Concocted Notions Of The Misguided

[Kripamoya 0]

I would like to share some very insightful information I found.

 

My understanding is that this is in response to some widescale preaching propaganda that is being made by a preacher who has become a thorn in the side of ISKCON.

 

http://www.mandala.com.au/gurudev/concocted_ideas_of_the_foolish.htm

 

 

 

Question: We have read in a book from another temple that union is higher than separation and we are having some problems understanding the explanations given there. In the past we have always read in books by Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja Prabhupada and Srila Guru Maharaj that vipralambha, separation, is the highest mood in Krsna consciousness. How are these statements compatible?

[Guest guest]

Sri Sri Guru Gaurangau Jayatah

 

Concocted ideas of the Foolish.

 

by His Divine Grace Shrila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Dev-Goswami Maharaj

 

Question: We have read in a book from another temple that union is higher than separation and we are having some problems understanding the explanations given there. In the past we have always read in books by Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja Prabhupada and Srila Guru Maharaj that vipralambha, separation, is the highest mood in Krsna consciousness. How are these statements compatible?

 

Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja: My feeling is that even after one thousand births more, such persons as wrote that statement (in that book from another temple) will never be able to understand what is vipralambha and what is contained there. Mahaprabhu stayed twelve years in Gambhira tasting the separation mood of Srimate Radharani to Krsna extremely, and that is the super-expression of Krsna-prema. Such super-expression came out through vipralambha, otherwise it is not possible to tase Krsna-prema. We can get some idea of how deep it is, that Mahaprabhu took the Form of Radharani's bhava and kanti, and that is not the mood of union, but of separation.

 

Everyone, including even a child goat, in this mundane world knows what union is, therefore it is not necessary to teach anyone to enjoy: they already know, so it is not necessary to clarify that for anyone. But all the attentive energy is to be used for what? What is not known is the transcendental mood of separation. Why was such mood tasted by Mahaprabhu again and again? Mahaprabhu's feeling always returned to the tasting of that vipralambha - the mood of separation from Krsna. The subject matter of Mahaprabhu's lila was to taste what deepest degree of feelings were felt by Srimate Radharani.

 

It is not possible to express by language the mood of separation that Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu tasted in Gambhira, but Srila Krsna Das Kaviraja tried to show something in Sri Chaitanya-caritamrta Madhya-lila, second chapter. Throughout the whole of Chaitanya-caritamrta the mood of separation is present. And why do we say that this is the supreme mood of the play of the Supreme Personality of Godhead? Just what degree of bhava is in Srimate Radharani that Krsna appeared as Mahaprabhu in order to take Her mood and taste that? Who is the enjoyer? What is enjoyment? And, who is being enjoyed through the mood of suffering?

 

Everyone knows enjoyment, especially conditioned souls involved with sexual enjoyment, and thinking it gives the highest happiness within this mundane world, but he who can say that the highest super-painful mood of separation can give the supreme feelings - the only one who can say that is Sriman Mahaprabhu.

 

One sloka expressed by Kaviraja Goswami about Madhavendra Puri's feeling of the mood of separation from Krsna is:

 

ayi dina dayardra-natha he mathuranatha kadavalokyase

hrdayam tvadaloka-kataram dayita bhramyati kim karomy aham

ei sloka hahiyachen radhara thakurani

 

This sloka was extremely expressed by Srimate Radharani, and through Her super-mercy Sripad Madhavendra Puri also tasted it at the last moment of his life. After that, only Sriman Mahaprabhu, and no one else, is qualified to taste it fully - this is the opinion of Srila Kaviraja Goswami.

 

You try to consider the following. What is it that Krsna cannot taste Himself? What is it taht Krsna wanted to taste, that He appeared in the Form of Mahaprabhu? Why did Krsna take the mood and colour of Radharani and what was His tasting matter (object)? What did Krsna taste in the Form of Mahaprabhu during His Pastimes here? What mood did Mahaprabhu show in Puri-Dham, especially in His Gambhira-lila, and why did He faint to see Krsna in Kurukshetra in the Form of Jagannatha. Why did Chandidasa write one poem:

 

lakha lakha yuga hiye rakhanu

tabu hiya judana ha gela

 

(Meaning: Why did Radharani say She couldn't be satisfied by embracing Krsna for millions of millions of years?) What mood is expressed here?

 

What mood of tasting is given by Sri Kaviraja Goswami in expressing Mahaprabhu's Antya-lila in Sri Chaitanya-caritamrta second part, second chapter?

 

That which Radharani tasted in separation of Krsna when he did not return but sent Uddhava to see Vridavan, Mahaprabhu tasted that Vramara-gita in an intoxicated way continuosly for twelve years like a mad man. If such souls are foolish then all the residents of Vrndavan, including the Gopis, are foolish. Why didn't they get straight into a chariot, like a taxi, ang go just half an hour to Mathura instead of foolishly living in Vrndavan?

 

But if that author (of the book you mention) with his conception wants to taste the mood of union he will immediately become pregnant, then what will be for him?

 

What was it that Rupa Goswami expressed in a praising way about the mood of Krsna-prema in separation when he said - pidabhir nava-kala-kuta, etc (CC Madhya 2.52) - the power even of a young cobra's poison is defeated by Krsna-prema of separation?

 

Actually I am not eager to give answer to this, but I am only remembering the mood of Srila Guru Maharaj and Srila (A.C. Bhaktivedanta) Swami Maharaj. I am extremely hating to give any answer to this question of childish mood praising union. That is, everybody knows the position of union.

 

I know what is hell, and I have some experience about heaven, but I do not know what is the destination of one who wants to criticize the dearmost associates of Radharani as well as Mahaprabhu Sri Chaitanyadeva. He has not even the smallest idea about Krsna consciousness, especially about the twelve years of Mahaprabhu's living in Gambhira, and the mood of Radharani tasted by Mahaprabhu, the non-different Form of Krsna. Can you say what kind of destination awaits such a person? If the residents of hell see such a person they must be fearful of him and need to make a new hell for him.

 

We have taken refuge at the lotus feet of Srila Guru Maharaj and therefore Krsna has been gracious to give us protection from the concocted ideas of the foolish.

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

-

 

Okay I read about this in a book called, Our Gurus One in Siddhanta by Bhaktivedanta Narayan Maharaja (pdf book is on the homepage) www.purebhakti.com. I copy/pasted from the book in a word doc.

 

See This attached file

OUR GURUS.doc

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

To me it's commen sense how meeting somebody is better, then being away from them. i.e if your in love with a girl, you may think about her all day, but when you meet her, well. I am not sure about the first quote, I don't really read anything by Maharaja as yet (never had the time) because I read by Sridhara Maharaja, though I respect Maharaja, because he served Sridhara Maharaja with all his heart and soul.

[Kripamoya 0]

 

To me it's commen sense how meeting somebody is better, then being away from them.

 

When coming to deal with the infinite, you have to leave common sense behind in the plane of common illusion.

 

the subject deals with the inconceivable.

common sense is useless there.

[Guest guest]

 

-

 

Okay I read about this in a book called, Our Gurus One in Siddhanta by Bhaktivedanta Narayan Maharaja (pdf book is on the homepage) . I copy/pasted from the book in a word doc.

 

 

Are they really one in siddhanta? This is what some people will tell you but when some devotees asked rila Sridhara Maharaja directly then this is what he had to say about Narayana Maharaja and Kesava Maharaja:

 

"Only what I know I can say to them, this is my position. No physical risk of any war or any fight. I am the last man to accept. I never did it in my life and now also it is so. Always standing in my own fight, alone. I may be alone, but not fighting with the environment, circumstances. I had to fight with Kesava Maharaja some principle of Rathayatra and when they abused me I left my propaganda for the same. The paper was abolished. But I still hold my position, principle there. That they are doing wrong. They have placed not only Jagai Madai, but even Vasudeva and Devananda figures as gatekeepers, I opposed. And so many acarya's figure, that should be worshiped and not a matter of play, as I understood from the teachings of Prabhupada. So I opposed and I still oppose. And the Ratha-yatra, that it is not a matter of play to show to the public."

"In any day you may put on the chariot for the play of the Deity or for Their satisfaction. But in the Ratha-yatra day when Mahaprabhu is taking from Kuruksetra to Vrndavana, with this attitude, that day, that idea should be overlapped. And by our whim we shall do anything and everything, especially in Navadwip dham. This is also Gupta Vrndavana. And Gaurasundara has got his nitya-lila. And against that current I shall create another current opposite to that, in collision. That is not desirable. Who will like it, they may follow. What I am, I am. That is my position. And if anyone comes to me then I shall try to say what I know."

(Feb. 4, 1982):

 

and:

 

"I avoided Madhava Maharaja, Kesava Maharaja and so many others. I came to live alone. That does not mean that I shall, you will guide me, you both will guide me. I can't accept this."

(tape recording of a discussion, July 25th, 1983:)

[Guest guest]

Srila Sridhar Maharaja:

 

I still hold my position, principle there. That they are doing wrong

 

Seems pretty conclusive to me.

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

I think Muladari prabhu posted something about this, something to do with a paper. ? I forget the details, anyway Sridhara M, is senior to both Narayana M, and Madhava M, so that is between them, (they are Godbrothers). Even in Krishna-lila, Krishna fights with His cowherd boys. To me the above is a transcendental fight, and I don't think we should delve into it.

[Sheki 0]

 

To me it's commen sense how meeting somebody is better, then being away from them. i.e if your in love with a girl, you may think about her all day, but when you meet her, well.

 

but then again are feelings of love and attachment notoften stronger when we are separated and longing for the object of love than when we have it near? Platonic love is often the more intense. When you get closer.. and even married it often diminishes (or transforms in a less intensive form)

[Guest guest]

 

When coming to deal with the infinite, you have to leave common sense behind in the plane of common illusion.

 

the subject deals with the inconceivable.

common sense is useless there.

 

The following poem, Sharagrahi Vaishnava, was composed in 1874

by Bhaktivinoda Thakur.

 

 

The Jiva Soul:

 

Was man intended to be

A brute in work and heart?

Should man, the Lord of all around,

From common sense depart?

 

Man's glory is in common sense

Dictating us the grace,

That man is made to live and love

The beauteous Heaven's embrace.

[Guest guest]

Who Is That Sri Radha?

 

--

Berlin, Germany: July 6, 2003

Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja

 

 

--

 

We will continue to explain about Ratha-yatra, but before that I want to tell you something important – and you should listen carefully. There is a guarantee given by Krsna, and sastra also confirms this when it says, “Vrndavanam parityajya padam ekam na gacchati – Krsna is always in Vrndavana” (Brahmana-samhita, 5.37). He never goes one step beyond Vrndavana. Does His power, hladini sakti Srimati Radhika, go? Even if Krsna would go outside Vrndavana, She doesn’t go. She will always be there; neither She nor Krsna will go even one inch out of Vrndavana. Vrndavana and Mathura are very near to each other, and they share the same border. There is only a fine line between them, yet Svayam Bhagavan Sri Krsna cannot go, and Srimati Radhika also cannot go, to Mathura.

Still, we see that there is a viyoga, a separation mood. Sri Krsna weeps bitterly in Dvaraka and Srimati Radhika, in Her separation mood, rolls on the earth and weeps bitterly in Nandagaon. Since They are always in Vrndavana, how does this separation mood come? There should not be any separation mood, yet we see that Srimati Radhika and Her sakhis feel such intense separation in Nandagaon that they roll down on the earth, weep bitterly, and do not take any meals. The sakhis must even test, by placing a cotton swab under Her nose, to see whether or not Srimati Radhika is alive. Within their minds and hearts, the sakhis suffer in unbearable separation.

 

For whom are they weeping? When Sri Krsna Bhagavan went to Kuruksetra for the meeting which was later celebrated by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu during the Ratha-yatra festival, all of the Vrajavasis also went there. Srimati Radhika, along with all of Her sakhis, went there and met with Him. Radhika told Him there, "You are the same Krsna and I am the same Radha, and this is the same spring season and We are meeting here, but now I am not happy. I want to be with You in a nikunja (secluded grove) on the shore of the Yamuna, where the peacocks dance and cuckoos sing. I want to meet You in that beautiful sweet Vrndavana, where there are very fragrant kadamba trees and the breeze of Yamuna. There are no controllers there – no father, mother, or anyone else like them in that kunja; only My sakhis are there, in parakiya mood.” Who is lamenting there, in Kuruksetra?

 

Another question may arise. Rohini-nandana Rama (Balarama) is always with Yasoda-nandana Krsna. He also cannot go an inch from Vrndavana. So who is that Sri Baladeva who went to Mathura with Lord Krsna? Who is that Sri Krsna and Baladeva? After spending some time in Mathura, Baladeva went with Krsna to Dvaraka-puri; so who is that Sri Baladeva and Sri Krsna who went to Dvaraka? Rohini-nandana Rama will not go an inch out of Vrndavana. He is always with Yasoda-nandana, Radha-kanta Krsna. So who is there in Dvaraka making Bhagavan Krsna weep (as described in both Srimad Bhagavatam and Brhat Bhagavatamrta). Lord Krsna wept so much that He fainted. Who is that Lord Baladeva? There are so many questions in this regard.

 

I think that most devotees will not be able to understand this subject, even if I continually speak about it. Only a high class of devotee can realize something – and yet I am explaining it. I don’t know why I am telling you this. This is my “bad habit”. I want to forget management and other external activities. I want to immerse myself and weep bitterly like the gopis do for Krsna. I want to serve Srimati Radhika and be very happy to control Krsna. I want that She will order me, "Be at the door of the kunja and don't let Krsna come in." These pastimes are in my heart.

 

Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura and Srila Rupa Gosvami have given an indication, an outline, explaining who they are, in reply to these questions. If They would go out of Vrndavana, then sastra’s (the scriptures’) guarantee cannot be kept and all sastra will be false. Also, regarding Mathura, sastra states: “yatra nityah sannihito harih – Hari is always in Mathura.” If He never goes out of Mathura, who was in Vrndavana and who came from Vrndavana to Mathura? The same thing has also been told for Lord Dvarakadhisa Krsna: He never goes out of Dvaraka; He always resides there. All these truths are very mysterious.

 

You should know that Yogamaya Paurnamasi is very “tricky”; she can perform magic. She is an expert magician, but who is she? She is simply the wish of Krsna. Krsna’s wish becomes Srimati Paurnamasi devi. Controlled by Himself, Krsna is dancing. He is dancing, Radha is dancing, and all the Vrajavasis are dancing – under the control or indication of Yogamaya – as puppets dance according to the puppeteer. An ordinary person in the audience cannot see how the puppet is dancing. Similarly, Sri Krsna, Srimati Radhika and all the Vrajavasis, and also Dvarakadhisa and Mathuresa and all their associates are dancing – by the indication of Yogamaya Paurnamasi.

 

Now we will return to the point. Sri Krsna and Srimati Radhika never go out of Vrndavana, so why are They feeling separation? Who did Uddhava see with his own eyes in Nandagaon? She is Viyogini Sri Radha. Who met with Lord Krsna in Kuruksetra and was weeping and wanted to bring Him from Kuruksetra to Vraja? She is Samyogini Radhika. She and Sri Krsna were meeting after a long time, and She is therefore called Samyogini. When She manifests as Viyogini, She is in Nandagaon and feeling separation from Krsna when He is not in Vrndavana.

 

When Srimati Radhika has expanded as Viyogini and Samyogini, She is in Vraja, and Krsna is in Vraja, but in a hidden way. There in Nandagaon, Viyogini Radhika always laments. All gopis lament there, but She especially So who will be meeting with Sri Krsna in Vraja? Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself. The Radhika who feels great separation for Krsna is Viyogini Radhika. The Radhika who meets with Him in Kuruksetra after a long time, but was not satisfied and thus wanted to bring Him to Vrndavana – and who brought Him on the chariot of Her heart – is called Samyogini Radhika. In the same way, Krsna, that is, Nanda-nandana Yasoda-nandana Radha-kanta, is always in Vrndavana.

 

Who goes to Mathura? Vasudeva-nandana goes to Mathura. In Mathura and Dvaraka, Krsna is Viyogi Krsna, and the Krsna who went to Kuruksetra is Samyogi Krsna. Viyogi – Viyogini, Samyogi – Samyogini.

 

And what about Sri Baladeva Prabhu? He is the son of Rohini-nandana, He never goes out of Vrndavana, and he is always with Krsna. Who is the Baladeva Prabhu that goes to Mathura and Dvaraka? He is Devaki-nandana, not Rohini-nandana. One can say that he was first in the womb of Devaki and went to Rohini Maiya as Sankarsana. The Baladeva Prabhu who was in Mathura is Devaki-nandana, and the Baladeva Prabhu who was in Vrndavana is Rohini-nandana. Baladeva Prabhu is the amsi, the complete personality from who others expand. He and his other two manifestations are different by nature. When He is in Vrndavana he is Rohini-nandana Himself, the origin of all. So who is in Mathura and Dvaraka? He is Devaki-nandana, and he is also known as mula-Sankarsana. When he goes to Dvaraka He becomes Mula Sankarsana, and in Vaikuntha he becomes Maha-Sankarsana., and when He manifests on the Causal Ocean, he becomes Maha Visnu or Karanadakasayi-Visnu from whom the tatastha jivas emanate After that he becomes Garbodakasayi-visnu and at last he becomes Khirodakasayi-visnu. And each incarnation has so many functions. You should know all these truths and then you will be able to understand this class; but I think that when you leave class you will forget what I am telling you. Try to know these teachings; otherwise you will mix all the information in a hodgepodge.

 

In the same way, Sri Gaurasundara, Sacinandana Gaurahari, is Sacinandana in Gaura-mandala, Sri Navadvipa-dhama When He goes to Puri, then, in the mood of Viyogini Radhika, He is always lamenting and weeping. Then, when He goes to Godavari and Sundaracala – the place of Gundica mandira –He becomes like Samyogini Radhika. At that time, during the Ratha-yatra festival, in the mood of Srimati Radhika, He is weeping and dancing and singing when He again meets that prananatha, Lord Jagannatha. You should note down these truths in your heart and then do bhajana.

 

gaura yadi pache cale, syama haya sthire

gaura age cale, syama cale dhire-dhire

 

[When Caitanya Mahaprabhu was dramatically enacting the song, He would sometimes fall behind in the procession. At such times, Lord Jagannatha would come to a standstill. When Caitanya Mahaprabhu again went forward, Lord Jagannatha's car would slowly start again. (Madhya 13.119)]

 

When Sri Caitanaya Mahaprabhu was dancing in front of the chariot, Lord Jagannatha would slowly move forward. He would watch the dance very happily with a side long glance. On the other hand, when Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu danced behind, Jagannatha would stop, and think, "Why should I go? For whom should I go?"

 

Ratha-yatra continued, and here, Sri Krsna as Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was in the mood of Samyogini Radhika feeling separation though meeting. He was singing continually and very happy as he was bringing Jagannatha deva to Gundica. He became tired from dancing for a long time, but still He continued. Sri Svarupa Damodara and Sri Raya Ramananda saw that He was tired, and thought, “We should give Him a rest.” They stopped the chariot and desired that He take rest in the garden of Jagannatha.

 

Sri Svarupa Damodara told the head pujari and others that anyone in the crowd can offer their bhoga from anywhere they desired. The thousands upon thousands of devotees assembled then began to give their offerings to Lord Jagannatha, and He began to accept everything by His eyes. In this way, by trick, Sri Svarupa Damodara, Sri Raya Ramananda, and Sri Nityananda Prabhu took Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu to that garden. Sriman Mahaprabhu was very tired and laid down at the base of a tree, keeping His head on the tree’s root. As He lay there He remembered the pastimes of Vrndavana and wept.

 

In the meantime, Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya, Svarupa Damodara, and especially Raya Ramananda told King Prataparudra, “This is the time. Leave your royal dress and be like a simple devotee wearing a simple dhoti. Go to Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and recite the verses of the Bhagavatam from Gopi-gita. He will then be merciful to you. He will embrace you and fulfill all your desires.” King Prataparudra offered his obeisances to Sri Nityananda Prabhu, Sri Advaita Acarya, the other devotees. Then he slowly went to Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, sat near His lotus feet, and began to recite Gopi-gita. He began from the first sloka and gradually came to this sloka:

 

tava kathamrtam tapta-jivanam

kavibhir iditam kalmasapaham

sravana-mangalam srimad atatam

bhuvi grnanti ye bhuri-da janah

 

[The nectar of Your words and the descriptions of Your activities are the life and soul of those suffering in this material world. These narrations, transmitted by learned sages, eradicate one's sinful reactions and bestow good fortune upon whoever hears them. These narrations are broadcast all over the world and are filled with spiritual power. Certainly those who spread the message of Godhead are most munificent. (SB 10.31.9)]

 

He sang this in a very sweet tone. You are now hearing my tune, but you cannot compare mine with his. His tune was millions of times superior and His eyes were full of tears. As he sang he massaged Mahaprabhu’s feet, and when the Lord heard this verse especially, He regained consciousness and exclaimed, "Who are you? Who are you? Without My asking you are giving Me so much high class of nectar. I cannot repay you; I am a street beggar. Be merciful and continue."

 

In this verse beginning “tava katamrtam tapta jivanam,” the gopis are telling Krsna, “We are about to die without You.” Krsna appeared to them, as a spurti, and told them, "You should die at once Don’t delay." Then the gopis said, "How can we die? You are the reason we are not dying."

 

“Tava katamrtam – discussions of Your sweet pastimes is greater then nectar, and even greater then heavenly nectar and moksamrta, the nectar of liberation. If we die, who will hear that harikatha of Your nama, form and pastimes? Tapta jivanam – those who are greatly suffering will get life by hearing these discussions. They will at once be relieved. This harikatha is so much cooler then a cool breeze.

 

“The word kavibhir is used because Lord Brahma, Lord Sankara, Sri Sukadeva Gosvami, Sri Narada Gosvami, and Srila Vyasadeva have all told the glories of Your harikatha. They have said that one who hears it cannot die, and that is why we have not died. “Kalmasapaham:” If anyone will hear your katha, all kinds of karma, anarthas, sins and suffering will go away at once. This statement is not a poet’s imagination; it is true to the fullest extent.

 

“Sravanam mangalanam. When one begins to hear your pastimes, from that very moment all kinds of qualifications and all kinds of auspiciousness will come to that person. The whole world will know of him; his glories will be everywhere. Bhuri da jana. Those who discuss and explain your sweet pastimes are the greatest donors in the entire world.”

 

Harikatha is the largest donation; the greatest charity. You should realize this. You can never repay me and my associates – never.

 

Who is telling this? Candravali or her sakhis. They are praying to Krsna, "Please come at once. You have disappeared from us, so please come at once.” They pray in this way, but another group of gopis, Srimati Radhika and her sakhis, are very angry by this cruel action of Krsna. Srimati Radhika wants to forget Krsna, but She cannot. Krsna told Her in the form of a sphurti, "Why are You not dying in My separation? She replied with anger “Tava katamrtam. Why are we not dying? You are responsible for that. You are most cruel, and the pastimes we are discussing are more then cruel.

 

“We were very happy in our family life, serving our husbands, children, fathers and mothers, but when we heard Your pastimes our lives were at once changed. From that time onward we began to die. Your pastimes are therefore like mrtya, very strong poison; more poisonous than snakes.

 

“We realize this. Tapta jivanam. Your katha gives our lives so much suffering – because You are not here. It is therefore more poisonous then a snake’s venomous poison. Your glories are only the imagination of poets.”

 

A poet may write a poem saying, "Jagannatha-deva's chariot was touching the sky." The chariot was not touching the sky, but this has been written in exaggeration. Even in Srimad Bhagavatam a poet wrote: "The horses of Arjuna where running in the sky." What is this? Can it be? Similarly, the gopis in Srimati Radhika’s group are telling Lord Krsna, “Poets have glorified Your harikatha, but actually it is very painful. Its glories are only the imagination of poets like Srila Vyasadeva and Srila Sukadeva Gosvami. Kalmasapaham: some suffering goes away, but it is replaced by more and more suffering. No one should hear the sweet pastimes of Krsna, or that person will always suffer. If you want to be happy with your family, don't chant Krsna’s name. Try to forget that black cheater; don't hear harikatha. Sravana-mangalam. This is quite false. By hearing, inauspicity will come. We have realization of this. At first we were happy, but when we heard His katha our life became upset and full of suffering. We have realization of this.

 

Srimad atatam. According to Srimati Radhika and Her group, this point is more dangerous. If any devotee, with a shaven head, wearing tilaka, kanti-mala and harinama-mala, holding a book under his arm, announces, "Come on. Come here. Without any price, free of cost, I will tell this harikatha,” he is the greatest and most dangerous cheater. He will spoil your life forever. Don't hear from him; remember this always. If you see a devotee wearing tilaka, kanti mala, and carrying a book, and especially in saffron cloth, you should offer dandavat pranama from afar – and run away.

 

This gopi, Srimati Radhika, is saying, “Be careful to avoid this dangerous person. Be far away. Don't chant; from today, stop.” There may be so many more meanings of this verse – depending on the nature of the different groups of gopis uttering it.

 

Srila Sukadeva Gosvami is explaining that if Sri Krsna Bhagavan is always with gopis, dancing, singing and playing with them, then His katha is amrta; otherwise it is mrtya.

 

Gaura Premanande!

 

So now the gopis are in Kuruksetra and Srimati Radhika is telling Krsna, “You are a great cheater.”

 

ahus ca te nalina-nabha padaravindam

yogesvarair hrdi vicintyam agadha-bodhaih samsara-kupa-patitottaranavalambam

geham jusam api manasy udiyat sada nah

 

[The gopis spoke thus: Dear Lord, whose navel is just like a lotus flower, Your lotus feet are the only shelter for those who have fallen into the deep well of material existence. Your feet are worshiped and meditated upon by great mystic yogis and highly learned philosophers. We wish that these lotus feet may also be awakened within our hearts, although we are only ordinary persons engaged in household affairs. (SB 10.82.48)]

 

What Sri Krsna is saying and Sri Radha is saying, and what He then replies to Her, has been explained in a beautiful way in Sri Caitanya-caritamrta.

 

On the fifth day, Hera Pancami, Bimala devi, Laksmi, came in search of Krsna in Sundaracala, (Gundica Temple) and bound and punished all of the associates of Jagannatha. They had to promise that, “Very soon, tomorrow, we will bring your husband.” This is Hera Pancami. So much sweet harikatha is there. Five days after the Hera Pancami festival, Krsna returned to His own Jagannatha temple, and the same krsna-katha, hari-kirtana and Mahaprabhu’s dancing continued. If Jagannatha was going to Jagannatha Puri, that is, Dvaraka or Kuruksetra, why did Mahaprabhu do so? Don’t think that He was returning. Even on that day, Caitanya Mahaprabhu thought, “I am taking My most beloved to Vrndavana.” In Sri Caitanya-caritamrta it has been written, “In the same way …”. After completing the Chariot festival Sriman Mahaprabhu was invited by many devotees to their homes, to honor great varieties of very sweet preparations of prasadam.

 

We have thus explained the essence of the Jagannatha festival, so try to remember all of these topics and to do bhajana. Don't be weak.

 

I want to give so many thanks and blessing to those persons who invited us to be here in Berlin. Especially, my blessing to the boy, Radha-madhava brahmacari. Day and night he did so much hard labor. And Radha-vinoda, you will have to make the same chariot for our Vrndavana temple. It should have a very beautiful shape.

[Kripamoya 0]

Puru,

 

those long copy paste refutations get very laborious for those who aren't fans of Narayana Maharaja.

 

Can't you just extrapolate a few select sentences to make your point?

 

The average attention span for forum posts is about 10 seconds tops.

 

Please make your points without all these volumes of essays by Narayana Maharaja.

 

Reduce it down and put spaces between thoughts.

that way people might bother to read your posts.

[Guest guest]

I have carefully examined the article of Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja above, which was posted on this thread by an anonymous Guest. It is a complex article, but if one carefully examines it, taking one's time, the meaning is quite clear.

 

The conclusion Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja arrives at is this:

 

 

In this verse beginning “tava katamrtam tapta jivanam,” the gopis are telling Krsna, “We are about to die without You.” Krsna appeared to them, as a spurti, and told them, "You should die at once Don’t delay." Then the gopis said, "How can we die? You are the reason we are not dying."

 

“Tava katamrtam – discussions of Your sweet pastimes is greater then nectar, and even greater then heavenly nectar and moksamrta, the nectar of liberation. If we die, who will hear that harikatha of Your nama, form and pastimes? Tapta jivanam – those who are greatly suffering will get life by hearing these discussions. They will at once be relieved. This harikatha is so much cooler then a cool breeze.

 

“The word kavibhir is used because Lord Brahma, Lord Sankara, Sri Sukadeva Gosvami, Sri Narada Gosvami, and Srila Vyasadeva have all told the glories of Your harikatha. They have said that one who hears it cannot die, and that is why we have not died. “Kalmasapaham:” If anyone will hear your katha, all kinds of karma, anarthas, sins and suffering will go away at once. This statement is not a poet’s imagination; it is true to the fullest extent.

 

“Sravanam mangalanam. When one begins to hear your pastimes, from that very moment all kinds of qualifications and all kinds of auspiciousness will come to that person. The whole world will know of him; his glories will be everywhere. Bhuri da jana. Those who discuss and explain your sweet pastimes are the greatest donors in the entire world.”

 

Harikatha is the largest donation; the greatest charity. You should realize this. You can never repay me and my associates – never.

 

Who is telling this? Candravali or her sakhis. They are praying to Krsna, "Please come at once. You have disappeared from us, so please come at once.” They pray in this way, but another group of gopis, Srimati Radhika and her sakhis, are very angry by this cruel action of Krsna. Srimati Radhika wants to forget Krsna, but She cannot. Krsna told Her in the form of a sphurti, "Why are You not dying in My separation? She replied with anger “Tava katamrtam. Why are we not dying? You are responsible for that. You are most cruel, and the pastimes we are discussing are more then cruel.

 

 

So, according to Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja, it is Candravali and her sakhis who are enjoying the bliss of separation and Harikatha, but Sri Radha and Her party want something else: union.

 

He continues:

 

 

“We were very happy in our family life, serving our husbands, children, fathers and mothers, but when we heard Your pastimes our lives were at once changed. From that time onward we began to die. Your pastimes are therefore like mrtya, very strong poison; more poisonous than snakes.

 

“We realize this. Tapta jivanam. Your katha gives our lives so much suffering – because You are not here. It is therefore more poisonous then a snake’s venomous poison. Your glories are only the imagination of poets.”

 

A poet may write a poem saying, "Jagannatha-deva's chariot was touching the sky." The chariot was not touching the sky, but this has been written in exaggeration. Even in Srimad Bhagavatam a poet wrote: "The horses of Arjuna where running in the sky." What is this? Can it be? Similarly, the gopis in Srimati Radhika’s group are telling Lord Krsna, “Poets have glorified Your harikatha, but actually it is very painful. Its glories are only the imagination of poets like Srila Vyasadeva and Srila Sukadeva Gosvami. Kalmasapaham: some suffering goes away, but it is replaced by more and more suffering. No one should hear the sweet pastimes of Krsna, or that person will always suffer. If you want to be happy with your family, don't chant Krsna’s name. Try to forget that black cheater; don't hear harikatha. Sravana-mangalam. This is quite false. By hearing, inauspicity will come. We have realization of this. At first we were happy, but when we heard His katha our life became upset and full of suffering. We have realization of this.

 

 

Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja says, Harikatha brings pain and not "the highest bliss". According to him Sri Radha and Her party want only union and the bliss of separation is of a lower order.

 

If there is no feeling of utter bliss for Sri Radha in Her mood of separation, then why didn't She just get in a taxi and go to Mathura as Srila Govinda Maharaja suggested?

 

That which Radharani tasted in separation of Krsna when he did not return but sent Uddhava to see Vridavan, Mahaprabhu tasted that Vramara-gita in an intoxicated way continuosly for twelve years like a mad man. If such souls are foolish then all the residents of Vrndavan, including the Gopis, are foolish. Why didn't they get straight into a chariot, like a taxi, ang go just half an hour to Mathura instead of foolishly living in Vrndavan?

 

 

If the bliss of separation didn't bring joy of an unprecedented kind - the highest ecstasy - then how is it possible that Sri Radha was able to remain in Vraja?

 

Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja continues:

 

 

Srimad atatam. According to Srimati Radhika and Her group, this point is more dangerous. If any devotee, with a shaven head, wearing tilaka, kanti-mala and harinama-mala, holding a book under his arm, announces, "Come on. Come here. Without any price, free of cost, I will tell this harikatha,” he is the greatest and most dangerous cheater. He will spoil your life forever. Don't hear from him; remember this always. If you see a devotee wearing tilaka, kanti mala, and carrying a book, and especially in saffron cloth, you should offer dandavat pranama from afar – and run away.

 

This gopi, Srimati Radhika, is saying, “Be careful to avoid this dangerous person. Be far away. Don't chant; from today, stop.” There may be so many more meanings of this verse – depending on the nature of the different groups of gopis uttering it.

 

Srila Sukadeva Gosvami is explaining that if Sri Krsna Bhagavan is always with gopis, dancing, singing and playing with them, then His katha is amrta; otherwise it is mrtya.

 

Gaura Premanande!

 

 

Here is his conclusion. Harikatha that tells of the pastimes of Bhagavan in union with the gopis is amrta.

 

Harikatha about the pastimes of separation is "mrtya" (death).

 

That is exactly what his conclusion is:

 

 

Srila Sukadeva Gosvami is explaining that if Sri Krsna Bhagavan is always with gopis, dancing, singing and playing with them, then His katha is amrta; otherwise it is mrtya.

 

 

Earlier, he made the point that the Form of Sri Radhika Who felt separation from Krsna is not fully Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself.

 

 

Now we will return to the point. Sri Krsna and Srimati Radhika never go out of Vrndavana, so why are They feeling separation? Who did Uddhava see with his own eyes in Nandagaon? She is Viyogini Sri Radha. Who met with Lord Krsna in Kuruksetra and was weeping and wanted to bring Him from Kuruksetra to Vraja? She is Samyogini Radhika. She and Sri Krsna were meeting after a long time, and She is therefore called Samyogini. When She manifests as Viyogini, She is in Nandagaon and feeling separation from Krsna when He is not in Vrndavana.

 

When Srimati Radhika has expanded as Viyogini and Samyogini, She is in Vraja, and Krsna is in Vraja, but in a hidden way. There in Nandagaon, Viyogini Radhika always laments. All gopis lament there, but She especially So who will be meeting with Sri Krsna in Vraja? Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself. The Radhika who feels great separation for Krsna is Viyogini Radhika. The Radhika who meets with Him in Kuruksetra after a long time, but was not satisfied and thus wanted to bring Him to Vrndavana – and who brought Him on the chariot of Her heart – is called Samyogini Radhika. In the same way, Krsna, that is, Nanda-nandana Yasoda-nandana Radha-kanta, is always in Vrndavana.

 

Who goes to Mathura? Vasudeva-nandana goes to Mathura. In Mathura and Dvaraka, Krsna is Viyogi Krsna, and the Krsna who went to Kuruksetra is Samyogi Krsna. Viyogi – Viyogini, Samyogi – Samyogini.

 

 

So it is clear from this that in his opinion the Form of Sri Radhika Who felt separation from Krsna is not fully Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself, but only a lesser, partial manifestation.

 

Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja has this to say of the inner circle of Sri Radha's followers:

 

 

I think that most devotees will not be able to understand this subject, even if I continually speak about it. Only a high class of devotee can realize something – and yet I am explaining it. I don’t know why I am telling you this. This is my “bad habit”. I want to forget management and other external activities. I want to immerse myself and weep bitterly like the gopis do for Krsna. I want to serve Srimati Radhika and be very happy to control Krsna. I want that She will order me, "Be at the door of the kunja and don't let Krsna come in." These pastimes are in my heart.

 

Let us not miss the significance of the role he wants to play in Radha-Krsna lila.

 

He says this:

 

I want to immerse myself and weep bitterly like the gopis do for Krsna. I want to serve Srimati Radhika and be very happy to control Krsna. I want that She will order me, "Be at the door of the kunja and don't let Krsna come in." These pastimes are in my heart.

 

Read his words again:

I want to serve Srimati Radhika and be very happy to control Krsna.

 

 

There is more to say, in commenting on this talk of Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja.

 

Let us consider the things Srila Sanatana Goswami said on this topic.

 

tathapi sambhoga-sukhad api stutah

so ko py' anirvacya-tamo mano-ramah

promoda-rasih parinamato dhruvam

tatra sphuret tad-rasikaika-vedyah

 

The anguish of separation (viraha bhava) is praised as greater than the happiness of sambhoga (meeting, union). Separation is so pleasing to the mind (mano-ramah) that it cannot be described (anirvacya-tamah). It always transforms into an abundance of ecstatic joy (promoda-rasih). Only actual rasiks know that separation is higher than union (rasika vedyah).

(Brhad Bhagavatamrta 1.7.126)

 

 

In his Dig-darsini-tika commentary to this verse Srila Sanatana Goswami says:

 

The so-called bliss of merging into the impersonal aspect of the Absolute Truth is often said to be indescribable, but the bliss of pure <em>prema</em> is even harder to describe. And most hard to describe is the inconceivable ecstasy of transcendental love in separation, which is born in pain but grows into the greatest possible pleasure. The ecstasy of separation is not the miserable experience it seems to outsiders; it is <em>mano-rama</em>, the cause of full satisfaction for the heart. If someone still asks how one can feel happy within misery, he should know that only the <em>rasikas</em>, those who have spontaneous eagerness to taste this <em>prema</em>, can understand it.

 

 

We must ask Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja, was Srila Sanatana Goswami mistaken when he said this?

 

The words of Srila Sanatana Goswami are crystal clear. Srila Sanatana Goswami said the bliss of Sri Radha in the mood of separation is greater than the bliss of union. Who tastes the highest bliss? The hladini shakti is the ultimate ecstatic energy and Sri Radha is Controller of the highest bliss. To taste this bliss, Sri Krsna manifest as Sri Gauranga.

 

It is to be noted that in this book of Srila Sanatana Goswami this verse of Brhad Bhagavatamrta comes from the lips of Sri Krsna Himself. Sri Krsna speaks these words above (promoda-rasih parinamato etc..). These words praising the bliss of separation as the highest type of ecstasy are spoken by Sri Krsna to Narada.

 

The words of Srila Sanatana Goswami are not to be disregarded, ignored or negated by crooked logic. True rasikas acknowledge that the bliss of Sri Radha's separation exceeds the bliss of union. To taste this bliss, Sri Krsna appeared as Sri Gauranga. The scriptures say this is so.

 

Again, I will repeat what I said earlier. If there is no feeling of utter bliss for Sri Radha in Her mood of separation, then why didn't She just get in a chariot and go to Mathura as Srila Govinda Maharaja suggested? Mathura is only half an hour distance from Vrindaban if She were to ride there in a chariot. Was She foolish - this is the implication of what is being said by Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja.

 

To which he might reply that the Form of Sri Radha Who feels separation is only a partial Form of Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself.

 

 

Viyogini Radhika always laments. All gopis lament there, but She especially So who will be meeting with Sri Krsna in Vraja? Vrsabhanu-nandini Radhika Herself. The Radhika who feels great separation for Krsna is Viyogini Radhika. The Radhika who meets with Him in Kuruksetra after a long time, but was not satisfied and thus wanted to bring Him to Vrndavana – and who brought Him on the chariot of Her heart – is called Samyogini Radhika.

 

Considering these things, we conclude Srila Govinda Maharaja must have been speaking about Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja when Srila Govinda Maharaja said:

 

I know what is hell, and I have some experience about heaven, but I do not know what is the destination of one who wants to criticize the dearmost associates of Radharani as well as Mahaprabhu Sri Chaitanyadeva. He has not even the smallest idea about Krsna consciousness, especially about the twelve years of Mahaprabhu's living in Gambhira, and the mood of Radharani tasted by Mahaprabhu, the non-different Form of Krsna. Can you say what kind of destination awaits such a person? If the residents of hell see such a person they must be fearful of him and need to make a new hell for him.

 

 

What is the thinking of the predecessor Acaryas in regard to this topic of Union and Separation.

 

Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura once revealed the importance of Kuruksetra in a unique way. The words of our guru maharaja were mostly very revolutionary. When I was a beginner with only two years or so in the Gaudiya Math, I was in charge of the Kuruksetra temple. Once, I came to the Calcutta headquarters at the hired house in Ulta Danga for the yearly preaching festival. After the festival I was to return to Kuruksetra. Srila Prabhupada was thinking of opening a "Theistic Exhibition" in Kuruksetra, showing with dioramas how Krishna and His friends came there from Dvaraka, and the gopis came there from Vrndavana.

 

It is mentioned in Srimad Bhagavatam that during the solar eclipse, they came to bathe in Brahma-kunda, a sacred lake in Kuruksetra. Srila Prabhupada wanted to show that pastime with a diorama, and so the exhibition was arranged. He ordered handbills to be printed, and twenty thousand circulated in the area, inviting people to come for the exhibition.

 

In this connection, he told us, "You all know that only the bogus, hollow people and men of shallow thinking like Vrndavana." I was very much perplexed to hear this. I had been told that Vrndavana is the highest place of spiritual perfection. I had heard that one who has not mastered his senses cannot enter Vrndavana. Only the liberated souls can enter Vrndavana and have the opportunity of discussing krsna-lila. Vrndavana is for the liberated souls. Those who are not liberated from the demands of their senses may live in Navadwipa, but the liberated souls may live in Vrndavana. Now Prabhupada was saying tha the shallow thinkers appreciate Vrndavana, but a man of real bhajana, real divine aspiration, will aspire to live in Kuruksetra.

 

Hearing this, I felt as if I had fallen from the top of a tree. "What is this?" I thought. I am a very acute listener, so I was very keen to catch the meaning of his words. The next thought he gave us was that Bhaktivinoda Thakura, after visiting many different places of pilgrimage, remarked, "I would like to spend the last days of my life in Kuruksetra. I shall construct a cottage near Brahma-kunda and pass the rest of my life there. Kuruksetra is the real place of bhajana."

 

Why? Service is more valuable according to the intensity of its necessity. Shrewd merchants seek a market in wartime because in that dangerous position, money is spent like water, without any care for its value. They can earn more money if a war comes. In the same way, when Srimati Radharani's necessity reaches its zenith, service to Her becomes extremely valuable. According to its necessity, service is valued. And in Kuruksetra, Srimati Radharani is in the highest necessity because Krishna is so close, but Their Vrndavana lila is impossible. in a football game, if the ball is just inches from the goal, but again comes back, it is considered a great loss. In the same way, after a long separation, Krishna is there in Kuruksetra, so the hankering for union felt by His devotees must come to its greatest point, but because He is in the role of a king, they cannot meet intimately. The circumstances do not allow the Vrndavana lila to take place. So at that time, Srimati Radharani needs the highest service from Her group, the sakhis.

 

Bhaktivinoda Thakura says that in that situation, a drop of service will draw the greatest amount of prema, divine love. In the pastimes of Radha-Govinda, there are two aspects: sambhoga, divine union, and vipralambha, divine separation. When Radha and Krishna are very near to each other, but can't meet intimately, service at that time can draw the greatest gain for the servitors. Therefore, Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura says, "I shall construct a hut on the banks of Brahmakunda in Kuruksetra and contemplate rendering service to the Divine Couple. If I can achieve that standard where the prospect of service is so high, then there is no possibility of returning to this mundane plane at any time."

 

 

 

According to Srila Sridhara Maharaja, both Bhaktivinoda Thakura and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura had a desire to serve Sri Radhika in Her mood of separation.

 

Clearly, Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja is of a different mind-set.

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

I will use my commen sence to leave this thread..

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

I think the people on this thread (most) don't have a clue, and the person who posted the quote about commen sence is a 'star'. Even a subtle point people cannot understand. I guess the eGO loves the fighting mentality.

 

I for one, would rather SEE Krishna then be away from Him. Enough said.

[Kripamoya 0]

After looking at some of the above posts as well as other writings of Sripad Narayana Maharaja, it is quite apparent that he has now ascended to the level of giving his own commentaries on the Gaudiya canon.

 

He has proclaimed himself as a neophyte that is just approaching the madhyama stage.

 

There are a lot of devotees around the world that would not have any disagreement with that.

 

The questions is; why is a madhyama-adhikari, who is a self-proclaimed sadhaka seeking self-realization, now giving different commentary on the most elevated Gaudiya shastra?

 

I guess Visvanatha Cakravarti, Jiva Goswami and the other great Vaishnava Goswamis forgot to mention something?

 

Narayana Maharaja makes many statements without referring to the words of the genuine Gaudiya acharyas.

 

Many devotees will NEVER accept his madhyama-adhikari (at best) commentaries that are tainted with the siddha-pranali sanga that he was infected with when he blooped from the Gaudiya Math to suck-up to the siddha-pranali types at Radha-kunda.

 

Narayana Maharaja is trying to create a convergence of Gaudiya Math with the siddha-pranali influence that he had to be DRAGGED away from.

 

It might work for a while, but someday most of the devotees are going to look back at this stuff as just so much fantasy - like a day at Disneyland.

 

Sadhakas like Narayana Maharaja don't need to be making commentary on shastra.

 

Most of the devotees he initiates don't have a clue about what he is saying or if it corresponds to what the authentic acharyas have given.

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

Most of them don't have a clue?

 

Does that include me?

 

I guess we all have our own views. You seem to be just saying a few things you heard but never really read any of His Books.

 

You should give it a chance.

[Kripamoya 0]

 

Most of them don't have a clue?

 

Does that include me?

 

I guess we all have our own views. You seem to be just saying a few things you heard but never really read any of His Books.

 

You should give it a chance.

 

Narayana Maharaja regularly pushes himself off on new devotees that have no faith in him and don't have a clue to what he is saying or if it corresponds to the Gaudiya siddhanta.

 

He is always telling some innocent bystander that they need to take initiation from him, even though they don't know him from Adam.

 

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that there is something seriously wrong with all that.

 

Offenses of the highest level simply turn them into madmen.

 

It's not amazing that there are people around to follow.

 

Rajneesh had plenty of followers.

 

There are many followers of many pseudo-incarnations all over India.

 

finding followers is not that difficult.

 

Finding a pure devotee is VERY VERY rare.

 

Srila Prabhupada ki-jaya!

Srila Sridhar Maharaja ki-jaya!

[Guest guest]

Radha Mai Madhava Gopala Hari Nama

Japatu Japatu Radhe Vrindavana Dham

Saranam Varanam Premai Harinam

Sriti Mai Vandhava Saranam Nittam

 

Hey Radhe, I am your Madhava, I am your cowboy Hari. I only remember your name always in Vrindavan. In your remembrance I take only name of Hari, I remember you always with all my old friends together.

 

Jayatu Jayatu Radhe Hari Vasi Badane

Sudha Mai Sriti Rupe Tame Mai Saranam

Yogi Mai Ananadama Sudhaa Varanam

Radhe Radhe Gopibala Sarane

 

When the flute of Hari I hear, I only listen your glorious name Radhe, Radhe. I only remember you from my memory in the form of nectar. In the form of a Yogi, I fill up all nectar of your love with your name Radhe, Radhe on behalf of all Gopies (Gopibala) of lord Hari

 

Antara Hari Moi Kebala Prema Nama

Krsna Krsna Mai Taba Nama Hare Rama

Yoga Bala Gopala Debamai Bhakthi

Antima Rasa Lila Kebala Tu Shakthi

 

Inside me only name of Hari with His supreme Love. In the name of Krsna I worship you calling Hare Rama. All those young yogis like companion of cowboys to Krsna, I offer my all obeisance to you through my devotion. Finally in all those rasa lila you become my all resources of energy to love everyone like you.

[Kripamoya 0]

 

Radha Mai Madhava Gopala Hari Nama

Japatu Japatu Radhe Vrindavana Dham

Saranam Varanam Premai Harinam

Sriti Mai Vandhava Saranam Nittam

 

Hey Radhe, I am your Madhava, I am your cowboy Hari. I only remember your name always in Vrindavan. In your remembrance I take only name of Hari, I remember you always with all my old friends together.

 

Jayatu Jayatu Radhe Hari Vasi Badane

Sudha Mai Sriti Rupe Tame Mai Saranam

Yogi Mai Ananadama Sudhaa Varanam

Radhe Radhe Gopibala Sarane

 

When the flute of Hari I hear, I only listen your glorious name Radhe, Radhe. I only remember you from my memory in the form of nectar. In the form of a Yogi, I fill up all nectar of your love with your name Radhe, Radhe on behalf of all Gopies (Gopibala) of lord Hari

 

Antara Hari Moi Kebala Prema Nama

Krsna Krsna Mai Taba Nama Hare Rama

Yoga Bala Gopala Debamai Bhakthi

Antima Rasa Lila Kebala Tu Shakthi

 

Inside me only name of Hari with His supreme Love. In the name of Krsna I worship you calling Hare Rama. All those young yogis like companion of cowboys to Krsna, I offer my all obeisance to you through my devotion. Finally in all those rasa lila you become my all resources of energy to love everyone like you.

 

I have come to dislike the term "cowboy", because in the western countries cowboys are cow killers.

 

I prefer "dairy boys" or "milkmaids", because in dairy farming the cows are not killed. (I know that eventually they are, but in India they are not supposed to be killed).

 

Cowboys are rope smoking, cattle herding, cattle branding cow killers.

 

We need to find a better word for gopa than "cowboy".

 

I think maybe "dairy boy" is better.

[Guest guest]

 

According to Srila Sridhara Maharaja, both Bhaktivinoda Thakura and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura had a desire to serve Sri Radhika in Her mood of separation.

 

Clearly, Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja is of a different mind-set.

Your conclusion is clearly prejudiced. Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura have a desire to serve Sri Radhika in Her mood of separation as do all Rupanugas. In their service then do not see the non-dual nature of bhakti like a jnani-yogi such as Uddhava when he first went to Vrndavana. Consequently they cannot stand to see their Swamini suffer in so much seperation from Krsna, therefore they try to make arraingements for the transcendental meeting between Radha and Krsna.

 

nikunja-yuno rati-keli-siddhyai

ya yalibhir yuktir apekshaniya

tatrati-dakshyad ati-vallabhasya

vande guroh shri-caranaravindam

[Kripamoya 0]

 

Your conclusion is clearly prejudiced. Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura have a desire to serve Sri Radhika in Her mood of separation as do all Rupanugas. In their service then do not see the non-dual nature of bhakti like a jnani-yogi such as Uddhava when he first went to Vrndavana. Consequently they cannot stand to see their Swamini suffer in so much seperation from Krsna, therefore they try to make arraingements for the transcendental meeting between Radha and Krsna.

 

nikunja-yuno rati-keli-siddhyai

ya yalibhir yuktir apekshaniya

tatrati-dakshyad ati-vallabhasya

vande guroh shri-caranaravindam

 

When you call Uddhava a jnani-yogi I get real pissed-off.

That is the most crude nonsense I have ever heard.

 

Uddhava prayed to be a clump of grass in Vrindavana to get the feet dust of the gopis on him because he was too ashamed to touch their lotus feet.

 

You people are INSANE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest guest]

O.K. so I mispoke. When Uddhava first went to Vrndavana he preached about the non-dual nature of reality to the gopas and gopis. This means that at that time he was a jnani BHAKTA yogi or a bhakti-jnani. After experiencing the extreme dedication of the gopis he then changed to the extent that he prayed to be a creeper in Vrndavana. Anyway Srila Sridhar Maharaja and Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, certainly did not see eye to eye over the Ratha Yatra issue. This is an indesputable fact. Yet Srila Sridhar Maharaja saw Srila Prabhupada as his siksa guru although they were not one on everything. Yet their relationship was certainly one of love and affection, as was Srila Prabhupada's relationship with both Srila Govinda Maharaja and Srila Narayana Maharaja. Your attacks on Srila Narayana Maharaja on going on without any consideration of this fact. Its like Srila Prabhupada does not exist in this equation. It appears that these attacks are also starting to include Srila Keshava Maharaja. Srila Prabhupada wept when Srila Keshava Maharaja disappeared and wanted his picture put up in all his major international temples. Do you care? It doesn't see that way at all. If you want to call a "spade a spade" then I'll have to say that I just don't see the same mood in the Sri Caitanya Saraswat Math that existed during the time of Srila Sridhar Maharaja. And this is irrespective of my position on Srila Narayana Maharaja. There were no campaigns against anyone during the time of Srila Sridhar Maharaja. His message was "the real enemy is within" and there were so many deviations during his days. All this negativity and hatred is a travesty in the name of Srila Sridhar Maharaja and it is a bigger offense against him than anyone because it impunes the dignity of his conception. Look within, we are all falling short and suffering, don't take it out on others in the name of Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar-deva Goswami Maharaja. It is too much to bear.

[Guest guest]

 

Yet Srila Sridhar Maharaja saw Srila Prabhupada as his siksa guru although they were not one on everything.

 

Should read: Srila Prabhupada saw Srila Sridhar Maharaja as his siksa guru...

Sorry for the typo

[Pankaja_Dasa 1]

I think Kripamoya needs some kripa. Few years from now you'll be a Mayavadi. 100% Guarantee.