M_Mehdi

all praise be to God the asamaurdhva (none equal and none above) peace /images/graemlins/smile.gif ps. am i using the term 'asamaurdhva' correct?

i feel the biggest misconception is that we lil humans think/act we know everything.... even about God... the ideas and problems to getting to know God i'm pretty sure we'll find out once we all leave our physical bodies... and thus it becomes a form of conversation which rounds and rounds and goes no where ... while we are here in our bodies... because as much as one can truely and sincerly feel one way... there will always be another human who will truely and sincerly feel another... in the part of this board titled 'letters to editor' i find this: God is described as "asamaurdhva" which means "none equal and none above". isn't this enough? ... lets move on... there is nothing to see here... /images/graemlins/grin.gif this is why it is said that the biggest spiritual crime (or sin if you wish) is to utter a lie about God... however... it is useful to use our spiritual learnings... to better our human society... you know.. one way or another calm the hearts of the fanatics... which ever flag they choose to wave... but this takes the letting go of pride... culture... class... all things which seperate us... peace... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

madhav, your anger only creates a mirror image which you see yourself in others... and you also become the mirror image of those who anger you... the cycle goes on and on... it is up to you to stop it... and everyone has their time... ---madhave writes: have you ever tried to explain your above para point to a muslim? probably not. try it and share the experience here.--- /images/graemlins/smile.gif it does not matter to me which flag a person chooses to wave... if it speaks intollorance and hate... i will say my piece(peace)... madhav please read my posts and do not let anger and pride blind you... you may go through all my posts easily by clicking on my name to the left of this post... you'll find an answer to your doubts on this very site... on which i have posted... anger blinds.... subside anger and open the eyes... and the rest of your post is very words of a bigot... ________________ big·ot ( P ) Pronunciation Key (bgt) n. One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ. ________________ ---madhav writes: we hindus on the other hand want to keep india for the hindus and hindus' friends only.--- this dear madhav what you say seems nothing different from what i've heard white supermists use as an excuse for their brand of ignorance, hatered, pride and anger... this is all text book dear madhav... the justification is in your mind... you're going to follow it because you wish to and at these points of conversing with you i feel you truley enjoy your anger... your anger seems to give you purpose... and power... and the joy you get from it is why you do not want to give it up... but remember your anger is material... and nothing more... there is however one other source (even though it is still material) which your anger comes from... and this is lack of knowledge... you knowledge of Islam is at best... bad... dear madhav... i said this to a muslims n this very site regarding Sufis... and to you i say the same: ---posted by M_Mehdi RE: sufi [re: muslim] 11/28/03 10:13 AM ...and although one might have a certain experience with a certain sufi order or particular person(s)... one cannot judge a whole people by actions of a few... --------------- also madhav... regarding you analogy of slavery... please take time to read: Uncle Tom's Cabin by Harriet Beecher Stowe ok now... to our dear Guest in hiding... /images/graemlins/smile.gif "The asuric person feels responsible for his or her life and is constantly seeking something that will improve the quality of life" my faith, my soul, my sprituality is nothing more than personal reponsibilty... i cannot blindly follow anything nor anyone... for at the end it will be I who will stand naked before God... God whome gifted the me and all humans with the faculty of reason... and thought... it is for us to learn the truth... and it is ourself whome have to be accountable for this truth... this is karmic and quranic... anger, pride, hate have no room in a "seeking seeking something that will improve the quality of life" no war... if my neighbor is happy... my household is also happy... why? ... simple... cause when he ain't he cranks up his stereo so loud.. no one can even think... lol! /images/graemlins/wink.gif sorry a lil jest but in essence true... may peace be on us all... and God the asamaurdhva (none equal and none above) guide us all... muhammad /images/graemlins/smile.gif

----quote by madhav: rather than analysing why i addressed you as my grand father, or you addressed me as a silly boy, why not we focus on the point a post tries to make.--- nice! /images/graemlins/smile.gif ok... what do you think of the following? The origin of anger may be very complicated. still one thing remains... the cycle of anger must be stopped somewhere... these feelings will never leave on their own... they will age with you from one life to the next... anger is the worst of the inner enemies because of its unending connection to the chain of desires... whenever there is dissatisfaction there is anger... peace /images/graemlins/smile.gif

madhav, it's sure nice to see your anger subside even if it manifests in the form of sarcasm... it's a step isn't it? /images/graemlins/smile.gif however sarcasm is insincere... which makes me wonder if your whole post is sarcastic or just parts... who knows really... maybe you do... and you can share... also the place where sarcasm comes from... would you agree that sarcasm comes in the form of the ego in self protection mode...? i'm curious to know... what you think? peace /images/graemlins/smile.gif

hindus and islam /images/graemlins/smile.gif but anyway i want to discuss pride... what i've learned about Krishna Consiencness... is no different from all true paths to the One... and upon this path are many pitfals.. and a big one is Pride /images/graemlins/frown.gif pride blinds... the soul knows no such thing as pride... pride is material... a source of the mind... not the soul... pride is animal... not spiritual... pride is the cause of many wars... personal and national.. what do you think? peace /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Assalaamu alaikum, just wanted to make a quick note on Sufis... since mentioned on the last post... /images/graemlins/smile.gif Sufis are also Believers... and although one might have a certain experience with a certain sufi order or particular person(s)... one cannot judge a whole people by actions of a few... i've known many who wish to call themselves Sufi who do quote from the Quran and hadeeth... good study of Sufi: Abu Hamid al-Ghazali (450-505 AH / 1058-1111 AD) again just a note.. i don't wish to stop the flow of this thread... /images/graemlins/smile.gif peace be on you.

as long as any go on seperating believer human beings into groups of us and them we will continue to go on missing the point of the God given gift of heart... no matter what excuses one wishes to give...

i will post again a part from my previous post and if you still need clarification please let me know /images/graemlins/smile.gif <<M_Mehdi writes- dear Guest... your words are from my own heart... this is one of my strongest feelings of what is implied here... one word.. SEMANTICS ... yes! we need to go beyond words to understand.... and attain peace within and towards others... it is human traditions that break us apart at times... (when there is pride behind them that is) ... and words which some use to own God... only for one club and not the other... clubs are what we have formed... formed in the physical... hindu... muslim... christian... etc. etc. etc.. words that only seperate the ignorant... but for the person blessed by God with knowledge... words that become doorways to better understanding full color of humanity and a chance to learn from eachother... and attain peace on earth... i find these discussion to be a really good thing... the line between hindu and muslim is not that wide apart... to better understand the many many things in common with eachother is to better understand ourselves... why do we not celebrate what we have in common rather than war with our differences... we are all spritual beings... and the true fight is not amongst ourselves... peace.. muhammad>> peace be on you... muhammad ... (God willing i will check in again tomorrow) /images/graemlins/smile.gif

huh? ... i'm sorry i do not understand the meaning of your subject... /images/graemlins/smile.gif none the less.. if you intention is to say that God has created with reason... and thought... i agree... the universe as we know it and don't ... is created for a reason... btw... i hold dear the teachings of the Buddah... so again i don't understand your subject.. may peace on you... muhammad

hare Krishna <<< yasodanandana writes- the attibutes reveal the presence of a personality (only a person can be Allah,, the greatest, the highest.. not a void or a mere concept), and personality is expressed through a form, a shape, beauty, voice, mouth, gesture, body, behaviour, charme etc...>>> the word you use 'person' to me reffers to humanity. the dictionary's first definition is "A living human. " .. if so.. i'd have to disagree with you respectfully... we are created by God... we need God... God does not need us... <<< yasodanandana writes- with all these names ( vishnu, narasimha, vamana, matsya etc) i mean various manifestations of the personality of god, krishna, not that there's polytheism>>> exactly... no polytheism ... i learned this from the hindu faith the first time i visited this site... which is also the very first step to peace between muslims and hindus.. much love to you yasodanandana ... /images/graemlins/smile.gif <<< yasodanandana writes- i do not understand the "circle, square" stuff all the forms i am speaking are spiritual, not material>>> percisly... and i agree with you fully that forms as attribuits are not material.. it is the logical human mind that wants to bring shape (shape meaning physical form) to such things... peace be on you yasodanandana /images/graemlins/smile.gif <<< Guest writes - Hare Krishna, What is pain ? It is a phenomenon that arises and then sibsides. What is required to feel pain ? Consciousness or awareness that one exists. If one is sleeping or unconscous, he/she/it does not feel anything. So to feel pain one needs to be conscious.>>> there two form of pain.. one physical the other a matter of the heart... one can feel pain even in sleep... <<< Guest writes - Do plants have consciousness ? Science has no idea what consciousness is ? There does not exist any known scientific methodology or framework to study consciousness. All we know is that man and animals have consciousness because animals feel, move, fear etc. just like human beings. Not to mention plants do not even possess a BRAIN. Do for all practical purposes they do not "FEEL" at all.>>> please let me know if i understand you correctly... so if you say science has no idea what consciousness is... and there is no sceintific framework to study consciousness then why believe that plants are not consious? since science can't prove that me and you are consious... and we know that we are awake in the sense(at least ) of communications... consious of right or wrong... we can say that there does exist some form of consiousness... there have been studies however that house plant grow better if one talks with them... and even seem to respond to music... is it proven 100% i don't know... but as you say... they also cannot prove consiousness... but it doesn't make it not real... peace be on you /images/graemlins/smile.gif <<< Guest(2)writes- GOD is "pure existence" = SAT implies only HE truly exists FULLY. HIS existence does not depend on anything else.>>> i agree... it is us humans that rely on God... not the other way around... <<< Guest(2)writes- GOD is CHIT = PURE AWARENESS with no impurities.>>> again i agree with you... this is beutiful your posts... <<< Guest(2)writes- GOD is ANANDA = Pure Bliss.>>> yes God is the goal and return of us all... <<< Guest(2)writes- Rupa or Form of GOD should not be understood as limited, none the less HE has a form. why ? Since GOD is different from other entities like living beings and dead matter.>>> yes i agree with you again... so why then try and own God by putting a limited form on God...? doing so only seems to cause discrose... <<< Guest(2)writes- So let us go beyond words and try to look at what is really implied here.>>> dear Guest... your words are from my own heart... this is one of my strongest feelings of what is implied here... one word.. SEMANTICS ... yes! we need to go beyond words to understand.... and attain peace within and towards others... it is human traditions that break us apart at times... (when there is pride behind them that is) ... and words which some use to own God... only for one club and not the other... clubs are what we have formed... formed in the physical... hindu... muslim... christian... etc. etc. etc.. words that only seperate the ignorant... but for the person blessed by God with knowledge... words that become doorways to better understanding full color of humanity and a chance to learn from eachother... and attain peace on earth... <<< Guest(2)writes- Anyway, Are you vegetarian ? >>> lol! /images/graemlins/smile.gif where i live i am not allowed to eat meat for it is not killed halal... the treatment of such animals where i live is horrible and the way they are killed is misreable and torterous... much love and may peace be on you... i find these discussion to be a really good thing... the line between hindu and muslim is not that wide apart... to better understand the many many things in common with eachother is to better understand ourselves... why do we not celebrate what we have in common rather than war with our differences... we are all spritual beings... and the true fight is not amongst ourselves... peace.. muhammad /images/graemlins/smile.gif

<<< madhav writes- so please preach peace to the islamists. this is wrong place for it. jai sri krishna! -madhav>>> it is no surprise to see you write this madhav.. you have fallin perfectly into the design... again... peace is at your back... you don't even want it in front of you... give up anger and find peace... we will always be there with open arms to recieve you... may God guide you to his path and put peace into your heart... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

salaam (peace), please this thread is going off subject already... the reseaon i posted this thread is for better understanding (God willing)... ---in another thread madanvrao posted: "The only difference is that Prophet Mohammed said that God is formless, whereas we say that God has a form, otherwise on what will you meditate upon?"--- and to help better understand eachother i posted this thread... this thread was intended to better understand the form(s) of God.. in Islam there is a saying that Allah (God) has many attribuits... would one call these attribuits forms? plus... the quesion still stands... what is the form of love? (insha-Allah) i will try and be more clear... is the form of love... a circle.. or a square... what is the physical form does a thought hold? peace be on you... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

hare Krishna, what is the form of love? peace

salaam madhav, your words are the mirror image of the name of this thread... one day the realazation of your anger will come to light... peace is at your back and anger at your front... everywhere you turn you'll continue to see anger... while peace will continue to be unreachable.. because it is behind you... i say this with of love... give up anger... and you'll find peace... salaam madanvrao , there are many fanatics in many ways... and 'forms' ... one can not judge a whole people by their worst... otherwise no two humans on earth could every live in peace... the rest... is very intersting what you say... about form...and the Quran being written by the prophet Muhammad (pboh) ... (God willing) i will start a new thread to discuss form... peace be on you.. muhammad /images/graemlins/smile.gif