mantrapushpam+sarbani is right

[Guest guest]

dear friends

 

let us appreciate the fact that sarbani-ji has stood up and asked

some very thought provoking questions. what she has said is right and

so is saileshji and dasgupataji whom i know since some time. we are

living in 21st century and not 21 bc. let us not be over dogmatic

with insignificant remarks. let us remember what vivekananda did for

upliftment of women. i doubt if any one is there in this august

gathering who would question what vivekananda did. despite his

valiant efforts and also shri dayananda saraswati we are still hold

hypocritical stance. The point was not regarding rishis or their

teachings , nor was it regarding the rituals. it was about basic

fundamental HUMAN RIGHTS. if we deny women of their rightful place

then we could never progress in society.

regards

partha

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

If I may throw in something here as somebody who has long fought for the

protection of women and children. It has been said that a culture or

civilization can be judged as to how women and children are protected and cared

for and respected. If one glances at the domestic violence statistics in most

countries with regard to women and children, it does not say much for our

civilization. Just a thought......

 

Robyn

-

partvinu5

vedic astrology

Friday, February 08, 2002 9:49 AM

[vedic astrology] mantrapushpam+sarbani is right

dear friendslet us appreciate the fact that sarbani-ji has stood up and asked

some very thought provoking questions. what she has said is right and so is

saileshji and dasgupataji whom i know since some time. we are living in 21st

century and not 21 bc. let us not be over dogmatic with insignificant remarks.

let us remember what vivekananda did for upliftment of women. i doubt if any

one is there in this august gathering who would question what vivekananda did.

despite his valiant efforts and also shri dayananda saraswati we are still hold

hypocritical stance. The point was not regarding rishis or their teachings , nor

was it regarding the rituals. it was about basic fundamental HUMAN RIGHTS. if we

deny women of their rightful place then we could never progress in

society.regardsparthaArchives:

vedic astrologyGroup info:

vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank

mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light

shine on us .......

 

[Guest guest]

Hello Friends and Heroes

Since u have all given ur last explanations i too

deserve one...You people are waging a war without even

knowing your enemy,Now if i say that women should not

read mantras or scriptures or i am against womens

rights then u can certainly point against me or

support Someone,but that is not so, i have no

objection for women reciting a mantra or reading

scriptures or infact i think anyone in this world can

do anything he likes as long as he does not hurt

anyone,My arguement was not against reciting mantras

by women atall,I was objecting to criticism against

our ancients,because what they said might look very

bad to us but their decisions might be or might not be

justified by prevailing circumstances at those

times,so in simple i meant that if u want to recite

anything u r free to do so but dont criticize manu or

anybody just take positive things from him and ignore

whatever u dont agree with him,in these days it is

best not to raise a controversy....SIMPLE DO WHATEVER

U WANT AND IGNORE ANYTHING U DONT LIKE BUT DONT POINT

FINGERS AT SOMEBODY WHICH MIGHT RAISE A

CONTROVERSY,but unfortunately this female stirred this

hornets nest by saying against Manu or our ancients,

see there are people who like some one as well as some

who dont like him and if u criticize unncessarily

people will react, like i did...First of all this lady

says that she reads scriptures(which is very good) and

she does not care for people objecting women reading

scriptures(THIS IS VERY VERY GOOD I TOO AGREE WITH IT

AND RECOMMEND IT,I AM ALSO WITH ALL THE FEMALES

HERE),then why did she or anyone ask whether a certain

mantra is readable by women or not,because anyway u

are a women who will read it so why not just be calm

and do whatever u wanted to do, that is read the

mantra even if anybody does not agree with it,why

unneccesarily raise it in this group(even if u r

privately discussing with anybody in a group still it

is for everyone because it will be mailed to everyone

and being in a group anybody can read it!!!!!!),if u r

a women who does not recite a mantra if anyone objects

it then u should ask or raise it in this group..U C

MAYBE U WANT A CONTROVERSY OR RAISE PASSIONS HERE..IS

IT NOT MY FRIENDS???.......And please once gain dont

raise an issue about Manu or anything again,cause I DO

NOT SUPPORT MANU OR I DO NOT HATE HIM BUT I AND MANY

WILL NOT TOLERATE ANYONE CRITICIZING OUR ANCIENTS WHO

ARE THE BASIS AND TREASURE OF OUR COUNTRY,and i am a

shudra ,but because i am an open minded man so i

respect his positive statements and his knowledge and

once again i ignore his controversial statements on

shudras and women because i know that maybe someone

later might have added some of his controversial

statements or maybe prevailing times or conditions

might have influenced him....SO SIMPLE I GRASP HIS

POSITIVE IDEALS AND IGNORE SOME OF HIS STATEMENTS

WHICH CAUSE ME PAIN EXAMPLE REGARDING SHUDRAS BUT I DO

NOT HATE HIM OR CRITICIZE HIM WITHOUT KNOWING THE FULL

PICTURE....That is the sign of broadmindedness, female

,i started reading manu smrithi because one of our

organizations whose mentality was like some people

over here,told me that he is inhuman and against women

and shudras,naturally i was annoyed and firstly wanted

to understand him and his book,and after completion of

reading,instead of hating him i thought there was a

world of good to be learnt from him rather than

looking at his much disliked statements,u c it depends

upon ur brain whether u look at positive side or

negative side,and i think i should definitely point u

what i got from his book..

1)He says the mostly hated statement that Brahmins

come from the mouth of Vishnu/Brahma,kshatriyas from

shoulder,vaishyas from thighs and shudras from the

feet.....Well here as a shudra myself i could not hate

him cause i thought that we should take the positive

meaning out of this and maybe even he meant it that is

ULTIMATELY ALL THE VARNAS HAVE SPRUNG FROM THE SAME

BRAHMA/VISHNU...GOD IS PURITY PERSONIFIED AND SO ALL

HIS PARTS ARE PURE,SO WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN

GODS FEET OR GODS MOUTH??????....got the point..if u r

negative person u will see only negative.....

2) In some verses he says women are full of lust,greed

etc(these days all people including women,

men,brahmins and shudras etc are full of these)and in

some verses he says that Verily in a house where a

women is not happy,even the gods are not

pleased!!.....U see do u think this man is a male

chauvinist???....and someone of u pointed about

Vivekananda and some social reformers,well then here

is something for u,Manu does not opine that a women

should get married only once and she should stick to

him even if he's inhuman,infact he said that if a

husband deserts his wife and leaves for foreign lands

then after some time she can get married to other

person,if a husband is impotent also he she can leave

him.....u see there are N number of examples where he

supported females and remarriages,Now if ur brain is

negative u will only c the negative stuff from

him.........

3)He says that a women should allways be under the

supervision of a someone/man,when she is a child she

should b under supervision of father,when she is grown

up she should b under supervision of brother,when

married she should b under supervision of

husband,after becoming a widow she should b under

supervision of children .......Here also if dirt is

our ur brains then we will find only dirt and if

wisdom is in our head then we will find only

wisdom..is it not ringing here that he meant at every

stage of a womens life she should be protected and

cared for!!!!!in these days when the parents get old

they are being deserted.

4)He suggests animal sacrifices and eating meat at

shraddha etc...but u c he also quotes that nonviolemce

is the biggest dharma(ahimso parama dharma)..not only

this in those times the pure brahmins had the powers

to sacrifice a animal and make it enter a higher birth

into humans which morons cannot understand,and

ofcourse animal sacrifices are wrong at this

period(kali yug),in those times it had different

significance......by the way are we not sacrificing

humans by allowing our country recruiting

soldiers..inevitably they r meant to b sacrificed for

our protection.........that is why gita says that

scrifice is brahma........

And he asks us, why eat the dead bodies of animals

and increase our own flesh,we will also b eaten by

these cerreatures in our future births.....U C WE

ENCOUNTER AND WONDER WHY SO MANY DIFFERENT AND

CONTRASTING STATEMENTS BY THE SAME MANU....that is why

we should b open,maybe someone later added some

statements or maybe rules change according to the

situation,like ahimso parama dharma is said to be best

by our forefathers but they say it is not for all

people and all conditions...it is only for a brahmin

or an ordinary person not for a soldier defending

against mercenaries,he has to do violence against some

to protect many people..u c contrasting statements for

contrasting conditions.......some people will not b

able to understand this and they start to ctiticize

our great works.....

THIS IS A VERY SENSITIVE AGE AND TIME SO PLEASE DO NOT

CRITICIZE ANY RELIGION OR BOOK OR PEOPLE AND FACE THE

WRATH ....And some of the people here seem to b

concerned with the respect given to females,so here is

what i am telling,my dear friends if u go to a

elocution contest where females and males take part

in..and they have to justify their side of a topic,u

allow a female to speak loudly and then when a male

contestant tries to argue his side of the topic

against a female u suddenly do not rise and cry to

stop the man saying,that he being a hindu/civilized

man should not disrespect the female and argue with

her..does not sound logical atall(again here this does

not imply that this group is an elocution ground as

some people might unfortunately link,this is just an

example to say that rules are according to the

situations)..........And some body over here was

talking about 21st century..friend u are in a group

which spells VEDIC ASTROLOGY and u mean that 21 bc is

backward??,how can u say 21 ad is better than 21 bc

when still u r trying to grapple with the great

science of astrology???which is much older than 21

bc....does it not prove that they were advanced....and

u should know that whatever year we encounter maybe 31

st century still the basic vedic sayings apply..even

if we are in computer age..look what is happening to

Bill gates he is being sued for LOBHA(thats what our

ancients said that a mans enemies are KAMA KRODHA

LOBHA MOHA in any age.....and that is why even in this

age VEdic astrology holds good)

ONCE MORE I AGREE THAT ALL WOMEN CAN DO WHATEVER THEY

FEEL,SO NO ARGUEMENTS HERE THE ONLY OBJECTION HERE IS

CRITICIZING OUR MASTERS BECAUSE IF SOMEONE MIGHT NOT B

A MASTER TO U ,BUT OTHERS RESPECT HIM,SO DO NOT

FOOLISHLY CRITICIZE ANYBODY...........

And by the way this subject is not too wayward for

this group because if someone dispels ignorance in

some topics of philosophy then it is ok,because vedic

astrology is not seperate from hindu philosophy,it is

part and parcel of our religion(or to put it right

culture/science/way of living) and all humankind, it

might be vedic astrology or it might be ayurveda or

vaastu,everything is related to religion and culture

and philosophy u cannot seperate them,if u seperate

them then u cannot judge the subject well because a

person like charaka who gave charaka samhitha told

that ultimately it is the name of govinda which can

heal a very sick person even parashara Muni said that

in remedial measures all the planets are ruled by

dasavataras so worship them,so it is very diffilut to

do justice to astrology without clearing the dirt

about some statements given by our

forefathers,Whatever a rishi or manu might b,firstly

they are our forefathers so we have a duty to respect

them.........I think now we know who are in

maya,people who cannot even understand that i am also

on their side when defending womens cause are trying

to voice against me,these are the people who start

writing a examination without even studying the

question........

I have given my justified answer,and i do not wish

to continue further,cause it seems my answer will not

b able to change fragmented mindset...Sorry once again

and take care.

regards

gsr

 

--- resimpson <resimpson wrote:

> Dear friends,

>

> If I may throw in something here as somebody who has

> long fought for the protection of women and

> children. It has been said that a culture or

> civilization can be judged as to how women and

> children are protected and cared for and respected.

> If one glances at the domestic violence statistics

> in most countries with regard to women and children,

> it does not say much for our civilization. Just a

> thought......

>

> Robyn

> -

> partvinu5

> vedic astrology

> Friday, February 08, 2002 9:49 AM

> [vedic astrology] mantrapushpam+sarbani

> is right

>

>

> dear friends

>

> let us appreciate the fact that sarbani-ji has

> stood up and asked

> some very thought provoking questions. what she

> has said is right and

> so is saileshji and dasgupataji whom i know since

> some time. we are

> living in 21st century and not 21 bc. let us not

> be over dogmatic

> with insignificant remarks. let us remember what

> vivekananda did for

> upliftment of women. i doubt if any one is there

> in this august

> gathering who would question what vivekananda did.

> despite his

> valiant efforts and also shri dayananda saraswati

> we are still hold

> hypocritical stance. The point was not regarding

> rishis or their

> teachings , nor was it regarding the rituals. it

> was about basic

> fundamental HUMAN RIGHTS. if we deny women of

> their rightful place

> then we could never progress in society.

> regards

> partha

>

>

>

> Sponsor

>

>

>

>

>

> Archives:

> vedic astrology

>

> Group info:

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vedic astrology/info.html

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> vedic astrology-

>

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>

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> Krishnaarpanamastu ||

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>

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