Type of Death and it's relation to There After ......

March 2, 2010

Shree Hari Ram Ram

Sadhak, we continue to emphasize BREVITY, RELEVANCE AND RESPECT FOR ALL. Please kindly adhere to these guidelines.

Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

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QUESTION:

Can we relate one's death to his destination after "swarg" (heaven) or "nark" (hell)

one who dies without a days illness and hospitalization

one who dies in bed in sleep

one who dies after prolonged illness

one whose atma leaves body thorugh 10th dwar (head)

which is the most probable indicators of one's final destination

SWARG (heaven), NARK (hell) OR PARAMDHAM (Eternal Abode of the Lord.

Thanking you and looking forward an opportunity to serve you again.

K.K.BIYANI

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COPIED FROM TOPIC - AFTER DEATH at /message/1314

namastey sadhaak ji,I does not die..but what is that I ?Sharira (Body) is born, changes and dies..whereas I goes from onebody (sharir) to other.Human posseses physical body, emotional body and mental body.Others,supramental and divine bodies can not be caliberated buttheir presence is accepted by unexplainable effects.After death of first physical body I lives in emotional body(purgatory) and dies to enter mental body(heaven), and dies, toenter supra mental bodies..After passing karma-related period in these bodies, the I descendsin reverse cycle to get another birth.Ramesh Jhalla--

What is the position of a person after death?We often harbor such confusion by questioning what we would be after death as if we have understood what we are when alive. The question "What am I now?" is more meaningful question than "what would I be after death?" The earlier brings peace because the verybasis for this question is the quest for peace. On the other hand, the later brings fear because the very basis for the question is fear of death. We somehow "want" to believe that we can somehowconquer death … if not circumvent it at the least to quench our insatiable desire to stick to our individual identities. This is the root cause for this perennial human quest (rather greed!) for after death continuity of an individual throughout the history of mankind.Bhagavdgita keeps emphasizing on this confusion in ones mind … for example,Jaatasya hi dhruvo mrithuh dhruvam janma mritasya cha |Tasmaadapariharyarthe na tvam shochitum arhasi ||If you think you are born, death is inevitable to you. If you think you are going to die, birth is inevitable to you as well. If you think you are born you are bound to be afraid of death. If you think you would die you are bound to lust for birth. Perception of birth and death are inseparable. Either win over such perception altogether or accept the perception as is. Either way you have no room for miseries. Bhagavan Vyasa is so beautifully explicit over this matter through out the epic of Mahabharatha.In other words, before addressing the question on after death situation, you have to address the following while you are "alive":1. What are life, birth and death?2. What is your relation with these three wonderfully illusive and evasive events?3. Who are you and what are you? Do you really know the "Sukshma Sharira" that you are referring to?4. Do you believe you were born? In that case what were you at the instance of birth?5. Do you believe you will die one day? In that case what would you be at the instance of death?My opinion is … You would be the same at the instance of death as you were at the instance of birth! Same are you while living!! Same were you before "your" birth!!! Same will you be after "your" death!!!Can you ever establish what YOU are, were and would be?! NO!!! NEVER!!!!|| Naayamaatmaa pravachena labhyah | Na medhaya na bhuna shrutena ||My suggestion is … do not pursue the mirage as the above verse from Bhagavadgita instructs. Can you ever establish what this "sukshma sharira" is when you have all the faculties such as "annam pranam chakshuh shrotram mano vaachamiti"? It is something that cannot beestablished as it is much more than your sensory capabilities of perception. Just like a man born blind can never experience what a color could be or like a man born deaf could never tell what a sound could be, all of us can never tell what anything could be beyond our senses.If you think that only those sensible make sense to you, so be it. Then, everything is as momentary as your sensory faculties are – that includes your "sukshma sharira" as well. If you understand that your senses are only partial, limited and momentary in nature, you would not dare to establish something beyond your senses within these senses. That would be as ridiculous as a blind man arguing about a color or a deaf man judging some music!Do not try to establish anything … just be as you are … just perceive everything as is … then you are automatically THAT which is The You before your birth, at your birth, through your life, at your death, and after your death. If you let yourself be … THAT reveals itself within and around.Yamevaisha vrinute tena labhyah | Tasyaisha aatmaa virunute tanumswaa ||Please think about it.Respects.Naga Narayana

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What happens at the time of Death of the gross body? Vedic description.At the time of death of the gross body, cells merge with the earth, spirit merges with the divine Nature (Prakrti), the soul being immortal remains alive, and hence consciousness remains. Based on degree of truth, quality of Karma (good or bad deeds), acquired in the present and previous births as individual's running ledger account, it gets manifested again on the birth of another gross body. This process of birth and rebirth continues until, the soul achieves perfection, is released from the three modes of Prakrti and moves beyond three gunas of transparency, activity and passivity. It is the stage of salvation, liberation i.e. Vedic Moksha.Rig Veda 1-164-20, 10-9-20, 10-8-43 and 44 describe three divine substances, Parmatma (Supreme Soul), Atma (human soul) and the divine Nature. On the "Death" of human beings, spirit goes back to Prakrti and merges with the Nature as part of the vast storehouse of energy. The soul does not go back to Parmatma who is the Supreme Soul as it gets affected with subtle atoms and particles of human good and bad deeds, thoughts and desires.Vedic metaphysics is emphatic that owing to the prevalence of the spirit of God in all human beings, any distinction of class superiority or inferiority is negation of religion and ethics.Soul is dynamic but not moving when manifested, but moves faster than all material things when not manifested. It traverses billions of miles when it goes to devas (beings of light as forces of divine Nature) viz. Suriya (Sun), Chandrama (Moon), Indra, , Mitra, Varun, Yama etc., during the 12 days journey after the death of gross body for purification, knowledge, luster, noble and divine traits, which it lost during the stage of manifestation in the body. (Yajur Veda 39-6). But the effects of Karma remain intact. It becomes fierce, calm, terrible, fearless, ignorant, enlightened, passionate or ascetic dependent on the past deeds, desires and thoughts (Y.V.39-7). In the womb it becomes lovely through various virtuous deeds, chastise able through ignoble deeds, supreme through divine knowledge, noble through spiritual force and protector of all bodily organs and the pericardium enclosing the heart. It is for this reason that most of the scriptures mention the soul dwelling in the heart of all individuals. Apart from Vedas, Bhagavad-Gita, Adi Grantha Gaund M-5 and Katha Upanishad 1-2-20 to 22 also mention the soul residing in the heart.After its 12 days journey, it is well equipped with Vedic knowledge, a-priori principles and cosmic laws of social and moral order (Rta). Thus on the birth of a child, the knowledge of four Vedas is made available through the manifested soul which is part of the inner world.Thus consciousness is the real cause of transmigration of soul from one body to another. Brihadarnyaka Upanishad 4-3-34 and 4-4-4 explains the rebirth as a man passes from dream to wakefulness, so does from this life to next life. At old age or during the stage of degeneration even during young age, the self separates from the limbs like ripe mango, fig or banayan fruit separates itself from the trunk. The same way the self hastens to his new abode based on past karma and begins a new life in a new body. The "self" i.e. atma departs through eye, or gate of the skull or some other apertures of the body. The deeds of the entire life and the impressions those deeds created to the manifested soul before leaving the body follows the individual in the next birth.Even those souls which have achieved Moksha and have become one with God also take birth after centuries to guide the harassed humanity. Some time they take birth through divine potency like Lord Krishna or Lord Rama and most often as human beings with normal birth likeBuddha, Mahavira, Socrates, Sankracharya and many others.From the above description, it is apparent that true followers of Vedic guidelines observe Prayer Meetings of the departed souls on the 13th day of the death as the departed soul completes its journey for purification on the 12th day.With kind regards,P.K.Sabhlok

--------------------------------Dear Sadaks,Jeevathuma is Sukshumamam. It is energy that comes into form (human, animal, ant, plant etc) depending on Karmas. This Jeevathuma (call it sprit/ sukshuma/ soul) joins with Paramathuma when there is no credit of puniyas or papas. Human can send his/her soul through Susunba Nerve right through spinal cord on to top of skull where there it can open and go to GOD. This is done only by Yogi after several births of practice Bagavan says in Geetha.

Electricity cannot be seen but can be known or used with help of material. So is everything on earth. The body is instrument packed with 6 types of DNA based on astrological factors again this based on one` s karmas. Body Pancha boothas (5 elements) covered by Pancha gosas (5 Layers of auras) and within or near to heart there is a vacuum space where this soul remains witness for all that the body, mind and intellect does. Actions of body (karmendriyam) Mind(thoughts) are called Manasha Karma. All the Karmas are recorded by 5 sheets of Gosas. When soul leaves the body due to decay 6th stage (Bagavan says 6 stages of transformations all living things undergo), the soul goes to SUN along with 5 gosas and from there the path of soul decided. The soul comes to earth through rain drop, gets into any eatable, the body (known as annamaiya) which eats and sperms develop. These sperms are injected into female body where the soul starts developing form. Once the mind on 5th month in womb starts working, the soul has capacity to know all that happened in past birth. The infant in womb soaked in chemical substance, smelling very bad odor, thinks that it made mistake wasting previous birth amidst pomp and show, wealth and fame etc. Unable to remain in one position, due to pricks, keeps turning. The sufferings of a child in womb is worst than living on earth. The child in wombsurely does feel that once it is out of womb, it will do only tapas, bakthi and remain aloof from world. But on touching atmosphere everything erased due to the karmas it had. Example: Jada Bharatha story of 3 births.DEAR SADAKS our scriptures had clearly said which month the baby develops form, when nail, when hair, when eyes etc. Each organ has it` s own devatha. Based on ones karma the child is born or dies in womb or gets suitable parents, countary/place, brothers sisters, poor/rich etc, with destined span of life. A person gets sickness first at aura level. The sickness penetrates through aura and enters body mostly at Kethu Raasi. One can take static from sick personsand they will be Kethu rasi. Again all sickess or accidents or sufferings effects little or nothing in case of Bagavan Bakthas.

Persons Praying demi Gods, Bagavan says in Geetha Mooda. There is places where these are said in Geetha. But Bagavan Sri Vishnu took birth as Kapila and gave full text of human life and death in Sri Math Bagavath as KAPILA GEETHA. Further full information is inGARBOPANASHID.Cycle of birth and death continues as long as one has desires on this earth. People, who contemplated that there is some thing much more extremely valuable, left behind everything in search of truth. Example: Buddha left kingdom, riches and happy family. Purandaradoss (said to be incarnation of Naradha) known as Nava Koti (9 Crores) narayana just left behind everything at one stroke went to Panderpur.Sadaks- That does not mean we go away into forest. We can be Baktha concentrating on Sri Krishna having in mind that everyone and everything is Asat.Who ever we may be. Once the soul departs the body is disposed off with in 24 hoursB.Sathyanarayan.

Subject of life and death is discussed in Bhagwat Gita in the very begining as primary. The main problem of Arjun was fear in causing death of his family members and soldiers for pecuniary gains, and therefore he was reluctant. Life and death happen all the time.Love for a condition between life and death is not possible to have for long, because the body is constantly changing, and environmental responses do change. Also, when a person changes the place of residence or employment from one to another city, this is death from old place and birth at new place. That means, if that person goes back to old city, he will know it but cannot recognize and cannot relate it to himself. At time of death, or changes in job or house or cloths, the changes occur is similar. At new city, new relations are forged and new businesses develop, but the man remains the same, and his mind is growing constantly, across different lives and death.When a person leaves a job for better job, he is happy and has no pain in reliving from old body; but when a person is kicked off from a job, then person pleaded to have more time, and not happy to leave it. After death and before birth is a time for relaxation and waiting for a good opportunity. This state is lonely and not engaged. After engagement, life becomes physical, and active in a given mould. In other words, the life is like a car, seed or medicine which is complete and full in itself, at begining itself, and expiry date in normal condition is fixed at time of manufacture. Birth place and time is very important for ones' life as it is for a car or medicines or any product. After manufacture, nothing can be added or deleated.It is fixed, and has to endure in physical world (mrityu lok). RegardsK G Misra ------------------------------

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!The following explanation is based on our own experience, and not some hypothesis.Just as we have a gross physical body with sense organs, brain, hands, legs, etc. there is also an experience of thoughts, intelligence, memory, mind-stuff, and a strong sense of "I"-ego, as if residing, in the gross body. This later beig subtle in nature and can be called subtle body, body meaning a collection of instrument of knowledge in this context.

However, gross body is like a TV set providing hardware, and subtle body is like unlocalized broadcasting waves, localized, as it were, in a body, like the TV set, which is the needed hardware without which localization is not possible. It is the subtle body which really dictates the gross body to act through senses and thinking process as we alll know. Since the subtle body has centered around the sense of separation, ego, "I", it is acting in ignorance as conditioned byuniversal body of ignorance-also known as collective Karmas-impressions done in terms of thoughts and feelings of all mankind since the beginning who lived and are living as egoicentities.Subtle body originates from the genetic and environmental conditioning and hence each person feels different and separate in ignorance! As we all know physical and subtle body of a person is useless without Atman, a self-evident Presence of Existence in us which makes body function at gross level as well as subtle level in terms of hearing, seeing, smelling, touching, tasting and thinking, knowing. Atman is thus pure Consciousness that witnesses body-mind and world. It isthe subtlest body of sat-chit-ananda experience, so to speak. In Consciousness-Atma when an identification with limitations of gross and subtle body takes place, a person, as described above, is born who lives life as separate and independent entity, and thinks he is doer of deeds. It is actually subtle body that drives his life.Such a person acquires desires, fears, likes and dislikes, and consequent suffering. Upon death subtle body(sukshma sarir) goes to merge with all collective subtle bodies, maintaining to some degree its ignorance of not knowing its impersonal nature.Collective subtle body or Karmas condition, in more or less degree, individuals born in that place and that time with then prevalent conditioning. For example some have compassionate thoughts of Saints and Sages who lived before us or living now, and some are impressed by cruelties, tragedies brought about by people of evil actions. Each one of us feeds from and to that collective subtle body of ignorance and it continues from body to body in an impersonal way as if reincarnated into a suitable body to continue where it left in a previous birth, so to speak, to wipe out karmas.

So Karmas, reincarnations are the results of living a conditioned life of a separate being with a Karta-bhav. Thus it is really a drama played in a dream of ignorance! Upon true knowledge of Atman, Universal Consciousness, one wakes up from such a dream. The subtle body thus dissolves into the ocean of Bliss! No more births or deaths, bodies simply come and go, are witnessed as roles, and right actions are brought about to establish Dharma!Namaskar.....Pratap(Pratap Bhatt)