some talk

[Guest guest]

Dear Das

 

I have been away for a week, a friend invited me to Skopelos in Greece I went

to a place in that island called Panormos where apparently there is a

monument attesting to the worship of the god Pan. The original Panormos was

built between the 7th and 8th century BC on the shores of a beautiful beach

of crystalline waters where there is an opportunity for a nice swim. The

worship of Pan was of pagan religion, or so we are told. On the western

horizon of Panormos there is an island, which from the hill known as

Palaiokastro (where the monument exists), it is possible to use it as a

landmark for the sunset. I wished I had a GPS compass to take the

coordinates of the place and later on with the help of a computer program,

verify the day of the year for an alienation of the sunset with Palaiokastro.

Unfortunately, the archeologists have the hill fenced and nobody can go in,

perhaps they are afraid of digging out their own grave, because they know

that what is going to appear is going to destroy their present theories.

 

While travelling I was thinking of my past email and I thought to clarify

certain things:

 

First of all, I want to ask for forgiveness if I offend anybody on the list

with my "Mexican ways", which are sometimes conditioning very difficult to

break, and also with my "broken" English, which as you may see is not perfect.

 

Das, I did not mean that you were greedy like the Spaniards conquistadors. I

do not detect greed in your talk, only anger from time to time. Greed is

more negative. Anger is easier to control.

 

I came up with an explanation: The best system to find a geographical place

on earth is by following the present system of latitude and longitude. In a

similar way, the tropical zodiac can describe the power of the solar

radiation on Earth, which is very important for obtaining food.

 

You wrote

"The point being, "Do the signs in the Zodiac have power or not.

Are they the signs, or were they just convenient 2000 years ago as

markers. This is the point. How much do the real signs in the Zodiac

matter or not?

 

If we use the Tropical Sun's relationship to our planet to establish the

signs begin points, and then apply those to the other much more distant

planets, are we doing the right thing? From experience personally, I

find the Tropical positions for the other planets incorrect."

 

I do agree with you, the present Tropical positions are incorrect. How is it

possible that Antares is now in Sagittarius when we know that it is the heart

of the Scorpion?. My feeling is that the Tropical sky has a role which key

we have lost somewhere.

 

You wrote

"Personal Quandry: I am not a "pure" person fully in Vedic terms.

Meaning, I have not mastered control over my senses. Only one who is

above the sway of the senses is eligible to be considered pure. One who

is still under the sway of their senses and material thinking mind, such

as myself, must struggle with duality in their own person. I am in this

struggle too."

 

You and me know that there are few "pure" people around and we are not those.

 

You wrote

"I have been given alot of training in Vedic matters, and it makes total

sense to me, but my materially conditioned mind still laments for what I

think I don't have. This causes me to suffer the pain and frustration

suffered by all of us, who are materially conditioned.

 

When I stand up so clearly for the Vedic conception, I do so therefore

with some trepidation and fear. I have, through my Vedic path,

essentially cut off most of my ties to the society in which I live, and

I move therefore like a covert operator through life. It's not at all

easy, to still be desiring fulfillment here, yet knowing that it is

ultimately fruitless or unsatisfying.

 

So I have the "troubled mind" that comes to one who tries to do what I'm

doing.

 

Seeing this, some persons on the various "Vedic" paths, put me down,

saying "if you're not happy perfectly, then why preach your views". This

makes sense, but not really as we have to try to enter that space

through actions, words and thoughts, and true, for awhile, a good while,

we're imperfect in our attempts.

 

Entering Veda land must be done largely on faith, as realization is not

there at first. This takes support, hence the Sadhu Sanga, or

association of devoted souls on the path, is all important for the

required support to keep going.

 

As the movement I come from (Hare Krishna) is falling apart all over the

West rapidly, and since I live in a city where it doesn't exist anyway,

I have few to no friends here. I'm also unmarried, and raise two

teenagers who attend public schools, so on all sides and in all ways I'm

quite alone. This list is my largest, only, or main association.

 

So when I get resistence here, it is, like the grocery store, like

everywhere, a challenging place for me to be. It's not easy. I feel very

alone.

 

But I can't turn back because only Vedic thought makes sense to me

fully. Everything else makes me feel like I'm ignoring our spiritual

birthright and true eternal heritage.

 

So all in all, I feel alone. When I receive positive and supporting

comments, it helps me.

 

I hope I can become stronger, more firm, more realized, in all these

Vedic matters. That alone it seems will end my personal internal pains."

 

Das, you are not alone. I went trough a similar experience as you but

different. I have learned the basics from Srila Prabhupada's books and

movement. I consider Srila Prabhupada as my instructor guru and I have read

his books 3 times in the past 30 years. Somehow, I was not meant to be

initiated by him, although I saw him in 1973, when he came to install the

Radha Krishna deities in Paris, then in 1974, 1975 and finally in 1976 when

he came to install the Nitai Gaur deities in the Neuvelle Mayapur chateau in

France. Although I had wonderful friends devotees around me there were also

some persons following the "Vedic " path telling me to stop the study of

Vedic astrology because "it is Maya". My background or Mexican conditioning

told me from the beginning not to trust them. Their external approach to

Divinity was not the standard desired, to me, they were inflexible, immature

and full of frustrations, and they used to walk like proud peacocks. What is

sad to me is that all of them are not any longer in the movement. For them,

shaving the head was a sign of being a devotee. Instead of asking me "how

are you?", whenever they used to see me, the used to say "when are you going

to shave your head?, when are you going to become a devotee?, you are in

Maya, you are too attached to your long hair". In Mexico, in the 50's and

60's there used to be the custom of shaving heads to the newcomers to high

school, pre-university level and to university. I think that the custom was

coming from the Aztecs because it was sometimes barbaric. Students of the

second and superior years (a minority of them) used to assault the newcomers

and with force (if they did not "surrender"), they used a pair of scissors to

cut the hair in order to force the new student to shave their heads. The

newcomers with shaven head were called "dogs" and in their first year, they

were supposed to be the "servants" of the others. Accidents used to happen,

in the struggle, cuts were made, sometimes the head, the ears, the nose or

even the eyes. In some schools, the custom was extended to smear tar in the

bodies of the "dogs" and ducks feathers and push them in the swimming pools,

without allowing them to come out of the water. Few "dogs" were drowned in

this way. In high school nobody touched me, in pre-university I

"surrendered" because I wanted to be part of the "club". And in university,

nobody came close to me. Those experiences made me "street wise" and when in

Europe I felt a similar treatment but to my mind. If in Mexico, the

experience coming from authorities is more physical, in Europe is more

psychological. If I have survived the physical treatment, the psychological

makes me laugh.

 

So, you can imagine what I think when somebody tells me what to do. I only

surrender to the humble and to the pure. Years later, I was initiated in

London (by mail because I could not afford to go to India) by Srila Sridhar

Maharaja. He told us to do according to our capacity and gave me advice when

my marriage to one of Srila Prabhupada's disciple ended (because of my

initiation to the "enemy" of my instructor guru). The law gave me access to

my children and to protect them and to give them association I lived close to

them until they were big enough to defend themselves.

 

So you can see that I too know about the fanatical approach of some people.

As astrologer, I wish them better and I pray that one day they get rid of

conditionments and reach the maturity required to advance on the spiritual

path.

 

The essence of ISKCON is going to survive, I am in debt to that movement and

I wish the best for them. I have many friends still there and I know that

they are sincere in saving as much as they can of their guru's legacy. Like

in any institution, mistakes have been made but everybody has the chance for

a second opportunity, either in this life or in the next. Our Guru Maharaja

said that we should not ask for justice because we do not have the chance,

rather, we should ask for His mercy. From the absolute point of view,

Krishna has a perfect plan, and not politician has the power to break that

plan, they may bark but Krishna is in control.

 

One of my teachers said to me that this materialistic society has brainwashed

us to think that we are the controllers, that is the inheritance of a false

system based in the teachings of Darwin, Freud etc. We have to break those

conditionings. Another teacher said that mother Durga knows best and that is

why she has given us this body for us to learn.

 

To have doubts is a sign of health, it means that we are going through

purification. The fire of purification eventually will burn any doubts and

will give us better eyes to see. When we cry with pain, our eyes can not see

properly, but eventually we will cry with happiness and we will see the plan

of the Lord.

 

Regarding your present position, prepare yourself for brahmacharia for the

next 6 to 9 months. Such tapasya will give you more clarity to your mind.

Meanwhile, continue preaching, I do not see any fault in that. When they say

"if you're not happy perfectly, then why preach your views", are they happy?

Just remember what Krishna says "lamentation is illusion", we should do our

duty, and you are a preacher and astrologer.

 

I hope that these lines help.

 

Yours in the service of Guru and Gauranga,

 

Natabara das