Gayatri Mantra and knowledge

[Puru_Das 0]

 

Preaching is something different from telling the truth?

I've never heard this before! Amazing.

Don't twist things out of proportion. Sometimes our acaryas adjust siddhanta for time and circumstance preaching. There are many examples that we don't need to offer here, so you can just try to use the information for your own agenda.

 

Puru dasa said that since SBSST didn't tell us the name. This is a fact. The diksa line of Srila Gaurakisora Babaji doesn't really matter. If a disciple gets Harinama, or sannyasa, or even siksa from a genuine Guru then that is a substantial link to the Parampara.

Granted.

 

The ritual of receiving diksa may not always eventuate but the devotee can still attain Krishna prema even without getting diksa from a genuine saint.

Most certainly if you are an eternally liberated soul like

Srila Goura Kishore das babaji or Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura. What they required or did not require does not preclude OUR need, or the need for sadhakas in general to accept diksa from a bona fide preceptor, even though chanting the gayatri mantras may not be necessary in certain rare cases where pure bhakti has already manifested. Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura wrote:

On the other hand, samskara is not necessary for liberated persons because their nature is not distorted. Distortion of the soul's original spiritual nature is the cause of his bondage in this world. For this reason, without samskara the life of the conditioned soul is impure. Even if a person has attained prema on account of previous samskara, still in his present life he again receives samskara in order to set a proper example for the good of all. . . .

Out of affection, teacher next gives a mantra that allows his student to easily experience the nectar of the Lord's holy name. A mantra is a kind of prayer that contains the name of God that is inflected grammatically in the dative case.<SUP> (7) </SUP>The mantra also includes certain adjectives that qualify the name of God and allows it to express a particular mood or taste. By giving a mantra the teacher helps his student taste the holy name by selecting a suitable 'flavor' for him. When we say "namah", obeisance to Hari, we employ the 4th or the dative case ending. The dative case expresses the proper relationship between the worshiper, the worshiped and the worship that allows the taste of the holy name to be easily experienced. There is no end to the happiness of a person who has received a mantra. Those who analyze the meaning of the 18 syllable mantra, generally used in the worship of Sri Krishna, know that it is a condensed sampling of the taste available from the Lord.<SUP> (8)</SUP> The same also applies to the 24 syllable gayatri and other mantras that are used to worship the Lord. <SUP>(9)</SUP> Those who have not received a mantra can only speculate about the taste of the holy name, but unfortunately most of their considerations are useless. Therefore you must receive a mantra. Those who have received it consider it to be a most important samskara. . .

(7) Such as Krishnaya or Ramaya.

(8) The 18 syllable Gopal mantra is one example.

(9) The kama-gayatri, used by Gaudiyas, is one example

from:

http://bvml.org/SBTP/pstpoi.html

.

[Guest guest]

In the same article quoted above, Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura writes:

 

Seeing the beloved student shining with tapa and urdhva-pundra, the teacher gladly gives nama, the holy name of God which awakens the soul's eternal nature. The eternal nature of the soul is servitude to the Lord, and by tasting the nectar of the Lord's holy name the soul is carried to the supreme abode. Then he says, "I am Hari Dasa. I am not the enjoyer of this world. Even Maya herself is eternally connected to Krishna and I must utilize her in the service to Krishna." The eternal soul is then enchanted by singing the name of Hari. By taking shelter in the nectar of the Lord's holy name, the soul becomes aware of his own spiritual nature. Intelligent men, always sing the name of Hari! Let the mind always remember the name of Hari. May the soul always be adorned with the name of Hari.

[Puru_Das 0]

"Those who have not received a mantra can only speculate about the taste of the holy name, but unfortunately most of their considerations are useless. Therefore you must receive a mantra. Those who have received it consider it to be a most important samskara."

SBT

". . . Thakur Bhakti Vinode is the pioneer of the suddha Bhakti Movement that is at present sweeping over the county. In his numerous literary works he has supplied the golden key that unlocks the region of etemal Bliss to all jivas. The teachings of Mahaprabhu give us the real meaning of the Scriptures, reconciling all differences of opinion that trouble the world. In Mahaprabhu centers the only hope of the future and present of all jivas. But the teachings of Mahaprabhu were not grasped by people of this country and their real significance passed long ago clean out of the memory of the nation. Thakur Bhakti Vinode has made the eternal religion live again in his pages. Without his help nobody at the present day can understand the teachings of Mahaprabhu or the Absolute Truth. With his help the absolute Truth can be easily understood. The absolute Truth alone can reconcile the otherwise erreconcilable differences and discords of this world. It is universally recognised that the Truth is bound to prevail over untruth in the long run. But even the Truth can only be grasped by those whose minds are perfectly free and prepared to receive it when it actually makes its appearance. But most of us are not ready to welcome the Truth for its own sake. Thakur Bhakti Vinode tells us that a perfectly pure mind alone is fit to receive the Truth. Perfect purity is not to be found in the world. It belongs to Divinity alone and is imparted by divine Grace; and God often sends His own beloved to convey His Grace to fallen jivas if only they submit to receive it from him.

B.V. TIRTHA

excerpted from a biographical essay which is the preface to Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura's Jaiva Dharma. Published by Sri Gaudiya Matha and edited by His Holiness Sri Srimad Bhakti Vilasa Tirtha Gosvami Maharaja.

http://bvml.org/SBTP/index.htm

[theist 1]

Hare Krsna Myrla,

 

So nice to hear of your spiritual growth. It is evident in your post perhaps even more than you realize. I am trying to learn that life is not static it is dynamic and that to become complacent at any level short of Krsna-prema is unacceptable and really only leads to dwindling and the drying up of our seedlings and creepers. I am glad you found a good water source.

[bija 0]

 

I want to take the timing of the new forum as a time of ridding myself of all my rude and divisive tone whitch is so natural to me and replace it with something more gentle and less pompous and fault finding. Before any new birth can become realized the old body must be discarded. Quote by Theist.

Thanks for sharing this Theist. Since chanting the Holy Names of Nitai-Gaura and Hare Krsna I have gradually become aware of my shortcomings also. It is interesting, I just have got back from the center of town today and due a particular circumstance it was really intense. Here in town there is only one other Hare Krsna devotee and I am finding this association so much more relishable than anything else. And very precious.

I have joined this forum in hopes of developing more contacts with devotee association and discovering these special dealings that can develop between devotees.

I am with your line of thought on this. Spiritual growth is a gradual process, and I am bound to make many blunders. But one thing I am sure of is how much I need to grow in a similar direction you have expressed.

This is my second attempt at joining this forum, as the first time I joined I opened my heart and personal life a little bit too much. And after reading some of the threads and posters comments dealing with others, felt very vulnerable. This time I am taking a different approach.

 

Recently I have been getting back to basics and have begun a gradual reading of Srila Prabhupada's small books. I am realising upon reading them what a great, loving, and caring man he was.

I would like to quote from Nectar of Instruction, text 5:

 

.....and one should associate with and faithfully serve that pure devotee who is advanced in undeviated devotional service and whose heart is completely devoid of the propensity to criticize others.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think I recall reading that if a person can overcome this propensity to criticize others, he becomes qualified to make disciples all over the world.

If we are fortunate enough to find a Guru, no matter what so-called camp he comes from, no matter how he may express the teachings of the Guru Parampara considering particular time and place, and so many other things which we continually debate over: if we can repose our faith in him, and he is bonafide. Then run to him, learn from him and follow him. Such a rare oppurtunity is the greatest of treasures rarely found in this material world.

 

Please forgive my foolishness.

[Puru_Das 0]

 

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think I recall reading that if a person can overcome this propensity to criticize others, he becomes qualified to make disciples all over the world. . .

Perhaps this is the verse you are thinking of:

vaco vegam manasah krodha-vegam

jihva-vegam udaropastha-vegam

etan vegan yo visaheta dhirah

sarvam apimam prthivim sa sisyat

"A sober person who can tolerate the urge to speak, the mind's demands, the actions of anger and the urges of the tongue, belly and genitals is qualified to make disciples all over the world."

NOI ,Verse 1

Nectar of Instruction (The Sri Upadesamrta of Srila Rupa Gosvami)

translated and purported by HDGACBSP

You can read His Divine Grace's purport here:

http://bvml.org/books/TNoI.html

 

If we are fortunate enough to find a Guru, no matter what so-called camp he comes from, no matter how he may express the teachings of the Guru Parampara considering particular time and place, and so many other things which we continually debate over: if we can repose our faith in him, and he is bonafide. Then run to him, learn from him and follow him. Such a rare oppurtunity is the greatest of treasures rarely found in this material world. . . .

Indeed! Here is a nice corroboration of this point,with regard to accepting a siksa guru, from Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhara Maharaja:

"The relative and absolute considerations are always coming in clash. The absolute should be accepted and the relative sacrificed. Still the relative is necessary. After graduation from primary school another teacher is accepted for higher education, but that does not mean that the primary teacher is neglected or insulted. For our own interest, whatever we find which is akin to what was given to us by our guru maharaja, whatever we find that will enlighten us further, and whatever will help us to understand more clearly what we heard from our guru maharaja, must be accepted. Is my realization a living thing, or is it dead? Anyone who has come in connection with the infinite cannot but say this: "I am nothing." That should be the salient point. . ."

SBRSM

Sri Guru and His Grace

http://bvml.org/SBRSM/SGaHG.html#5

[theist 1]

In our ordinary mundane schooling it is important for the lower grade student to understand the material he is being taught before moving to the higher grade. This is a haphazard process. New students are pressing to move up from lower grades to higher grades en masse and it pushes students along that are not fully qualified, kinda like a factory line.

Not so in transcendental education. No such pressures exist. Time is not an issue. One only advances by personally internally realizing the material. This is not just an intellectual excercise of memorizing one book, understanding some concepts and then moving on to a "higher" one.

That approach is like a bee licking the outside of one honey jar and then moving on to a supposed "higher" grade of honey(according to the label) and then licking that jar.

This is not true spiritual progression. The taste of the honey from neither jar is being tasted.

In transcendentalism we move forward by experiencing a higher taste. The fact that in Krsna consciousness the honey just tastes sweeter and sweeter every time with full variety and increases that way throughout eternity is astounding and stunning for sure. But there are no shortcuts like bluffing or cheating our way into Krsna's pastimes. Haven't we read of various demons trying to do that in Krsna book? Never worked, either Krsna or Balarama would just kick their ass and throw them out.

So for a bee to think that just by reading the labels of the jars he is progressing to finer and finer nectar is really tragic. We must get past the jars first!

[bija 0]

Thank you Puru for pointing out the correct verse in Nectar of Instruction.

Also, what a wonderful verse you have bought forward from Sri Guru and His Grace. I recall some years ago when I first recieved a copy of this book, and how it opened my heart to a deeper understanding of Gaudiya Vaisnavism. As to how this is a growing, developing and expansive philosophy, and as to how siksa comes from many sources by the grace of God to fully enlighten our hearts and lead us homeward.

I find these writings so balanced and thoughtful, so much so that by gleaning a tiny bit of their purport many contentions in the heart can be obliterated.

[vipul 0]

There arevery nice books titled Super Science of Gayatri, Gayatri Sadhna- why and how?, Gayatri Sadhna truths and distortions on the website of All world Gayatri Pariwar ( www.awgp.org) ., You can download htem from

http://www.awgp.org/gamma/LiteratureEnglish

Also, Thereis a of Gayati Sadhakas:

gayatri_parivar/

[Guest guest]

 

Thank you Puru for pointing out the correct verse in Nectar of Instruction.

Also, what a wonderful verse you have bought forward from Sri Guru and His Grace. I recall some years ago when I first recieved a copy of this book, and how it opened my heart to a deeper understanding of Gaudiya Vaisnavism. As to how this is a growing, developing and expansive philosophy, and as to how siksa comes from many sources by the grace of God to fully enlighten our hearts and lead us homeward.

I find these writings so balanced and thoughtful, so much so that by gleaning a tiny bit of their purport many contentions in the heart can be obliterated.

Mahaprabhu himself tried unsuccessfully to convert Murari Gupta to His Krishna conception. When he wouldn't budge, He could have accused him of sectarian fanaticism; being entrenched in a lower conception. Rather He placed his devotion on a pedestal for all to bow before as the standard: a "one master dog." Mahaprabhu happily signed off on his forehead, "Ramdas."

 

The gist of Sri Guru and His Grace lies in the capacity to recognize that highest substance whenever and wherever it appears and in diverse manifestation. But that is proportionate to one's qualification (adhikara). If one lacks the capacity and qualification to recognize substance, a "plurality" theme becomes suspect. Case in point: blatant sahajiyaism under the auspices of Srila Saraswati Thakur and Gaudiya Math and the marketing of spiritual concepts. The conception of a plurality of gurus has been misappropriated, adulterated, and perverted to the point of corruption. It fuels the guru trade as a lure for the naïve and inexperienced. The present landscape is bombarded by a bazaar of barkers, "C'mon, mañjari swarup; best quality — cheap price!"

 

Srila Govinda Maharaja once chided me for being indirectly responsible for the widespread abuse of the concepts revealed in Sri Guru and His Grace, "You should have included a chapter called "First Become a Disciple." He quoted the Katha Upanishad's observing that as rare as it is to find a qualified guru in this world, it is equally rare, even more miraculous, to find a qualified disciple (ascaryo jñata kusalanusistah). If we do not properly conceive of guru and what it means to offer ourselves in service to guru (disciple), extending that to include a plurality merely amplifies misconception.

 

- Sripad Bhakti Sudhir Goswami Maharaj (editor of the lectures that collectively were published in a book as "Sri Guru and His Grace".

[bija 0]

Thank you for this nice piece of writing Guest. Could you guide me as to where this comes from. I would like to read more.

[Puru_Das 0]

 

. . . The conception of a plurality of gurus has been misappropriated, adulterated, and perverted to the point of corruption. It fuels the guru trade as a lure for the naïve and inexperienced. The present landscape is bombarded by a bazaar of barkers, "C'mon, mañjari swarup; best quality — cheap price"

Indeed. SBRSM's remarks very clearly guide us to stay within our guru varga and not be influenced by prakrta sahajiya conceptions.

"For our own interest, whatever we find which is akin to what was given to us by our guru maharaja, whatever we find that will enlighten us further, and whatever will help us to understand more clearly what we heard from our guru maharaja, must be accepted."

It still behooves us to maintain a sectarian attitude toward the bona fide guru parampara, that comes in the line of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarsavati Thakura despite abuses outside that line in the name of plurality of guru, gurun.

". . . Gentlemen, the offering of such an homage as has been arranged this evening to the acaryadeva is not a sectarian concern, for when we speak of the fundamental principle of gurudeva or acaryadeva, we speak of something that is of universal application. There does not arise any question of discriminating my guru from yours or anyone else’s.

There is only one guru, who appears in an infinity of forms to teach you, me and all others.

In the Mundaka Upanisad (1.2.12) it is said:

<CENTER>tad-vijnartham sa gurum evabhigacchet

samit-panih srotriyam brahma-nistham

</CENTER>"In order to learn the transcendental science, one must approach the bona fide spiritual master in disciplic succession, who is fixed in the Absolute Truth."

Thus it has been enjoined herewith that in order to receive that transcendental knowledge, one must approach the guru. Therefore, if the Absolute Truth is one, about which we think there is no difference of opinion, the guru cannot be two. The acaryadeva to whom we have assembled tonight to offer our humble homage is not the guru of a sectarian institution or one out of many differing exponents of the truth. On the contrary, he is the jagad-guru, or the guru of all of us, the only difference is that some obey him wholeheartedly, while others do not obey him directly.

Abhay Charan Das

[early name of His Divine Grace Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada]Given originally as an address before the

Members of the Sri Gaudiya Math, Bombay

Circa February l936

http://bvml.org/ACBSP/oeg.htm

[bija 0]

"For our own interest, whatever we find which is akin to what was given to us by our guru maharaja, whatever we find that will enlighten us further, and whatever will help us to understand more clearly what we heard from our guru maharaja, must be accepted."

 

The above quote pasted by Puru dasa is very essential. The siksa recieved must enhance what was previously revealed by guru maharaja.

 

 

The conception of a plurality of gurus has been misappropriated, adulterated, and perverted to the point of corruption. quote by guest

It seems to be a very common practice in some spiritual circles today(not neccesarily refering to Vaisnava here), to be eclectic in approach. A kind of relativism, of taking a bit from here and there to satisfy one's own desires.

 

It fuels the guru trade as a lure for the naïve and inexperienced. The present landscape is bombarded by a bazaar of barkers, "C'mon, mañjari swarup; best quality — cheap price!" quote by guest

And due to this approach of accepting a variety of guru's to satisfy one's own desires the spiritual seeker will most likely be misguided or cheated. As stated in your post it is important to recognise the substance of the teaching or the plurality of guru's may be nothing more than this relative eclectic approach.

I am sure any bonafide teacher will warn against such an approach.

[Guest guest]

Goswami Maharaj's website address is "dailydarshan.com"

 

The article which the quote here is from is on the front page.

[bija 0]

www.dailydarshan.com

 

thank you very much.