Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > toombaru > People tell him that he should take photographs of them. He just smiles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , Noel <noel_beau wrote: > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " > > <lastrain@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very > > elaborate > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > Perhaps the ocean embraces them... > > Noel > No..........It smashes them to smithereens. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , Noel <noel_beau wrote: > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " > > <lastrain@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very > > elaborate > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > Perhaps the ocean embraces them... > > Noel sweeps them into loving arms... Nice, Noel, Namaste... I don't think we've met in this ocean before... My name is Ana. ;-) > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , Noel <noel_beau@> wrote: > > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " > > > <lastrain@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very > > > elaborate > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > Perhaps the ocean embraces them... > > > > Noel > > > > > > No..........It smashes them to smithereens. > > > LOL > What's the difference? (See, here's a " question " of pure .....) ~ * 8 * ~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > toombaru > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, where the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling in. I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards observed waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, as the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made some kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the bigger wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, but the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that it's all just a pattern in the universe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, where > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling in. > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards observed > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then > more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, as > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made some > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the bigger > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, but > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that it's > all just a pattern in the universe. > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a supposition? toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > wrote: > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, where > > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling in. > > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards observed > > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then > > more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. > > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, as > > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made some > > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the bigger > > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One > > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, but > > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that it's > > all just a pattern in the universe. > > > > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a supposition? > > > > toombaru It is God's speculation and only parenthetically an (I's) self- evident truth. Supposition is only supposing of supposing. Seems to be merely a base and fundemental surmising of the devolved nature of the Real. ...........bob(parenthetically) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > wrote: > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, where > > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling in. > > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards observed > > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then > > more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. > > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, as > > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made some > > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the bigger > > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One > > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, but > > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that it's > > all just a pattern in the universe. > > > > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a supposition? > > > > toombaru > not if one presupposes its supposition to the proposition that proposes exposing the posulating of an alternative assumption that predetermines any and all positions based on/of/as the poser--...;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2006 Report Share Posted July 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, > where > > > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling > in. > > > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards > observed > > > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then > > > more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. > > > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, > as > > > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made > some > > > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the > bigger > > > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One > > > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, > but > > > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > > > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > > > > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that > it's > > > all just a pattern in the universe. > > > > > > > > > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a > supposition? > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > not if one presupposes its supposition to the proposition that > proposes exposing the posulating of an alternative assumption that > predetermines any and all positions based on/of/as the poser--...;-) > Poser....imposer......imposter........ Come walk with me..........down Strawberry Canyon. The baby quail are here. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very elaborate > > > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, > > where > > > > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves rolling > > in. > > > > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards > > observed > > > > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. Then > > > > more waves came until there was only a vague depression left. > > > > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early stages, > > as > > > > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it made > > some > > > > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the > > bigger > > > > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. One > > > > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the world, > > but > > > > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > > > > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > > > > > > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, that > > it's > > > > all just a pattern in the universe. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a > > supposition? > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > not if one presupposes its supposition to the proposition that > > proposes exposing the posulating of an alternative assumption that > > predetermines any and all positions based on/of/as the poser-- ....;-) > > > > > Poser....imposer......imposter........ > > > Come walk with me..........down Strawberry Canyon. > > > The baby quail are here. > > > > > toombaru > Ah, my Toomey, I've been waiting for you to ask me that......... I'll be your green shadow......... Don't forget me........or to breathe....... ana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana@> > wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " > <jasondedonno@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I have a friend who builds very beautiful.....very > elaborate > > > > > > structures out of driftwood on Moonstone Beach. > > > > > > > > > > > > Every night the ocean comes in and knocks them down. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I was on the beach today, and I was walking along the shore, > > > where > > > > > the sand was wet and flat due to the the breaking waves > rolling > > > in. > > > > > I made footprints in the wet sand, and shortly afterwards > > > observed > > > > > waves that came and washed away the crispness of the print. > Then > > > > > more waves came until there was only a vague depression > left. > > > > > Eventually alll would be worn smooth again. In the early > stages, > > > as > > > > > the wave receded and water emptied from the depression, it > made > > > some > > > > > kind of ripple in the sea, that was quickly swamped by the > > > bigger > > > > > wave energies. And the I thought, that's what life is like. > One > > > > > appears, as a body-mind, and makes an impression on the > world, > > > but > > > > > the impression is gradually eroded over time until no longer > > > > > preceptable. But still there as part of the chaos. > > > > > > > > > > I suppose I had nothing to do with the impression making, > that > > > it's > > > > > all just a pattern in the universe. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a > > > supposition? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > not if one presupposes its supposition to the proposition that > > > proposes exposing the posulating of an alternative assumption > that > > > predetermines any and all positions based on/of/as the poser-- > ...;-) > > > > > > > > > Poser....imposer......imposter........ > > > > > > Come walk with me..........down Strawberry Canyon. > > > > > > The baby quail are here. > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > Ah, my Toomey, I've been waiting for you to ask me that......... > I'll be your green shadow......... Don't forget me........or to > breathe....... > > > ana > Did you know that baby quail have no legs? They scurry and shoot through the shadows like little Luke Skywalkers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a supposition? > > > > toombaru > Rather it as an expedidient used when expressing the suppositions of this particular dream of a body-mind....as this partcular illusory body-mind can't be arsed to keep expressing everything in this verbiose method, particularly when the whole point of the posting was just an express an image, or metaphor. This particular body-mind has not yet realised its own original nature so it feels (to the illusory person there) prententious to write like this. Good enough for now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > > You you suppose that the I that supposes........is merely a > supposition? > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > J: Rather it as an expedidient used when expressing the suppositions of > this particular dream of a body-mind....as this partcular illusory > body-mind can't be arsed to keep expressing everything in this > verbiose method, particularly when the whole point of the posting was > just an express an image, or metaphor. This particular body-mind has > not yet realised its own original nature so it feels (to the illusory > person there) prententious to write like this. Good enough for now? D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are individual body-minds that have some kind of great realization. That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is recognizable as a unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has experiences and knowledge. The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations with other beings who exist this way, is very important to be maintained (until it isn't). It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the game called " survival. " As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game full of victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn victimize. But give up the stake in the game? Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and relations with others of various types? Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and thus disinvest. There is no realization of what is so. There is disinvestment in what isn't so. -- Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2006 Report Share Posted July 17, 2006 ? > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are individual > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. There are no human beings caught in an illusion....The conceptual me arrises concurrently with the illusion. The characters in a dream are not caught in the dream. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are individual > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is recognizable as a > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > experiences and knowledge. > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations with > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be maintained > (until it isn't). > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the game > called " survival. " > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game full of > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn victimize. > > But give up the stake in the game? > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > relations with others of various types? > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and thus > disinvest. > > There is no realization of what is so. > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > -- Dan > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm fine as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs and illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here about everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking them for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time in 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone has said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The only good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. I'll run along and let you get on with it. If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. So what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't want to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die along with normal people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 > > There are no human beings caught in an illusion....The conceptual me > arrises concurrently with the illusion. > > > > The characters in a dream are not caught in the dream. > > > > toombaru > How is it you continually argue with each other? How do you think this looks from the outside? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > > > > There are no human beings caught in an illusion....The conceptual me > > arrises concurrently with the illusion. > > > > > > > > The characters in a dream are not caught in the dream. > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > How is it you continually argue with each other? How do you think this > looks from the outside? > I don't know about Dan.........but I simply do not care about what others think we are doing. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are > individual > > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is recognizable as > a > > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > > experiences and knowledge. > > > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations with > > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be maintained > > (until it isn't). > > > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the game > > called " survival. " > > > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game full > of > > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn victimize. > > > > But give up the stake in the game? > > > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > > relations with others of various types? > > > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and thus > > disinvest. > > > > There is no realization of what is so. > > > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > > > -- Dan > > > > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so > everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm fine > as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs and > illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here about > everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking them > for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time in > 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's > comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone has > said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many > wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The only > good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. > I'll run along and let you get on with it. > > If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. So > what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't want > to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die along > with normal people. > What makes you think that anyone here is trying to help others? toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are > individual > > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is recognizable as > a > > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > > experiences and knowledge. > > > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations with > > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be maintained > > (until it isn't). > > > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the game > > called " survival. " > > > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game full > of > > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn victimize. > > > > But give up the stake in the game? > > > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > > relations with others of various types? > > > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and thus > > disinvest. > > > > There is no realization of what is so. > > > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > > > -- Dan > > > > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so > everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm fine > as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs and > illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here about > everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking them > for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time in > 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's > comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone has > said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many > wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The only > good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. > I'll run along and let you get on with it. > > If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. So > what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't want > to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die along > with normal people. sometimes it seem that " the truth " is only....endlessly discussed in here....yes... restless minds....sharing with restless minds... to catch " the truth " .....the mind need to be calm.... the spiritual path is an inner path..... it's not a religious path....therefore.... means....it's not about the truth outside there.... behind the clouds....or in nice book....or in a forest....or cave....in churches....in temples..... when yourself get a " temple " ....one day.... then it's possible to ....be...... wherever you like to wish a peaceful path Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > There are no human beings caught in an illusion....The conceptual me > > > arrises concurrently with the illusion. > > > > > > > > > > > > The characters in a dream are not caught in the dream. > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > How is it you continually argue with each other? How do you think this > > looks from the outside? > > > > > I don't know about Dan.........but I simply do not care about what > others think we are doing. > > toombaru > The " Others " are? What are doing exactly? Why are you here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > There are no human beings caught in an illusion....The > conceptual me > > > > arrises concurrently with the illusion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The characters in a dream are not caught in the dream. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > How is it you continually argue with each other? How do you > think this > > > looks from the outside? > > > > > > > > > I don't know about Dan.........but I simply do not care about what > > others think we are doing. > > > > toombaru > > > The " Others " are? What are doing exactly? Why are you here? maybe nobody ever will realy know....why Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > wrote: > > > > > > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are > > individual > > > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > > > > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is recognizable as > > a > > > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > > > experiences and knowledge. > > > > > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations with > > > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be maintained > > > (until it isn't). > > > > > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the game > > > called " survival. " > > > > > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game full > > of > > > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn victimize. > > > > > > But give up the stake in the game? > > > > > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > > > relations with others of various types? > > > > > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and thus > > > disinvest. > > > > > > There is no realization of what is so. > > > > > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > > > > > -- Dan > > > > > > > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so > > everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm fine > > as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs and > > illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here about > > everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking them > > for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time in > > 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's > > comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone has > > said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many > > wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The only > > good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. > > I'll run along and let you get on with it. > > > > If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. So > > what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't want > > to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die along > > with normal people. > > > > > > What makes you think that anyone here is trying to help others? > > > toombaru > Certain people have shown that they want to help. But if not interested in helping others, why are you here? Why all the writing and arguing? And why am I not allowed to do but you and Dan can? Ah, I know, it's because I'm not one of the club. This is an enlightened one's club where you all to sing and dance to each other, and quickly the spot those who aren't one of you (or with you) Reminds me of the 70s film invasion of the body snatchers where the humans, when identified, are pointed out with a long finger accompanied by a loud, unearthly shriek. Or could there be such a thing as snobbery here? Is that possible? I wouldn't have thought so but I've learned a lot since I came here and it wouldn't surprise me now. There's a certain smugness about the behaviour of some of you that makes me feel about as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit. You mentioned Christ and Buddha and few others earlier, as if to compare yourself to them. Well they were all into helping others, these " non-existant entities " So when I said I hope I can be quiet about my realisation in that other thread, perhaps you now know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are > > > individual > > > > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > > > > > > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is > recognizable as > > > a > > > > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > > > > experiences and knowledge. > > > > > > > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations > with > > > > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be > maintained > > > > (until it isn't). > > > > > > > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the > game > > > > called " survival. " > > > > > > > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game > full > > > of > > > > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn > victimize. > > > > > > > > But give up the stake in the game? > > > > > > > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > > > > relations with others of various types? > > > > > > > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and > thus > > > > disinvest. > > > > > > > > There is no realization of what is so. > > > > > > > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > > > > > > > -- Dan > > > > > > > > > > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so > > > everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm > fine > > > as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs > and > > > illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here > about > > > everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking > them > > > for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time > in > > > 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's > > > comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone > has > > > said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many > > > wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The > only > > > good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. > > > I'll run along and let you get on with it. > > > > > > If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. > So > > > what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't > want > > > to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die > along > > > with normal people. > > > > > > > > > > > What makes you think that anyone here is trying to help others? > > > > > > toombaru > > > Certain people have shown that they want to help. > > But if not interested in helping others, why are you here? Why all > the writing and arguing? And why am I not allowed to do but you and > Dan can? Ah, I know, it's because I'm not one of the club. This is > an enlightened one's club where you all to sing and dance to each > other, and quickly the spot those who aren't one of you (or with > you) Reminds me of the 70s film invasion of the body snatchers where > the humans, when identified, are pointed out with a long finger > accompanied by a loud, unearthly shriek. Or could there be such a > thing as snobbery here? Is that possible? I wouldn't have thought so > but I've learned a lot since I came here and it wouldn't surprise me > now. There's a certain smugness about the behaviour of some of you > that makes me feel about as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit. > > You mentioned Christ and Buddha and few others earlier, as if to > compare yourself to them. Well they were all into helping others, > these " non-existant entities " > > So when I said I hope I can be quiet about my realisation in that > other thread, perhaps you now know why. > If you want to deify other humans........do that. As for me......there is no head higher them my own. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2006 Report Share Posted July 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > D: Human beings are caught in the illusion that there are > > > individual > > > > body-minds that have some kind of great realization. > > > > > > > > That is due to the belief that a body-mind that is > recognizable as > > > a > > > > unit and given a name is the seat of a knowing entity that has > > > > experiences and knowledge. > > > > > > > > The belief that one can exist in this way, and have relations > with > > > > other beings who exist this way, is very important to be > maintained > > > > (until it isn't). > > > > > > > > It must be maintained for the sake of having a player in the > game > > > > called " survival. " > > > > > > > > As Toom observed, this has always been a bloody game, a game > full > > > of > > > > victims looking for someone to blame, as they in turn > victimize. > > > > > > > > But give up the stake in the game? > > > > > > > > Give up having a life of experiences to claim as one's own, and > > > > relations with others of various types? > > > > > > > > Giving up the game is only to understand what isn't so, and > thus > > > > disinvest. > > > > > > > > There is no realization of what is so. > > > > > > > > There is disinvestment in what isn't so. > > > > > > > > -- Dan > > > > > > > > > > Ah - so now we're back to " there's no realization " . Ok, so > > > everything's fine. Don't tell me off for saying " I " !!! If I'm > fine > > > as I am then I don't need to hear anymore stuff about beliefs > and > > > illusions. Amazing how so many people have so much to say here > about > > > everything here. Analysing my sentences instead of just taking > them > > > for face value. Something is not right here. For the first time > in > > > 10 years I question the Avaita path. Apart from perhaps Bill's > > > comments, and may be one or two others, none of anything anyone > has > > > said has seemed kind or helpful or beneficial to me. Too many > > > wannabe gurus, not possible to have normal conversation. The > only > > > good thing you do is write poetry to each other - which is fine. > > > I'll run along and let you get on with it. > > > > > > If you can't talk to people in normal way, you can't help them. > So > > > what's the use of it all? If you can't benefit others? I don't > want > > > to be like that. I'd sooner stick with my ignorance and die > along > > > with normal people. > > > > > > > > > > > What makes you think that anyone here is trying to help others? > > > > > > toombaru > > > Certain people have shown that they want to help. > > But if not interested in helping others, why are you here? Why all > the writing and arguing? And why am I not allowed to do but you and > Dan can? Ah, I know, it's because I'm not one of the club. This is > an enlightened one's club where you all to sing and dance to each > other, and quickly the spot those who aren't one of you (or with > you) Reminds me of the 70s film invasion of the body snatchers where > the humans, when identified, are pointed out with a long finger > accompanied by a loud, unearthly shriek. Or could there be such a > thing as snobbery here? Is that possible? I wouldn't have thought so > but I've learned a lot since I came here and it wouldn't surprise me > now. There's a certain smugness about the behaviour of some of you > that makes me feel about as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit. > > You mentioned Christ and Buddha and few others earlier, as if to > compare yourself to them. Well they were all into helping others, > these " non-existant entities " > > So when I said I hope I can be quite about my realisation in that > other thread, perhaps you now know why. > Oh..........One more thing. You can give up the hope for realization. No human has ever become realized. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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