[pa-l] Biophotonics in the infrared spectralrangereveal acupuncture meridian structure of the body

[Guest guest]

" Foreign influence " is different than outright dilution of the

underlying theoretical foundation. I think it needs to be made clear

when a practitioner is using Chinese medical strategy or biomedical

strategy, not blurred.

>>>>>Zev would you drop Wen bing? would you stop using any herbs the origin of

which is India?

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

We've had this discussion in one form or another before, Alon. I have

no problems with medicinals, therapies, herbs from anywhere. The

question is about the underlying logical/theoretical structure of the

medicine itself. As Zhang Xi-chun put it, " follow the classical theory

of Chinese medicine, feel free to use the data of Western medicine " .

One simply needs to be clear what one is practicing when one is

practicing.

 

 

On Mar 14, 2005, at 2:05 PM, wrote:

 

> " Foreign influence " is different than outright dilution of the

> underlying theoretical foundation. I think it needs to be made clear

> when a practitioner is using Chinese medical strategy or biomedical

> strategy, not blurred.

>>>>>> Zev would you drop Wen bing? would you stop using any herbs the

>>>>>> origin of which is India?

>

[Guest guest]

To sum up, it is how the physician thinks, diagnoses, develops

treatment strategies, and refers to source materials that determines

what he or she practices.

>>>>No question. But lets take my wen bing example, what time have they taken to

absorb we are talking about very short duration's between introduction of ideas

and appearance in the lit. I think sometimes the romance takes over here.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Alon,

It depends what one considers to be the beginning of the Wen Bing

school. Some say it begins with Liu Wan-su, a Jin-yuan dynasty

physician (13th century). Certainly, his works are the origin of the

basic Wen Bing concepts. At this point, there was no 'Western

medicine'. Or, is Wen Bing just a Qing dynasty phenomenon? This is a

complex historical question. Several authors considered to be of the

Wen Bing school had no access to Western medicine, including perhaps

the greatest physician of that school, Ye Tian-shi. Others, such as Wu

You-ke developed the idea of " one disease, one qi " . But did they get

that idea from Western medicine? Physicians such as Liu Bao-yi

developed the idea of fu xie wen bing/latent evil warm disease, and

being early 20th century, probably had exposure to Western medicine.

But, historically, can we say certainly that they 'borrowed' their

ideas from Western medicine? Or, if they did, they were reframed

within the conceptual body of Chinese medicine.

 

Reframing ideas within the Chinese framework allows development of

the medicine without diluting its power or strength. The readings I've

done in the Wen Bing literature are not mixtures of Western and Chinese

medicine, they are expressed within the structure of the classical

medicine. There is no veering away from the original influence of the

Shang Han Lun, there is just further elaboration and development. This

is very different from what one reads in modern Chinese medical

journals, where the Chinese medical theory is often greatly simplified,

or secondary to biomedical diagnosis. The new medicine (zhong xin yi

jie he) is clearly a hybrid, with Chinese medical theory secondary to

biomedical concerns.

 

Finally, in the West, our own grasp of Chinese medical concepts is

still, profession-wise as a whole, very weak. We are only beginning to

get some decent translated materials, too few of us have the Chinese

(or Japanese or Korean) language skills to read about the medicine in

its original Asian languages. Therefore, when researching conditions

or trying to understand Chinese medicine at a more than superficial

level, we are drawn back to what we know. What we know is the huge

data base of Western medicine that is available to us in a language

that we know. This leads to an incomplete hybrid or integration which,

again, shortchanges Chinese medicine in the mix.

 

 

On Mar 14, 2005, at 7:19 PM, wrote:

 

> To sum up, it is how the physician thinks, diagnoses, develops

> treatment strategies, and refers to source materials that determines

> what he or she practices.

>>>>> No question. But lets take my wen bing example, what time have

>>>>> they taken to absorb we are talking about very short duration's

>>>>> between introduction of ideas and appearance in the lit. I think

>>>>> sometimes the romance takes over here.

>