Airicky

Why bother? He admits his intent was to show how messed up everyone is and that he has the answer to save the movement. Just read the first paragraph of his last post above this one. He doesn't care what we think and he obviously doesn't want to stop eating meat; if he actually does (is that also part of the game?) It was all a game to create a ruckus. It was a powerplay.

Complete waste.

And Allen, you are another example of a huge problem in this world - duplicity.

You are perfect. Let us know when you start accepting disciples.

Thanks for wasting our time.

This thread went exactly the way I had hoped. My motivation for this thread was to bring the attitudes to the forefront that I knew existed and that I knew to be the cause of the problems in the HK movement. They have been there for over 30 years and you guys, right on que, showed them once again. You guys really are so predictable.

Lets review the facts.

1. The Hare Krishna movement in the US is in a deplorable state. The movement has been disgraced and westerners avoid it like the plague. It takes absolutely no qualifications to see this. All one has to do is open his eyes.

2. I also offered the reason for this deplorable state. That being mainly arrogance and the inability to deal with people as normal human beings in human relationships.

3. I offered what is a reasonable starting ground for turning the problem around and to get the movement going in the right direction. That solution is to start listening to people and being more understanding of their weaknesses, their trails and tribulations, and all of the complex differences that make up all of us.

4. The devotees contribution was,as always, to attack the messenger. It's like a thirty year broken record. We are superior to you because we have all of these qualifications that you don't. Even though people with all of the qualifications that they tout are the very ones that got movement into the mess it is in today. They neither admitted the problems or offered any possible solutions to them. Hear no evil,see no evil and speak no evil. Everything is just fine. Thank You. Do you think HDG would be saying that about the current state of his movement?

So in summation the state of the HK movement is as I stated. It is a fact and it cannot be disputed. The people inside the movement who have all the qualifications and who have created all of these problems have no solutions and they will not listen to anyone outside the movement. In other words, the quintessential Catch-22. A paradox. The problem with a Catch-22 situation is that there is no way out of it. It will always stay that way.

This is my last post on this topic. If there are other posts arguing against my posts I'm will not be responding. It won't be because the person has so called defeated me(HK members love to play the defeated him game) with his superior argument and I have given up; but because the thread and the topic has reached it conclusion. All points of view are clear on both sides and we obviously disagree.

I will pray for members and as always will wish you well.HK

Ask the doctor to check him for parasites. Doctors in the United States won't often think of testing for parasites but it is a very common cause of stomach distress.

Certain parasites can enter the body thru the skin between the toes particularly in hot tropical climates such as India and if the person walked on the ground barefoot. Remember animals do not use bathrooms but use the ground.

Then there is the possibility of contaminated water and food.

I will pray for your friend to be well soon. Please let us know how he does.

Please give the reference for this. Which disk is it from? Thanks.

There are quite a few so here is the google search page for christian vegetarianism.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=vegetarian+christian&btnG=Google+Search

Thanks for the suggestion of the sending them to Christian veggie sites. This could come in very very handy!

Right in the very first chapter of the first book in the Bible one reads that man's first diet given by the Elohim was a vegan diet. But later different Hebrew teachers said different things and so contradictions can be found.

I have beaten my head against the stone of Christian hard headness enough on this issue. Now I just point them to various Christian vegetarian web sites to learn if they want.

Can you please post the links to the Christian Vegetarian sites?

Who told you that vegetarians are not violent? There is no such researched conclusion. Violence has nothing to do with one's diet.

As long as man kills animals and eats their flesh; there can be no true and eternal peace.

The fact of the matter is man is omnivorous and has evolved or has been "intelligently designed" to eat meat. If God created man and intended him to be vegetarian he would have created him as a herbivore like a deer or a cow.

And if God had meant for man to fly; he would have given him wings.

Anyway, the vegetarian country India has an average life expectancy of 60+ years while meat eating nations have improved their life expectancy to near 80. Obviously the good Lord has not cursed them until now for slaughtering animals.

And they will continue to come back and live long lifes in this hellish material world until they learn to quit killing and eating their brothers.

Miracle Gro contains a substance called Urea Phosphate.

Isn't Urea urine? The most common place for a company to obtain urine for their products is a slaughterhouse.

I was told by a temple Tulasi caretaker that he uses Miracle Gro. Is Urea Phosphate something different from a urine product?

Another meat eater thread in the Hindu Discussion section of this forum

http://www.audarya-fellowship.com/forums/hinduism/43014-eating-meat.html

mikey this attitude wouldnt please prabhupada.

unless we are perfectly situated in devotional service, we cannot judge. we are servant of the servant. that is our position.

does trnad api sunicena mean anything to u?

new devotee syndrome is a scary thing.

haribol.

Hare Krishna

Airicky trying to make someone do something by trying to make them feel guilty or shamed is manipulation and does not work. Also there is a great deal of anger in your post. Honestly if your reply was the only one I got I would never try to be a vegetarian. If it made people that anger it would of no use to me or anyone.

The reply by the guest yesterday at 7:55 PM is also no help what-so-ever. The old,YOU ARE A WEAK MINDED NINNY JUST DO IT, approach is dictatorial and shows no understanding or compassion. It is not that I have been brainwashed into a meat eating mindset. I did not feel up to par either physically, mentally or emotionally and somewhat unwell on the diet. I asked for help regarding those issues.

The other suggestions were helpful and showed understanding and compassion. The comment regarding a vegan diet is misguided however. His Divine Grace recommended a high fat lacto-vegetarian diet; for that reason, the type of diet to be followed is not up for debate. Direction in how to follow that type of diet is the issue at hand and your helpful comments in that regard are appreciated. Hare Krishna

I agree with the guest that told you to just do it. Sorry if it offends you but I say it like it is. I have been vegetarian since the late sixties and the longer I don't eat meat the more the idea of torturing the animals sickens me. If you can still eat meat or it makes you want to eat it all the more after hearing that they too suffer and feel fear and pain then I feel badly for you.

I also agree that if you go to the temple and eat the Krishna prasadam and chant then your heart will begin to soften.

Good luck.

No, looks like someone has decided to speak in the third person from now on. That's usually a sure sign of improved communications in any discussion.

Yes, that made Airicky smile.

Sorry, Anadi didn't mean to yell. He wanted to make clear, your statement need a specific correction.

 

Is there more than one person using Anadi i.d.?

anadi said:

Can you bring evidence that he wrote in any of his commentaries to his translated books, or any other books, that his books are the essence?

[Airicky]

Sorry, got it backwards.

Prabhupada told us that preaching is the essence and books are the basis.

BTW, you don't have to yell to get your point across Anadi

Dear Airicky,

Sorry, Anadi didn't mean to yell. He wanted to make clear, your statement need a specific correction.

Thank you for clarifying that. Next time just say something like "I think what Prabhupada really said was...." or "Are you sure? I seem to remember...."

Can you bring evidence that he wrote in any of his commentaries to his translated books, or any other books, that his books are the essence?

Sorry, got it backwards.

Prabhupada told us that preaching is the essence and books are the basis.

BTW, you don't have to yell to get your point across Anadi.

I've tried to change to a vegetarian diet several times but I found it difficult. I don't really know how to describe it but I felt strange. I just didn't feel like myself and I mean that in a bad way. It wasn't like what I felt was good or positive. It really was a negative experience. I also was much more short tempered.

I know in my heart that a vegetarian diet is the natural diet for man and I want to be vegetarian. I would like any suggestions anyone has on helping me adopt a vegetarian diet.

Do you believe in transmigration of the soul? if so, that should be enough to do it.

If not, whatch the PETA movie "Meet Your Meat". Just go to PETA website and order it for free.

The animals that are being slaughtered for the temporary pleasure of your tongue feel intense fear and pain by the act. They also feel love and pleasure when treated with respect and love.

Kinda like you right? If someone takes a weapon to you and you can not defend yourself, then you will feel pain and fear. If someone treats you with loving kindness then you feel pleasure and love.

Take this anyway you like but going to the fast food restaurant or buying that steak in the supermarket implicates you in murder even if you are not the one that dealt the death blow. And those who murder pay the price.

If you murder a person you are punished by the government laws. Murder an animal for the pleasure of your tongue and the Supreme Law will deal out your punishment. It is a lose lose situation.

Just think about the animals fear and silent screams of anquish next time you bite down into that steak.

Bon Appetit

Prabhupada taught that his books are the essence. Devotee association is very important but his books are the essence.

Anybody can say anything they want on the internet. They can lay claims to all kinds of stuff including hearing from a bona fide spiritual master. Names, places, activities and history, even supposed knowledge, can all be fabricated behind the screen.

The internet can be a great place but it also can be like some fictional movie with actors playing parts. Some play these parts better than others.

We can only place our faith and trust in Srila Prabhupada and Lord Krishna. If we surrender fully at the Lotus Feet of guru and Krishna we will always find ourselves on the right path.

Well the moderators here again edited/deleted my posts, even the one asking for an explanation of why they were doing it!

So, why don't you just step up and give an explanation? I MADE NO ATTACKS ON THE "AS IT IS" OR ANY OTHER RENDITION OF THE GITA!!! SO, What gives?

Well, in one thread you had the gull to say Lord Caitanya was wrong. Then you suggest we read Mayavadi interpretations of Bhagavad-gita.

wrong forum to come in and say the Supreme Lord is wrong and to push impersonalists philosophies.

doh!

Who are you responding to and what is that supposed to mean?

Vijaya Ekadasi was last month on February 24th. On March 25th is Papamocani Ekadasi.

Can you give the verse in Bhagavad-gita please?

i think i used a poor example.

what i am wanting to know is what Krishna meant by "killing selflessly"

Doesn't Arjuna represent the ideal that I could be? SO in contemporary western scoiety what does Krishna consider "killing" And how do I practice this selflessly?

Who wrote and who published this book?

Petitions are good but legal action is not out of the realm of possibility

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/03-06/editorials241.htm

We have always fasted completely for half day; not the ekadasi style fasting as you say. I doubled checked with the temple and they said the half day fast is correct.

Hare Krishna. Reading the above gives rise to the following questions:

 

a) How do you know these persons are "so-called gurus" and are not bonafide?

 

The one and -- only -- sure way for you to be able to so

conclusively say such a thing is if Krishna were to personally tell you so.

 

b) How do you know that they have not realized their spiritual body or that of their disciples?

 

c) How do you know that they have not reached the stage of prema?

 

d) Why make such sweeping critical judgements of other vaishnavas?

 

Are we the seers?

 

Does taking the self-appointed position of judge and jury to pass judgement on them help your otherwise good arguments?

 

ys

 

govinda

 

 

Srila Prabhupada is our example and he told us himself that by reading and studying his books very carefully we will be able to know who is true guru and teaching according to sastra, sadhu and guru.