Guest guest Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Hello, I have a question for respected members on this forum. I have been reading Lad's fundamental principles and just read a section on Tarpaka Kapha. It described one of the functions of this sub dosha as the myelin sheath. >From a MS perspective, I am a bit confused. I always considered MS to be due to Prana Vayu and aggravated by Pitta (inflammation). However, when I think about it, the nerves still function correctly; they simply get confused because of bad myelin sheathing. For example, the electric flowing into a house flows normally, but bad insulation can cause the electric to flow outside it normal path, thus causing issues. So considering this, is MS really a disease associated with Vata and/or Pitta? If Tarpaka Kapha is behind the sheath, I would think it would be more of a Kapha imbalance? You thoughts on this matter as sincerely appreciated. Om Shanti, Charles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 hi charles, the specific pathological features including histological changes to neural tissues weren't exactly identified by ayurveda but the symptoms are clear enough if you look at MS, the primary features are progressive paralysis, fatigue, neuralgia etc, all of which relate to a disorder of vata thus primary treatment is given to vata however, the caveat is that the underlying cause is AMA, and as we know AMA is most similar in quality to kapha when AMA accumulates it essentially displaces kapha and disables the nourishing or 'embracing' (shlish) function of tarpak kapha around the nerves as we know, the presence of AMA vitiates pitta, which is activated as against AMA in the myelin, and ends up destroying the integrity of the nerves resulting in a vattika disorder so you can see that all three doshas are in one way or another responsible, and need to be addressed in any successful protocol the biggest misconception is to treat MS ONLY as a vata disorder, which may make the condition worse to see more please read message: http://health.ayurveda/message/5271 also, the referring links to websites listed in this message have been changed for the paleolithic diet see: http://www.toddcaldecott.com/health_pn.html also, check out ashton embry's site http://www.direct-ms.org/ best... todd caldecott > Hello, > > I have a question for respected members on this forum. > > I have been reading Lad's fundamental principles and just read a > section on Tarpaka Kapha. It described one of the functions of this > sub dosha as the myelin sheath. > > From a MS perspective, I am a bit confused. Caldecott todd (AT) toddcaldecott (DOT) com www.toddcaldecott.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Hello Thank you for the very clear explanations and supplemental links. I do have some follow up questions. In the e-book, it talks about not doing oil massage, if you have MS. And it also talks about not doing pancha karma. My constitution type is Pitta Kapha. For the last year or so, I have been doing daily self massage with a pitta blend from Banyan about 5 times a week. I really feel I benefit from this as it provides time to check in and see how my body feels. In addition, I get a massage every other week, in which he uses oils. Am I understanding it correctly, that I should not do this? Also, I just did a week long cleanse / fast (David Jubbs). Primarily whole life food shakes and herbal laxatives followed by a day of coffee enema and gall bladder purge. I was amazed as I got close to a cup of stones! Anyway, I was hoping to do a cleanse/fast on a spring / fall basis. At some point, I wanted to do full fledged pancha karma. Should I avoid this? My symptoms are very mild. I have been extremely fortunate up until this point. But now, I am a bit confused at this point! Om Shanti, Charles ayurveda, Todd Caldecott <todd wrote: > > hi charles, > > the specific pathological features including histological changes to > neural tissues weren't exactly identified by ayurveda but the > symptoms are clear enough > > if you look at MS, the primary features are progressive paralysis, > fatigue, neuralgia etc, all of which relate to a disorder of vata > thus primary treatment is given to vata Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 Dear Charles Sorry for jumping into the middle of communication between you and Todd. Most of your doubts can be attributed to e-advise method you are seeking. No vaidya can give you specific advise, unless you see him in person. Let us try to examine each point. Though the specific pathological features including histological changes to neural tissues weren't exactly identified by ayurveda, ayurveda permits and encourages treating according to dosha unbalance, whether a particular disease has been identified and named by others or not. When a a disese falls under basically predominantly Vata class, oil is the approach whether massage, oral administration or dhara. Panch Karma basti is especially useful according to this author. for instance, the flare up of MS for one patient got stopped in a day itself, when basti along with head massage was administered. Ofcourse this was a "quick-fix" and program was continued to obtain stability. Another problem with e-advise is that each individual is different. Though several may have MS like symptoms, both prakuti and vikuti differes a little from person to person. When Vaidya has an opportunity to examine the patient, he can devise the protocol for each individual. Thus though e-book recommends going for animal proteins/fats etc, this author found that his vegetarian patients benifitted by omega-3 oils of plant origin rather than fish oil. They shuddered at the mention of fish oil! While green gram was very beneficial, some other pulses were negative, except when taken in sprouted form. The cleanse for gallstones was useful for all MS patients! Most of these observations were patient specific, one size did not fit all! Despite e-book mentioning not to undertake Panch Karma or oil massage, you seem to have benifitted! Self experience is ultimate Guru, but initially seek a Guru in person rather than net. Secondly, fastings and cleanses give opportunity for body to undertake self- healing, and one should not treat diet recommendations as simple "medicines without side effects". abstaining from the negative influence of wrong food is also a medicine! This author would urge you to see nearby vaidya, though you may collect tons of e-info on MS, just for education purpose. ayurveda, charles_corbit <no_reply wrote: In the e-book, it talks about not > doing oil massage, if you have MS. And it also talks about not doing > pancha karma. > For the last year or so, I have > been doing daily self massage with a pitta blend from Banyan about 5 > times a week. I really feel I benefit from this as it provides time > to check in and see how my body feels. In addition, I get a massage > every other week, in which he uses oils. > > Also, I just did a week long cleanse / fast (David Jubbs). Primarily > whole life food shakes and herbal laxatives followed by a day of > coffee enema and gall bladder purge. I was amazed as I got close to > a cup of stones! Anyway, I was hoping to do a cleanse/fast on a > spring / fall basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2006 Report Share Posted October 12, 2006 > > Hello > > Thank you for the very clear explanations and supplemental links. I > do have some follow up questions. In the e-book, it talks about not > doing oil massage, if you have MS. And it also talks about not doing > pancha karma. > > My constitution type is Pitta Kapha. For the last year or so, I have > been doing daily self massage with a pitta blend from Banyan about 5 > times a week. I really feel I benefit from this as it provides time > to check in and see how my body feels. In addition, I get a massage > every other week, in which he uses oils. > > Am I understanding it correctly, that I should not do this? hi charles the late dr bajracharya was a well known ayurvedic physician who worked with hundreds upon hundreds of western patients, many of whom had MS his recommendations are based on his experience as well as his accomplished understanding of the ayurvedic theory behind them however, his recommendations are for the treatment of a disease, not a person, and so need to be understood in this context your best bet, as dr. bhate states, is to educate yourself as best as possible and then consult an experienced practitioner you don't state that your receive benefit from the oil massage other than to check in with your body so, you could probably also check in by doing a dry massage (garshana) also, its unlikely that you are administering a therapeutic dose of medicated oil, i.e. >500 mL, and so a little bit of oil is unlikely to have the negative impact that dr. bajracharya discussed in his text > > > Also, I just did a week long cleanse / fast (David Jubbs). Primarily > whole life food shakes and herbal laxatives followed by a day of > coffee enema and gall bladder purge. I was amazed as I got close to > a cup of stones! did you save these "stones"? in many cases they are saponified olive oil you can easily tell by gently heating them on a pan in the oven - the oil "stones" will quickly melt but the real stones will not there is some debate about the benefit of this treatment there is similar regimen is used in ayurveda called snehana, but there are cautions around using in in patients with actual stones as the treatment can push a stone in the common bile duct and lodge a stone in the pancreatic oultet, causing a reflux of pancreatic juices... > Anyway, I was hoping to do a cleanse/fast on a > spring / fall basis. > > At some point, I wanted to do full fledged pancha karma. Should I > avoid this? according to dr. bajracharya other vaidyas please write with your experience putting MS into remission with pancha karma, not just a temporary improvement in symptoms it seems to me that pancha karma is often recommended as a cure-all, but as with anything, it might not the best treatment in the case of MS, sri bajracharya recommends shamana therapy, to eliminate ama and pacify the doshas, not forcibly expel them, because the body may be too weak Caldecott todd (AT) toddcaldecott (DOT) com www.toddcaldecott.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 Hello Shirish, I understand what you are saying. I was seeing an Ayurvedic physician (BAMS) for over a year on a monthly basis. He recommended the daily abhyanga and pancha karma. I have not done formal pancha karma due to cost. I have also been practicing vegetarianism since May, but moving in that direction for over two years. So a meat based diet is not an option for me at this point. I am hoping the good karma of ahimsa will pay dividends in the next life! My questions are more educational and curiosity. I would not make significant changes to my approach as it is working quite well (at this point). I was just a bit surprised as I thought pancha karma was a "cure-all" from an ayurvedic perspective. Thank you for your sound advice. Om Shanti, Charles ayurveda, "Shirish Bhate" <shirishbhate wrote: > Sorry for jumping into the middle of communication between you and . Most of your doubts can be > attributed to e-advise method you are seeking. No vaidya can give you > specific advise, unless you see him in person. Let us try to examine > each point. <snip> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2006 Report Share Posted October 13, 2006 Hello ---------- >its unlikely that you are administering a therapeutic dose of >medicated oil, i.e. >500 mL, and so a little bit of oil is unlikely >to have the negative impact that dr. bajracharya discussed in his text ----------- You are absolutely correct. I only use a few tablespoons. I also believe it helps move lymph fluid as well. -------- >did you save these "stones"? in many cases they are saponified olive oil >you can easily tell by gently heating them on a pan in the oven - the >oil "stones" will quickly melt but the real stones will not >there is some debate about the benefit of this treatment >there is similar regimen is used in ayurveda called snehana, but >there are cautions around using in in patients with actual stones as >the treatment can push a stone in the common bile duct and lodge a >stone in the pancreatic oultet, causing a reflux of pancreatic juices... --------- That is very very interesting! I did not save them, but a few of the folks I did it with did. I am asking them to try this. In my case, there were about 20% dark shiny black and 70% dark shiny green, almost a deep jade color. The remaining 10% were more of a brownish. I would not be surprised if these 10% were oil conglomerates. The others actually looked like shiny stones. ----------- >it seems to me that pancha karma is often recommended as a cure-all, >but as with anything, it might not the best treatment >in the case of MS, sri bajracharya recommends shamana therapy, to >eliminate ama and pacify the doshas, not forcibly expel them, >because the body may be too weak ----------- Sound advice. I think one thing that gets a bit confusing when I talk about this topic, MS, is that I am very fortunate to have very mild symptoms. I was very fortunate to catch it early and aggressively treat thru many lifestyle / diet changes. I am still very strong and in fact, I went on a 7 day canoe camping trip a year ago and was carrying a 70 pound canoe over portage trails. One trail I did non stop and it was close to ¾ of a mile. Once again thank you. You always contribute very detailed and thorough messages and it is much appreciated. Om Shanti, Charles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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