > separation was contracted or blurred in CTS > > > > patients compared to healthy adults, the D2 > > > > SI representation shifted laterally after > > > > acupuncture treatment, leading to increased > > > > D3/D2 separation. Increasing D3/D2 separation > > > > correlated with decreasing paresthesias in > > > > CTS patients (P < 0.05). As CTS-induced > > > > paresthesias constitute diffuse, > > > > synchronized, multidigit symptomatology, our > > > > results for maladaptive change and correction > > > > are consistent with Hebbian plasticity > > > > mechanisms. Acupuncture, a somatosensory > > > > conditioning stimulus, shows promise in > > > > inducing beneficial cortical plasticity > > > > manifested by more focused digital > > > > representations. Hum Brain Mapp, 2006. © > > > > 2006 Wiley-Liss, Inc. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 the general idea was to not be too stimulating - hence the lower frequency and shorter duration (needles were retained for longer after EA). our protoocl was designed mainly by a senior acupuncturist (not me) who prefers gentle stimulation. Chronic pain, by the way, is certainly maintained in the brain. in many chronic pain conditions, the originating peripheral lesion is improved or even resolved, but the brain circuitry is wound-up in such a way that the perception of pain remains and is now maintained by brain circuitry... In CTS, the peripheral lesion is still probably there and is reflected by changed brain circuitry. perhaps if you can attack the brain hyperactivation (by needling points away from the wrist) it can indeed modify the severity of the originating lesion at the wrist by such things as autonomic anti-inflammatory reflexes etc... this remains to be seen... vitaly Chinese Medicine , " marianpblac " <chinesemed wrote: > > Vitaly, > > Is there a reason why you didn't use EA for longer than 10 minutes? > I usually use EA 20 mins, often with mixed hz-2to100 to get more > types of responses. > > I see the TCM rationale: P7 source point and TB5 luo point. > > Thanks for the further explanation. I wonder whether the peripheral > nerve impingement feeds back to the brain to, in effect, maintain or > exacerbate the perception of the impingement? Lots of interesting > hypotheses to explore ... if you're patient. > > Marian > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 I have found many cases where pain from peripheral nerve lesions is exacerbated by EA. I'll turn down the intensity but leave frequency and length of treatment the same and that usually works. I'll try shorter time. I wonder whether scalp acupuncture has been studied--whether it has particular effects on autonomic reflexes. Does its proximity to the brain mean its effects on it are more direct, or more effective than body acupuncture? Marian Chinese Medicine , " napadov " <napadov wrote: > > the general idea was to not be too stimulating - hence the lower > frequency and shorter duration (needles were retained for longer after > EA). our protoocl was designed mainly by a senior acupuncturist (not > me) who prefers gentle stimulation. > > Chronic pain, by the way, is certainly maintained in the brain. in > many chronic pain conditions, the originating peripheral lesion is > improved or even resolved, but the brain circuitry is wound-up in such > a way that the perception of pain remains and is now maintained by > brain circuitry... In CTS, the peripheral lesion is still probably > there and is reflected by changed brain circuitry. perhaps if you can > attack the brain hyperactivation (by needling points away from the > wrist) it can indeed modify the severity of the originating lesion at > the wrist by such things as autonomic anti-inflammatory reflexes > etc... this remains to be seen... > > vitaly > > > Chinese Medicine , " marianpblac " > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > Vitaly, > > > > Is there a reason why you didn't use EA for longer than 10 minutes? > > I usually use EA 20 mins, often with mixed hz-2to100 to get more > > types of responses. > > > > I see the TCM rationale: P7 source point and TB5 luo point. > > > > Thanks for the further explanation. I wonder whether the peripheral > > nerve impingement feeds back to the brain to, in effect, maintain or > > exacerbate the perception of the impingement? Lots of interesting > > hypotheses to explore ... if you're patient. > > > > Marian > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 Marian I think hand points may have a stronger central (brain) effects because of the hands large representation. I use them often in nerve pains. I almost never use local EA on any neuropathic type pain, especially at the start of treatment. What is find most important for CTS is to use the above techniques while at the same time use manual techniques to release the wrist, use functional and fluid techniques. Also, use retinacular release i will show you them in the next course. Oakland, CA 94609 - marianpblac Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 8:31 AM Re: CTS research I have found many cases where pain from peripheral nerve lesions is exacerbated by EA. I'll turn down the intensity but leave frequency and length of treatment the same and that usually works. I'll try shorter time. I wonder whether scalp acupuncture has been studied--whether it has particular effects on autonomic reflexes. Does its proximity to the brain mean its effects on it are more direct, or more effective than body acupuncture? Marian Chinese Medicine , " napadov " <napadov wrote: > > the general idea was to not be too stimulating - hence the lower > frequency and shorter duration (needles were retained for longer after > EA). our protoocl was designed mainly by a senior acupuncturist (not > me) who prefers gentle stimulation. > > Chronic pain, by the way, is certainly maintained in the brain. in > many chronic pain conditions, the originating peripheral lesion is > improved or even resolved, but the brain circuitry is wound-up in such > a way that the perception of pain remains and is now maintained by > brain circuitry... In CTS, the peripheral lesion is still probably > there and is reflected by changed brain circuitry. perhaps if you can > attack the brain hyperactivation (by needling points away from the > wrist) it can indeed modify the severity of the originating lesion at > the wrist by such things as autonomic anti-inflammatory reflexes > etc... this remains to be seen... > > vitaly > > > Chinese Medicine , " marianpblac " > <chinesemed@> wrote: > > > > Vitaly, > > > > Is there a reason why you didn't use EA for longer than 10 minutes? > > I usually use EA 20 mins, often with mixed hz-2to100 to get more > > types of responses. > > > > I see the TCM rationale: P7 source point and TB5 luo point. > > > > Thanks for the further explanation. I wonder whether the peripheral > > nerve impingement feeds back to the brain to, in effect, maintain or > > exacerbate the perception of the impingement? Lots of interesting > > hypotheses to explore ... if you're patient. > > > > Marian > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 thanks Tom Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:51 AM Re: Re: CTS research I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2006 Report Share Posted June 18, 2006 Tom which direction are the line supposed to be? Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:51 AM Re: Re: CTS research I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Well, when you look at the picture the rotation of the needling is in the direction of the palm. So not outwardly but inwardly. How does the technique work? Perhaps by breaking adhesions so that the retinaculum releases? Tom. ---- 06/18/06 23:49:36 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom which direction are the line supposed to be? We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 7New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Tom i am asking about locating the points, i am not sure how you locate lines A and B Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:04 PM Re: Re: CTS research Well, when you look at the picture the rotation of the needling is in the direction of the palm. So not outwardly but inwardly. How does the technique work? Perhaps by breaking adhesions so that the retinaculum releases? Tom. ---- 06/18/06 23:49:36 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom which direction are the line supposed to be? We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 7New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 I see, just follow the " lines " BETWEEN 2nd and 3rd finger, and 4th and 5th finger (= the line that extends from proximal to distal phalanx). You can either extend or flex the fingers; the phalangeal line stays the same. I know, it is not a common " line " to use in anatomy, but that is the description used in the article. Tom. ---- 06/19/06 06:08:58 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom i am asking about locating the points, i am not sure how you locate lines A and B We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 6New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Threading from p6 into p7 (into the tunnel) also gets great results. Kelvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Kevin, with threading, do you mean through-needling? Tom. ---- acupuncturebeverlyhills 06/19/06 07:46:06 Chinese Medicine Re: CTS research Threading from p6 into p7 (into the tunnel) also gets great results. Kelvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 thanks Tom Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:20 PM Re: Re: CTS research I see, just follow the " lines " BETWEEN 2nd and 3rd finger, and 4th and 5th finger (= the line that extends from proximal to distal phalanx). You can either extend or flex the fingers; the phalangeal line stays the same. I know, it is not a common " line " to use in anatomy, but that is the description used in the article. Tom. ---- 06/19/06 06:08:58 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom i am asking about locating the points, i am not sure how you locate lines A and B We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 6New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 P6 to p7 into the carpal space with the median nevre under the flexor retinaculum. Kelvin Chinese Medicine , " Tom Verhaeghe " <tom.verhaeghe wrote: > > > Kevin, > > with threading, do you mean through-needling? > > Tom. > > ---- > > acupuncturebeverlyhills > 06/19/06 07:46:06 > Chinese Medicine > Re: CTS research > > Threading from p6 into p7 (into the tunnel) also gets great results. > > Kelvin > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Tom By the way the photo and description of the points are distal to the flexor retinaculum in the thenar and hypothenar muscle Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:51 AM Re: Re: CTS research I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 I also noticed that B2 and A2 are not really located on the retinaculum, but A1 and B1 are, won't you agree?And if you needle B2 and A2 in a proximal direction, don't you still reach the retinaculum? Tom. ---- 06/19/06 20:10:47 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom By the way the photo and description of the points are distal to the flexor retinaculum in the thenar and hypothenar muscle Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:51 AM Re: Re: CTS research I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 not if the picture is correct and its hard to know from the description Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Monday, June 19, 2006 12:24 PM Re: Re: CTS research I also noticed that B2 and A2 are not really located on the retinaculum, but A1 and B1 are, won't you agree?And if you needle B2 and A2 in a proximal direction, don't you still reach the retinaculum? Tom. ---- 06/19/06 20:10:47 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research Tom By the way the photo and description of the points are distal to the flexor retinaculum in the thenar and hypothenar muscle Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Sunday, June 18, 2006 9:51 AM Re: Re: CTS research I have been using a protocol for CTS that I found in a Chinese article. The translated title of the article is " horizontal unidirectional needling in treatment of 48 cases of CTS " , published in Chinese Acupuncture and Moxibustion, Aug 2002, Vol. 22, No. 8, p. 550. It was written by Peng Jiang-Hua. The technique has worked really well on my CTS patients, so I thought I'd share it to the group. I have uploaded a file to the files/ articles/ acupuncture section of the that shows a picture of the extra points used in this protocol. The points clearly aim to reduce pressure in the carpal tunnel, and they do so by " loosening and elongating the retinaculum flexorum, increasing its elasticity, and increasing the volume of the carpal tunnel and decreasing pressure on the n. medianus in the carpal tunnel. " Location of the points: (look at the picture that I uploaded) let the patient make a fist and you can see three lines (lines between the fingers). We don't need the middle " line " but we need the line between the index and middle finger = line B, and the line between the ring finger and the little finger= line A. At the proximal side, point A1 is to be found where line A crosses the hypothenar, and A2 is to be found appr. 2 cm distally. And again proximally, point B1 is to be found where line B crosses the thenar bulge, and B2 2 cm distal from there. You will notice that these four points are the attchachments of the retinaculum flexorum. Technique: Needle the four points like in the picture; needles are to be inserted horizontally, facing each other. First needle perpendicularly, and then move to a 15 degree angle (so that the needles are almost horizontal). Insert the needles appr 0.8 cms deep. After insertion, manipulate the needles in pairs: for the A points, the practitioner stands on the ulnar side: right hand grasps the A2 needle, left hand graps A1 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or let an assistant hold the needles horizontally. for the B points, the practitioner stands on the radial side: right hand grasps the B1 needle, left hand graps B2 needle. Right hand turns the needle clockwise, and the left hand turns the needle counterclockwise, so that the needles move in the same direction. You twist the needles rapidly and until you feel you cannot twist the needle any further. Then tape the needles to the palm, or hold the needles horizontally. After 20 minutes of releasing the retinaculum with the previous technique, remove the needles and apply some three minutes of mild moxibustion to each of the four points, until some redness appears. Treatment may be done every day (in China, yes), 10 treatments make up one course, if necessary start a second course. Needless to say that results were excellent : ) only 2 people got no benefit of this treatment (4.2%). 45.8% cured. and 50% markedly better. Anyway, I have used the technique with success in my clinic. Even after one time people report significant benefit. I just met a patient today on the street, whom I treated only one time. She felt so good that she forgot to make a new appointment. She said she could still feel some numbness, but she could easily sleep through the night. Other patients also report benefit. Make sure your technique is good for needling the four points. Better tell them beforehand it possibly might hurt a bit - don't forget the patient still has a good hand to strike you : ) I sometimes combine this with (deep) needling on Daling PC7. Hope all of this is clear; if you want to read the original in Chinese, please send me an email... Greetings from a sunny Belgium, Tom. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 I'd still think that at least A1 and B1 are located on the retinaculum: for example, compare the picture on this page http://tinyurl.com/ne4ny with the one I uploaded ---- 06/19/06 21:33:57 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research not if the picture is correct and its hard to know from the description We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 6New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 i guess a better description would be for the proximal points to start at the crease of the wrist Oakland, CA 94609 - Tom Verhaeghe Chinese Medicine Monday, June 19, 2006 12:56 PM Re: Re: CTS research I'd still think that at least A1 and B1 are located on the retinaculum: for example, compare the picture on this page http://tinyurl.com/ne4ny with the one I uploaded ---- 06/19/06 21:33:57 Chinese Medicine Re: Re: CTS research not if the picture is correct and its hard to know from the description We Made Changes Your email is all new. Learn More Share Feedback Recent Activity 6New Members 1New Files Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 Those needles are in the abducto pollicis brevis, flexor pollicis brevis, opponensdigiti minimi, and flexor digiti minimi brevis which all attach to the retinaculum flexorum. Kelvin Chinese Medicine , " Tom Verhaeghe " <tom.verhaeghe wrote: > > > I'd still think that at least A1 and B1 are located on the retinaculum: for > example, compare the picture on this page http://tinyurl.com/ne4ny with the > one I uploaded > > > ---- > > > 06/19/06 21:33:57 > Chinese Medicine > Re: Re: CTS research > > not if the picture is correct and its hard to know from the description > > > > We Made Changes > Your email is all new. > Learn More > Share Feedback > Recent Activity > 6New Members > 1New Files > Visit Your Group > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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