2-Shivani & All: Question to all- Integrity of Jyotish Reading >> Mark Kincaid 8/24

[Guest guest]

Dear Shivani & All:

I'd like to add a few thoughts here regarding the 'jyotish reading' as well.

When I first started studying Jyotish, one of the Vedic scholars I was studying with told me

to have '3 different Jyotish readings' done.

Later I was to learn one of he possible reasons for this.

When you have one person do your chart, you might not be able to tell what is 'you' and what

is due to the unique subjectivity of the Jyotishee.

But, when you've had 2 or even 3, it becomes more clear what comes up again and again, is

probably about 'you'....and what is different between the different readings, may be due to the

Astrologer.

Also, Partha is right, the key to life is self-referral consciousness.

We can go to Jyotishees, I have done it, too, but when I started studying my own, chart, that's

when I really learned the most.

However, there will always be a place for professional Astrologers, because most people won't

have the time or the inclination to study their charts.

Another value to going to a professional is the years of study that have been undertaken can

help you emmensely at understanding any of the different various 'meanings' in one's chart.

Finally, perhaps because the quality of subjectivity is used so often by Astrologers, many try

and make predictions.

And, though this is one of the basic benefits of Jyotish, it's also true that the level of precision

regarding correct predictions is not as high as it should be.

In fact, I discovered this very early, and realized that this feature may not be as perfected as

people might believe.

My Guru, also said that Jyotish is supposed to be perfect, without mistakes, so I thought maybe

I'd study other areas.

One area that I found 'perfect' was the fact that people's charts fit them.

After thousands and thousands of charts, now, and after 16 years study, I have not found one

chart that doesn't fit the person and their life.

This then, is a great boon for humanity, that there is a clear, precise, even scientific reason why

we're the way we are, and why we go through what we go through.

However, there's also great wisdom in our charts for growth, self-improvement and even self-

transformation!

Good luck.

Sincerely,

Mark Kincaid

Astrologer

Teacher of Meditation & Ayurved

/

1 641 472-0000.

"V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu >

vedic astrology

Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:28:17 -0000

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] Re: Question to all- Integrity of Jyotish Reading

Hello Shivani

Different astrologers give different viewpoints, based upon their

knowledge and experience. Some always see positive even in the most

negative charts, and some see negative in the most positive charts.

It is better not to consult astrologers in the first place, and do

self introspection.

Even when you take opinions of various people(astrologers),

understand that the opinion is biased by so many subjective factors

which makes it highly complicated.

The best course of action is to follow what your heart says. If you

know that you are kind hearted and helping lot, then what is the need

to react to their opinion? We react only when we believe it to be

true. Resistance comes only when we dont accept a situation.

Atleast that is what i say to people who come to me for consultation.

I Just ask them to follow their heart as it never shows you the wrong

path. No prediction in this world, even when made by a saint can come

correct, if the consciousness of the individual, or the group agrees

to it. If the Consciousness doesnot agree to what has been predicted,

then some other reality is chosen, and only that reality is

experienced.

But astrologers will justify any event, because the knowledge is so

vast, techniques so many, tools so many that any event can be

justified by clever analysis.

And even future predictions are actually never made by astrology, all

future predictions are actually made by intuition, under the garb or

clothing of astrological analysis.

I will tell you an incident. Once a old man came to me and asked me

if his daugher will find employment in the coming month. She was

unemployed for almost 6 months. When i opened her chart, i couldnot

see how she could get a job based upon the knowledge that i had

aquired. But still i predicted a job on May 19th. She indeed got a

job on that day, but my knowledge failed there and intuition worked.

Some people might opine that i missed a trick or a technique, and if

i would have used that trick then definitely i would have known why

the event took place. But they will not or cannot answer me, when i

ask how come i predicted using time of births that were sometimes off

by minutes, sometimes days, sometimes even years.

We can reach to right conclusion without using

any "perfect "astrological tool is my experience after reading some

thousands of charts.

So what is the purpose of astrology if not prediction. I now

understand that it can be used as a self development and aspiritual

tool. But that too till an extent. After one crosses the river, the

boat is no longer required. Similarly astrology can be used just like

a boat.

best wishes

partha

vedic astrology, "shivani_dass"

<shivani_dass> wrote:

> Respected Members,

>

> Generally once a horoscope is interpreted by an astrologer it is the

> normal practise to go along with what has been said and try to

> overcome those problems, but what happens if one astrologer says

> something completely opposite of another astrolger? As astrological

> advice can have a far-stretched affect on a persons life it is

> necessary therefore to seek the advice of the consensus - a second

or

> third opinion even.

>

> My horoscope details when interpreted by astrologers in the past

have

> always indicated a problem with getting along with people in terms

of

> relationships and so-forth, and have also termed me manglik, however

> i have always felt that im actually a very kind hearted and nice

> person to get along with then why do i always feel as if i cannot

> relate to everyone properly, or shy away from certain social

> situations. Astrologers have pedicted that because of my rahu-ketu

on

> the first-seventh house axis coupled with mars in the first house

> would cause me a divorce. But i also have jupiter in lagna WITH the

> Mangal and Rahu, so would that not be a positive affect on my

> marriage?

>

>

> Till now i have always accepted the fact that i will have marital

> problems once i get married (as i am still single)and learned to

cope

> with the fact that marriage will not be heaven for me. However,

> recently one astrolger said that i will have a happy marriage and

> will not have anything like a divorce etc and it was said that all

> other astrolgers have been incorrect in advising me so.

>

> I respect all astrolgers advices, and understand that everyone will

> have a different interpretation of events, However astrology cannot

> be so far different that two people give such opposite views...or

can

> it?

>

> So i therefore ask the opinion of everyone in this group to give me

> the views of their interpretations and how such conclusions have

been

> reached.

>

> I am a Leo Ascendant, with Mars/Rahu/Jupiter in lagna,

> Mercury/Ketu in 7th house.

>

> My details are:

> Date of Birth: 05 February 1980

> Time of Birth: 07:10 PM

> place: London, UK

>

> It will be interestin to know how astrologers can caste their views

> on the different aspects in this chart! Many thanks- look forward to

> the conclusion.

>

> Warm Regards,

> Shivani

 

 

 

 

 

 

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<vedic astrology> " on the web.

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[Guest guest]

You mention that you did not find any difference with the

actual characteristics of the of the person in real life and the pen

picture as per the chart, during your long years of

practice as an astrologer. Could you tell us which was the ayanamsa used to get

these horoscopes. Was it the same ayanamsa used to generate all these

horoscopes, or the horoscopes were generated using different ayanamsas.

Perhaps this should throw some light on the controversy as to which ayanamsa

gives the best results.

 

With respect,

 

(G.K.Rangan)

 

(EOM) Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid (AT) mchsi (DOT) com> wrote:

Dear Shivani & All:I'd like to add a few thoughts here regarding the 'jyotish

reading' as well.When I first started studying Jyotish, one of the Vedic

scholars I was studying with told meto have '3 different Jyotish readings'

done.Later I was to learn one of he possible reasons for this.When you have one

person do your chart, you might not be able to tell what is 'you' and whatis due

to the unique subjectivity of the Jyotishee.But, when you've had 2 or even 3, it

becomes more clear what comes up again and again, isprobably about 'you'....and

what is different between the different readings, may be due to

theAstrologer.Also, Partha is right, the key to life is self-referral

consciousness.We can go to Jyotishees, I have done it, too, but when I started

studying my own, chart, that'swhen I really learned

the most.However, there will always be a place for professional Astrologers,

because most people won'thave the time or the inclination to study their

charts.Another value to going to a professional is the years of study that have

been undertaken canhelp you emmensely at understanding any of the different

various 'meanings' in one's chart.Finally, perhaps because the quality of

subjectivity is used so often by Astrologers, many tryand make predictions.And,

though this is one of the basic benefits of Jyotish, it's also true that the

level of precisionregarding correct predictions is not as high as it should

be.In fact, I discovered this very early, and realized that this feature may

not be as perfected aspeople might believe.My Guru, also said that Jyotish is

supposed to be perfect, without mistakes, so I thought maybeI'd study other

areas.One area that I found 'perfect' was the fact that people's charts

fit them.After thousands and thousands of charts, now, and after 16 years study,

I have not found onechart that doesn't fit the person and their life.This then,

is a great boon for humanity, that there is a clear, precise, even scientific

reason whywe're the way we are, and why we go through what we go

through.However, there's also great wisdom in our charts for growth,

self-improvement and even self-transformation!Good luck.Sincerely,Mark Kincaid

AstrologerTeacher of Meditation &

Ayurved/1 641 472-0000.

"V.Partha sarathy" <partvinu >

vedic astrologyDate: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:28:17 -0000To:

vedic astrologySubject: [vedic astrology] Re: Question to all-

Integrity of Jyotish Reading

Hello ShivaniDifferent astrologers give different viewpoints, based upon their

knowledge and experience. Some always see positive even in the most negative

charts, and some see negative in the most positive charts. It is better not to

consult astrologers in the first place, and do self introspection. Even when

you take opinions of various people(astrologers), understand that the opinion

is biased by so many subjective factors which makes it highly complicated.The

best course of action is to follow what your heart says. If you know that you

are kind hearted and helping lot, then what is the need to react to their

opinion? We react only when we believe it to be true. Resistance comes only

when we dont accept a situation.Atleast that is what i say to people who come

to me for consultation. I Just ask them to follow their heart as it never shows

you the wrong path. No prediction in this world, even

when made by a saint can come correct, if the consciousness of the individual,

or the group agrees to it. If the Consciousness doesnot agree to what has been

predicted, then some other reality is chosen, and only that reality is

experienced.But astrologers will justify any event, because the knowledge is so

vast, techniques so many, tools so many that any event can be justified by

clever analysis.And even future predictions are actually never made by

astrology, all future predictions are actually made by intuition, under the

garb or clothing of astrological analysis. I will tell you an incident. Once a

old man came to me and asked me if his daugher will find employment in the

coming month. She was unemployed for almost 6 months. When i opened her chart,

i couldnot see how she could get a job based upon the knowledge that i had

aquired. But still i predicted a job on May 19th. She indeed got a job on that

day, but my knowledge failed there and intuition worked. Some people might opine

that i missed a trick or a technique, and if i would have used that trick then

definitely i would have known why the event took place. But they will not or

cannot answer me, when i ask how come i predicted using time of births that

were sometimes off by minutes, sometimes days, sometimes even years. We can

reach to right conclusion without using any "perfect "astrological tool is my

experience after reading some thousands of charts.So what is the purpose of

astrology if not prediction. I now understand that it can be used as a self

development and aspiritual tool. But that too till an extent. After one crosses

the river, the boat is no longer required. Similarly astrology can be used just

like a boat.best wishesparthavedic astrology,

"shivani_dass" <shivani_dass> wrote:>

Respected Members,> > Generally once a horoscope is interpreted by an astrologer

it is the> normal practise to go along with what has been said and try to>

overcome those problems, but what happens if one astrologer says> something

completely opposite of another astrolger? As astrological> advice can have a

far-stretched affect on a persons life it is> necessary therefore to seek the

advice of the consensus - a second or> third opinion even.> > My horoscope

details when interpreted by astrologers in the past have> always indicated a

problem with getting along with people in terms of> relationships and so-forth,

and have also termed me manglik, however> i have always felt that im actually a

very kind hearted and nice> person to get along with then why do i always feel

as if i cannot> relate to everyone properly, or shy away from certain social>

situations.

Astrologers have pedicted that because of my rahu-ketu on> the first-seventh

house axis coupled with mars in the first house> would cause me a divorce. But

i also have jupiter in lagna WITH the> Mangal and Rahu, so would that not be a

positive affect on my> marriage?> > > Till now i have always accepted the fact

that i will have marital> problems once i get married (as i am still single)and

learned to cope> with the fact that marriage will not be heaven for me.

However,> recently one astrolger said that i will have a happy marriage and>

will not have anything like a divorce etc and it was said that all> other

astrolgers have been incorrect in advising me so.> > I respect all astrolgers

advices, and understand that everyone will> have a different interpretation of

events, However astrology cannot> be so far different that two people give such

opposite views...or

can> it?> > So i therefore ask the opinion of everyone in this group to give me>

the views of their interpretations and how such conclusions have been> reached.>

> I am a Leo Ascendant, with Mars/Rahu/Jupiter in lagna,> Mercury/Ketu in 7th

house.> > My details are:> Date of Birth: 05 February 1980> Time of Birth:

07:10 PM> place: London, UK> > It will be interestin to know how astrologers

can caste their views> on the different aspects in this chart! Many thanks-

look forward to> the conclusion.> > Warm Regards,> ShivaniArchives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

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