Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 Dear SriVaishnavaites, Iam regularly watching the Thirupavai upanyasam in both Jaya TV (Sthalasayanam Swami)and DD (Velukudi Krishnan Swami)at Chennai. While explaining about the phrase “engaL mEl saapam izhinthu” of 22nd Pasuram, (angaNmaa), they said that saapam will come when we do not worship the lord. I feel that Sin(paapam) and Curse (saapam) are different. One can accumulate Sin (paapam) due to intentional or unintentional actions. Sometimes we do actions thinking that they are good but will end up otherway. But Curse is based on specific adharmic act. So here why Kothapiratti mentioned as “engaL mEl saapam”?. As she herself says “puNNiyam yaamudaiyOm” in 28th pasuram, so how we can fit the saapam here? And moreover when we refer Valmiki Ramayanam, we see that there is no rishi or maharishi worshipping Lord rama when he was wandering in the forest. But on the otherway, we see that Lord Rama goes to each and every Rishi and pays his respects. So if saapam can come to people who did not worship lord, will that not be applicable to the rishis of ramanyanam. I do not have contacts of these upanyasakas here. Hence can anyone clarify and enlighten me? Thanks, Srinath Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2004 Report Share Posted January 15, 2004 Your question is a good question and the explanation that adiyen can have is as follows. If you look at the line above it is "a~GgaN iraNDum koNDu e~GgaL mEl nOkkudiyEl* " "a~GgaN" is explained by poorvacharyas as a synonym for "Karunai". Didnt perumal show this in Vibheshana Sharanagati. He just signaled Vibishana with his eyes saying that he has already granted abhayam to him and the metting that he held was just to hear what others said.The rest of the "vanara padai" did not understand this action of Emperuman. Now lets look at the case when perumals karunnai doest not fall on us . Firstly if this has to happen then either that person has to have commited a sin(s) or had a curse(s).For sins accumulated through ones one acts and in this kaiyuga where prayachitam is also difficult we have to approach an acharyan who will show us the way to Emperuman and thats when Perumal will show us Karunai. Same is the case with accumulated curse as well(for eg. gajendra had the curse of Sage agastya and perumal had to come to rescue him and many other stories which reflect the karunai of Perumal). hence this pasuram is a prayer saying that have mercy on us and rescue us from all the sins and curses. On the highest level "e~GgaL mEl shaapaM izhindElOr empaavaay " means that being caught in this cycle of life and birth is a big curse , so again godai piraati requests perumal to come and release us from this cycle of life and birth as he his parama karuna moorthi and grant moksha. Adiyen is also enclosing the exceprt from Srimadh 44th Azagiya Singars Vyakhyanam. ***************************************************** SrI: SrImathE Gopaladesika mahadesikaya namah: Dearest Srivaishnavas, These young girls of Ayarpaadi are desirous of only Bhagawath kaimkaryam and nothing else; not at Srivaikuntam only; but here itself; right then. For that, they want KaNNan’s divine glances (Kataaksham) on them to shower His mercy and dayA on them, with all their sins getting dissolved We have come now at your door step, after getting into very many bodies, suffered lots and lots of himsa; realized that there is absolutely no pleasure here in this birth; Still until this birth, we have been sleeping and now we have woken up from those sense organs which never ever wish to leave us at anytime; We have woken up those sense organs as well towards You after greatest difficulty. Do not leave such a property of Yours that has come at your doorstep- which You had missed for so many ages; [as we had trespassed Your instructions and have gone away from you]. Please protect us as if You have got back the property that belongs to You. We will inform You how we have come. Just look at us with your vailakshaNya divine kataaksham and there is nothing else that we aspire for. How have you come? Tell me. Then I will decide if I need to look at or not. Huge, vast, beautiful expanded kingdoms with all comforts- the kings ruled. Those kings as if those worlds belong to them at all times and are theirs at any time for ever; they were proud and arrogant with ahankaara, mamakaaram. None can shake them- they thought. The thought they are capable of ruling them whoever comes as an enemy. They do not need anyone’s help/support for the same. Not even the God’s blessing. They never bow down to anyone. They over a priod of time, unfortunately lose their kingdoms and do lose everything that belongs to them. {Srimath Azhagiya Singar asks: Will such a thing happen? Losing all for such great kings?- why not? In India itself, it has happened. The kings who had everything- have lost all theirs and someone else takes over. We have seen in our own history.} Those kings- talked about earlier,- now realize that “what is this! Even we have lost everything- and what shall we do now to get back the wealth again?- They think and are told by an ardent devotee of the Lord Sriman Narayanan that only He can help you all. Without Him, nothing can come by mere human efforts. Due to your own karma, that Lord had given you kingdom, and He can grant you again- if you prostrate and pray to Him with unconditional faith. They are now here at your doorstep, with tears rolling down their cheeks incessantly shedding all their ahankara, mamaraaras (I and mine) and are standing with folded hands performing anjali. They are praising your names and are crying for their past arrogance and pride. Like that we are also waiting at your door step crying. Pelase have mercy on us and look at us. Listening to your voice, it does not sound as if you have any sort of kaarpaNyam (helplessness) or reduction of ahambaavam (pride/arrogance)? You say that you all have come like those kings who had lost their kingdoms. – KaNNan appears to have said. We were also arrogant and having ahankara. Who can be eual to us in this world? Which girl can be as blessed as we are? We are the most blessed and most formtunate ones in the world. Our parents and KaNNan’s parenst have handed over KaNNan to us for our own. He has also agreed to do what they had mentioned. So, we will get what we were planning. This is what we had in our minds. That is the ahankaara that we had. Hereafter KaNNan is only ours- we had that mamakara. You now know how much we have been suffering to wake You up for going with You to Yamuna- had You been Sarveshwaran. So why did you say- chief of Nithyasuris (umbarkOmAnE! ParanchudharE! Ulagalandha UtthamanE!- why did you tell all such lies then? Did you think I would be fooled and come with you? – He angered on them. That’s why we made that qualification, KaNNA! Had you been Sarveshwaran- was mentioned by us only to make you get up like this. Bhishma sent thousand of arrows to your friend Arjuna ignoring your presence and your saving him, and then only after 1000s of arrow, You went towards him (Bhsihma) with the chakrA in your hand declaring, “I am not an ordinary human; I am Paradevatha”. Please forgive us. We also just instigated your anger in order to let yourself declare to us. Then proceed- KaNNan said, pleased. Had you not pepned your mouth or left it as we are crying, our hearts would have ached. We have shed our ahankaram, makaram completely and have come to your doorstep. We have bowed down to Your feet, with no other refuge for us- not from other demi gods- that we have fully realized. Also we have come to your paLLikkattu. (bed). It is difficult to get a place on top of your cot; we will stay right beneath at your feet. We will not however stop you from keeping us (whenever you wish) on the cot next to Your divine ThirumEni. Okay. What do you want me to do now?- Tell me. – said KaNNan. Without any hatred for us, without any anger on us, without any indifference to us, without any dislike on us, please open your lovely, large red lotus eyes, slowly towards us, and with those cool merciful glances which can dispel all the sufferings of your devotees then and there, look at us; with those eyes that remove the taapam of Nappinnai; with those eyes that accept the surrender grant mOksham to the saraNagathars (one who surrenders). Simply look at us. That is what we desire for. Then see what that glances do to us for yourself. See for yourself if those glances keep us in this place or lift us to the Other place (Srivaikuntam). Do you think it can lift you all straight to Srivaikuntam? Yes. What is the hurdle then? That’s why we never ask for moKsham. Your eyes which are like the Sun and the Moon appearing together can grant the same by themselves. Without my knowledge they (eyes) can give? Yes. All your angas (parts of the body) without your knowdlege alone grant to the devotees. Alavandhar says: tvadhgrimuddhisya kadhApikEnachith.. ... sakruthkruthOnjali: … na jAthu heeyathE.. Meditating on yout lotus feet if one performs anjali (Saranagathi) to You, your lotus feet through that particlualr anjali does removal of all paapams and grants all sukhams. Without your knowledge when one surrenders to Your lotus feet alone, that grants mOksham to him-. Like that your glances will grants us the same as well. Also you do not take us directly to Srivaikuntam. Adhivaahikars only take us. Among them, the important ones are the Sun and the Moon. They have given abhayam to us- through your two lotus eyes. Those eyes are like those Sun and Moon having just got up. Chandhra Sooryow cha nEthrE.. So, we need not worry. They (those eyes) will take care. Also we will hold onto the lotus feet of those Sun and the Moon who are like Your eyes. Are they not devathantharam? How can you do that? DO not stun us with such queries. Archiraahdi DevathAs are all belonging to NithyasUri Ghoshti – elders say. Muktha: arcchirthina pUrvapaksha: agni- means: there is a NithysaUri who is the abhimAna Devatha of agni. Dhina: the day light. – his abhimAni dEvatha is NithyasUri. Like that all archirAdhi devathas are NithyasUris. Hence, they are blemishless. Nothing wrong holding onto the feet of those NithyasUris. They are your eyes as well. Hence there is no devAthAntharam here. Whatever it is, please look at us now. Then only you will see for yourself, how these poor girls cry and wait for your darshan. Also we know that your eyes have anger and mercy as well simultaneously. If you see with those two eyes, all our enemies will get destroyed and grants us good until final bliss (mOksha paryantham). We know of your greatness and your eyes greatness. You simply looked at those dead cattle at the pond (of Kaalingan) and they got up alive. You are GopAlan. Is there any life for us- if you have your eyes closed? Please open them and look at us. Listening to them, He got up. Please read from vidwAns' commentaries about other greater details- Srimath Azhagiya singar ends with such great humility. Sri Andal ThiruvaDigaLE SaraNam ***************************************************** anything good - the credit goes to the divine commentary of SrI Mukkur Azhagiya Singar's. Errors, faults are only due to my lack of understanding. Regards dAsan Anand --- Srinath Venkatakrishnan <srinath_venkatakrishnan wrote: > > Dear SriVaishnavaites, > > > > Iam regularly watching the Thirupavai upanyasam in > both Jaya TV (Sthalasayanam Swami)and DD (Velukudi > Krishnan Swami)at Chennai. > > > > While explaining about the phrase “engaL mEl saapam > izhinthu” of 22nd Pasuram, (angaNmaa), they said > that saapam will come when we do not worship the > lord. > > > > I feel that Sin(paapam) and Curse (saapam) are > different. One can accumulate Sin (paapam) due to > intentional or unintentional actions. Sometimes we > do actions thinking that they are good but will end > up otherway. > > > > But Curse is based on specific adharmic act. So here > why Kothapiratti mentioned as “engaL mEl saapam”?. > As she herself says “puNNiyam yaamudaiyOm” in 28th > pasuram, so how we can fit the saapam here? And > moreover when we refer Valmiki Ramayanam, we see > that there is no rishi or maharishi worshipping Lord > rama when he was wandering in the forest. But on the > otherway, we see that Lord Rama goes to each and > every Rishi and pays his respects. So if saapam can > come to people who did not worship lord, will that > not be applicable to the rishis of ramanyanam. > > > > I do not have contacts of these upanyasakas here. > Hence can anyone clarify and enlighten me? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Srinath > > > > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" > Sweepstakes > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes./signingbonus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2004 Report Share Posted January 16, 2004 Dear Shri Srinath, Sri GodA's tiruppAvai is a master piece of entire nAlAyiram. Our AchAryAs have bestowed on us various vyAkyAnams. One such describes that tiruppAvai explains Artha Pancakam ie. Five points 1) What is the nature of Paramatma 2) What is the nature of Jivatma 3) What are the ways to attain salvation 4) What do we enjoy upon salvation 5) what are the hindrances in attaining salvation. The first 5 verses describes the nature of paramatma who has five forms namely para (vaikunta nathan), vyuha (ksherrabdi - parkadal nathan), antaryami (our inner dweller), vibhava (avatar like vamanan) and archa (srirangam, kancheepuram etc). The next 10 verses describes jivatma who has slept forgetting our spiritual duties and association with the Lord. That's where AndAL awakens them up. The next 5 verses describes ways to attain salvation (vAyinAl padi, manathinAl sindithu, thooya malar thoovi thozhudu). Another 5 verses describe the obstacles in attaining salvation and the last 2 describes the anubhavam of salvation (ettraikkum ezh ezh piravikkum - kaimkaryam). In this pasuram (amkaN ma), AndAL requests "sabham izhidal" from God. sAbham are sins done by this jIvAtma during thousands of previous births due to ignorance and which are forced upon the jIvAtmAs. And those sins are the one which blocks us from getting attached with the god. Moreover, AndAL did not had the grace to be present when Krishna was there in gokulam and aaypadi. Also, she refers here to the great kings who have shed their ego as kings and have come and sat near your throne. AndAL has no such ego, hence Swamy Periyavachan Pillai questions himself "what abimanam AndAL has to shed" ? Until now, she was waiting for Lord to come and marry her as it is not customary for girls to go to the boy's house. Now, after realising this eternal union with Lord, she has shed even that abimAnam. Sabham word refers to "not deserving". One of the Lord's kalyana guna is "sowhartam or nirhetuka krupa". Upon a bakthas sincere prayers, he wipes out our "disqualification". In the other verse where she mentions "punniyam yam udayom". If you refer to earlier words "unthannai piravi perunthanai", she says we have not accumulated "punniyam". Having yourself born in our aayar kulam, we are blessed with punniyam. Since you have chosen to born in our idayar kulam, we are blessed. Similarly, nammAzhwar prays to Lord "ozhivil kala mellam udanAi manni vazhuvilla adimai seyya vendum". Azhwar requests that he wants to do unblemished kaimkaryam to Lord in the past, present and future. The Lord gets stunned and ask Azhwar that it is reasonable to ask in present and future, how I can change your past ? Lord Rama while returning with piratti from Lanka says "I lost you for 10 months and got you back, I can even bring back Ravana after killing him (bless him with good birth if he realises his mistake), but I can't bring back the lost 10 months, where I missed you". The Lord who dictates kalam himself says "I can't change the past or lost time". Azhwar says I don't want the time which has past. I want the past deeds not to dictate me now or forget that in the past, I was not in the nitya kaimkaryam to the Lord. Even so many of us, after getting involved in the amrutham of kaimkaryam or pooja, laments that we had lost so many years of this service. Even when we wanted, something had blocked us from doing that's the sApam, what AndAL says when you look on us with both of your eyes as sun and moon (sun removes darkness or ignorance and moon provides coolness or mayar vara mathi nalam), all our sabham are destroyed. I hope other learned baghavatas in this list will provide more explanation. namO nArAyanA G. Sundarrajan - "Srinath Venkatakrishnan" <srinath_venkatakrishnan <ramanuja>; <>; <> Monday, January 12, 2004 5:49 PM One more Doubt on Tirupaavai Dear SriVaishnavaites, Iam regularly watching the Thirupavai upanyasam in both Jaya TV (Sthalasayanam Swami)and DD (Velukudi Krishnan Swami)at Chennai. While explaining about the phrase "engaL mEl saapam izhinthu" of 22nd Pasuram, (angaNmaa), they said that saapam will come when we do not worship the lord. I feel that Sin(paapam) and Curse (saapam) are different. One can accumulate Sin (paapam) due to intentional or unintentional actions. Sometimes we do actions thinking that they are good but will end up otherway. But Curse is based on specific adharmic act. So here why Kothapiratti mentioned as "engaL mEl saapam"?. As she herself says "puNNiyam yaamudaiyOm" in 28th pasuram, so how we can fit the saapam here? And moreover when we refer Valmiki Ramayanam, we see that there is no rishi or maharishi worshipping Lord rama when he was wandering in the forest. But on the otherway, we see that Lord Rama goes to each and every Rishi and pays his respects. So if saapam can come to people who did not worship lord, will that not be applicable to the rishis of ramanyanam. I do not have contacts of these upanyasakas here. Hence can anyone clarify and enlighten me? Thanks, Srinath Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes / Your Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 hi everybody , i have now listened to all 30 day thiru pavai upanyasam held in Bangalore sripuram by H.H srimad andavan , which was amazing and fantastic i have made CDs of his upanyasams. anybody wants please send me your address, 1 CD 150Rs ========================================================================= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2004 Report Share Posted January 21, 2004 Adiyen thank you for all your concerns regarding the CD i will send to all of you who ever has sent me the address by courier, Probably by Mid feb you all will receive the CDs , as i am going to bombay for my project work, i will send you all as soon as i come. These CDs recorded when the acharyan was giving discourse. And i am taking only the operating cost. hi everybody , i have now listened to all 30 day thiru pavai upanyasam held in Bangalore sripuram by H.H srimad andavan , which was amazing and fantastic i have made CDs of his upanyasams. anybody wants please send me your address, 1 CD 150Rs ================================================================================\ ================================================================= / Your India Mobile: Ringtones, Wallpapers, Picture Messages and more.Download now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2004 Report Share Posted January 22, 2004 adiyen, this is 1 CD of 30 hr upanyasam it is in mp3 and cost is 150+courier charge All of you will receive the CD when i come from bombay if possible please mail the cheque of 200(150 for CD+50 for courier) named as hema.v for the following address 6,6th main bull temple 'a' cross chamarajpet blore-18 ph:- 6508490 This would be convenient for me to process the CDs to you all at earliest Thank you. Otherwise also, i will send the CD, then you can send the money Who ever is sending the money before they get CD please mail me if i dont receive any mail, i will arrange for CDs to be dispatched, on receiving you can pay me. Put sub:- of mail as "paying the amount" Thank you Santhanam <rs1936 wrote: swamin, this is further to my mail of yester date. i wld like to know as to how many cds this upanyasam by srimad andavan swami on tiruppavai was recorded and also the total cost that may bea involved. is there any possibility that this may be available in mP3 format and if what is the cost? i request swamin to inform me these details before despatching the cds. thanking u, adiyen dasan, santhanam. On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 hema kasturi wrote : >Adiyen >thank you for all your concerns regarding the CD i will send to all of you who ever has sent me the address by courier, Probably by Mid feb you all will receive the CDs , as i am going to bombay for my project work, i will send you all as soon as i come. These CDs recorded when the acharyan was giving discourse. >And i am taking only the operating cost. > > > >hi everybody , >i have now listened to all 30 day thiru pavai upanyasam held in Bangalore sripuram by H.H srimad andavan , which was amazing and fantastic >i have made CDs of his upanyasams. >anybody wants please send me your address, >1 CD 150Rs >===============================================================================\ ================================================================== Links > > >/ > > > > >Your > > > > India Mobile: Ringtones, Wallpapers, Picture Messages and more.Download now. > Links > > > / > > > > >Your > > > i India Mobile: Ringtones, Wallpapers, Picture Messages and more.Download now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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