Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Since there aren`t to many answers to my question, I`ve replied too myself: What is the " I AM " that Nis. referrs to ? It would be like Toom said: the totality of my consciousness, and I `ll add, my body and mind and head and heart. Now I am satisfied w/ that. Which brings me to the Witness, the dew drop that reflects the sunlight, and that is laying very still in the heart of heart, and I mean that very litterally. AAAHH, I feel less confused, more able to communicate and ready to go hang out by the cliff with my friends, and jump if Silver allows... Patricia _________________________ Nouveau : téléphonez moins cher avec Messenger ! Découvez les tarifs exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international. Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 In a message dated 2/16/2006 3:36:16 PM Pacific Standard Time, Nisargadatta writes: OConnor Patricia <gdtige RE: about I and the dew drop Since there aren`t to many answers to my question, I`ve replied too myself: What is the " I AM " that Nis. referrs to ? It would be like Toom said: the totality of my consciousness, and I `ll add, my body and mind and head and heart. Now I am satisfied w/ that. Which brings me to the Witness, the dew drop that reflects the sunlight, and that is laying very still in the heart of heart, and I mean that very litterally. AAAHH, I feel less confused, more able to communicate and ready to go hang out by the cliff with my friends, and jump if Silver allows... Patricia Silver's bein kind of a stick in the mud. I'm thinking the problem is not enough mugwort. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Hi Patricia... I was thinking about taking the challenge and answer your question. But then I didn't, because I felt that any word to explain " I am " would be one word too many. Isn't it self explanatory... when you wake up in the morning, the first sensation you can recall... Stefan (Is it not stormy by the cliff sometimes...?) Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > Since there aren`t to many answers to my question, > I`ve replied too myself: > What is the " I AM " that Nis. referrs to ? >It would be like Toom said: the totality of my >consciousness, and I `ll add, my body and mind and >head and heart. >Now I am satisfied w/ that. >Which brings me to the Witness, the dew drop that >reflects the sunlight, and that is laying very still >in the heart of heart, and I mean that very >litterally. >AAAHH, I feel less confused, more able to communicate >and ready to go hang out by the cliff with my friends, >and jump if Silver allows... >Patricia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Well come and check the Cliff for yourself dear Stefan.. It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a clear distinction between I AM (content of consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are two very different principles. Maybe obvious for some... Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for everybody, not even clear for myself. Patricia P.S : Well come and check the Cliff for yourself dear Stefan..it can be bleak or it can be esctatic.. and..bring an empty cup, so we know Who you are. ............................................... --- Stefan <s.petersilge a écrit : Hi Patricia... I was thinking about taking the challenge and answer your question. But then I didn't, because I felt that any word to explain " I am " would be one word too many. Isn't it self explanatory... when you wake up in the morning, the first sensation you can recall... Stefan (Is it not stormy by the cliff sometimes...?) Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > Since there aren`t to many answers to my question, > I`ve replied too myself: > What is the " I AM " that Nis. referrs to ? >It would be like Toom said: the totality of my >consciousness, and I `ll add, my body and mind and >head and heart. >Now I am satisfied w/ that. >Which brings me to the Witness, the dew drop that >reflects the sunlight, and that is laying very still >in the heart of heart, and I mean that very >litterally. >AAAHH, I feel less confused, more able to communicate >and ready to go hang out by the cliff with my friends, >and jump if Silver allows... >Patricia ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a clear distinction between I AM (content of consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are two very different principles. Maybe obvious for some... Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for everybody, not even clear for myself. Patricia P.S : Well come and check the Cliff for yourself dear Stefan..it can be bleak or it can be esctatic.. and..bring an empty cup, so we know Who you are. ............................................... --- Stefan <s.petersilge a écrit : Hi Patricia... I was thinking about taking the challenge and answer your question. But then I didn't, because I felt that any word to explain " I am " would be one word too many. Isn't it self explanatory... when you wake up in the morning, the first sensation you can recall... Stefan (Is it not stormy by the cliff sometimes...?) Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > Since there aren`t to many answers to my question, > I`ve replied too myself: > What is the " I AM " that Nis. referrs to ? >It would be like Toom said: the totality of my >consciousness, and I `ll add, my body and mind and >head and heart. >Now I am satisfied w/ that. >Which brings me to the Witness, the dew drop that >reflects the sunlight, and that is laying very still >in the heart of heart, and I mean that very >litterally. >AAAHH, I feel less confused, more able to communicate >and ready to go hang out by the cliff with my friends, >and jump if Silver allows... >Patricia ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2006 Report Share Posted February 18, 2006 Hi Patricia! I dont know about that " content of consciousness " thing. When I traced that sense of " I am " I only found " I am " ... something very simple that everybody knows. And then: " I am " is I am. " I am the witness " means I am: the witness. " I am the content of consciousness " means I am: the content of consciousness. And so on and so on ... It all comes after " I am " . Things are too simple to be understood, sometimes! Haha! Stefan P.S. I will bring my empty cup but my heart is overflowing. Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > clear distinction between I AM (content of > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > some... > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > Patricia > > P.S : Well come and check the Cliff for yourself dear > Stefan..it can be bleak or it can be esctatic.. > and..bring an empty cup, so we know Who you are. > .............................................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2006 Report Share Posted February 18, 2006 > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > some... > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions between 'things' that exist only as concepts. (especially when the one attempting such a task is itself merely a tightly woven clot of concepts). One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and " the witness " . toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2006 Report Share Posted February 18, 2006 Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > clear distinction between I AM (content of > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > some... > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > Patricia i hope you are joking... or are you serious about what you wrote?!? it is so confusing. what is this Witness yuo are talking about???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > > some... > > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > > > > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions between 'things' that exist only as concepts. > (especially when the one attempting such a task is itself merely a tightly woven clot of > concepts). > > One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. > > One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and " the witness " . > > > toombaru > ..... It is like drawing a line with a brush full of ink on paper that is flooded with water. Just a blur. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > some... > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions between 'things' that exist only as concepts. (especially when the one attempting such a task is itself merely a tightly woven clot of concepts). One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and " the witness " .Toombaru >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Toombaru, Yes yes, it can be done! The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line between Iam and the witness. " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, self-preservation.... The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, it has the potential to reflect something of an altogether different nature. A different magnetic field in a way.. Greetings to you, Patricia ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor > Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make > a > > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they > are > > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > > some... > > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking > about > > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > > > > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions > between 'things' that exist only as concepts. > (especially when the one attempting such a task is > itself merely a tightly woven clot of > concepts). > > One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. > > One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and > " the witness " .Toombaru > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Toombaru, > Yes yes, it can be done! > The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is > the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still > think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line > between Iam and the witness. > " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, > self-preservation.... > The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, > it has the potential to reflect something of an > altogether different nature. A different magnetic > field in a way.. > Greetings to you, > Patricia > The term 'I am " includes within it the concept 'witness'. The witness is a facet of I am. Both are concepts concocted by the cells in the frontal cortex in an attempt to explain the thought stream that for some unexplainable reason becomes aware of itself. The result of this dynamic is the creation of the secondary-conceptual-world complete with an imaginary separate self at the helm. Within that self-referential circularity spins a dream in which the hero bares your name. If the terms 'I am' and 'witness' are taken too literally.....the attempt to explore their imagined relationship can result only in further confusion. They, like alld concepts, only hint at what lies deeper. .........and deeper......past the I am........past the witness..........is the door that never was. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:14:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, Nisargadatta writes: OConnor Patricia <gdtige RE: Re: about I and the dew drop --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make a > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they are > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > some... > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking about > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions between 'things' that exist only as concepts. (especially when the one attempting such a task is itself merely a tightly woven clot of concepts). One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and " the witness " .Toombaru >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Toombaru, Yes yes, it can be done! The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line between Iam and the witness. " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, self-preservation.... The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, it has the potential to reflect something of an altogether different nature. A different magnetic field in a way.. Greetings to you, Patricia I've tried to avoid the 'I AM' discussion cause it's about as interesting to me as paging through the dictionary. However, how did we end up with a daffynition of 'I AM' as ego? Did some guru say that? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:14:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, Nisargadatta writes: " toombaru2006 " <lastrain Re: about I and the dew drop Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor > Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make > a > > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they > are > > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > > some... > > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking > about > > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > > > > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions > between 'things' that exist only as concepts. > (especially when the one attempting such a task is > itself merely a tightly woven clot of > concepts). > > One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. > > One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and > " the witness " .Toombaru > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Toombaru, > Yes yes, it can be done! > The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is > the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still > think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line > between Iam and the witness. > " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, > self-preservation.... > The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, > it has the potential to reflect something of an > altogether different nature. A different magnetic > field in a way.. > Greetings to you, > Patricia > The term 'I am " includes within it the concept 'witness'. The witness is a facet of I am. Both are concepts concocted by the cells in the frontal cortex in an attempt to explain the thought stream that for some unexplainable reason becomes aware of itself. The result of this dynamic is the creation of the secondary-conceptual-world complete with an imaginary separate self at the helm. Within that self-referential circularity spins a dream in which the hero bares your name. If the terms 'I am' and 'witness' are taken too literally.....the attempt to explore their imagined relationship can result only in further confusion. They, like alld concepts, only hint at what lies deeper. .........and deeper......past the I am........past the witness..........is the door that never was. toombaru That's all agreeable to me. The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without self awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but because of self awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:14:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > OConnor Patricia <gdtige > RE: Re: about I and the dew drop > > --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor > Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make > a > > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they > are > > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > > some... > > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking > about > > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > > > > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions > between 'things' that exist only as concepts. > (especially when the one attempting such a task is > itself merely a tightly woven clot of > concepts). > > One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. > > One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and > " the witness " .Toombaru > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Toombaru, > Yes yes, it can be done! > The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is > the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still > think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line > between Iam and the witness. > " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, > self-preservation.... > The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, > it has the potential to reflect something of an > altogether different nature. A different magnetic > field in a way.. > Greetings to you, > Patricia > Hello Patricia, The imagined dynamic of the thought stream dividing its self up into discernible and distinct factions.....one of which is able to objectively observe and presumably somehow improve the other.......is a very convoluted belief system. It is the contention here that which is called the mind....places and gets entrapped in such snares ....with the sole purpose of avoiding detection in its role of imposter....and charlatan. It is a very tricky little monkey. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:14:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain > Re: about I and the dew drop > > Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > --- toombaru2006 <lastrain@> a écrit : > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor > > Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > > > It is of upmost importance at the moment, to make > > a > > > > clear distinction between I AM (content of > > > > consciousness) and the Witness. It seems that they > > are > > > > two very different principles. Maybe obvious for > > > > some... > > > > Because when talking of I Am, I`ve been talking > > about > > > > the Witness all along, and it can be confusing for > > > > everybody, not even clear for myself. > > > > > > > > > > It is difficult indeed to make clear distinctions > > between 'things' that exist only as concepts. > > (especially when the one attempting such a task is > > itself merely a tightly woven clot of > > concepts). > > > > One can draw a line between a cat and a rock. > > > > One cannot, however, draw a line between " I am " and > > " the witness " .Toombaru > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > Toombaru, > > Yes yes, it can be done! > > The amalgame we are doing with I AM and witness is > > the cause of endless confusion and frustration.I still > > think it is of the upmost importance to draw a line > > between Iam and the witness. > > " I am " a bundle of memories, fear, reactions, > > self-preservation.... > > The witness is nothing like that. In its neutrality, > > it has the potential to reflect something of an > > altogether different nature. A different magnetic > > field in a way.. > > Greetings to you, > > Patricia > > > > > The term 'I am " includes within it the concept 'witness'. > > The witness is a facet of I am. > > Both are concepts concocted by the cells in the frontal cortex in an attempt > to explain the > thought stream that for some unexplainable reason becomes aware of itself. > > The result of this dynamic is the creation of the > secondary-conceptual-world complete > with an imaginary separate self at the helm. > > Within that self-referential circularity spins a dream in which the hero > bares your name. > > If the terms 'I am' and 'witness' are taken too literally.....the attempt to > explore their > imagined relationship can result only in further confusion. > > They, like alld concepts, only hint at what lies deeper. > > ........and deeper......past the I am........past the witness..........is > the door that never was. > > > > toombaru > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without self > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but because of self > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > Phil > Actually.......impossible. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 I've tried to avoid the 'I AM' discussion cause it's about as interesting to me as paging through the dictionary. However, how did we end up with a daffynition of 'I AM' as ego? Did some guru say that? Phil Somebody(Toombaru?) said it was the content of consciousness..feels right to me. It is annoying to not have a better understanding of all the concepts we talk about, ego, consciousness, mind, spirit witness.... I get " Witness " because there is a seeing of that changeless state, and also " consciousness " because I sure can taste it. where is that dictionary? Patricia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > I've tried to avoid the 'I AM' discussion cause it's > about as interesting to > me as paging through the dictionary. However, how did > we end up with a > daffynition of 'I AM' as ego? Did some guru say that? > > Phil > > Somebody(Toombaru?) said it was the content of > consciousness..feels right to me. It is annoying to > not have a better understanding of all the concepts we > talk about, ego, consciousness, mind, spirit > witness.... I get " Witness " because there is a seeing > of that changeless state, and also " consciousness " > because I sure can taste it. > where is that dictionary? > Patricia > > ...............catching the shadows of butterflies........... using the shadows of nets........ toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, Nisargadatta writes: " toombaru2006 " <lastrain Re: about I and the dew drop > That's all agreeable to me. > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without self > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but because of self > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > Phil > Actually.......impossible. toombaru Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of ego can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain > Re: about I and the dew drop > > That's all agreeable to me. > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without > self > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but because > of self > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > Phil > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > toombaru > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of ego > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > Phil > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, outdo, surmount, outperform Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware of yourself and your situation We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to transcend all-that-is? toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2006 Report Share Posted February 22, 2006 In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, Nisargadatta writes: " toombaru2006 " <lastrain Re: about I and the dew drop Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain > Re: about I and the dew drop > > That's all agreeable to me. > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without > self > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but because > of self > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > Phil > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > toombaru > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of ego > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > Phil > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, outdo, surmount, outperform Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware of yourself and your situation We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to transcend all-that-is? toombaru Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to transcend all-that-is? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2006 Report Share Posted February 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain > Re: about I and the dew drop > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without > > > self > > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but > because > > of self > > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of > ego > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, outdo, surmount, > outperform > > > > Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware of yourself > and your > situation > > > We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. > > > What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to transcend > all-that-is? > > > > toombaru > > > > > Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to transcend > all-that-is? > > Phil > Phil: " Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of ego can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. " All there is is consciousness.......Can Consciousness transcend itself? toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2006 Report Share Posted February 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > > > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it possible to > > > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego possible. Without > > > > > self > > > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending consciousness but > > because > > > of self > > > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of > > ego > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, outdo, surmount, > > outperform > > > > > > > > Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware of yourself > > and your > > situation > > > > > > We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. > > > > > > What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to transcend > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to transcend > > all-that-is? > > > > Phil > > > > > > Phil: " Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I assume you > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the existence of > ego > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. " > > > > All there is is consciousness.......Can Consciousness transcend itself? > > > toombaru > > All there is is consciousness....... You think so? > Can Consciousness transcend itself? Is it presumptuous to assume that is a meaningful question? Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2006 Report Share Posted February 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > > > > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it > possible to > > > > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego > possible. Without > > > > > > > self > > > > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending > consciousness but > > > because > > > > of self > > > > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I > assume you > > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > existence of > > > ego > > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, > outdo, surmount, > > > outperform > > > > > > > > > > > > Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware > of yourself > > > and your > > > situation > > > > > > > > > We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. > > > > > > > > > What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to > transcend > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to transcend > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > Phil: " Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and > so I assume you > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > existence of > > ego > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. " > > > > > > > > All there is is consciousness.......Can Consciousness transcend itself? > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > All there is is consciousness....... > You think so? > > That is known. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2006 Report Share Posted February 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > > > > > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it > > possible to > > > > > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego > > possible. Without > > > > > > > > > self > > > > > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending > > consciousness but > > > > because > > > > > of self > > > > > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I > > assume you > > > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > > existence of > > > > ego > > > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, > > outdo, surmount, > > > > outperform > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware > > of yourself > > > > and your > > > > situation > > > > > > > > > > > > We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to > > transcend > > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to transcend > > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil: " Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and > > so I assume you > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > > existence of > > > ego > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. " > > > > > > > > > > > > All there is is consciousness.......Can Consciousness transcend itself? > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > All there is is consciousness....... > > You think so? > > > > That is known. > > toombaru > and does consciousness have no end? is consciousness boundless, inexhaustable? for to *know* that all there is is consciousness implies something about those questions. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2006 Report Share Posted February 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/22/2006 2:01:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 2/21/2006 1:55:04 AM Pacific Standard > Time, > > > > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > " toombaru2006 " <lastrain@> > > > > > > Re: about I and the dew drop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's all agreeable to me. > > > > > > > The irony about self awareness is that it's what makes it > > > possible to > > > > > > > transcend human consciousness, but it also makes ego > > > possible. Without > > > > > > > > > > > self > > > > > > > awareness, nobody would care about transcending > > > consciousness but > > > > > because > > > > > > of self > > > > > > > awareness, ego makes it extremely difficult. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually.......impossible. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and so I > > > assume you > > > > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > > > existence of > > > > > ego > > > > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Transcend: Go beyond , surpass, outstrip, outmatch, outgo, > > > outdo, surmount, > > > > > outperform > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Consciousness: an alert cognitive state in which you are aware > > > of yourself > > > > > and your > > > > > situation > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We are told by the sages that all there is is consciousness. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the nature of this 'thing' that you propose is able to > > > transcend > > > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Where did I propose that there is a thing that is able to > transcend > > > > > all-that-is? > > > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil: " Transcending consciousness is clearly not impossible, and > > > so I assume you > > > > mean it's not possible for ego to do, which is true. But the > > > existence of > > > > ego > > > > can prevent this from occurring for a time, which it does. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All there is is consciousness.......Can Consciousness transcend > itself? > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > > > > All there is is consciousness....... > > > You think so? > > > > > > > That is known. > > > > toombaru > > > > and does consciousness have no end? > is consciousness boundless, inexhaustable? Is there a place in your dream last night where the space in which it occurs ends? Is the primal cause able to see itself? Do you like it here better then in the summer? toombaru > > for to *know* that all there is is consciousness > implies something about those questions. > > Bill > It implies only something about the questioner. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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