Bad news: changes in holland

March 24, 2007

In Holland there are some big changes to happen to the insurance for alternative

therapies.

A big insurance compagny announced that from april of this year the

compensations for alternative therapies wil be lowered. Also, from April, only

Medical doctors-acupuncturist can make use of the insurance's compensations.

This is the First insurance compagny that will start with this and its expected

that many others will follow.

This is very bad news for practioners (like me) who dont have any background as

MD. (altought we all have done a basic western medicine course)

Its not sure how the other insurance compagny's will react on this first step.

But one thing is for sure , the war has started.

I've heard that in France , its forbidden to non MD's to penetrate the skin

with needles. Is this true? What about then for making tattoo's on the skin.

They also make use of superficial needles to penetrate the skin.

Well i will keep you informed about the development of the proces in Holland

best wishes

Rick

______________________________\

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March 24, 2007

Rick:

Something is rotten in Holland. This is not good news. Does your acupuncture

societies stay on top of this - get active?

I think one must stay on this situation however it does not mean that your

practice is parachuting down.

I recommend a book by Lynn Grodzki - Building Your Own Ideal Private Practice.

She is a therapist, but includes acupuncturists in her discussion. Her basic

premise is, stay away from managed care - it works people to death with lower

compensation. She tells you how to build a practice without it. Of course the

rates for the patient will be higher.

If we want the medical model, we will have to treat a lot of people at a time.

Perhaps the Community Acupuncture is the answer. Also you can do both

individual treatments (at good rates) and community acupuncture.

Hope this helps,

Anne

-------------- Original message ----------------------

Rick <rick_kamps1973

> In Holland there are some big changes to happen to the insurance for

alternative

> therapies.

> A big insurance compagny announced that from april of this year the

> compensations for alternative therapies wil be lowered. Also, from April, only

> Medical doctors-acupuncturist can make use of the insurance's compensations.

> This is the First insurance compagny that will start with this and its

expected

> that many others will follow.

>

> This is very bad news for practioners (like me) who dont have any background

as

> MD. (altought we all have done a basic western medicine course)

> Its not sure how the other insurance compagny's will react on this first step.

> But one thing is for sure , the war has started.

>

> I've heard that in France , its forbidden to non MD's to penetrate the skin

> with needles. Is this true? What about then for making tattoo's on the skin.

> They also make use of superficial needles to penetrate the skin.

>

> Well i will keep you informed about the development of the proces in Holland

>

> best wishes

>

> Rick

>

> Alon Marcus <alonmarcus

> Chinese Medicine

> Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:26:15 PM

> Re: Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc.org/basic

>

> Phil

> The links do not work

>

> www.integrativeheal thmedicine. com

> -

>

> Cc: EVHMA ; traditional_ Chinese_Medicine

> Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:37 AM

> Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc. org/basic

>

> Hi Alon & All,

>

> > Phil What is this formula? Alon

>

> Alon, apologies, for not being more understandable in that mail.

>

> http://sx.hbttc. org/basic has summary data on the composition and uses of

> hundreds of formulas, under many classifications, as below. The data are in

> Chinese. This means that one would need to understand Chinese to use the

> data effectively:

>

> The Classes of Formulas listed are:

>

> Anshen Ji | Calm Shen Formulas

> Biao-Li Shuangjie | Exterior-Interior Dual Release Formulas

> Buyi Ji | Tone & Benefit Formulas

> Guse Ji | Consolidate & Astringe Formulas

> Hejie Ji | Harmonise & Release Formulas

> Jiebiao Ji | Release Exterior+Make Sweat Formulas

> Kaiqiao Ji | Open Portals (Open Consciousness) Formulas

> Liqi Ji | Rectify Qi Formulas

> Lixue Ji | Rectify Xue Formulas

> Qingre Ji | Clear Heat Formulas

> Quchongji | Dispel/Expel Parasites (Parasitifuge) Formulas

> Qushi Ji | Dispel Damp Formulas

> Qushu Ji | Dispel Summerheat Formulas

> Qutan Ji | Dispel Phlegm/Expectorant Formulas

> Shachong Ji | Parasiticide Formulas

> Shili Ji | Damp~Interior Formulas

> Xiaodao Huaji Ji | Ease Indigestion (Disperse & Lead Out) Formulas

> Xiexia Ji | Drain Down (Purgative) Formulas

> Zhenduan Yongyao | Diagnosis & Application of Herbs

> Zhifeng Ji | Govern (Cure / Stop) Wind Formulas

> Zhike Pingchuan Ji | Stop Cough & Calm Asthma Formulas

> Zhiyang Ji | Cure Sores Formulas

> Zhizao Ji | Cure Dryness Formulas

>

> Go to http://sx.hbttc. org/basic and click on any icon in the centre of the

> page. For example, the Stop Cough & Ease Asthma Class of formulas lists

> summary details of 73 different formulas:

>

> bai ke jing tangjiang

> bai ling jiaonang

> bu shen fang chuan pian

> chuan shu pian

> chuanbei pipa chongji(koufuye, tangjiang)

> dansuan zhike pian

> ding chuan gao

> er tong ke ye

> fengre kesou jiaonang(ruan jiaonang)

> fufang baibu zhike chongji(tangjiang)

> fufang chuanbei jing pian

> gejie ding chuan jiaonang(wan)

> gu ben ke chuan pian

> gu shen ding chuan wan

> gui long ke chuan ning jiaonang

> hei xi dan

> heng zhi ke chuan jiaonang

> ji dan koufuye

> ji zhi keli(tangjiang)

> jian'er qingjie ye

> jiang qi ding chuan wan

> jiegeng dong huapian

> jiere qing fei tangjiang

> jin bei tan ke qing keli

> jing zhi kesou tanchuan wan

> ke chuan shun wan

> ke ning chongji(tangjiang, jiaonang)

> kugan chongji

> li fei pian

> ling bei zhike tangjiang

> ling gui ke chuan ning jiaonang

> liqi ding chuan wan

> lu si ge wan

> man zhi gu ben chongji

> mangguo zhike pian

> ning shu lu(tangjiang ji)

> niuhuang qing fei san

> pipa zhike chongji(jiaonang)

> qianjin huatan wan

> qiguanyan xiangjiao gao

> qing an chuan ding pian

> qingre zhen ke tangjiang

> renshen bao fei wan

> san hao shedan chuanbei pian

> san shedan chuanbei tangjiang

> shedan chuanbei pipagao

> shen bei beigua gao

> tian yi zhike tangjiang

> tong xuan li fei jiaonang(koufuye, wan)

> xiao ke chuan tangjiang(jiaonang)

> xiao'er feire ke chuan keli

> xiao'er feire ke chuan koufuye

> xiao'er ma gan chongji

> xiao'er qing fei koufuye(wan)

> xiao'er qing fei san

> xiao'er qing fei zhike pian

> xiao'er qingre zhike koufuye

> xiao'er xiao ji zhike koufuye

> xiao'er zhi sou tangjiang

> yi fei qinghua gao

> Yin xing lu

> zhen ke ning jiaonang(tangjiang, koufuye)

> zhi chuan ling zhushe ye

> zhi chuan lingqi wu ji(koufuye)

> zhi ke bao pian

> zhi ke wan

> zhi sou qingguo heji(koufuye, wan)

> zhike chuanbei pipalu

> zhike juhong koufuye(wan, keli)

> zhike ningsou jiao xiang

> zhikepingchuan ji

> zhikepingchuan tangjiang

> zhubei ding chuan wan

>

> I wish that I were fluent in Chinese, or that top class machine translations

> were available!

>

> Best regards,

>

March 24, 2007

Hi Rick,

Yes, non MD's cannot practice acupuncture or herbal medicine. This is

true in other European countries such as Spain, etc, which use

Napoleonic law.

It's a shame the insurance companies have done that. I think your

association should do its best through the media and educate the

insurance companies that MD trained acupuncturists do not offer the

best type of acupuncture treatment. To be honest, they shouldn't be

allowed to even call it acupuncture or use the word acupuncture.

Medical acupuncture has absolutely nothing to do with acupuncture.

Attilio

www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

Chinese Medicine , Rick

<rick_kamps1973 wrote:

>

> In Holland there are some big changes to happen to the insurance

for alternative therapies.

> A big insurance compagny announced that from april of this year the

compensations for alternative therapies wil be lowered. Also, from

April, only Medical doctors-acupuncturist can make use of the

insurance's compensations. This is the First insurance compagny that

will start with this and its expected that many others will follow.

>

> This is very bad news for practioners (like me) who dont have any

background as MD. (altought we all have done a basic western medicine

course)

> Its not sure how the other insurance compagny's will react on this

first step. But one thing is for sure , the war has started.

>

> I've heard that in France , its forbidden to non MD's to penetrate

the skin with needles. Is this true? What about then for making

tattoo's on the skin. They also make use of superficial needles to

penetrate the skin.

>

> Well i will keep you informed about the development of the proces

in Holland

>

> best wishes

>

> Rick

>

> Alon Marcus <alonmarcus

> Chinese Medicine

> Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:26:15 PM

> Re: Re: Chinese Formula Data at:

http://sx.hbttc.org/basic

>

> Phil

> The links do not work

>

> www.integrativeheal thmedicine. com

> -

>

> Cc: EVHMA ; traditional_ Chinese_Medicine

> Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:37 AM

> Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc.

org/basic

>

> Hi Alon & All,

>

> > Phil What is this formula? Alon

>

> Alon, apologies, for not being more understandable in that mail.

>

> http://sx.hbttc. org/basic has summary data on the composition and

uses of

> hundreds of formulas, under many classifications, as below. The

data are in

> Chinese. This means that one would need to understand Chinese to

use the

> data effectively:

>

> The Classes of Formulas listed are:

>

> Anshen Ji | Calm Shen Formulas

> Biao-Li Shuangjie | Exterior-Interior Dual Release Formulas

> Buyi Ji | Tone & Benefit Formulas

> Guse Ji | Consolidate & Astringe Formulas

> Hejie Ji | Harmonise & Release Formulas

> Jiebiao Ji | Release Exterior+Make Sweat Formulas

> Kaiqiao Ji | Open Portals (Open Consciousness) Formulas

> Liqi Ji | Rectify Qi Formulas

> Lixue Ji | Rectify Xue Formulas

> Qingre Ji | Clear Heat Formulas

> Quchongji | Dispel/Expel Parasites (Parasitifuge) Formulas

> Qushi Ji | Dispel Damp Formulas

> Qushu Ji | Dispel Summerheat Formulas

> Qutan Ji | Dispel Phlegm/Expectorant Formulas

> Shachong Ji | Parasiticide Formulas

> Shili Ji | Damp~Interior Formulas

> Xiaodao Huaji Ji | Ease Indigestion (Disperse & Lead Out) Formulas

> Xiexia Ji | Drain Down (Purgative) Formulas

> Zhenduan Yongyao | Diagnosis & Application of Herbs

> Zhifeng Ji | Govern (Cure / Stop) Wind Formulas

> Zhike Pingchuan Ji | Stop Cough & Calm Asthma Formulas

> Zhiyang Ji | Cure Sores Formulas

> Zhizao Ji | Cure Dryness Formulas

>

> Go to http://sx.hbttc. org/basic and click on any icon in the

centre of the

> page. For example, the Stop Cough & Ease Asthma Class of formulas

lists

> summary details of 73 different formulas:

>

> bai ke jing tangjiang

> bai ling jiaonang

> bu shen fang chuan pian

> chuan shu pian

> chuanbei pipa chongji(koufuye, tangjiang)

> dansuan zhike pian

> ding chuan gao

> er tong ke ye

> fengre kesou jiaonang(ruan jiaonang)

> fufang baibu zhike chongji(tangjiang)

> fufang chuanbei jing pian

> gejie ding chuan jiaonang(wan)

> gu ben ke chuan pian

> gu shen ding chuan wan

> gui long ke chuan ning jiaonang

> hei xi dan

> heng zhi ke chuan jiaonang

> ji dan koufuye

> ji zhi keli(tangjiang)

> jian'er qingjie ye

> jiang qi ding chuan wan

> jiegeng dong huapian

> jiere qing fei tangjiang

> jin bei tan ke qing keli

> jing zhi kesou tanchuan wan

> ke chuan shun wan

> ke ning chongji(tangjiang, jiaonang)

> kugan chongji

> li fei pian

> ling bei zhike tangjiang

> ling gui ke chuan ning jiaonang

> liqi ding chuan wan

> lu si ge wan

> man zhi gu ben chongji

> mangguo zhike pian

> ning shu lu(tangjiang ji)

> niuhuang qing fei san

> pipa zhike chongji(jiaonang)

> qianjin huatan wan

> qiguanyan xiangjiao gao

> qing an chuan ding pian

> qingre zhen ke tangjiang

> renshen bao fei wan

> san hao shedan chuanbei pian

> san shedan chuanbei tangjiang

> shedan chuanbei pipagao

> shen bei beigua gao

> tian yi zhike tangjiang

> tong xuan li fei jiaonang(koufuye, wan)

> xiao ke chuan tangjiang(jiaonang)

> xiao'er feire ke chuan keli

> xiao'er feire ke chuan koufuye

> xiao'er ma gan chongji

> xiao'er qing fei koufuye(wan)

> xiao'er qing fei san

> xiao'er qing fei zhike pian

> xiao'er qingre zhike koufuye

> xiao'er xiao ji zhike koufuye

> xiao'er zhi sou tangjiang

> yi fei qinghua gao

> Yin xing lu

> zhen ke ning jiaonang(tangjiang, koufuye)

> zhi chuan ling zhushe ye

> zhi chuan lingqi wu ji(koufuye)

> zhi ke bao pian

> zhi ke wan

> zhi sou qingguo heji(koufuye, wan)

> zhike chuanbei pipalu

> zhike juhong koufuye(wan, keli)

> zhike ningsou jiao xiang

> zhikepingchuan ji

> zhikepingchuan tangjiang

> zhubei ding chuan wan

>

> I wish that I were fluent in Chinese, or that top class machine

translations

> were available!

>

> Best regards,

>

March 26, 2007

Hi Rick,

that is bad news indeed. You had been priviliged in Holland because of the

high level of reimbursement by insurance companies, creating possibly more

clients and also higher prices. In Belgium, people pay out of pocket in 90%

of the cases.

Which professional organization do you belong to? NVA? I can't imagine that

they are going to let this happen.

MD's in Belgium have also started a new offensive to get exclusive rights

for acupuncture treatments. In Belgium there was a law in '99 ( " de wet Colla

) that legalized acupuncture (and osteopathy, chiropraxy and homeopathy) but

since the arrival of a new government that law has not been implemented.

Reason for this is that the liberals make up the government, and MD's and

lots of their families vote liberal. They have a lot of money and political

power so the liberals cannot justify a true legalization of alternative

medicine to their voters (this has been voiced by a minister to a colleague

of mine).

In July we will have a new government in Belgium. I think I will vote

socialist since they do want as much reimbursement as possible for their

voters, including acupuncture.

About France: both France and Italy only allow MD's to perform acupuncture.

I don't know about Spain. But even in countries like France, there are many

non-MD acupuncturists that practice. This is mentioned in the Thieme

calendar; sometimes they will catch one of those acupuncturists and close

his office, but not very often.

I personally get many patients referred by MD's, so I don't think all is

lost. The only MD's that want exclusive righths are the Medical

Acupuncturists themselves. There are only 400 of those in Belgium (amongst

80.000 MD's) so I think we have a future.

Best,

Tom.

----

Rick

24/03/2007 13:48:36

Chinese Medicine

bad news: Changes in holland

In Holland there are some big changes to happen to the insurance for

alternative therapies.

A big insurance compagny announced that from april of this year the

compensations for alternative therapies wil be lowered. Also, from April,

only Medical doctors-acupuncturist can make use of the insurance's

compensations. This is the First insurance compagny that will start with

this and its expected that many others will follow.

This is very bad news for practioners (like me) who dont have any background

as MD. (altought we all have done a basic western medicine course)

Its not sure how the other insurance compagny's will react on this first

step. But one thing is for sure , the war has started.

I've heard that in France , its forbidden to non MD's to penetrate the skin

with needles. Is this true? What about then for making tattoo's on the skin.

They also make use of superficial needles to penetrate the skin.

Well i will keep you informed about the development of the proces in Holland

best wishes

Rick

Alon Marcus <alonmarcus

Chinese Medicine

Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:26:15 PM

Re: Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc.org/basic

Phil

The links do not work

www.integrativeheal thmedicine. com

-

Cc: EVHMA ; traditional_ Chinese_Medicine

Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:37 AM

Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc. org/basic

Hi Alon & All,

> Phil What is this formula? Alon

Alon, apologies, for not being more understandable in that mail.

http://sx.hbttc. org/basic has summary data on the composition and uses of

hundreds of formulas, under many classifications, as below. The data are in

Chinese. This means that one would need to understand Chinese to use the

data effectively:

The Classes of Formulas listed are:

Anshen Ji | Calm Shen Formulas

Biao-Li Shuangjie | Exterior-Interior Dual Release Formulas

Buyi Ji | Tone & Benefit Formulas

Guse Ji | Consolidate & Astringe Formulas

Hejie Ji | Harmonise & Release Formulas

Jiebiao Ji | Release Exterior+Make Sweat Formulas

Kaiqiao Ji | Open Portals (Open Consciousness) Formulas

Liqi Ji | Rectify Qi Formulas

Lixue Ji | Rectify Xue Formulas

Qingre Ji | Clear Heat Formulas

Quchongji | Dispel/Expel Parasites (Parasitifuge) Formulas

Qushi Ji | Dispel Damp Formulas

Qushu Ji | Dispel Summerheat Formulas

Qutan Ji | Dispel Phlegm/Expectorant Formulas

Shachong Ji | Parasiticide Formulas

Shili Ji | Damp~Interior Formulas

Xiaodao Huaji Ji | Ease Indigestion (Disperse & Lead Out) Formulas

Xiexia Ji | Drain Down (Purgative) Formulas

Zhenduan Yongyao | Diagnosis & Application of Herbs

Zhifeng Ji | Govern (Cure / Stop) Wind Formulas

Zhike Pingchuan Ji | Stop Cough & Calm Asthma Formulas

Zhiyang Ji | Cure Sores Formulas

Zhizao Ji | Cure Dryness Formulas

Go to http://sx.hbttc. org/basic and click on any icon in the centre of the

page. For example, the Stop Cough & Ease Asthma Class of formulas lists

summary details of 73 different formulas:

bai ke jing tangjiang

bai ling jiaonang

bu shen fang chuan pian

chuan shu pian

chuanbei pipa chongji(koufuye, tangjiang)

dansuan zhike pian

ding chuan gao

er tong ke ye

fengre kesou jiaonang(ruan jiaonang)

fufang baibu zhike chongji(tangjiang)

fufang chuanbei jing pian

gejie ding chuan jiaonang(wan)

gu ben ke chuan pian

gu shen ding chuan wan

gui long ke chuan ning jiaonang

hei xi dan

heng zhi ke chuan jiaonang

ji dan koufuye

ji zhi keli(tangjiang)

jian'er qingjie ye

jiang qi ding chuan wan

jiegeng dong huapian

jiere qing fei tangjiang

jin bei tan ke qing keli

jing zhi kesou tanchuan wan

ke chuan shun wan

ke ning chongji(tangjiang, jiaonang)

kugan chongji

li fei pian

ling bei zhike tangjiang

ling gui ke chuan ning jiaonang

liqi ding chuan wan

lu si ge wan

man zhi gu ben chongji

mangguo zhike pian

ning shu lu(tangjiang ji)

niuhuang qing fei san

pipa zhike chongji(jiaonang)

qianjin huatan wan

qiguanyan xiangjiao gao

qing an chuan ding pian

qingre zhen ke tangjiang

renshen bao fei wan

san hao shedan chuanbei pian

san shedan chuanbei tangjiang

shedan chuanbei pipagao

shen bei beigua gao

tian yi zhike tangjiang

tong xuan li fei jiaonang(koufuye, wan)

xiao ke chuan tangjiang(jiaonang)

xiao'er feire ke chuan keli

xiao'er feire ke chuan koufuye

xiao'er ma gan chongji

xiao'er qing fei koufuye(wan)

xiao'er qing fei san

xiao'er qing fei zhike pian

xiao'er qingre zhike koufuye

xiao'er xiao ji zhike koufuye

xiao'er zhi sou tangjiang

yi fei qinghua gao

Yin xing lu

zhen ke ning jiaonang(tangjiang, koufuye)

zhi chuan ling zhushe ye

zhi chuan lingqi wu ji(koufuye)

zhi ke bao pian

zhi ke wan

zhi sou qingguo heji(koufuye, wan)

zhike chuanbei pipalu

zhike juhong koufuye(wan, keli)

zhike ningsou jiao xiang

zhikepingchuan ji

zhikepingchuan tangjiang

zhubei ding chuan wan

I wish that I were fluent in Chinese, or that top class machine translations

were available!

Best regards,

March 26, 2007

Hi Rick, Tom,

Too bad about the Dutch situation!

In Denmark until this year only MDs or aupuncturists supervised by MDs could

practice acupuncture legally (Pircing of the skin for medical reasons were

only allowed to be performed by MDs - practices such as cosmetic piercing

and tattoing are not under any such regulative measure).

Following ten years of lobby and commitee work under a liberal government

(most of the time) the law was revised - under much protest from the

established medical community at large - so that from January 1st 2007

acupuncturists can now practice without supervision from MDs provided that

they fulfil certain requirments. Unfortunately education is NOT one of them,

however the Danish Dept. of Health has issued a title (Registered

Alternative Therapist) to be distributed by different guilds that fulfil

special requirements (Member's educational standard, liability insurance and

more) - §s in the revised law states that therapist who is qualified to the

above title is legally allowed to: " diagnose and treat or do preventional

treatment of disease " as long as the therapist makes sure to refer out when

necessary.

This - as well as public demand - has spawned new interest in the insurance

companies to reimburse ie acupunture treatments performed by therapist with

the above title of Registered Alternative Therapist (in Danish: R.A.B.)

It is my hope that the rest of Europe, where acupuncturists are still

" enslaved " og practicing illegally will try to follow this example

Public demand for qualified complimentary and alternative treatment options

is on the rise here and following the booming economy people are becoming

more and more willing to pay for treatment as well as becoming more and more

desillusioned regarding Western Medical care which is free in Denmark, but

suck big time in quality and the waiting list are stupifying........

Best regards,

Thomas Sorensen

Acupuncturist, PA, RAB

Denmark

2007/3/26, Tom Verhaeghe <tom.verhaeghe:

>

> Hi Rick,

>

> that is bad news indeed. You had been priviliged in Holland because of the

> high level of reimbursement by insurance companies, creating possibly more

> clients and also higher prices. In Belgium, people pay out of pocket in

> 90%

> of the cases.

>

> Which professional organization do you belong to? NVA? I can't imagine

> that

> they are going to let this happen.

>

> MD's in Belgium have also started a new offensive to get exclusive rights

> for acupuncture treatments. In Belgium there was a law in '99 ( " de wet

> Colla

> ) that legalized acupuncture (and osteopathy, chiropraxy and homeopathy)

> but

> since the arrival of a new government that law has not been implemented.

> Reason for this is that the liberals make up the government, and MD's and

> lots of their families vote liberal. They have a lot of money and

> political

> power so the liberals cannot justify a true legalization of alternative

> medicine to their voters (this has been voiced by a minister to a

> colleague

> of mine).

> In July we will have a new government in Belgium. I think I will vote

> socialist since they do want as much reimbursement as possible for their

> voters, including acupuncture.

>

> About France: both France and Italy only allow MD's to perform

> acupuncture.

> I don't know about Spain. But even in countries like France, there are

> many

> non-MD acupuncturists that practice. This is mentioned in the Thieme

> calendar; sometimes they will catch one of those acupuncturists and close

> his office, but not very often.

>

> I personally get many patients referred by MD's, so I don't think all is

> lost. The only MD's that want exclusive righths are the Medical

> Acupuncturists themselves. There are only 400 of those in Belgium (amongst

> 80.000 MD's) so I think we have a future.

>

> Best,

>

> Tom.

>

> ----

>

> Rick

> 24/03/2007 13:48:36

> To:

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>

> bad news: Changes in holland

>

> In Holland there are some big changes to happen to the insurance for

> alternative therapies.

> A big insurance compagny announced that from april of this year the

> compensations for alternative therapies wil be lowered. Also, from April,

> only Medical doctors-acupuncturist can make use of the insurance's

> compensations. This is the First insurance compagny that will start with

> this and its expected that many others will follow.

>

> This is very bad news for practioners (like me) who dont have any

> background

> as MD. (altought we all have done a basic western medicine course)

> Its not sure how the other insurance compagny's will react on this first

> step. But one thing is for sure , the war has started.

>

> I've heard that in France , its forbidden to non MD's to penetrate the

> skin

> with needles. Is this true? What about then for making tattoo's on the

> skin.

> They also make use of superficial needles to penetrate the skin.

>

> Well i will keep you informed about the development of the proces in

> Holland

>

> best wishes

>

> Rick

>

> Alon Marcus <alonmarcus <alonmarcus%40wans.net>>

> To:

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>

> Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:26:15 PM

> Re: Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc.org/basic

>

> Phil

> The links do not work

>

> www.integrativeheal thmedicine. com

> -

>

> Cc: EVHMA ; traditional_ Chinese_Medicine @.

> com

>

> Wednesday, March 21, 2007 8:37 AM

> Re: Chinese Formula Data at: http://sx.hbttc. org/basic

>

> Hi Alon & All,

>

> > Phil What is this formula? Alon

>

> Alon, apologies, for not being more understandable in that mail.

>

> http://sx.hbttc. org/basic has summary data on the composition and uses of

>

> hundreds of formulas, under many classifications, as below. The data are

> in

> Chinese. This means that one would need to understand Chinese to use the

> data effectively:

>

> The Classes of Formulas listed are:

>

> Anshen Ji | Calm Shen Formulas

> Biao-Li Shuangjie | Exterior-Interior Dual Release Formulas

> Buyi Ji | Tone & Benefit Formulas

> Guse Ji | Consolidate & Astringe Formulas

> Hejie Ji | Harmonise & Release Formulas

> Jiebiao Ji | Release Exterior+Make Sweat Formulas

> Kaiqiao Ji | Open Portals (Open Consciousness) Formulas

> Liqi Ji | Rectify Qi Formulas

> Lixue Ji | Rectify Xue Formulas

> Qingre Ji | Clear Heat Formulas

> Quchongji | Dispel/Expel Parasites (Parasitifuge) Formulas

> Qushi Ji | Dispel Damp Formulas

> Qushu Ji | Dispel Summerheat Formulas

> Qutan Ji | Dispel Phlegm/Expectorant Formulas

> Shachong Ji | Parasiticide Formulas

> Shili Ji | Damp~Interior Formulas

> Xiaodao Huaji Ji | Ease Indigestion (Disperse & Lead Out) Formulas

> Xiexia Ji | Drain Down (Purgative) Formulas

> Zhenduan Yongyao | Diagnosis & Application of Herbs

> Zhifeng Ji | Govern (Cure / Stop) Wind Formulas

> Zhike Pingchuan Ji | Stop Cough & Calm Asthma Formulas

> Zhiyang Ji | Cure Sores Formulas

> Zhizao Ji | Cure Dryness Formulas

>

> Go to http://sx.hbttc. org/basic and click on any icon in the centre of

> the

> page. For example, the Stop Cough & Ease Asthma Class of formulas lists

> summary details of 73 different formulas:

>

> bai ke jing tangjiang

> bai ling jiaonang

> bu shen fang chuan pian

> chuan shu pian

> chuanbei pipa chongji(koufuye, tangjiang)

> dansuan zhike pian

> ding chuan gao

> er tong ke ye

> fengre kesou jiaonang(ruan jiaonang)

> fufang baibu zhike chongji(tangjiang)

> fufang chuanbei jing pian

> gejie ding chuan jiaonang(wan)

> gu ben ke chuan pian

> gu shen ding chuan wan

> gui long ke chuan ning jiaonang

> hei xi dan

> heng zhi ke chuan jiaonang

> ji dan koufuye

> ji zhi keli(tangjiang)

> jian'er qingjie ye

> jiang qi ding chuan wan

> jiegeng dong huapian

> jiere qing fei tangjiang

> jin bei tan ke qing keli

> jing zhi kesou tanchuan wan

> ke chuan shun wan

> ke ning chongji(tangjiang, jiaonang)

> kugan chongji

> li fei pian

> ling bei zhike tangjiang

> ling gui ke chuan ning jiaonang

> liqi ding chuan wan

> lu si ge wan

> man zhi gu ben chongji

> mangguo zhike pian

> ning shu lu(tangjiang ji)

> niuhuang qing fei san

> pipa zhike chongji(jiaonang)

> qianjin huatan wan

> qiguanyan xiangjiao gao

> qing an chuan ding pian

> qingre zhen ke tangjiang

> renshen bao fei wan

> san hao shedan chuanbei pian

> san shedan chuanbei tangjiang

> shedan chuanbei pipagao

> shen bei beigua gao

> tian yi zhike tangjiang

> tong xuan li fei jiaonang(koufuye, wan)

> xiao ke chuan tangjiang(jiaonang)

> xiao'er feire ke chuan keli

> xiao'er feire ke chuan koufuye

> xiao'er ma gan chongji

> xiao'er qing fei koufuye(wan)

> xiao'er qing fei san

> xiao'er qing fei zhike pian

> xiao'er qingre zhike koufuye

> xiao'er xiao ji zhike koufuye

> xiao'er zhi sou tangjiang

> yi fei qinghua gao

> Yin xing lu

> zhen ke ning jiaonang(tangjiang, koufuye)

> zhi chuan ling zhushe ye

> zhi chuan lingqi wu ji(koufuye)

> zhi ke bao pian

> zhi ke wan

> zhi sou qingguo heji(koufuye, wan)

> zhike chuanbei pipalu

> zhike juhong koufuye(wan, keli)

> zhike ningsou jiao xiang

> zhikepingchuan ji

> zhikepingchuan tangjiang

> zhubei ding chuan wan

>

> I wish that I were fluent in Chinese, or that top class machine

> translations

>

> were available!

>

> Best regards,

>

March 27, 2007

Hi , thanks for your responses

I've heard about the progress in Danmark also. That's very good news indeed.

As for in Holland , its not for sure how things will develop. Its just one

insurance compagny for now, and thankfully there are many others. (altough its

not for sure how they will act on this) As for Zhong ( the organisation where i

am in) has asked all the members and their patients to write or mail his or

her's protest to the concerning insurance compagny.

Before this strange step of the insurance compagny , things where at a good

progress. the different TCM organisations did and do their jobs very well. And i

am for sure that they will make a good point to the government. The most

important thing is that we dont take a step back but a step forwards to them.

I am curious what will happen when whole Europe will fall under one law. The

laws about TCM seem to be different in most country's. And which law will stay

up after the new constitution?

Well ill keep the list up to date about the progress here.

Best wishes

Rick

I will keep in touch about the development here.

Tom Verhaeghe <tom.verhaeghe

Chinese Medicine

Monday, March 26, 2007 10:00:50 AM

Re: bad news: Changes in holland