Buddhism and Hinduism

June 13, 2004

Namaste All:

Yesterday in the bookstore I saw a book called Yoga and

Mindfulness. Apparently, it's a "new" concept to bring yoga and

mindfulness together. The book came out in April 2004. My

experience of yoga is that the more I practice, the more mindful I

can become. In Iyengar yoga classes, so much attention is

placed on correct alignment, the point being to align the body so

that gravity is working with you, not against you. This brings

about the conditions that create space for mindfulness to

blossom. I have noticed that the yoga classes I attend most

regularly have not directly addressed the spiritual aspects of

yoga, and that I am still developing my own awareness in this

area, despite the fact that the teachers are not instructing in that

area. This is why I appreciated Machig Lapdron's comment that

she is not the teacher, and a student needs to trust her/his

innate wisdom. I have also noticed that teachers that attempt to

address the spiritual aspects are not generally that good at

addressing the physical aspects, or do not have a sense of how

these aspects actually work together.

I have been reading Thich Nhat Hanh, as you can tell if you've

been reading my posts of late. That is how I came across this

book; he wrote the forward, and the book was on the shelf where

his books are kept at the store I visited yesterday. Here is what

the publisher is saying about this book. If anyone has any

comments about Buddhism and Hinduism, I would be

interested in hearing/reading them. I have been wondering how

Thich Nhat Hanh's work would be seen by Hindus, or by

members of this group. For me, it fits right in with why I am a

member of this group.

".... Relating the Indian sage Patanjali's teachings on yoga to

Buddhist teachings, the author invites practitioners of yoga and

meditation to experience yoga's asanas, or poses, as occasions

for mindfulness meditation. This relationship is both novel and

logical. Buddhism grew from Hindu-yoga roots, and yoga,

certainly as understood in America, could use a greater

appreciation of its spiritual significance. Following a discussion

of Buddhist teachings grounded on some central discourses

(sutras) and heavily indebted to Vietnamese Zen monk Thich

Nhat Hanh, who supplies a foreword, Boccio provides four

sequences of poses. The sequences generally repeat poses

but are intended to lead the student to new understandings of

those poses, thus encouraging growth in the discipline of yoga.

..... Because this book tries to do so much, it's not for beginning

yoga students or meditators, but those with established

practices may benefit from seeing the postures in a surprising

and more spiritual light."

Reed Business Information, a division of Reed

Yoga Journal, April 2004

"EDITOR'S CHOICE! Boccio shows that Buddhist practice is

itself a form of yoga, presenting a meditational approach to

asana practice."

Mary Ann

June 13, 2004

There's a fiction by Bhagwan Gidwani "The return of the aryans"

which i have not read completely but the first few chapters. But in

it he mentions somethings which i completely agree to. If everyone

who went to the forest for deep meditation and spiritual life and

who got enlightened came back and started their own religion, there

would be thousands of religions in the Indian sub-continent.

Fortunately many of the people who started their journey to the

divine origin and found the divine fountain, found them similar and

they spread their knowledge. Now there were some who found their

divine fountain different and started whole new movements, one of

them was budha.

Budhism and shakti sadhana are too entirely different systems, the

former atheistic and the latter centered in beliefs of existence of

numerous devas/devis/gods. If someone claims mindfulness as

something new it shows how much wise they are.

I never read budhist books except skim through them. Using mind as a

tool to overcome the veiling mind is something which does not strike

me as time well spend!.

, "Mary Ann" <maryann@m...>

wrote:

> Namaste All:

>

> Yesterday in the bookstore I saw a book called Yoga and

> Mindfulness. Apparently, it's a "new" concept to bring yoga and

> mindfulness together. The book came out in April 2004. My

> experience of yoga is that the more I practice, the more mindful I

> can become. In Iyengar yoga classes, so much attention is

> placed on correct alignment, the point being to align the body so

> that gravity is working with you, not against you. This brings

> about the conditions that create space for mindfulness to

> blossom. I have noticed that the yoga classes I attend most

> regularly have not directly addressed the spiritual aspects of

> yoga, and that I am still developing my own awareness in this

> area, despite the fact that the teachers are not instructing in

that

> area. This is why I appreciated Machig Lapdron's comment that

> she is not the teacher, and a student needs to trust her/his

> innate wisdom. I have also noticed that teachers that attempt to

> address the spiritual aspects are not generally that good at

> addressing the physical aspects, or do not have a sense of how

> these aspects actually work together.

>

> I have been reading Thich Nhat Hanh, as you can tell if you've

> been reading my posts of late. That is how I came across this

> book; he wrote the forward, and the book was on the shelf where

> his books are kept at the store I visited yesterday. Here is what

> the publisher is saying about this book. If anyone has any

> comments about Buddhism and Hinduism, I would be

> interested in hearing/reading them. I have been wondering how

> Thich Nhat Hanh's work would be seen by Hindus, or by

> members of this group. For me, it fits right in with why I am a

> member of this group.

>

> ".... Relating the Indian sage Patanjali's teachings on yoga to

> Buddhist teachings, the author invites practitioners of yoga and

> meditation to experience yoga's asanas, or poses, as occasions

> for mindfulness meditation. This relationship is both novel and

> logical. Buddhism grew from Hindu-yoga roots, and yoga,

> certainly as understood in America, could use a greater

> appreciation of its spiritual significance. Following a discussion

> of Buddhist teachings grounded on some central discourses

> (sutras) and heavily indebted to Vietnamese Zen monk Thich

> Nhat Hanh, who supplies a foreword, Boccio provides four

> sequences of poses. The sequences generally repeat poses

> but are intended to lead the student to new understandings of

> those poses, thus encouraging growth in the discipline of yoga.

> .... Because this book tries to do so much, it's not for beginning

> yoga students or meditators, but those with established

> practices may benefit from seeing the postures in a surprising

> and more spiritual light."

> Reed Business Information, a division of Reed

> Yoga Journal, April 2004

> "EDITOR'S CHOICE! Boccio shows that Buddhist practice is

> itself a form of yoga, presenting a meditational approach to

> asana practice."

>

> Mary Ann

June 13, 2004

I appreciate your comments. There are teachings from Indian

masters/gurus that say the mind is the Self. Muktananda, in his

book Meditate, says this: "[Trouble] happens when we try to

subdue the mind forcibly in meditation. Instead of worrying about

the thoughts of the mind, instead of trying to erase the thoughts

from the mind, it would be much better if we tried to understand

the nature of mind. What is the mind? The mind has no

independent existence. The Upanishads say that the Self has

itself become the mind. The mind is nothing but a contracted

form of the supreme Consciousness that has created the

Universe."

I feel this is a user-friendly approach to the mind and meditation.

I also feel this is in keeping with the Buddhist practice of

mindfulness (at least, from what I have read in Thich Nhat

Hanh), which is about tuning into the breath so that breath and

body are united, which calms the mind, re-establishing the

harmony of unity between self and Self, so that our emotions and

thoughts do not wreak havoc on ourselves, others, and the

world.

Maybe different systems, but not opposing (unless someone

wants them to be). An ishtadevata is a symbol - a focal point for

one's meditation and development. Buddhists use sounds like a

bell as a focal point; Hindus a mantra.

Mary Ann

, "malyavan_tibet"

<malyavan_tibet> wrote:

> There's a fiction by Bhagwan Gidwani "The return of the

aryans"

> which i have not read completely but the first few chapters. But

in

> it he mentions somethings which i completely agree to. If

everyone

> who went to the forest for deep meditation and spiritual life and

> who got enlightened came back and started their own religion,

there

> would be thousands of religions in the Indian sub-continent.

> Fortunately many of the people who started their journey to the

> divine origin and found the divine fountain, found them similar

and

> they spread their knowledge. Now there were some who

found their

> divine fountain different and started whole new movements,

one of

> them was budha.

>

> Budhism and shakti sadhana are too entirely different

systems, the

> former atheistic and the latter centered in beliefs of existence

of

> numerous devas/devis/gods. If someone claims mindfulness

as

> something new it shows how much wise they are.

>

> I never read budhist books except skim through them. Using

mind as a

> tool to overcome the veiling mind is something which does not

strike

> me as time well spend!.

>

> , "Mary Ann"

<maryann@m...>

> wrote:

> > Namaste All:

> >

> > Yesterday in the bookstore I saw a book called Yoga and

> > Mindfulness. Apparently, it's a "new" concept to bring yoga

and

> > mindfulness together. The book came out in April 2004. My

> > experience of yoga is that the more I practice, the more

mindful I

> > can become. In Iyengar yoga classes, so much attention is

> > placed on correct alignment, the point being to align the body

so

> > that gravity is working with you, not against you. This brings

> > about the conditions that create space for mindfulness to

> > blossom. I have noticed that the yoga classes I attend most

> > regularly have not directly addressed the spiritual aspects of

> > yoga, and that I am still developing my own awareness in

this

> > area, despite the fact that the teachers are not instructing in

> that

> > area. This is why I appreciated Machig Lapdron's comment

that

> > she is not the teacher, and a student needs to trust her/his

> > innate wisdom. I have also noticed that teachers that attempt

to

> > address the spiritual aspects are not generally that good at

> > addressing the physical aspects, or do not have a sense of

how

> > these aspects actually work together.

> >

> > I have been reading Thich Nhat Hanh, as you can tell if you've

> > been reading my posts of late. That is how I came across

this

> > book; he wrote the forward, and the book was on the shelf

where

> > his books are kept at the store I visited yesterday. Here is

what

> > the publisher is saying about this book. If anyone has any

> > comments about Buddhism and Hinduism, I would be

> > interested in hearing/reading them. I have been wondering

how

> > Thich Nhat Hanh's work would be seen by Hindus, or by

> > members of this group. For me, it fits right in with why I am a

> > member of this group.

> >

> > ".... Relating the Indian sage Patanjali's teachings on yoga to

> > Buddhist teachings, the author invites practitioners of yoga

and

> > meditation to experience yoga's asanas, or poses, as

occasions

> > for mindfulness meditation. This relationship is both novel

and

> > logical. Buddhism grew from Hindu-yoga roots, and yoga,

> > certainly as understood in America, could use a greater

> > appreciation of its spiritual significance. Following a

discussion

> > of Buddhist teachings grounded on some central discourses

> > (sutras) and heavily indebted to Vietnamese Zen monk Thich

> > Nhat Hanh, who supplies a foreword, Boccio provides four

> > sequences of poses. The sequences generally repeat

poses

> > but are intended to lead the student to new understandings

of

> > those poses, thus encouraging growth in the discipline of

yoga.

> > .... Because this book tries to do so much, it's not for

beginning

> > yoga students or meditators, but those with established

> > practices may benefit from seeing the postures in a

surprising

> > and more spiritual light."

> > Reed Business Information, a division of Reed

> > Yoga Journal, April 2004

> > "EDITOR'S CHOICE! Boccio shows that Buddhist practice is

> > itself a form of yoga, presenting a meditational approach to

> > asana practice."

> >

> > Mary Ann

June 13, 2004

Yes, the mind is the Self, but the Self is not the mind, mind is

just a part of the self.

They are different, and budhism has a face of a peaceful religion.

Yet it has done its work similar to other religions,

the diety of badrinath is and was vishnu, the budhist people

replaced it with budha. I dont know why a peaceful religion would do

something like that!.

Budhism is a man-made religion and like all man made religions it has

added fantasies to its history and even theories of origin.

Once a chinese acquaintance claimed budha was born in china.

I asked her why the name is budha and not ping, or ming for which

she did not have any answer.

The peaceful era of spread of budhism made india vulnerable for

numerous invasions from outside. So did it really promote peace?

, "Mary Ann" <maryann@m...>

wrote:

> I appreciate your comments. There are teachings from Indian

> masters/gurus that say the mind is the Self. Muktananda, in his

> book Meditate, says this: "[Trouble] happens when we try to

> subdue the mind forcibly in meditation. Instead of worrying about

> the thoughts of the mind, instead of trying to erase the thoughts

> from the mind, it would be much better if we tried to understand

> the nature of mind. What is the mind? The mind has no

> independent existence. The Upanishads say that the Self has

> itself become the mind. The mind is nothing but a contracted

> form of the supreme Consciousness that has created the

> Universe."

>

> I feel this is a user-friendly approach to the mind and

meditation.

> I also feel this is in keeping with the Buddhist practice of

> mindfulness (at least, from what I have read in Thich Nhat

> Hanh), which is about tuning into the breath so that breath and

> body are united, which calms the mind, re-establishing the

> harmony of unity between self and Self, so that our emotions and

> thoughts do not wreak havoc on ourselves, others, and the

> world.

>

> Maybe different systems, but not opposing (unless someone

> wants them to be). An ishtadevata is a symbol - a focal point for

> one's meditation and development. Buddhists use sounds like a

> bell as a focal point; Hindus a mantra.

>

> Mary Ann

>

> , "malyavan_tibet"

> <malyavan_tibet> wrote:

> > There's a fiction by Bhagwan Gidwani "The return of the

> aryans"

> > which i have not read completely but the first few chapters. But

> in

> > it he mentions somethings which i completely agree to. If

> everyone

> > who went to the forest for deep meditation and spiritual life

and

> > who got enlightened came back and started their own religion,

> there

> > would be thousands of religions in the Indian sub-continent.

> > Fortunately many of the people who started their journey to the

> > divine origin and found the divine fountain, found them similar

> and

> > they spread their knowledge. Now there were some who

> found their

> > divine fountain different and started whole new movements,

> one of

> > them was budha.

> >

> > Budhism and shakti sadhana are too entirely different

> systems, the

> > former atheistic and the latter centered in beliefs of existence

> of

> > numerous devas/devis/gods. If someone claims mindfulness

> as

> > something new it shows how much wise they are.

> >

> > I never read budhist books except skim through them. Using

> mind as a

> > tool to overcome the veiling mind is something which does not

> strike

> > me as time well spend!.

> >

> > , "Mary Ann"

> <maryann@m...>

> > wrote:

> > > Namaste All:

> > >

> > > Yesterday in the bookstore I saw a book called Yoga and

> > > Mindfulness. Apparently, it's a "new" concept to bring yoga

> and

> > > mindfulness together. The book came out in April 2004. My

> > > experience of yoga is that the more I practice, the more

> mindful I

> > > can become. In Iyengar yoga classes, so much attention is

> > > placed on correct alignment, the point being to align the body

> so

> > > that gravity is working with you, not against you. This brings

> > > about the conditions that create space for mindfulness to

> > > blossom. I have noticed that the yoga classes I attend most

> > > regularly have not directly addressed the spiritual aspects of

> > > yoga, and that I am still developing my own awareness in

> this

> > > area, despite the fact that the teachers are not instructing

in

> > that

> > > area. This is why I appreciated Machig Lapdron's comment

> that

> > > she is not the teacher, and a student needs to trust her/his

> > > innate wisdom. I have also noticed that teachers that attempt

> to

> > > address the spiritual aspects are not generally that good at

> > > addressing the physical aspects, or do not have a sense of

> how

> > > these aspects actually work together.

> > >

> > > I have been reading Thich Nhat Hanh, as you can tell if you've

> > > been reading my posts of late. That is how I came across

> this

> > > book; he wrote the forward, and the book was on the shelf

> where

> > > his books are kept at the store I visited yesterday. Here is

> what

> > > the publisher is saying about this book. If anyone has any

> > > comments about Buddhism and Hinduism, I would be

> > > interested in hearing/reading them. I have been wondering

> how

> > > Thich Nhat Hanh's work would be seen by Hindus, or by

> > > members of this group. For me, it fits right in with why I am

a

> > > member of this group.

> > >

> > > ".... Relating the Indian sage Patanjali's teachings on yoga

to

> > > Buddhist teachings, the author invites practitioners of yoga

> and

> > > meditation to experience yoga's asanas, or poses, as

> occasions

> > > for mindfulness meditation. This relationship is both novel

> and

> > > logical. Buddhism grew from Hindu-yoga roots, and yoga,

> > > certainly as understood in America, could use a greater

> > > appreciation of its spiritual significance. Following a

> discussion

> > > of Buddhist teachings grounded on some central discourses

> > > (sutras) and heavily indebted to Vietnamese Zen monk Thich

> > > Nhat Hanh, who supplies a foreword, Boccio provides four

> > > sequences of poses. The sequences generally repeat

> poses

> > > but are intended to lead the student to new understandings

> of

> > > those poses, thus encouraging growth in the discipline of

> yoga.

> > > .... Because this book tries to do so much, it's not for

> beginning

> > > yoga students or meditators, but those with established

> > > practices may benefit from seeing the postures in a

> surprising

> > > and more spiritual light."

> > > Reed Business Information, a division of Reed

> > > Yoga Journal, April 2004

> > > "EDITOR'S CHOICE! Boccio shows that Buddhist practice is

> > > itself a form of yoga, presenting a meditational approach to

> > > asana practice."

> > >

> > > Mary Ann

June 13, 2004

I read a Buddhist story about a king whose son dethroned him

and had him killed. This was allowed to happen by the Buddha,

and all around the king and son. The son was not strong in

himself, and had many fears as a leader (due to the kind of

element that led him to attain the throne as he did). He had many

inner troubles, and eventually went to the Buddha for counsel.

The Buddha had been his father's friend. Once he understood

the Buddha's teaching, the son had a dream in which his father

embraced him. It was like they had to let the bad occur, and only

through so doing, did the son get to the good. They were looking

at life as a bigger picture than just what takes place during life,

seeing the power struggles we go through as part of our spiritual

development, and that death does not kill the spirit. I have no

opinion on this, other than that it was interesting.

, "malyavan_tibet"

<malyavan_tibet> wrote:

> Yes, the mind is the Self, but the Self is not the mind, mind is

> just a part of the self.

>

> They are different, and budhism has a face of a peaceful

religion.

> Yet it has done its work similar to other religions,

> the diety of badrinath is and was vishnu, the budhist people

> replaced it with budha. I dont know why a peaceful religion

would do

> something like that!.

>

> Budhism is a man-made religion and like all man made

religions it has

> added fantasies to its history and even theories of origin.

> Once a chinese acquaintance claimed budha was born in

china.

> I asked her why the name is budha and not ping, or ming for

which

> she did not have any answer.

>

> The peaceful era of spread of budhism made india vulnerable

for

> numerous invasions from outside. So did it really promote

peace?

>

> , "Mary Ann"

<maryann@m...>

> wrote:

> > I appreciate your comments. There are teachings from Indian

> > masters/gurus that say the mind is the Self. Muktananda, in

his

> > book Meditate, says this: "[Trouble] happens when we try to

> > subdue the mind forcibly in meditation. Instead of worrying

about

> > the thoughts of the mind, instead of trying to erase the

thoughts

> > from the mind, it would be much better if we tried to

understand

> > the nature of mind. What is the mind? The mind has no

> > independent existence. The Upanishads say that the Self

has

> > itself become the mind. The mind is nothing but a contracted

> > form of the supreme Consciousness that has created the

> > Universe."

> >

> > I feel this is a user-friendly approach to the mind and

> meditation.

> > I also feel this is in keeping with the Buddhist practice of

> > mindfulness (at least, from what I have read in Thich Nhat

> > Hanh), which is about tuning into the breath so that breath

and

> > body are united, which calms the mind, re-establishing the

> > harmony of unity between self and Self, so that our emotions

and

> > thoughts do not wreak havoc on ourselves, others, and the

> > world.

> >

> > Maybe different systems, but not opposing (unless someone

> > wants them to be). An ishtadevata is a symbol - a focal point

for

> > one's meditation and development. Buddhists use sounds

like a

> > bell as a focal point; Hindus a mantra.

> >

> > Mary Ann

> >

> > , "malyavan_tibet"

> > <malyavan_tibet> wrote:

> > > There's a fiction by Bhagwan Gidwani "The return of the

> > aryans"

> > > which i have not read completely but the first few chapters.

But

> > in

> > > it he mentions somethings which i completely agree to. If

> > everyone

> > > who went to the forest for deep meditation and spiritual life

> and

> > > who got enlightened came back and started their own

religion,

> > there

> > > would be thousands of religions in the Indian

sub-continent.

> > > Fortunately many of the people who started their journey to

the

> > > divine origin and found the divine fountain, found them

similar

> > and

> > > they spread their knowledge. Now there were some who

> > found their

> > > divine fountain different and started whole new

movements,

> > one of

> > > them was budha.

> > >

> > > Budhism and shakti sadhana are too entirely different

> > systems, the

> > > former atheistic and the latter centered in beliefs of

existence

> > of

> > > numerous devas/devis/gods. If someone claims

mindfulness

> > as

> > > something new it shows how much wise they are.

> > >

> > > I never read budhist books except skim through them.

Using

> > mind as a

> > > tool to overcome the veiling mind is something which does

not

> > strike

> > > me as time well spend!.

> > >

> > > , "Mary Ann"

> > <maryann@m...>

> > > wrote:

> > > > Namaste All:

> > > >

> > > > Yesterday in the bookstore I saw a book called Yoga and

> > > > Mindfulness. Apparently, it's a "new" concept to bring

yoga

> > and

> > > > mindfulness together. The book came out in April 2004.

My

> > > > experience of yoga is that the more I practice, the more

> > mindful I

> > > > can become. In Iyengar yoga classes, so much attention

is

> > > > placed on correct alignment, the point being to align the

body

> > so

> > > > that gravity is working with you, not against you. This

brings

> > > > about the conditions that create space for mindfulness to

> > > > blossom. I have noticed that the yoga classes I attend

most

> > > > regularly have not directly addressed the spiritual

aspects of

> > > > yoga, and that I am still developing my own awareness in

> > this

> > > > area, despite the fact that the teachers are not instructing

> in

> > > that

> > > > area. This is why I appreciated Machig Lapdron's

comment

> > that

> > > > she is not the teacher, and a student needs to trust

her/his

> > > > innate wisdom. I have also noticed that teachers that

attempt

> > to

> > > > address the spiritual aspects are not generally that good

at

> > > > addressing the physical aspects, or do not have a sense

of

> > how

> > > > these aspects actually work together.

> > > >

> > > > I have been reading Thich Nhat Hanh, as you can tell if

you've

> > > > been reading my posts of late. That is how I came

across

> > this

> > > > book; he wrote the forward, and the book was on the

shelf

> > where

> > > > his books are kept at the store I visited yesterday. Here is

> > what

> > > > the publisher is saying about this book. If anyone has

any

> > > > comments about Buddhism and Hinduism, I would be

> > > > interested in hearing/reading them. I have been

wondering

> > how

> > > > Thich Nhat Hanh's work would be seen by Hindus, or by

> > > > members of this group. For me, it fits right in with why I

am

> a

> > > > member of this group.

> > > >

> > > > ".... Relating the Indian sage Patanjali's teachings on

yoga

> to

> > > > Buddhist teachings, the author invites practitioners of

yoga

> > and

> > > > meditation to experience yoga's asanas, or poses, as

> > occasions

> > > > for mindfulness meditation. This relationship is both

novel

> > and

> > > > logical. Buddhism grew from Hindu-yoga roots, and yoga,

> > > > certainly as understood in America, could use a greater

> > > > appreciation of its spiritual significance. Following a

> > discussion

> > > > of Buddhist teachings grounded on some central

discourses

> > > > (sutras) and heavily indebted to Vietnamese Zen monk

Thich

> > > > Nhat Hanh, who supplies a foreword, Boccio provides

four

> > > > sequences of poses. The sequences generally repeat

> > poses

> > > > but are intended to lead the student to new

understandings

> > of

> > > > those poses, thus encouraging growth in the discipline of

> > yoga.

> > > > .... Because this book tries to do so much, it's not for

> > beginning

> > > > yoga students or meditators, but those with established

> > > > practices may benefit from seeing the postures in a

> > surprising

> > > > and more spiritual light."

> > > > Reed Business Information, a division of

Reed

> > > > Yoga Journal, April 2004

> > > > "EDITOR'S CHOICE! Boccio shows that Buddhist practice

is

> > > > itself a form of yoga, presenting a meditational approach

to

> > > > asana practice."

> > > >

> > > > Mary Ann

June 14, 2004

The Vajrayana is Buddhist yoga.

-

Mary Ann

Sunday, June 13, 2004 1:12 PM