Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

January 9, 2008

I agree with Sreenadhji.Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika.Similar is story in BPHS and other classics.Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points - like lagna, and all planets.So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages.I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail and also go through various classicsThanksKiranSreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji, Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be in a hurry. Love and regards, Sreenadh , "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question that worries me is that â€œWhat did parasara actually say and teach v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts today?â€. If there is a difference and if everyone is following that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some discrepancy there. > >

> > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Remesh ji, > ==> > > Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.

> <== > You are absolutely right. > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known horoscopes or not. > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that Ã¢â‚¬" for sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just because of this combination the

said result should fructify; but this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the statemnt of those sages. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@> wrote: > > > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh, > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not wrong. > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage. > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages. > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with Ma. Sa and Ra. > > The placemeent of Ve

in dual signs. > > Thanks and regards. > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from Taurus. That is correct. > > > > But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be such. There must be problems or some such things indicating. > > > > Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th house. > > > > However for a person to break the marital bond and go

outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. > > > > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too. > > > > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? > > > > > > 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or

her degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery. > > > > For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person. > > > > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > Dear Ash, > > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But rather

related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation

mentioned here could be - > > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of first marriage is present in horoscope) > > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the family relatives/relations > > > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that "if 2nd lord is in 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as a marriage". It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will find him settled in the next relation

(married!) again enjoying life. May be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this derivation. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 wives? > > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in property > > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a

bigamous > > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce and > > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so that > > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then mostly > > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > > that native might be in business but he was

CEO, I wrote a mail I think in > > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures to > > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception happens > > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > _____ > > > > > >

> > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail > > > of Gopu ji, I

should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need to > > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, and > > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 or > > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't have > > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc)." > > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord

would be very prosperous. The tight- fistedness > > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is not > > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and right > > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but rather > > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes in > > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the too > > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong as > > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - multiple > > > wives for the native. > > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > >

horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to share > > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , "vinita kumar" > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > > effort > > > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus.

> > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > > marriages? > > > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the

significator of > > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. >

> > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > > application. > > > > > > > > warm regards, > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being

2nd > > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > >

> > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > > results such as "good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > > earnings" etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - "He will have no > > > > son"?!! The quiz question is - > > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result

derivations > > > > true in actual experience? > > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > > here. ;=) > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > Now you can chat without downloading messenger. Click here to know how. > > >

5, 50, 500, 5000 - Store N number of mails in your inbox.

January 9, 2008

Dear Remesh Mishra ji,

That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable

points.

==>

> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different

methodology but our

> main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have

missed the correct aim.

<==

I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical

astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify

with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into

understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for

predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers

should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important

and not the various methodologies/approaches. What ever the methodology

applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that

methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated.

==>

> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the

correct target.

> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion.

> With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .

<==

Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here.

==>

> we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members

to prove it with

> suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.

<==

Right you said.

==>

> For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to

justify the event

> taking help of dictum of ancient sages.

<==

You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart

reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be

rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the

approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from

sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by

the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise

helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students

- me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach,

because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself

and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the

approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations.

==>

> These books written by sages during their dates were translated in

different languages according to their own understanding.

> Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the

originals are either mutilated or lost.

<==

But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost

Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own

understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve

the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based

on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient'

indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the

group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it

is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any

alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a

friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP,

KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi

astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but

still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient indian astrology - the

ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi

Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate

on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/approach - as they put it.

==>

> Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing

the event.

> Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the

public.

> Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.

<==

Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to

come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying

various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling

planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts

to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that

would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on

'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know

about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful

and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this

regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our

quest of astrology.

==>

> Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.

<==

Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

, ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002 wrote:>> Dear respected all learnades,>

It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent

scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and

many others.> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help

of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the

target.> If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .>

When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any

method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with

suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> For this

purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to

justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.>

These books written by sages during their dates were translated in

different languages according to their own understanding.> Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.>

Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways

according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different

meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> So it is now

very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of

discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.>

BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali

etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on

their verses.> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.>

I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this

native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> The

chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family),

speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with

right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.>

Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma

is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and

guru > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> He may not be getting support from his father.> He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> Is all this correct or incorrect ?> Thanks and regards.> Ramesh Mishra > > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote:> Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> ==>>

Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also

cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way

even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> <==>

There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here

is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no

doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases,

nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants

with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle

work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a

wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such

capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder

drug - and u know why. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > > , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> >> > Dear Ash,> > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > >

> "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if

they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > >

> For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga

yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and

its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass

though then we got something good and strong.> > >

> Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists,

that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold

any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1

law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the

contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the

mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > You

have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is

what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes

etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80%

accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of

result so far.> > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > All the best!> > > > Regards,> > Krishna> > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > Dear Sreenadh,> > >

> You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are

so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for

this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping

that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it.

Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things

in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of

ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or

the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using

KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not

about argument, but that is what I know.> > > >

Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the

language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not

mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and

try to just talk things logically.> > > > I am a

very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be

proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > >

> For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga

yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and

its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass

though then we got something good and strong.> > >

> You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same

time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by

symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take

9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e

the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if

11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self

earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is

opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > >

> So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father

and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as

father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and

8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > >

> Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such

things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either

someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which

infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > Of in old

days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged

based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind

and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be

known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > >

> I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji

explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally

mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is

just left out. What about that?> > > > So if u just

go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its

English translation which is flavoured by the author and the

translators who might not have translated things properly so many

things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > >

> Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave

their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple

relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we

also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL

picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass

the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > >

Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that

when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any

water.> > > > Even just find 1 law that works

consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put

that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation

might get cleared. > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca> >> > > > > > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.>

January 9, 2008

Dear Kiran ji,

Our understanding of Ashtaka Varga system is limited -

that too is a very elaborate system and perfected by many in various

ways. Unlike any other Ashtaka varga school, KAS is a long tradition -

unique in its own respect. Please don't try to see rishi hora

methods in it - every approach has its own dictom and when one try to

understand a system followed by a particular tradition we SHOULD think as they

do, and follow their foundations. The same holds true for Nadi, KP, Lal Kitab,

Tajik, Ashtakavarga (here KAS) and Jaimini system. In all those systems

you will encounter may rules and fundamental concepts contradicting ancient

indian astrology and Rishi hora quotes, but that DOES NOT make them invalid -

but instead makes them unique - a different approach. When followed in

their true sense all those methods can lead us to right results. Know this as a

fact - and I repeat - please DON'T try see Rishi hora methods in them; they are

part of different tradition or school of astrology; a different

parmapara. Astrology is NOT a science but only 'advice imparted to us by ancient

traditions' and know that whether we divide light as 'Red- Green-Blue' or

'Cyan-Yellow-Magenta' any of those 3 colors together will form the white

light. The significance attributed to various signs, houses and planets

may differ as per various systems; but when treated together they all speak

about the same whole picture, helping us to arrive at right conclusions.

I am not

discussing or quoting Ashtaka varga principles neither because it

is not dependable nor because I don't appreciate the methodology; but

only

because the available quotes from lost Rishi horas and the available

Rishi

horas (prior to Mihira) DOES NOT speak about Ashtaka Varga - and

also because this group concentrate on Ancient Indian Astrology as

Rishi Horas puts it. Thus as far

as my quest is concerned the same is not relevant - but NOTE IT the system is truly

relevant and useful, and KAS (since it has the power of a long traditon) truly

unique and should be appreciated. The same statement goes in support of -

Nadi, Lal Kitab,Tajik and Jaimini system as well. KP is appreciated

since it tried to reconstruct the lost system of ancient 'Stellar

Astrology' in a new way.

Also note that in the whole of astrology groups,

'' deserve a special praise because it is one of the

rare calm and sincere group which concentrates on the study, understanding and

improvement of the traditional system they follow. There is only a handful of

such groups on astrology in the net, and learn to appreciate them, whether you

want to follow them or not.

* When a Lal Kitab astrologer comes to you and tells you and tell

you that the significance of the planet changes from house to house - you would

be wonder struck.

* When KAS presents some special principles differentiating Karak for

house and Karak planet- you would be wonder struck.

* When a nadi astrologer comes to you, when the significance he

associates with planets and houses does not match with your understanding - you

would be wonder struck.

* When KP starts ascribing the numerous stars, star lords and sublords

and speak about sensitive points and ruling planets - you would be wonder

struck.

* When Tajik astrologer starts speaking about various yogas

with absurd sounding names such as Ikkavali and Induvara - you would be wonder struck.

* When a Jaimini astrologer comes to you and start speaking

about Atma karaka, Amatya karaka, Prana pada, varnada lagna, argala,

Chara dasa and so on - you would be wonder struck.

But (NOTE IT) the mistakes lies with

you - because you are TRYING TO MIX

SYSTEMS which is sure to lead to contradictions and confusions; you are

trying to view AIA in other unique systems has credit of their own and

ARE valuable. Note that Remesh Mishra ji has already highlighted this point correct (check below) and this is what we should be beware of.

Hope you will see the point. So first select 'what you want to learn',

'which system you find intelligible, easy to understand, and useful' - and then

follow that and NEVER mix various system - making a Kichadi out of the same. :=)

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

, Kiran R <kiran.rama wrote:>> I agree with Sreenadhji.> > Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika.> Similar is story in BPHS and other classics.> >

Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is

benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points -

like lagna, and all planets.> > So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages.> I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail and also go through various classics> > Thanks> Kiran> > Sreenadh sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji,> Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - > and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be > in a hurry. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh > > , "Ash's Corner@" > kas@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question > that worries me is that â€œWhat did parasara actually say and teach > v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts > today?â€. If there is a difference and if everyone is following > that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually > practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some > discrepancy there.> > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca> > > > _____ > > > > > On Behalf Of > Sreenadh> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM> > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it > true?!!!> > > > > > > > Dear Remesh ji,> > ==>> > > Both of you are correct your own way.> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.> > <== > > You are absolutely right. > > > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the > methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us > denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of > Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the > systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) > interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known > horoscopes or not. > > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to > state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to > emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that Ã¢â‚¬" for > sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of > fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other > supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just > because of this combination the said result should fructify; but > this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the > statemnt of those sages. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > , ramesh mishra > <aarceemastro2002@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh,> > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way.> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.> > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not > wrong.> > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is > second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage.> > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages.> > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with > Ma. Sa and Ra.> > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs.> > > Thanks and regards.> > > Ramesh Mishra> > >

January 9, 2008

Dear Sreenadh,

I donâ€™t think u understood what I was

trying to say, OhÂ I donâ€™t doubt that what our ancient seers taught us is not

correct.

However my emphasis is on â€œWhat Words of

the Sages?â€.

How do we know for sure that what the

sages said and what is translated in English today are same.Â That canâ€™t be

assumed.Â

So, let me clarify, that what our ancient

seers and sages taught was perfect, but what we have today cannot be said that

that is exactly what the sages taught.

So just quoting blindly using incomplete

texts, Â by translators who might not have grasped the essence of what the real

meaning of the shokes were meant to be, inability to interpret it w.r.t point

in time, i.e. for example, somewhere its given that Ju in 4th house

means elephants at door step, now that has to be translated in todays worlds as

maybe chauffer derive limousine or something like that, and even one step

before that, has the exact shloke been written done exactly as the way our

ancient seers have said?

Back then the medium of teaching was

verbal so someone at some point might have documented all this.

So many layers of area where

interpretation might go wrong.

In reference to your comment about having

patience, to that I have to say that I have decided when I started learning

Jyotish, so not to worry, itâ€™s a life long journey (or several lifetimes), but

the only way in my opinion to do justice to our ancient seers is to make

accurate prediction, by that I mean, 80-100% of charts must be read accurately.

Â That would automatically imply that what they taught and what we have

understood is perfect J

That and only that is and can be the

truth.Â

I also understand that there has to be a

start somewhere, and u can use these so called remains that we have today

called â€œclassic textsâ€ as the starting point, but it would be not proper to

think that that is what

a) Exaclty what Maharishis

b) We have all the texts and and in proper

form

c) We have proper translations of the

same.

So consider this as starting point and

only starting point and the end point will be or we can say that we have

understood what the sages have taught only when we are able to predict events

100% or rather understand the essence of Jyotish 100%.

Also one more thought and this is on a

tangent, but since its come to my mind, I will note it down.Â Has it occurred to

anyone that maybe our Maharishis DID NOT want everyone to have full knowledge?Â

Have full knowledge, would mean having absolute power and absolute power will

corrupt.

Maybe all the knowledge was intentionally

dispersed across the world, with some knowledge with the say Mayans some with

the Greek or Yavans, some hidden in the Kabbalah, some in western astrology etc

etc.

Only the big guy upstairs knows what our

ancient maharishis really wanted and the actual reason why the medium of

instruction was only verbal, why is all this knowledge dispersed, and why the

texts were destroyed etc etc.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Wednesday January 9, 2008

6:55 AM

Subject:

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash ji,

Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right -

and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be

in a hurry.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

" Ash's Corner "

<kas wrote:

>

> Dear Sreenadh,

>

> Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question

that worries me is that Ã¢â‚¬Å“What did parasara actually say and teach

v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts

today?Ã¢â‚¬Â. If there is a difference and if everyone is following

that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually

practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some

discrepancy there.

>

> Cheers !!!

>

> Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca>

http://www.ashtro.ca

>

> _____

>

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM

>

> Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

>

> Dear Remesh ji,

> ==>

> > Both of you are correct your own way.

> > But the problem is, mixing two different system.

> <==

> You are absolutely right.

>

> This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the

methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us

denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of

Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the

systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be)

interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known

horoscopes or not.

> I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to

state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to

emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬ " for

sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of

fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other

supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just

because of this combination the said result should fructify; but

this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the

statemnt of those sages.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

>

> ,

ramesh mishra

<aarceemastro2002@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Ash and Sreenadh,

> > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way.

> > But the problem is, mixing two different system.

> > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not

wrong.

> > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is

second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage.

> > But chart must indicate multiple marriages.

> > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with

Ma. Sa and Ra.

> > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs.

> > Thanks and regards.

> > Ramesh Mishra

> >

> > " Ash's Corner@ " kas@ wrote:

> > Dear Sreenadh,

> >

> > I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in

Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th

from Taurus. That is correct.

> >

> > But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have

some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be

such. There must be problems or some such things indicating.

> >

> > Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing

period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results

of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple

marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th

house.

> >

> > However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside

the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by

the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more

yogs.

> >

> > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own

home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are

4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds,

stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also

knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart

and your Guru and father too.

> >

> > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other

way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd

house?

> >

> > 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of

2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need

not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her degree in

education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery.

> >

> > For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some

particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma

and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more

passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord

runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen

that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju

aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like

other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the

person.

> >

> > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons

will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts.

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

> >

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM

> >

> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is

it true?!!!

> >

> > Dear Ash,

> > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation'

mentioned here is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th

(bed pleasures); But rather related to the house indicating 2nd

marriages or relations within the relationships such as 2nd and 11th

houses.

> > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and

Venus is the lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that

the same Venus gets exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd

marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, note that Jupiter is the

significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in Taurus (2nd lord in

any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) means, 11th lord

from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd lord in

2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is

debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting

relation with both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd

wife/relation). Note that 11th indicates friendship turned into

relation.

> >

> > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could

be -

> > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication

of break of first marriage is present in horoscope)

> > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation.

> > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in

the family relatives/relations

> >

> > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd

lord is in 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image

and he would be good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital

affairs; almost strong as a marriage " . It is not that the native is

immoral, non-sincere, does not loves his wife or something like

that; it is just that for fulfillment (complimenting) he needs some

extra relations - and have it, solid. If even by a slight chance if

his marriage is affected, the very next day you will find him

settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May be

some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this

derivation.

> > Love and regards,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

kas@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadh,

> > >

> > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by

2 or 3 wives?

> > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so

partner in property

> > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th

house matters

> > > which involves pleasures?

> > >

> > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that

might be a

bigamous

> > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that

he or she

> > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and

divorce and

> > > marry 3rd time like that?

> > >

> > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd

lord a person

> > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y

chromosomes so that

> > > might be a factor in having more female children.

> > >

> > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart,

then mostly

> > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such

persons are

> > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO

where I said

> > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a

mail I think in

> > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large

ventures to

> > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and

conception happens

> > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child.

> > >

> > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this

2nd lord in

> > > lagna logic as well?

> > >

> > > Cheers !!!

> > >

> > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca>

http://www.ashtro.ca

> > >

> > > _____

> > >

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM

> > >

> > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends!

Is

it true?!!!

> > >

> > > Dear Vinita ji,

> > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as

lagna and that

> > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that

Venus gets

> > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female

eunuch.

> > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji

and the mail

> > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi

horas. We need to

> > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the

sage quotes, and

> > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal.

> > >

> > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic.

He

may have 2 or

> > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but

won't have

> > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will

indulge in

> > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will

have much

> > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will

always try to

> > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more

and more money.

> > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech

etc). "

> > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight-

fistedness

> > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful

expenses; it is not

> > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For

useful and right

> > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple

> > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral

attitude, but rather

> > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people

he comes in

> > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women,

due to the too

> > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong

relation (strong as

> > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to

mention - multiple

> > > wives for the native.

> > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in

real

> > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same

combination to share

> > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above

reading.

> > > Love and regards,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > ,

" vinita kumar "

> > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Shreenadh ji,

> > > >

> > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily

be close

> > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again

appreciate

the

> > > > effort

> > > >

> > > > Why should such a person have no son?

> > > >

> > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in

Taurus.

> > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its

feminine

> > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even

sign also

> > > > equal to female??? dunno!

> > > >

> > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming

2nd

house

> > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female

sign.

> > > >

> > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person

may

have 2-

> > > > 3 wives....why and how?

> > > >

> > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first

marriage

or all

> > > > marriages?

> > > >

> > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i

have

heard

> > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the

significator of

> > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so

on...Of

> > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements.

> > > >

> > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH

just as

> > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd.

> > > >

> > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a

sign

of

> > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage.

> > > >

> > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is

the hidden

> > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how

this fits

> > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such

marriages are

> > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection

there.

> > > >

> > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used

the

nh2

> > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in

terms

of

> > > > application.

> > > >

> > > > warm regards,

> > > > vinita

> > > >

> > > > ,

Krishnamurthy

> > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Let me try -

> > > > >

> > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th

being 2nd

> > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence,

might be

> > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one

wife.

> > > > >

> > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart,

it

would be

> > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th

lord in the

> > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of

family

> > > > is not good.

> > > > >

> > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son.

> > > > >

> > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical

case.

The

> > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has

2nd lord

> > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only

child.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Krishna

> > > > >

> > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in

2nd -

> > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives.

> > > > > * He will have NO son!!

> > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out

very

good

> > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful

face,

> > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted

these

grate

> > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He

will

have no

> > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is -

> > > > > * What is the logic behind?

> > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result

derivations

> > > > true in actual experience?

> > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house

every

> > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned

principles

> > > > here. ;=)

> > > > > Love and regards,

> > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > >

> > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast

with

> > > > Search.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> > Now you can chat without downloading messenger. Click here to

know how.

> >

>

January 9, 2008

Dear Sreenadh,

Perfect. Lets keep on discussing.

Knowledge will only grow by sharing and ofcouse with sincere effort and hard

work those are a given.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Wednesday January 9, 2008

6:53 AM

Subject:

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

==>

if u want to keep Jyotish as science then there must be some logical

and concrete reasoning behind all things. That is the search.

<==

True. I know it well and also know that the sages knew it

better than us. So we just have to understand their true

perspective from their own words - which we are doing right now.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

" Ash's Corner "

<kas wrote:

>

> Dear Sreenadh,

>

> I use the theory of Karak. So 5th house is friends but with the

karak of

> 12th means can be a couple. 3rd house is for sahudar or friends

like

> brothers and karak is 10th house. 11th house friends means karak

is 6th so

> legal matters or service like that.

>

> Means there is some concrete and logical reasoning behind this.

Means if u

> want to keep Jyotish as science then there must be some logical

and concrete

> reasoning behind all things. That is the search.

>

> Cheers !!!

>

> Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca>

http://www.ashtro.ca

>

> _____

>

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:28 AM

>

> Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

>

> Dear Ash,

> Actually there are numerous houses that can signify friends -

4th, 11th,

> 3rd, 8th, 7th and so on. If you look care fully you will see that

all the 12

> houses can signify friends. Similar to the fact that all the

12 houses

> can signify love. Have a look at this message:

>

</message/6128>

> /message/6128

> The methodologies uses to find significators etc may vary from

system to

> system - here from ancient indian astrology to KAS. But what we

all are

> interested in is just to know - whether the said results are true

in

> available horoscopes or not. Methods are immaterial but the

results are not.

> Every method/approach will have its own pet theories (which none

else may

> accept), but what ever be the theory - if some thing helps to

reveal the

> true result that is welcome. What we are doing here is NOT

discussing the

> various methodologies and their approach, but instead verifying

whether a

> result provided by Parasara and Lomasa is true or not.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

>

> ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

> <kas@> wrote:

> >

>

> RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

>

> Dear Sreenadh,

>

> For friends u can also take 3rd house as well, i.e. Sahudhar or

like

> brothers for that Karak is 10th house.

>

> For friend though legal means i.e. karak is 6th house so for

example

> Marriage is 7th house, 2nd house is Karak and 11th house is friend

but as a

> result of legal i.e. karak is 6th.

>

> Then 7th becomes karak for 12th house so a person get enjoyment

with wife,

> then 12th becomes karak for 5th so childbirth. Somewhere it is

given in

> some text that marriage is when there is intension to grow family

and have

> child, so here is the logic or let me put it this way that what I

am saying

> is ONE of the way to view things and I am sure every system must

have their

> own approach.

>

> Then when one gets a child then that becomes karak for authority,

i.e. 12th

> house is karak for 5th means mating (12th) is karak for childbirth

(5th),

> once u get a child (5th) that becomes karak for authority (10th),

gives u a

> promotion to Dad, once u get authority then that becomes karak for

your

> Parakram means u will now work harder to support your child and

family, i.e.

> 3rd house, and 3rd becomes karak for 8th house :-) ending the

circle of life

>

> Cheers !!!

>

> Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca/>

http://www.ashtro.ca

>

> _____

>

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM

>

> Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

>

> Dear Ash,

> The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation'

mentioned here

> is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed

pleasures); But

> rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations

within the

> relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses.

> Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and

Venus is the

> lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same

Venus gets

> exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As

per NHT2,

> note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that

Jupiter in

> Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that

house)

> means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use

NHT2, 2nd

> lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna -

Mercury is

> debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting

relation with

> both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation).

Note that

> 11th indicates friendship turned into relation.

>

> Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could

be -

> * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication

of break of

> first marriage is present in horoscope)

> * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation.

> * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in

the

> family relatives/relations

>

> This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd

lord is in

> 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he

would be

> good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost

strong as

> a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere,

does not

> loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for

fulfillment

> (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it,

solid. If even

> by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day

you will

> find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying

life. May

> be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate

this

> derivation.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

> >

> > ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

> > kas@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadh,

> > >

> > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by

2 or 3

> > wives?

> > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so

partner in

> > property

> > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th

house matters

> > > which involves pleasures?

> > >

> > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that

might be a

bigamous

> > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that

he or she

> > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and

divorce

> and

> > > marry 3rd time like that?

> > >

> > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd

lord a person

> > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y

chromosomes so

> that

> > > might be a factor in having more female children.

> > >

> > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart,

then

> mostly

> > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such

persons are

> > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO

where I said

> > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a

mail I think

> in

> > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large

ventures

> to

> > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and

conception

> happens

> > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child.

> > >

> > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this

2nd lord in

> > > lagna logic as well?

> > >

> > > Cheers !!!

> > >

> > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca>

http://www.ashtro.ca

> > >

> > > _____

> > >

On Behalf Of

Sreenadh

> > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM

> > >

> > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends!

Is

it

> true?!!!

> > >

> > > Dear Vinita ji,

> > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as

lagna and that

> > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that

Venus gets

> > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female

eunuch.

> > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji

and the

> mail

> > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi

horas. We need

> > to

> > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the

sage quotes,

> > and

> > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal.

> > >

> > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic.

He

may have 2

> or

> > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but

won't

> have

> > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will

indulge in

> > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will

have much

> > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will

always try to

> > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more

and more

> > money.

> > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech

etc). "

> > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight-

fistedness

> > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful

expenses; it is

> > not

> > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For

useful and

> > right

> > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple

> > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral

attitude, but

> > rather

> > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people

he comes

> in

> > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women,

due to the

> > too

> > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong

relation (strong

> > as

> > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to

mention -

> multiple

> > > wives for the native.

> > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in

real

> > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same

combination to

> > share

> > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above

reading.

> > > Love and regards,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > ,

" vinita kumar "

> > > shankar_mamta@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Shreenadh ji,

> > > >

> > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily

be close

> > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again

appreciate

the

> > > > effort

> > > >

> > > > Why should such a person have no son?

> > > >

> > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in

Taurus.

> > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its

feminine

> > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even

sign also

> > > > equal to female??? dunno!

> > > >

> > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming

2nd

house

> > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female

sign.

> > > >

> > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person

may

have 2-

> > > > 3 wives....why and how?

> > > >

> > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first

marriage

or all

> > > > marriages?

> > > >

> > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i

have

heard

> > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the

significator of

> > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so

on...Of

> > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements.

> > > >

> > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH

just as

> > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd.

> > > >

> > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a

sign

of

> > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage.

> > > >

> > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is

the hidden

> > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how

this fits

> > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such

marriages are

> > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection

there.

> > > >

> > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used

the

nh2

> > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in

terms

of

> > > > application.

> > > >

> > > > warm regards,

> > > > vinita

> > > >

> > > > ,

Krishnamurthy

> > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,

> > > > >

> > > > > Let me try -

> > > > >

> > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th

being 2nd

> > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence,

might be

> > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one

wife.

> > > > >

> > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart,

it

would be

> > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th

lord in the

> > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of

family

> > > > is not good.

> > > > >

> > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son.

> > > > >

> > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical

case.

The

> > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has

2nd lord

> > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only

child.

> > > > >

> > > > > Regards,

> > > > > Krishna

> > > > >

> > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in

2nd -

> > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives.

> > > > > * He will have NO son!!

> > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out

very

good

> > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful

face,

> > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted

these

grate

> > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He

will

have no

> > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is -

> > > > > * What is the logic behind?

> > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result

derivations

> > > > true in actual experience?

> > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house

every

> > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned

principles

> > > > here. ;=)

> > > > > Love and regards,

> > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > >

> > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast

with

> > > > Search.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 9, 2008

Dear Sreenadh,

Wonderfully explained.Â All roads will

lead eventually to the truth.Â We just have to follow a path and keep at it, working

hard and with sincerity and open mind, which is all easier said than done.

Kiran, yes one thing, Â what Krushnaji has

disclosed upto today, is only Timing of Events portion of KAS.Â Still much has

to be covered.Â Krushanji has disclosed this portion, with the assumption that

those learning KAS would first know and be proficient with VA.Â

Then one can use the the lessons that are

given for finding â€œTiming of Eventsâ€.

For example, if in a chart there are no

yogâ€™s for marriage, then how u can time the same?Â So one has to first know the

yogs for marriage and that is expected.

Yes, Krushnaji has given us some special

laws that are NOT available to us in Standard Texts today which work.Â

For example, Ve in Krittika gets spoilt

which is worst for Venus, Venus in nak of sun gets spoilt, Jupiter in Libra

gets spoilt particularly for marriage. Â So such things only Krushanji has

given, but its expected that one knows the VA portion.

Yes, so the focus is in TIMING OF EVENTS

which is NOT given clearly in any of the vedic texts today.Â

The QUALITY of event is totally different

thing.Â So I always keep saying that separate Timing of Event from Quality of

Event.

IF someone asks you the question of â€œWhen

xyz will happen?â€ here we have to answer pin point.

For example, if u see a chart with someones

venus is very spoilt, and u can see that 7th house is disturbed, but

such a person comes to you and puts forward a question â€œWhen will I marry?â€

then you must answer that question.Â Now that might be a different thing that

after marriage there will be a separation (temporary or permanent like divorce

or even death) that is different.

I mean there is so much more still to be

learnt in KAS.Â

Now, w.r.t Vedic Astrology, if you will

notice I will use my path i.e KAS as I am using that in my journey, and try to

co-relate the same in unearthing the meaning of what the sages meant just like

Sreenadh is doing, but I use KAS.

Just somewhere there wasÂ a discusson of

Marnakarak sthan, and Juâ€™s MKS is in 3rd house, so here I study this

w.r.t KAS, so as per KAS and using our laws, a planet that aspects the primary

significator house is defunct from giving result, but its SD will give.Â This

law does not change.Â Now using this law, if I VIEW MKS theory, then Jupiter

from 3rd house will aspect 9th house so it canâ€™t give

result of 9th house.

Its given in VA that many planets in 7th

house then a person is wandring and is more like a child, so if u view that

from the eyes of KAS using the same law, then many planets aspecting 1st

house will not give result of 1st i.e. individuality and their SD (samdharmi)

will give.

Just see the text of Laghu parasari that

Raj yog in MD of yogakarak and in marak then as per KAS we say MD is related to

KARAK so say mars rules 5th and 10th house then in MD of

mars and in antra of 7th lord one will experience good rise if there

are good raj yogs.

If u view the same from KAS and the laws,

the MD is related to karaktwa so in 5th lord natural is leo so Sun

is karak for authority and if mars is 5th and 10th lord

then in Mars MD will have flavour for 10th house as 5th is

karak and 3rd house as 10th is karak so effort, parakram

and also authority.Â Now in antra of 7th house (marak) means 10th

from 10th house so as per KAS, its LoD or 10th from 10th

the person will get more authority.Â

Now the level of rise is different, one

might be a havaldar and might get promoted to supervisor, in other case one

might be a senior official might be promoted or might be given a higher

authority or something like that that is totally different but as far as timing

of event is concerned and if someone comes and asks u about â€œWhen I will get

promotion?â€ then u can reply pin point.

Regarding Quality its different thing.Â

That will depend on the status of Karak and so many other factors, like intelligence,

capacity to work hard, somewhere I read â€œHard work without ambition is like a

bird without wingsâ€ so all such things must be taken into consideration.

Now sun is the karak for Authority, that

Sreenadh knows, Kiran knows, I know, but why, is what I study based on that

path I have chosen and try to discuss that view point without writing too much

KAS Lingua.

I hope its clear.

One thing u also must note, and Sreenadh

has written it and covered it that, mostly all Maharishis have spoken about

Ashtakavarga, but donâ€™t you find it surprising on why not much info is there.

It would take 3 days before computers to

manually compute all the charts and data needed to get ready to make a prediction.Â

If some astrologers were using this as business means to earn a living then

what they will feed their family.

So all thatâ€™s remained is the reference to

Ashtakavarga but over time all this got lost.Â Same for Nadi too.Â Its not easy

to make all these computations.Â Just think about it.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Wednesday January 9, 2008

12:10 PM

Subject:

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Kiran ji,

Our understanding of Ashtaka Varga system is limited -

that too is a very elaborate system and perfected by many in various

ways. Unlike any other Ashtaka varga school, KAS is a long tradition -

unique in its own respect. Please don't try to see rishi hora

methods in it - every

approach has its own dictom and when one try to understand a system followed by

a particular tradition we SHOULD think as they do, and follow their

foundations. The same holds true for Nadi, KP, Lal Kitab, Tajik,

Ashtakavarga (here KAS) and Jaimini system. In

all those systems you will encounter may rules and fundamental concepts

contradicting ancient indian astrology and Rishi hora quotes, but that DOES NOT

make them invalid - but instead makes them unique - a different approach.

When followed in their true sense all those

methods can lead us to right results. Know this as a fact - and I repeat - please DON'T try see

Rishi hora methods in them; they are part of different tradition or school of

astrology; a different parmapara. Astrology is NOT a science but only

'advice imparted to us by ancient traditions' and know that whether we divide

light as 'Red- Green-Blue' or 'Cyan-Yellow-Magenta' any of those 3 colors

together will form the white light. The significance attributed to

various signs, houses and planets may differ as per various systems; but when

treated together they all speak about the same whole picture, helping us

to arrive at right conclusions.

I am

not discussing or quoting Ashtaka varga principles neither because it is not

dependable nor because I don't appreciate the methodology; but only because the

available quotes from lost Rishi horas and the available Rishi horas

(prior to Mihira) DOES NOT speak about Ashtaka Varga - and also because this

group concentrate on Ancient Indian Astrology as Rishi Horas puts it. Thus

as far as my quest is concerned the same is not relevant - but NOTE IT the

system is truly relevant and useful, and KAS (since it has the power of a long

traditon) truly unique and should be appreciated. The same statement goes

in support of - Nadi, Lal Kitab,Tajik and Jaimini system as well.

KP is appreciated since it tried to reconstruct the lost system of

ancient 'Stellar Astrology' in a new way.

Also note that in the whole of astrology groups,

'' deserve a special praise because it is one of the

rare calm and sincere group which concentrates on the study, understanding and

improvement of the traditional system they follow. There is only a handful of

such groups on astrology in the net, and learn to appreciate them, whether you

want to follow them or not.

* When a Lal Kitab astrologer comes to you and tells you and tell

you that the significance of the planet changes from house to house - you would

be wonder struck.

* When KAS presents some special principles differentiating Karak for

house and Karak planet- you would be wonder struck.

* When a nadi astrologer comes to you, when the significance he

associates with planets and houses does not match with your understanding - you

would be wonder struck.

* When KP starts ascribing the numerous stars, star lords and sublords

and speak about sensitive points and ruling planets - you would be wonder

struck.

* When Tajik astrologer starts speaking about various yogas

with absurd sounding names such as Ikkavali and Induvara - you would be wonder

struck.

* When a Jaimini astrologer comes to you and start speaking

about Atma karaka, Amatya karaka, Prana pada, varnada lagna, argala,

Chara dasa and so on - you would be wonder struck.

But (NOTE IT) the mistakes

lies with you - because you are TRYING TO MIX SYSTEMS which is sure to lead to

contradictions and confusions; you are trying to view AIA in other unique

systems has credit of their own and ARE valuable. Note that Remesh Mishra ji has already highlighted this point

correct (check below) and this is what we should be beware of.

Hope you will see the point. So first select 'what you want to

learn', 'which system you find intelligible, easy to understand, and useful' -

and then follow that and NEVER mix various system - making a Kichadi out of the

same. :=)

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

Kiran R <kiran.rama wrote:

>

> I agree with Sreenadhji.

>

> Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what

Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika.

> Similar is story in BPHS and other classics.

>

> Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is

benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points - like

lagna, and all planets.

>

> So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages.

> I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail

and also go through various classics

>

> Thanks

> Kiran

>

> Sreenadh sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji,

> Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right -

> and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be

> in a hurry.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

>

> ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

> kas@ wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh,

> >

> > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question

> that worries me is that Ã¢â‚¬Å“What did parasara actually say and teach

> v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts

> today?Ã¢â‚¬Â. If there is a difference and if everyone is following

> that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually

> practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some

> discrepancy there.

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> >

> > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca

> >

> > _____

> >

>

On Behalf Of

> Sreenadh

> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM

> >

> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is

it

> true?!!!

> >

> > Dear Remesh ji,

> > ==>

> > > Both of you are correct your own way.

> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.

> > <==

> > You are absolutely right.

> >

> > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the

> methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us

> denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of

> Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the

> systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be)

> interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known

> horoscopes or not.

> > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to

> state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to

> emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬ " for

> sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of

> fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other

> supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just

> because of this combination the said result should fructify; but

> this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the

> statemnt of those sages.

> > Love and regards,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > ,

ramesh mishra

> <aarceemastro2002@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh,

> > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way.

> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.

> > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not

> wrong.

> > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is

> second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage.

> > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages.

> > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with

> Ma. Sa and Ra.

> > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs.

> > > Thanks and regards.

> > > Ramesh Mishra

> > >

January 9, 2008

Dear Krishna,

That is where there lies is a

difference.

For death of father, 4th house

is karak sthan and for death of mother 10th house is karak sthan

i.e. 8th from respective house. That would indicate that house

of mother is 3rd and that of father is 9th.

In any case, this difference is noted and

let us hope that Sreenadh can unearth something from the ancient texts. I

am giving this as per concrete logic as I have understood.

I shall wait for someone to give a

concrete logic behind that as well and not philosophical.

In any case Krishna,

I have penned down my thoughts as well that there might be some difference

there as well eh. So in due course of time, it might get sorted out.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama

Wednesday January 9, 2008

2:45 AM

RE:

RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

If I have understood it correctly, he has given 4th lord as karaka for

mother and 10th lord as karaka for father.

Regards,

Krishna

" Ash's

Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas

wrote:

Dear Krishna,

Did Parasara mean 10th house

stands for mothers death and 4th house for fathers death or in short

4th house as karak for father and 10th as karak sthan for

mother? Is that a possibility? Is that what Parasara meant?

4th house would control

the status of 9th house the house of father and same way, 10th

house would control the status of 3rd house, in the same way 3rd

house controls the status of 8th house or 2nd house

controls the status of 7th house as they are Karak sthan?

Is it possible?

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy

Seetharama

Wednesday January 9, 2008

12:30 AM

RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

If I remember correctly, Parashara says take 4th as mother and

10th as father. But again, 1-5-9 fits so well with self-child-father. This is

something that should be looked into in detail.

Regards,

Krishna

" Ash's

Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas

wrote:

Dear Sreenadh,

I take 3rd house as

mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father.

Why 4th house is taken

as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. against symmetry I am not

too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this mystery in why such things

have happened.

The true test will be to time the

death of father and mother.

If 4th house is mother

than death of mother must be from 11th house. If 3rd

is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th

is father than death must be from 5th house and if 9th is

then from 4th house.

If u can find out the consistent

laws of death that work then we can test this, otherwise in KAS the laws are

there that also we can check and those should.

That will confirm many things

especially why what the Sages actually said v/s what is in the books today

might be very different.

So many thoughts going on in my

mind, just trying to pen those down. So bear with me.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:17

AM

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

==>

> How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other

way, I have not

> understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house?

> 2nd

house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear

> with that either.

<==

Could be - but that is well popular classical dictum.

Ask any astrologer he will tell you that 4th house signify maternal family and

2nd own family - because there are numerous classical quotes that

describe/clarify the same.

* 4th house signify mother, maternal family, relatives,

friends, and natives (people in native place).

* 2nd house signify 'Swam' (anything that is our own), 'Bhartavyam

Akhilam vittam' (any treasure/money or other things we rule), own family (means

the family of our own with wife/husband and children). Bharta (husband)

means - ruler; we rule our own family our own wife, our own children. 2nd

house indicates own family is a very very popular common info well described in

Brihat Jataka, Prasnamarga and many more texts. 2nd house can signify 2nd

marriage this too is well described in many classics.

==>

> However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the

boundaries and

> have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person,

status of

> venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs.

<==

I agree - other supporting yogas (like in all the other cases) can help

us emphasis such readings and result; but that does not answer the question -

whether such a combination indicate such a result or not.

==>

> In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all

such persons will have multiple

> marriages etc might not hold true in all charts.

<==

I agree that in presence of Bhanga yogas the above combination may not

hold true in all the charts; but the question is whether the said combination

has such a tendency and whether the statement hold true in most of

the charts - i.e. at least 6/10. Only the response of the group members

can help us identify this - and not theoretical argumentation. Note that

-

* The RESULT is proposed by the sages and we only provide

the logical reasoning (EXPLANATION) for the same.

* What we need to confirm is - whether the results proposed by the sages

for this combination, actualize in reality or not; so as to confirm -

whether we can depend on that derivation or not. So let the people

with actual experience, or people with charts having the same combination,

or people who have familiar charts with the same

combination come forward and clarify our doubt - and let us stay away for some

time from argumentation regarding the same; Because the RESULT is NOT proposed

by me; but only the EXPLANATION. As practical astrologers we shouldn't

be much concerned about the 'explanation' which depends on individual

intellectual acumen, but about the RESULTS - we need to be sure, 'whether

we can depend on them or not'; and it is NOT me who is proposing

those results - and so I am not bothered even if they are right or

wrong. Hope I am making my stand clear.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

" Ash's Corner " <kas wrote:

RE: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

Dear Sreenadh,

I do not think we are on the same

wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in

upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from

Taurus. That is correct.

But for a person to have extra marital

relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and

character must be such. There must be problems or some such things

indicating.

Here 2nd house means karak for

marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or

Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it

means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means

disturbed 7th house.

However for a person to break the marital

bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be

indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short

more yogs.

2nd house as per your mail, you

wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House

and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb

or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back

in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house

in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too.

How are u linking home to 2nd

house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have

u linked Home to 2nd house?

2nd house is 10th

from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd

or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house.

Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her

degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery.

For a person to have romantic relation, he

or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa

or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more

passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord

runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen

that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju

aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other

influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person.

In all cases if 2nd lord is in

2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc

might not hold true in all charts.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

> _____

>

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

> Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM

>

> Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

>

> Dear Ash,

> The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here

> is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But

> rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within

the

> relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses.

> Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the

> lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets

> exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per

NHT2,

> note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in

> Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house)

> means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd

> lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury

is

> debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation

with

> both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation).

Note that

> 11th indicates friendship turned into relation.

>

> Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be -

> * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of

> first marriage is present in horoscope)

> * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation.

> * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the

> family relatives/relations

>

> This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is

in

> 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be

> good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong

as

> a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does

not

> loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment

> (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If

even

> by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will

> find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May

> be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this

> derivation.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

>

> ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

> kas@ wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh,

> >

> > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3

> wives?

> > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in

> property

> > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house

matters

> > which involves pleasures?

> >

> > If a person say in India as 2

or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous

> > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or

she

> > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and

divorce and

> > marry 3rd time like that?

> >

> > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a

person

> > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so

that

> > might be a factor in having more female children.

> >

> > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then

mostly

> > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons

are

> > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I

said

> > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think

in

> > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large

ventures to

> > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception

happens

> > then there are MORE chances of having a female child.

> >

> > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord

in

> > lagna logic as well?

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> >

> > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca

> >

> > _____

> >

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM

> >

> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is

it true?!!!

> >

> > Dear Vinita ji,

> > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and

that

> > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus

gets

> > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch.

> > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail

> > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We

need

> to

> > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage

quotes,

> and

> > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal.

> >

> > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may

have 2 or

> > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't

have

> > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in

> > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have

much

> > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always

try to

> > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more

> money.

> > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech

etc). "

> > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The

tight-fistedness

> > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it

is

> not

> > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and

> right

> > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple

> > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but

> rather

> > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he

comes in

> > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to

the

> too

> > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation

(strong

> as

> > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention -

multiple

> > wives for the native.

> > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real

> > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to

> share

> > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading.

> > Love and regards,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > ,

" vinita kumar "

> > shankar_mamta@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Shreenadh ji,

> > >

> > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be

close

> > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the

> > > effort

> > >

> > > Why should such a person have no son?

> > >

> > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus.

> > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine

> > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign

also

> > > equal to female??? dunno!

> > >

> > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd

house

> > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign.

> > >

> > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may

have 2-

> > > 3 wives....why and how?

> > >

> > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage

or all

> > > marriages?

> > >

> > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have

heard

> > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the

significator of

> > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so

on...Of

> > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements.

> > >

> > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just

as

> > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd.

> > >

> > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of

> > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage.

> > >

> > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the

hidden

> > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this

fits

> > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages

are

> > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection

there.

> > >

> > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2

> > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of

> > > application.

> > >

> > > warm regards,

> > > vinita

> > >

> > > ,

Krishnamurthy

> > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,

> > > >

> > > > Let me try -

> > > >

> > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th

being 2nd

> > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be

> > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife.

> > > >

> > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it

would be

> > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in

the

> > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of

family

> > > is not good.

> > > >

> > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son.

> > > >

> > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The

> > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd

lord

> > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Krishna

> > > >

> > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > Dear All,

> > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd -

> > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives.

> > > > * He will have NO son!!

> > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very

good

> > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful

face,

> > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted

these grate

> > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will

have no

> > > son " ?!! The quiz question is -

> > > > * What is the logic behind?

> > > > And the verification question is - Is that result

derivations

> > > true in actual experience?

> > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house

every

> > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles

> > > here. ;=)

> > > > Love and regards,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with

> > > Search.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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January 9, 2008

Dear Krishna,

I juts had an epiphany. The sages have

used in many cases Karak and Phal sthan to denote a house. For example, Marak

house is referred to as 2nd and 7th house. So 7th

house is phal sthan and so its Karak who is 2nd house is also

referred to as Karak.

So its quite possible that 4th house

and 10th house are referred in that context as well as 4th

house is karak for 9th and 10th house is karak for 3rd.

Interesting.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama

Wednesday January 9, 2008

2:45 AM

RE:

RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

If I have understood it correctly, he has given 4th lord as karaka for

mother and 10th lord as karaka for father.

Regards,

Krishna

" Ash's

Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas

wrote:

Dear Krishna,

Did Parasara mean 10th

house stands for mothers death and 4th house for fathers death or in

short 4th house as karak for father and 10th as karak

sthan for mother? Is that a possibility? Is that what Parasara

meant?

4th house would control

the status of 9th house the house of father and same way, 10th

house would control the status of 3rd house, in the same way 3rd

house controls the status of 8th house or 2nd house

controls the status of 7th house as they are Karak sthan?

Is it possible?

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy

Seetharama

Wednesday January 9, 2008

12:30 AM

RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

If I remember correctly, Parashara says take 4th as mother and

10th as father. But again, 1-5-9 fits so well with self-child-father. This is

something that should be looked into in detail.

Regards,

Krishna

" Ash's

Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas

wrote:

Dear Sreenadh,

I take 3rd house as

mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father.

Why 4th house is taken

as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. against symmetry I am not

too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this mystery in why such things

have happened.

The true test will be to time the

death of father and mother.

If 4th house is mother

than death of mother must be from 11th house. If 3rd

is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th

is father than death must be from 5th house and if 9th is

then from 4th house.

If u can find out the consistent

laws of death that work then we can test this, otherwise in KAS the laws are

there that also we can check and those should.

That will confirm many things

especially why what the Sages actually said v/s what is in the books today

might be very different.

So many thoughts going on in my

mind, just trying to pen those down. So bear with me.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:17

AM

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

==>

> How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other

way, I have not

> understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house?

> 2nd

house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear

> with that either.

<==

Could be - but that is well popular classical dictum.

Ask any astrologer he will tell you that 4th house signify maternal family and

2nd own family - because there are numerous classical quotes that

describe/clarify the same.

* 4th house signify mother, maternal family, relatives,

friends, and natives (people in native place).

* 2nd house signify 'Swam' (anything that is our own), 'Bhartavyam

Akhilam vittam' (any treasure/money or other things we rule), own family (means

the family of our own with wife/husband and children). Bharta (husband)

means - ruler; we rule our own family our own wife, our own children. 2nd

house indicates own family is a very very popular common info well described in

Brihat Jataka, Prasnamarga and many more texts. 2nd house can signify 2nd

marriage this too is well described in many classics.

==>

> However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the

boundaries and

> have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person,

status of

> venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs.

<==

I agree - other supporting yogas (like in all the other cases) can help

us emphasis such readings and result; but that does not answer the question -

whether such a combination indicate such a result or not.

==>

> In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all

such persons will have multiple

> marriages etc might not hold true in all charts.

<==

I agree that in presence of Bhanga yogas the above combination may not

hold true in all the charts; but the question is whether the said combination

has such a tendency and whether the statement hold true in most of

the charts - i.e. at least 6/10. Only the response of the group members

can help us identify this - and not theoretical argumentation. Note that

-

* The RESULT is proposed by the sages and we only provide

the logical reasoning (EXPLANATION) for the same.

* What we need to confirm is - whether the results proposed by the sages

for this combination, actualize in reality or not; so as to confirm -

whether we can depend on that derivation or not. So let the people

with actual experience, or people with charts having the same combination,

or people who have familiar charts with the same

combination come forward and clarify our doubt - and let us stay away for some

time from argumentation regarding the same; Because the RESULT is NOT proposed

by me; but only the EXPLANATION. As practical astrologers we shouldn't

be much concerned about the 'explanation' which depends on individual

intellectual acumen, but about the RESULTS - we need to be sure, 'whether

we can depend on them or not'; and it is NOT me who is proposing

those results - and so I am not bothered even if they are right or

wrong. Hope I am making my stand clear.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

" Ash's Corner " <kas wrote:

RE: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

Dear Sreenadh,

I do not think we are on the same

wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in

upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from

Taurus. That is correct.

But for a person to have extra marital relationship

he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be

such. There must be problems or some such things indicating.

Here 2nd house means karak for

marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or

Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it

means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means

disturbed 7th house.

However for a person to break the marital

bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be

indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short

more yogs.

2nd house as per your mail, you

wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House

and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb

or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back

in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house

in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too.

How are u linking home to 2nd

house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have

u linked Home to 2nd house?

2nd house is 10th

from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd

or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house.

Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her

degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery.

For a person to have romantic relation, he

or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa

or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more

passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord

runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen

that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju

aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other

influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person.

In all cases if 2nd lord is in

2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc

might not hold true in all charts.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

> _____

>

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

> Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM

>

> Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it

true?!!!

>

> Dear Ash,

> The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here

> is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But

> rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within

the

> relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses.

> Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the

> lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets

> exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per

NHT2,

> note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in

> Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house)

> means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd

> lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury

is

> debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with

> both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation).

Note that

> 11th indicates friendship turned into relation.

>

> Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be -

> * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of

> first marriage is present in horoscope)

> * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation.

> * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the

> family relatives/relations

>

> This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is

in

> 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be

> good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong

as

> a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does

not

> loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment

> (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If

even

> by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will

> find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May

> be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this

> derivation.

> Love and regards,

> Sreenadh

>

> ,

" Ash's Corner@ "

> kas@ wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sreenadh,

> >

> > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3

> wives?

> > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in

> property

> > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house

matters

> > which involves pleasures?

> >

> > If a person say in India as 2

or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous

> > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or

she

> > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and

divorce and

> > marry 3rd time like that?

> >

> > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a

person

> > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so

that

> > might be a factor in having more female children.

> >

> > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then

mostly

> > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons

are

> > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I

said

> > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I

think in

> > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large

ventures to

> > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception

happens

> > then there are MORE chances of having a female child.

> >

> > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord

in

> > lagna logic as well?

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> >

> > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca

> >

> > _____

> >

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM

> >

> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is

it true?!!!

> >

> > Dear Vinita ji,

> > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and

that

> > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus

gets

> > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch.

> > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail

> > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need

> to

> > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage

quotes,

> and

> > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal.

> >

> > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may

have 2 or

> > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't

have

> > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in

> > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have

much

> > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always

try to

> > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more

> money.

> > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech

etc). "

> > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The

tight-fistedness

> > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it

is

> not

> > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and

> right

> > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple

> > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but

> rather

> > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he

comes in

> > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to

the

> too

> > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation

(strong

> as

> > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention -

multiple

> > wives for the native.

> > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real

> > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to

> share

> > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading.

> > Love and regards,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > ,

" vinita kumar "

> > shankar_mamta@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Shreenadh ji,

> > >

> > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be

close

> > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the

> > > effort

> > >

> > > Why should such a person have no son?

> > >

> > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus.

> > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine

> > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign

also

> > > equal to female??? dunno!

> > >

> > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd

house

> > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign.

> > >

> > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may

have 2-

> > > 3 wives....why and how?

> > >

> > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage

or all

> > > marriages?

> > >

> > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have

heard

> > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the

significator of

> > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so

on...Of

> > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements.

> > >

> > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just

as

> > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd.

> > >

> > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of

> > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage.

> > >

> > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the

hidden

> > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this

fits

> > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages

are

> > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection

there.

> > >

> > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2

> > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of

> > > application.

> > >

> > > warm regards,

> > > vinita

> > >

> > > ,

Krishnamurthy

> > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,

> > > >

> > > > Let me try -

> > > >

> > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th

being 2nd

> > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be

> > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife.

> > > >

> > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it

would be

> > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in

the

> > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of

family

> > > is not good.

> > > >

> > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son.

> > > >

> > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The

> > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd

lord

> > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child.

> > > >

> > > > Regards,

> > > > Krishna

> > > >

> > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > Dear All,

> > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd -

> > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives.

> > > > * He will have NO son!!

> > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very

good

> > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful

face,

> > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted

these grate

> > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will

have no

> > > son " ?!! The quiz question is -

> > > > * What is the logic behind?

> > > > And the verification question is - Is that result

derivations

> > > true in actual experience?

> > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house

every

> > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles

> > > here. ;=)

> > > > Love and regards,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with

> > > Search.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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January 9, 2008

Dear Sreenadh,

These are philosophical things. What are

concrete facts.

Is sun father or is Ju father? If 10th

hosue is taken for father than Sa must be father.

Too many fathers lol… just kidding….

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Wednesday January 9, 2008

4:20 AM

Subject:

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Ash,

Read the previous mail, and the document 'Lagna lord in various

houses'. As per AIA 4th is mother because the 4th house in NH is

owned by Moon, and it is due to the same reason that Ju is guru and

father. Also, Sun is Siva the father of the universe and everything

and so the significator of father, and Moon is Sakti (Parvati) the

mother of the universe and everything and so the significator of

mother.

Love and regards,

Sreenadh

,

" Ash's Corner "

<kas wrote:

>

> Dear Sreenadh,

>

> I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father.

>

> Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e.

against

> symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this

mystery in

> why such things have happened.

>

> The true test will be to time the death of father and mother.

>

> If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th

house. If 3rd

> is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is

father than

> death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house.

>

> If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we

can test

> this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check

and those

> should.

>

> That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages

actually said

> v/s what is in the books today might be very different.

>

> So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those

down. So

> bear with me.

>

> Cheers !!!

>

> Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca>

http://www.ashtro.ca

>

January 9, 2008

Hare rama krishna ,

dear ash .

Namaskar

The mystery or intricasy of house of father is always intriguing and we dont know why majority of rishis or may be their commentaters took as 9th house for father than 10th house ,i mean in available literature .

Yes some parampara and regions took 10th for father .

The universal pitru karaka is sun also he is universal atma karaka .

even in beeja sphutta calculations and kshetra sphutta calculations sun and jup is participating in beeja ( male virility ) and moon and jup is participating for female virility ( kshetra sphutta )

so common One is jup and sun is included for males and moon also included for females ,ya calculation i am not discussing here as it may make the mail so legthy .

9th house stands for luck ,dharma ,guru .According to indian tradition father is instigatr and the one who is taking u to guru and he is also guru after mother .

also if u see every ones luck is a good father .I find in charts with 9th lord is afflicted or gone to 8th ,they hav a unlucky father ,or they get adopted or some thing happening to the early rise in child hood .

if u take 10th then the dasa s in 11th and 4th shud be maraka for father .

with ayanamsa u follows may be ur correct .

Some schools in south they take sani for karaka for father for nite births .

since i follow karaka/house /Lord scheme in timing events and general observation of strenght charts ,i find 9th is consistently following it ,may be some stray charts i dont know .

offcource the transits ,and karaka sun s place ments also has a major say .Even in majority of nadis also follows this system and u know also better as ur guru parampara also is following some nadi principles .

,May be this thought of 9th happened because the father is thought as provider and who can be lucky for kid .Also may according to the upachaya theorey which ur school follws 6th from 4th is also 9th ( i dont know much abt prmary or secondary upachaya and u can explain better as i am always open and inquisiv)

Also 9th is important laxmi stana and trikona and dharma trikona .

my 2 annas .

regrds sunil nair

om shreem mahalaxmai namah .

, "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh,> > > > These are philosophical things. What are concrete facts.> > > > Is sun father or is Ju father? If 10th hosue is taken for father than Sa> must be father.> > > > Too many fathers lol. just kidding..> > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca/> http://www.ashtro.ca> > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh> Wednesday January 9, 2008 4:20 AM> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > > > Dear Ash,> Read the previous mail, and the document 'Lagna lord in various > houses'. As per AIA 4th is mother because the 4th house in NH is > owned by Moon, and it is due to the same reason that Ju is guru and > father. Also, Sun is Siva the father of the universe and everything > and so the significator of father, and Moon is Sakti (Parvati) the > mother of the universe and everything and so the significator of > mother. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ <%40>> astrology , "Ash's Corner@" > kas@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. > > > > > > > > Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. > against> > symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this > mystery in> > why such things have happened.> > > > The true test will be to time the death of father and mother.> > > > If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th > house. If 3rd> > is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is > father than> > death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house.> > > > > > > > If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we > can test> > this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check > and those> > should. > > > > > > > > That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages > actually said> > v/s what is in the books today might be very different.> > > > > > > > So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those > down. So> > bear with me.> > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro. <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca> http://www.ashtro.> <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca> >>

January 9, 2008

Dear Sreenadh,

You have talked about blind charts. I

would like to give my opinion here.

Your idea is good, but to reach that stage

u must first get the laws.

Trying to solve blind charts, first, might

be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.

So, for example, say u took 2nd

lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first

get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what

circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel.

Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100

charts from members and see all points are covered.

Then u can do a blind chart to see if that

technique holds.

Otherwise, what are u testing?

If you had tested your 2nd lord

in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how

many points you would have got.

You should find out the entire law of 2nd

lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and

then do a blind chart focusing on the law.

In the mean time collect some charts that

have perfect time recorded to test the laws.

Cheers !!!

Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca

On Behalf Of Sreenadh

Wednesday January 9, 2008

10:58 AM

Subject:

Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!

Dear Remesh Mishra ji,

That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable

points.

==>

> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different

methodology but our

> main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have

missed the correct aim.

<==

I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical

astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that

fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts

put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts

'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means

the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is

what important and not the various methodologies/approaches. What

ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct

result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be

appreciated.

==>

> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the

correct target.

> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion.

> With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .

<==

Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here.

==>

> we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members

to prove it with

> suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.

<==

Right you said.

==>

> For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to

justify the event

> taking help of dictum of ancient sages.

<==

You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart

reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be

rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the

approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from

sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by

the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole

exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only

students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its

approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this

group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results -

so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations.

==>

> These books written by sages during their dates were translated in

different languages according to their own understanding.

> Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the

originals are either mutilated or lost.

<==

But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost

Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own

understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve

the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based

on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient'

indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the

group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it

is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though

any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome

in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like

KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system,

Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there

but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient indian astrology -

the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi

Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to

concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/approach - as

they put it.