Devi Bhava/ Ekadashi mishap

July 19, 2005

I am bummed out. Yesterday (Monday), Ammachi was in

Noo Yawk to give darshan, perform a Puja, and take on

her Devi Bhava. I was intending to go, and in

preparation had been eating vegetarian for the last

few days. I read somewhere that Amma said, "I love my

Western devotees, but am upset that so many of them

smell like meat-eaters." I figured a few days of

careful eating would prevent my carnivorous stench :-)

and help raise my consciousness. Monday afternoon I

ordered a lunch of Chinese eggplant in garlic sauce,

which I ate hungrily with lots of white rice. Then,

about an hour before I was supposed to leave home, I

was struck with an intestinal upset of explosive

proportions! Ugh, was I a mess! Naturally, I

cancelled my ride and stayed home near the bathroom.

At home and depressed that I would miss this year's

chance to see Amma, I surfed the Web and found an

astrological Panchanga which informed me that Monday

was an Ekadashi day, the eleventh night after the New

Moon, observed as a fasting day by Vaishnavas. Not

only had I NOT fasted, the foods I ate were all

explicitly forbidden to eat on Ekadashi -- rice,

garlic, and eggplant. I am not a Vaishnava, but it

seemed strange that this breaking of dietary

restrictions coincided with my toilet adventure. (A

note said that Lord Brahma put a curse on all rice

grains eaten on Ekadashi, that they would explode in

the devotee's stomach.)

Today I spoke to a couple of my Wiccan friends who did

manage to get downtown to see Ammachi on Monday.

Karen's darshan was particularly moving. When Amma

hugged her and blessed a bracelet, she put it on

Karen's wrist, saying in English, "from Mother to

Daughter." At that moment, Karen says she got a vivid

loving image of her own biological mother, dead for

several years, and could smell her mother's perfume

scent.

Karen was concerned that I didn't have Amma's

comforting hug, since my father had passed away less

than a month ago. And it occurred to me -- don't some

Hindus avoid performing Pujas or taking darshan of

their Guru for a period (ranging from 11 days to a

whole year) after the death of a parent?

I intend to light a candle this Thursday to honor

Ammachi, and celebrate Guru Purnima. For whatever

reason, I was prevented from meeting my Guru this

year, but I still keep her image cherished in my

heart.

Om amriteshvariye namaha

-- Len/ Kalipadma

__

Start your day with - make it your home page

http://www./r/hs

July 20, 2005

Namste,

This is another email which I think I would like to reply.Looking at your

id i Guess you are a Hindu who Like the Goddess. I too am a Hindu and I adore

Mookambika Devi as my Mother.

Your experiences below shows that you are showered with Gods Blessings and the

God just wants to awaken you to your true identity. Firstly you should try to be

a vegy in future not at the moment for you are still young. Time will tell you

when. Secondly what you had experienced is a true experience with Amma.

I would like to tell you few things openly. Firstly when you visit a Guru never

keep pain or thought in Mind for you see a Guru can sence your Pain immediately

for they can read our Mind and Pain for the past days. Predicitions are True s

well why? For they can assume things to a lot of extent knowing our pain.

If you want the Guru to tell you things about yourself NEver keep your mind

full of thoughts keep it empty and then see if Guru can tell you what is it that

you have in mind.Believe me they will never even Mind you. Weekness is their

target.

Sorry to hear about your Parents. Never loose hope for your parents are not with

you in Presence but remember they are there watching us and Guiding us no matter

what we feel they are there. I talk to Spirits on and off I know they exsists

and that they belong to another country their pain is so more than us for they

cannot visit their Family but only others.

If you wish to reply please do so.

Pranam,

babitha

July 20, 2005

Dear Lenji.

Namaste. I hope you feel better. I am going to suggest that you should become

strictly vegetarian, not because i belong to the "Catholicism of Hinduism" as a

Vaishnava (just joking! - as of course you know Vaishnavas are known for

orthodoxy with certain issues). I am nevertheless suggesting this because you

are a shakti devotee partaking in Sri Chakra worship and such, which requires

alot of purity of body, mind, and speech. Thus to be a complete vegetarian would

be ideal.

Om & Prem

Janardana Dasa

July 20, 2005

, Janardana Dasa

<lightdweller> wrote:

> Dear Lenji.

>

> Namaste. I hope you feel better. I am going to suggest that you

should become strictly vegetarian, not because i belong to

the "Catholicism of Hinduism" as a Vaishnava (just joking! - as of

course you know Vaishnavas are known for orthodoxy with certain

issues). I am nevertheless suggesting this because you are a shakti

devotee partaking in Sri Chakra worship and such, which requires

alot of purity of body, mind, and speech. Thus to be a complete

vegetarian would be ideal.

>

> Om & Prem

>

> Janardana Dasa

When you really love HER as you would love your lover. Accepting HER

as what SHE is. Thinking about HER at all times. Seeing HER all

around you: your mind, body and soul is already purified. Love is

the main ingredients here. What does that got to do with food!

July 20, 2005

Namaste Kalipadma,

Amma hugs lepers and all kinds of ill folks who need what she's

dispensing. If she is not able to tolerate the smell of meat-eaters,

she must not be able to tolerate most animals and humans the world

over. Amma herself has eaten meat, having been fed fish by birds (I

have read).

This past June's visit by Amma, I also chose not to eat meat for

several days out of respect for Amma's traditions. But one must honor

one's own traditions, also. I think DB posted a quote from the Dalai

Lama on this list recently that said exactly that - to make

pilgrimages of other religions, but to honor one's own as well. I

feel that this is what one's relationship with the guru teaches - not

just how to honor the guru's traditions,

but how to honor oneself while honoring each person one meets. I'm

sure there's always some source material you can go to that will

reinforce whatever view you are subscribing to at any given point in

time, but ultimately, it's about compassion, acceptance, love. I am

sorry you missed Amma's physical embrace this year, but I'm sure you

still received Her Grace.

Mary Ann

, "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

wrote:

> , Janardana Dasa

> <lightdweller> wrote:

> > Dear Lenji.

> >

> > Namaste. I hope you feel better. I am going to suggest that you

> should become strictly vegetarian, not because i belong to

> the "Catholicism of Hinduism" as a Vaishnava (just joking! - as of

> course you know Vaishnavas are known for orthodoxy with certain

> issues). I am nevertheless suggesting this because you are a

shakti

> devotee partaking in Sri Chakra worship and such, which requires

> alot of purity of body, mind, and speech. Thus to be a complete

> vegetarian would be ideal.

> >

> > Om & Prem

> >

> > Janardana Dasa

>

> When you really love HER as you would love your lover. Accepting

HER

> as what SHE is. Thinking about HER at all times. Seeing HER all

> around you: your mind, body and soul is already purified. Love is

> the main ingredients here. What does that got to do with food!

July 20, 2005

Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The keyword is ideal.

You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to do with devotion to HER.

God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta devotees in Bengal eat fish or goat.

Cheers,

Janardana Dasa

July 20, 2005

, Janardana Dasa

<lightdweller> wrote:

> Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The keyword

is ideal. You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to do with

devotion to HER. God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta devotees

in Bengal eat fish or goat.

>

> Cheers,

>

> Janardana Dasa

.... And indeed non vegetarian too is IDEAL. My keyword too is Ideal,

which I find questionable.

July 20, 2005

To each his own.

Om & Prem

Janardana Dasa

July 20, 2005

Actually to not eat food at all is IDEAL (LOL, but only half

joking)...if you can manage to stay alive!!

-yogaman

, "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

wrote:

> , Janardana Dasa

> <lightdweller> wrote:

> > Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The keyword

> is ideal. You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to do

with

> devotion to HER. God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta

devotees

> in Bengal eat fish or goat.

> >

> > Cheers,

> >

> > Janardana Dasa

>

> ... And indeed non vegetarian too is IDEAL. My keyword too is Ideal,

> which I find questionable.

July 21, 2005

--- Mary Ann <buttercookie61 wrote:

> Namaste Kalipadma,

>

> Amma hugs lepers and all kinds of ill folks who need

> what she's

> dispensing. If she is not able to tolerate the smell

> of meat-eaters,

> she must not be able to tolerate most animals and

> humans the world

> over. Amma herself has eaten meat, having been fed

> fish by birds (I

> have read).

Of course. Amma was born amongst fisher-folk in

Kerala. I'm sure she ate fish in her youth, cooked by

her mother if not offered by birds.

>

> This past June's visit by Amma, I also chose not to

> eat meat for

> several days out of respect for Amma's traditions.

> But one must honor

> one's own traditions, also.

You, too, eh? I admit that when I've been eating

vegetarian food, I feel lighter, and my "psychic

senses" (if that's what you'd call them) become

sharper. It is said that the Witches of Europe would

go on a "white fast" periodically, avoiding all meat

and flesh-derived foods, to sharpen their magickal or

psychic skills.

I'm not certain what "my own traditions" are, exactly.

My parents were Jewish, but never in my memory kept a

Kosher kitchen. My body regularly rejects beef and

turkey (should I by accident eat these) by responding

with a gout attack. Non-Kosher foods like pork and

shrimp don't seem to negatively affect me (and I'm

fond of them, though don't over-do).

And of course, my intestinal adventure occurred after

several days of vegetarian eating. A cleansing

crisis? Or Lord Brahma's Ekadashi curse? Who knows.

> I think DB posted a

> quote from the Dalai

> Lama on this list recently that said exactly that -

> to make

> pilgrimages of other religions, but to honor one's

> own as well. I

> feel that this is what one's relationship with the

> guru teaches - not

> just how to honor the guru's traditions,

>

> but how to honor oneself while honoring each person

> one meets.

Tibetans are one of the exceptions to the general

Buddhist tendancies towards vegetarianism. It gets

COLD in Tibet, and bodies crave animal fats for

internal heating. Also, there are fewer options for

varied and delicious plant-derived foods in Tibet.

The Tibetan Buddhists still practice <ahimsa>, insofar

as they hire non-Buddhists to act as butchers for

their flesh-derived food.

> I'm

> sure there's always some source material you can go

> to that will

> reinforce whatever view you are subscribing to at

> any given point in

> time, but ultimately, it's about compassion,

> acceptance, love. I am

> sorry you missed Amma's physical embrace this year,

> but I'm sure you

> still received Her Grace.

I agree, Mary Ann, I agree.

-- Len/ Kalipadma

__

Start your day with - make it your home page

http://www./r/hs

July 21, 2005

actually John the baptist survived on Honey and locusts.

childofdevi <childofdevi wrote:Actually to not eat food at all is

IDEAL (LOL, but only half

joking)...if you can manage to stay alive!!

-yogaman

, "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

wrote:

> , Janardana Dasa

> <lightdweller> wrote:

> > Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The keyword

> is ideal. You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to do

with

> devotion to HER. God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta

devotees

> in Bengal eat fish or goat.

> >

> > Cheers,

> >

> > Janardana Dasa

>

> ... And indeed non vegetarian too is IDEAL. My keyword too is Ideal,

> which I find questionable.

Beliefs of hinduism Sri chakra Traditions Divine

Visit your group "" on the web.

July 21, 2005

, Len Rosenberg

<kalipadma108> wrote:

>

> Tibetans are one of the exceptions to the general

> Buddhist tendancies towards vegetarianism. It gets

> COLD in Tibet, and bodies crave animal fats for

> internal heating. Also, there are fewer options for

> varied and delicious plant-derived foods in Tibet.

> The Tibetan Buddhists still practice <ahimsa>, insofar

> as they hire non-Buddhists to act as butchers for

> their flesh-derived food.

>

> -- Len/ Kalipadma

Len,

Not all Buddhists are vegetarian. Chinese tended to eat veg because

they were directly impacted by Bodhidharma's presence (the reason is

a guess only), but Thai, Vietnam and Japanese buddhists are

generally meat-eaters also.

Sorry to hear you missed the darshan with Amma.... especially so

because of your father's demise and that you would have liked to see

her. anyway, all for the best.....

regards.

July 21, 2005

Well said, Nora. Thank you for this.

, "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

wrote:

>

> When you really love HER as you would love your lover. Accepting HER

> as what SHE is. Thinking about HER at all times. Seeing HER all

> around you: your mind, body and soul is already purified. Love is

> the main ingredients here. What does that got to do with food!

July 21, 2005

Hm, where can we find good locusts this time of year? Are locusts

grasshoppers, BTW? Was Quay Chang Cain a Buddhist?

, sankara menon <kochu1tz>

wrote:

>

> actually John the baptist survived on Honey and locusts.

> childofdevi <childofdevi> wrote:Actually to not eat food at

all is IDEAL (LOL, but only half

> joking)...if you can manage to stay alive!!

>

> -yogaman

>

> , "NMadasamy"

<nmadasamy@s...>

> wrote:

> > , Janardana Dasa

> > <lightdweller> wrote:

> > > Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The

keyword

> > is ideal. You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to

do

> with

> > devotion to HER. God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta

> devotees

> > in Bengal eat fish or goat.

> > >

> > > Cheers,

> > >

> > > Janardana Dasa

> >

> > ... And indeed non vegetarian too is IDEAL. My keyword too is

Ideal,

> > which I find questionable.

>

> Beliefs of hinduism Sri chakra Traditions Divine

>

> Visit your group "" on the web.

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

July 21, 2005

It's not important for this conversation, but the "locusts" in this

reference are locust bean, or carob bean/fruit, also known as "St.

John's Bread." It's my understanding that carob beans were a

traditional animal food and famine food in Biblical times.

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/carob.html

, sankara menon <kochu1tz>

wrote:

>

> actually John the baptist survived on Honey and locusts.

July 21, 2005

Thanks for the clarification I was making jokes, actually, but I

didn't know that about carob bean.

, "msbauju" <msbauju> wrote:

>

> It's not important for this conversation, but the "locusts" in this

> reference are locust bean, or carob bean/fruit, also known as "St.

> John's Bread." It's my understanding that carob beans were a

> traditional animal food and famine food in Biblical times.

>

> http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/carob.html

>

> , sankara menon <kochu1tz>

> wrote:

> >

> > actually John the baptist survived on Honey and locusts.

July 21, 2005

"survived on honey and locusts"?? hmmm....it sounds very nourishing

to me (dont ask me to eat it though LOL).

Mary Ann: come to Seattle and get them, there are some locusts like

creatures here (they could be cockroaches though, but locusts,

cockroaches.. all the same LOL). I would have shipped you some were

it not for the fact that I dont like to kill them.

Janardana Dasa: Well said, to each his/her own ideal. There is some

himsa involved in eating plants or animals. So the best eating habit

from the standpoint of ahimsa is not to eat at all. After all, food

like sex is only a disposable habit.....

-yogaman

, sankara menon <kochu1tz>

wrote:

>

> actually John the baptist survived on Honey and locusts.

> childofdevi <childofdevi> wrote:Actually to not eat food at

all is IDEAL (LOL, but only half

> joking)...if you can manage to stay alive!!

>

> -yogaman

>

> , "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

> wrote:

> > , Janardana Dasa

> > <lightdweller> wrote:

> > > Respectfully, i said: thus, to be vegetarian IS IDEAL. The

keyword

> > is ideal. You're absolutely correct: Food has got nothing to do

> with

> > devotion to HER. God only knows how many Vaishnava or Shakta

> devotees

> > in Bengal eat fish or goat.

> > >

> > > Cheers,

> > >

> > > Janardana Dasa

> >

> > ... And indeed non vegetarian too is IDEAL. My keyword too is

Ideal,

> > which I find questionable.

>

> Beliefs of hinduism Sri chakra Traditions Divine

>

> Visit your group "" on the web.

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

July 21, 2005

childofdevi wrote: Janardana Dasa: Well said, to each his/her own

ideal. There is some himsa involved in eating plants or animals. So

the best eating habit from the standpoint of ahimsa is not to eat at

all. After all, food like sex is only a disposable habit.....

hmmmmmmm I beg to differ on this. Not eating is like denying your

body the basic nutrition it needs. It is like torturing your body.

Its also a suicide. From my perspective, that is also not good. Your

body is a sacred temple where you need to take care like your own

home or your pooja room. Neglecting your body, is neglecting the

Divine. I know of a wise man who just consume banana and milk.

My take is this, no harm in eating what you like weather meat or

plants. Being vegetarian or nonvegetarian to me is not the issue.

The issue it to get ourself attach to the act of "eating". Some

people are obsess with food. They will go or do anything to get

their favourite food but will not put an effort to do something in

spiritual aspect. You live to eat or eat to live?

My husband and me choose to consume more vegetable not because of

religious reason, but health. We have aged and as such our

metabolism and our way of living too have changed. As such it is

just practical to change our dietary habit. But when we go back and

stay with our inlaws [ who are nonvegetarian ] we eat whatever they

cook. Why? because we do not want to trouble them. We learn to

adjust ourselves to the situation. And we do not want to hurt their

feelings as you know sometimes how mother-in-laws are. So the main

reason here is that : not to cause inconvenience and hurt another

person's feeling. For to us which ever way, we are okay. If we stay

in a vegetarian home for a month, we eat whatever being offered, and

we will still be okay. If meat being offered, you take it. And it is

still okay with us. Consume not because we enjoy, but we do not want

to hurt the feelings of the person offering it. We would not even

tell the person about it for it will cause such inconvenience for

them.

July 21, 2005

If Saint John ate carob, he was a vegetarian. If he

ate locust grasshoppers, he was a carnivore. (Since

he ate honey, he was not a Vegan. I am amazed at the

number of Westerners who assume that Hindu vegetarians

are Vegan, and become upset to find veggie Hindu

cuisine includes honey and lots of milk products!)

-- Len/ Kalipadma

--- msbauju <msbauju wrote:

>

> It's not important for this conversation, but the

> "locusts" in this

> reference are locust bean, or carob bean/fruit, also

> known as "St.

> John's Bread." It's my understanding that carob

> beans were a

> traditional animal food and famine food in Biblical

> times.

>

> http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/carob.html

>

> , sankara menon

> <kochu1tz>

> wrote:

> >

> > actually John the baptist survived on Honey and

> locusts.

>

July 22, 2005

Nora:

I think we are in complete agreement. Eat if you cannot do otherwise,

do not eat if you can manage without eating (and dying LOL)... of

course this is not meant for all. See

http://www.fruitnut.net/index2.htm?PAG=25BreathGiri,REF=

-yogaman

, "NMadasamy" <nmadasamy@s...>

wrote:

> childofdevi wrote: Janardana Dasa: Well said, to each his/her own

> ideal. There is some himsa involved in eating plants or animals. So

> the best eating habit from the standpoint of ahimsa is not to eat

at

> all. After all, food like sex is only a disposable habit.....

>

> hmmmmmmm I beg to differ on this. Not eating is like denying your

> body the basic nutrition it needs. It is like torturing your body.

> Its also a suicide. From my perspective, that is also not good.

Your

> body is a sacred temple where you need to take care like your own

> home or your pooja room. Neglecting your body, is neglecting the

> Divine. I know of a wise man who just consume banana and milk.

>

> My take is this, no harm in eating what you like weather meat or

> plants. Being vegetarian or nonvegetarian to me is not the issue.

> The issue it to get ourself attach to the act of "eating". Some

> people are obsess with food. They will go or do anything to get

> their favourite food but will not put an effort to do something in

> spiritual aspect. You live to eat or eat to live?

>

> My husband and me choose to consume more vegetable not because of

> religious reason, but health. We have aged and as such our

> metabolism and our way of living too have changed. As such it is

> just practical to change our dietary habit. But when we go back and

> stay with our inlaws [ who are nonvegetarian ] we eat whatever they

> cook. Why? because we do not want to trouble them. We learn to

> adjust ourselves to the situation. And we do not want to hurt their

> feelings as you know sometimes how mother-in-laws are. So the main

> reason here is that : not to cause inconvenience and hurt another

> person's feeling. For to us which ever way, we are okay. If we stay

> in a vegetarian home for a month, we eat whatever being offered,

and

> we will still be okay. If meat being offered, you take it. And it

is

> still okay with us. Consume not because we enjoy, but we do not

want

> to hurt the feelings of the person offering it. We would not even

> tell the person about it for it will cause such inconvenience for

> them.

July 22, 2005

Of course there is Bala and ati bala referred to in Ramayana

childofdevi <childofdevi wrote:Nora: