Guest guest Posted February 19, 2002 Report Share Posted February 19, 2002 Greg Thanks, but I am not sure what you mean by " inhibit soy enzyme bioactivity " ... " roasting may be beneficial " . Please explain? Can soy beans be eaten raw? I guess, until further clarification, you advocate lightly roasting them. Morton Greg Watson wrote: > - > " Kevin Gagnon " <powerofbelieving > > Monday, February 18, 2002 2:27 PM > Re: Soy > > > I have questions, if someone can tell me. When the soy bean is roasted, > > does it lose much of it's nutrient qualities? Much? If yes, how can this > > loss be minimized? If these beans can be eaten raw, is their available > > nutrition enhanced? > > Hi Morton, > > Roasting (heating) generally denatures proteins (unfolds them from their natural curls) and thus will inhibit soy > enzymes bioactivity, however unless you really burn them, roasting may be beneficial. > ======================== > Good health & long life, > Greg Watson, > http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2002 Report Share Posted February 19, 2002 Greg Watson wrote: > - > " the desert_rat " <ron > > Monday, February 18, 2002 2:33 PM > Re: Soy > > > Hi Kevin, > > http://www.westonaprice.org/soy/soy_alert.html > > Hi Ron, > > If you read the articles carefully, you will see the problems are eating non fermented soy products. Fermenting is the > traditional Asian way to eat soy and to eat it with iodine rich sea fish as the Okinawans do. > > Just understand the multi billon dollar market for protein in the US. Even very small changes in market % represent > millions of dollars in sales and like the dirty practices engaged in by the oil seed barons as they killed off topical > oils and butter in place of margarine are now being used against soy. > ======================== > Good health & long life, > Hi I am responding to each of the emails as I receive them, so I may say/ask something which will have been answered later. Can I assume that the soy I buy will have been fermented? If I buy raw soy beans, (do I really want to?) can I/how can I ferment them myself? Morton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2002 Report Share Posted February 19, 2002 Pam I see nothing condescending in Greg's response. He is suggesting, quite reasonably so, that Ron become a little more receptive to other ideas, especially when they are backed by credible evidence. Should every enlightened person be labelled as condescending? Morton Pamela Southall wrote: > > Greg Watson <gowatson wrote: > Hi Ron, > > <snip> I guess you can throw away any information that does not fit your view of the world. Living is about > learning and being constantly aware that we don't know all the answers. You can't learn without allowing new knowledge > to replace old. <snip> > > Greg, > > I think your posts would be better received if they weren't sometimes condescending. > > Just a suggestion, > > Pam > > > > Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2002 Report Share Posted February 19, 2002 > Hi, Greg W O W! After all is said and done................ Morton > > > Hi Morton, > > I use tofu and not beans. > > Here is a good article with a view of both sides of the issue and is about where I stand on soy: > > http://www.prescription4health.com/articles/articles_print/RX4Health-article-002\ 8.htm > SOY - Healthy Food or Dreaded Toxin? > By Brian Sanderoff, P.D. > > Occasionally, the scientific evidence concerning a particular topic is so confounding, confusing and contradictory that > it is nearly............ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2002 Report Share Posted February 19, 2002 Hi Gregg, Well you are voluminous if nothing else. I looked at most of the " evidences " that you supply (I notice they all come from PubMed) and it appears to me that they are measuring the good effects of PHYTOESTROGENS and not taking into account any of SOYS negatives. (caps for emphasis not shouting . Although soy is, next to linseed, the highest in phytos it is quite possible to get them without soy's negative baggage. http://www.a-better-way.com/women.html Also another slant : The consensus that is emerging is that the outcome of increased phytoestrogen intake is unpredictable partly due to a poor understanding of their mechanisms of action. There is the possibility of both adverse and beneficial effects in some individuals in different target organs, depending on their age or their maturity. References: Cassidy A., (1999), 'Dietary phytoestrogens - potential anti-cancer agents?' British Nutrition Foundation Bulletin, 24, 22-30. Institute for Environment and Health (1997), 'Phytoestrogens in the human diet'. MAFF R & D surveillance report 291. National Dairy Council Nutrition Service 'Soy protein and breast cancer'. Quarterly review, Winter 1998, 21-23. McMichael-Phillips, D.E. et al.,(1998), 'Effects of soy-protein supplementation on epithelial proliferation in the histologically normal human breast'. >Am J Clin Nutr, 68 (suppl), 1431S-1436S. Murkies A L. et al. (1995), 'Dietary flour supplementation decreases post- menopausal hot flushes: Effect of soy and wheat'' Maturitas, 21, 189-195. National Dairy Council Nutrition Service 'Soya phytoestrogens - Cause for concern?' Quarterly review, 4 / 1999-2000, 2-5. Sheehan D M. (1998), 'Herbal medicines, phytoestrogens and toxicity: Risk:benefit considerations'. Food Standards Agency, 'Food safety information bulletin'. Bulletin No.120, May 2000. _____________ Get the FREE email that has everyone talking at http://www.mail2world.com <> > > Greg Watson > 2/19/2002 1:41:41 PM > Gettingwell > Re: Soy Hi Ron, Here are a few: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11823590 & dopt=Abstract Dietary intake of phytoestrogens is associated with a favorable metabolic cardiovascular risk profile in postmenopausal U.S.women: the Framingham study. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11773506 & dopt=Abstract The inhibitory effect of soy protein isolate on atherosclerosis in mice does not require the presence of LDL receptors or alteration of plasma lipoproteins. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11710352 & dopt=Abstract Candidate foods in the asia-pacific region for cardiovascular protection: nuts, soy, lentils and Tempe. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11708310 & dopt=Abstract Cholesterol lowering benefits of soy and linseed enriched foods. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11701680 & dopt=Abstract High dietary phytoestrogen intake is associated with higher bone mineral density in postmenopausal but not premenopausal women. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11694655 & dopt=Abstract Soy for breast cancer survivors: a critical review of the literature http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11605103 & dopt=Abstract Eating soya improves human memory. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11603652 & dopt=Abstract Dietary effects on cardiovascular disease risk factors: beyond saturated fatty acids and cholesterol. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11603649 & dopt=Abstract The role of phytoestrogens in the prevention and treatment of osteoporosis in ovarian hormone deficiency. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11603644 & dopt=Abstract Soy isoflavones--benefits and risks from nature's selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=10702626 & dopt=Abstract Selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs): effects on multiple organ systems http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=PubMed & lis t_uids=11595123 & dopt=Abstract Effect of soy isoflavone supplementation on markers of oxidative stress in men and women. ======================== Good health & long life, Greg Watson, http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2002 Report Share Posted February 20, 2002 - " the desert_rat " <ron Wednesday, February 20, 2002 3:06 AM Re: Soy > Hi Gregg, > Well you are voluminous if nothing else. > I looked at most of the " evidences " that you supply (I notice they all > come from PubMed) I do consider PubMed to be the least biased of sources but even then I do come across very biased and bad science papers. > and it appears to me that they are measuring the good > effects of PHYTOESTROGENS and not taking into account any of SOYS > negatives. (caps for emphasis not shouting . > > Although soy is, next to linseed, the highest in phytos it is quite > possible to get them without soy's negative baggage. Hi Ron, Linseed / flax provides a different class of phytoestrogens than that available from soy. We eat both. I have said may times that I would not use soy in large amounts or non fermented forms and understand it's limitations and advantages. Smart eating is about just that. Maximizing the advantages of various foods, while minimizing the disadvantages. In my opinion, using fermented soy products in moderate doses does avoid the negatives. ======================== Good health & long life, Greg Watson, http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2002 Report Share Posted February 20, 2002 >I have said may times that I would not use soy in large amounts or non fermented forms and understand it's limitations >and advantages. Smart eating is about just that. Maximizing the advantages of various foods, while minimizing the >disadvantages. > >In my opinion, using fermented soy products in moderate doses does avoid the negatives. >======================== >Good health & long life, > Greg Watson, > http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au And what do you consider good fermented soy products...tempeh? or are there others? Ken W Check out Cupid School where you will learn from Matchmaker's best and brightest. Good Luck! http://ecard.matchmaker.com/cupid0202/cupid0202.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2002 Report Share Posted February 20, 2002 - " Ken N Woody " <kenwoody Wednesday, February 20, 2002 10:58 AM Re: Soy > And what do you consider good fermented soy products...tempeh? or are there others? Hi Ken, Checkout: http://theimmunesystemcure.com/WN-4.html " Non-fermented soybeans contain enzyme inhibitors that can block protein absorption and they also contain hemagglutin known to decrease the ability of red blood cells to properly absorb oxygen and distribute it through the body. When soybeans are naturally fermented as found in tempeh, miso, tofu and fermented soy powder, the fermentation process deactivates hemagglutinin and enhances protein and isoflavones absorption. Traditional Asian diets contain mainly fermented soy foods not isolated soy protein or whole soybeans. Fermented soy powders also provide more absorbable forms (alglycone forms) of the isoflavones genistein and daizein. Dr. John R Lee, M.D. prefers that we chose fermented soy foods in moderation along with a varied diet rich in vitamins, minerals and other essential nutrients. A study published in the Journal of the American Dietetic Association compared the effects of consuming fermented soy to unfermented soy. Their conclusion fermented soy provided an increase in the availability and absorption of the isoflavones in soy. " ======================== Good health & long life, Greg Watson, http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2002 Report Share Posted February 20, 2002 Interesting, I had always thought Tofu was not fermented. Thanks, Greg. -- On Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:20:55 Greg Watson wrote: >- > " Ken N Woody " <kenwoody > >Wednesday, February 20, 2002 10:58 AM >Re: Soy > > >> And what do you consider good fermented soy products...tempeh? or are there others? > >Hi Ken, > >Checkout: >http://theimmunesystemcure.com/WN-4.html > " Non-fermented soybeans contain enzyme inhibitors that can block protein absorption and they also contain hemagglutin >known to decrease the ability of red blood cells to properly absorb oxygen and distribute it through the body. When >soybeans are naturally fermented as found in tempeh, miso, tofu and fermented soy powder, the fermentation process >deactivates hemagglutinin and enhances protein and isoflavones absorption. Traditional Asian diets contain mainly >fermented soy foods not isolated soy protein or whole soybeans. Fermented soy powders also provide more absorbable forms >(alglycone forms) of the isoflavones genistein and daizein. Dr. John R Lee, M.D. prefers that we chose fermented soy >foods in moderation along with a varied diet rich in vitamins, minerals and other essential nutrients. > >A study published in the Journal of the American Dietetic Association compared the effects of consuming fermented soy to >unfermented soy. Their conclusion fermented soy provided an increase in the availability and absorption of the >isoflavones in soy. " >======================== >Good health & long life, > Greg Watson, > http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au > > > Check out Cupid School where you will learn from Matchmaker's best and brightest. Good Luck! http://ecard.matchmaker.com/cupid0202/cupid0202.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2002 Report Share Posted February 20, 2002 In a message dated 2/19/02 9:55:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, gowatson writes: << Fermented soy powders also provide more absorbable forms (alglycone forms) of the isoflavones genistein and daizein >> Do I understand you to mean that soy powders such as found in the brand 'PHtoSoy' is the fermented kind? Thank you. Jean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2002 Report Share Posted February 21, 2002 - <gemno Wednesday, February 20, 2002 11:41 PM Re: Soy > << Fermented soy powders also provide more absorbable forms > (alglycone forms) of the isoflavones genistein and daizein >> > > Do I understand you to mean that soy powders such as found in the brand > 'PHtoSoy' is the fermented kind? Thank you. Hi Jean, Not unless they are from fermented soy. ======================== Good health & long life, Greg Watson, http://optimalhealth.cia.com.au Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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