Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Realization, Judi Rhodes <judirhodes@e...> wrote: > Judi wrote: > > Simply going along indulging yourself in life doesn't cut the mustard. > Every idiot and their brother does that. Nothing new there. No arguments. But don't interpret 'Partying' as just indulgence. It is more like accepting anything as partying and staying dispassionately with whatever there is . Like while dreaming, suppose somehow you had a conviction that you are just dreaming, and whatever happens thereafter in that dream becomes 'Partying'. You enjoy whatever happens -pain or pleasure- as a movie with the confidence that they are all happening to a dream character and I am not that. Then you can enjoy even the death of that character within the dream without any suffering. >Realization, > if there is to be any, lies in a specific process, which is > intelligence, which has nothing to do with indulgences, or the lack of > them. First of all who wants to be realized? Murali? Judi? They are all false entities. Appearances. By the definition, realization is the ending of these false entities (not necessarily physical). So after realization (so to say) if Murali is not there, for whom realization has any validity? If it is not for Murali then whatever there was beyond Murali, was/is already real. There is nothing to be realized for 'that'. Indulgences or lack of them does not change the picture for anybody at all. So why criticize anybody for whatever they are doing or not doing? Whether it falls in line with your way of thinking or not? on Yes, in such false entities there can be an understanding (intelligence as you say) of falsity of all this. Then, the party begins... Murali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 For your consideration, from my webiste: Judi wrote: Simply going along indulging yourself in life doesn't cut the mustard. Every idiot and their brother does that. Nothing new there. Realization, if there is to be any, lies in a specific process, which is intelligence, which has nothing to do with indulgences, or the lack of them. Bruce wrote: Right, and that intelligence can't be measured with an IQ test either -- the world is awash in high-IQ fools fascinated by their own shallow cleverness much like an ape entertaining itself by playing with its own dung! Krishnamurti often referred to intelligence that had nothing to do with the activity of thought. It's like the Cher character in " Moonstruck " yelling out " Get over it! " The " it " in this case is that which craves indulgence or exults in its supposed absence. -- Happy Days, Judi http://www.users.uniserve.com/~samuel/judi-1.htm TheEndOfTheRopeRanch http://www.livingston.net/allison/sacred01.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Hi Murali -- > The secret is that no one is doing anything here. Indeed -- Everything is done without anyone doing anything. Everything is known without anything there to be known. No knower or known, this is knowing. >And 20-30 years > later is, here now. Yes. Past, now, and later -- all equally " (present) " > > Does an enlightened entity (so to say) care for any secrets? The enlightened entity is simply a belly laugh, or perhaps an expelling of gas, leading the universe to feeling lighter :-) > By the way the word 'secret' was used in the context of this dialogue > just to replace " tell us what we are doing here " . Okay. Got ya. > > Will the sky keep one of its clouds unenlightened, > > so it can then give it the secret later? :-) > > > > The sky has no interest in any of the clouds. The clouds are the sky. There's no separation, so nothing about which to be distinterested. > It is what is. Always. On all sides, inside and out. > Clouds come an go. It seems that the clouds are after something. " Seems " is the key word. Seems to whom? The sky? But the sky is the clouds :-) > And > some who think they have achieved something think they are in some > way superior to others. What others? There is only sky :-) > > And when it rains, it is all water returning to water... Whether it is raining or not raining, it is all water all the time, on all sides ... But then, would a fish have any word for " wet? " :-) Wetly, Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Hi Murali Mirage :-), > Yes Dan. > > Murali, Judi, Dan all are mirages. > > Just appearances. > > There is a limit on how deep " I " can look. Beyond that no mirage, no > I, no you. Indeed. Stretched to the limit, the balloon breaks. No inside or outside, now. -- Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Realization, " murali_mel " <murali@g...> wrote: > Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > > > > > > Okay -- so let's look into this partying and suffering, then. > > There isn't any " we " who can look into it, > > it's the " me " who makes the " we " ... > > > > Yes indeed. Apparently. I myself is one appearance thinking it is > Murali who is striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. No -- an appearance doesn't think it is something. > > And that which runs the show through Murali is appearing as Judi or > Dan and letting those apparent entities think that thery are > striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. Nothing runs the show through Murali, or Judi, or Dan. Apparent entities don't think that they are striving, etc. They aren't capable of knowing. That's why they're called " apparent entities. " > > If I am just an " appearance " who is afraid of death? I was never born > and will never die. You are the fear behind the attempt to believe that. > > If you are not afraid of death, what good enlightenment can bring to > you or what you lose by being un-enlightened? All you are is fear of death, of being nothing. And yes, if knowing this clearly, there is no concern with what enlightenment could bring. > The partying will go on as it goes on now, irrespective of what you > try to do or try not to do. The anxiety about being nothing will continue to claim that it is partying along, having a merry time. > > > Having said that let me mention one more thing. Even if Judi digs > > in > > > a dagger into this throat, my love for you will never stain a bit > > as > > > there is an understanding here that you are nothing but " I am " . > > > > Judi didn't invent death. > > She's not to blame for the way this is. > > > > Of course not. With the above said understanding how can I blame > anybody for anything? Acceptance is the only option and natural. True. There can be no blame, hence no attempt to continue. > > > > > > > Why focus on Judi -- she's just an image > > appearing on an e-mail list? > > > > > Who else you think Murali is? Exactly. She is the anxiety about having no Murali to have a party. > > > > > When the " I " tries to have what it likes, that's partying. > > When the " I " tries to get away from what it doesn't like, > > or eliminate it, that's suffering. > > The " I " can't keep its partying, so its partying is suffering. > > > > No. All what there is, is partying. Including suffering and death. > Partying of that which is bored of being 'alone', appararently > manifesting itself into multitude. You are this anxiety about being alone -- you are now looking into this honestly -- so no backing off, no going forward -- no attempt to party on, which is another version of the attempt to escape death, being nothing. > And here is a wave attempting to realize the ocean! The ocean is the ocean. Nothing to say about it. > > > > There's no way not to keep on suffering, as long as one > > is alive. Gautama simply commmented on what he > > honestly noticed going on. > > > > > > Dan > > > True. There is no way out. So why bother. That's why I said in the > first place, " Let's go party " That's an attempt at a way out. > > Now, shall we start all over again? <LOL> Nope :-) Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Realization, Judi Rhodes <judirhodes@e...> wrote: >Judi wrote: >Simply going along indulging yourself in life doesn't cut the mustard. >Every idiot and their brother does that. Nothing new there. No arguments. But don't interpret 'Partying' as mere indulgence. It is more like accepting all happenings as partying without any discrimination or attachment. Like when you are dreaming, suppose somehow you got convinced that you are dreaming, then whatever happens thereafter becomes partying. You just enjoy everything as in a movie -both pain and pleasure- nothing ever touches you because you know very well that it is only a dream and whatever is happening is happening to that dream character, but I AM NOT THAT. With that understanding you may even watch the death of that character itself without you suffering. >Realization, >if there is to be any, lies in a specific process, which is >intelligence, which has nothing to do with indulgences, or the lack of them. Who want's realization? Murali? Judi? They are all false entities. Just appearances. By definition, realization is ending of these false entities (not ncessarily physical). So after realization (so to say) if Murali is nomore then for whom realization has any validity? If realization is not for Murali then what is there beyond Murali is always real and there is nothing to be realized as far as 'that' is concerned. Indulgence or lack of it does not change the picture at all. So why criticise anybody's action or inaction just because it does not fall in line with your views? Whatever the false entiy 'does' or 'thinks' can only be false irrespective of the conceptual standing of that entity. Yes, in some such entities there may be an understanding (Intelligence as you may put) of the falsity of all this. That's when the party begins.... >Bruce wrote: >Right, and that intelligence can't be measured with an IQ test either >-- the world is awash in high-IQ fools fascinated by their own shallow >cleverness much like an ape entertaining itself by playing with its own >dung! >Krishnamurti often referred to intelligence that had nothing to do >with the activity of thought. It's like the Cher character in > " Moonstruck " yelling out " Get over it! " The " it " in this case is that >which craves indulgence or exults in its supposed absence. Not interested in others' dung. <LOL> >-- >Happy Days, >Judi Same to you Judi. Murali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 Whatever you say Dan. No need to try harder. <LOL> Stay with your version of partying. Let this appearance called 'Murali' live with it's fears and anxiety in your world. And here, the partying goes on as usual. The duet of one. (A bow to the patend owners of this expression) Murali Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > Realization, " murali_mel " <murali@g...> wrote: > > Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Okay -- so let's look into this partying and suffering, then. > > > There isn't any " we " who can look into it, > > > it's the " me " who makes the " we " ... > > > > > > > Yes indeed. Apparently. I myself is one appearance thinking it is > > Murali who is striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. > > No -- > an appearance doesn't think it is something. > > > > > And that which runs the show through Murali is appearing as Judi or > > Dan and letting those apparent entities think that thery are > > striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. > > Nothing runs the show through Murali, or Judi, or Dan. > > Apparent entities don't think that they are striving, etc. > They aren't capable of knowing. > That's why they're called " apparent entities. " > > > > > If I am just an " appearance " who is afraid of death? I was never > born > > and will never die. > > You are the fear behind the attempt to believe that. > > > > > If you are not afraid of death, what good enlightenment can bring > to > > you or what you lose by being un-enlightened? > > All you are is fear of death, of being nothing. > And yes, if knowing this clearly, there is no > concern with what enlightenment could bring. > > > The partying will go on as it goes on now, irrespective of what you > > try to do or try not to do. > > The anxiety about being nothing will continue > to claim that it is partying along, having > a merry time. > > > > > > Having said that let me mention one more thing. Even if Judi > digs > > > in > > > > a dagger into this throat, my love for you will never stain a > bit > > > as > > > > there is an understanding here that you are nothing but " I am " . > > > > > > Judi didn't invent death. > > > She's not to blame for the way this is. > > > > > > > > Of course not. With the above said understanding how can I blame > > anybody for anything? Acceptance is the only option and natural. > > True. > > There can be no blame, hence no attempt to continue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why focus on Judi -- she's just an image > > > appearing on an e-mail list? > > > > > > > > > Who else you think Murali is? > > Exactly. > She is the anxiety about having no Murali > to have a party. > > > > > > > > > > When the " I " tries to have what it likes, that's partying. > > > When the " I " tries to get away from what it doesn't like, > > > or eliminate it, that's suffering. > > > The " I " can't keep its partying, so its partying is suffering. > > > > > > > No. All what there is, is partying. Including suffering and death. > > Partying of that which is bored of being 'alone', appararently > > manifesting itself into multitude. > > You are this anxiety about being alone -- > you are now looking into this honestly -- > so no backing off, no going forward -- > no attempt to party on, which is > another version of the attempt > to escape death, being nothing. > > > And here is a wave attempting to realize the ocean! > > The ocean is the ocean. Nothing to say about it. > > > > > > > > There's no way not to keep on suffering, as long as one > > > is alive. Gautama simply commmented on what he > > > honestly noticed going on. > > > > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > True. There is no way out. So why bother. That's why I said in the > > first place, " Let's go party " > > That's an attempt at a way out. > > > > > Now, shall we start all over again? <LOL> > > Nope :-) > > Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 Realization, " murali_mel " <murali@g...> wrote: > > Whatever you say Dan. No need to try harder. > > <LOL> > > > > Stay with your version of partying. > > Let this appearance called 'Murali' live with it's fears and anxiety > in your world. > > And here, the partying goes on as usual. > > The duet of one. (A bow to the patend owners of this expression) > > Murali > Perhaps the singular duets and all the appearances that are thus condensed into the One which IS('cause really, them multitudes in fact ARE NOT?), should get together which of course they already Is, and jest party or suffer themslves to death. Thereby, doin' thier own selves a favour by not Bein' anymore and thus Ye Shall Know the Ye that Ain't and therefore Be the We/Me that ya already Know without and within and everthin' else that can be imagined in the mind or not, Which all of course is the case.So we agree I/not I etc. Mmmmmm.... Feller named Billy Shakespeare once said, " Much Ado About Nothing " .But it is fun to play around,ain't it? Jest some thoughts of the illusion which thinks it Is and can thus think these thoughts(even though,of course it cain't cause it ain't)...Known as the cowboy named Robere...roberibus111 > > > Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > > Realization, " murali_mel " <murali@g...> wrote: > > > Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay -- so let's look into this partying and suffering, then. > > > > There isn't any " we " who can look into it, > > > > it's the " me " who makes the " we " ... > > > > > > > > > > Yes indeed. Apparently. I myself is one appearance thinking it is > > > Murali who is striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. > > > > No -- > > an appearance doesn't think it is something. > > > > > > > > And that which runs the show through Murali is appearing as Judi > or > > > Dan and letting those apparent entities think that thery are > > > striving, achieving, suffering, partying etc. etc. > > > > Nothing runs the show through Murali, or Judi, or Dan. > > > > Apparent entities don't think that they are striving, etc. > > They aren't capable of knowing. > > That's why they're called " apparent entities. " > > > > > > > > If I am just an " appearance " who is afraid of death? I was never > > born > > > and will never die. > > > > You are the fear behind the attempt to believe that. > > > > > > > > If you are not afraid of death, what good enlightenment can bring > > to > > > you or what you lose by being un-enlightened? > > > > All you are is fear of death, of being nothing. > > And yes, if knowing this clearly, there is no > > concern with what enlightenment could bring. > > > > > The partying will go on as it goes on now, irrespective of what > you > > > try to do or try not to do. > > > > The anxiety about being nothing will continue > > to claim that it is partying along, having > > a merry time. > > > > > > > > > Having said that let me mention one more thing. Even if Judi > > digs > > > > in > > > > > a dagger into this throat, my love for you will never stain a > > bit > > > > as > > > > > there is an understanding here that you are nothing but " I > am " . > > > > > > > > Judi didn't invent death. > > > > She's not to blame for the way this is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Of course not. With the above said understanding how can I blame > > > anybody for anything? Acceptance is the only option and natural. > > > > True. > > > > There can be no blame, hence no attempt to continue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why focus on Judi -- she's just an image > > > > appearing on an e-mail list? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Who else you think Murali is? > > > > Exactly. > > She is the anxiety about having no Murali > > to have a party. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When the " I " tries to have what it likes, that's partying. > > > > When the " I " tries to get away from what it doesn't like, > > > > or eliminate it, that's suffering. > > > > The " I " can't keep its partying, so its partying is suffering. > > > > > > > > > > No. All what there is, is partying. Including suffering and > death. > > > Partying of that which is bored of being 'alone', appararently > > > manifesting itself into multitude. > > > > You are this anxiety about being alone -- > > you are now looking into this honestly -- > > so no backing off, no going forward -- > > no attempt to party on, which is > > another version of the attempt > > to escape death, being nothing. > > > > > And here is a wave attempting to realize the ocean! > > > > The ocean is the ocean. Nothing to say about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > There's no way not to keep on suffering, as long as one > > > > is alive. Gautama simply commmented on what he > > > > honestly noticed going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > > > > True. There is no way out. So why bother. That's why I said in > the > > > first place, " Let's go party " > > > > That's an attempt at a way out. > > > > > > > > Now, shall we start all over again? <LOL> > > > > Nope :-) > > > > Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 > Whatever you say Dan. Yup. Whatever, Murali. >No need to try harder. Nope. No effort. > > <LOL> > Funny. > Stay with your version of partying. What for? > Let this appearance called 'Murali' live with it's fears and anxiety > in your world. Nope, can't allow that, as she's not able to do that. > > And here, the partying goes on as usual. No, in fact, it doesn't. > > The duet of one. (A bow to the patend owners of this expression) There isn't such thing, only the belief in the appearance as such. Don't be deceived by these patented expressions, including " whatever you say, Murali. " LOL, too! -- Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 Realization, " roberibus111 " <roberibus111@a...> wrote: <SNIP> > Feller named Billy Shakespeare once said, " Much Ado About > Nothing " . Yes. That sum's it all. But even after knowing that, can Murali or Robere just shut up? No way. Beacause in all these noises there is no Muarli making any noise nor any Robere adding to that. >But it is fun to play around,ain't it? Indeed. I was just bored. Did anybody take things seriously? <LOL> Nice meeting you Robere. Murali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 Hi Cowboy Robere -- Only this. And thus, not the past, not an image. Very simple. Not caught in any image, anywhere. Thoughts come and go. But not really. Come and go compared to what? Go where? Images. Thoughts, fun, images, perceptions, feelings ... Not. Nothing comes or goes, nor doesn't ... Only this! -- Dan > Perhaps the singular duets and all the appearances that are thus > condensed into the One which IS('cause really, them multitudes in > fact ARE NOT?), should get together which of course they already Is, > and jest party or suffer themslves to death. Thereby, doin' thier own > selves a favour by not Bein' anymore and thus Ye Shall Know the Ye > that Ain't and therefore Be the We/Me that ya already Know without > and within and everthin' else that can be imagined in the mind or > not, Which all of course is the case.So we agree I/not I etc. > Mmmmmm.... > Feller named Billy Shakespeare once said, " Much Ado About > Nothing " .But it is fun to play around,ain't it? > Jest some thoughts of the illusion which thinks it Is and can thus > think these thoughts(even though,of course it cain't cause it > ain't)...Known as the cowboy named Robere...roberibus111 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 Realization, " dan330033 " <dan330033> wrote: > > > Let this appearance called 'Murali' live with it's fears and > anxiety > > in your world. > > Nope, can't allow that, as she's not able to do that. > Hey Dan, Murali is more close to a he, even if you don't like it. These Indian names! Am I smelling a little more symapthy now? LOL. > Don't be deceived by these patented expressions, > including " whatever you say, Murali. " > > LOL, too! > > -- Dan Do you see a bit of 'Sandeep Chatterjee' there? A bow to him as well; where ever he is. Ever since I was deceived by that dude's prattling " seriousness is a desease " I just can't stop laughing. Murali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 > Hey Dan, Murali is more close to a he, even if you don't like it. > These Indian names! What's not to like, Murali? Thanks for the clarification. Always interesting what is learned on these lists :-) > Am I smelling a little more symapthy now? LOL. Nope. I think what you're smelling is that I'm very incensed. Or perhaps it's Rome burning that you're smelling :-0 > > Don't be deceived by these patented expressions, > > including " whatever you say, Murali. " > > > > LOL, too! > > > > -- Dan > > Do you see a bit of 'Sandeep Chatterjee' there? A bow to him as well; > where ever he is. Wherever you say, Murali. :-) Ever since I was deceived by that dude's > prattling " seriousness is a desease " I just can't stop laughing. It was one Rajneesh/Osho liked a lot, too. Careful of these tricksters, they'll play with your head. Clearly, you're taking the statement too seriously, and now you're stuck laughing and partying. To paraphrase Ecclesiastes: To everything, there is a season... A time to party, and a time to mourn ... A time to laugh, and a time for tears ... When you take nothing to heart, and have your heart set on nothing, all is well -- Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2002 Report Share Posted April 19, 2002 Realization, " murali_mel " <murali@g...> wrote: > Realization, " roberibus111 " <roberibus111@a...> wrote: > > <SNIP> > > > Feller named Billy Shakespeare once said, " Much Ado About > > Nothing " . > > > > Yes. That sum's it all. > > But even after knowing that, can Murali or Robere just shut up? > > No way. Beacause in all these noises there is no Muarli making any > noise nor any Robere adding to that. > > > > >But it is fun to play around,ain't it? > > > > Indeed. I was just bored. Did anybody take things seriously? > <LOL> > > Nice meeting you Robere. > > Murali And indeed, nice meeting you Murali.I'd say more ma'am, but I feel I should shut up 'cause o' what I know.Or Not.As the case MAY BE.I mean, What can I say? Now wait, I know what I can say! And,I think therefore I am I think I will say that again??? Which 'course leads me back to Billy... Seriously..............a cowboy named Robere..roberibus111 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2002 Report Share Posted April 20, 2002 Howdy, Robere. Cowgirl from Wyoming here. You really do get a different philosophy of life when you spend a lot of time cowboyin'. Bein' alone, rained on, cold, checkin' fence,and learning that gripin' does no good, cause it is still gonna be cold. Learnin' that some of the purtiest things in the world are a calf you had to help deliver, and a sunrise when you are still sleepy. Learnin' that time ain't all that inportant, unless you are on the world's schedule (Rodeoin' or something) Learnin' that laughing is important to your overall health. Glad to meet you cowboy . Come on over for supper whenever you are in the neighborhood. Gelf Never be pessimistic: It is not going to work anyhow. ---- >Seriously..............a cowboy named Robere..roberibus111 __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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