Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 I agree with Sreenadhji.Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika.Similar is story in BPHS and other classics.Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points - like lagna, and all planets.So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages.I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail and also go through various classicsThanksKiranSreenadh <sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji, Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be in a hurry. Love and regards, Sreenadh , "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question that worries me is that “What did parasara actually say and teach v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts today?â€. If there is a difference and if everyone is following that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some discrepancy there. > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Remesh ji, > ==> > > Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > <== > You are absolutely right. > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known horoscopes or not. > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that â€" for sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just because of this combination the said result should fructify; but this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the statemnt of those sages. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@> wrote: > > > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh, > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not wrong. > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage. > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages. > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with Ma. Sa and Ra. > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs. > > Thanks and regards. > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from Taurus. That is correct. > > > > But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be such. There must be problems or some such things indicating. > > > > Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th house. > > > > However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. > > > > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too. > > > > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? > > > > > > 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery. > > > > For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person. > > > > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > Dear Ash, > > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be - > > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of first marriage is present in horoscope) > > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the family relatives/relations > > > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that "if 2nd lord is in 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as a marriage". It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this derivation. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 wives? > > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in property > > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous > > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce and > > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so that > > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then mostly > > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think in > > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures to > > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception happens > > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail > > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need to > > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, and > > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 or > > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't have > > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc)." > > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight- fistedness > > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is not > > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and right > > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but rather > > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes in > > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the too > > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong as > > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - multiple > > > wives for the native. > > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to share > > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , "vinita kumar" > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > > effort > > > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus. > > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > > marriages? > > > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the significator of > > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. > > > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > > application. > > > > > > > > warm regards, > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being 2nd > > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > > results such as "good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > > earnings" etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - "He will have no > > > > son"?!! The quiz question is - > > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result derivations > > > > true in actual experience? > > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > > here. ;=) > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now you can chat without downloading messenger. Click here to know how. > > > 5, 50, 500, 5000 - Store N number of mails in your inbox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Remesh Mishra ji, That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. ==> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim. <== I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. ==> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target. > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean . <== Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. ==> > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology. <== Right you said. ==> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event > taking help of dictum of ancient sages. <== You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. ==> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding. > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost. <== But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/approach - as they put it. ==> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event. > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public. > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too. <== Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. ==> > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H. <== Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. Love and regards, Sreenadh , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002 wrote:>> Dear respected all learnades,> It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> He may not be getting support from his father.> He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> Is all this correct or incorrect ?> Thanks and regards.> Ramesh Mishra > > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote:> Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> ==>> Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> <==> There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > > , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> >> > Dear Ash,> > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > All the best!> > > > Regards,> > Krishna> > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca> >> > > > > > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Kiran ji, Our understanding of Ashtaka Varga system is limited - that too is a very elaborate system and perfected by many in various ways. Unlike any other Ashtaka varga school, KAS is a long tradition - unique in its own respect. Please don't try to see rishi hora methods in it - every approach has its own dictom and when one try to understand a system followed by a particular tradition we SHOULD think as they do, and follow their foundations. The same holds true for Nadi, KP, Lal Kitab, Tajik, Ashtakavarga (here KAS) and Jaimini system. In all those systems you will encounter may rules and fundamental concepts contradicting ancient indian astrology and Rishi hora quotes, but that DOES NOT make them invalid - but instead makes them unique - a different approach. When followed in their true sense all those methods can lead us to right results. Know this as a fact - and I repeat - please DON'T try see Rishi hora methods in them; they are part of different tradition or school of astrology; a different parmapara. Astrology is NOT a science but only 'advice imparted to us by ancient traditions' and know that whether we divide light as 'Red- Green-Blue' or 'Cyan-Yellow-Magenta' any of those 3 colors together will form the white light. The significance attributed to various signs, houses and planets may differ as per various systems; but when treated together they all speak about the same whole picture, helping us to arrive at right conclusions. I am not discussing or quoting Ashtaka varga principles neither because it is not dependable nor because I don't appreciate the methodology; but only because the available quotes from lost Rishi horas and the available Rishi horas (prior to Mihira) DOES NOT speak about Ashtaka Varga - and also because this group concentrate on Ancient Indian Astrology as Rishi Horas puts it. Thus as far as my quest is concerned the same is not relevant - but NOTE IT the system is truly relevant and useful, and KAS (since it has the power of a long traditon) truly unique and should be appreciated. The same statement goes in support of - Nadi, Lal Kitab,Tajik and Jaimini system as well. KP is appreciated since it tried to reconstruct the lost system of ancient 'Stellar Astrology' in a new way. Also note that in the whole of astrology groups, '' deserve a special praise because it is one of the rare calm and sincere group which concentrates on the study, understanding and improvement of the traditional system they follow. There is only a handful of such groups on astrology in the net, and learn to appreciate them, whether you want to follow them or not. * When a Lal Kitab astrologer comes to you and tells you and tell you that the significance of the planet changes from house to house - you would be wonder struck. * When KAS presents some special principles differentiating Karak for house and Karak planet- you would be wonder struck. * When a nadi astrologer comes to you, when the significance he associates with planets and houses does not match with your understanding - you would be wonder struck. * When KP starts ascribing the numerous stars, star lords and sublords and speak about sensitive points and ruling planets - you would be wonder struck. * When Tajik astrologer starts speaking about various yogas with absurd sounding names such as Ikkavali and Induvara - you would be wonder struck. * When a Jaimini astrologer comes to you and start speaking about Atma karaka, Amatya karaka, Prana pada, varnada lagna, argala, Chara dasa and so on - you would be wonder struck. But (NOTE IT) the mistakes lies with you - because you are TRYING TO MIX SYSTEMS which is sure to lead to contradictions and confusions; you are trying to view AIA in other unique systems has credit of their own and ARE valuable. Note that Remesh Mishra ji has already highlighted this point correct (check below) and this is what we should be beware of. Hope you will see the point. So first select 'what you want to learn', 'which system you find intelligible, easy to understand, and useful' - and then follow that and NEVER mix various system - making a Kichadi out of the same. :=) Love and regards, Sreenadh , Kiran R <kiran.rama wrote:>> I agree with Sreenadhji.> > Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika.> Similar is story in BPHS and other classics.> > Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points - like lagna, and all planets.> > So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages.> I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail and also go through various classics> > Thanks> Kiran> > Sreenadh sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji,> Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - > and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be > in a hurry. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh > > , "Ash's Corner@" > kas@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question > that worries me is that “What did parasara actually say and teach > v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts > today?â€. If there is a difference and if everyone is following > that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually > practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some > discrepancy there.> > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca> > > > _____ > > > > > On Behalf Of > Sreenadh> > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM> > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it > true?!!!> > > > > > > > Dear Remesh ji,> > ==>> > > Both of you are correct your own way.> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.> > <== > > You are absolutely right. > > > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the > methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us > denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of > Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the > systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) > interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known > horoscopes or not. > > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to > state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to > emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that â€" for > sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of > fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other > supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just > because of this combination the said result should fructify; but > this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the > statemnt of those sages. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > , ramesh mishra > <aarceemastro2002@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh,> > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way.> > > But the problem is, mixing two different system.> > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not > wrong.> > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is > second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage.> > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages.> > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with > Ma. Sa and Ra.> > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs.> > > Thanks and regards.> > > Ramesh Mishra> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, I don’t think u understood what I was trying to say, Oh I don’t doubt that what our ancient seers taught us is not correct. However my emphasis is on “What Words of the Sages?â€. How do we know for sure that what the sages said and what is translated in English today are same. That can’t be assumed. So, let me clarify, that what our ancient seers and sages taught was perfect, but what we have today cannot be said that that is exactly what the sages taught. So just quoting blindly using incomplete texts,  by translators who might not have grasped the essence of what the real meaning of the shokes were meant to be, inability to interpret it w.r.t point in time, i.e. for example, somewhere its given that Ju in 4th house means elephants at door step, now that has to be translated in todays worlds as maybe chauffer derive limousine or something like that, and even one step before that, has the exact shloke been written done exactly as the way our ancient seers have said? Back then the medium of teaching was verbal so someone at some point might have documented all this. So many layers of area where interpretation might go wrong. In reference to your comment about having patience, to that I have to say that I have decided when I started learning Jyotish, so not to worry, it’s a life long journey (or several lifetimes), but the only way in my opinion to do justice to our ancient seers is to make accurate prediction, by that I mean, 80-100% of charts must be read accurately.  That would automatically imply that what they taught and what we have understood is perfect J That and only that is and can be the truth. I also understand that there has to be a start somewhere, and u can use these so called remains that we have today called “classic texts†as the starting point, but it would be not proper to think that that is what a) Exaclty what Maharishis b) We have all the texts and and in proper form c) We have proper translations of the same. So consider this as starting point and only starting point and the end point will be or we can say that we have understood what the sages have taught only when we are able to predict events 100% or rather understand the essence of Jyotish 100%. Also one more thought and this is on a tangent, but since its come to my mind, I will note it down. Has it occurred to anyone that maybe our Maharishis DID NOT want everyone to have full knowledge? Have full knowledge, would mean having absolute power and absolute power will corrupt. Maybe all the knowledge was intentionally dispersed across the world, with some knowledge with the say Mayans some with the Greek or Yavans, some hidden in the Kabbalah, some in western astrology etc etc. Only the big guy upstairs knows what our ancient maharishis really wanted and the actual reason why the medium of instruction was only verbal, why is all this knowledge dispersed, and why the texts were destroyed etc etc. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Wednesday January 9, 2008 6:55 AM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash ji, Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be in a hurry. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question that worries me is that “What did parasara actually say and teach v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts today?â€Â. If there is a difference and if everyone is following that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some discrepancy there. > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Remesh ji, > ==> > > Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > <== > You are absolutely right. > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known horoscopes or not. > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that †" for sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just because of this combination the said result should fructify; but this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the statemnt of those sages. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@> wrote: > > > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh, > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way. > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not wrong. > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage. > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages. > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with Ma. Sa and Ra. > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs. > > Thanks and regards. > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > " Ash's Corner@ " kas@ wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from Taurus. That is correct. > > > > But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be such. There must be problems or some such things indicating. > > > > Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th house. > > > > However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. > > > > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too. > > > > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? > > > > > > 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery. > > > > For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person. > > > > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > Dear Ash, > > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be - > > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of first marriage is present in horoscope) > > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the family relatives/relations > > > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is in 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this derivation. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , " Ash's Corner@ " kas@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 wives? > > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in property > > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous > > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce and > > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so that > > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then mostly > > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think in > > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures to > > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception happens > > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail > > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need to > > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, and > > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 or > > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't have > > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). " > > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight- fistedness > > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is not > > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and right > > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but rather > > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes in > > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the too > > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong as > > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - multiple > > > wives for the native. > > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to share > > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > > effort > > > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus. > > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > > marriages? > > > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the significator of > > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. > > > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > > application. > > > > > > > > warm regards, > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being 2nd > > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will have no > > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is - > > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result derivations > > > > true in actual experience? > > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > > here. ;=) > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now you can chat without downloading messenger. Click here to know how. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, Perfect. Lets keep on discussing. Knowledge will only grow by sharing and ofcouse with sincere effort and hard work those are a given. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Wednesday January 9, 2008 6:53 AM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, ==> if u want to keep Jyotish as science then there must be some logical and concrete reasoning behind all things. That is the search. <== True. I know it well and also know that the sages knew it better than us. So we just have to understand their true perspective from their own words - which we are doing right now. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > I use the theory of Karak. So 5th house is friends but with the karak of > 12th means can be a couple. 3rd house is for sahudar or friends like > brothers and karak is 10th house. 11th house friends means karak is 6th so > legal matters or service like that. > > > > Means there is some concrete and logical reasoning behind this. Means if u > want to keep Jyotish as science then there must be some logical and concrete > reasoning behind all things. That is the search. > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:28 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Ash, > Actually there are numerous houses that can signify friends - 4th, 11th, > 3rd, 8th, 7th and so on. If you look care fully you will see that all the 12 > houses can signify friends. Similar to the fact that all the 12 houses > can signify love. Have a look at this message: > </message/6128> > /message/6128 > The methodologies uses to find significators etc may vary from system to > system - here from ancient indian astrology to KAS. But what we all are > interested in is just to know - whether the said results are true in > available horoscopes or not. Methods are immaterial but the results are not. > Every method/approach will have its own pet theories (which none else may > accept), but what ever be the theory - if some thing helps to reveal the > true result that is welcome. What we are doing here is NOT discussing the > various methodologies and their approach, but instead verifying whether a > result provided by Parasara and Lomasa is true or not. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , " Ash's Corner@ " > <kas@> wrote: > > > > RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > For friends u can also take 3rd house as well, i.e. Sahudhar or like > brothers for that Karak is 10th house. > > For friend though legal means i.e. karak is 6th house so for example > Marriage is 7th house, 2nd house is Karak and 11th house is friend but as a > result of legal i.e. karak is 6th. > > Then 7th becomes karak for 12th house so a person get enjoyment with wife, > then 12th becomes karak for 5th so childbirth. Somewhere it is given in > some text that marriage is when there is intension to grow family and have > child, so here is the logic or let me put it this way that what I am saying > is ONE of the way to view things and I am sure every system must have their > own approach. > > Then when one gets a child then that becomes karak for authority, i.e. 12th > house is karak for 5th means mating (12th) is karak for childbirth (5th), > once u get a child (5th) that becomes karak for authority (10th), gives u a > promotion to Dad, once u get authority then that becomes karak for your > Parakram means u will now work harder to support your child and family, i.e. > 3rd house, and 3rd becomes karak for 8th house :-) ending the circle of life > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca/> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > Dear Ash, > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here > is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But > rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the > relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the > lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets > exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, > note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in > Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) > means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd > lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is > debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with > both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that > 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be - > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of > first marriage is present in horoscope) > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the > family relatives/relations > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is in > 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be > good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as > a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not > loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment > (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even > by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will > find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May > be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this > derivation. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > > > , " Ash's Corner@ " > > kas@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 > > wives? > > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in > > property > > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous > > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce > and > > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so > that > > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then > mostly > > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think > in > > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures > to > > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception > happens > > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it > true?!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the > mail > > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need > > to > > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, > > and > > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 > or > > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't > have > > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more > > money. > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). " > > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight- fistedness > > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is > > not > > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and > > right > > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but > > rather > > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes > in > > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the > > too > > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong > > as > > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - > multiple > > > wives for the native. > > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to > > share > > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > > Love and regards, > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > > effort > > > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus. > > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > > marriages? > > > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the significator of > > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. > > > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > > application. > > > > > > > > warm regards, > > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being 2nd > > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > > Dear All, > > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will have no > > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is - > > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result derivations > > > > true in actual experience? > > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > > here. ;=) > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, Wonderfully explained. All roads will lead eventually to the truth. We just have to follow a path and keep at it, working hard and with sincerity and open mind, which is all easier said than done. Kiran, yes one thing,  what Krushnaji has disclosed upto today, is only Timing of Events portion of KAS. Still much has to be covered. Krushanji has disclosed this portion, with the assumption that those learning KAS would first know and be proficient with VA. Then one can use the the lessons that are given for finding “Timing of Eventsâ€. For example, if in a chart there are no yog’s for marriage, then how u can time the same? So one has to first know the yogs for marriage and that is expected. Yes, Krushnaji has given us some special laws that are NOT available to us in Standard Texts today which work. For example, Ve in Krittika gets spoilt which is worst for Venus, Venus in nak of sun gets spoilt, Jupiter in Libra gets spoilt particularly for marriage.  So such things only Krushanji has given, but its expected that one knows the VA portion. Yes, so the focus is in TIMING OF EVENTS which is NOT given clearly in any of the vedic texts today. The QUALITY of event is totally different thing. So I always keep saying that separate Timing of Event from Quality of Event. IF someone asks you the question of “When xyz will happen?†here we have to answer pin point. For example, if u see a chart with someones venus is very spoilt, and u can see that 7th house is disturbed, but such a person comes to you and puts forward a question “When will I marry?†then you must answer that question. Now that might be a different thing that after marriage there will be a separation (temporary or permanent like divorce or even death) that is different. I mean there is so much more still to be learnt in KAS. Now, w.r.t Vedic Astrology, if you will notice I will use my path i.e KAS as I am using that in my journey, and try to co-relate the same in unearthing the meaning of what the sages meant just like Sreenadh is doing, but I use KAS. Just somewhere there was a discusson of Marnakarak sthan, and Ju’s MKS is in 3rd house, so here I study this w.r.t KAS, so as per KAS and using our laws, a planet that aspects the primary significator house is defunct from giving result, but its SD will give. This law does not change. Now using this law, if I VIEW MKS theory, then Jupiter from 3rd house will aspect 9th house so it can’t give result of 9th house. Its given in VA that many planets in 7th house then a person is wandring and is more like a child, so if u view that from the eyes of KAS using the same law, then many planets aspecting 1st house will not give result of 1st i.e. individuality and their SD (samdharmi) will give. Just see the text of Laghu parasari that Raj yog in MD of yogakarak and in marak then as per KAS we say MD is related to KARAK so say mars rules 5th and 10th house then in MD of mars and in antra of 7th lord one will experience good rise if there are good raj yogs. If u view the same from KAS and the laws, the MD is related to karaktwa so in 5th lord natural is leo so Sun is karak for authority and if mars is 5th and 10th lord then in Mars MD will have flavour for 10th house as 5th is karak and 3rd house as 10th is karak so effort, parakram and also authority. Now in antra of 7th house (marak) means 10th from 10th house so as per KAS, its LoD or 10th from 10th the person will get more authority. Now the level of rise is different, one might be a havaldar and might get promoted to supervisor, in other case one might be a senior official might be promoted or might be given a higher authority or something like that that is totally different but as far as timing of event is concerned and if someone comes and asks u about “When I will get promotion?†then u can reply pin point. Regarding Quality its different thing. That will depend on the status of Karak and so many other factors, like intelligence, capacity to work hard, somewhere I read “Hard work without ambition is like a bird without wings†so all such things must be taken into consideration. Now sun is the karak for Authority, that Sreenadh knows, Kiran knows, I know, but why, is what I study based on that path I have chosen and try to discuss that view point without writing too much KAS Lingua. I hope its clear. One thing u also must note, and Sreenadh has written it and covered it that, mostly all Maharishis have spoken about Ashtakavarga, but don’t you find it surprising on why not much info is there. It would take 3 days before computers to manually compute all the charts and data needed to get ready to make a prediction. If some astrologers were using this as business means to earn a living then what they will feed their family. So all that’s remained is the reference to Ashtakavarga but over time all this got lost. Same for Nadi too. Its not easy to make all these computations. Just think about it. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Wednesday January 9, 2008 12:10 PM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Kiran ji, Our understanding of Ashtaka Varga system is limited - that too is a very elaborate system and perfected by many in various ways. Unlike any other Ashtaka varga school, KAS is a long tradition - unique in its own respect. Please don't try to see rishi hora methods in it - every approach has its own dictom and when one try to understand a system followed by a particular tradition we SHOULD think as they do, and follow their foundations. The same holds true for Nadi, KP, Lal Kitab, Tajik, Ashtakavarga (here KAS) and Jaimini system. In all those systems you will encounter may rules and fundamental concepts contradicting ancient indian astrology and Rishi hora quotes, but that DOES NOT make them invalid - but instead makes them unique - a different approach. When followed in their true sense all those methods can lead us to right results. Know this as a fact - and I repeat - please DON'T try see Rishi hora methods in them; they are part of different tradition or school of astrology; a different parmapara. Astrology is NOT a science but only 'advice imparted to us by ancient traditions' and know that whether we divide light as 'Red- Green-Blue' or 'Cyan-Yellow-Magenta' any of those 3 colors together will form the white light. The significance attributed to various signs, houses and planets may differ as per various systems; but when treated together they all speak about the same whole picture, helping us to arrive at right conclusions. I am not discussing or quoting Ashtaka varga principles neither because it is not dependable nor because I don't appreciate the methodology; but only because the available quotes from lost Rishi horas and the available Rishi horas (prior to Mihira) DOES NOT speak about Ashtaka Varga - and also because this group concentrate on Ancient Indian Astrology as Rishi Horas puts it. Thus as far as my quest is concerned the same is not relevant - but NOTE IT the system is truly relevant and useful, and KAS (since it has the power of a long traditon) truly unique and should be appreciated. The same statement goes in support of - Nadi, Lal Kitab,Tajik and Jaimini system as well. KP is appreciated since it tried to reconstruct the lost system of ancient 'Stellar Astrology' in a new way. Also note that in the whole of astrology groups, '' deserve a special praise because it is one of the rare calm and sincere group which concentrates on the study, understanding and improvement of the traditional system they follow. There is only a handful of such groups on astrology in the net, and learn to appreciate them, whether you want to follow them or not. * When a Lal Kitab astrologer comes to you and tells you and tell you that the significance of the planet changes from house to house - you would be wonder struck. * When KAS presents some special principles differentiating Karak for house and Karak planet- you would be wonder struck. * When a nadi astrologer comes to you, when the significance he associates with planets and houses does not match with your understanding - you would be wonder struck. * When KP starts ascribing the numerous stars, star lords and sublords and speak about sensitive points and ruling planets - you would be wonder struck. * When Tajik astrologer starts speaking about various yogas with absurd sounding names such as Ikkavali and Induvara - you would be wonder struck. * When a Jaimini astrologer comes to you and start speaking about Atma karaka, Amatya karaka, Prana pada, varnada lagna, argala, Chara dasa and so on - you would be wonder struck. But (NOTE IT) the mistakes lies with you - because you are TRYING TO MIX SYSTEMS which is sure to lead to contradictions and confusions; you are trying to view AIA in other unique systems has credit of their own and ARE valuable. Note that Remesh Mishra ji has already highlighted this point correct (check below) and this is what we should be beware of. Hope you will see the point. So first select 'what you want to learn', 'which system you find intelligible, easy to understand, and useful' - and then follow that and NEVER mix various system - making a Kichadi out of the same. :=) Love and regards, Sreenadh , Kiran R <kiran.rama wrote: > > I agree with Sreenadhji. > > Ashtakavarga is mainly used for transit predictions - that is what Mantreswara also said in Phaladeepika. > Similar is story in BPHS and other classics. > > Ashtakavarga basically tells us in which houses each planet is benefic/malefic (as 1/0) - with respect to different reference points - like lagna, and all planets. > > So using only Ashtakavarga you are missing many teachings of the sages. > I request you to have patience and understand the 7-fold method in detail and also go through various classics > > Thanks > Kiran > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote: Dear Ash ji, > Wait pls. You will right away see that their words are right - > and error is only in our understanding. Have patiants and don't be > in a hurry. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , " Ash's Corner@ " > kas@ wrote: > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > Yes, I agree with u, but my only grave concern and this question > that worries me is that “What did parasara actually say and teach > v/s what had been understood and written down and available in texts > today?â€Â. If there is a difference and if everyone is following > that blindly and if such things do not pass the test of actually > practical solving of charts then that must mean that there is some > discrepancy there. > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > _____ > > > > > On Behalf Of > Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 6:15 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it > true?!!! > > > > > > > > Dear Remesh ji, > > ==> > > > Both of you are correct your own way. > > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > > <== > > You are absolutely right. > > > > This is what I tried to explain in my previous post - the > methodologies/systems differ - i.e. ancient Indian astrology (let us > denote it as AIA) and KAS. But as far us the case (statement of > Parasara and Lomasa regarding 2nd lord 2nd house) is concerned the > systems/methodologies are irrelevant - what we are (and should be) > interested in is verifying whether the said result is true in known > horoscopes or not. > > I also agree that - multiple factors should indicate the same to > state such a result with confidence. But the point I wanted to > emphasis (supporting the statement of the sages) was that †" for > sure it shows a trend in that direction, i.e. in the direction of > fructification of multiple marriages; in the absence of other > supporting yogas/combinations, it is NOT necessary that just > because of this combination the said result should fructify; but > this shouldn't hold us back from giving proper waitage to the > statemnt of those sages. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , ramesh mishra > <aarceemastro2002@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ash and Sreenadh, > > > Sorry to intrtvene here. Both of you are correct your own way. > > > But the problem is, mixing two different system. > > > In VA for second marriage second house is considered if I am not > wrong. > > > 8th house is for break in first marriage and 7th from 8th is > second that is why 2nd house is for second marriage. > > > But chart must indicate multiple marriages. > > > For that we have to see the status of Ve. Its relationship with > Ma. Sa and Ra. > > > The placemeent of Ve in dual signs. > > > Thanks and regards. > > > Ramesh Mishra > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Krishna, That is where there lies is a difference. For death of father, 4th house is karak sthan and for death of mother 10th house is karak sthan i.e. 8th from respective house. That would indicate that house of mother is 3rd and that of father is 9th. In any case, this difference is noted and let us hope that Sreenadh can unearth something from the ancient texts. I am giving this as per concrete logic as I have understood. I shall wait for someone to give a concrete logic behind that as well and not philosophical. In any case Krishna, I have penned down my thoughts as well that there might be some difference there as well eh. So in due course of time, it might get sorted out. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama Wednesday January 9, 2008 2:45 AM RE: RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, If I have understood it correctly, he has given 4th lord as karaka for mother and 10th lord as karaka for father. Regards, Krishna " Ash's Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas wrote: Dear Krishna, Did Parasara mean 10th house stands for mothers death and 4th house for fathers death or in short 4th house as karak for father and 10th as karak sthan for mother? Is that a possibility? Is that what Parasara meant? 4th house would control the status of 9th house the house of father and same way, 10th house would control the status of 3rd house, in the same way 3rd house controls the status of 8th house or 2nd house controls the status of 7th house as they are Karak sthan? Is it possible? Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama Wednesday January 9, 2008 12:30 AM RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, If I remember correctly, Parashara says take 4th as mother and 10th as father. But again, 1-5-9 fits so well with self-child-father. This is something that should be looked into in detail. Regards, Krishna " Ash's Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas wrote: Dear Sreenadh, I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. against symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this mystery in why such things have happened. The true test will be to time the death of father and mother. If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th house. If 3rd is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is father than death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house. If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we can test this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check and those should. That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages actually said v/s what is in the books today might be very different. So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those down. So bear with me. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:17 AM Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, ==> > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not > understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear > with that either. <== Could be - but that is well popular classical dictum. Ask any astrologer he will tell you that 4th house signify maternal family and 2nd own family - because there are numerous classical quotes that describe/clarify the same. * 4th house signify mother, maternal family, relatives, friends, and natives (people in native place). * 2nd house signify 'Swam' (anything that is our own), 'Bhartavyam Akhilam vittam' (any treasure/money or other things we rule), own family (means the family of our own with wife/husband and children). Bharta (husband) means - ruler; we rule our own family our own wife, our own children. 2nd house indicates own family is a very very popular common info well described in Brihat Jataka, Prasnamarga and many more texts. 2nd house can signify 2nd marriage this too is well described in many classics. ==> > However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and > have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of > venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. <== I agree - other supporting yogas (like in all the other cases) can help us emphasis such readings and result; but that does not answer the question - whether such a combination indicate such a result or not. ==> > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple > marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. <== I agree that in presence of Bhanga yogas the above combination may not hold true in all the charts; but the question is whether the said combination has such a tendency and whether the statement hold true in most of the charts - i.e. at least 6/10. Only the response of the group members can help us identify this - and not theoretical argumentation. Note that - * The RESULT is proposed by the sages and we only provide the logical reasoning (EXPLANATION) for the same. * What we need to confirm is - whether the results proposed by the sages for this combination, actualize in reality or not; so as to confirm - whether we can depend on that derivation or not. So let the people with actual experience, or people with charts having the same combination, or people who have familiar charts with the same combination come forward and clarify our doubt - and let us stay away for some time from argumentation regarding the same; Because the RESULT is NOT proposed by me; but only the EXPLANATION. As practical astrologers we shouldn't be much concerned about the 'explanation' which depends on individual intellectual acumen, but about the RESULTS - we need to be sure, 'whether we can depend on them or not'; and it is NOT me who is proposing those results - and so I am not bothered even if they are right or wrong. Hope I am making my stand clear. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: RE: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from Taurus. That is correct. But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be such. There must be problems or some such things indicating. Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th house. However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too. How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery. For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person. In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Ash, > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here > is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But > rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the > relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the > lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets > exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, > note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in > Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) > means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd > lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is > debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with > both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that > 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be - > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of > first marriage is present in horoscope) > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the > family relatives/relations > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is in > 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be > good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as > a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not > loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment > (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even > by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will > find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May > be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this > derivation. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , " Ash's Corner@ " > kas@ wrote: > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 > wives? > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in > property > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce and > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so that > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then mostly > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think in > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures to > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception happens > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > _____ > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need > to > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, > and > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 or > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't have > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more > money. > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). " > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight-fistedness > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is > not > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and > right > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but > rather > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes in > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the > too > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong > as > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - multiple > > wives for the native. > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to > share > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > effort > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus. > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > marriages? > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the significator of > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > application. > > > > > > warm regards, > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being 2nd > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > Dear All, > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will have no > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is - > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result derivations > > > true in actual experience? > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > here. ;=) > > > > Love and regards, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now. Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Krishna, I juts had an epiphany. The sages have used in many cases Karak and Phal sthan to denote a house. For example, Marak house is referred to as 2nd and 7th house. So 7th house is phal sthan and so its Karak who is 2nd house is also referred to as Karak. So its quite possible that 4th house and 10th house are referred in that context as well as 4th house is karak for 9th and 10th house is karak for 3rd. Interesting. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama Wednesday January 9, 2008 2:45 AM RE: RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, If I have understood it correctly, he has given 4th lord as karaka for mother and 10th lord as karaka for father. Regards, Krishna " Ash's Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas wrote: Dear Krishna, Did Parasara mean 10th house stands for mothers death and 4th house for fathers death or in short 4th house as karak for father and 10th as karak sthan for mother? Is that a possibility? Is that what Parasara meant? 4th house would control the status of 9th house the house of father and same way, 10th house would control the status of 3rd house, in the same way 3rd house controls the status of 8th house or 2nd house controls the status of 7th house as they are Karak sthan? Is it possible? Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Krishnamurthy Seetharama Wednesday January 9, 2008 12:30 AM RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, If I remember correctly, Parashara says take 4th as mother and 10th as father. But again, 1-5-9 fits so well with self-child-father. This is something that should be looked into in detail. Regards, Krishna " Ash's Corner (AT) ashtro (DOT) ca " <kas wrote: Dear Sreenadh, I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. against symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this mystery in why such things have happened. The true test will be to time the death of father and mother. If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th house. If 3rd is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is father than death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house. If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we can test this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check and those should. That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages actually said v/s what is in the books today might be very different. So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those down. So bear with me. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Tuesday January 8, 2008 5:17 AM Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, ==> > How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not > understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? > 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear > with that either. <== Could be - but that is well popular classical dictum. Ask any astrologer he will tell you that 4th house signify maternal family and 2nd own family - because there are numerous classical quotes that describe/clarify the same. * 4th house signify mother, maternal family, relatives, friends, and natives (people in native place). * 2nd house signify 'Swam' (anything that is our own), 'Bhartavyam Akhilam vittam' (any treasure/money or other things we rule), own family (means the family of our own with wife/husband and children). Bharta (husband) means - ruler; we rule our own family our own wife, our own children. 2nd house indicates own family is a very very popular common info well described in Brihat Jataka, Prasnamarga and many more texts. 2nd house can signify 2nd marriage this too is well described in many classics. ==> > However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and > have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of > venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. <== I agree - other supporting yogas (like in all the other cases) can help us emphasis such readings and result; but that does not answer the question - whether such a combination indicate such a result or not. ==> > In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple > marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. <== I agree that in presence of Bhanga yogas the above combination may not hold true in all the charts; but the question is whether the said combination has such a tendency and whether the statement hold true in most of the charts - i.e. at least 6/10. Only the response of the group members can help us identify this - and not theoretical argumentation. Note that - * The RESULT is proposed by the sages and we only provide the logical reasoning (EXPLANATION) for the same. * What we need to confirm is - whether the results proposed by the sages for this combination, actualize in reality or not; so as to confirm - whether we can depend on that derivation or not. So let the people with actual experience, or people with charts having the same combination, or people who have familiar charts with the same combination come forward and clarify our doubt - and let us stay away for some time from argumentation regarding the same; Because the RESULT is NOT proposed by me; but only the EXPLANATION. As practical astrologers we shouldn't be much concerned about the 'explanation' which depends on individual intellectual acumen, but about the RESULTS - we need to be sure, 'whether we can depend on them or not'; and it is NOT me who is proposing those results - and so I am not bothered even if they are right or wrong. Hope I am making my stand clear. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: RE: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, I do not think we are on the same wavelength here. Ve exalts in Pisces the 12th house and in upachaya from 7th house. That is 11th from Taurus. That is correct. But for a person to have extra marital relationship he must have some yogs indicating that, his personality and character must be such. There must be problems or some such things indicating. Here 2nd house means karak for marriage is what I am seeing period. If 2nd house is spoilt or Venus is spoilt then the results of 7th house are spoilt, so it means there might be multiple marriages or no marriage or some such thing means disturbed 7th house. However for a person to break the marital bond and go outside the boundaries and have extra marital relation must be indicated by the nature of the person, status of venus etc etc i.e. in short more yogs. 2nd house as per your mail, you wrote that it denotes own home??? I am not clear with that either. House and fixed assets are 4th house. 2nd house is kutumb or family and wealth i.e. bonds, stocks gold as per todays day and age and back in old days, also knowledge i.e. Karak is Jupiter lord of 9th house in Kalpurush chart and your Guru and father too. How are u linking home to 2nd house or let me put it in other way, I have not understood in what context have u linked Home to 2nd house? 2nd house is 10th from 5th so primary upachaya. So in dasha of 2nd or 10th lord that might trigger 5th house. Now that only need not be romance, it can be a person might get his or her degree in education or might gain in speculation, or might win a lottery. For a person to have romantic relation, he or she must have some particular nature or yogs like say Mars and Venus with Sa or say Ma and Ve in 1 house aspected by Saturn, so that can make a person more passionate (personality) and then in such case, if antra of 2nd lord runs or 10th lord then more chances of something that might happen that he or she might meet someone in that antra. Again then, if Ju aspects then it might not let it go out of hand etc etc etc like other influence of planets modifying the overall nature of the person. In all cases if 2nd lord is in 2nd house then all such persons will have multiple marriages etc might not hold true in all charts. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Tuesday January 8, 2008 3:52 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Ash, > The 2nd and 3rd marriage/'strong extra marital relation' mentioned here > is not mainly related to 5th (platonic love) or 12th (bed pleasures); But > rather related to the house indicating 2nd marriages or relations within the > relationships such as 2nd and 11th houses. > Note that 2nd house indicates own home, homely relations; and Venus is the > lord of 2nd house and 7th house in NH; and also that the same Venus gets > exalted in 11th (a house signifying 2nd marriage) from Taurus. As per NHT2, > note that Jupiter is the significator of 2nd house and that Jupiter in > Taurus (2nd lord in any house is equivalent to Jupiter in that house) > means, 11th lord from Taurus in Taurus. Also note that if we use NHT2, 2nd > lord in 2nd is equivalent to Mercury in Taurus for Taurus lagna - Mercury is > debilitated in 11th and owns 2nd house from Tarus - indicting relation with > both 2nd and 11th house (both house signifying 2nd wife/relation). Note that > 11th indicates friendship turned into relation. > > Thus in essence, the 2nd and 3rd relation mentioned here could be - > * Actual marriages that took place (provided enough indication of break of > first marriage is present in horoscope) > * Friendship turned into strong extra marital relation. > * A relationship mainly caused by the environment/chance with in the > family relatives/relations > > This is my opinion - any how I am of the opinion that " if 2nd lord is in > 2nd house - even though the native may have a clean image and he would be > good at heart, for sure he will have extra marital affairs; almost strong as > a marriage " . It is not that the native is immoral, non-sincere, does not > loves his wife or something like that; it is just that for fulfillment > (complimenting) he needs some extra relations - and have it, solid. If even > by a slight chance if his marriage is affected, the very next day you will > find him settled in the next relation (married!) again enjoying life. May > be some more examples and actual experiences may confirm or negate this > derivation. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > , " Ash's Corner@ " > kas@ wrote: > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > I read your reply and am not able to understand what u mean by 2 or 3 > wives? > > Do u mean in the literal sense, i.e. w.r.t 7th house so partner in > property > > or do mean affairs i.e. 5th house matter platonic or 12th house matters > > which involves pleasures? > > > > > > > > If a person say in India as 2 or 3 wives, then that might be a bigamous > > marriage which might be punishable by law. Or do u mean that he or she > > might have a marriage then divorce and then marry 2nd time and divorce and > > marry 3rd time like that? > > > > > > > > Yes, one more thing about 2nd lord is that in antra of 2nd lord a person > > worries, so at that time, a male might generate more Y chromosomes so that > > might be a factor in having more female children. > > > > > > > > In KAS, if 3:6:10:11 points are in rising trend in Male chart, then mostly > > the 1st child is female. This is due to the logic that such persons are > > very enterprising, just see the chart that Renu gave of CEO where I said > > that native might be in business but he was CEO, I wrote a mail I think in > > response to that as well, so if the person is taking on large ventures to > > establish business or if he is rising to much power and conception happens > > then there are MORE chances of having a female child. > > > > > > > > Maybe that is why or some base of it might be there in this 2nd lord in > > lagna logic as well? > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > _____ > > > > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > > Tuesday January 8, 2008 12:56 AM > > > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > > > > > Dear Vinita ji, > > That was a good attempt. As for NHT2, assume Taurus as lagna and that > > 2nd lord from Taurus (i.e. Mercury) is in Taurus. Note that Venus gets > > debilitated in 5th Virgo, and also that mercury is a female eunuch. > > But in face of the lawyers horoscope presented by Krishna ji and the mail > > of Gopu ji, I should clarify the reading as per the Rishi horas. We need > to > > verify this reading, and I will stand by in support of the sage quotes, > and > > let us see what the reality and facts has to reveal. > > > > " If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have 2 or > > 3 wives (affairs or near marriage relations also will do), but won't have > > any children (especially son). He would be wealthy, will indulge in > > righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much > > income/earnings/gain/profit, but would be stingy. He will always try to > > increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more > money. > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). " > > The Dasa of the 2nd lord would be very prosperous. The tight-fistedness > > of the native comes from his intention to avoid wasteful expenses; it is > not > > that he will not spend enough money for useful things. For useful and > right > > things he will spend money without any stinginess. The multiple > > relationships of the native spring not from his immoral attitude, but > rather > > from his sincerity. He is sincere to himself and to the people he comes in > > contact with. If he happens to make relationships with women, due to the > too > > much sincerity, the chance for it to turn into a strong relation (strong > as > > marriage) is very big. This is what prompts the sage to mention - multiple > > wives for the native. > > Let us to what extend these clear derivations actualized in real > > horoscopes or not. I request the readers with the same combination to > share > > their experience; and their response/coment about the above reading. > > Love and regards, > > Sreenadh > > > > , " vinita kumar " > > shankar_mamta@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Shreenadh ji, > > > > > > ok here is my take on this ...not that it will necessarily be close > > > to the right answer , but then u can once again appreciate the > > > effort > > > > > > Why should such a person have no son? > > > > > > 2nd lord in 2nd...in the natural zodiac this is Venus in Taurus. > > > Venus is a female planet which gets strengthened in its feminine > > > characteristics being in its own sign. Taurus is an even sign also > > > equal to female??? dunno! > > > > > > i dont know if this application is correct, but assuming 2nd house > > > to be first...the fifth house is Virgo, another female sign. > > > > > > Now for the 2nd question which is tougher....this person may have 2- > > > 3 wives....why and how? > > > > > > 7th house is the significator of marriage....first marriage or all > > > marriages? > > > > > > i dunno what is the significator of 2nd marriage, but i have heard > > > or read somewhere that 2nd to 7th, ie., 8th H is the significator of > > > 2nd marriage, 9th the significator of 3rd marriage and so on...Of > > > course, i don't know the basis of such pronouncements. > > > > > > Going by the bhavat bhavam principle 8th from 8thH is 3rdH just as > > > 3rdH is also 2nd from 2nd. > > > > > > 2nd from 2nd (Taurus) is Gemini, a dual sign and also a sign of > > > copulation....so maybe more than one marriage. > > > > > > Venus from Taurus aspects Mars ruled Scorpio...Scorpio is the hidden > > > 8th house also related to sex....but then i don't know how this fits > > > in with formal 2nd or 3rd marriage. Of course, if such marriages are > > > not in the open and hidden, there would be some connection there. > > > > > > i am afraid this is the best i could do. i have not used the nh2 > > > principle successfully because it is yet to sink in in terms of > > > application. > > > > > > warm regards, > > > vinita > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Krishnamurthy > > > Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > Let me try - > > > > > > > > If 2nd lord is in 2nd, he would influence the 8th. 8th being 2nd > > > from 7th influences the longevity of the spouse. Hence, might be > > > logical to say that the native would have more than one wife. > > > > > > > > Secondly, going by the logic of Kaalapursusha chart, it would be > > > Venus in Taurus for Aries lagna. This also means the 7th lord in the > > > second. The 7th lord being a maraka sitting in the house of family > > > is not good. > > > > > > > > But, I can't figure out why NO son. > > > > > > > > All the above is theory. Let me quote a practical case. The > > > chart that I have already shared (that of a lawyer), he has 2nd lord > > > Mercury in the 2nd houuse Virgo. He has a Son - the only child. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Krishna > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote: > > > > Dear All, > > > > Sage Parasara and Lomasa tells us that if 2nd lord in 2nd - > > > > * The native may have 2 or 3 wives. > > > > * He will have NO son!! > > > > We all know expect a very good reading speaking out very good > > > results such as " good family, wealth, house, beautiful face, > > > earnings " etc only for such a placement. What prompted these grate > > > sages to make a very strong derivation such as - " He will have no > > > son " ?!! The quiz question is - > > > > * What is the logic behind? > > > > And the verification question is - Is that result derivations > > > true in actual experience? > > > > Note: I hope that after the previous quiz on 2nd house every > > > body would be much interested in applying the learned principles > > > here. ;=) > > > > Love and regards, > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > > > Search. > > > > > > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now. Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, These are philosophical things. What are concrete facts. Is sun father or is Ju father? If 10th hosue is taken for father than Sa must be father. Too many fathers lol… just kidding…. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Wednesday January 9, 2008 4:20 AM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, Read the previous mail, and the document 'Lagna lord in various houses'. As per AIA 4th is mother because the 4th house in NH is owned by Moon, and it is due to the same reason that Ju is guru and father. Also, Sun is Siva the father of the universe and everything and so the significator of father, and Moon is Sakti (Parvati) the mother of the universe and everything and so the significator of mother. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. > > > > Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. against > symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this mystery in > why such things have happened. > > The true test will be to time the death of father and mother. > > If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th house. If 3rd > is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is father than > death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house. > > > > If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we can test > this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check and those > should. > > > > That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages actually said > v/s what is in the books today might be very different. > > > > So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those down. So > bear with me. > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca> http://www.ashtro.ca > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Hare rama krishna , dear ash . Namaskar The mystery or intricasy of house of father is always intriguing and we dont know why majority of rishis or may be their commentaters took as 9th house for father than 10th house ,i mean in available literature . Yes some parampara and regions took 10th for father . The universal pitru karaka is sun also he is universal atma karaka . even in beeja sphutta calculations and kshetra sphutta calculations sun and jup is participating in beeja ( male virility ) and moon and jup is participating for female virility ( kshetra sphutta ) so common One is jup and sun is included for males and moon also included for females ,ya calculation i am not discussing here as it may make the mail so legthy . 9th house stands for luck ,dharma ,guru .According to indian tradition father is instigatr and the one who is taking u to guru and he is also guru after mother . also if u see every ones luck is a good father .I find in charts with 9th lord is afflicted or gone to 8th ,they hav a unlucky father ,or they get adopted or some thing happening to the early rise in child hood . if u take 10th then the dasa s in 11th and 4th shud be maraka for father . with ayanamsa u follows may be ur correct . Some schools in south they take sani for karaka for father for nite births . since i follow karaka/house /Lord scheme in timing events and general observation of strenght charts ,i find 9th is consistently following it ,may be some stray charts i dont know . offcource the transits ,and karaka sun s place ments also has a major say .Even in majority of nadis also follows this system and u know also better as ur guru parampara also is following some nadi principles . ,May be this thought of 9th happened because the father is thought as provider and who can be lucky for kid .Also may according to the upachaya theorey which ur school follws 6th from 4th is also 9th ( i dont know much abt prmary or secondary upachaya and u can explain better as i am always open and inquisiv) Also 9th is important laxmi stana and trikona and dharma trikona . my 2 annas . regrds sunil nair om shreem mahalaxmai namah . , "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh,> > > > These are philosophical things. What are concrete facts.> > > > Is sun father or is Ju father? If 10th hosue is taken for father than Sa> must be father.> > > > Too many fathers lol. just kidding..> > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca/> http://www.ashtro.ca> > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh> Wednesday January 9, 2008 4:20 AM> > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > > > Dear Ash,> Read the previous mail, and the document 'Lagna lord in various > houses'. As per AIA 4th is mother because the 4th house in NH is > owned by Moon, and it is due to the same reason that Ju is guru and > father. Also, Sun is Siva the father of the universe and everything > and so the significator of father, and Moon is Sakti (Parvati) the > mother of the universe and everything and so the significator of > mother. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ <%40>> astrology , "Ash's Corner@" > kas@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. > > > > > > > > Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. > against> > symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this > mystery in> > why such things have happened.> > > > The true test will be to time the death of father and mother.> > > > If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th > house. If 3rd> > is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is > father than> > death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house.> > > > > > > > If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we > can test> > this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check > and those> > should. > > > > > > > > That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages > actually said> > v/s what is in the books today might be very different.> > > > > > > > So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those > down. So> > bear with me.> > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro. <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca> http://www.ashtro.> <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here. Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered. Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds. Otherwise, what are u testing? If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law. In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Remesh Mishra ji, That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. ==> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim. <== I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. ==> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target. > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean . <== Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. ==> > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology. <== Right you said. ==> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event > taking help of dictum of ancient sages. <== You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. ==> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding. > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost. <== But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/approach - as they put it. ==> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event. > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public. > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too. <== Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. ==> > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H. <== Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. Love and regards, Sreenadh , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002 wrote: > > Dear respected all learnades, > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others. > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target. > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim. > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target. > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean . > When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology. > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages. > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding. > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost. > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning. > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them . > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right. > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses. > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event. > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public. > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too. > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H. > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us. > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also. > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house. > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju. > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me. > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house. > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings. > He may not be getting support from his father. > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa. > Is all this correct or incorrect ? > Thanks and regards. > Ramesh Mishra > > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote: > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji, > ==> > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > <== > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > > , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote: > > > > Dear Ash, > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following: > > > > " I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts. > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong. > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water. > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. " > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far. > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths. > > > > All the best! > > > > Regards, > > Krishna > > > > > > " Ash's Corner@ " kas@ wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are " n " number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know. > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the " KAS terminology " that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically. > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts. > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong. > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment. > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry. > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother. > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things. > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that? > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time. > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere. > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water. > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca > > > > > > > > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2008 Report Share Posted January 9, 2008 Dear Sunil, If you can refer to Krushnaji’s mail, he had explained this and given his view point explaining it scientifically. /message/2011 You can refer to this J.K DasGupta had asked Krushnaji this question and Krushanji had replied. You can read the entire thread and it will be quite informative. That will give the details and this is straight from Krushanji and ofcourse to me that is like my Bible J We can discuss the “Marak” concept of VA in a different thread and try to get to the root of that as well. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of sunil nair Wednesday January 9, 2008 5:42 PM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Hare rama krishna , dear ash . Namaskar The mystery or intricasy of house of father is always intriguing and we dont know why majority of rishis or may be their commentaters took as 9th house for father than 10th house ,i mean in available literature . Yes some parampara and regions took 10th for father . The universal pitru karaka is sun also he is universal atma karaka . even in beeja sphutta calculations and kshetra sphutta calculations sun and jup is participating in beeja ( male virility ) and moon and jup is participating for female virility ( kshetra sphutta ) so common One is jup and sun is included for males and moon also included for females ,ya calculation i am not discussing here as it may make the mail so legthy . 9th house stands for luck ,dharma ,guru .According to indian tradition father is instigatr and the one who is taking u to guru and he is also guru after mother .. also if u see every ones luck is a good father .I find in charts with 9th lord is afflicted or gone to 8th ,they hav a unlucky father ,or they get adopted or some thing happening to the early rise in child hood . if u take 10th then the dasa s in 11th and 4th shud be maraka for father . with ayanamsa u follows may be ur correct . Some schools in south they take sani for karaka for father for nite births . since i follow karaka/house /Lord scheme in timing events and general observation of strenght charts ,i find 9th is consistently following it ,may be some stray charts i dont know . offcource the transits ,and karaka sun s place ments also has a major say .Even in majority of nadis also follows this system and u know also better as ur guru parampara also is following some nadi principles . ,May be this thought of 9th happened because the father is thought as provider and who can be lucky for kid .Also may according to the upachaya theorey which ur school follws 6th from 4th is also 9th ( i dont know much abt prmary or secondary upachaya and u can explain better as i am always open and inquisiv) Also 9th is important laxmi stana and trikona and dharma trikona . my 2 annas . regrds sunil nair om shreem mahalaxmai namah . , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > These are philosophical things. What are concrete facts. > > > > Is sun father or is Ju father? If 10th hosue is taken for father than Sa > must be father. > > > > Too many fathers lol. just kidding.. > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro.ca/> http://www.ashtro.ca > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Sreenadh > Wednesday January 9, 2008 4:20 AM > > Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! > > > > Dear Ash, > Read the previous mail, and the document 'Lagna lord in various > houses'. As per AIA 4th is mother because the 4th house in NH is > owned by Moon, and it is due to the same reason that Ju is guru and > father. Also, Sun is Siva the father of the universe and everything > and so the significator of father, and Moon is Sakti (Parvati) the > mother of the universe and everything and so the significator of > mother. > Love and regards, > Sreenadh > > ancient_indian_ <%40> > astrology , " Ash's Corner@ " > kas@ wrote: > > > > Dear Sreenadh, > > > > > > > > I take 3rd house as mother, i.e. 7th from 9th house is father. > > > > > > > > Why 4th house is taken as mother when 9th is taken as father i.e. > against > > symmetry I am not too sure. I am hoping that u can unearth this > mystery in > > why such things have happened. > > > > The true test will be to time the death of father and mother. > > > > If 4th house is mother than death of mother must be from 11th > house. If 3rd > > is of mother than death is from 10th house. Same way if 10th is > father than > > death must be from 5th house and if 9th is then from 4th house. > > > > > > > > If u can find out the consistent laws of death that work then we > can test > > this, otherwise in KAS the laws are there that also we can check > and those > > should. > > > > > > > > That will confirm many things especially why what the Sages > actually said > > v/s what is in the books today might be very different. > > > > > > > > So many thoughts going on in my mind, just trying to pen those > down. So > > bear with me. > > > > > > > > Cheers !!! > > > > Ash -> <http://www.ashtro. <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca> http://www.ashtro. > <http://www.ashtro.ca> ca > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 Dear Ash,==>Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.<== I want to make certain things clear. I am NOT trying to learn here - but rather trying to present what I know in a systematic manner FOR the benefit of OTHERS. Unlike you I have been a professional astrologer for long - and rigorously practiced it for long 8 years; I hope you may see the difference. So when I explain something I am not trying to learn from all (even though for certain that happens at times) but rather trying to present what I know in a a better way for the benefit of others. I know that you may not see the point because you are yet to devote such a long period to practice astrology and that too as a professional astrologer with daily interactions with many number of astrologers and clients - ya, it demand time, effort, dedication, opportunity and environment. Also please note that - "the branches of trees with fruits naturally comes down" and not demanding; a quote that might be of help to you. ==>If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law<== Please don't teach what I should do - I know what I should and is doing it. Please be on your path and know that what you are learning and what I am following are just 2 different tools. Your group is trying to understand you own tool in a better way; and this group is trying to understand our tool in a better way. So let us keep the respect for both of them - and try to be humble and sincere. No challenges please - that is not the path of the wise. ==>In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws.<== Thanks for you advice. By the way with laughter filled face, I am prompted to ask - Did you do it? Did you mastered all things so that now you are playing the teacher who advices? :=) Note: Please don't make things look childish - I hope we have a better maturity and better undestanding about 'where we want to go?' and 'What are we doing?' - certainly I am not a wreched ship without an aim; but have a solid idea about my aim, and is working for it - daily. Love and regards,Sreenadh , "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote: RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here. Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered. Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds. Otherwise, what are u testing? If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law. In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. Cheers !!! Ash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 Dear Sreenadh-ji, here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male child?/ you know i didnt told you this that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd time we only need daughter since we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male & so i was not my dicesion but my wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my family for abortion & yes i still feel guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even though it isnt my fault i am already ready thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life or family. Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his friend just wonted to check my kundali i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will seteled in western world [usa]will be in public relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing grows through sun & yes[grocery store] as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean in all facters now this all things are open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me honest god i am not lieing. ok he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had come true ok your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of 19 this other guy predicted sons only i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my kundali, my detail are as [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 long/lati please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what you or do you see other facters which my kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you agree with my kundali?? sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know ok thanks rashmikant patel "Ash's Corner" <kas Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here. Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered. Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds. Otherwise, what are u testing? If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law. In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca ancient_indian_ astrology [ ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of SreenadhWednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AMancient_indian_ astrology[ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Remesh Mishra ji, That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. ==>> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.<== I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. ==>> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .<== Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. ==>> we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with> suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.<== Right you said. ==>> For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event> taking help of dictum of ancient sages.<== You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. ==>> These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost.<== But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. ==>> Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.<== Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. ==>> Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.<== Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. Love and regards,Sreenadh ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:>> Dear respected all learnades,> It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> He may not be getting support from his father.> He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> Is all this correct or incorrect ?> Thanks and regards.> Ramesh Mishra > > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote:> Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> ==>> Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> <==> There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > > ancient_indian_ astrology , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> >> > Dear Ash,> > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > All the best!> > > > Regards,> > Krishna> > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> >> > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 <>Dear Rashmi ji, You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. Did you read this post? /message/6360 I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for the understanding of everyone and for future reference. "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/gain/profit but would be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if other combinations also support the same." Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to make. Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each of the numerous derivations they provide. Hope this helps. Love and regards, Sreenadh , rashmi patel <rashmihpatel wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh-ji,> here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male child?/ you know i didnt told you this> that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd time we only need daughter since> we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male & so i was not my dicesion but my> wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my family for abortion & yes i still feel> guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even though it isnt my fault i am already ready> thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life or family.> Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his friend just wonted to check my kundali> i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean in all facters now this all things are> open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me honest god i am not lieing. ok> he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> come true ok> your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of 19 this other guy predicted sons only> i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my kundali, my detail are as> [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 long/lati> please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what you or do you see other facters which my> kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you agree with my kundali??> sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know ok thanks> rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner" kas > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Sreenadh,> > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here.> Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws.> > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.> > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered.> > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law.> > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws.> > > > Cheers !!!> Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> ancient_indian_ astrology> [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. > ==>> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> <==> I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > ==>> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> <==> Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > ==>> > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with> > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> <==> Right you said. > ==>> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event> > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> <==> You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > ==>> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> <==> But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > ==>> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> <==> Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. > ==>> > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> <==> Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> >> > Dear respected all learnades,> > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> > When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> > He may not be getting support from his father.> > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > Thanks and regards.> > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > ==>> > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > <==> > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > Regards,> > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> >> > > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > http://www./r/hs> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 Dear Sreenadh, My apologies. I was mistaken. I thought that this was a discussion group. Since you already know it all and you are explaining what you know there is no point for me to put forward my points or no point in me discussing. Rest of your mail is getting personal and I do not intend to get into that. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Thursday January 10, 2008 3:08 AM Subject: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, ==> Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. <== I want to make certain things clear. I am NOT trying to learn here - but rather trying to present what I know in a systematic manner FOR the benefit of OTHERS. Unlike you I have been a professional astrologer for long - and rigorously practiced it for long 8 years; I hope you may see the difference. So when I explain something I am not trying to learn from all (even though for certain that happens at times) but rather trying to present what I know in a a better way for the benefit of others. I know that you may not see the point because you are yet to devote such a long period to practice astrology and that too as a professional astrologer with daily interactions with many number of astrologers and clients - ya, it demand time, effort, dedication, opportunity and environment. Also please note that - " the branches of trees with fruits naturally comes down " and not demanding; a quote that might be of help to you. ==> If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law <== Please don't teach what I should do - I know what I should and is doing it. Please be on your path and know that what you are learning and what I am following are just 2 different tools. Your group is trying to understand you own tool in a better way; and this group is trying to understand our tool in a better way. So let us keep the respect for both of them - and try to be humble and sincere. No challenges please - that is not the path of the wise. ==> In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. <== Thanks for you advice. By the way with laughter filled face, I am prompted to ask - Did you do it? Did you mastered all things so that now you are playing the teacher who advices? :=) Note: Please don't make things look childish - I hope we have a better maturity and better undestanding about 'where we want to go?' and 'What are we doing?' - certainly I am not a wreched ship without an aim; but have a solid idea about my aim, and is working for it - daily. Love and regards, Sreenadh , " Ash's Corner " <kas wrote: RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here. Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered. Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds. Otherwise, what are u testing? If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law. In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. Cheers !!! Ash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. Jagdish: I am egotic. But who is not egotic in this world ? If you dont have ego then you are a saint. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). Jagdish: Well.. now a days almost everyone has more than one "near marriage relations." I also had. He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. Jagdish: yet to fructify. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. Jagdish: What is the definition of wealth ? I get food to eat, bed to sleep, dress to wear, and car to drive. I can spend money on movie theater, clubs, friends, eating-out and other such kind of fun activities. Well, i dont have a BMW, Mercedes or a Helicopter or private jet. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. Jagdish: Oh well, i am enjoying as you can see from above statement. He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be stingy. Jagdish: Sometimes i feel that i am stingy. But sometimes other way round. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. Jagdish: Who does not want to increase his earning and would not be after accumulating more and more money ? The above statement is so perfect for me. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Jagdish: I am able in doing my stuff. Earnings depends on job profile. Speech is ok. I can talk to people and can easily convey my message to them. WOW............. i satisfy so many criteria for 2nd lord in 2nd... and I dont have second lord in 2nd... These criterias are so so so so so "Common-Human-Tendencies." Please prove me wrong... Thanks Jagdish Sreenadh <sreesog wrote: <>Dear Rashmi ji, You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. Did you read this post? /message/6360 I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for the understanding of everyone and for future reference. "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/gain/profit but would be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if other combinations also support the same." Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to make. Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each of the numerous derivations they provide. Hope this helps.Love and regards,Sreenadh , rashmi patel <rashmihpatel wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh-ji,> here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male child?/ you know i didnt told you this> that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd time we only need daughter since> we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male & so i was not my dicesion but my> wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my family for abortion & yes i still feel> guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even though it isnt my fault i am already ready> thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life or family.> Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his friend just wonted to check my kundali> i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean in all facters now this all things are> open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me honest god i am not lieing. ok> he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> come true ok> your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of 19 this other guy predicted sons only> i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my kundali, my detail are as> [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 long/lati> please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what you or do you see other facters which my> kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you agree with my kundali??> sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know ok thanks> rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner" kas > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Sreenadh,> > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here.> Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws.> > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.> > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered.> > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law.> > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws.> > > > Cheers !!!> Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> ancient_indian_ astrology> [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. > ==>> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> <==> I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > ==>> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> <==> Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > ==>> > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with> > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> <==> Right you said. > ==>> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event> > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> <==> You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > ==>> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> <==> But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > ==>> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> <==> Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. > ==>> > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> <==> Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> >> > Dear respected all learnades,> > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> > When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> > He may not be getting support from his father.> > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > Thanks and regards.> > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > ==>> > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > <==> > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > Regards,> > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> >> > > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > http://www./r/hs> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2008 Report Share Posted January 10, 2008 Dear Sreenadhji, jai ganesh Well I guess now you geting mad on me but you please try to understand what i mean is study more on my kundali[ group discusion] if you want to to find out there are other facters also works on each individual kundali not nothing else. I am trying to prove you wrong in personal manner but as group discusion if i can show my kundali as example so that in future you your self can show in group this kundali with this experience, ok I exactly know what you are trying in this discusion & i dont have any problem or i am not here to make people mad in group so please dont take it personaly, ok sorry if i had heart your feeling, & please lets just stop this discusion right here & look forward for other discusion ok thanks rashmikant Sreenadh <sreesog Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:53:11 PM Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! <>Dear Rashmi ji, You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. Did you read this post? http://groups. / group/ancient_ indian_astrology /message/ 6360 I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for the understanding of everyone and for future reference. "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if other combinations also support the same." Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to make. Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each of the numerous derivations they provide. Hope this helps.Love and regards,Sreenadh--- In ancient_indian_ astrology, rashmi patel <rashmihpatel@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh-ji,> here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male child?/ you know i didnt told you this> that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd time we only need daughter since> we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male & so i was not my dicesion but my> wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my family for abortion & yes i still feel> guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even though it isnt my fault i am already ready> thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life or family.> Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his friend just wonted to check my kundali> i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean in all facters now this all things are> open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me honest god i am not lieing. ok> he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> come true ok> your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of 19 this other guy predicted sons only> i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my kundali, my detail are as> [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 long/lati> please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what you or do you see other facters which my> kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you agree with my kundali??> sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know ok thanks> rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner" kas ancient_indian_ astrology> Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> [ancient_indian_ astrology] RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Sreenadh,> > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here.> Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws.> > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.> > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered.> > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law.> > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws.> > > > Cheers !!!> Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> ancient_indian_ astrology> [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. > ==>> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> <==> I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > ==>> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> <==> Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > ==>> > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with> > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> <==> Right you said. > ==>> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event> > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> <==> You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > ==>> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> <==> But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > ==>> > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> <==> Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. > ==>> > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> <==> Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> >> > Dear respected all learnades,> > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> > When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> > He may not be getting support from his father.> > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > Thanks and regards.> > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > ==>> > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > <==> > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > >> > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > Regards,> > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> >> > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________> Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > http://www.. com/r/hs> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 Dear All, here is my take on the 2nd house lord in 2nd house . {Please read carefully before reacting} _ 2nd house is the 8th of the 7th. Thus it also signifies secret activities of 7th house ( spouse ) and therefore is an indicator to even his/her relationship. 2nd house lord Sun in Leo makes a person egoistic, harsh speaker and denotes past glory. ( our forefather's had so many horses etc.... ) The result of such harshness is that it destroys their family life and hurts everybody. As for Royal ways described in somebody's mail - For the want of a better ( worse? ) word "they are free loaders." All their so called royalty is at somebody else's cost ( nowaday's exchequr earlier some king, community etc.). Also Sun inthe 2nd house does not ensure truthfullness. These people suffer a lot during transit of Saturn, ketu or Rahu in the 2nd house ( similar to current transit). Somebody mentioned in his mail about 2nd house Mars. Can lead to an operation or an acciedent so be carefull. It also aspects 8th so organs connected with 8th house will be affected. --- O Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 Dear Ash,It is you who is opinionated and not Sreenadhji. I get the feeling that you want everyone to believe and follow your KAS method.Have an open mind.RegardsKiran"Ash's Corner" <kas wrote: Dear Sreenadh, My apologies. I was mistaken. I thought that this was a discussion group. Since you already know it all and you are explaining what you know there is no point for me to put forward my points or no point in me discussing. Rest of your mail is getting personal and I do not intend to get into that. Cheers !!! Ash -> http://www.ashtro.ca On Behalf Of Sreenadh Thursday January 10, 2008 3:08 AM Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Ash, ==> Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. <== I want to make certain things clear. I am NOT trying to learn here - but rather trying to present what I know in a systematic manner FOR the benefit of OTHERS. Unlike you I have been a professional astrologer for long - and rigorously practiced it for long 8 years; I hope you may see the difference. So when I explain something I am not trying to learn from all (even though for certain that happens at times) but rather trying to present what I know in a a better way for the benefit of others. I know that you may not see the point because you are yet to devote such a long period to practice astrology and that too as a professional astrologer with daily interactions with many number of astrologers and clients - ya, it demand time, effort, dedication, opportunity and environment. Also please note that - "the branches of trees with fruits naturally comes down" and not demanding; a quote that might be of help to you. ==> If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law <== Please don't teach what I should do - I know what I should and is doing it. Please be on your path and know that what you are learning and what I am following are just 2 different tools. Your group is trying to understand you own tool in a better way; and this group is trying to understand our tool in a better way. So let us keep the respect for both of them - and try to be humble and sincere. No challenges please - that is not the path of the wise. ==> In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. <== Thanks for you advice. By the way with laughter filled face, I am prompted to ask - Did you do it? Did you mastered all things so that now you are playing the teacher who advices? :=) Note: Please don't make things look childish - I hope we have a better maturity and better undestanding about 'where we want to go?' and 'What are we doing?' - certainly I am not a wreched ship without an aim; but have a solid idea about my aim, and is working for it - daily. Love and regards, Sreenadh , "Ash's Corner" <kas wrote: RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Dear Sreenadh, You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here. Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws. Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving. So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered. Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds. Otherwise, what are u testing? If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law. In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws. Cheers !!! Ash Save all your chat conversations. Find them online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 Hare ramakrishna, dear jagdish . Its u realy made me reay laugh . As i know why all this transformations happening . As usual u must hav come to this astro grps for getting free predictions when u were facing some problems and must got advise from so many neo astrologers and so called astrologers and many of the predictions might hav gone off the mark or their prediction were not wat u wanted to hear .Then u stayed back in grps unlike others who signs off immediately after getting a free reading .Also Ur kind of persons wanted to get read their chart again and again or to be discussed .or will be looking for some discussion conncted to u r chart happening and then jumping on spot with my chart has this and that .And then subsequent feed back of lies and false claims and self prasing and boasting and may be even if the reading is correct then abuse the astrologers for saving ur skin . I remeber in this grp itself when one astrologer commented abt one chart abt bad married life and relationship with woman ,actualy he presented this chart as if a known frnds chart ( actualy it was his chart and his wife has gone back to her house within months of marriage and that is the reason of his dasavatar in the jyothish grps ) He started claiming this nativ has very beautiful and willing relation with evn with 100s ladies of foreign origin ( its all paid prostitutes ) and he has great and thunderous lov and sex life and what ever u r saying is wrong and then that astrologer even stopped writing in all forums .( i know personly this astrologer and the fellow who jumped at first opportunity to get free reading ) How come india has produced so many such spiritual indians who make sure that their gurus will die of hunger and desperation .Here i remeber the great C S Patel died in his old age without proper money and care because of financial problems ,It will happen only in spiritual india and i remeber one american who just translated yavana hora got 4 crores indian ruppes on sponsorship from some organisation in US and his guru and guide who piloted this project suicided in varanasi ( no body knows why he travelled all the way to varanasi ) because he was very succesful financialy and was caring his wife and family wel .And left behind a gr8 sum of financial problems to his family to solve . ( this is fate of free astrology most popularised by all crumpling vedic astrology grps except this grp ,KAS and KP and one Lal kitab grp were they strictly discuss only their theoreys and even u cant find this free dom their even to make any out of context commends .anything except discussion will be moderated and deleted.In free grps U can find in memeber ship may 7000 or 8000 on home page but in actual not even 100 ppl will be even reading the mails .And no serious discussion ther and only this confusing predictions ,each will say and contradict each other and the free seeker dont know which one to take as he dont hav time to look for who is best and who is worst .And some ppl will join 100s of grps at a time and ask this question every where ,so will end up with 500 contradicting replys and finaly he himself will lose track who said what ) And the worst thing is even if some prediction fulfilled no feed back ,so the astrologer has no way benefitting .except some one will say ur prediction not fulfilled ,where as out of 100 may be 70 percent of his prediction s may be fulfilled .So as a dutiful man get abused again . Now those who say astrology will able to see only generic things .But think when ppl cannot take any decisions their own and they dont know what is ahead and they r at cross roads ,dont know which direction to take ,then only they approach astrologer ,when some is happy and triving i never find any one approaching in modern days ,even to fix a muhurtha excpt marriage or house building .When every hope is lost only anybody is coming to astrologers . even i think i find u were pointing towards ur attacks with respected bhaskar ji ( ur favrite of one time ) ,i dont know what mistake he did ,except he does lot of free reading without caring his own families needs .Tho by birth he is as rich as who can buy 10 jagdhish tuppads . even i find u also trying ur hand on some charts ( if my memory is correct ) .what was ur knowledge in astrology to do this devine science and now u find joke with basic discussions .here what was happening ,its simply a discussion on 2nd lord in 2nd .it was not reading of any ones chart specificaly .here some ppl start taking as opportunity to get their chart read and y u dont see this and that if that astrologer can see it .why cant u see it .And here u must accept defeat and things like that .Was any reading of charts done here ?? Then how a reserch work can be done on the basis of astrology ,which is already hidden and lost .How can we check whether this so called manglik dosh is happening or not and when what context .what i thought was publik will apreciate such moves and they will support with max chart and max feed backs .Here ppl with young age and many of the charts significations may be yet to fully blossom in coming years .and many forget that this to fruitify a dasa also connected to those significations recquired ,and it can also happen in worst transits ,if the finding was bad .Also in chart itself so many bhanga yogas may be there . Here some r behaving like those blind men see the elephant .And this kind of ppl thinks they can make fun of any body who is trying to do some servise .As they know only selfish ness from head to toe .All wanted to ask free questions and by sitting at their comforts and even if they make a miss cal its duty of astrologer to call back and giv a free reading .How come our indian s become this much spiritual .To make sure that those who practise or follow this noble indian scinces shud be humilaited . But nothing to say when millions of ruppees were spent on election surveys and went wrong ,weather forcast went wrong on same day ( and governemnt is spending billions of ruppes and has a dept for it ) ,same with so called economists ,and also market pundits and comapny advisers and economic advisers .But any body can hit on astrologers or astro lovers as if its a drum discared in street . The clear signal is that --u r assessed on what u made as wealth or what r u making in currency exchange and but they think themselves - see us with our peanut brains we r making millions of ruppes ,see how smart we r .u fools look at urself . So this worlds greatest intellectual profession is being judged this way as its available free .As many gurus go down to the levl of normal ppl than making an air of dignity for themselves .And this free is producing thankless reactions .As they dont contribute any thing ,Here i respect osho s words who was against giving anything free ,he used to say if u dont hav ur hard earned money ,u work in kitchen and gets ur due . Labda vidhye guru dweshi ( the thankless and evil ppl will abuse gurus after getting vidhya ) Labhda bharyestu mataram ( such ppl after getting a beutiful wife will abuse his own mother ) Labhda putra pathim nari : ( such ladies after getting a good son will abuse their husbands ) labhdaste aryogya chikilsakam ( such ppl will abuse the physician after himself getting into full health after a free treatment ) . This is bartha hari in neeti saram said -may be 1000s of years back .So in this era nothing surprising . PS +====== ( thankless ppl will hav there 9th lord in 8th ,or will be debilated ,or afflicted ,along with may be jupiter afflicted and ill placed and also 2nd lord( as to speak lies and bad things ) also in some of the hidden rasis or will be afflicted ) and they end up finaly unlucky .since 9th lord is also dharma they will abuse dharam and dharmik things .) So pls check any thing of this sort is in ur chart .Also check if ur dasa any way connected with 9th house ,if so u r inviting also wrath of rishis .As some un burned karma u r activating .Finaly 9th house is deciding our bahgya ) such ppl better stay clear away from even reading or practising astrology . Now u can continue with ur mission and i hav all my support with u . Sorry if i hurt u or become personal . regrs sunil nair om shreem mahalaxmai namah. , Prathamesn Chawan <upaoakcrest wrote:>> thats great... if my mail can make you laugh...> > he he he> > Jagdish> > vinita kumar shankar_mamta wrote:> Oh dear, i had such a good laugh reading this message > > , Prathamesn Chawan > upaoakcrest@ wrote:> >> > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. > > > > Jagdish: I am egotic. But who is not egotic in this world ? If > you dont have ego then you are a saint.> > > > > > > > He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more > than one family (very close friendly relationship with another > family as if both are one). > > > > Jagdish: Well.. now a days almost everyone has more than > one "near marriage relations." I also had.> > > > He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other > yogas also indicate the same. > > > > Jagdish: yet to fructify.> > > > > > He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. > > > > Jagdish: What is the definition of wealth ? I get food to eat, > bed to sleep, dress to wear, and car to drive. I can spend money on > movie theater, clubs, friends, eating-out and other such kind of fun > activities. Well, i dont have a BMW, Mercedes or a Helicopter or > private jet.> > > > > > He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. > > > > Jagdish: Oh well, i am enjoying as you can see from above > statement.> > > > He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be > stingy. > > > > Jagdish: Sometimes i feel that i am stingy. But sometimes other > way round.> > > > He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after > accumulating more and more money. > > > > Jagdish: Who does not want to increase his earning and would > not be after accumulating more and more money ? The above statement > is so perfect for me. > > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech > etc). > > > > Jagdish: I am able in doing my stuff. Earnings depends on job > profile. Speech is ok. I can talk to people and can easily convey my > message to them.> > > > > > WOW............. i satisfy so many criteria for 2nd lord in > 2nd... and I dont have second lord in 2nd...> > > > > > These criterias are so so so so so "Common-Human-Tendencies."> > > > Please prove me wrong...> > > > > > Thanks> > > > Jagdish> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > <>Dear Rashmi ji,> > You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. > Did you read this post? > /message/6360> > I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa > mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day > scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and > Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points > while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real > examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but > alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the > total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own > brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put > real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without > even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then > there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become > visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so > called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! > > Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! > It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is > true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! > > From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for > the understanding of everyone and for future reference. > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may > have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one > family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if > both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – > provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, > will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly > pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/gain/profit but would > be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be > after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able > individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the > results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This > is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may > not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a > bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if > other combinations also support the same." > > > > Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what > makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of > effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the > use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what > I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a > saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and > research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among > the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - > but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no > capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to > make. > > Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact > that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as > always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - > with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group > responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what > you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets > cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each > of the numerous derivations they provide. > > Hope this helps.> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > , rashmi patel > <rashmihpatel@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Sreenadh-ji,> > > here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male > child?/ you know i didnt told you this> > > that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd > time we only need daughter since> > > we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male > & so i was not my dicesion but my> > > wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my > family for abortion & yes i still feel> > > guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even > though it isnt my fault i am already ready> > > thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my > horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life > or family.> > > Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his > friend just wonted to check my kundali> > > i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is > strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no > daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i > will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me > i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> > > so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will > seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> > > relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing > grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> > > as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean > in all facters now this all things are> > > open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me > honest god i am not lieing. ok> > > he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple > recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> > > come true ok> > > your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of > 19 this other guy predicted sons only> > > i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my > kundali, my detail are as> > > [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 > long/lati> > > please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what > you or do you see other facters which my> > > kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you > agree with my kundali??> > > sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know > ok thanks> > > rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@> > > > > > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> > > RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is > it true?!!!> > > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my > opinion here.> > > Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the > laws.> > > > > > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to > give a driving test before learning driving.> > > > > > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U > quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the > contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give > male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > > > > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and > see all points are covered.> > > > > > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > > > > > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > > > > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the > text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > > > > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house > first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind > chart focusing on the law.> > > > > > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time > recorded to test the laws.> > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ > ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> > > Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> > > ancient_indian_ astrology> > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is > it true?!!!> > > > > > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> > > That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable > points. > > > ==>> > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of > different methodology but our > > > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed > then we have missed the correct aim.> > > <==> > > I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth > practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at > results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what > is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As > Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, > therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the > correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the > various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied > be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology > should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > > > ==>> > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of > aiming the correct target.> > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from > the ocean .> > > <==> > > Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > > > ==>> > > > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of > forum members to prove it with> > > > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > <==> > > Right you said. > > > ==>> > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known > chart and try to justify the event> > > > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> > > <==> > > You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart > reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may > be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups > the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the > lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets > verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on > known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. > There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I > don't think that the group should change its approach, because this > is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself > and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so > the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > > > ==>> > > > These books written by sages during their dates were > translated in different languages according to their own > understanding.> > > > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit > and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> > > <==> > > But please note that enough material is available to us from > those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject > as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this > group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi > horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. > That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and > that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group > itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is > visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even > though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of > astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for > alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic > Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and > numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime > focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> > > indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as > presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of > those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and > reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > > > ==>> > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after > pinpointing the event.> > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous > before the public.> > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > <==> > > Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we > need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using > and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, > Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. > We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the > event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and > good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' > based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various > techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and > to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in > this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such > method in our quest of astrology. > > > ==>> > > > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > <==> > > Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh > mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear respected all learnades,> > > > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and > intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita > ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of > different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the > target.> > > > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of > aiming the correct target.> > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from > the ocean .> > > > When we say that astrology is science then we should not > accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to > prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known > chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient > sages.> > > > These books written by sages during their dates were > translated in different languages according to their own > understanding.> > > > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit > and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > > > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different > ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different > meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > > > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct > meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and > verify them .> > > > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another > method is right.> > > > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, > Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach > is based on their verses.> > > > > > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after > pinpointing the event.> > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous > before the public.> > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows > this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > > > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan > (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here > with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > > > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify > the house.> > > > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > > > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger > brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord > of father and guru > > > > > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > > > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd > from 8th house.> > > > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent > in his speech and talkative. > > > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. > He may be eldest among his siblings.> > > > He may not be getting support from his father.> > > > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > > > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > > > Thanks and regards.> > > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > > > ==>> > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > > > <==> > > > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to > arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. > Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' > for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to > cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all > would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE > here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. > Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue > that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , > Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking > and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u > take up charts.> > > > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory > does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In > fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-> ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit > at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given > this kind of result so far.> > > > > > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using > different paths.> > > > > > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such > discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and > paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as > much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is > being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the > same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is > so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the > same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system > and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all > my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but > that is what I know.> > > > > > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in > the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort > in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers > here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u > take up charts.> > > > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the > same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u > go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if > u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th > house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse > or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned > income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If > 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and > enjoyment.> > > > > > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as > father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u > take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that > 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why > such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that > either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house > which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and > she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am > saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time > it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such > things.> > > > > > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit > is complicated. > > > > > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, > Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning > was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could > not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and > then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by > the author and the translators who might not have translated things > properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period > of time.> > > > > > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people > gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or > multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be > applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach > means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - > 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory > does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > ________> _______________> > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > > http://www./r/hs> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with > Mobile. Try it now.> >> > > > > > > > Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Yes Nairji is true in some of his observations, examples. Astrology is a "Daridra Vidya". It reduces wealth. That is due to a curse according to our texts by Mata Laxmi ( I think). Such childish remarks "is astrology a figment of imagination etc" was going to invoke unnecessary arguments and waste of time.That is the reason why I had written the first mail. People want definative results - like a T.V. remote. They do not understand that even our gods took birth to rectify any wrongs. They did not reach for the remote like we do. As for disbelief in astrology : you can continue to work irrespective of bad/good times irrespective of fate helping you or no and god does reward such a karmayogi, however that does not mean astrology does not exist. When you undergo some trials & tribulations - that is the time you can decide and exclaim whatever you want. --- On Sat, 12/1/08, sunil nair <astro_tellerkerala wrote: sunil nair <astro_tellerkerala Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! Date: Saturday, 12 January, 2008, 4:51 AM Hare ramakrishna, dear jagdish . Its u realy made me reay laugh . As i know why all this transformations happening . As usual u must hav come to this astro grps for getting free predictions when u were facing some problems and must got advise from so many neo astrologers and so called astrologers and many of the predictions might hav gone off the mark or their prediction were not wat u wanted to hear .Then u stayed back in grps unlike others who signs off immediately after getting a free reading .Also Ur kind of persons wanted to get read their chart again and again or to be discussed .or will be looking for some discussion conncted to u r chart happening and then jumping on spot with my chart has this and that .And then subsequent feed back of lies and false claims and self prasing and boasting and may be even if the reading is correct then abuse the astrologers for saving ur skin . I remeber in this grp itself when one astrologer commented abt one chart abt bad married life and relationship with woman ,actualy he presented this chart as if a known frnds chart ( actualy it was his chart and his wife has gone back to her house within months of marriage and that is the reason of his dasavatar in the jyothish grps ) He started claiming this nativ has very beautiful and willing relation with evn with 100s ladies of foreign origin ( its all paid prostitutes ) and he has great and thunderous lov and sex life and what ever u r saying is wrong and then that astrologer even stopped writing in all forums .( i know personly this astrologer and the fellow who jumped at first opportunity to get free reading ) How come india has produced so many such spiritual indians who make sure that their gurus will die of hunger and desperation .Here i remeber the great C S Patel died in his old age without proper money and care because of financial problems ,It will happen only in spiritual india and i remeber one american who just translated yavana hora got 4 crores indian ruppes on sponsorship from some organisation in US and his guru and guide who piloted this project suicided in varanasi ( no body knows why he travelled all the way to varanasi ) because he was very succesful financialy and was caring his wife and family wel .And left behind a gr8 sum of financial problems to his family to solve . ( this is fate of free astrology most popularised by all crumpling vedic astrology grps except this grp ,KAS and KP and one Lal kitab grp were they strictly discuss only their theoreys and even u cant find this free dom their even to make any out of context commends .anything except discussion will be moderated and deleted.In free grps U can find in memeber ship may 7000 or 8000 on home page but in actual not even 100 ppl will be even reading the mails .And no serious discussion ther and only this confusing predictions ,each will say and contradict each other and the free seeker dont know which one to take as he dont hav time to look for who is best and who is worst .And some ppl will join 100s of grps at a time and ask this question every where ,so will end up with 500 contradicting replys and finaly he himself will lose track who said what ) And the worst thing is even if some prediction fulfilled no feed back ,so the astrologer has no way benefitting .except some one will say ur prediction not fulfilled ,where as out of 100 may be 70 percent of his prediction s may be fulfilled .So as a dutiful man get abused again . Now those who say astrology will able to see only generic things .But think when ppl cannot take any decisions their own and they dont know what is ahead and they r at cross roads ,dont know which direction to take ,then only they approach astrologer ,when some is happy and triving i never find any one approaching in modern days ,even to fix a muhurtha excpt marriage or house building .When every hope is lost only anybody is coming to astrologers . even i think i find u were pointing towards ur attacks with respected bhaskar ji ( ur favrite of one time ) ,i dont know what mistake he did ,except he does lot of free reading without caring his own families needs .Tho by birth he is as rich as who can buy 10 jagdhish tuppads . even i find u also trying ur hand on some charts ( if my memory is correct ) .what was ur knowledge in astrology to do this devine science and now u find joke with basic discussions .here what was happening ,its simply a discussion on 2nd lord in 2nd .it was not reading of any ones chart specificaly .here some ppl start taking as opportunity to get their chart read and y u dont see this and that if that astrologer can see it .why cant u see it .And here u must accept defeat and things like that .Was any reading of charts done here ?? Then how a reserch work can be done on the basis of astrology ,which is already hidden and lost .How can we check whether this so called manglik dosh is happening or not and when what context .what i thought was publik will apreciate such moves and they will support with max chart and max feed backs .Here ppl with young age and many of the charts significations may be yet to fully blossom in coming years .and many forget that this to fruitify a dasa also connected to those significations recquired ,and it can also happen in worst transits ,if the finding was bad .Also in chart itself so many bhanga yogas may be there . Here some r behaving like those blind men see the elephant .And this kind of ppl thinks they can make fun of any body who is trying to do some servise .As they know only selfish ness from head to toe .All wanted to ask free questions and by sitting at their comforts and even if they make a miss cal its duty of astrologer to call back and giv a free reading .How come our indian s become this much spiritual .To make sure that those who practise or follow this noble indian scinces shud be humilaited . But nothing to say when millions of ruppees were spent on election surveys and went wrong ,weather forcast went wrong on same day ( and governemnt is spending billions of ruppes and has a dept for it ) ,same with so called economists ,and also market pundits and comapny advisers and economic advisers .But any body can hit on astrologers or astro lovers as if its a drum discared in street . The clear signal is that --u r assessed on what u made as wealth or what r u making in currency exchange and but they think themselves - see us with our peanut brains we r making millions of ruppes ,see how smart we r .u fools look at urself . So this worlds greatest intellectual profession is being judged this way as its available free .As many gurus go down to the levl of normal ppl than making an air of dignity for themselves .And this free is producing thankless reactions .As they dont contribute any thing ,Here i respect osho s words who was against giving anything free ,he used to say if u dont hav ur hard earned money ,u work in kitchen and gets ur due . Labda vidhye guru dweshi ( the thankless and evil ppl will abuse gurus after getting vidhya ) Labhda bharyestu mataram ( such ppl after getting a beutiful wife will abuse his own mother ) Labhda putra pathim nari : ( such ladies after getting a good son will abuse their husbands ) labhdaste aryogya chikilsakam ( such ppl will abuse the physician after himself getting into full health after a free treatment ) . This is bartha hari in neeti saram said -may be 1000s of years back .So in this era nothing surprising . PS +====== ( thankless ppl will hav there 9th lord in 8th ,or will be debilated ,or afflicted ,along with may be jupiter afflicted and ill placed and also 2nd lord( as to speak lies and bad things ) also in some of the hidden rasis or will be afflicted ) and they end up finaly unlucky .since 9th lord is also dharma they will abuse dharam and dharmik things .) So pls check any thing of this sort is in ur chart .Also check if ur dasa any way connected with 9th house ,if so u r inviting also wrath of rishis .As some un burned karma u r activating .Finaly 9th house is deciding our bahgya ) such ppl better stay clear away from even reading or practising astrology . Now u can continue with ur mission and i hav all my support with u . Sorry if i hurt u or become personal . regrs sunil nair om shreem mahalaxmai namah. ancient_indian_ astrology, Prathamesn Chawan <upaoakcrest@ ...> wrote:>> thats great... if my mail can make you laugh...> > he he he> > Jagdish> > vinita kumar shankar_mamta@ ... wrote:> Oh dear, i had such a good laugh reading this message > > ancient_indian_ astrology, Prathamesn Chawan > upaoakcrest@ wrote:> >> > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. > > > > Jagdish: I am egotic. But who is not egotic in this world ? If > you dont have ego then you are a saint.> > > > > > > > He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more > than one family (very close friendly relationship with another > family as if both are one). > > > > Jagdish: Well.. now a days almost everyone has more than > one "near marriage relations." I also had.> > > > He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other > yogas also indicate the same. > > > > Jagdish: yet to fructify.> > > > > > He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. > > > > Jagdish: What is the definition of wealth ? I get food to eat, > bed to sleep, dress to wear, and car to drive. I can spend money on > movie theater, clubs, friends, eating-out and other such kind of fun > activities. Well, i dont have a BMW, Mercedes or a Helicopter or > private jet.> > > > > > He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. > > > > Jagdish: Oh well, i am enjoying as you can see from above > statement.> > > > He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be > stingy. > > > > Jagdish: Sometimes i feel that i am stingy. But sometimes other > way round.> > > > He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after > accumulating more and more money. > > > > Jagdish: Who does not want to increase his earning and would > not be after accumulating more and more money ? The above statement > is so perfect for me. > > > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech > etc). > > > > Jagdish: I am able in doing my stuff. Earnings depends on job > profile. Speech is ok. I can talk to people and can easily convey my > message to them.> > > > > > WOW......... .... i satisfy so many criteria for 2nd lord in > 2nd... and I dont have second lord in 2nd...> > > > > > These criterias are so so so so so "Common-Human- Tendencies. "> > > > Please prove me wrong...> > > > > > Thanks> > > > Jagdish> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > <>Dear Rashmi ji,> > You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. > Did you read this post? > http://groups. / group/ancient_ indian_astrology /message/ 6360> > I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa > mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day > scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and > Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points > while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real > examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but > alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the > total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own > brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put > real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without > even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then > there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become > visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so > called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! > > Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! > It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is > true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! > > From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for > the understanding of everyone and for future reference. > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may > have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one > family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if > both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – > provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, > will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly > pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would > be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be > after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able > individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the > results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This > is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may > not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a > bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if > other combinations also support the same." > > > > Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what > makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of > effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the > use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what > I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a > saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and > research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among > the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - > but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no > capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to > make. > > Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact > that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as > always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - > with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group > responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what > you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets > cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each > of the numerous derivations they provide. > > Hope this helps.> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > ancient_indian_ astrology, rashmi patel > <rashmihpatel@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Sreenadh-ji,> > > here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male > child?/ you know i didnt told you this> > > that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd > time we only need daughter since> > > we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male > & so i was not my dicesion but my> > > wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my > family for abortion & yes i still feel> > > guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even > though it isnt my fault i am already ready> > > thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my > horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life > or family.> > > Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his > friend just wonted to check my kundali> > > i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is > strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no > daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i > will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me > i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> > > so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will > seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> > > relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing > grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> > > as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean > in all facters now this all things are> > > open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me > honest god i am not lieing. ok> > > he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple > recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> > > come true ok> > > your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of > 19 this other guy predicted sons only> > > i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my > kundali, my detail are as> > > [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 > long/lati> > > please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what > you or do you see other facters which my> > > kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you > agree with my kundali??> > > sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know > ok thanks> > > rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@> > > ancient_indian_ astrology> > > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is > it true?!!!> > > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my > opinion here.> > > Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the > laws.> > > > > > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to > give a driving test before learning driving.> > > > > > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U > quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the > contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give > male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > > > > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and > see all points are covered.> > > > > > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > > > > > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > > > > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the > text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > > > > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house > first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind > chart focusing on the law.> > > > > > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time > recorded to test the laws.> > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ > ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> > > Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> > > ancient_indian_ astrology> > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is > it true?!!!> > > > > > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> > > That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable > points. > > > ==>> > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of > different methodology but our > > > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed > then we have missed the correct aim.> > > <==> > > I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth > practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at > results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what > is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As > Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, > therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the > correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the > various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied > be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology > should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > > > ==>> > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of > aiming the correct target.> > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from > the ocean .> > > <==> > > Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > > > ==>> > > > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of > forum members to prove it with> > > > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > <==> > > Right you said. > > > ==>> > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known > chart and try to justify the event> > > > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> > > <==> > > You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart > reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may > be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups > the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the > lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets > verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on > known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. > There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I > don't think that the group should change its approach, because this > is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself > and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so > the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > > > ==>> > > > These books written by sages during their dates were > translated in different languages according to their own > understanding.> > > > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit > and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> > > <==> > > But please note that enough material is available to us from > those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject > as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this > group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi > horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. > That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and > that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group > itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is > visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even > though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of > astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for > alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic > Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and > numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime > focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> > > indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as > presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of > those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and > reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > > > ==>> > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after > pinpointing the event.> > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous > before the public.> > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > <==> > > Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we > need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using > and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, > Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. > We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the > event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and > good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' > based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various > techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and > to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in > this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such > method in our quest of astrology. > > > ==>> > > > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > <==> > > Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh > mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear respected all learnades,> > > > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and > intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita > ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of > different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the > target.> > > > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of > aiming the correct target.> > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from > the ocean .> > > > When we say that astrology is science then we should not > accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to > prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known > chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient > sages.> > > > These books written by sages during their dates were > translated in different languages according to their own > understanding.> > > > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit > and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > > > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different > ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different > meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > > > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct > meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and > verify them .> > > > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another > method is right.> > > > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, > Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach > is based on their verses.> > > > > > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after > pinpointing the event.> > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous > before the public.> > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows > this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > > > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan > (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here > with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > > > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify > the house.> > > > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > > > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger > brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord > of father and guru > > > > > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > > > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd > from 8th house.> > > > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent > in his speech and talkative. > > > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. > He may be eldest among his siblings.> > > > He may not be getting support from his father.> > > > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > > > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > > > Thanks and regards.> > > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > > > ==>> > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > > > <==> > > > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to > arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. > Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' > for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to > cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all > would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE > here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. > Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue > that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , > Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking > and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u > take up charts.> > > > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory > does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In > fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-> ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit > at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given > this kind of result so far.> > > > > > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using > different paths.> > > > > > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such > discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and > paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as > much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is > being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the > same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is > so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the > same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system > and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all > my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but > that is what I know.> > > > > > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in > the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort > in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers > here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u > take up charts.> > > > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the > same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u > go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if > u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th > house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse > or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned > income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If > 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and > enjoyment.> > > > > > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as > father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u > take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that > 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why > such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that > either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house > which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and > she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am > saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time > it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such > things.> > > > > > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit > is complicated. > > > > > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, > Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning > was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could > not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and > then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by > the author and the translators who might not have translated things > properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period > of time.> > > > > > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people > gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or > multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be > applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach > means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - > 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory > does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> ____________ ___> > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > > http://www.. com/r/hs> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with > Mobile. Try it now.> >> > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.> Why delete messages? Unlimited storage is just a click away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Dear Jagdish, Female only children - a human tendency?!! Every self projecting individual a success in job and life?!! Astrology shouldn't consider the human tendencies and psychology?!!!! Jagdish you make me laugh.... :) Every dress that suits you is not yours.... Every life story that resembles you is not yours..... Last but not the least... Every free reading presented in is not yours.... ;=) Continue to try to squeeze out one from others.... continue trying to know about your future job possibilities and looking at your own chart from various angles, but still failing to make any meaning out of it....and wondering, 'does the charts tell something at all?....' Ya, that is one of the most common human tendency I watched in ... And you are no exception - can you be? Is there the capability to be different in you? Is there some potential residing? Or are you too just one among those common flock?! Meditate...... Answers are not always that simple.... and never in capsule.....! Note: Souvik ji and Sunil ji has already presented some truths beautifully - which could be help in clearing many of your doubts - if you like them or not. Still a kid, you have ample time. Love and regards, Sreenadh , Prathamesn Chawan <upaoakcrest wrote: Re: Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!! "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. Jagdish: I am egotic. But who is not egotic in this world ? If you dont have ego then you are a saint. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). Jagdish: Well.. now a days almost everyone has more than one "near marriage relations." I also had. He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. Jagdish: yet to fructify. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. Jagdish: What is the definition of wealth ? I get food to eat, bed to sleep, dress to wear, and car to drive. I can spend money on movie theater, clubs, friends, eating-out and other such kind of fun activities. Well, i dont have a BMW, Mercedes or a Helicopter or private jet. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. Jagdish: Oh well, i am enjoying as you can see from above statement. He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be stingy. Jagdish: Sometimes i feel that i am stingy. But sometimes other way round. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. Jagdish: Who does not want to increase his earning and would not be after accumulating more and more money ? The above statement is so perfect for me. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Jagdish: I am able in doing my stuff. Earnings depends on job profile. Speech is ok. I can talk to people and can easily convey my message to them. WOW............. i satisfy so many criteria for 2nd lord in 2nd... and I dont have second lord in 2nd... These criterias are so so so so so "Common-Human-Tendencies." Please prove me wrong... Thanks Jagdish > > > Sreenadh sreesog wrote:> <>Dear Rashmi ji,> You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. Did you read this post? /message/6360> I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!! > Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!! It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!! > From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for the understanding of everyone and for future reference. > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/gain/profit but would be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if other combinations also support the same." > > Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything - but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to make. > Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages - with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each of the numerous derivations they provide. > Hope this helps.> Love and regards,> Sreenadh> , rashmi patel rashmihpatel@ wrote:> >> > Dear Sreenadh-ji,> > here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male child?/ you know i didnt told you this> > that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd time we only need daughter since> > we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male & so i was not my dicesion but my> > wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my family for abortion & yes i still feel> > guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even though it isnt my fault i am already ready> > thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life or family.> > Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his friend just wonted to check my kundali> > i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> > so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> > relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> > as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean in all facters now this all things are> > open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me honest god i am not lieing. ok> > he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> > come true ok> > your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of 19 this other guy predicted sons only> > i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my kundali, my detail are as> > [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12 long/lati> > please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what you or do you see other facters which my> > kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you agree with my kundali??> > sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know ok thanks> > rashmikant patel> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@> > > > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> > RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my opinion here.> > Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the laws.> > > > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to give a driving test before learning driving.> > > > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give male child as in came of Rashmi Patel. > > > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and see all points are covered.> > > > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > > > Otherwise, what are u testing? > > > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got. > > > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind chart focusing on the law.> > > > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time recorded to test the laws.> > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [ ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> > Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> > ancient_indian_ astrology> > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!!> > > > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> > That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable points. > > ==>> > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our > > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > <==> > I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results, therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated. > > ==>> > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> > <==> > Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here. > > ==>> > > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with> > > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > <==> > Right you said. > > ==>> > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event> > > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> > <==> > You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better. There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I don't think that the group should change its approach, because this is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations. > > ==>> > > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> > <==> > But please note that enough material is available to us from those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them. That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> > indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it. > > ==>> > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > <==> > Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit, Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be. We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event' based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such method in our quest of astrology. > > ==>> > > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > <==> > Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> > >> > > Dear respected all learnades,> > > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the target.> > > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of aiming the correct target.> > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion. > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from the ocean .> > > When we say that astrology is science then we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient sages.> > > These books written by sages during their dates were translated in different languages according to their own understanding.> > > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and verify them .> > > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another method is right.> > > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari, Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach is based on their verses.> > > > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after pinpointing the event.> > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous before the public.> > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify the house.> > > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord of father and guru > > > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd from 8th house.> > > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent in his speech and talkative. > > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly. He may be eldest among his siblings.> > > He may not be getting support from his father.> > > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > > Thanks and regards.> > > Ramesh Mishra > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > > ==>> > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > > <==> > > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step. Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug' for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Ash,> > > > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given this kind of result so far.> > > > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using different paths.> > > > > > > > All the best!> > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > Krishna> > > > > > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but that is what I know.> > > > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u take up charts.> > > > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them pass though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and enjoyment.> > > > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such things.> > > > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit is complicated. > > > > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji, Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by the author and the translators who might not have translated things properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period of time.> > > > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% - 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory does not hold any water.> > > > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> > >> > > > > > > > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www./r/hs> >> > > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Dear Sunil ji, You disclosed may unpleasant truths. A fact and fate of some - the current condition; yes, a suffering due to 'common human tendencies' or is it 'common netizen tendencies' lacking the depth? Love and regards, Sreenadh , "sunil nair" <astro_tellerkerala wrote:>> > > > Hare ramakrishna,> > dear jagdish .> > > > Its u realy made me reay laugh .> > As i know why all this transformations happening .> > > > As usual u must hav come to this astro grps for getting free> predictions when u were facing some problems and must got advise from so> many neo astrologers and so called astrologers and many of the> predictions might hav gone off the mark or their prediction were not wat> u wanted to hear .Then u stayed back in grps unlike others who signs off> immediately after getting a free reading .Also Ur kind of persons wanted> to get read their chart again and again or to be discussed .or will be> looking for some discussion conncted to u r chart happening and then> jumping on spot with my chart has this and that .And then subsequent> feed back of lies and false claims and self prasing and boasting and> may be even if the reading is correct then abuse the astrologers for> saving ur skin .> > > > I remeber in this grp itself when one astrologer commented abt one> chart abt bad married life and relationship with woman ,actualy he> presented this chart as if a known frnds chart ( actualy it was his> chart and his wife has gone back to her house within months of marriage> and that is the reason of his dasavatar in the jyothish grps ) He> started claiming this nativ has very beautiful and willing relation with> evn with 100s ladies of foreign origin ( its all paid prostitutes ) and> he has great and thunderous lov and sex life and what ever u r saying is> wrong and then that astrologer even stopped writing in all forums .( i> know personly this astrologer and the fellow who jumped at first> opportunity to get free reading )> > > > How come india has produced so many such spiritual indians who make> sure that their gurus will die of hunger and desperation .Here i remeber> the great C S Patel died in his old age without proper money and care> because of financial problems ,It will happen only in spiritual india> and i remeber one american who just translated yavana hora got 4 crores> indian ruppes on sponsorship from some organisation in US and his guru> and guide who piloted this project suicided in varanasi ( no body knows> why he travelled all the way to varanasi ) because he was very succesful> financialy and was caring his wife and family wel .And left behind a> gr8 sum of financial problems to his family to solve .> > > > ( this is fate of free astrology most popularised by all crumpling > vedic astrology grps except this grp ,KAS and KP and one Lal kitab grp> were they strictly discuss only their theoreys and even u cant find this> free dom their even to make any out of context commends .anything> except discussion will be moderated and deleted.In free grps U can find> in memeber ship may 7000 or 8000 on home page but in actual not even 100> ppl will be even reading the mails .And no serious discussion ther and> only this confusing predictions ,each will say and contradict each other> and the free seeker dont know which one to take as he dont hav time to> look for who is best and who is worst .And some ppl will join 100s of> grps at a time and ask this question every where ,so will end up with> 500 contradicting replys and finaly he himself will lose track who said> what )> > And the worst thing is even if some prediction fulfilled no feed back> ,so the astrologer has no way benefitting .except some one will say ur> prediction not fulfilled ,where as out of 100 may be 70 percent of his> prediction s may be fulfilled .So as a dutiful man get abused again .> > > > Now those who say astrology will able to see only generic things .But> think when ppl cannot take any decisions their own and they dont know> what is ahead and they r at cross roads ,dont know which direction to> take ,then only they approach astrologer ,when some is happy and triving> i never find any one approaching in modern days ,even to fix a muhurtha> excpt marriage or house building .When every hope is lost only anybody> is coming to astrologers .> > > > even i think i find u were pointing towards ur attacks with respected> bhaskar ji ( ur favrite of one time ) ,i dont know what mistake he did> ,except he does lot of free reading without caring his own families> needs .Tho by birth he is as rich as who can buy 10 jagdhish tuppads .> > > > even i find u also trying ur hand on some charts ( if my memory is> correct ) .what was ur knowledge in astrology to do this devine science> and now u find joke with basic discussions .here what was happening> ,its simply a discussion on 2nd lord in 2nd .it was not reading of any> ones chart specificaly .here some ppl start taking as opportunity to get> their chart read and y u dont see this and that if that astrologer can> see it .why cant u see it .And here u must accept defeat and things like> that .Was any reading of charts done here ??> > Then how a reserch work can be done on the basis of astrology ,which is> already hidden and lost .How can we check whether this so called manglik> dosh is happening or not and when what context .what i thought was> publik will apreciate such moves and they will support with max chart> and max feed backs .Here ppl with young age and many of the charts> significations may be yet to fully blossom in coming years .and many> forget that this to fruitify a dasa also connected to those> significations recquired ,and it can also happen in worst transits ,if> the finding was bad .Also in chart itself so many bhanga yogas may be> there .> > > > Here some r behaving like those blind men see the elephant .And this> kind of ppl thinks they can make fun of any body who is trying to do> some servise .As they know only selfish ness from head to toe .All> wanted to ask free questions and by sitting at their comforts and even> if they make a miss cal its duty of astrologer to call back and giv a> free reading .How come our indian s become this much spiritual .To make> sure that those who practise or follow this noble indian scinces shud be> humilaited .> > But nothing to say when millions of ruppees were spent on election> surveys and went wrong ,weather forcast went wrong on same day ( and> governemnt is spending billions of ruppes and has a dept for it ) ,same> with so called economists ,and also market pundits and comapny advisers> and economic advisers .But any body can hit on astrologers or astro> lovers as if its a drum discared in street .> > > > The clear signal is that --u r assessed on what u made as wealth or> what r u making in currency exchange and but they think themselves -> see us with our peanut brains we r making millions of ruppes ,see how> smart we r .u fools look at urself .> > > > So this worlds greatest intellectual profession is being judged this> way as its available free .As many gurus go down to the levl of normal> ppl than making an air of dignity for themselves .And this free is> producing thankless reactions .As they dont contribute any thing ,Here i> respect osho s words who was against giving anything free ,he used to> say if u dont hav ur hard earned money ,u work in kitchen and gets ur> due .> > > > Labda vidhye guru dweshi ( the thankless and evil ppl will abuse gurus> after getting vidhya )> > Labhda bharyestu mataram ( such ppl after getting a beutiful wife will> abuse his own mother )> > Labhda putra pathim nari : ( such ladies after getting a good son will> abuse their husbands )> > labhdaste aryogya chikilsakam ( such ppl will abuse the physician after> himself getting into full health after a free treatment ) .> > This is bartha hari in neeti saram said -may be 1000s of years back .So> in this era nothing surprising .> > PS> > +======> > ( thankless ppl will hav there 9th lord in 8th ,or will be debilated ,or> afflicted ,along with may be jupiter afflicted and ill placed and also> 2nd lord( as to speak lies and bad things ) also in some of the hidden> rasis or will be afflicted ) and they end up finaly unlucky .since 9th> lord is also dharma they will abuse dharam and dharmik things .) So pls> check any thing of this sort is in ur chart .Also check if ur dasa any> way connected with 9th house ,if so u r inviting also wrath of rishis> .As some un burned karma u r activating .Finaly 9th house is deciding> our bahgya ) such ppl better stay clear away from even reading or> practising astrology .> > > > Now u can continue with ur mission and i hav all my support with u .> > Sorry if i hurt u or become personal .> > > > regrs sunil nair> > > > om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > > > > > > , Prathamesn Chawan> upaoakcrest@ wrote:> >> > thats great... if my mail can make you laugh...> >> > he he he> >> > Jagdish> >> > vinita kumar shankar_mamta@ wrote:> > Oh dear, i had such a good laugh reading this message > >> > , Prathamesn Chawan> > upaoakcrest@ wrote:> > >> > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic.> > >> > > Jagdish: I am egotic. But who is not egotic in this world ? If> > you dont have ego then you are a saint.> > >> > >> > >> > > He may have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more> > than one family (very close friendly relationship with another> > family as if both are one).> > >> > > Jagdish: Well.. now a days almost everyone has more than> > one "near marriage relations." I also had.> > >> > > He may not have any son, but may have daughters – provided other> > yogas also indicate the same.> > >> > > Jagdish: yet to fructify.> > >> > >> > > He would be wealthy, will indulge in righteous deeds.> > >> > > Jagdish: What is the definition of wealth ? I get food to eat,> > bed to sleep, dress to wear, and car to drive. I can spend money on> > movie theater, clubs, friends, eating-out and other such kind of fun> > activities. Well, i dont have a BMW, Mercedes or a Helicopter or> > private jet.> > >> > >> > > He will enjoy much worldly pleasures.> > >> > > Jagdish: Oh well, i am enjoying as you can see from above> > statement.> > >> > > He will have much income/earnings/ gain/profit but would be> > stingy.> > >> > > Jagdish: Sometimes i feel that i am stingy. But sometimes other> > way round.> > >> > > He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be after> > accumulating more and more money.> > >> > > Jagdish: Who does not want to increase his earning and would> > not be after accumulating more and more money ? The above statement> > is so perfect for me.> > >> > > He would be a very able individual (in work, earnings, speech> > etc).> > >> > > Jagdish: I am able in doing my stuff. Earnings depends on job> > profile. Speech is ok. I can talk to people and can easily convey my> > message to them.> > >> > >> > > WOW............. i satisfy so many criteria for 2nd lord in> > 2nd... and I dont have second lord in 2nd...> > >> > >> > > These criterias are so so so so so "Common-Human-Tendencies."> > >> > > Please prove me wrong...> > >> > >> > > Thanks> > >> > > Jagdish> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > <>Dear Rashmi ji,> > > You got the whole point and purpose of the exersise wrong. > > Did you read this post?> > /message/6360> > > I was simply driving home the point that - Parasara and Lomasa> > mentioned the results 'many wives' and 'no son', but later day> > scholars such as Meenaraja, Nrisimha (Jataka Saradeepa) and> > Balabhadra (Hora Ratna) disagreed with him only on these two points> > while discussing the same. This is what I wanted to show, with real> > examples and clearly helping all to realize why it happened - but> > alas we don't have enough patience always! And we want to see the> > total in the first instance itself (without exercising our own> > brain), and then blame the people (the sages and scholars) who put> > real effort in understanding various combinations - ya, without> > even knowing that 'if we can't see the small picture clear, then> > there is not even a ray of hope that the total picture will become> > visible to us'!!! Yes, this is really the current condition of so> > called modern day 'astrological truth seekers'!!> > > Why all even fails to notice even the title of the thread?!!!> > It reads "Oh! Friends! Is it true?!!" - If I believed that it is> > true to 100% then what was the use of such a title?!!> > > From the above mail, here is the final reading I presented for> > the understanding of everyone and for future reference.> > > "If 2nd lord is in 2nd house, the native would be egotic. He may> > have affairs or near marriage relations, or may have more than one> > family (very close friendly relationship with another family as if> > both are one). He may not have any son, but may have daughters –> > provided other yogas also indicate the same. He would be wealthy,> > will indulge in righteous deeds. He will enjoy much worldly> > pleasures. He will have much income/earnings/gain/profit but would> > be stingy. He will always try to increase his earnings, and would be> > after accumulating more and more money. He would be a very able> > individual (in work, earnings, speech etc). Meenaraja omits the> > results `many wives' and `no son' given by Parasara and Lomasa. This> > is a true guidance to us indicating that those two said results may> > not actualize in some horoscopes for the said combination - so be a> > bit cautious about those two derivations, and speak them out only if> > other combinations also support the same."> > >> > > Yes, this kind of impatience and unsystematic approach is what> > makes me frustrated in detailed discussions; If the same amount of> > effort and patience is not coming from the other side - what is the> > use with this nonsense exercises? I am forced to talk more than what> > I should - that too, without purpose and usefulness! There is a> > saying 'slow and study wins the raise' - in astrological study and> > research too the same is true. Hope this helps. We are not among> > the thousand groups, who have ready made solutions for everything -> > but instead we have no solutions for anything - and there is no> > capsules available here. This would be the point I would like to> > make.> > > Concerning I am going wrong - simply understand it as a fact> > that - it is always a possibility and I am no authority. What (as> > always) I am trying to do is presenting the views of the sages -> > with possible explanations and verifying it in public from the group> > responses. And what is the benefit? The benefit itself is what> > you have seen - the misunderstanding regarding those quotes gets> > cleared and we learn to what extend we should give weightage to each> > of the numerous derivations they provide.> > > Hope this helps.> > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > > , rashmi patel> > <rashmihpatel@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Sreenadh-ji,> > > > here i read that Mr Ashji, is asking why i have only male> > child?/ you know i didnt told you this> > > > that infact i need a daughter & when my wife was pregnant 3rd> > time we only need daughter since> > > > we had 2 sons but when we had checked reports again it was male> > & so i was not my dicesion but my> > > > wife didnt wont son so she had aborted, i had a big issue in my> > family for abortion & yes i still feel> > > > guilty foe wrong doing i think god will punish me for this even> > though it isnt my fault i am already ready> > > > thinking during my sani [sade sati] time. anyway people says my> > horoscope is good, very good, i may dont have any complain for life> > or family.> > > > Let me tell when i was 19 yrs first in life a family friends his> > friend just wonted to check my kundali> > > > i showned him & at that time i predicted that my kundali is> > strong good at that time he said that i will only get sons & no> > daughter,my wife will be from abroad[usa]will be pretty looking,i> > will sufer from pyles & i was laughing for that & trust me belive me> > i sufered from pyles after 6 months, not now> > > > so after i sufered i went for more detail & he said i will> > seteled in western world [usa]will be in public> > > > relation business yes[hotel] & several others like any thing> > grows through sun & yes[grocery store]> > > > as time went on all that he predicted at 17 yrs came TRUE i mean> > in all facters now this all things are> > > > open in my small village in india everyone knows this trust me> > honest god i am not lieing. ok> > > > he even told me i will do donations religiously built temple> > recently[ganesh] so every thing so far had> > > > come true ok> > > > your 2nd on 2nd really didnt applied??/ why ?? & why at age of> > 19 this other guy predicted sons only> > > > i mean what did he saw that you didnt see??? specially for my> > kundali, my detail are as> > > > [12 may 1957,] /[ 04;25 am]/[ aden[yemen] /[3hrsgmt] 12n45,45e12> > long/lati> > > > please if you are studying charts sreenadhji pls find out what> > you or do you see other facters which my> > > > kundali is right now going on,pls check it & tell me do you> > agree with my kundali??> > > > sreendhji i am sorry for lengthy writings. but pls let me know> > ok thanks> > > > rashmikant patel> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@> > > > > > > > Wednesday, January 9, 2008 9:56:34 PM> > > > RE: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is> > it true?!!!> > > >> > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > >> > > > You have talked about blind charts. I would like to give my> > opinion here.> > > > Your idea is good, but to reach that stage u must first get the> > laws.> > > >> > > > Trying to solve blind charts, first, might be like trying to> > give a driving test before learning driving.> > > >> > > > So, for example, say u took 2nd lord in 2nd house as 1 law. U> > quoted so many texts. Let us first get the proper law. Get all the> > contras, or bhangas. Find out under what circumstance might give> > male child as in came of Rashmi Patel.> > > >> > > > Once you do that, take 20 charts to 100 charts from members and> > see all points are covered.> > > >> > > > Then u can do a blind chart to see if that technique holds.> > > >> > > > Otherwise, what are u testing?> > > >> > > > If you had tested your 2nd lord in 2nd house theory based on the> > text u have printed, honestly how many points you would have got.> > > >> > > > You should find out the entire law of 2nd lord in 2nd house> > first is my opinion. Study it from all angles and then do a blind> > chart focusing on the law.> > > >> > > > In the mean time collect some charts that have perfect time> > recorded to test the laws.> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Cheers !!!> > > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology [> > ancient_indian_ astrology ] On Behalf Of Sreenadh> > > > Wednesday January 9, 2008 10:58 AM> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology> > > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Quiz - Oh! Friends! Is> > it true?!!!> > > >> > > > Dear Remesh Mishra ji,> > > > That was a beautiful mail, matured, presenting many valuable> > points.> > > > ==>> > > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of> > different methodology but our> > > > > main aim is to hit the bull of the target. If it is missed> > then we have missed the correct aim.> > > > <==> > > > I agree to those points 100% and feel that any down to earth> > practical astrologer will do the /same. If not we cannot arrive at> > results that fructify with an accuracy of at least 7/10 points what> > is the use of efforts put into understanding this subject at all! As> > Krishneeyam puts 'Astrology is for predicting the correct results,> > therefore by all means the astrologers should try to arrive at the> > correct derivation' - Yes, this is what important and not the> > various methodologies/ approaches. What ever the methodology applied> > be, if it helps us to arrive at the correct result, that methodology> > should be appreciated; and such guidance should be appreciated.> > > > ==>> > > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of> > aiming the correct target.> > > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion.> > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from> > the ocean .> > > > <==> > > > Yes. I hope , you will agree that is what we are all doing here.> > > > ==>> > > > > we should not accept any method blindly. This is the duty of> > forum members to prove it with> > > > > suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > > <==> > > > Right you said.> > > > ==>> > > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known> > chart and try to justify the event> > > > > taking help of dictum of ancient sages.> > > > <==> > > > You have a point - and you may have noted that with blind chart> > reading and other such readings we are doing it occasionally or may> > be rather frequently. But you should note that unlike other groups> > the approach followed by this group is entirely different - here the> > lessons from sage horas are discussed first, and then the same gets> > verified or negated by the responses of the group members based on> > known charts - and the whole exercise helps us to learn better.> > There is no teacher in this group, but only students - me too. I> > don't think that the group should change its approach, because this> > is a decision and approach decided while forming this group itself> > and is still followed and has given this much fruitful results - so> > the approach will remain the same - with occasional oscillations.> > > > ==>> > > > > These books written by sages during their dates were> > translated in different languages according to their own> > understanding.> > > > > Books, during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit> > and the originals are either mutilated or lost.> > > > <==> > > > But please note that enough material is available to us from> > those lost Rishi horas which CAN help us to reconstruct this subject> > as per their own understanding - and as the home page states this> > group is preciously to achieve the same; and depends mainly on Rishi> > horas - and try to see things based on the path shown to us by them.> > That is why the group name itself is 'ancient' indian astrology, and> > that is why the same is stated in the home page of the group> > itself. 'Reconstruction of this ancient branch of knowledge as it is> > visualized by the sages' remains the ultimate aim of the group, even> > though any alternative methodologies to approach the subject of> > astrology are welcome in a friendly manner. The respect for> > alternative approaches like KP, KAS, Western astrology, Vedic> > Tropical astrology, Lal Kitab, Tajik system, Nadi astrology and> > numerous other methedologies is certainly there but still this prime> > focus of the group is in 'AIA' (Ancient> > > > indian astrology - the ancient Nirayana system of astrology as> > presented by the sages in Rishi Horas). It is the AVAILABILITY of> > those quotes that prompted us to concentrate on the same, and> > reconstruct the methodology/ approach - as they put it.> > > > ==>> > > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after> > pinpointing the event.> > > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous> > before the public.> > > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > > <==> > > > Right you said - and that can be another major thread. Yes, we> > need to come into some solid foundations and approach here, by using> > and verifying various methodologies - whether it be Dasa, Transit,> > Ashtaka Varga, KP ruling planets, Nadi system or what ever that be.> > We can try with blind charts to pin point the period at which the> > event took place - and certainly that would be a nice discussion and> > good experience. I request you start a thread on 'timing of event'> > based on a chart. I am also much eager to know about various> > techniques used by the astrologers and also to know how useful and> > to the point they are - AIA too does not have any wonder drug in> > this regard, and it would be beautiful if we encounter any such> > method in our quest of astrology.> > > > ==>> > > > > Lastly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > > <==> > > > Ya. And once it is through, then with 2nd house lord in 3rd. > > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > >> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology , ramesh> > mishra <aarceemastro2002@ ...> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear respected all learnades,> > > > > It is our good luck that this forum got very nice and> > intelligent scholars like Sreenadhji, Krishnaji, Ash ji, Vinita> > ji,Kiran ji and many others.> > > > > We are all intend to learn astrology with the help of> > different methodology but our main aim is to hit the bull of the> > target.> > > > > If it is missed then we have missed the correct aim.> > > > > It is good to churn the ocean of astrology with the hope of> > aiming the correct target.> > > > > We should not take or rather feel other way while discussion.> > > > > With discussion only we may take out something valuables from> > the ocean .> > > > > When we say that astrology is science then we should not> > accept any method blindly. This is the duty of forum members to> > prove it with suitable derivations irrespective of methodology.> > > > > For this purpose Sreenadh ji and all members take a known> > chart and try to justify the event taking help of dicturm of ancient> > sages.> > > > > These books written by sages during their dates were> > translated in different languages according to their own> > understanding.> > > > > Books,during their days, were written in Devnagari Samskrit> > and the originals are either mutiliated or lost.> > > > > Samskrit is such a language you may interpret two different> > ways according to own understandings. Thus it may give two different> > meanings which may contradict with other meaning.> > > > > So it is now very important for us to find out the correct> > meaning with the help of discussion taking many many charts and> > verify them .> > > > > One should not so feel that one method is wrong and another> > method is right.> > > > > BPHS, Phaldeepika, Maansagari, Samhitas, Laghu Parasari,> > Saravali etcetc are backbone of the science and hence our approach> > is based on their verses.> > > > >> > > > > Our main idea should be to find out the correct timing after> > pinpointing the event.> > > > > Generally astrologers fail in timing and it becomes ridiculous> > before the public.> > > > > Hence astrology gets bad name and astrologer too.> > > > > Lstly let us continue with our topic on 2L in 2H.> > > > > I am taking the chart of lawyer given by Krishna Ji. He knows> > this native very well. If anything goes wrong he may correct us.> > > > > The chart has 2nd lord in 2nd house. 2H indicates Kutumb sthan> > (Family), speech, it is dhansthaan, right eye ( I am confused here> > with right/left), education in childhood. It is marak sthaan also.> > > > > Here Me being exalted and lord of 2nd and 11th house fortify> > the house.> > > > > Ma joins the Me and has aspect of Ju.> > > > > Ma is yogkarak for this chart. Ma is sthir karak of younger> > brother. Ma is also badhakesh for this chart.Ma as badhakesh is lord> > of father and guru> > > > >> > > > > Ma is enemy of Me so here Ma will go against Me.> > > > > On the other hand fortified Ju lord of 5th and 8th aspects 2nd> > from 8th house.> > > > > The person may be endowed with wealth. He may be well affluent> > in his speech and talkative.> > > > > His relationship with his younger borther may not be friendly.> > He may be eldest among his siblings.> > > > > He may not be getting support from his father.> > > > > He may suffer from eyesight during Ma dasa.> > > > > Is all this correct or incorrect ?> > > > > Thanks and regards.> > > > > Ramesh Mishra> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > Dear Krishna ji and Ash ji,> > > > > ==>> > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law> > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to> > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > > > > <==> > > > > There is no solutions in one go What we are trying to> > arrive at here is a better understanding that too step by step.> > Since there is no doctor present here with neither the 'wonder drug'> > for all diseases, nor even a wonder drung for a single disease to> > cure all the patiants with a single dose itself in one go - we all> > would have to struggle work and find our way out. There is NONE> > here to provide us with a wonder drug, a caplsule solution. > > Actually I am against any such capsules or its sellers who argue> > that they had found any such wonder drug - and u know why. > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology ,> > Krishnamurthy Seetharama krishna_1998@ wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Ash,> > > > > >> > > > > > I think you have clearly expressed what I have been thinking> > and not expressed clearly when you said the following:> > > > > >> > > > > > "I am a very practical person and do not believe in many> > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u> > take up charts.> > > > > >> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga> > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and> > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them> pass> > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > >> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many> > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory> > does not hold any water.> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law> > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to> > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared. "> > > > > >> > > > > > You have beautifully expressed what I have been thinking. In> > fact, that is what I have been following in my research and my write-> > ups on diabetes etc. that my could find in my blog. My aim is to hit> > at least 80% accuracy. The combinations I have described have given> > this kind of result so far.> > > > > >> > > > > > Looks like our philosophies match, though we are using> > different paths.> > > > > >> > > > > > All the best!> > > > > >> > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > Krishna> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > "Ash's Corner@" kas@ wrote:> > > > > > Dear Sreenadh,> > > > > >> > > > > > You have sent an interesting mail. Sometimes such> > discussions are so much easier to perform in person or with pen and> > paper, but alas for this medium. All we can do is try to explain as> > much as possible hoping that the reader is able to grasp what is> > being said or understand it. Many a times 2 people are saying the> > same thing, but just seeing things in different light. This field is> > so vast and there are "n" number of ways / paths to arrive to the> > same conclusion. Yes, the way I follow or the path is of KAS system> > and therefore I have tried to grasp VA using KAS as the path and all> > my explanations are based on that, so its not about argument, but> > that is what I know.> > > > > >> > > > > > Even many laws of VA can be explained as per the path or in> > the language I know which is KAS and I make a conscienceous effort> > in not mixing the "KAS terminology" that would confuse the readers> > here and try to just talk things logically.> > > > > >> > > > > > I am a very practical person and do not believe in many> > law's if they can't be proven practically and consistently when u> > take up charts.> > > > > >> > > > > > For example, 2nd lord in 2nd house and then u talk of bhanga> > yog's. So we need to talk of both things together i.e the dictum and> > its contra and then take up charts and then if 80%—90% of them> pass> > though then we got something good and strong.> > > > > >> > > > > > You have said, that 4th house is for mother and then at the> > same time u have told that its also for maternal relatives. Now if u> > go by symmetry of the chart, which I personally believe in, then if> > u take 9th as father then 3rd house becomes mother, the 7th from 9th> > house i.e the same logic we say that 1st is SELF and 7th is Spouse> > or Partner, if 11th is self earned income then 5th is unearned> > income, if 2nd is self earned wealth then 8th is unearned wealth. If> > 10th is work then 4th is opposite of that so that is home and> > enjoyment.> > > > > >> > > > > > So if u go by symmetry of chart then either u take 10th as> > father and 4th as mother or 9th as father and 3rd as mother. If u> > take 9th as father and 4th as mother it will similar to saying that> > 1st is SELF and 8th is wife which does not hold the symmetry.> > > > > >> > > > > > Now, if u are studying ancient Indian astrology then why> > such things have happened? Here there are 2 possibilities that> > either someone mis-interpreted things over time and called 4th house> > which infact is DHAN sthan of Mother.> > > > > >> > > > > > Of in old days, the real wealth of mother was the home and> > she might be judged based on that (just try to understand what I am> > saying with open mind and the essence), then in due course of time> > it might have come to be known as Mother. So u must unearth such> > things.> > > > > >> > > > > > So many books are making reference to other texts. Sanskrit> > is complicated.> > > > > >> > > > > > I will share some things, In my chats with Krushnaji,> > Krushnaji explained to me some verses as given and how its meaning> > was totally mis-interpreted and somethings which the author could> > not make out is just left out. What about that?> > > > > >> > > > > > So if u just go by existing texts which are incomplete and> > then add a layer of its English translation which is flavoured by> > the author and the translators who might not have translated things> > properly so many things might have become bungled up over a period> > of time.> > > > > >> > > > > > Just in this case, 2nd lord in 2nd house, I think 3 people> > gave their feedback that they did not experience such relations or> > multiple relations. So it means that this law directly cannot be> > applied. So we also need to know the bhanga as per your approach> > means get the FULL picture and then apply on charts and then 80% -> > 90% of them must pass the test then we are reaching somewhere.> > > > > >> > > > > > Otherwise, it's the same thing that is happening on so many> > lists, that when practical charts are taken then all that theory> > does not hold any water.> > > > > >> > > > > > Even just find 1 law that works consistently and that law> > should also cover ALL the contras. And put that law up for people to> > test. That way even the mis-interpretation might get cleared.> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Cheers !!!> > > > > > Ash -> http://www.ashtro. ca> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > > > Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ________> > _______________> > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> > > > http://www./r/hs> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with > > Mobile. Try it now.> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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