Jana-Stations of the Nodes

[Guest guest]

Replying to Jana Lynn's note about the stations of the nodes from 2/10

 

 

The nodes stations are not entirely accepted. The nodes are the points where

the Moon crosses the ecliptic. The Moon has an oblique orbit around the

Earth, so it does cross the ecliptic twice a month. When the Moon is not

crossing the ecliptic, the node is slowly moving forward to it's next

Moon/Ecliptic contact point. The Moon's orbit takes 18 years to move around

the Earth so that is why that is the length of the nodes orbit round the

zodiac.

 

To say that the nodes go retrograde, and station therefore, is to imply that

the moon changes it's path slightly. That is doubtful. I can't be totally

sure, but I think basically that the nodes retros and stations are illusions

of our math regarding the Moon's orbit.

 

There are perterbations upon the Moon, gravity from other planets and

Sun/Earth relationships cause it to flutter in it's path, yes, but whether

we should see this as affecting the course of the nodes is uncertain.

 

In the old days, prior to NASA style exactness which we do now use in our

programs, the nodes were seen as ALWAYS direct, no retrogrades, and no

stations. There's no way ancients could calculate such things.

 

This is not a conclusive letter. I do think personally that looking at the

retros and stations of nodes is folly. Personal opinion after reviewing the

facts and working with orbital mathematics, code and logic. One things is

for sure, that which cause OTHER planets to go retro, have stations, is

entirely different from that which causes, as some say, the nodes to do so.

 

But in the finery of the Divine spin, perhaps it is going on and affecting

us. I cannot be certain.

 

roik

[Guest guest]

Hello Roik,

 

"To say that the nodes go retrograde, and station therefore, is to

imply that the moon changes it's path slightly."

 

I think there may be a slight misunderstand regarding the concept of

retrogression. As I understand it, retrogression has nothing to do

with the real movement of the planetary bodies. It is a concept

derived from direct visual observation of the planets. Because the

heliocentric path of planets appears oblong or elliptic from the

geocentric viewpoint at certain times, the planets only appear to

slow down, stop and then go retrograde (before slowing down, stopping

and moving forward again). This very same logic applies to the nodes,

which are points on the ecliptic.

 

If you click on the following link, you can see the mean and true

node. The mean node never goes retrograde, because it is calculated

in such a way. The true node, however, move as seen on an elliptic

path.

 

http://www.jyotishtools.com/images/meantrue2003.gif

 

>From an astrological perspective, the nodal station has repeatedly

been shown to be a time of considerable stress for those experiencing

it in relation to weak or afflicted natal placements. The nodal

return, if it happens to be stationary and exact, can be a very

difficult time. In my experience, using the true node is very

important for accurate prediction.

 

Take care.

 

Thor

 

 

gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

>

> Replying to Jana Lynn's note about the stations of the nodes from

2/10

>

>

> The nodes stations are not entirely accepted. The nodes are the

points where

> the Moon crosses the ecliptic. The Moon has an oblique orbit around

the

> Earth, so it does cross the ecliptic twice a month. When the Moon

is not

> crossing the ecliptic, the node is slowly moving forward to it's

next

> Moon/Ecliptic contact point. The Moon's orbit takes 18 years to

move around

> the Earth so that is why that is the length of the nodes orbit

round the

> zodiac.

>

> To say that the nodes go retrograde, and station therefore, is to

imply that

> the moon changes it's path slightly. That is doubtful. I can't be

totally

> sure, but I think basically that the nodes retros and stations are

illusions

> of our math regarding the Moon's orbit.

>

> There are perterbations upon the Moon, gravity from other planets

and

> Sun/Earth relationships cause it to flutter in it's path, yes, but

whether

> we should see this as affecting the course of the nodes is

uncertain.

>

> In the old days, prior to NASA style exactness which we do now use

in our

> programs, the nodes were seen as ALWAYS direct, no retrogrades, and

no

> stations. There's no way ancients could calculate such things.

>

> This is not a conclusive letter. I do think personally that looking

at the

> retros and stations of nodes is folly. Personal opinion after

reviewing the

> facts and working with orbital mathematics, code and logic. One

things is

> for sure, that which cause OTHER planets to go retro, have

stations, is

> entirely different from that which causes, as some say, the nodes

to do so.

>

> But in the finery of the Divine spin, perhaps it is going on and

affecting

> us. I cannot be certain.

>

> roik

[Guest guest]

But since the Moon moves with the Earth, is a satellite, and the node also

moves thus with them both, ... ?

 

It's not the same as other planets at all.

 

But although I know alot about orbits, I don't know everything, so I cannot

say for sure.

 

Just a bit suspect.

 

My program does both.

[Guest guest]

Dear Thor

I am most interested in what you just wrote. I'm also not a skilled

astronomer, but it seems to me that the nodes and the Moon can not really be

apart.

The system of reference upon which the measurement is based must be called into

question.

Does that make sense?

Regards

Gordon

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hello Roik,

 

To visualise the moon´s path around the earth, think of an

imaginary spiral tracing out the Moon´s orbit. The nodes are

points on opposite ends of that spiral. Just like the other planets

(excluding the Sun and Moon), The retrogression is a visual

phenomena. Moreover, the retrogression of the nodes is purely

nominal. It is better described as stationary placement.

 

With my best wishes,

 

Thor

 

gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

>

> But since the Moon moves with the Earth, is a satellite, and the

node also

> moves thus with them both, ... ?

>

> It's not the same as other planets at all.

>

> But although I know alot about orbits, I don't know everything, so

I cannot

> say for sure.

>

> Just a bit suspect.

>

> My program does both.

[Guest guest]

Hi again,

 

One more point, while I am not an astronomer, I want to add that

there is some discrepancy between the nodes and Moon. This

discrepancy is seen during times of lunar eclipses (when the earth

moves in-between the Sun and Moon, blocking the Moon´s refracted

rays on earth). I have noted a difference of a few degrees between

the Moon´s exact placement and that of the nodes during such

eclipses. If the Moon and nodes were identical in their path, it

should manifest at such times, when the nodes are said to "devour"

the Moon (the Sun would be devoured during the solar eclipse). I

don´t know exactly the reason for this, but expect it is because

the nodes are two extremes of the Moon course, while the lunar

placement is centered. Perhaps the discrepancy would be explained by

this. If someone who knows for sure can tell us, it could possibly

explain this matter to everyones satisfaction.

 

Cheers,

 

Thor

 

gjlist, "thorsteinnt" <thorsteinnt> wrote:

> Hello Roik,

>

> To visualise the moon´s path around the earth, think of an

> imaginary spiral tracing out the Moon´s orbit. The nodes are

> points on opposite ends of that spiral. Just like the other planets

> (excluding the Sun and Moon), The retrogression is a visual

> phenomena. Moreover, the retrogression of the nodes is purely

> nominal. It is better described as stationary placement.

>

> With my best wishes,

>

> Thor

>

> gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

> >

> > But since the Moon moves with the Earth, is a satellite, and the

> node also

> > moves thus with them both, ... ?

> >

> > It's not the same as other planets at all.

> >

> > But although I know alot about orbits, I don't know everything,

so

> I cannot

> > say for sure.

> >

> > Just a bit suspect.

> >

> > My program does both.

[Guest guest]

Dear Gordon,

 

I have faith in the astronomical basis of the nodal calculations.

These calculations go back such a long way. Today, these calculations

are performed by the very same people that have given us highly

accurate ephemris and astronomical calculation engines.

 

>From an astrological standpoint, the use of the (true) nodes

has given consistently good results. If it works, I see little reason

to discard it.

 

That said, I would love to have a better understanding of this

phenomenon.

 

Cheers,

 

Thor

 

gjlist, GWBrennan@a... wrote:

> Dear Thor

> I am most interested in what you just wrote. I'm also not a

skilled

> astronomer, but it seems to me that the nodes and the Moon can not

really be apart.

> The system of reference upon which the measurement is based must be

called into

> question.

> Does that make sense?

> Regards

> Gordon

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Roik Das and Thor:

 

I do have still a few questions relating to the cause of the Moon's nodes, R-K,

to be at a particular degree for a longer period of time, i.e., the "station"

March 21-June 3 when R-K are at 17 * Aries-Libra? Is this a visual or

mathematical phenomenon?

(2) With my NT Moon at 15 * Aries [Cancer lagna with Saturn, Sun, Mercury

also in Cancer (and Pluto)], I think the potential is there, as Thor suggests,

for

the Nodes station to be particularly emotionally stressful, not just for me but

for others. With the Moon's influence predominating my chart, I follow the

Moon's nodes/path very closely since I am so sensitive to lunar phases and

shifts, and this is what is behind my question for more clarification of the

"Nodal Station." (An example of emotional stress was last week when Mars

conjunct Rahu 19 * created several days of temper tantrum, emotional

instability, etc.; now that state is calmer and purified as a result of going

through the intensity).

(3) Could you also say more about the Nodal Return, how it is calculated, etc.

I think I may be "in the Nodal Return," but not sure how I arrived at that from

studies over the past two years.

 

As always, I do not derive my understanding so much from the mathematics of

astrology (which I lack precise understanding of) but try to combine my

understanding of the mathematics (in both your explanations) with my intuitive

perceptions. This particular time period also partly corresponds with the

Venus Rx station (May 17-June 29) and I wonder if there is any significance,

although I realize in Jyotish, Venus in Gemini-Taurus would not be "aspected"

by R-K.

 

But thanks for replying to the "Nodes Station" query. Only one other person

answered my request for clarification "off-list." I do like to be prepared for

any

major cataclysmic events and the reason for my study of astrology.

 

Janna

 

Satyam Shivam Sundaram

 

http://seven_directions.tripod.com/

 

gjlist, "thorsteinnt" <thorsteinnt> wrote:

> Hello Roik,

>

> "To say that the nodes go retrograde, and station therefore, is to

> imply that the moon changes it's path slightly."

>

> I think there may be a slight misunderstand regarding the concept of

> retrogression. As I understand it, retrogression has nothing to do

> with the real movement of the planetary bodies. It is a concept

> derived from direct visual observation of the planets. Because the

> heliocentric path of planets appears oblong or elliptic from the

> geocentric viewpoint at certain times, the planets only appear to

> slow down, stop and then go retrograde (before slowing down, stopping

> and moving forward again). This very same logic applies to the nodes,

> which are points on the ecliptic.

>

> If you click on the following link, you can see the mean and true

> node. The mean node never goes retrograde, because it is calculated

> in such a way. The true node, however, move as seen on an elliptic

> path.

>

> http://www.jyotishtools.com/images/meantrue2003.gif

>

> From an astrological perspective, the nodal station has repeatedly

> been shown to be a time of considerable stress for those experiencing

> it in relation to weak or afflicted natal placements. The nodal

> return, if it happens to be stationary and exact, can be a very

> difficult time. In my experience, using the true node is very

> important for accurate prediction.

>

> Take care.

>

> Thor

>

>

> gjlist, Das Goravani <das@g...> wrote:

> >

> > Replying to Jana Lynn's note about the stations of the nodes from

> 2/10

> >

> >

> > The nodes stations are not entirely accepted. The nodes are the

> points where

> > the Moon crosses the ecliptic. The Moon has an oblique orbit around

> the

> > Earth, so it does cross the ecliptic twice a month. When the Moon

> is not

> > crossing the ecliptic, the node is slowly moving forward to it's

> next

> > Moon/Ecliptic contact point. The Moon's orbit takes 18 years to

> move around

> > the Earth so that is why that is the length of the nodes orbit

> round the

> > zodiac.

> >

> > To say that the nodes go retrograde, and station therefore, is to

> imply that

> > the moon changes it's path slightly. That is doubtful. I can't be

> totally

> > sure, but I think basically that the nodes retros and stations are

> illusions

> > of our math regarding the Moon's orbit.

> >

> > There are perterbations upon the Moon, gravity from other planets

> and

> > Sun/Earth relationships cause it to flutter in it's path, yes, but

> whether

> > we should see this as affecting the course of the nodes is

> uncertain.

> >

> > In the old days, prior to NASA style exactness which we do now use

> in our

> > programs, the nodes were seen as ALWAYS direct, no retrogrades, and

> no

> > stations. There's no way ancients could calculate such things.

> >

> > This is not a conclusive letter. I do think personally that looking

> at the

> > retros and stations of nodes is folly. Personal opinion after

> reviewing the

> > facts and working with orbital mathematics, code and logic. One

> things is

> > for sure, that which cause OTHER planets to go retro, have

> stations, is

> > entirely different from that which causes, as some say, the nodes

> to do so.

> >

> > But in the finery of the Divine spin, perhaps it is going on and

> affecting

> > us. I cannot be certain.

> >

> > roik

[Guest guest]

Dear Janna,

 

The question you pose about the station (retrograde) planets is in

the first instance a visual phenomenon. This phenomenon has then been

calculated. As the nodes are "invisible" planets (points on the

Moon´s path) they are not directly visible. They exist as

calculated placements only.

 

A "nodal return" is simply the return of the nodes in transit over

their natal placement. If this conjunction is stationary it can be

quite difficult. If a nodal sub-period is running at the same time,

the energy of the nodes would be further amplified.

 

The best recourse to transit afflictions is to use astral remedies.

The remedies are intended to help people avoid tragedies, setbacks or

unfulfilled hopes in the life. As I found the Systems Approach to

deliver accurate predictions, I began to use the astral

remedies recommended by . The results have been

good. That said, while astral remedies help us avoid the adverse

happenings, they do not remove the strain felt by heavy transits.

However, by sparing us the additional strain of tragedies or

disappointment they keep the strain to a minimum. For further

information about these you can consult: www.yournetastrologer.com

 

You will also find some information about what planets are really

malefic for Cancer ascendants (under the heading Impact of Ascending

Signs).

 

Cheers,

 

Thor

 

gjlist, "Janna Lynn" <jnanalynn> wrote:

> Dear Roik Das and Thor:

>

> I do have still a few questions relating to the cause of the Moon's

nodes, R-K,

> to be at a particular degree for a longer period of time, i.e.,

the "station"

> March 21-June 3 when R-K are at 17 * Aries-Libra? Is this a visual

or

> mathematical phenomenon?

> (2) With my NT Moon at 15 * Aries [Cancer lagna with Saturn, Sun,

Mercury

> also in Cancer (and Pluto)], I think the potential is there, as

Thor suggests, for

> the Nodes station to be particularly emotionally stressful, not

just for me but

> for others. With the Moon's influence predominating my chart, I

follow the

> Moon's nodes/path very closely since I am so sensitive to lunar

phases and

> shifts, and this is what is behind my question for more

clarification of the

> "Nodal Station." (An example of emotional stress was last week when

Mars

> conjunct Rahu 19 * created several days of temper tantrum,

emotional

> instability, etc.; now that state is calmer and purified as a

result of going

> through the intensity).

> (3) Could you also say more about the Nodal Return, how it is

calculated, etc.

> I think I may be "in the Nodal Return," but not sure how I arrived

at that from

> studies over the past two years.

>

> As always, I do not derive my understanding so much from the

mathematics of

> astrology (which I lack precise understanding of) but try to

combine my

> understanding of the mathematics (in both your explanations) with

my intuitive

> perceptions. This particular time period also partly corresponds

with the

> Venus Rx station (May 17-June 29) and I wonder if there is any

significance,

> although I realize in Jyotish, Venus in Gemini-Taurus would not

be "aspected"

> by R-K.

>

> But thanks for replying to the "Nodes Station" query. Only one

other person

> answered my request for clarification "off-list." I do like to be

prepared for any

> major cataclysmic events and the reason for my study of astrology.

>

> Janna

>

> Satyam Shivam Sundaram

>

> http://seven_directions.tripod.com/

[Guest guest]

Thank you Thor. Your explanation is clear, but even though "invisible," Rah=

u-

Ketu do have (in my experience) a strong impact on us, as the Unconscious

(the hidden, invisible) does whether we're aware of it or not! Since the

"apparent nodal station" March 21-June 3 also includes Rahu swallowing the=

 

Sun at the Solar Eclipse April 19 at sidereal 6 * Aries (exactly square my =

 

Cancer Sun and aspecting TR Jupiter in Leo), I will be "taking my own

astrology notes" on the nodal stations. I think I am experiencing "amplific=

ation"

of the Nodes in general, and it seems there will be more amplification duri=

ng

the station, at least for me from what I am piecing together so far.

 

Yes, I was running Rahu-Mars Dasa when TR Rahu-Mars aspected NT Rahu-

Ketu in Taurus-Scorpio until last year, so that is why I pursued the "Nodal=

 

Return" research but had forgotten it. Now in Jupiter Dasa (malefic for Can=

cer

lagna, I'm told), I am facing a whole new set of challenges. I did check ou=

t Prof

Chodhry's site (I think Sateesh recommended it once), and that is one of th=

e

places I'm using to research the impact of Jupiter Dasa for a Cancer Lagna,=

 

so "the work" continues.

 

Thank you for another illumination on the astro puzzle.

 

Janna

 

Satyam Shivam Sundaram

 

http://seven_directions.tripod.com/

 

 

 

 

 

-- In gjlist, "thorsteinnt" <thorsteinnt> wrote:

> Dear Janna,

>

> The question you pose about the station (retrograde) planets is in

> the first instance a visual phenomenon. This phenomenon has then been

> calculated. As the nodes are "invisible" planets (points on the

> Moon´s path) they are not directly visible. They exist as

> calculated placements only.

>

> A "nodal return" is simply the return of the nodes in transit over

> their natal placement. If this conjunction is stationary it can be

> quite difficult. If a nodal sub-period is running at the same time,

> the energy of the nodes would be further amplified.

>

> The best recourse to transit afflictions is to use astral remedies.

> The remedies are intended to help people avoid tragedies, setbacks or

> unfulfilled hopes in the life. As I found the Systems Approach to

> deliver accurate predictions, I began to use the astral

> remedies recommended by . The results have been

> good. That said, while astral remedies help us avoid the adverse

> happenings, they do not remove the strain felt by heavy transits.

> However, by sparing us the additional strain of tragedies or

> disappointment they keep the strain to a minimum. For further

> information about these you can consult: www.yournetastrologer.com

>

> You will also find some information about what planets are really

> malefic for Cancer ascendants (under the heading Impact of Ascending

> Signs).

>

> Cheers,

>

> Thor

>

> gjlist, "Janna Lynn" <jnanalynn> wrote:

> > Dear Roik Das and Thor:

> >

> > I do have still a few questions relating to the cause of the Moon's

> nodes, R-K,

> > to be at a particular degree for a longer period of time, i.e.,

> the "station"

> > March 21-June 3 when R-K are at 17 * Aries-Libra? Is this a visual

> or

> > mathematical phenomenon?

> > (2) With my NT Moon at 15 * Aries [Cancer lagna with Saturn, Sun,

> Mercury

> > also in Cancer (and Pluto)], I think the potential is there, as

> Thor suggests, for

> > the Nodes station to be particularly emotionally stressful, not

> just for me but

> > for others. With the Moon's influence predominating my chart, I

> follow the

> > Moon's nodes/path very closely since I am so sensitive to lunar

> phases and

> > shifts, and this is what is behind my question for more

> clarification of the

> > "Nodal Station." (An example of emotional stress was last week when

> Mars

> > conjunct Rahu 19 * created several days of temper tantrum,

> emotional

> > instability, etc.; now that state is calmer and purified as a

> result of going

> > through the intensity).

> > (3) Could you also say more about the Nodal Return, how it is

> calculated, etc.

> > I think I may be "in the Nodal Return," but not sure how I arrived

> at that from

> > studies over the past two years.

> >

> > As always, I do not derive my understanding so much from the

> mathematics of

> > astrology (which I lack precise understanding of) but try to

> combine my

> > understanding of the mathematics (in both your explanations) with

> my intuitive

> > perceptions. This particular time period also partly corresponds

> with the

> > Venus Rx station (May 17-June 29) and I wonder if there is any

> significance,

> > although I realize in Jyotish, Venus in Gemini-Taurus would not

> be "aspected"

> > by R-K.

> >

> > But thanks for replying to the "Nodes Station" query. Only one

> other person

> > answered my request for clarification "off-list." I do like to be

> prepared for any

> > major cataclysmic events and the reason for my study of astrology.

> >

> > Janna

> >

> > Satyam Shivam Sundaram

> >

> > http://seven_directions.tripod.com/