Buried in the sands of Mesopotamia

[Guest guest]

Some kind of graceful exit out of Iraq - this business about a graceful exit just simply has no realism to it at all! Of course Bush is not Hitler. Like Blair, he once thought he was Winston Churchill, a man who never - ever - lied to his people about Britain's defeats in war. But fantasy knows no bounds.....

 

<b>Bush is in denial</b>

– The Independent December 1, 2006

 

More than half a million deaths, an army trapped in the largest military debacle since Vietnam, a Middle East policy already buried in the sands of Mesopotamia - and still George W Bush is in denial. How does he do it? How does he persuade himself - as he apparently did in Amman yesterday - that the United States will stay in Iraq "until the job is complete"? The "job" - Washington's project to reshape the Middle East in its own and Israel's image - is long dead, its very neoconservative originators disavowing their hopeless political aims and blaming Bush, along with the Iraqis of course, for their disaster.

 

History's "deniers" are many - and all subject to the same folly: faced with overwhelming evidence of catastrophe, they take refuge in fantasy, dismissing evidence of collapse as a symptom of some short-term setback, clinging to the idea that as long as their generals promise victory - or because they have themselves so often promised victory - that fate will be kind. George W Bush - or Lord Blair of Kut al-Amara for that matter - need not feel alone. The Middle East has produced these fantasists by the bucketful over past decades.

 

In 1967, Egyptian president Gamel Abdul Nasser insisted his country was winning the Six Day War hours after the Israelis had destroyed the entire Egyptian air force on the ground. President Carter was extolling the Shah's Iran as "an island of stability in the region" only days before Ayatollah Khomeini's Islamic revolution brought down his regime. President Leonid Brezhnev declared a Soviet victory in Afghanistan when Russian troops were being driven from their fire bases in Nangahar and Kandahar provinces by Osama bin Laden and his fighters.

 

And was it not Saddam Hussein who promised the "mother of all battles" for Kuwait before the great Iraqi retreat in 1991? And was it not Saddam again who predicted a US defeat in the sands of Iraq in 2003? Saddam's loyal acolyte, Mohamed el-Sahaf, would fantasise about the number of American soldiers who would die in the desert; George W Bush let it be known that he sometimes slipped out of White House staff meetings to watch Sahaf's preposterous performance and laugh at the fantasies of Iraq's minister of information.

 

So who is laughing at Bush now? Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, almost as loyal a retainer to Bush as Sahaf was to Saddam, receives the same false praise from the American president that Nasser and Brezhnev once lavished upon their generals. "I appreciate the courage you show during these difficult times as you lead your country," Bush tells Maliki. "He's the right guy for Iraq," he tells us. And the Iraqi Prime Minister who hides in the US-fortified "Green Zone" - was ever a crusader fortress so aptly named? - announces that "there is no problem". Power must be more quickly transferred to Maliki, we were informed yesterday. Why? Because that will save Iraq? Or because this will allow America to claim, as it did when it decided to allow the South Vietnamese army to fight on its own against Hanoi, that Washington is not to blame for the debacle that follows? "One of his frustrations with me is that he believes that we've been slow about giving him the tools necessary to protect the Iraqi people." Or so Bush says. "He doesn't have the capacity to respond. So we want to accelerate that capacity." But how can Maliki have any "capacity" at all when he rules only a few square miles of central Baghdad and a clutch of rotting ex-Baathist palaces?

 

About the only truthful statement uttered in Amman yesterday was Bush's remark that "there's a lot of speculation that these reports in Washington mean there's going to be some kind of graceful exit out of Iraq [but] this business about a graceful exit just simply has no realism to it at all." Indeed, it has not. There can be no graceful exit from Iraq, only a terrifying, bloody collapse of military power. The withdrawal of Shia ministers from Maliki's cabinet mirror the withdrawal of Shia ministers from another American-supported administration in Beirut - where the Lebanese fear an equally appalling conflict over which Washington has, in reality, no military or political control.

 

Bush even appeared oblivious of the current sectarian map of Iraq. "The Prime Minister made clear that splitting his country into parts, as some have suggested, is not what the Iraqi people want, and that any partition of Iraq would only lead to an increase in sectarian violence," he said. "I agree." But Iraq is already "split into parts". The fracture of Iraq is virtually complete, its chasms sucking in corpses at the rate of up to a thousand a day.

 

Even Hitler must chuckle at this bloodbath, he who claimed in April 1945 that Germany would still win the Second World War, boasting that his enemy, Roosevelt, had died - much as Bush boasted of Zarqawi's killing - while demanding to know when General Wenck's mythical army would rescue the people of Berlin. How many "Wencks" are going to be summoned from the 82nd Airborne or the Marine Corps to save Bush from Iraq in the coming weeks? No, Bush is not Hitler. Like Blair, he once thought he was Winston Churchill, a man who never - ever - lied to his people about Britain's defeats in war. But fantasy knows no bounds.

[gHari 0]

Not that quantity is the all in all, but the BBC website showed that before the recent number of 655,000 other Iraqi sources gave numbers of 100,000 and 150,000. The horrendous number seems suspect. Hopefully.

[Guest guest]

Oh no, stop me, this phrase reminds me of my favorite rap artist. Ice T. But I dont think id get much response, nor will I post lyrics soon (although I do highly recommend Ice T's autobiography).

 

The numbersa are controlled from all sides, great effort has been enacted to keep the public from knowing the truth.

 

Like the 2800 american dead figure. This means 2800 were dead on the dirt in Iraq, if the body is still wiggling when placed in the helocopter, it is not KIA (killed in action).

 

In actuality, over 9000 US military personnel are dead as a result of taking part in the bogus war. The 600,000 Iraqi dead figure may not be high, rather very low, for the same reason. Thousands of Iraqis have died in route to somewhere else, and the number of Iraqis dead at the hands of Iraqis is staggering, some say up to over 3000 per month, increasing, not decreasing.

 

All we do at this point is pray. That those who die are treated well on the other side. War is a catastrophe, like tsunamis, like volocanoes, caused by failure to speak the TRUE. We honor all the dead, yes, even the suicide bomber, also VICTIMS of circumstance, denizens of Kali Yuga.

[Guest guest]

Bush is no hitler. Hitler didnt have beef for brains. Also, Hitler had an exit strategy. Wulfschnaze.

[krishnadasa 0]

 

Oh no, stop me, this phrase reminds me of my favorite rap artist. Ice T. But I dont think id get much response, nor will I post lyrics soon (although I do highly recommend Ice T's autobiography).

 

The numbersa are controlled from all sides, great effort has been enacted to keep the public from knowing the truth.

 

Like the 2800 american dead figure. This means 2800 were dead on the dirt in Iraq, if the body is still wiggling when placed in the helocopter, it is not KIA (killed in action).

 

In actuality, over 9000 US military personnel are dead as a result of taking part in the bogus war. The 600,000 Iraqi dead figure may not be high, rather very low, for the same reason. Thousands of Iraqis have died in route to somewhere else, and the number of Iraqis dead at the hands of Iraqis is staggering, some say up to over 3000 per month, increasing, not decreasing.

 

All we do at this point is pray. That those who die are treated well on the other side. War is a catastrophe, like tsunamis, like volocanoes, caused by failure to speak the TRUE. We honor all the dead, yes, even the suicide bomber, also VICTIMS of circumstance, denizens of Kali Yuga.

 

I wonder if those dead in Iraq war would ever get any Heaven for dyring for thier mother land... Here it appears like they died for someone's selfish cause... Might have born as new age Iraqi by now who would eventually avenge over US... A history that just repeats itself:mad:

 

Sri hari hari bol

[Guest guest]

I sympathize with what you say, krsnadas, but Ill reprint this from another topic:

 

"Lord Brahma looked at the winsome girl, and replied, "Then I must make them equal. You will not have to kill them, you will never kill gods, demons or human beings. I now create greed, envy, anger, and shame, jealousy and passion. From Your tears, I make war and disease. Do nothing, they will all come to You. You will not be the cause or the prevention of death, but You must greet all who come to You well in their hour. They will kill themselves, and only fools will weep over what none can avoid."

 

so, as far as the "reward" for their participation in WAR, I would say that it all depends on their consciousness. A lowlife redneck enjoying killing "sand-------" may have a horrible hell facing him, while an old lady suicide bomber, having lost everyone she knows to bombs, may be engaged in humble service in defense of her people.

 

To get angry is OK, but to act on that anger is not. Warfare fought according to religious principles is performed without anger, even though the passion of the very act may seem like actions of anger (like Bhima during Kuruksetra). When the war began, each side offered humble obiesancies, arjuna sending arrows to the feet of his teacher, Drona, and Yudhisthira asking permission from Bhisma, Drona, and Krpa to fight with them.

 

So, Im not angry at our soldiers, Israelis, Palestinians, al qaida, saddam. We are all victims of our culture. Only those who value the TRUE can see beyond the modes and be balanced, as Lord Brahma teaches here.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

[Guest guest]

Thomas Horn – Raiders News Network November 17, 2006

 

Israeli newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth reports that Israel is using nanotechnology to try to create a robot no bigger than a hornet that would be able to chase, photograph and kill its targets. The flying robot, nicknamed the "bionic hornet", would be able to navigate its way down narrow alleyways to target otherwise unreachable enemies.

 

According to the Bible an unprecedented war will occur in the future. It will be fought on land and sea, in the heavens above, and in the earth below, in the physical and spiritual worlds. It will include "Michael and his angels [fighting] against the dragon; and the dragon [fighting] and his angels" (Rev. 12:7).

 

Heretics will join the battle, calling upon "idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood" (Rev. 9:20) to convene their evil powers against the Christian God. They will unite with "unclean spirits....to gather them to the battle of that great day....[to] a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon ["Mount Megiddo"]" (Rev. 16:13-14;16).

 

The fowl of the air will "eat the flesh of the mighty" and hybrid locusts will sting the enemies of God until the omnipotent Christ utterly repels the forces of darkness and destroys the New World Army.

 

At least that's the way fundamentalist Christians believe it will happen.

 

When reading about the war mentioned above I find particular interest in Revelation 9:1-11 where it speaks of synthesized insectoids and arthropods emerging from the bottomless pit to join the End-time battle.

 

Down through time myriad preachers have terrified sinners with tales of demonic locusts bursting upward from out of the abyss and torturing unfortunate earthlings during a future time of great tribulation. Is that really what the prophet saw?

 

Some scholars believe 'John the Revelator' actually beheld future technologies, and that he simply referred to them in terms he understood; i.e. a military helicopter was perceived as a giant locust whose wings sounded like "many horses running to battle" (Rev. 9:9).

 

A report by Jim Wilson in Popular Mechanics presents evidence supporting this interpretation of the Book of Revelation. It may also shed light on a different, much older Biblical subject, 'the lord of the flies.'

 

"Ron Fearing has the future of warfare at the tip of his finger," writes Wilson. "It isn't pressing on the trigger of a laser death ray or button of a doomsday device. It's holding a stubby-winged mechanical bug."

 

"Flies are one of the most stable and maneuverable of all flying animals," he goes on to quote Fearing as saying. "They are the jet fighters of the animal world."

 

Evidently the Pentagon agrees and is working with engineers and biologists to create a lethal arsenal of micro-mechanical fighting bugs that combine insect aerodynamics with GPS navigation and molecular electronics.

 

Micro air vehicles (MAVs) represent one of the most fantastic opportunities for military surveillance and weapons delivery. "When perfected," Wilson points out, "Fearing's stainless steel and Mylar robot flies will be able to flap their way into the most secret places on Earth--the bunkers where Saddam Hussein plans his genocidal campaigns, and where Chinese spymasters plot their raids on America's nuclear weapons laboratories."

 

Consider these scenarios from Popular Mechanics:

 

Alan H. Epstein, of Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), recently described....GPS-guided MAVs landing on structurally critical points along bridges deep in enemy territory. Each MAV would carry a small piece of shaped-charge plastique. Responding to a command transmitted from half a world away, the MAVs would explode in sequence, bringing down the bridge with only one-hundredth of the amount of explosives required by a pinpoint-accurate smart bomb.

 

Some military strategists envision swarms of robot flies fluttering onto battlefields. Scout flies, equipped with miniature cameras, would do the work of reconnaissance teams by eavesdropping on tactical communications and sending back real-time videos of enemy positions. Sniper flies would seek out field commanders, recognizing them by the iris patterns of their eyes....Then, they would become the 21st century incarnation of the tribesman's poison dart as they hurled themselves into the carotid arteries of their targets.

 

Meanwhile, titanium-tipped robot flies too small to register on radar screens would gather in the weeds at the end of enemy runways. Then, rising as a swarm, they would allow themselves to be sucked into jet engine air intakes. The MAVs' titanium bodies would fracture the whirling turbine blades and send a rain of red-hot fragments through thousands of pounds of jet fuel and ammunition.

 

While such stratagems obviously appeal to the highest levels of US military intelligence, theologians will be troubled by glaring similarities between MAV technology and fundamentalists predictions of an end-time spiral by mankind into a cataclysmic war where locust-sized weapons are "given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power" (Rev. 9:3).

 

When one considers the exponential achievements of modern science and humanity's newfound interest in playing god, the inevitability of soul-free soldier-clones keeping eye on a biometric chip-implanted humanity with the help of GPS controlled micro air vehicles... well, it just kind of takes the fun out of wondering where our once-idyllic world is headed.

 

On the other hand, fundamentalists Christians may have been right all along. Perhaps our pretentious sciences are forcing Armageddon!

 

The Bible - a book repeatedly proven to possess astounding mathematical codex's and incomprehensibly accurate predictions - states that Jesus Christ will return at a future time and will defeat a well-equipped Antichrist army made of soldiers that kill without conscience. Could these be clones?

 

The Bible also depicts flying locust-weapons. Are these micro air vehicles developed by the military?

 

We also note the 'MAVs' of Revelation 9 torment those who receive the Mark of the Beast. Are we looking at GPS enabled biometric chip implants?

 

Either way it's interesting to note that while the locust hoards of Revelation 9 are presided over by Abaddon and may have been created in human laboratories, the flying weapons of the Apocalypse do whatever Jesus commands, as every member of humanity ultimately will.

[gHari 0]

3,000 a month times 50 months equals 150,000

[krishnadasa 0]

Mahakji, what comes here is who is fighting for good and who is for bad.. Thats a typical situation of a war of dahrama, just like war in Kurukshetra.. There wasnt actauuly any selfish motive behind the war. It was faught for the cause of Good and to bring back the dharma on the planet./...

 

But here the war is completely different, cant even be compared. All for selfish needs. And about the consciousness, as Lord says its covered by the mode of ignorance here.. Else why do we think at all there is such a war...If a lady avenge for killings of her kinsmen by being a suicide bomber that apparently kills so many of her own people (innocent) what consciousness do you think she has got. And tell me what kind of heaven will she reach after this , for kiiling the innocents?

 

This is a pretty tight topic and difficult to discuss,,,, And i don think either parties of the war are fighting any war of dharma, so niether actually reach any of the heavens, irrespective of the consciousness;;;;

 

Hari hari bol

 

 

 

 

 

I sympathize with what you say, krsnadas, but Ill reprint this from another topic:

 

"Lord Brahma looked at the winsome girl, and replied, "Then I must make them equal. You will not have to kill them, you will never kill gods, demons or human beings. I now create greed, envy, anger, and shame, jealousy and passion. From Your tears, I make war and disease. Do nothing, they will all come to You. You will not be the cause or the prevention of death, but You must greet all who come to You well in their hour. They will kill themselves, and only fools will weep over what none can avoid."

 

so, as far as the "reward" for their participation in WAR, I would say that it all depends on their consciousness. A lowlife redneck enjoying killing "sand-------" may have a horrible hell facing him, while an old lady suicide bomber, having lost everyone she knows to bombs, may be engaged in humble service in defense of her people.

 

To get angry is OK, but to act on that anger is not. Warfare fought according to religious principles is performed without anger, even though the passion of the very act may seem like actions of anger (like Bhima during Kuruksetra). When the war began, each side offered humble obiesancies, arjuna sending arrows to the feet of his teacher, Drona, and Yudhisthira asking permission from Bhisma, Drona, and Krpa to fight with them.

 

So, Im not angry at our soldiers, Israelis, Palestinians, al qaida, saddam. We are all victims of our culture. Only those who value the TRUE can see beyond the modes and be balanced, as Lord Brahma teaches here.

 

Hare Krsna, ys, mahaksadasa