The thingy known as Consciousness

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " carolina112900 "

<freyjartist@a...> wrote:

> Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

> <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > -

> > skoggman

> > Nisargadatta

> > Monday, July 28, 2003 08:25 PM

> > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> >

> >

> > the question:

> >

> > >>

> > What is Consciousness?

> > <<

> >

>

> Well, any answer is as good as the next,

> but all's i know is that while y'all are giving out

> answers, Andrew Cohen will probably start

> a new magazine called

> " What is Consciousness? "

> to go along with " What is Enlightenment? "

> and rake in some more ka-ching.

>

> LOL

>

> Freyja

 

Yes, even more deep than consciousness

is the primal sound: ka-ching!

 

Thanks for reminding us of this ancient

wisdom, Freyja.

 

Going now to read one of the verses

of the Ka Ching,

 

Dan

[Guest guest]

- carolina112900

Nisargadatta

Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

 

Nisargadatta , "Sandeep" <sandeepc@b...> wrote:> > - > dan330033 > Nisargadatta > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM> Re: The thingy known as Consciousness> > > <SNIP> > > > > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.> > I'll just bet you are <s>> > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.> > ------> > Ahaa.> > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.> Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly be "enlightened"! <g> ;-)Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot be enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be enlightened......This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not realized.But are they problems, or just more situations to deal with,like everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to do something about itwhen we think we don't have what we think we should have, as opposed to when we feel everything is fine.Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no money problems, etc, and realization.

 

-------

 

Oh realization.

 

Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

<sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> -

> carolina112900

> Nisargadatta

> Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

wrote:

> >

> > -

> > dan330033

> > Nisargadatta

> > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> >

> >

> > <SNIP>

> >

> >

> >

> > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.

> >

> > I'll just bet you are <s>

> >

> > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.

> >

> > ------

> >

> > Ahaa.

> >

> > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.

> >

>

>

> Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly

be " enlightened " ! <g> ;-)

>

> Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot be

enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon

hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....

> oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be enlightened......

>

> This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual

illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not realized.

>

> But are they problems, or just more situations to deal with,like

everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?

>

> However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to do

something about it

> when we think we don't have what we think we should have, as

opposed to when we feel everything is fine.

>

> Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific

world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no money

problems, etc, and realization.

>

>

> -------

>

> Oh realization.

>

> Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

 

 

 

Is this the part where Ramesh or Ram Tzu or whoever

suggests taking the million bucks?

 

;o))

[Guest guest]

Salaam walekhuim Dan.

 

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033>

wrote:

 

<SNIP>

 

 

 

> >

> > Can you come again on that, Dan?

> >

> >

> > ------------

>

> Okay. If your statements don't arise I can't read them.

>

> Reading them, therefore they have arisen.

>

> If affirming that their arising is conditioning, then whatever

> is being said in the statement is conditioning -- for

> the statement is arising.

>

> In other words, whatever comments you make about conditioning

> are themselves conditioned -- whatever is said.

>

> And anything being perceived, whether your statements or

> anything else, is perceived in the context of conditioning.

>

> So, I can't really comment on the activity of conditioning,

> since the comment is conditioned.

>

> Same with perception, I can't perceive what conditioning

> actually is, because perceptions are conditioned -- and

> conditional.

>

> So, nothing is being said, ever -- or perceived, or known.

>

> As conditioning can't be aware of itself as conditioning,

> as what it is, as how perceptions arise.

 

-------

 

Right.

 

 

A prattling, arose elsewhere........

 

An apparent need to express the Universal I AM, is the very apparent

creation of finity, in which all expressions inlcuding the very

expression, " Universal I AM " , .....comes into existence.

 

The eye can see everything, but not itself.

 

Except as an image in a mirror.

 

Phenomenality is the mirror and the dancing images within the mirror,

images of that-which-IS.

 

In seeing the images, I sees I-self.

 

----------

 

<SNIP>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " diana_53231 " <diana@1...> wrote:

> Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

> <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> > -

> > carolina112900

> > Nisargadatta

> > Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

> wrote:

> > >

> > > -

> > > dan330033

> > > Nisargadatta

> > > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > >

> > >

> > > <SNIP>

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.

> > >

> > > I'll just bet you are <s>

> > >

> > > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.

> > >

> > > ------

> > >

> > > Ahaa.

> > >

> > > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.

> > >

> >

> >

> > Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly

> be " enlightened " ! <g> ;-)

> >

> > Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot

be

> enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon

> hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....

> > oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be enlightened......

> >

> > This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual

> illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not

realized.

> >

> > But are they problems, or just more situations to deal with,like

> everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?

> >

> > However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to do

> something about it

> > when we think we don't have what we think we should have, as

> opposed to when we feel everything is fine.

> >

> > Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific

> world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no money

> problems, etc, and realization.

> >

> >

> > -------

> >

> > Oh realization.

> >

> > Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

>

>

>

> Is this the part where Ramesh or Ram Tzu or whoever

> suggests taking the million bucks?

 

 

Diana, do you really need some one else to suggest to you, for you to

pick up a million bucks?

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

<sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> -

> carolina112900

> Nisargadatta

> Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

wrote:

> >

> > -

> > dan330033

> > Nisargadatta

> > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> >

> >

> > <SNIP>

> >

> >

> >

> > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.

> >

> > I'll just bet you are <s>

> >

> > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.

> >

> > ------

> >

> > Ahaa.

> >

> > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.

> >

>

>

> Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly

be " enlightened " ! <g> ;-)

>

> Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot be

enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon

hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....

> oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be enlightened......

>

> This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual

illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not realized.

>

> But are they problems, or just more situations to deal with,like

everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?

>

> However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to do

something about it

> when we think we don't have what we think we should have, as

opposed to when we feel everything is fine.

>

> Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific

world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no money

problems, etc, and realization.

>

>

> -------

>

> Oh realization.

>

> Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.>>

 

 

Yes. The hoopla is what it is

with all the enlighteningly realized

talk. It's what is talked about

on these lists. " Sci-phi " someone

called it. Leaves a lot to the imagination.

All in good fun.

 

I never cease to be bored with

the surprise of a lightening strike, --

and there is a lot of it around here

where i live

 

Freyja

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> Nisargadatta , " diana_53231 " <diana@1...>

wrote:

> > Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

> > <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> > > -

> > > carolina112900

> > > Nisargadatta

> > > Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

> > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > -

> > > > dan330033

> > > > Nisargadatta

> > > > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > <SNIP>

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.

> > > >

> > > > I'll just bet you are <s>

> > > >

> > > > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.

> > > >

> > > > ------

> > > >

> > > > Ahaa.

> > > >

> > > > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly

> > be " enlightened " ! <g> ;-)

> > >

> > > Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot

> be

> > enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon

> > hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....

> > > oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be

enlightened......

> > >

> > > This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual

> > illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not

> realized.

> > >

> > > But are they problems, or just more situations to deal

with,like

> > everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?

> > >

> > > However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to

do

> > something about it

> > > when we think we don't have what we think we should have, as

> > opposed to when we feel everything is fine.

> > >

> > > Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific

> > world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no

money

> > problems, etc, and realization.

> > >

> > >

> > > -------

> > >

> > > Oh realization.

> > >

> > > Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

> >

> >

> >

> > Is this the part where Ramesh or Ram Tzu or whoever

> > suggests taking the million bucks?

>

>

> Diana, do you really need some one else to suggest to you, for you

to

> pick up a million bucks?

 

 

To collect a million bucks:

 

Would you kill someone?

 

Would you frame your own mother?

 

 

It would depend what " conditions "

are attached

 

It would depend on what was happening

in that exact moment

 

But, if you are asking, would i accept

a condition-less million bucks OR " enlightenment " .....

 

LOL

 

Freyja

[Guest guest]

Hi Sandeep --

 

Nice hearing from you on this -- as always.

 

> Right.

>

>

> A prattling, arose elsewhere........

>

> An apparent need to express the Universal I AM, is the very

apparent

> creation of finity, in which all expressions inlcuding the very

> expression, " Universal I AM " , .....comes into existence.

>

> The eye can see everything, but not itself.

>

> Except as an image in a mirror.

>

> Phenomenality is the mirror and the dancing images within the

mirror,

> images of that-which-IS.

>

> In seeing the images, I sees I-self.

>

> ----------

 

Yes, nicely put.

 

As long as there is distance from the mirror,

there are apparent objects, phenomena,

and the observer of phenomena (which actually

also is phenomenal, arising with phenomena --

but pretending to be something else, a subject

to whom phenomena appear).

 

Clarity on this issue makes seeming distance

disappear.

 

There can't be distance between perceiver and

perceived if the perceiver also is phenomenal,

also is perceived.

 

Without distance, there isn't anything appearing

in the mirror, and there isn't anyone able to

look into the mirror, or touch the surfaces

of things appearing.

 

With no distance, even " I looking at I " dissolves.

 

But, what about this fascinating appearance of

phenomena " as if " -- along with the apparent

observer of phenomena, " as if " apart -- to

interact, think, touch, feel, experience sensations?

 

How could it be happening, if nothing is happening?

 

What an awesome play, this movement of images,

the apparent interactions and sensations arisings,

the births, lives, and deaths.

 

All for no reason, and with no explanation.

 

Wonderful!

 

-- Dan

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> Nisargadatta , " diana_53231 " <diana@1...>

wrote:

> > Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

> > <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> > > -

> > > carolina112900

> > > Nisargadatta

> > > Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

> > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > -

> > > > dan330033

> > > > Nisargadatta

> > > > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > <SNIP>

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > Earnestly awaiting enlightenment.

> > > >

> > > > I'll just bet you are <s>

> > > >

> > > > You already are the enlightenment you are awaiting.

> > > >

> > > > ------

> > > >

> > > > Ahaa.

> > > >

> > > > But then right now I have to raise $40,000.

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Oh my, Sandeep, if you need to raise money, you can't possibly

> > be " enlightened " ! <g> ;-)

> > >

> > > Also, if one has cancer or any other health problem, you cannot

> be

> > enlightened. That is how the story goes-- that someone said upon

> > hearing that Nisargadatta had throat cancer....

> > > oh well, then he must have issues, and can't be

enlightened......

> > >

> > > This kind of thinking must be another form of spiritual

> > illusion,that if you have any kind of 'problems'you are not

> realized.

> > >

> > > But are they problems, or just more situations to deal

with,like

> > everything else that arises, whether they are labeled good or bad?

> > >

> > > However, we are so much more quick to scramble about trying to

do

> > something about it

> > > when we think we don't have what we think we should have, as

> > opposed to when we feel everything is fine.

> > >

> > > Lots of correlations out there, even in the scientific

> > world,between things like having perfect physical 'health'no

money

> > problems, etc, and realization.

> > >

> > >

> > > -------

> > >

> > > Oh realization.

> > >

> > > Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

> >

> >

> >

> > Is this the part where Ramesh or Ram Tzu or whoever

> > suggests taking the million bucks?

>

>

> Diana, do you really need some one else to suggest to you, for you

to

> pick up a million bucks?

 

Laughing!

 

Talk about conditioning!

 

Who could have avoided that conditioning?

 

However, I have heard of people who returned

money that wasn't theirs, which they

stumbled across.

 

People for whom their sense of integrity was

more important than the money.

 

-- Dan

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> Nisargadatta , " diana_53231 " <diana@1...>

wrote:

> > Nisargadatta , Sandeep Chatterjee

> > <sandeepc@b...> wrote:

> > > -

> > > carolina112900

> > > Nisargadatta

> > > Wednesday, July 30, 2003 08:46 PM

> > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " Sandeep " <sandeepc@b...>

> > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > -

> > > > dan330033

> > > > Nisargadatta

> > > > Tuesday, July 29, 2003 08:40 PM

> > > > Re: The thingy known as Consciousness

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > <SNIP>

> > >

> > > Oh realization.

> > >

> > > Kinda bored with being enlighteningly realized.

> >

> >

> >

> > Is this the part where Ramesh or Ram Tzu or whoever

> > suggests taking the million bucks?

>

>

> Diana, do you really need some one else to suggest to you, for you

to

> pick up a million bucks?

 

 

Um....Sandeep, do you really need to ask?

[Guest guest]

For those who are interested. Perhaps no new web-sites but I think

they are worth being surfed and throw light on the concept

of " consciousness " from different fakultative angles.

 

http://www.imprint-academic.demon.co.uk/SPECIAL/05_01.html

 

and also:

 

http://www.imprint-academic.demon.co.uk/SPECIAL/author.html#471

 

but, there are much more.

 

 

Maybe we will come to an scientific break-trough here on this list?

Just kidding. Have fun while reading!

 

 

gassho

sk

[Guest guest]

 

 

 

What is Consciousness?

 

 

 

A prattling which appeared elsewhere to that posed question..........

 

 

The apparent lack of a terminological answer, as represented by that posed question ...........how does it intefere with the living, right now?

 

Or, in other words, what issue of your living, do you hope, ........will get addressed through an answer, any answer,... to that question?